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ngl bro you glazed to the max “bro got stronger because he got bigger” if that’s the case physically gojo as a teen is the same as gojo as an adult as there was no growth in size
not only that but even if he did get stronger gojo earned it the whole thing about sukuna being a “fraud” was because gojo sukuna needed a technique that wasn’t his to win
and then for you to say that the fingers get stronger every day than to say that sukuna was probably lower than 75% was wild wouldn’t that quite literally mean the opposite
Saying heian sukuna couldn't use domain amplification is a baseless claim.The fact that the disaster curses were taught domain amp by kenjaku doesn't prove that sukuna was also taught by kenjaku.Infact given how old kenjaku is and that he is the one who introduced it to the series.it's is more logical and plausible that domain amplification was an old domain counter like hollow wicker basket which was lost with time hence sukuna likely knowing Abt it.
@@Br0ku That doesn't really make it less baseless though. But yeah ur right, maybe later we'll get more elaboration on the Heian era capabilities in the future manga.
I really really doubt that Sukuna didn’t know how to use domain amplification and agree that it’s completely baseless. I mean the man could paint without a canvas you would think he knew how to use domain amplification. Plus when Gojo was faced with domain amplification he knew exactly what it was. Awful interpretation of Sukuna’s mastery of jujustu.
Yeah but we know he definitely trained at least a little since he learned how to change condition of his barrier from pr I'm sure he did some pushups on his free time
I mean. It’s stated in the series that domain explain in heian era is super different from the modern day so. Maybe the way to counter it wasn’t even made at that point
@@Drahcouland saying that electricity as a replacement for oil would fall under theoretical physics is the same as saying geothermal steam and energy can be converted for the purpose of replacing oil, yes its theoretical and yes it includes physics but it wasn't Einstein's main focus just thought I'd add that
Weird to go by physique in manga verses. By that logic a maki who was not that muscular in shibuya would be way weaker than the maki post shibuya before she got 0 ce but thats not the case.
i don't think gojo could gain over 5 fingers of power in just 5 weeks... IT makes 0 SENSE i get it i get it, he might got somewhat stronger but thinking he gained OVER 5 FINGERS OF POWER in just 5 weeks is just straight up dumb
@@andremoraski408 Bro would've just trained for another week then he would've been 21 fingers worth of power and Sukuna would've no chance to defeat him.
Basically if neither of them ever got sealed by kenjaku, whoever opens a domain first will win because neither combatants learned a successful counter yet. Knowing this makes the fight better imo, dope video.
@@Six-bw3irnot to mention their win conditions in a Domain Clash are very different for Gojo to win a Domain Clash he has to damage Sukuna enough to collapse his Domain while all Sukuna has to do is outlast Gojo and destroy his Domains Barrier, it's highly unlikely that Heian Era Sukuna loses in H2H so basically Sukuna doesn't get brain damage and starts smokin that Gojo pack as early as chapter 230...
pretty similar to how the fight started lol, half of the fight only happened becasue both "ran out" of domains. Even in the current timeline, Heian Sukuna vs Gojo would've just been a race of "Can Gojo land a single UV before he gets too much brain damage!?".
@@monschi1715 because in the first domain clash the wheel was already on megumi and sukuna can not use ten shadows and shrine simultaneously simultaneously.
@@Weebgamer236 he could have turned it off to use the fire arrow like he did when he used da. If this fire arrow would be that much of an win con theres no point to not do it atleast once when he even used da sometimes. Also do we know sukuna can even use shrine manually when his de is activated bc unlike gojos in his de sukuna isnt the center bc he imbued shrine into the literal physical shrine. Otherwise why should he be able to use de and da at the same time?
@@monschi1715 Sukuna plan was to get rid of UV if he completely disables ten shadows he may loose the adaption progress of the wheel but if he doesn't have mahoraga he could have easily gone for that combo.D'ont get me wrong Sukuna made really questionable decisions in this whole fight but that all ties to the sukuna holding back statement from gojo. That only applies as you said for techniques imbued into the domain which in this case are cleave and dismantle.Thats why he could domain amp and His domain .But the fire arrow isn't imbued in shrine and we don't know if sukuna can change the actual technique he imbues in his domain mid fight plus that wouldn't really be meaningful as he will just be exchanging one sure hit for another instead of being able to lunch a fire arrow while his domain is slicing gojo.
@@monschi1715Sukuna wanted to make Mahoraga adapt to infinity in order to learn a new slash, which he did, but wouldn’t be possible if he killed Gojo earlier
Doesn't the narrator say that Unlimited void and Shrine don't overlap fully with their sure hits? So in the fight we got, every time they clashed, Sukuna shifted the hit to Megumi whilst the domains were both open, but if he doesn't have Megumi's soul to shift to, he might just lose the domain clash instantly due to how their domains overlap, it's a weirdly horrific matchup of domains without a host body for Sukuna When other territories clashed, the sure hits were negated fully, but I think the fact that Sukuna's domain doesn't enclose a barrier is probably why it works this way, effectively he just overlaps an area instead, so if he doesn't close a barrier he might just lose in the most BS way possible.
sukuna's was purposely turning off his can't miss comand on himself in order to adapt to unlimited void, their domains would just cancel until sukuna's destroys gojo's from the outside
the narrator said they were cancelling each other out... this shifting the damage thing was an invention by fans who did not understand the literature written when they were both clashing domains.... what sukuna did was not protect megumi's soul using the sure hit of MS ...
this is a misunderstanding, Sukuna didn’t have to shift the damage anywhere, he simply didn’t cover Megumi’s soul in his sure hit so that he could put Mahoraga’s wheel there and use it for adaptation.
@@Axel_2K just re-read it, it's not super clear It feels like Sukuna should be able to target his domain precisely, but there's the whole making it smaller to not hit Megumi in Shibuya thing which gives me a bit of doubt there. Basically, either his domain doesn't target himself in general (which would make sense given he would slash himself), or he can chose to exclude himself. We know that Gojo hits himself and gets affected, it's just the 6-eyes can process the info. It feels like it shouldn't work this way, but it looks like it might or he'd hit himself with his slashes. Domains are all unique, so it's kinda hard to put a blanket rule on them clashing. (good example is the clash between Dagon and Megumi, the sure hit got turned off, but Dagon's Domain Shikigami could still attack Megumi normally, even though they are part of the domain) Weirdly, Shrine, Void are the only domains we know of that just auto hit everything immediately with a lethal technique, every other domain involves an activated technique that is then guaranteed to hit. The other domains that just auto hit are all 'rules based domains' like Hakari's
Well, the manga has ended and I wanted to clarify some thing(s) that were speculated on. But tbf there are still volumes that have yet to be released and with those will come additional information like vol.28 has (though I haven't seen all the additions and corrections vol.28 made as of yet, unfortunately I'm still early in my Japanese studies). The first is in regards to CE Reinforcement. We got definitive confirmation from a flashback of Gojo speaking to Miguel that if a sorcerer has a stronger base body then they are better off than one who doesn't if the amount of CE Reinforcement is equal between the two. So Heian Era Sukuna is most definitely faster, stronger, etc... than Yujikuna and Meguna. Conversely, that also means that Yujikuna was faster, stronger, etc... than Meguna and therefore more suited to hand to hand combat. In which case Sukuna (hypothetical ~20 finger Yujikuna) would likely have had an advantage over Gojo in their exchanges when using DA rather than simply matching Gojo as he did while using DA as ~20 finger Meguna. Therefore Heian Era Sukuna (provided he has DA, which it is reasonable and likely that he did) would certainly have had an advantage over Gojo in hand to hand with regards to just stats alone. (I'll likely edit this as I go along and perhaps come back to it at a later time. Fair warning: it's not going to be in any particular order, just what I feel like at that time.) Next is HP and it's effect on Sukuna. Whereas it would be a mostly reasonable assumption to make that Sukuna used DA to reduce the damage of both HP's he received from Gojo, no where is that stated and could only be implied via a generous interpretation of the statement. I've compared 3 separate translations of the passage (Viz, TBC, & Shishiso) and when comparing them together it leaves little to no room to interpret the statement as Sukuna having used DA for reducing the damage of HP. Shishiso (the most reputable amd accurate of the three) specifically says "reinforced arms", viz says "reinforced hands", & TBC says "enhanced arms". Other than "enhanced arms" (and even that is a pretty big stretch), it is clear that Sukuna only utilized CE Reinforcement and that was sufficient to weather HP. There was a third time HP was used on Sukuna from Yu/jo, but my memory is a bit foggy on how that exactly played out other than Sukuna survived it with minimal damage (relatively speaking). So for now I will not include that one here other than the brief mention to be through. (I may again come back to this later today, but for the time being that will be it.)*Just wanted to express my appreciation for the video and thought exercise it provided, thanks!
It dont get past the domain clash. Sukunan wins the clash but now gojo is dealing with vajra, fire arrow, and more on top of that, sukunanis boxing with 2 arms punching, one if them whipping out vajra and another using dismantle while hes chanting attacks. We have to remember that sukuna wasnt going all out, he was prolonging the clash for adaptation, gojo even notes that sukuna couldve strengthen his barrier to destrot IV. He was simply never going all out as it main goal was surpassing infinity
Yes bro, people be acting like he did all he could, another reason he couldn’t use the fire arrows in the domain clashes is cause of the adaptation wheel being active. Imagine how much stronger he would be in his ascended state with all his cursed tools, faster casting due to the 4 hands and two mouths, stronger body and still the other abilities we are yet to see, bro just had soo much pride and wanted to be above infinity and make it a nonentity to himself which is why he took as much hits as possible to adapt more and more, especially now that we know the more mahoraga is shown a specific phenomena the faster he adapta
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
None of the things you named would bypass infinity. Fire, lightning make zero difference. Maybe the extra arms would help with hand to hand but short of domain amplification or space/world cleave nothing gets through.
@@-UNKNOWN-13 cant sukuna just use domain amplication to neutralize infinity and then let his curse tool, Hiten and Kamotoke do the rest of the work? Or I'm trippin on how domain amplication works 😅
Old Heian era Sukuna would not have the knowledge that he has now from being inside of yuji’s body so he would never have known about how gojo’s domain expansion works plus modern day heian era sukuna is vastly more powerful than the old one, since he has learned at the very least 2 immensely important things which was the new space targeting slice and then also how to use RCT to compensate for a burnout after DE.
It was just assumed he didn’t already know how to use rct to heal burn out. And it was just assumed that he learned it from gojo. Which actually doesn’t seem to be the case given Hana/angel questioned whether he knew from the beginning. And on top of that after the 5th clash he knew ahead of time exactly when gojo would be getting brain damage and why. Then he literally started explaining how doing that is different than healing things normally. Implying that he already completely knew and understood how the process works before seeing gojo do it. Altogether sukuna could’ve actually been using a different method entirely to heal his burnt out ct in theory.
He could've easily destroyed UV from inside in 2nd clash. Gojo himself said that. So there is no need for the yuji's body knowledge. He can learn to heal RCT burnout it by seeing gojo through the fight.
I really enjoyed this video and I can tell that you actually put a lot of effort into this. You are well informed and it's really cool to see someone looking at this debate through an objective lens based off of what the manga said and not some stupid nonsense like Pixel scaling or attempting to put math into it or whatever (because the author very obviously did not account for any of that at all). That being said I'm gonna nitpick a little bit. (I copied and pasted this paragraph from another comment I wrote) Sukuna is a Jujutsu geek, he literally lives for this shit. I feel like it would make less sense to assume Sukuna DOESN'T know Domain amp than actually knowing domain amp. He's the king of curses and fought and won against the strongest the Heian era had to offer, assuming that he wouldn't know domain amp/ not be able to figure it out himself in their fight is just ridiculous. He's able to pick up on Jujutsu abilities just by looking at them once, was able to see the potential in Megumi's 10S technique before even knowing the existance of Mahoraga/What Mahoraga was capable of, is always trying to enhance his Jujutsu skills (He literally altered his body to be the most efficient at using Jujutsu), his domain is even considered to be DIVINE because of his understanding of Jujutsu. There are far more reasons to believe he WOULD know than wouldn't. Another thing, the assumption that domain's amp up the damage of the person casting the domain that Gojo talked about in his fight with Jogo is kind of iffy too. The reason being, as we saw, Sukuna's domain is far from ordinary. It already breaks the conventional domain in the sense that it is barrier less, and as I mentioned previously it's considered such a feat that the narrator calls it divine, so I don't really think you can assume something like that in this sense. We also don't actually know where the source of power comes from, whether it be from the barrier itself or just simply being in it so I don't think that's really a factor that you can consider in this fight. On top of this, it was stated in terms of domain refinement, Sukuna's and Gojo's were on the same level, meaning we also do not know that if two domains that occupy the same space with the same level of refinement would still be able to uphold the rule that your CE output/ damage would be higher, or if they would cancel out. Also somewhat unrelated to what you said but I think when looking at this fight people actually disregard the amount of nuance and the objective of both sorcerers. I'm gonna go off on a tangent cause I'm kind of passionate about this dynamic lol. Gojo's objective in this encounter was to kill Sukuna by any means. We can deduce this from the ad-libbed hollow purple at the end of the fight that damaged Gojo himself, the idea that Gojo is actually a very loving and caring person (Demonstrated by his anger towards the higher-ups from sending Yuji to the detention center, and him doubling down on the fact he wants Sukuna to suffer for what he did to Yuji) and for him this fight is essentially "Kill Sukuna, or my students will suffer the consequences". Sukuna obviously wants to kill Gojo as well but his motive is actually kind of different. He doesn't go into this fight with the same stakes at Gojo, he views Gojo as "another fish on the chopping board". Like I said earlier, Sukuna lives for Jujutsu. That's the primary reason why he used Mahoraga, he wanted to upgrade his technique and further expand upon his knowledge on Jujutsu because for Sukuna fighting strong opponents and getting stronger himself is quite literally what he lives for. So much so that he will gamble his life on it, because as was stated during the culling games, past sorcerers do not view life as modern sorcerers do, they will be more than happy to die in battle against strong opponents. Sukuna in this fight was quite literally experimenting, gambling on the idea that Mahoraga would be able to grant him a stronger technique. His goal wasn't to just KILL Gojo, but to get STRONGER in doing so. This is also kind of why I disagree with the rhetoric that Sukuna NEEDED Mahoraga to kill Gojo. The only instance we see Sukuna talking about the development of his upgraded space dismantle was him stating that he **WANTED** a blueprint from Mahoraga to tear through infinity, there was actually nothing indicating that he **NEEDED** him, which is further reinforced by Gojo in the "afterlife" saying that he was unsure if Sukuna needed 10S in the first place to kill him. This leads to an interesting dichotomy between both characters. Gojo considers himself to be the strongest, all his peers do as well. He calls himself the strongest on multiple occassions and also asserts himself as "the honored one". On the other hand, I cannot remember a SINGLE scan where Sukuna proclaimed himself to be the strongest. In fact, the narrator proclaimed Sukuna to be the honored one, not Sukuna himself. Gojo hasn't had any reason to increase his power dramatically since being attacked by Toji 12 years ago because in this era he is quite literally peerless. He hasn't had any reason to. Any curse he would go up against requires minimal effort for him to kill. Sukuna, on the other hand, had to fight the strongest the Heian era had to offer. He had a REASON to constantly be stronger, because he lived for it and the pressure the environment he was in led him to as well. I know I said a LOT but I genuinely think that Sukuna was destined to win this fight from the very beginning and that Gege always intended for this to happen, and this is without me talking about his actual Heian era form.
@Six-bw3ir thank you man I really appreciate it. I think I really only scratched the surface at the dichotomy between two characters because I haven't even gotten into gojo or sukunas perspectives on being the strongest
Completely agree with everything bro.....People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
Point to be note that when Sukuna was killed, his soul was divided into 20 fingers. We know in jjk theory that true Innate technique lies in soul. We never heard that Heian Era Sukuna's mummified finger was part of his soul. It's just he is so strong that his heian era mummified figure itself had the power of 1 finger. Sukuna meant that his mummified figure had curse energy equivalent to 1 finger but didn't involved with his innate technique. So his last finger will give him the full power of his innate technique
Sukuna isn't missing anything, by your logic sukuna needs Yuji to be at full strength? His body would contain just as much as a finger if not more (as literally stated when he ate his own head) he isn't missing any parts of his soul.
@@mist3325^dawg above doesn’t know what he’s talking about his soul isn’t complete since he didn’t take in all his fingers. Even if his head made up for the power his soul is still incomplete. So story wise his last finger will probably have some importance
1. It was never implied that Gojo learned how to do flip flop barrier inside prison realm. The guy learns and adapts on the fly just like Sukuna and the lawyer guy. He learned many things like that including CT that he couldn't prior to being "killed" by Toji, HP that he first used against Toji(he couldn't do it without mastering red and he could do red until he understood how to do CT). 2. Physical appearance means nothing. His face also changed along with the art style. Not to mention that you can't build muscle without food and created muscle tension(even calisthenics pros won't do much in a month). Calories aren't just energy if you eat 3500 grams of sugar you won't build muscles. On top of that it was said that prison realm has no concept of TIME in there. That's why you can't change anything unless you die. So you can't subtract from your body and you can't add to it. The only change that is allowed is users death. 3. Just because Sukuna thinks he can kill Gojo at 15 F doesn't mean he can. He was already mistaken few times in their fight as well as surprised that Itadori could retake control of his body easily. Gojo said he'd win the same way when he was first asked about him back in the beginning of the manga, so what's your point here that Gojo at the begining could beat 20 F Sukuna? So both Sukuna and Gojo are overconfident characters. But Sukuna also had Mahoraga, so ofcourse he'd thought he could take Gojo even with 15 F. Mahoraga would make the most work anyway and he just need to survive long enough. 4. What makes you think Gojo got even stronger after 5 weeks and the difference was significant? You can't train much against opponents that can't fight on equal ground at least. And that wasn't the reason he agreed on a break. He agreed because it was 2 high level opponents(+Mahoraga) against 1 and he wanted to increase his chances of success. You're saying that Gojo could train himself in 5 weeks from 15 F Sukuna to the level of 20 F Sukuna? 5. Your proof as to why Sukuna is faster is absent. Itadori could clearly see Sukuna while runing to him and he isn't a speedster himself. 4 arms don't help with running at all. There is zero proof that Sukuna got faster. This people get faster if they have more CE, his CE remain the same. 6. To counter DE you SD, it's not as toxic on a brain thus Sukuna would have more trouble to even harm Gojo as outside of his domain only DA can help him and that's excluding his CTs. 6. Unlimited Hollow damaged Gojo as well but as you saw he RCT himself quite fast unlike Sukuna. So this would give more advantage to Gojo in a long fight because remember, sooner or later DE clashes will be over and Sukuna won't be able to do it for a long time. And this is when Gojo start winning. Sukuna CTs are useless on Gojo but Gojo's CTs harm Sukuna, slowly but steadily he would win.
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
You stated that, the only reason meguna was taking it from Gojo was that for Magora adaptation, cause more he took hits faster the adaption was. So Heian sukuna will not need that, no reason to take hits so he will just go with the plan of killing Gojo not playing. Heian sukuna just destroy Gojo I don't know why those guys are discussing. In a domain clash sukuna will just win cause in Heian form his curse energy and his power are increased
@@As-pp1rmWhat are you even talking about?😂 The only chance bro has to defeat Gojo would be their domain clashes... we've seen how Gojo fared in his and we also so how he fared in Gojo's 😂... fight over❗ The domain clashes would be interested... we've seen Gojo is way better in H2H but two extra hands would maybe even the gap a tad...his extra mouths for chants doesn't nothing because it doesn't bypass infinity... His only attack would be with domain amplification... So educate yourself before you yap garbage mate☠️
@@As-pp1rm Had no idea you owned TH-cam 😂 And you're obviously the delusional/ignorant one here... Re-read the manga if you may... assuming you can read of course ☠️
@@osas2kul brother there was no hand to hand combat, gojo was using limitless neutral and blue infused punches while Sukuna was operating with just domain amplification, if we took both of their CT's then Gojo does less damage per hit, no high speed movement and no sudden red. Hope you got it
Great analysis. I always appreciate your nuance to scaling. My biggest issue with Gojo scaling in general is he never really uses his ability to its fullest IMO. For example : He can literally teleport and yet he doesn't use it near enough. like why not teleport away from Sukuna so he can't touch him ? in the domain ? He made made multiple blues ( if we assume those blues weren't fractions of one big blue ) so why not try for multiple reds ….. which could get him multiple purples + enchantments for all 3. and lastly (unreasonable baseless fan boy head canon territory ...sorry ) its hard to believe Gojo doesn't intuitively understand jujutsu is about interpretation. his power is the concept of infinity, he made his DE sure hit mind crushing infinite info dump like surely he can conceptualise near Infinite speed or at least be insanely fast ? faster than even Sukuna. he has been shown to have crazy creativity and battle IQ .
Those blue little orbs that he fired at Sukuna under that bridge could have been much bigger and strong honestly, or a red maybe like you mentioned. I can't think of any other reason why Gege wasn't using Gojo's abilities to a greater extent besides wanting Sukuna to win the fight. A guy that controls space could have just done so much more.
@@calamityxdusk I'm not mad or unsatisfied with the outcome of the fight. It was no surprise to anyone that Gojo would most certainly lose. But hearing Gojo say Sukuna was so freaking strong, he didn't go all out, I don't know if I could win either way.. All these statements that contradict the feats. Comes a bit as forced by Gege. Giving Sukuna prior intel, detailed information about Gojo's technique before the fight. The direct counter to any other cursed technique (Mahoraga). On the other hand Gojo with the six eyes still has no idea what Sukuna can do, or that he has a barrierless domain expansion. Many people agrue "oh Sukuna would have ended the fight much sooner, since when their domains clashed for the first time". They expect Sukuna to fight differently but Gojo perform the same... I don't think there will be any other occasion better thatn this fight to reveal Sukuna's technique and go deeper on that. If the 2 strongest won't give their all against each other, then against who? Ino? Choso? Mei mei? Yuji? Maki? Yuta? All these guys are drastically weaker than Gojo. My concern now is that the good guys are still sooo weak in comparison. Gege is trying to fill in that gap with pointless statements that have no correlation to the feats. How do you expect me to believe these guys will make Sukuna finally go all out when the character described as "he can do anything he tries, but doesn't get too involved with things for the sake of the next generation". The character with the technique that controls space, limitless, the strongest in the manga (claimed by Gege in the chapter when Gojo fought Jogo), can most likely delete you out of the existence (but Sukuna has the biggest durability aka plot armor) ... apparently couldn't make Sukuna break a sweat. I don't know man. At this point just end the series with the antagonists winning. Can't see a reason why Sukuna isn't one shotting everyone. Giving us flashbacks mid fight of the good guys somehow finding ways to deal with Sukuna when they scale so far below him is unbelievable for me.
@@blackreaper378 what makes you think that gojo didn't know about sukuna's open domain? Everyone talks about plot armor on sukuna but noone talks about gojo's plot armor. Sukuna was able to pinpoint gojo's location from another district yet he couldn't sense a sneaky blue or red. Gege never called gojo or sukuna the strongest of all time. Whenever strongest was used it was for their respective eras. The fight literally started as the strongest in history vs today. But for some reason people always use gege's previous statements by taking them out of context. And gojo and sukuna both can delete anyone out of existence.
@@nickstrong2756 yea I was expecting something a bit more nuanced, but he essentially just used head canons to build certain points and use those points to come to a baseless conclusion, I’m not even saying his conclusion is “wrong” but nothing in the canon gives us an answer as concrete as he just gave
the curse on the finger grows stronger which is why they couldnt even destroy the gravewax anymore the actual fingers/sukuna himself doesnt get any buff
Gojo would defeat hein Sukuna. People forget current modern day Sukuna is far stronger given the fact we knew his power grew everyday for 1000 years. Gojo saying Sukuna holding is meaningless when Sukuna pretty much stated he needed 10S to fight Gojo twice. To get rid of uv and to get rid of infinity. He could've turned back at any moment.
It didn't grow. The sealing got weaker and they were approaching their original power. That's the proper translation. He could've killed Gojo with his DE+Fire Arrow combo, after the first or second clash, due to Domain Burnout for Gojo. He literally states that he wanted to use Maho to learn how to naturally get through Infinity and Limitless, and that the adaptation limits what he can do both offensively and defensively. Which is why he started using multiple Shikigami at once to split Gojo's attention from just him and Maho, and why he hid in the shadows for sneak attacks. Adaptation/10S keeps him from using Domain Amplification, C/D and Fuga. He was playing a long, risky game just to learn a new move. That's his personality. Same reason he hasn't just killed everyone he's facing now. He'd rather see how much they can do and what they're hiding up their sleeves, than just kill them all.
@@blackmanwithcomputer you already contradicted yourself bro. Sukuna could kill him with fire arrow and slash combo which it self is a might but infinity would've blacked it.
@@khalidhayat6461 No it wouldn't. Infinity blocks everything, automatically, unless he wills it. After, both times after his DE (prior to the Sukuna fight) he got touched by an outside force. Hanami's CE and then the transfigured human blood. The DE aftereffect always disrupts your CT usage.
1) speed id put heian era above gojou. Recently we've seen him blitz a piercing blood, something gojou was able to dodge. I guess you could argue he was fighting mahoraga and agito, but yuuji and the other arguably scale to mahoraga/agito now, due to recent feats. So he wouldnt be able to hit sukuna with hollow purple or even aim red 2) Strength id say sukuna because hes 7 foot, 4 arms made of pure muscle and he has more ce than gojou to amp himself. 3)in terms of domain interaction id give it to sukuna. Even though you argue that sukuna wouldnt know domain amplification, id argue he does knowing hes sukuna and that he was from the prime era of sorcecery. If gojou loses the domain battle he loses entirely, i dont think i need to go into much depth.
how is dodging piercing blood faster than gojo that makes no sense, if Kenjaku can dodge piercing blood how can Gojo not? How can being 7 ft make u stronger than the guy literally rag dolling you and strength is based off curse energy reinforcement so that literally does not matter. Domain interaction Sukuna would win the clash but he has literally gotten destroyed in his own domain and hit with unlimited void
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
@@nirbanjyotidas5828So you're telling me sakuna got almost murdered by infinity for fun? He got knocked out by a black flash for fun? His brain almost got completely mushed for fun? Him being stated to be nervous against a black flash amped gojo was for fun? And him screaming for daddyraga to stop gojo from doing the last hollow purple was for fun? Stop being dumb 😭
@iaw0kened442 Oh, yea forgot about kenjaku dodging that. Still I find it strange kenjaku dodges an piercing blood point blank, but barely, gojou gets hit but sukuna dodges it completely by a long shot so I'll give you that. However even if you argued ce does increase strength which it does, this makes things worse for gojou, since he's fighting someone with 2-3x his ce with 4 arms. We know people can still be physically stronger and contend with people who have less ce so either way this ce shouldnt be a problem. Maki and itadori are examples. He's not losing the clash nor is he losing hand to hand combat anymore, how does gojou beat someone with four arms when he was already have difficulty fighting before. Then he'd have to dodge 120% boosted dismantles and cleaves with chants aswell. On top of the fire arrow. It's just not fair
i asked this question in the live stream and broku delivered also screw u dude for ruining my sleep schedule, dropping this video just when i'm about to go to sleep
You can talk about food all you want, but humans can go as much as 3 weeks without food, but only 2-2.5 days without water before dying. Now I know what happened in the prison realm. The prison realm has a personal gym, a full cafeteria, and great views of the prison realm from multiple wonderful window points.
@@Br0ku well I don’t know what you expect, but this is a show where everyone but Maki dies. And as we all know, dying it better than long term culture. Does Sukuna really want to deal with UN or congressional committees about his treatment of prisoners? I mean the paperwork alone could be why Sukuna has 4 arms.
@@Br0ku trying to get the FBI involved now? Wow. You know you admit someone is killing you, and in about 30 years the fbi knocks on my door. Btw I already know how the show ends. (It involved a minor bit of kidnapping) but apparently right before killing everyone in the world, Sukuna touches a truck…. Seems like a normal truck, but it’s…. TRUCK-KUN! As we all know, truck-kun is the most powerful being in all of anime. 1 touch and Sukuna is sent to another world and now apparently has to fight a demon lord. The rest of the last chapter just involved the JJK sorcerers in a room discussing just how bad phase 4 and 5 of the MCU was.
Bro it's confirmed😂.... Gojo trained after coming back from prison raim.... In chapter 150 yuta mentioned that ( we cheated) which fans speculate they did something to get more powerful in short amount of time... 1 theory is they used the prison raim ( which i highly doubt) 2nd one is you remember that guy who can slow time( fans speculate they used him like a time capsule) And that should also say why gojo after releasing didn't fight 15 finger sukuna
HOLD ON You made me realize that anyone with rct could be an elite bodybuilder within weeks, maybe even days, as they could just work out, heal, and repeat to get endless muscle growth
I think one of the biggest facts is Sakuna wouldn’t have the knowledge of Gojo domain, or how infinity works. Gojo spelled out his techniques for Sakuna to plan around. Without that prior knowledge who’s to say while Sakuna was figuring out Infinity he wouldn’t lost to the unlimited void. We also don’t know if Gojo knew how to heal his burnout before the prison realm. It’s an interesting thought.
Gojo wouldn't tell a strong opponent how his technique works. He only did it to Jogo because he knew that Jogo can't do anything to touch him... He might be cocky but he's not stupid to tell the Strongest sorcerer in HISTORY his technique..
@@Six-bw3ir First of all why are you bringing Yuji into this? We're talking about Heian Era Sukuna not Modern era Sukuna. And the cons of explaining your technique outweighs the pros. Explaining his technique to the most knowledgeable and strongest sorcerer is like a death sentence.
6:15 oh yeah most definitely prison did him right 💀 he went from twink yaoi to jacked it’s very common is JJK for character to get more jacked as they get stronger
Also sukuna finger doesn't grow overtime, some dude said gege siad it was a mistake in an interview and people who read japanese version say its an mistranslation.
I don't think it's fair to use the clash between 15 finger sukuna and gojo as speed scaling for sukuna, yes his heian era form is stronger and faster, but I doubt 20 fingers heian era sukuna is significantly faster than gojo, during the 1-month time skip it was heavily implied by gojo that most of his training was towards mentally preparing himself to fight megumi, nothing implied that he got way faster and stronger. As for the "gojo got jacked and thus got stronger" argument, I think it's entirely possible that gojo was this jacked before the prison realm simply because it was never stated that the went through any physical training in the prison realm, so that's just pure speculation at best. Just to clarify, I am not here to argue for gojo winning, I just think that putting him on 15 finger levels of speed post prison realm is a bit crazy.
Another thing is the fionger just gives him ce so he just ha sless ce in 15 f but that only is a disadvantage when the fight drags on bc he hasnt as much ce in general but output and efficiency is what makes youre ce reinforcement strong which doesnt change here.
And the fact that that same gojo proceeded to overpower 20f sukuna +mahoraga+ agito in hand to hand, has the same speed and strength as that same sukuna with 5 less fingers? Doesn't make a lot of sense
In an isolated 1v1, if we're talking about Heian Era Sukuna, it's a 50/50. If we're talking about current day Sukuna (before his fight with Gojo) in his four arm form, Sukuna wins 100%. That's just the cold hard facts.
I hear the argument Gojo can’t win a domain clash with sukuna since he can’t box him inside. The thing is if Gojo knows he can’t win a domain clash Gojo would just teleport out of malevolent shrines range. And would just shoot red from range. Since the reason Gojo and sukuna domain clashed is because If Gojo won the domain clash he would win due to unlimited voids effect. And sukuna fought Gojo in a domain clash so that Mahoraga can adapt to infinity. So Gojo would most likely teleport out of Malevolant shrine if he knows he can’t win. And sukuna and Gojo would just go to round 2 and fight without domains since Gojo would just teleport out if Sukuna uses his domain.
Nigga how would he know the range? It’s not like sukuna does the cheap ass move of explaining his cursed technique and domain expansion, it’s the narrator that does that for us
Plus did you see gojo at any point during their battle teleport? That takes very specific conditions to do and especially when he’s not in the heat of battle, imagine a million slashes going through your body and you have to meet very specific conditions to teleport while not knowing how big the domain expansion is, I think that’s why we never saw gojo teleport apart from goodwill arc
@@beetrus Gojo knows Sukuna’s domain size since he uses his own domain barrier to encompass Sukuna’s domain. And the reason Gojo didn’t teleport out of Malevolent shrine is because he was adapting to Sukuna’s open domain. Since if Gojo won the domain clash he would win due to Unlimited voids effect. If Gojo knew he simply couldn’t win a domain clash he would just teleport out. And he can even when being slashed since he was able to use simple domain,rct,rct to heal his CT, falling blossom leaf emotion, RCT with normal CT, blue, and red while still being in Sukuna’s domain. As it was stated that teleportation is simply a different usage of blue, Gojo should be able to teleport out.
True he might have known sukuna’s domain size, Yes teleportation is a different usage of blue but as I said it needs specific conditions to be met which we aren’t told and also I believe if he could’ve used it he would, he hasn’t used it since goodwill when no one was actively attacking him and or in a serious situation
@@beetrus we see him use it against 1 finger sukuna and in jjk 0. It’s pretty clearly shown that the activation of his teleportation is just him clasping his hands together. We even see Gojo teleport other people away. And when Gojo was unsealed 8thousand feet underwater with kenjaku’s cursed spirits he teleported from the Japanese trench all the way to mainland Japan on top of kenjaku. The only reason he didn’t teleport out of Sukuna’s domain is because he knew he could win a domain clash. If Gojo lost a domain clash he could still survive malevolent shrine and recover, meanwhile if he won the clash he would just win the entire fight because of infinite voids ability.
The only problem I truely had with this fight is that there was no usual narrator build up/extra panels to Sukuna finally understanding what he needed to do to finally break through his infinity shown in a set of panels before us seeing Gojo essentially get off screened . I feel like if we were able to see something like that it would've been slightly better. Does anyone else feel like this too?
maho cutting through infinity was the clearest indication. just use the basis that sukuna learnt how to rct burn out instantaneously after watching gojo do it, add binding vows to his domain after gojo did it, etc etc, then simplify the logic.
When mahoraga cuted gojo sukuna replayed "that's good" or "lovely" I think it was, at that moment sukuna knew how to do it, or better said, saw how to do it, but it was a very hard skill to pull of so he needed time to figure it out, hench when he kicked gojo to agito he didn't go for a kill cos he could just crush gojos head with a flame arrow(we saw everyone how big of a nuke that shit is) o just cut gojo, he needed time, thats why he was nervous in the last moments of the fight, cos he knew what's coming and the state he was in, thats why sukuna was laughing after the nuke, cos he knew he already won
U can't tell on the first read because we see things from Gojo's perspective. When you reread u can see the signs. Pretty much every Sukuna does from the very beginning of the series is planned. Even the signs that Sukuna would take Megumi's body happen very early in the series. It's crazy, Sukuna really cooked all of us
Heinan Sukuna vs peak Gojo comes down to who uses DE first .If Sukuna uses Domain first Sukuna will just learn how to use DA or SD or FBD when Gojo uses one of these to protect himself from Sukuna DE as we know Sukuna can copy any CT that isn't locked behind a type of CE after seeing it once.
The prison realm (IMO) would be a form of time suspension like the hyperbolic time chamber, im assuming this based on the statement kenjaku made about releasing him in a 1000 years, so yea he probably didn’t need to eat either he was just a prisoner of time so yea him training would of course put some muscle mass on
Gojo's (*Shibuya / fp) only win-con against heain sukuna is if heian sukuna underestimated him like sh*t and got caught in the UV other than that gojo doesn't have anything that can one shot heian sukuna. While that guy has a stronger domain bcoz of the 2nd mouth plus that guy would use a trident against gojo inside MS with no infinity (*why am i seeing flashbacks of gojo vs toji but much worse)
Sukuna mid diffs Gojo looses his first domain and gets spammed by cuts from malevolent shrine and Sukuna + fire arrows, lightning bolts and a spear. He would be dead before he could even figure out the strategy to compress his domain
and here is the massive knowledge buff sukuna had over gojo, sukuna had all of megumis memories, kenjakus knowledge about gojos powers and saw first hand through yuji gojos abilities aswell while gojo hadnt much knowledge about sukuna.
inside the domain sukuna only use dismantle not cleave the fight would end in the 1st domain battle.... you tend to forget sukuna have a goal to improve not just to kill gojo
Actually without the knowledge sukuna wouldn't turn his sure hit off, would just destroy gojos domain faster as even gojo was woundering why sukuna easy playing the risky game, wich we later get revealed is to adapt maho, without that sukuna wouldnt turn off his sure hit, hed just keep crushing it like the 1st and 2nd domain clash, realistically heien sukuna and even meguna without mahoraga wouldve win way faster, as they wouldn't need to play the long game to adapt to infinity but just straight up kill gojo
For those who don't know, anime/manga is called JJK (Just JoKing) and it's about a boy, Yuji Itadori, who harbors w/in him a malevolent entity named Sukuna who constantly makes jokes in his expense by making him commit assault, murder, mass murder, curse on curse crime and etc. It's a good read/watch.
I think some yall misunderstood what I said, which is fine, I could have been more clear. I am not saying that Sukuna didn’t have Domain Amplification in the Heian era. I’m saying we don’t know. This isn’t me making a claim that he didn’t have domain amplification. My point was, he still has Simple Domain and I think that is enough for him to win especially with Domain Expansion even if he didn’t have DA. It’s not downplaying Sukuna if I’m saying that he still wins WITHOUT a technique. That would actually be more impressive. Hope that clears it up. 💪🏻 thanks for the support.
I mean your reasoning was fine but shibuya gojo is one of the weakest versions of adult gojo and heian era sukuna is one of the strongest versions of sukuna
And literally 15 finger yujikuna has arguments to defeat shibuya gojo because kenjaku considered 15 finger sukuna as a failsafe for gojo breaking out of the prison realm because 15 finger meguna who should be physically weaker than 15 finger yujikuna blocked an attack from unsealed gojo who should be stronger than shibuya gojo and before prison realm gojo wouldn't know how to change conditions of his domain plus we know that sukuna can use the fire arrow in conjunction with his domain because he did and a stronger version of gojo barely can out of normal melovelent shrine and if sukuna broke gojo's domain and put a barrier over his domain after that sukuna just needs to use fire arrow with his domain Though i don't think 15 finger yujikuna beats shibuya gojo but these are some good arguments
It's pretty easy for me to see as to why Gojo would lose against a Sukuna from the Heian Era. If he was suffering that much damage in Sukuna's domain, then Gojo would have a much more fun time trying to deal with the Shrine as a bigger Sukuna, with four arms and weapons, gunning for his throat. I don't see Gojo putting up a fight against a guy with Sukuna's physique and knowledge like that, unless he finds some way to regenerate AND fire off a red faster than Sukuna is able to blitz him immediately.
@@benjaminpalmajimenez1843no reason? 4 arms and his body being stated as perfect is more than enough also sukuna never got blitzed by gojo wtf are you talking abt
Hien Sukuna would still win. He wouldn't even need to Mahoraga in first place because he would spam his domain to neutralise infinity. People dont even understand what Sukuna can do is why all these people mouthing about him and Malevolent shrine. Plus I don't think ascended true form Sukuna would be affected by UV, Sukuna got hit only because he was in human body of Megumi with normal humam brain. His ascended form is basically two people in one body. So I think it's arguable to say UV Can actually damage him. Because we can see in Shibuya mahito and other disaster cured got cured from UV than normal Japanese who go hit by Gojo.
saying heian era sukuna couldn't use domain amplification is baseless and counterintuitive when there is a ton of evidence pointing to it. he even uses his domain against the special grade earlier in the series before we even meet kenjaku and claims that domain expansions are "real jujutsu" which is an odd thing to say for someone who you claim only learned of it in the modern time period. so you're saying he didn't know domain expansion even though he could use it after getting in yuji's body, and that was before yuji ever saw domain expansions anywhere else so we know sukuna didn't "learn" it from anything.
i personally think your argument for Gojo getting stonger doesnt hold up very well, inside the prison realm time is supposed to be non existant in a biological sense, its that way so that the prisoner doesnt die of age or die of starvation, so working out shouldnt have many results, how do we explain him having bigger muscles then? well, we do know Gege hadnt drawn him for like a year or 2, most likely he just drew him that way cause he wanted, his art style did change between Shibuya and Gojo's release, what they were referencing when Gojo shrunk his domain was that the expirience inside the prison realm teached him that shrinking a domain to a size that shouldnt be posible is actually posible, him being in a place thats smaller than he is showed him how to replicate that. and it wouldnt make much sense for him to have become twice as strong in between his release and the fight, i think what prevented him from beating Sukuna right there was he lost his edge, after being trapped for so long inside an empty space he would have gone a bit dull combat wise, so in the weeks prior to the fight he was just regaining his edge. now im going to say a very hot take: Sukuna fingers are just cursed energy, i know, its pretty clear that 3 finger Sukuna is weaker than 15 finger Sukuna, but we never learn how much weaker or why that is, when 15 finger Sukuna is fighting Mahoraga, he says "maybe back then, you could have defeated me" referencing the moment when Megumi almost summoned it against 3 finger Sukuna, and Mahoraga was close to winning that fight, had he not learned fire from Jogo he would have had to resort to a secret technique or he would have lost, yet he still says "*maybe*.... you *could* have...." if we go by the assumption that Sukuna's finger grant him linear power 5-10-15-etc, then he shouldnt have stood a chance against Mahoraga when at 3 fingers, we see Mahoraga was keeping up pretty well against Sukuna, but even if you assume Sukuna was only using like 30% of his power, that would still be superior to a 3 finger Sukuna, and its even worse if you assume its an exponential increase cause 15 fingers would mean he is much much much much stronger, so either he was holding back to an extreme level against Mahoraga and thats why he says Mahoraga MIGHT have killed him at 3 fingers, but it wouldnt make much sense since Sukuna HAD to use a domain expansion to win. so i propose they just give him more CE, we know sorcerers become stronger when they reinforce their bodies with CE, they gain inmense speed, strenght and durability, so Sukuna becoming stronger is most likely bc he has much more CE to expend, we see right from the start that 2 finger Sukuna is much more superior to most special grade curses, he isnt just twice as strong as the finger bearer who has 1 finger, so clearly his power comes from his knowledge of CE, having more fingers wouldnt give him more knowledge, but it would give him much more ammo to spend. another thing, Heian era Sukuna seems to be much weaker than current Sukuna in terms of CE, what Gojo said is that the fingers gain power everyday, so they better have Yuji eat them now in order to stop Sukuna from having even more CE in the future, this can mean 2 things, either at the moment Sukuna became a cursed object he lost most of his CE and he was recovering it, OR, in the 1000 years he was "sealed" he gained a ton of extra CE, now, this doesnt necesarly mean he would run out of CE in their fight, but it could be the case, we dont know how much CE he gained in 1000 years, maybe a lot, maybe without that he wouldnt have more CE than Yuta, we cant really know for certain, but it seems to be the case that he is stronger than ever before. and i wanna finish off with a question, was it stated that all sorcerers who have a naturally strong body automatically have an advantage in speed, strenght and durability? yes, Yuji was going toe to toe with Todo while being a sorcerer for a month, but he was training that entire time, and he is clearly using CE to reinforce his body, so Sukuna having Megumi's, Yuji's or his own body shouldnt make much of a difference right? cause going 5 m/s faster or slower wouldnt make a difference when they are around light speed level.
My arguments are different, in my humble OPINION, gojo won against Sukuna heian. *Misunderstandings* 1. *Malevolent Shrine's chants and slashes*: There is no evidence in the manga that Sukuna needs to chant or use more hands to power up his domain's slashes. In chapter 259, when he uses his domain with only one hand, it is not observed that the effectiveness of the slashes changes. This implies that the use of more hands does not have a direct impact on the attack power or range of the Malevolent Shrine. In chapter 259, Sukuna was damaged, and proceeds to make a domain, Sukuna used a binding vow (in exchange for being able to invoke the domain with one hand, and other unknown things, I will be able to invoke the domain, but only for 99 seconds) even so, the power of the cuts of this incomplete domain, have exactly the same power, and I believe that Sukuna's Malevolent Shrine, the only limitation was the time at 99 seconds. If with one hand, its power and range is the same as with two hands, it suggests that it would be the same in the opposite direction. On top of that, he never showed that he enhanced the cuts of the domain, only those of his body technique. 2. *Sukuna's domain escape*: The idea that Sukuna could have killed Gojo with the thermobaric explosion is unrealistic. Kamino Fuga is not only a slow process, but it is also not guaranteed to be effective (Choso Block part of the explosion proving that Fuga is not part of the safe effect). If Sukuna had attempted Fuga, Gojo could have used a simple hold, and taken advantage to restore his *limitless* (infinite), escape and protect himself before Sukuna's attack was completed, or worse, attack Sukuna. This would have left Sukuna vulnerable, making the decision to use Fuga even riskier. (Choso Block Fuga blood) 3. *Weapons*: It is not relevant to consider the use of weapons in this fight, as doing so would weaken the argument in favor of Sukuna. The fact that Sukuna has to resort to weapons would indicate a lack of power, and if weapons are discussed in his case, it would also be necessary to review the possibility that Gojo could have used other weapons. In this sense, the fight becomes more about personal skills than external equipment. *Statements within the manga* 1. *Gojo laments Sukuna's limitations*: In one of the crucial moments in the afterlife, Gojo expresses that Sukuna “can't do any more” he never said “don't try”, suggesting that he has already reached his limit in power and abilities. In Japanese, the word used is more specific, and denotes Sukuna's inability to continue improving his performance, implying that Sukuna was giving it his all and wasn't holding back any strength. This comment reinforces the idea that Sukuna wasn't holding back, but had reached his limit. In English they even say "unable" instead of "not tryn" (the biggest proof I have is that the kanji used by Yuta in Chapter 235 are the same ones used by Gojo in the afterlife, denoting the expression "Sukuna can't do more, as soon as we jump against him, he will be forced to change and kill us" referring to Shrine, Sukuna's "limitation" was not using Shrine (useless against Gojo) and limiting himself to the 10 shadows, not "not trying" 2. *Sukuna's fear*: When we go to Japanese. You are all wrong. The kanji used do not have a direct translation into Spanish or English, in fact the official translation given in the American media was "uneasy". But the interpretation of the kanji derives in the following (since there is no translation English:direct): -uncomfortable -worried -anxious -fast-paced -stressed -apprehensive -panic -FEAR is also one of the possible translations. All of the above are valid translations and words if we look at the kanji. -,The phrase "high on tension" is a strange translation, which would never have occurred to me as such, but I could think that it could fit, but it is at least a strange translation. Seriously, where did they get the phrase "high on tension" from? Was it a pirated manga? Or worse yet, VLZ? With this, saying that Sukuna felt fear is as accurate as saying that Sukuna was uncomfortable, worried, anxious, etc. All of these are possible depending on the kanji used. 3. *Gojo and the 10 Shadows*: Gojo mentions that he is not sure if he could have beaten Sukuna without the intervention of the 10 Shadows technique, indicating that this technique played a decisive role in Sukuna's victory. Without the 10 Shadows, Gojo believes that the fight would have been close anyway, suggesting that under normal conditions, without this factor, Sukuna would not have had a significant advantage over Gojo. but even *Statements from author Gege Akutami* Although I don't have the interview in Japanese to translate, but in Spanish and English, Gege Akutami, the author of *Jujutsu Kaisen*, has mentioned in interviews that the only way Sukuna was able to beat Gojo was through the use of *Mahoraga* (one of the 10 shadows techniques). This reinforces the idea that Sukuna, on his own, without the help of that technique, would not have been able to defeat Gojo. Akutami even pointed out that the fight was designed to be interesting and strategic, using elements like the 10 shadows to create a balance. In essence, without that external intervention, Sukuna would not have had the ability to win. (margin of error, I don't have the interview in Japanese, only in Spanish and English) *Cheating and preparation of both* The thing is, that Utahime's only affected the first attack, which was more of a warning than an attack to kill, and it doesn't matter because Sukuna used the deer of the 10 shadows (from the ability of Megumi's stolen body) to heal his arm. The thing about Gojo's barrier reduction he obtained by an empirical approach from experience APART and nothing to do with an observation of Sukuna. (Look at Yuta, when he took Gojo's body, the first thing he did was shrink the barrier to resist the malevolent shrine, Yuta's was by directly seeing the fight with Sukuna) While Sukuna obtained DIRECTLY and RELATED TO GOJO the way to counter the infinite void. Sukuna entered the fight with a series of advantages that Gojo did not have. Not only was he using Megumi's stolen techniques, such as the 10 shadows, but he also had prior knowledge of Gojo's *limitless*, something Gojo did not possess in relation to Sukuna. This allowed Sukuna to be able to plan his attacks more effectively, resulting in his victory. Furthermore, Sukuna was able to keep his distance and heal himself during the fight, taking advantage of abilities that were not originally his. Gojo, on the other hand, did not know that Sukuna's domain could be opened, which put him at a disadvantage from the start. If both had had the same level of preparation, the balance would have been different. Such as using the "basketball" domain from the start, or using "fallen petals" in the event that the MS destroyed the UV, making the cuts not deep, thus not being in real danger in the first place. *Logical Aspects* Gojo fought against a powered-up Sukuna, who not only had access to stolen skills, but also vast knowledge about Gojo's weaknesses. Despite all these advantages, Gojo came very close to winning. This shows that, had Sukuna not had those additional cheats, Gojo would likely have emerged victorious. The Sukuna in his original Heian era form, while stronger in physical terms, would not have had the strategic adaptations that made the fight so difficult for Gojo. *Conclusion* In short, Sukuna managed to beat Gojo thanks to a set of external factors, including Megumi's stolen techniques and his knowledge about Gojo's *Limitless* weaknesses. Without these advantages, the fight would have been different, and Gojo, with his innate abilities, would likely have won in a more balanced matchup. Gojo never felt like he was in any real danger, in the manga it's mentioned that it wasn't until Mahoraga broke his infinity that the possibility of losing his mind really came about, and even then, that possibility excited him, thrilled him, even pleased him. While Sukuna, as soon as he saw some difficulty, canonically felt fear and yelled at Mahoraga to do something.
A quick correction, Black flashes are NOT luck based, (they are luck based for every character that isn't very fast) but they occur when cursed energy is applied within 0.000001 seconds of a physical hit. So, with Gojo's speed its less luck and more skill.
Its worth noting that gojo likely didnt actually display his powers outside of the prison realm. None of his powers or abilities would cause prison realm to get heavy, however some one standing right there holding prison realm has an anti gravity technique that he primarily revearses to cause more gravity. Kenjaku made it heavy in order to make sure he could get Mahito, hoping mahito would get stronger. Prison realm looked like gojos eyes because the eye color likely changes to thwt of whoever is trapped.
It really doesn’t seem like Kenjaku taught Sukuna domain amp. Yea, it’s really a stomp. Kenjaku, whose opinion definitely counts, thought a 14 finger Sukuna would beat Shibuya Gojo. And that makes sense. If Meguna, who’s physically worse, could clash evenly with a buffed Gojo, then a physically stronger Sukuna using domain amp should be stronger. He still wins domain clashes, and this time there’s no Mahoraga stopping him from using fire arrows. Those definitely matter. Sukuna hitting him with fire arrows while Gojo is trying to recover his ct is gonna break the simple domain, which means Gojo is gonna get hit by shrine even more. Or if Sukuna shoots out the giant waffle cuts he did against Kashimo while he’s domain amped and Gojo doesn’t have his domain buff. Since he’s free to use any ct now instead of using ten shadows in the shadows, pun intended
This is before I watch the video. As a Gojo fan I still think Heian Sukuna could win. He would fastly understand he can't touch Gojo, so he would engage him in domain battles. Is said battles, as opposed by Meguna, Heian Sukuna would not play as risky and try to dodge more as that would be his only way to beat Gojo realistically without claiming he knows DA and stuff like that xd. Sinse Sukuna does not play as risky, and has 4 arms that would sorta make up for the difference in H2H skill it is very likely that Sukuna can force Gojo to fry his brain because of repeated DE with just two domains of his own, rather than 3, he would also never suffer the effects of Unilimed Void. Don't get me wrong, the battle will still be extremely hard, Sukuna would most likely engage him more in combat before expanding his domain in an attempt to learn how to beat him, and also to have fun. Even after expanding his DE he would be suprised that Gojo can teleport and be caught off guard. But ultimately I think Sukuna would win a hard-extreme diff win, but still a win! Edit: After watching the video, there is only one thing I disagree with two things. One is that Gojo got any stronger in that one month between him being released and the battle with Sukuna, I do however agree that a Post Prisonrealm Gojo definitely got stronger as compared to his Shibuya Self. And two I disagree eith you implying pre Prisonrealm Gojo would not be able to flip the conditions of his DE, he absolutely would, the only thing he would be unable to do is imgaine his domain so small as to trap Sukuna isidr it. That said if we were comparing 15F Meguna to Shibuya Gojo, I would say it would go basically the same as 20F Meguna vs Prisonrealm Gojo, Sukuna would be getting ragdolled as he was in his 20F Form but ultimately would get what he needs to win in the end. As for Heian Sukuna vs Shibuya Gojo, I think it goes in the way I described up above with Sukuna possibly beating Gojo with a single domain not even needing to open multiple, he would also most likely shred Gojo making this a low-mid diff win for Heian Sukuna xd.
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
I’m so glad there are smart sukuna fans who actually state facts because people glaze gojo too much and talk down on sukuna like he doesn’t have the most op ct in the show 🙏
As was said, physical condition is very important. So i feel that the only reason why gojo had an advantage in close combat is because sukuna didnt train with megumi or yuji's body. In my opinion, that also implies that sukuna with 20 fingers would be more powerful in close combat with yuji rather than with megumi.
@@monschi1715 wldnt that quicken the brain damage he does to himself cz we know he caps out at 5 domains... if and this is a ver big fat if he didnot get that prison realm experience wld he have figured out how to make that tiny domain b4 his 5 tries get done..
@@briansam5681 Yeah but ppl forget gojo doesnt need to engage de battles bc he could simply escape ms. The external and internal con switched de is just bc it could help at some point. Engaging in de battle was an huge disadvantage for gojo in general. Then not forgetting sukuna had such an advantage of knowing all of gojos powers.
does heian era sukuna have any way around infinity cause the only reason gojo put it down in the fight is because maho was gonna adapt it and i just feel like we left out his biggest hax. not to mention that if we say that the sure hit from domains gets passed infinity whats to say he doesn't use falling blossom emotion to negate the effects. If we are being real and not just riding either character the biggest reason gojo lost is he was too cocky its his largest character trait. He was beating megunas ass and thats while having to be extra strategic about how he used his abilities cause of maho i dont see a world that heian era sukuna wins cause he has more energy and stronger attacks. The whole reason sukuna took megumi's body was to get maho so he wouldnt have to deal with infinity one of his highest iq feats. idk man id love to hear some thoughts on this cause i dont see anyone talking about it in the comments good vid tho!!
In the whole discussion you forgot about infinity. Even if Sukuna could use domain amplification he couldn't use his CT so he would be able to punch Gojo but not use slashing. All of his cursed tools and cursed technique won't be able to pass infinity except the one that Toji used. Also, Gojo is not just infinity, blue, red and purple he could also use other basic techniques like black flash, falling blossom emotion and other basic jjk techniques.
@@alexweah8396 If he manages to use domain amplification and cursed too together the Gojo can increase his infinity output which he used to destroy Hanami.
@@durgeshkirpal460 thats what we saw in the manga, i am talking about the posibility of sukuna letting the cleave and dismantle hit gojo while using kamutoke or flame arrow as he is able to keep a domain up while using domain amp
When gojo talked about him losing to sukuna even without ten shadows i always thought he meant sukuna just turning back to his true form as In the domain battle gojo would have lost if sukuna just turned back as he would have refreshed and just used a domain and won never using ten shadows
Let’s consider if Gojo had the battle experience of Sukuna, is this fight even close? Gojo was only challenged like the three times in his life. He is arguably more of a prodigy.
Probably, but this debate centers on talent vs hard work. Gojo undoubtedly surpasses Sukuna as the most talented and gifted sorcerer. But Sukuna compensates with combat experience and knowledge. Disregarding one of Sukuna's crucial aspects is unfair and undermines the argument. Consider a scenario where Sukuna had Six Eyes, is this fight even close? May sound absurd, but it mirrors the flaw in this argument.
Gotta disagree with Gojo being more of a prodigy. Sukuna has been cited by Angel to only require a glance at a Jujutsu skill in order to understand/replicate it. Gojo couldn’t learn RCT, even with the Six Eyes, until he was on the verge of death.
Crazy how when Yuta said that Hakari is stronger, everyone said that he is being humble but when Gojo said the same thing for Sukuna, suddenly ppl vote against him?? Ppl need to realise that Gojo was being humble there. And even then he said that with a 50-50 chance of him losing lol. The only thing Sukuna held back against Gojo was his true form. He was going all out INSIDE MEGUMI'S BODY. He had no reason to hold back his output as he literally had a "reset to full health" button ready. A true not holding back Sukuna which Gojo mentioned he would lose against would have been Sukuna with true form + TS which obviously would be stronger than Gojo. But only true form Sukuna vs Gojo will be a very close fight.
Bro THANK YOU so much for actually having some sense throughout this thread. Hein area sukuna is literally a bad matchup for gojo and meguna literally was trying to survive gojo after the domain clashes. Mahoraga saved this man 3 times. Literally begged mahoraga to upgraded his technique.
People when they realise sukuna was using gojo as a training arc.... sukuna wasn't even focus in fighting with gojo he was learning what mahoraga did and modifying his technique 😂...if sukuna was in Hein era form the fight would end in 5 chapter lmao
@@nirbanjyotidas5828 U guys will literally say anything to defend Sukuna lol 😂. If wut u said is the case then why did SUKUNA FELT NERVOUS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN 1000 YEARS 🤣?? Like imagine feeling nervous in ur training arc xd. Thats the wildest take I've seen in a while. At least make it make sense.
fun fact its either hinted or stated that kenny met sukuna and taught himthings in the heain era aka domain amp finger split not confirmed simple domain and more
Sukuna literally admits he’s not him, he wouldn’t have been able to beat Gojo w/o Mahoraga and Sukuna can’t go all out against Gojo because none of his many techniques could get by infinity and transforming back into his heian era form to heal is cool but doesn’t change his inability to get by infinity. Sukuna loses w/o Mahoraga protecting and teaching him, the extra power of the chanting and arms doesn’t matter if he can’t land hits
tbh when most people refer to gojo vs heian sukuna im pretty sure they're implying post prison realm gojo since thats way more interesting and thats the version meguna beat
all prison realm did was enable gojo to visualize himself in tiny space. the flipping of the domain conditions is just specific to gojo and sukuna because of their mastery of jujutsu. Also DE is about refinement and they're equal in refinement, sukuna and gojo would always tie where their domains overlapped, it would've always been a conditions chess match. Also, about prison realm, time doesn't exist there, meaning there's no healing there. you are essentially as you were phyiscally. for example if gojo did fifteen push ups, he wouldn't feel it, he could do millions and still nothing. time doesn't exist. there's no forward or backwards. it's why he can't get hungry, or thirsty, or need to pee or poop, your body is essentially in stasis. that's how prison realm works. gojo describes it as feeling busy but it passing in the blink of an eye. prison realm is just mentally really tasking. hope this helps. Personally i just think sukuna is just stronger than gojo point blank. the margin is small but thats what i think it is. sukuna would've always figured something out i think. Remember angel saying if sukuna finds another way to bypass infinity he would win. Gojo is just a really hard matchup tbh the combo of his talent, infinity then add six eyes is ridiculous, gege wrote himself into a corner but sukuna had to be stronger. if the fought 10 times sukuna would probably win 6/7 out of 10.
There is a plot hole in the fight, there is no way Gojo would’ve not seen the World Bisecting Slash, because of the fact the Six Eyes Sees and distributes techniques on a Molecular Level
Does that mean that using your Logic Toji is stronger than maki because he is more muscular now ghat I think about how are maki and a Toji equal I know the author wrote that but apart from a few people in JP the rest of the world is normal so body mass and hight even weight classes are a thing and didn’t maki just get her heavanly restriction a couple of months ago and Toji was born with it. Come to thing of it if maki and Toji lost their amp from their heavenly restriction Toji would win after all a jacked middle age man vs a 16 year old girl is pretty obvious so if they have the same amp the outcome should be the same how is this a debate 😵💫
How so I mean logic works the same way in the jjk world so honestly since yoji is a middle aged man and maki is a 16 year old girl if they fought Toji would win even if they both get the same boost the outcome would be the same did I miss something like Toji was born with his ability and maki just got it a couple of months ago
There is a specific part where I am quite aganist what the video says and many stuff follow from that. As far as we know consuming fingers add extra CE to sukuna's tank but we don't know if it increase his CE output... actually given how powerful sukuna is in his first consumed fingers compared to the rest of the special grades we saw... I think Sukuna once reincarnated had always his full output at his disposal but with a far limited tank of CE to use it with... if this is true 15 Fingers Sukuna and 20 Finger sukuna (or 19+ mummy) are equally powerful, just with less fuel to work with... but given that this fights hardly end because one of the fighters run out of CE this is a meaningless difference...This would explain why Sukuna was confident to defeat Gojo when they met soon after the Prison was lifted... For sukuna it made no difference having or no those extra fingers)... Also the canon statement of the fingers become stronger over time makes no sense (but this is not a problem of the video, but actually of the original material) because it would mean that depending on how much time passed 20 fingers Sukuna would have been far different in strenght by that... but not even once after that first statement something like that was said of him or any other cursed object (like the death paintings for example). Now an interesting part, I am not sure the extra arms/mouths will produce differences in the DE, but let's assume it does... I think once this happen, Gojo will simply change strategy and not keep attempt a domain clash with Sukuna... Like if Sukuna beated Gojo in activating the Domain or Gojo dies there... or he could always flee the Domain Area and force sukuna to dispell the domain to keep fighting him...and without Gojo showing him how to recover from a burnt CT... the fight could go weirdly because Sukuna will be in his Domain uncapable of harming Gojo(who is out) but knowing that dismissing the Domain will leave him (relativelly) powerless aganist Gojo for a while... Gojo could even force sukuna to dismiss his domain shooting a purple at him from outside... without the 10 S, Gojo has not the issue of not using option to avoid the Adaptation as he did in the original It's possible (maybe also probable) that Original Sukuna would win aganist gojo without the 10 Shadows but it will be overall harder for him
He did not need the 10 shadows to be Gojo and his origin form their domain expansions probably aren't a tie and he could probably outright. That's what Gojo was saying.
Heian Era Sukuna can use his hand signs and mount incantations and amplify his domain effective output , that way he can create even stronger domains and break gojos domain. The only win condition for gojo is if sukuna is playing around without taking care of himself , but knowing sukuna , he would only take risks if he knows he can win. Gojo is always inferior to sukuna
Chants don't buff domains 😂...when have you even seen that? Only binding vows do... chants only buffs his own techniques which would be useless against infinity anyways... It's like you people don't even read the manga😂...
@@osas2kul chants can improve one's effective output , which can help him cast even more powerful domain with greater output , what do u think happens if sukuna domain output increases? It'll break gojo's domain way to sooner & gojo would be forced to use domain multiple times until he can't which is game over for him.
@@suraajgogeta5390 You chatting rubbish fam Chants don't do anything for a domains😂...they only alter their domains through binding vows not chants... If I'm wrong...tell me an instance... any instance that has ever happened?😂
@@osas2kul It was never shown till now so there's no instance , but since domain are cast by user, his effective output is domains effective out. So its safe to say signs and incantations can amp domain output
@@suraajgogeta5390 Bro you assuming...if it hasn't been shown...then it doesn't exist... Sukuna used binding vows to increase his domain's slashing output by decreasing his domain radius... chanting does nothing for a domain boost... Stop it with the assumptions...
I believe this debate is too early sukuna fingers were getting stronger and after 1000 years he's probably stronger than Heian era version Also heian era sukuna have weapons we already know that one of them can control lighting but we don't know what the spear can do
I don't see how casting a domain would be any faster with more arms and an extra mouth, it's not as if it's a technique like hollow people where you have incantations and hand signs
a few points one possible argument for sukuna at 20fingers not being stronger/ faster than 15fingers is that we know CE reinforcement has clear limits and 20f sukuna already has more than 2x the CE of gojo at the very least so his CE reinforcement with only 75% his CE should still be maxed and you can say the remaining fingers would buff his techniques output. another thing is gojo after getting unsealed said his training consisted of mental training to fight megumi any him being relative to 15finger sukuna in speed and strength makes no sense then since we wouldnt have gotten stronger in the timeskip besides the barrier techniques being refined and mental training(unless you believe my 15finger sukuna having maxed out reinforcement theory) one more thing is that gojo did blatantly outspeed 20finger sukuna many times in the fights and he while being cut up by MS was still moving relative to sukuna and fighting him on even ground despite sukuna being over 120% cause of his domain buff. also DA being able to nullify purple is a very far fetched thing since DA didnt even fully nullify a red which didnt explode. sukuna also being able to do DE handsigns early is a maybe since gojos DE hand sign is shorter than sukuna(requires one hand only) so i doubt he would be able to cast it before gojo also casts his due to gojo also being able to see the spark which for DE would be very noticeable also heian sukuna being stronger than meguna at 20f is kinda weird cause of what we know about CE reinforcement being able to amp you to a point. Kashimos "perfection" probably just means that sukuna's body is now perfected to handle doing multiple things at once(hand signs,chanting) so it becomes perfect for fighting. You can argue he got jacked that would improve the base physicals tho all in all good video very informative
side note the domain clash would also be weirder since now sukuna has no info on gojos domain and they were equal in refinement and there is no megumi who can tank the sure hit here and stuff so its kinda weird how the sure hits would overlap or whatnot and once gojo strengthens the outer shell sukuna would take much longer to break it since now he cant use a binding vow to increase its output by turning the sure hit inside off and touching gojo. sukuna can use simple domain but sukuna is arrogant and might just think he can tank UV not knowing what it does and simple domain doesnt last at all against a domain so sukuna would be on the back foot either he spams simple domains so save himself or he takes longer to break gojos barrier
Firstly, Shibuya Gojo and Gojo after release are still the same guy, for some stupid reason people are divided because his clothes are torn and he is jacked. They can't see that after the Prison Realm, Gojo wore his jacket again and talked to Gaku Ganji. He looks exactly the same, just in stupid baggy clothes. Yes, Gojo trained for 1 month, which is something we never get to see, plus his Domain shrinking technique, which he might have learned from the Prison Realm. For Sukuna fans and arguments: You only rely on 'What if' to this date. Sukuna bypassing Infinite is always a question, and 'What if' also leads towards him not being able to do anything against Gojo. Secondly, the author makes Gojo say those words, 'Like Sukuna didn't give anything, was holding back,' when just one chapter ago, Sukuna felt fear/unease for the first time in his life, while Gojo was Black Flashing him everywhere, knocking him out, etc. Gojo also commented, 'Thanks for taking it seriously.' So, if holding back is a definition of getting knocked out, then my comprehension level may be different from yours. Thirdly, the whole fight was Gojo adjusting to Sukuna, then you call it making it sound like the other way around. Gojo got 0 intel from his group (for some stupid absurd reason when they had a 1-month time period together). Meanwhile, Sukuna had all the intel from Yuji and Megumi, plus Kenjaku, who already had all the info about Gojo, despite Kenjaku himself not being able to deal with him, but of course, Sukuna could. Sukuna was already prepared from 100%, whereas Gojo came with 0%, giving his best there is to give.
@@BlackJack32.God you fruadkuna fans are being cursed by the reading comprehension devil. When sakuna transformed back into his original body he lost the 10 shadows lol. He literally would've never been able to bypass infinity besides da, and he probably still wouldn't have been better at h2h against gojo.
Sukuna in yujis body < Gojo = Meguna < Heiyen era Sukuna (Only because of him having advantage in Domain expansion fights, i can't see a world where sukuna could possibly beat gojo with just domain amp and his 4 arms) That's my opinion about it
Chants wouldn't increase domain strenght aka the barrier( that wouldn't be a factor cuz sukuna as an open barrier domain) but what it does increase is the domain surehit strength as your surehit is your CT & chants increase CT strength. So 20f true form sukuna would most likely(100% would win) win the surehit battle against gojo or break gojo domain from the outside before the 3min 9s, thus gojo losing either way. Not the mention the fact if sukuna spam 20f chanted flame arrow at gojo while gojo already as his RCT runninng at MAX output against MS, bro would be cooked( I don't see how he would have time to heal his CT or last long in MS if that as the case).
why would chants boost youre de or ct when youre output hasnt dropped? theres a reason why the subtraction thing was broad out and someone like gojo could us emax output blue without chants.Also calling the name of the de is already the chant. When has sukuna shown to be able to use his ct when using his de? There should be a reason why he can use de and da at the same time bc the physical shrine contain the ct know.
@@monschi1715 1. Chants has nothing to do with your output. Clearly gojo didn't have lowered output at start of fight when he fire off that 200% purple but the chants still boost his CT to 120% and true form sukuna was constantly using chants to boost his CT reguardless of his output( bro output clearly was high). 2. Chants would be impossible for gojo to do inside his domain. 1. He would need to endlessly chant to match his domain duration & form hands sign which he can't chant endlessly cuz he as human heart & lungs( stress his lung & heart and kill himself) and can't form hand signs while doing h2h( doesn't have extra arms) only sukuna can do that. 3. Chants don't restore output like black flash( this is while only time its stated gojo output returned, was when he hit a black flash), it only boost Ct output so it as nothing to do with your output( CE you have) and chants aren't good for combat for human cuz u would be busy chanting and it would slow u down( require u to focus on the chant) thats while gojo only use chants when no one was attacking him and he had distance from them aka when punch maho and it couldn't move & he outed sukuna with black flash , end of fight when he had distance from them and start of the fight. 4. Just imagine gojo trying to chants while been attacking by sukuna, bro would pick a alot of punching from sukuna while trying to chants as he wouldn't be able to defend himself. This is why the manga hype up sukuna true form up as being prefection for jujustu and there better advantage for jujustu than it meaning it better than any other amps, 6eyes and DE amp. ( its basically hitting an infinite black flash for sukuna)
There is no verson of Gojo that can defeat Sukuna. Sukuna would not underestimate his opponents, he 100% would no let Gojo inflict Infinit Void on him, for the sake of argument lets say Final Battle Gojo clashes with Heian Sukuna and they tie again until Sukuna slashes the 1st barreir then Sukuna can spam flame arrow, kamutoke and anything else that he has before Gojo can recover.
5:12 lol who said that? Gojo obviously got stronger in the prison realm. Didnt Gojo say he was training. Like when he died he said it. "I was training this body to the limit"
@@davidsamarra2053Gojo. To refer to a guy as Adonis is basically implying he’s the perfect man, with a flawless physique, and you get the gist. Perfect in every way. Where Heian Sukuna is a Chad, Gojo is one step higher by being compared to a god.
Its crazy how persons think that sukuna in his original forma (einan era only) beat gojo becuz he has more arms and another mouth. We witness gojo fighting against, sukuna, maha, and the other shikigami, thats six arms and still held his own. And sukuna couldve manifested his mouth on his body (just like in the anime and maha fight) but he choose not to do so cuz it wouldne have done anything significant just like him not using his ct against gojo infinity. His form doesnt dictates his chances of winning since from the start sukana already had 100% information on gojo while gojo didnt knew anything about sukuna, without that prior knowledge the chances increases of gojo wining, which is fair.
sukuna in megumi's body is the strongest form of sukuna cuz of a simple math sukuna at shibuya was 15 fingers and it was implied that jogo is about 8 fingers of sukuna,but sukuna in megumi's body has magohara which way stronger than jogo so (jogo=8 fingers20 finger sukuna)
Kashimo's CT was so powerful that Sukuna was forced to reincarnate into this form yet people are always slandering him 🙃 weakened or not, it's an impressive feat
about gojo can't change domain conditions if he's never been traped inside the prison realm , in my opinion the only thing gojo learn from it aside of physical strength is to shrink his domain to basketball size and keep the inside bigger , and changing other condition of the barrier like make the outside Stronger than the inside is something he can do even he didn't get traped inside the prison realm, and if sukuna's finger get stronger by time that's mean the current real form manga sukuna is stronger than the Hein era sukuna , that's doesn't mean either win easily but it will be interesting fight and maybe better fight
I have 3 mains contentions with this video... Firstly, we both know damn well that Gojo was lying through his teeth when he said that Sukuna was stronger than him. Secondly, there's no solid evidence that Gojo got stronger from the Prison Realm besides him looking stronger. It could very well have been a stylistic chance. Thirdly, you keep saying that Sukuna in his Heian Era form would be stronger than he is now, but I find that highly incorrect. As you previously stated, his Fingers get stronger every single day - and it's been over 1000 years since he split his Soul. I find it highly likely that his differential in power between his Meguna form and his Heian Era incarnation would be significantly different to Gojo's Shibuya and Shinjuku forms.
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ngl bro you glazed to the max “bro got stronger because he got bigger” if that’s the case physically gojo as a teen is the same as gojo as an adult as there was no growth in size
not only that but even if he did get stronger gojo earned it the whole thing about sukuna being a “fraud” was because gojo sukuna needed a technique that wasn’t his to win
and then for you to say that the fingers get stronger every day than to say that sukuna was probably lower than 75% was wild wouldn’t that quite literally mean the opposite
that's an absolutely atrocious argument lmfao @@junior_-3218
@@Br0ku it was using your logic bro 😭😭😭😭
Saying heian sukuna couldn't use domain amplification is a baseless claim.The fact that the disaster curses were taught domain amp by kenjaku doesn't prove that sukuna was also taught by kenjaku.Infact given how old kenjaku is and that he is the one who introduced it to the series.it's is more logical and plausible that domain amplification was an old domain counter like hollow wicker basket which was lost with time hence sukuna likely knowing Abt it.
It’s not baseless, I also said in the video that the true Heian Sukuna is very limited because we don’t know much about him.
@@Br0ku That doesn't really make it less baseless though. But yeah ur right, maybe later we'll get more elaboration on the Heian era capabilities in the future manga.
@@Br0ku so you admit we dont know if he has domain amplification or not we dont know how long its been known we cant use that as a reference at all
@@Salvalvekens this is why I did 2 Sukuna’s in the video. A very limited one, and that isn’t very limited. 🤷🏼♂️
I really really doubt that Sukuna didn’t know how to use domain amplification and agree that it’s completely baseless. I mean the man could paint without a canvas you would think he knew how to use domain amplification. Plus when Gojo was faced with domain amplification he knew exactly what it was. Awful interpretation of Sukuna’s mastery of jujustu.
There's a drawing of Gojo made by gege prior to his release from PR that implied he was always muscular when wearing regular clothes (black shirt)
i mean its a manga world, to scale based on physique isnt that reliable. Aside the fact that gojo did wear a jacket.
@@monschi1715plus gege art skills definitely improved. Yuji looks like he matured by 5 years when you compare ch 1 to the recent chapters
Yeah but we know he definitely trained at least a little since he learned how to change condition of his barrier from pr I'm sure he did some pushups on his free time
@@Six-bw3ir where is stated he couldnt change conditions of his de before?
@monschi1715 they say that he did learn to change it from pr did you not read do I need to find the chapter for u? I can read for you if you want?
Why would Sukuna, the most knowledgeable jujutsu sorcerer in the series not know about domain amplification?
Why would einstan the smartest man at one point did not know abt converting electricity into a replacement for oil?
I mean. It’s stated in the series that domain explain in heian era is super different from the modern day so. Maybe the way to counter it wasn’t even made at that point
He does, he’s been shown to use it against Gojo in Ch. 223
@@Drahcoul dumb analogy, sukanas speciality was cursed energy and manipulation while Einstein's was theoretical physics
@@Drahcouland saying that electricity as a replacement for oil would fall under theoretical physics is the same as saying geothermal steam and energy can be converted for the purpose of replacing oil, yes its theoretical and yes it includes physics but it wasn't Einstein's main focus just thought I'd add that
Gojo getting buff could've been due to training but i think it was just an artstyle change
Weird to go by physique in manga verses. By that logic a maki who was not that muscular in shibuya would be way weaker than the maki post shibuya before she got 0 ce but thats not the case.
i don't think gojo could gain over 5 fingers of power in just 5 weeks...
IT makes 0 SENSE
i get it i get it, he might got somewhat stronger but thinking he gained OVER 5 FINGERS OF POWER in just 5 weeks is just straight up dumb
@@SagreChintonot really considering he doesn’t train at all he’s growth would be exponentially greater then the people around him
@@andremoraski408 Bro would've just trained for another week then he would've been 21 fingers worth of power and Sukuna would've no chance to defeat him.
def an artstyle change cus he was buff the moment he came out of prison realm. Before he had the month training
Basically if neither of them ever got sealed by kenjaku, whoever opens a domain first will win because neither combatants learned a successful counter yet. Knowing this makes the fight better imo, dope video.
Yeah, people often talk about how sukuna only won because of megumi, but if we never got to this point, gojo would be a lot weaker too.
Sukuna will be able to cast first 9 times out of 10 with 4 arms it's not even a question
gojos domain sign is literally one handed its much shorter than sukunas and gojo can see the spark of it before sukuna casts it@@Six-bw3ir
@@Six-bw3irnot to mention their win conditions in a Domain Clash are very different for Gojo to win a Domain Clash he has to damage Sukuna enough to collapse his Domain while all Sukuna has to do is outlast Gojo and destroy his Domains Barrier, it's highly unlikely that Heian Era Sukuna loses in H2H so basically Sukuna doesn't get brain damage and starts smokin that Gojo pack as early as chapter 230...
pretty similar to how the fight started lol, half of the fight only happened becasue both "ran out" of domains.
Even in the current timeline, Heian Sukuna vs Gojo would've just been a race of "Can Gojo land a single UV before he gets too much brain damage!?".
We all forget that sukuna couldn't use his domain fire arrow combo because he had the wheel was always active .
Why didnt sukuna use fire arrow in the first de clash when gojo had no ct then if the fire arrow would be that useful?
@@monschi1715 because in the first domain clash the wheel was already on megumi and sukuna can not use ten shadows and shrine simultaneously simultaneously.
@@Weebgamer236 he could have turned it off to use the fire arrow like he did when he used da. If this fire arrow would be that much of an win con theres no point to not do it atleast once when he even used da sometimes.
Also do we know sukuna can even use shrine manually when his de is activated bc unlike gojos in his de sukuna isnt the center bc he imbued shrine into the literal physical shrine. Otherwise why should he be able to use de and da at the same time?
@@monschi1715 Sukuna plan was to get rid of UV if he completely disables ten shadows he may loose the adaption progress of the wheel but if he doesn't have mahoraga he could have easily gone for that combo.D'ont get me wrong Sukuna made really questionable decisions in this whole fight but that all ties to the sukuna holding back statement from gojo.
That only applies as you said for techniques imbued into the domain which in this case are cleave and dismantle.Thats why he could domain amp and His domain .But the fire arrow isn't imbued in shrine and we don't know if sukuna can change the actual technique he imbues in his domain mid fight plus that wouldn't really be meaningful as he will just be exchanging one sure hit for another instead of being able to lunch a fire arrow while his domain is slicing gojo.
@@monschi1715Sukuna wanted to make Mahoraga adapt to infinity in order to learn a new slash, which he did, but wouldn’t be possible if he killed Gojo earlier
I'm not sure why Heian era Sukuna would be unaware of domain amplification but I agree with basically every point besides that
Kenny teaching the curses DA doesn’t mean that he taught it to sakuna. The guy is a domain god who also has an open domain.
Doesn't the narrator say that Unlimited void and Shrine don't overlap fully with their sure hits?
So in the fight we got, every time they clashed, Sukuna shifted the hit to Megumi whilst the domains were both open, but if he doesn't have Megumi's soul to shift to, he might just lose the domain clash instantly due to how their domains overlap, it's a weirdly horrific matchup of domains without a host body for Sukuna
When other territories clashed, the sure hits were negated fully, but I think the fact that Sukuna's domain doesn't enclose a barrier is probably why it works this way, effectively he just overlaps an area instead, so if he doesn't close a barrier he might just lose in the most BS way possible.
sukuna's was purposely turning off his can't miss comand on himself in order to adapt to unlimited void, their domains would just cancel until sukuna's destroys gojo's from the outside
the narrator said they were cancelling each other out... this shifting the damage thing was an invention by fans who did not understand the literature written when they were both clashing domains.... what sukuna did was not protect megumi's soul using the sure hit of MS ...
this is a misunderstanding, Sukuna didn’t have to shift the damage anywhere, he simply didn’t cover Megumi’s soul in his sure hit so that he could put Mahoraga’s wheel there and use it for adaptation.
@@Axel_2K just re-read it, it's not super clear It feels like Sukuna should be able to target his domain precisely, but there's the whole making it smaller to not hit Megumi in Shibuya thing which gives me a bit of doubt there.
Basically, either his domain doesn't target himself in general (which would make sense given he would slash himself), or he can chose to exclude himself. We know that Gojo hits himself and gets affected, it's just the 6-eyes can process the info.
It feels like it shouldn't work this way, but it looks like it might or he'd hit himself with his slashes. Domains are all unique, so it's kinda hard to put a blanket rule on them clashing. (good example is the clash between Dagon and Megumi, the sure hit got turned off, but Dagon's Domain Shikigami could still attack Megumi normally, even though they are part of the domain)
Weirdly, Shrine, Void are the only domains we know of that just auto hit everything immediately with a lethal technique, every other domain involves an activated technique that is then guaranteed to hit. The other domains that just auto hit are all 'rules based domains' like Hakari's
Sukuna just changed his sure hit conditions to not protect himself and thus make Megumi be hit, he can just change it back
I love how smoothly he transitioned from talking about Gojo to laying a full blown explanation on how to master the art of GYM
Well, the manga has ended and I wanted to clarify some thing(s) that were speculated on. But tbf there are still volumes that have yet to be released and with those will come additional information like vol.28 has (though I haven't seen all the additions and corrections vol.28 made as of yet, unfortunately I'm still early in my Japanese studies).
The first is in regards to CE Reinforcement. We got definitive confirmation from a flashback of Gojo speaking to Miguel that if a sorcerer has a stronger base body then they are better off than one who doesn't if the amount of CE Reinforcement is equal between the two. So Heian Era Sukuna is most definitely faster, stronger, etc... than Yujikuna and Meguna. Conversely, that also means that Yujikuna was faster, stronger, etc... than Meguna and therefore more suited to hand to hand combat. In which case Sukuna (hypothetical ~20 finger Yujikuna) would likely have had an advantage over Gojo in their exchanges when using DA rather than simply matching Gojo as he did while using DA as ~20 finger Meguna. Therefore Heian Era Sukuna (provided he has DA, which it is reasonable and likely that he did) would certainly have had an advantage over Gojo in hand to hand with regards to just stats alone.
(I'll likely edit this as I go along and perhaps come back to it at a later time. Fair warning: it's not going to be in any particular order, just what I feel like at that time.)
Next is HP and it's effect on Sukuna. Whereas it would be a mostly reasonable assumption to make that Sukuna used DA to reduce the damage of both HP's he received from Gojo, no where is that stated and could only be implied via a generous interpretation of the statement. I've compared 3 separate translations of the passage (Viz, TBC, & Shishiso) and when comparing them together it leaves little to no room to interpret the statement as Sukuna having used DA for reducing the damage of HP. Shishiso (the most reputable amd accurate of the three) specifically says "reinforced arms", viz says "reinforced hands", & TBC says "enhanced arms". Other than "enhanced arms" (and even that is a pretty big stretch), it is clear that Sukuna only utilized CE Reinforcement and that was sufficient to weather HP. There was a third time HP was used on Sukuna from Yu/jo, but my memory is a bit foggy on how that exactly played out other than Sukuna survived it with minimal damage (relatively speaking). So for now I will not include that one here other than the brief mention to be through.
(I may again come back to this later today, but for the time being that will be it.)*Just wanted to express my appreciation for the video and thought exercise it provided, thanks!
It dont get past the domain clash. Sukunan wins the clash but now gojo is dealing with vajra, fire arrow, and more on top of that, sukunanis boxing with 2 arms punching, one if them whipping out vajra and another using dismantle while hes chanting attacks. We have to remember that sukuna wasnt going all out, he was prolonging the clash for adaptation, gojo even notes that sukuna couldve strengthen his barrier to destrot IV. He was simply never going all out as it main goal was surpassing infinity
Yes bro, people be acting like he did all he could, another reason he couldn’t use the fire arrows in the domain clashes is cause of the adaptation wheel being active. Imagine how much stronger he would be in his ascended state with all his cursed tools, faster casting due to the 4 hands and two mouths, stronger body and still the other abilities we are yet to see, bro just had soo much pride and wanted to be above infinity and make it a nonentity to himself which is why he took as much hits as possible to adapt more and more, especially now that we know the more mahoraga is shown a specific phenomena the faster he adapta
And then he still has domain amplification which would be stronger with the extra hands and mouths for casting
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
None of the things you named would bypass infinity. Fire, lightning make zero difference.
Maybe the extra arms would help with hand to hand but short of domain amplification or space/world cleave nothing gets through.
@@-UNKNOWN-13 cant sukuna just use domain amplication to neutralize infinity and then let his curse tool, Hiten and Kamotoke do the rest of the work? Or I'm trippin on how domain amplication works 😅
Old Heian era Sukuna would not have the knowledge that he has now from being inside of yuji’s body so he would never have known about how gojo’s domain expansion works plus modern day heian era sukuna is vastly more powerful than the old one, since he has learned at the very least 2 immensely important things which was the new space targeting slice and then also how to use RCT to compensate for a burnout after DE.
its thr same he will learn everything is his fight with gojo ur logic is dumb sorry
@@dalimelki2971 huh? Explain it properly
It was just assumed he didn’t already know how to use rct to heal burn out. And it was just assumed that he learned it from gojo.
Which actually doesn’t seem to be the case given Hana/angel questioned whether he knew from the beginning.
And on top of that after the 5th clash he knew ahead of time exactly when gojo would be getting brain damage and why. Then he literally started explaining how doing that is different than healing things normally. Implying that he already completely knew and understood how the process works before seeing gojo do it.
Altogether sukuna could’ve actually been using a different method entirely to heal his burnt out ct in theory.
He could've easily destroyed UV from inside in 2nd clash. Gojo himself said that. So there is no need for the yuji's body knowledge. He can learn to heal RCT burnout it by seeing gojo through the fight.
I really enjoyed this video and I can tell that you actually put a lot of effort into this. You are well informed and it's really cool to see someone looking at this debate through an objective lens based off of what the manga said and not some stupid nonsense like Pixel scaling or attempting to put math into it or whatever (because the author very obviously did not account for any of that at all).
That being said I'm gonna nitpick a little bit.
(I copied and pasted this paragraph from another comment I wrote) Sukuna is a Jujutsu geek, he literally lives for this shit. I feel like it would make less sense to assume Sukuna DOESN'T know Domain amp than actually knowing domain amp. He's the king of curses and fought and won against the strongest the Heian era had to offer, assuming that he wouldn't know domain amp/ not be able to figure it out himself in their fight is just ridiculous. He's able to pick up on Jujutsu abilities just by looking at them once, was able to see the potential in Megumi's 10S technique before even knowing the existance of Mahoraga/What Mahoraga was capable of, is always trying to enhance his Jujutsu skills (He literally altered his body to be the most efficient at using Jujutsu), his domain is even considered to be DIVINE because of his understanding of Jujutsu. There are far more reasons to believe he WOULD know than wouldn't.
Another thing, the assumption that domain's amp up the damage of the person casting the domain that Gojo talked about in his fight with Jogo is kind of iffy too. The reason being, as we saw, Sukuna's domain is far from ordinary. It already breaks the conventional domain in the sense that it is barrier less, and as I mentioned previously it's considered such a feat that the narrator calls it divine, so I don't really think you can assume something like that in this sense. We also don't actually know where the source of power comes from, whether it be from the barrier itself or just simply being in it so I don't think that's really a factor that you can consider in this fight. On top of this, it was stated in terms of domain refinement, Sukuna's and Gojo's were on the same level, meaning we also do not know that if two domains that occupy the same space with the same level of refinement would still be able to uphold the rule that your CE output/ damage would be higher, or if they would cancel out.
Also somewhat unrelated to what you said but I think when looking at this fight people actually disregard the amount of nuance and the objective of both sorcerers. I'm gonna go off on a tangent cause I'm kind of passionate about this dynamic lol. Gojo's objective in this encounter was to kill Sukuna by any means. We can deduce this from the ad-libbed hollow purple at the end of the fight that damaged Gojo himself, the idea that Gojo is actually a very loving and caring person (Demonstrated by his anger towards the higher-ups from sending Yuji to the detention center, and him doubling down on the fact he wants Sukuna to suffer for what he did to Yuji) and for him this fight is essentially "Kill Sukuna, or my students will suffer the consequences".
Sukuna obviously wants to kill Gojo as well but his motive is actually kind of different. He doesn't go into this fight with the same stakes at Gojo, he views Gojo as "another fish on the chopping board". Like I said earlier, Sukuna lives for Jujutsu. That's the primary reason why he used Mahoraga, he wanted to upgrade his technique and further expand upon his knowledge on Jujutsu because for Sukuna fighting strong opponents and getting stronger himself is quite literally what he lives for. So much so that he will gamble his life on it, because as was stated during the culling games, past sorcerers do not view life as modern sorcerers do, they will be more than happy to die in battle against strong opponents. Sukuna in this fight was quite literally experimenting, gambling on the idea that Mahoraga would be able to grant him a stronger technique. His goal wasn't to just KILL Gojo, but to get STRONGER in doing so.
This is also kind of why I disagree with the rhetoric that Sukuna NEEDED Mahoraga to kill Gojo. The only instance we see Sukuna talking about the development of his upgraded space dismantle was him stating that he **WANTED** a blueprint from Mahoraga to tear through infinity, there was actually nothing indicating that he **NEEDED** him, which is further reinforced by Gojo in the "afterlife" saying that he was unsure if Sukuna needed 10S in the first place to kill him.
This leads to an interesting dichotomy between both characters. Gojo considers himself to be the strongest, all his peers do as well. He calls himself the strongest on multiple occassions and also asserts himself as "the honored one". On the other hand, I cannot remember a SINGLE scan where Sukuna proclaimed himself to be the strongest. In fact, the narrator proclaimed Sukuna to be the honored one, not Sukuna himself. Gojo hasn't had any reason to increase his power dramatically since being attacked by Toji 12 years ago because in this era he is quite literally peerless. He hasn't had any reason to. Any curse he would go up against requires minimal effort for him to kill.
Sukuna, on the other hand, had to fight the strongest the Heian era had to offer. He had a REASON to constantly be stronger, because he lived for it and the pressure the environment he was in led him to as well.
I know I said a LOT but I genuinely think that Sukuna was destined to win this fight from the very beginning and that Gege always intended for this to happen, and this is without me talking about his actual Heian era form.
Underrated comment I read most of this massive essay and agree with all of it. clearly high iq chad 👍
@Six-bw3ir thank you man I really appreciate it. I think I really only scratched the surface at the dichotomy between two characters because I haven't even gotten into gojo or sukunas perspectives on being the strongest
This comment is lowkey better than the video itself
@guyschill2059 LOL thank you bro.
Completely agree with everything bro.....People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
Point to be note that when Sukuna was killed, his soul was divided into 20 fingers. We know in jjk theory that true Innate technique lies in soul. We never heard that Heian Era Sukuna's mummified finger was part of his soul. It's just he is so strong that his heian era mummified figure itself had the power of 1 finger. Sukuna meant that his mummified figure had curse energy equivalent to 1 finger but didn't involved with his innate technique. So his last finger will give him the full power of his innate technique
Yeah, he is still missing 1 finger of his soul.
Sukuna isn't missing anything, by your logic sukuna needs Yuji to be at full strength?
His body would contain just as much as a finger if not more (as literally stated when he ate his own head) he isn't missing any parts of his soul.
@@Chrisdish does that mean that his corpse contained the last part of his soul?
@@mist3325^dawg above doesn’t know what he’s talking about his soul isn’t complete since he didn’t take in all his fingers. Even if his head made up for the power his soul is still incomplete. So story wise his last finger will probably have some importance
1. It was never implied that Gojo learned how to do flip flop barrier inside prison realm. The guy learns and adapts on the fly just like Sukuna and the lawyer guy. He learned many things like that including CT that he couldn't prior to being "killed" by Toji, HP that he first used against Toji(he couldn't do it without mastering red and he could do red until he understood how to do CT).
2. Physical appearance means nothing. His face also changed along with the art style. Not to mention that you can't build muscle without food and created muscle tension(even calisthenics pros won't do much in a month). Calories aren't just energy if you eat 3500 grams of sugar you won't build muscles.
On top of that it was said that prison realm has no concept of TIME in there. That's why you can't change anything unless you die. So you can't subtract from your body and you can't add to it. The only change that is allowed is users death.
3. Just because Sukuna thinks he can kill Gojo at 15 F doesn't mean he can. He was already mistaken few times in their fight as well as surprised that Itadori could retake control of his body easily.
Gojo said he'd win the same way when he was first asked about him back in the beginning of the manga, so what's your point here that Gojo at the begining could beat 20 F Sukuna?
So both Sukuna and Gojo are overconfident characters. But Sukuna also had Mahoraga, so ofcourse he'd thought he could take Gojo even with 15 F. Mahoraga would make the most work anyway and he just need to survive long enough.
4. What makes you think Gojo got even stronger after 5 weeks and the difference was significant? You can't train much against opponents that can't fight on equal ground at least. And that wasn't the reason he agreed on a break. He agreed because it was 2 high level opponents(+Mahoraga) against 1 and he wanted to increase his chances of success. You're saying that Gojo could train himself in 5 weeks from 15 F Sukuna to the level of 20 F Sukuna?
5. Your proof as to why Sukuna is faster is absent. Itadori could clearly see Sukuna while runing to him and he isn't a speedster himself. 4 arms don't help with running at all. There is zero proof that Sukuna got faster. This people get faster if they have more CE, his CE remain the same.
6. To counter DE you SD, it's not as toxic on a brain thus Sukuna would have more trouble to even harm Gojo as outside of his domain only DA can help him and that's excluding his CTs.
6. Unlimited Hollow damaged Gojo as well but as you saw he RCT himself quite fast unlike Sukuna. So this would give more advantage to Gojo in a long fight because remember, sooner or later DE clashes will be over and Sukuna won't be able to do it for a long time. And this is when Gojo start winning. Sukuna CTs are useless on Gojo but Gojo's CTs harm Sukuna, slowly but steadily he would win.
Nah I'd win.
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
You stated that, the only reason meguna was taking it from Gojo was that for Magora adaptation, cause more he took hits faster the adaption was. So Heian sukuna will not need that, no reason to take hits so he will just go with the plan of killing Gojo not playing. Heian sukuna just destroy Gojo I don't know why those guys are discussing. In a domain clash sukuna will just win cause in Heian form his curse energy and his power are increased
@@As-pp1rmWhat are you even talking about?😂
The only chance bro has to defeat Gojo would be their domain clashes... we've seen how Gojo fared in his and we also so how he fared in Gojo's 😂... fight over❗
The domain clashes would be interested... we've seen Gojo is way better in H2H but two extra hands would maybe even the gap a tad...his extra mouths for chants doesn't nothing because it doesn't bypass infinity...
His only attack would be with domain amplification...
So educate yourself before you yap garbage mate☠️
@@osas2kul please with all respects! Leave. You don't know anything
@@As-pp1rm Had no idea you owned TH-cam 😂
And you're obviously the delusional/ignorant one here...
Re-read the manga if you may... assuming you can read of course ☠️
@@osas2kul brother there was no hand to hand combat, gojo was using limitless neutral and blue infused punches while Sukuna was operating with just domain amplification, if we took both of their CT's then Gojo does less damage per hit, no high speed movement and no sudden red. Hope you got it
Great analysis. I always appreciate your nuance to scaling. My biggest issue with Gojo scaling in general is he never really uses his ability to its fullest IMO.
For example :
He can literally teleport and yet he doesn't use it near enough. like why not teleport away from Sukuna so he can't touch him ? in the domain ?
He made made multiple blues ( if we assume those blues weren't fractions of one big blue ) so why not try for multiple reds ….. which could get him multiple purples + enchantments for all 3.
and lastly (unreasonable baseless fan boy head canon territory ...sorry ) its hard to believe Gojo doesn't intuitively understand jujutsu is about interpretation. his power is the concept of infinity, he made his DE sure hit mind crushing infinite info dump like surely he can conceptualise near Infinite speed or at least be insanely fast ? faster than even Sukuna. he has been shown to have crazy creativity and battle IQ .
Those blue little orbs that he fired at Sukuna under that bridge could have been much bigger and strong honestly, or a red maybe like you mentioned. I can't think of any other reason why Gege wasn't using Gojo's abilities to a greater extent besides wanting Sukuna to win the fight. A guy that controls space could have just done so much more.
@@blackreaper378 yeah that’s a good point ! I agree 👌🏾
@@calamityxdusk I'm not mad or unsatisfied with the outcome of the fight. It was no surprise to anyone that Gojo would most certainly lose.
But hearing Gojo say Sukuna was so freaking strong, he didn't go all out, I don't know if I could win either way.. All these statements that contradict the feats. Comes a bit as forced by Gege. Giving Sukuna prior intel, detailed information about Gojo's technique before the fight. The direct counter to any other cursed technique (Mahoraga). On the other hand Gojo with the six eyes still has no idea what Sukuna can do, or that he has a barrierless domain expansion.
Many people agrue "oh Sukuna would have ended the fight much sooner, since when their domains clashed for the first time". They expect Sukuna to fight differently but Gojo perform the same...
I don't think there will be any other occasion better thatn this fight to reveal Sukuna's technique and go deeper on that. If the 2 strongest won't give their all against each other, then against who? Ino? Choso? Mei mei? Yuji? Maki? Yuta? All these guys are drastically weaker than Gojo.
My concern now is that the good guys are still sooo weak in comparison. Gege is trying to fill in that gap with pointless statements that have no correlation to the feats.
How do you expect me to believe these guys will make Sukuna finally go all out when the character described as "he can do anything he tries, but doesn't get too involved with things for the sake of the next generation". The character with the technique that controls space, limitless, the strongest in the manga (claimed by Gege in the chapter when Gojo fought Jogo), can most likely delete you out of the existence (but Sukuna has the biggest durability aka plot armor) ... apparently couldn't make Sukuna break a sweat.
I don't know man. At this point just end the series with the antagonists winning. Can't see a reason why Sukuna isn't one shotting everyone. Giving us flashbacks mid fight of the good guys somehow finding ways to deal with Sukuna when they scale so far below him is unbelievable for me.
His power aint the concept of infinity tf are you talking bout?
@@blackreaper378 what makes you think that gojo didn't know about sukuna's open domain?
Everyone talks about plot armor on sukuna but noone talks about gojo's plot armor. Sukuna was able to pinpoint gojo's location from another district yet he couldn't sense a sneaky blue or red.
Gege never called gojo or sukuna the strongest of all time. Whenever strongest was used it was for their respective eras. The fight literally started as the strongest in history vs today. But for some reason people always use gege's previous statements by taking them out of context. And gojo and sukuna both can delete anyone out of existence.
The longer this video goes on the more head cannon and guesswork he throws at us
Facts. The levels of reaching is insane
@@nickstrong2756 yea I was expecting something a bit more nuanced, but he essentially just used head canons to build certain points and use those points to come to a baseless conclusion, I’m not even saying his conclusion is “wrong” but nothing in the canon gives us an answer as concrete as he just gave
Would've morden reincarnated Heian Sukuna be stronger then actually Heian Sukuna since his fingers would've have grown stronger over A 1000 years?
That’s certainly possibly actually
They haven't grown stronger. That was mistranslation
@@Zokalexwhat was the actual translation?
the curse on the finger grows stronger which is why they couldnt even destroy the gravewax anymore the actual fingers/sukuna himself doesnt get any buff
@@jxlswe249 thats facts.
Gojo would defeat hein Sukuna. People forget current modern day Sukuna is far stronger given the fact we knew his power grew everyday for 1000 years. Gojo saying Sukuna holding is meaningless when Sukuna pretty much stated he needed 10S to fight Gojo twice. To get rid of uv and to get rid of infinity. He could've turned back at any moment.
It didn't grow. The sealing got weaker and they were approaching their original power. That's the proper translation.
He could've killed Gojo with his DE+Fire Arrow combo, after the first or second clash, due to Domain Burnout for Gojo. He literally states that he wanted to use Maho to learn how to naturally get through Infinity and Limitless, and that the adaptation limits what he can do both offensively and defensively. Which is why he started using multiple Shikigami at once to split Gojo's attention from just him and Maho, and why he hid in the shadows for sneak attacks. Adaptation/10S keeps him from using Domain Amplification, C/D and Fuga.
He was playing a long, risky game just to learn a new move. That's his personality. Same reason he hasn't just killed everyone he's facing now. He'd rather see how much they can do and what they're hiding up their sleeves, than just kill them all.
@@blackmanwithcomputer you already contradicted yourself bro. Sukuna could kill him with fire arrow and slash combo which it self is a might but infinity would've blacked it.
@@khalidhayat6461 No it wouldn't. Infinity blocks everything, automatically, unless he wills it. After, both times after his DE (prior to the Sukuna fight) he got touched by an outside force. Hanami's CE and then the transfigured human blood. The DE aftereffect always disrupts your CT usage.
Mahito even flashbacks to Gojo, when he's thinking about how his CT is being disrupted like Gojo's was.
@@khalidhayat6461ever heard of CT burnout
1) speed id put heian era above gojou. Recently we've seen him blitz a piercing blood, something gojou was able to dodge. I guess you could argue he was fighting mahoraga and agito, but yuuji and the other arguably scale to mahoraga/agito now, due to recent feats. So he wouldnt be able to hit sukuna with hollow purple or even aim red
2) Strength id say sukuna because hes 7 foot, 4 arms made of pure muscle and he has more ce than gojou to amp himself.
3)in terms of domain interaction id give it to sukuna. Even though you argue that sukuna wouldnt know domain amplification, id argue he does knowing hes sukuna and that he was from the prime era of sorcecery. If gojou loses the domain battle he loses entirely, i dont think i need to go into much depth.
how is dodging piercing blood faster than gojo that makes no sense, if Kenjaku can dodge piercing blood how can Gojo not? How can being 7 ft make u stronger than the guy literally rag dolling you and strength is based off curse energy reinforcement so that literally does not matter. Domain interaction Sukuna would win the clash but he has literally gotten destroyed in his own domain and hit with unlimited void
Facts bruh like come on
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
@@nirbanjyotidas5828So you're telling me sakuna got almost murdered by infinity for fun? He got knocked out by a black flash for fun? His brain almost got completely mushed for fun? Him being stated to be nervous against a black flash amped gojo was for fun? And him screaming for daddyraga to stop gojo from doing the last hollow purple was for fun? Stop being dumb 😭
@iaw0kened442 Oh, yea forgot about kenjaku dodging that. Still I find it strange kenjaku dodges an piercing blood point blank, but barely, gojou gets hit but sukuna dodges it completely by a long shot so I'll give you that. However even if you argued ce does increase strength which it does, this makes things worse for gojou, since he's fighting someone with 2-3x his ce with 4 arms. We know people can still be physically stronger and contend with people who have less ce so either way this ce shouldnt be a problem. Maki and itadori are examples. He's not losing the clash nor is he losing hand to hand combat anymore, how does gojou beat someone with four arms when he was already have difficulty fighting before. Then he'd have to dodge 120% boosted dismantles and cleaves with chants aswell. On top of the fire arrow. It's just not fair
i asked this question in the live stream and broku delivered also screw u dude for ruining my sleep schedule, dropping this video just when i'm about to go to sleep
Oh no!!
You can talk about food all you want, but humans can go as much as 3 weeks without food, but only 2-2.5 days without water before dying.
Now I know what happened in the prison realm.
The prison realm has a personal gym, a full cafeteria, and great views of the prison realm from multiple wonderful window points.
Lmao bro was on vacation 🤯
@@Br0ku well I don’t know what you expect, but this is a show where everyone but Maki dies.
And as we all know, dying it better than long term culture.
Does Sukuna really want to deal with UN or congressional committees about his treatment of prisoners?
I mean the paperwork alone could be why Sukuna has 4 arms.
@@joshbkaufman you’re killing me 🤣
@@Br0ku trying to get the FBI involved now?
Wow. You know you admit someone is killing you, and in about 30 years the fbi knocks on my door.
Btw I already know how the show ends. (It involved a minor bit of kidnapping) but apparently right before killing everyone in the world, Sukuna touches a truck…. Seems like a normal truck, but it’s….
TRUCK-KUN!
As we all know, truck-kun is the most powerful being in all of anime.
1 touch and Sukuna is sent to another world and now apparently has to fight a demon lord.
The rest of the last chapter just involved the JJK sorcerers in a room discussing just how bad phase 4 and 5 of the MCU was.
"Like a Las Vegas Personal Trainer who claims to be natty"
Gojo is Mike O'Hearn confirmed😭😭
Bro it's confirmed😂.... Gojo trained after coming back from prison raim.... In chapter 150 yuta mentioned that ( we cheated) which fans speculate they did something to get more powerful in short amount of time...
1 theory is they used the prison raim ( which i highly doubt)
2nd one is you remember that guy who can slow time( fans speculate they used him like a time capsule)
And that should also say why gojo after releasing didn't fight 15 finger sukuna
HOLD ON
You made me realize that anyone with rct could be an elite bodybuilder within weeks, maybe even days, as they could just work out, heal, and repeat to get endless muscle growth
I think one of the biggest facts is Sakuna wouldn’t have the knowledge of Gojo domain, or how infinity works. Gojo spelled out his techniques for Sakuna to plan around. Without that prior knowledge who’s to say while Sakuna was figuring out Infinity he wouldn’t lost to the unlimited void. We also don’t know if Gojo knew how to heal his burnout before the prison realm.
It’s an interesting thought.
Gojo wouldn't tell a strong opponent how his technique works. He only did it to Jogo because he knew that Jogo can't do anything to touch him... He might be cocky but he's not stupid to tell the Strongest sorcerer in HISTORY his technique..
Kenjaku knows about Gojo's domain 😂 through Jogo 💀
@@Kill_em_quickthat's not why he was explaining to yuji. Also if you tell someone ur technique in jjk they get a buff. Todo said as much
@@Six-bw3ir First of all why are you bringing Yuji into this? We're talking about Heian Era Sukuna not Modern era Sukuna.
And the cons of explaining your technique outweighs the pros. Explaining his technique to the most knowledgeable and strongest sorcerer is like a death sentence.
@@Kill_em_quickWell he knows about it through Yuji and Kenjaku. Also, telling someone your CT makes it stronger
And there we have it!! Thank you!!
6:15 oh yeah most definitely prison did him right 💀 he went from twink yaoi to jacked it’s very common is JJK for character to get more jacked as they get stronger
Also sukuna finger doesn't grow overtime, some dude said gege siad it was a mistake in an interview and people who read japanese version say its an mistranslation.
I don't think it's fair to use the clash between 15 finger sukuna and gojo as speed scaling for sukuna, yes his heian era form is stronger and faster, but I doubt 20 fingers heian era sukuna is significantly faster than gojo, during the 1-month time skip it was heavily implied by gojo that most of his training was towards mentally preparing himself to fight megumi, nothing implied that he got way faster and stronger. As for the "gojo got jacked and thus got stronger" argument, I think it's entirely possible that gojo was this jacked before the prison realm simply because it was never stated that the went through any physical training in the prison realm, so that's just pure speculation at best. Just to clarify, I am not here to argue for gojo winning, I just think that putting him on 15 finger levels of speed post prison realm is a bit crazy.
That’s fair I just disagree.
Another thing is the fionger just gives him ce so he just ha sless ce in 15 f but that only is a disadvantage when the fight drags on bc he hasnt as much ce in general but output and efficiency is what makes youre ce reinforcement strong which doesnt change here.
Lol I will believe kanjaku's word more than you
And the fact that that same gojo proceeded to overpower 20f sukuna +mahoraga+ agito in hand to hand, has the same speed and strength as that same sukuna with 5 less fingers? Doesn't make a lot of sense
@@guyschill2059 yeah true
In an isolated 1v1, if we're talking about Heian Era Sukuna, it's a 50/50. If we're talking about current day Sukuna (before his fight with Gojo) in his four arm form, Sukuna wins 100%. That's just the cold hard facts.
I hear the argument Gojo can’t win a domain clash with sukuna since he can’t box him inside. The thing is if Gojo knows he can’t win a domain clash Gojo would just teleport out of malevolent shrines range. And would just shoot red from range. Since the reason Gojo and sukuna domain clashed is because If Gojo won the domain clash he would win due to unlimited voids effect. And sukuna fought Gojo in a domain clash so that Mahoraga can adapt to infinity. So Gojo would most likely teleport out of Malevolant shrine if he knows he can’t win. And sukuna and Gojo would just go to round 2 and fight without domains since Gojo would just teleport out if Sukuna uses his domain.
Nigga how would he know the range? It’s not like sukuna does the cheap ass move of explaining his cursed technique and domain expansion, it’s the narrator that does that for us
Plus did you see gojo at any point during their battle teleport? That takes very specific conditions to do and especially when he’s not in the heat of battle, imagine a million slashes going through your body and you have to meet very specific conditions to teleport while not knowing how big the domain expansion is, I think that’s why we never saw gojo teleport apart from goodwill arc
@@beetrus Gojo knows Sukuna’s domain size since he uses his own domain barrier to encompass Sukuna’s domain. And the reason Gojo didn’t teleport out of Malevolent shrine is because he was adapting to Sukuna’s open domain. Since if Gojo won the domain clash he would win due to Unlimited voids effect. If Gojo knew he simply couldn’t win a domain clash he would just teleport out. And he can even when being slashed since he was able to use simple domain,rct,rct to heal his CT, falling blossom leaf emotion, RCT with normal CT, blue, and red while still being in Sukuna’s domain. As it was stated that teleportation is simply a different usage of blue, Gojo should be able to teleport out.
True he might have known sukuna’s domain size,
Yes teleportation is a different usage of blue but as I said it needs specific conditions to be met which we aren’t told and also I believe if he could’ve used it he would, he hasn’t used it since goodwill when no one was actively attacking him and or in a serious situation
@@beetrus we see him use it against 1 finger sukuna and in jjk 0. It’s pretty clearly shown that the activation of his teleportation is just him clasping his hands together. We even see Gojo teleport other people away. And when Gojo was unsealed 8thousand feet underwater with kenjaku’s cursed spirits he teleported from the Japanese trench all the way to mainland Japan on top of kenjaku. The only reason he didn’t teleport out of Sukuna’s domain is because he knew he could win a domain clash. If Gojo lost a domain clash he could still survive malevolent shrine and recover, meanwhile if he won the clash he would just win the entire fight because of infinite voids ability.
The only problem I truely had with this fight is that there was no usual narrator build up/extra panels to Sukuna finally understanding what he needed to do to finally break through his infinity shown in a set of panels before us seeing Gojo essentially get off screened . I feel like if we were able to see something like that it would've been slightly better. Does anyone else feel like this too?
maho cutting through infinity was the clearest indication. just use the basis that sukuna learnt how to rct burn out instantaneously after watching gojo do it, add binding vows to his domain after gojo did it, etc etc, then simplify the logic.
When mahoraga cuted gojo sukuna replayed "that's good" or "lovely" I think it was, at that moment sukuna knew how to do it, or better said, saw how to do it, but it was a very hard skill to pull of so he needed time to figure it out, hench when he kicked gojo to agito he didn't go for a kill cos he could just crush gojos head with a flame arrow(we saw everyone how big of a nuke that shit is) o just cut gojo, he needed time, thats why he was nervous in the last moments of the fight, cos he knew what's coming and the state he was in, thats why sukuna was laughing after the nuke, cos he knew he already won
U can't tell on the first read because we see things from Gojo's perspective. When you reread u can see the signs. Pretty much every Sukuna does from the very beginning of the series is planned. Even the signs that Sukuna would take Megumi's body happen very early in the series. It's crazy, Sukuna really cooked all of us
@@ache5168I could have used this in some debates way back🤦🏾♂️
@@IdontlikeWhytepeople did it just never came to mind since everyone usually over explains?
Heinan Sukuna vs peak Gojo comes down to who uses DE first .If Sukuna uses Domain first Sukuna will just learn how to use DA or SD or FBD when Gojo uses one of these to protect himself from Sukuna DE as we know Sukuna can copy any CT that isn't locked behind a type of CE after seeing it once.
The prison realm (IMO) would be a form of time suspension like the hyperbolic time chamber, im assuming this based on the statement kenjaku made about releasing him in a 1000 years, so yea he probably didn’t need to eat either he was just a prisoner of time so yea him training would of course put some muscle mass on
Gojo's (*Shibuya / fp) only win-con against heain sukuna is if heian sukuna underestimated him like sh*t and got caught in the UV other than that gojo doesn't have anything that can one shot heian sukuna. While that guy has a stronger domain bcoz of the 2nd mouth plus that guy would use a trident against gojo inside MS with no infinity (*why am i seeing flashbacks of gojo vs toji but much worse)
Sukuna mid diffs
Gojo looses his first domain and gets spammed by cuts from malevolent shrine and Sukuna + fire arrows, lightning bolts and a spear. He would be dead before he could even figure out the strategy to compress his domain
and here is the massive knowledge buff sukuna had over gojo, sukuna had all of megumis memories, kenjakus knowledge about gojos powers and saw first hand through yuji gojos abilities aswell while gojo hadnt much knowledge about sukuna.
why wouldn’t gojo be able to just use falling blossom emotions and ?
heal with rct
@@kapplq8271 Neither of these techniques would save him, Sukuna would wipe him regardless
inside the domain sukuna only use dismantle not cleave the fight would end in the 1st domain battle.... you tend to forget sukuna have a goal to improve not just to kill gojo
@@nirbanjyotidas5828 he does use cleave, it's been stated that his domain does both cleave and dismantle at the same time.
Actually without the knowledge sukuna wouldn't turn his sure hit off, would just destroy gojos domain faster as even gojo was woundering why sukuna easy playing the risky game, wich we later get revealed is to adapt maho, without that sukuna wouldnt turn off his sure hit, hed just keep crushing it like the 1st and 2nd domain clash, realistically heien sukuna and even meguna without mahoraga wouldve win way faster, as they wouldn't need to play the long game to adapt to infinity but just straight up kill gojo
For those who don't know, anime/manga is called JJK (Just JoKing) and it's about a boy, Yuji Itadori, who harbors w/in him a malevolent entity named Sukuna who constantly makes jokes in his expense by making him commit assault, murder, mass murder, curse on curse crime and etc. It's a good read/watch.
I think some yall misunderstood what I said, which is fine, I could have been more clear.
I am not saying that Sukuna didn’t have Domain Amplification in the Heian era. I’m saying we don’t know. This isn’t me making a claim that he didn’t have domain amplification. My point was, he still has Simple Domain and I think that is enough for him to win especially with Domain Expansion even if he didn’t have DA. It’s not downplaying Sukuna if I’m saying that he still wins WITHOUT a technique. That would actually be more impressive.
Hope that clears it up. 💪🏻 thanks for the support.
Yeah👌🏾👌🏾
I mean your reasoning was fine but shibuya gojo is one of the weakest versions of adult gojo and heian era sukuna is one of the strongest versions of sukuna
And literally 15 finger yujikuna has arguments to defeat shibuya gojo because kenjaku considered 15 finger sukuna as a failsafe for gojo breaking out of the prison realm because 15 finger meguna who should be physically weaker than 15 finger yujikuna blocked an attack from unsealed gojo who should be stronger than shibuya gojo and before prison realm gojo wouldn't know how to change conditions of his domain plus we know that sukuna can use the fire arrow in conjunction with his domain because he did and a stronger version of gojo barely can out of normal melovelent shrine and if sukuna broke gojo's domain and put a barrier over his domain after that sukuna just needs to use fire arrow with his domain
Though i don't think 15 finger yujikuna beats shibuya gojo but these are some good arguments
@@Julian.noah2 yeah Kenjaku thinking 15 finger was a legit failsafe of beating Gojo is a point I forgot to add 💪🏻
@@Br0ku yeah and next do heian era gojo vs shinjuku gojo and if you are reading kagurabachi then can you do a kagurabachi power scaling video
It's pretty easy for me to see as to why Gojo would lose against a Sukuna from the Heian Era. If he was suffering that much damage in Sukuna's domain, then Gojo would have a much more fun time trying to deal with the Shrine as a bigger Sukuna, with four arms and weapons, gunning for his throat. I don't see Gojo putting up a fight against a guy with Sukuna's physique and knowledge like that, unless he finds some way to regenerate AND fire off a red faster than Sukuna is able to blitz him immediately.
sukuna was getting blitzed hand to hand purely based on ability, theres no reason to think any of that is goign to change with another body
@@benjaminpalmajimenez1843no reason? 4 arms and his body being stated as perfect is more than enough also sukuna never got blitzed by gojo wtf are you talking abt
perfect as for jj, not for h2h, also he got like 2 hits in maximum while gojo literally kod him @@solansigilknight
Hien Sukuna would still win. He wouldn't even need to Mahoraga in first place because he would spam his domain to neutralise infinity. People dont even understand what Sukuna can do is why all these people mouthing about him and Malevolent shrine.
Plus I don't think ascended true form Sukuna would be affected by UV, Sukuna got hit only because he was in human body of Megumi with normal humam brain. His ascended form is basically two people in one body. So I think it's arguable to say UV Can actually damage him. Because we can see in Shibuya mahito and other disaster cured got cured from UV than normal Japanese who go hit by Gojo.
saying heian era sukuna couldn't use domain amplification is baseless and counterintuitive when there is a ton of evidence pointing to it. he even uses his domain against the special grade earlier in the series before we even meet kenjaku and claims that domain expansions are "real jujutsu" which is an odd thing to say for someone who you claim only learned of it in the modern time period.
so you're saying he didn't know domain expansion even though he could use it after getting in yuji's body, and that was before yuji ever saw domain expansions anywhere else so we know sukuna didn't "learn" it from anything.
i personally think your argument for Gojo getting stonger doesnt hold up very well, inside the prison realm time is supposed to be non existant in a biological sense, its that way so that the prisoner doesnt die of age or die of starvation, so working out shouldnt have many results, how do we explain him having bigger muscles then? well, we do know Gege hadnt drawn him for like a year or 2, most likely he just drew him that way cause he wanted, his art style did change between Shibuya and Gojo's release, what they were referencing when Gojo shrunk his domain was that the expirience inside the prison realm teached him that shrinking a domain to a size that shouldnt be posible is actually posible, him being in a place thats smaller than he is showed him how to replicate that. and it wouldnt make much sense for him to have become twice as strong in between his release and the fight, i think what prevented him from beating Sukuna right there was he lost his edge, after being trapped for so long inside an empty space he would have gone a bit dull combat wise, so in the weeks prior to the fight he was just regaining his edge.
now im going to say a very hot take:
Sukuna fingers are just cursed energy, i know, its pretty clear that 3 finger Sukuna is weaker than 15 finger Sukuna, but we never learn how much weaker or why that is, when 15 finger Sukuna is fighting Mahoraga, he says "maybe back then, you could have defeated me" referencing the moment when Megumi almost summoned it against 3 finger Sukuna, and Mahoraga was close to winning that fight, had he not learned fire from Jogo he would have had to resort to a secret technique or he would have lost, yet he still says "*maybe*.... you *could* have...." if we go by the assumption that Sukuna's finger grant him linear power 5-10-15-etc, then he shouldnt have stood a chance against Mahoraga when at 3 fingers, we see Mahoraga was keeping up pretty well against Sukuna, but even if you assume Sukuna was only using like 30% of his power, that would still be superior to a 3 finger Sukuna, and its even worse if you assume its an exponential increase cause 15 fingers would mean he is much much much much stronger, so either he was holding back to an extreme level against Mahoraga and thats why he says Mahoraga MIGHT have killed him at 3 fingers, but it wouldnt make much sense since Sukuna HAD to use a domain expansion to win.
so i propose they just give him more CE, we know sorcerers become stronger when they reinforce their bodies with CE, they gain inmense speed, strenght and durability, so Sukuna becoming stronger is most likely bc he has much more CE to expend, we see right from the start that 2 finger Sukuna is much more superior to most special grade curses, he isnt just twice as strong as the finger bearer who has 1 finger, so clearly his power comes from his knowledge of CE, having more fingers wouldnt give him more knowledge, but it would give him much more ammo to spend.
another thing, Heian era Sukuna seems to be much weaker than current Sukuna in terms of CE, what Gojo said is that the fingers gain power everyday, so they better have Yuji eat them now in order to stop Sukuna from having even more CE in the future, this can mean 2 things, either at the moment Sukuna became a cursed object he lost most of his CE and he was recovering it, OR, in the 1000 years he was "sealed" he gained a ton of extra CE, now, this doesnt necesarly mean he would run out of CE in their fight, but it could be the case, we dont know how much CE he gained in 1000 years, maybe a lot, maybe without that he wouldnt have more CE than Yuta, we cant really know for certain, but it seems to be the case that he is stronger than ever before.
and i wanna finish off with a question, was it stated that all sorcerers who have a naturally strong body automatically have an advantage in speed, strenght and durability? yes, Yuji was going toe to toe with Todo while being a sorcerer for a month, but he was training that entire time, and he is clearly using CE to reinforce his body, so Sukuna having Megumi's, Yuji's or his own body shouldnt make much of a difference right? cause going 5 m/s faster or slower wouldnt make a difference when they are around light speed level.
My arguments are different, in my humble OPINION, gojo won against Sukuna heian.
*Misunderstandings*
1. *Malevolent Shrine's chants and slashes*: There is no evidence in the manga that Sukuna needs to chant or use more hands to power up his domain's slashes. In chapter 259, when he uses his domain with only one hand, it is not observed that the effectiveness of the slashes changes. This implies that the use of more hands does not have a direct impact on the attack power or range of the Malevolent Shrine.
In chapter 259, Sukuna was damaged, and proceeds to make a domain, Sukuna used a binding vow (in exchange for being able to invoke the domain with one hand, and other unknown things, I will be able to invoke the domain, but only for 99 seconds) even so, the power of the cuts of this incomplete domain, have exactly the same power, and I believe that Sukuna's Malevolent Shrine, the only limitation was the time at 99 seconds. If with one hand, its power and range is the same as with two hands, it suggests that it would be the same in the opposite direction. On top of that, he never showed that he enhanced the cuts of the domain, only those of his body technique.
2. *Sukuna's domain escape*: The idea that Sukuna could have killed Gojo with the thermobaric explosion is unrealistic. Kamino Fuga is not only a slow process, but it is also not guaranteed to be effective (Choso Block part of the explosion proving that Fuga is not part of the safe effect). If Sukuna had attempted Fuga, Gojo could have used a simple hold, and taken advantage to restore his *limitless* (infinite), escape and protect himself before Sukuna's attack was completed, or worse, attack Sukuna. This would have left Sukuna vulnerable, making the decision to use Fuga even riskier. (Choso Block Fuga blood)
3. *Weapons*: It is not relevant to consider the use of weapons in this fight, as doing so would weaken the argument in favor of Sukuna. The fact that Sukuna has to resort to weapons would indicate a lack of power, and if weapons are discussed in his case, it would also be necessary to review the possibility that Gojo could have used other weapons. In this sense, the fight becomes more about personal skills than external equipment.
*Statements within the manga*
1. *Gojo laments Sukuna's limitations*: In one of the crucial moments in the afterlife, Gojo expresses that Sukuna “can't do any more” he never said “don't try”, suggesting that he has already reached his limit in power and abilities. In Japanese, the word used is more specific, and denotes Sukuna's inability to continue improving his performance, implying that Sukuna was giving it his all and wasn't holding back any strength. This comment reinforces the idea that Sukuna wasn't holding back, but had reached his limit. In English they even say "unable" instead of "not tryn" (the biggest proof I have is that the kanji used by Yuta in Chapter 235 are the same ones used by Gojo in the afterlife, denoting the expression "Sukuna can't do more, as soon as we jump against him, he will be forced to change and kill us" referring to Shrine, Sukuna's "limitation" was not using Shrine (useless against Gojo) and limiting himself to the 10 shadows, not "not trying"
2. *Sukuna's fear*: When we go to Japanese. You are all wrong.
The kanji used do not have a direct translation into Spanish or English, in fact the official translation given in the American media was "uneasy".
But the interpretation of the kanji derives in the following (since there is no translation English:direct):
-uncomfortable
-worried
-anxious
-fast-paced
-stressed
-apprehensive
-panic
-FEAR is also one of the possible translations.
All of the above are valid translations and words if we look at the kanji.
-,The phrase "high on tension" is a strange translation, which would never have occurred to me as such, but I could think that it could fit, but it is at least a strange translation. Seriously, where did they get the phrase "high on tension" from? Was it a pirated manga? Or worse yet, VLZ?
With this, saying that Sukuna felt fear is as accurate as saying that Sukuna was uncomfortable, worried, anxious, etc. All of these are possible depending on the kanji used.
3. *Gojo and the 10 Shadows*: Gojo mentions that he is not sure if he could have beaten Sukuna without the intervention of the 10 Shadows technique, indicating that this technique played a decisive role in Sukuna's victory. Without the 10 Shadows, Gojo believes that the fight would have been close anyway, suggesting that under normal conditions, without this factor, Sukuna would not have had a significant advantage over Gojo. but even
*Statements from author Gege Akutami*
Although I don't have the interview in Japanese to translate, but in Spanish and English, Gege Akutami, the author of *Jujutsu Kaisen*, has mentioned in interviews that the only way Sukuna was able to beat Gojo was through the use of *Mahoraga* (one of the 10 shadows techniques). This reinforces the idea that Sukuna, on his own, without the help of that technique, would not have been able to defeat Gojo. Akutami even pointed out that the fight was designed to be interesting and strategic, using elements like the 10 shadows to create a balance. In essence, without that external intervention, Sukuna would not have had the ability to win. (margin of error, I don't have the interview in Japanese, only in Spanish and English)
*Cheating and preparation of both*
The thing is, that Utahime's only affected the first attack, which was more of a warning than an attack to kill, and it doesn't matter because Sukuna used the deer of the 10 shadows (from the ability of Megumi's stolen body) to heal his arm.
The thing about Gojo's barrier reduction he obtained by an empirical approach from experience APART and nothing to do with an observation of Sukuna.
(Look at Yuta, when he took Gojo's body, the first thing he did was shrink the barrier to resist the malevolent shrine, Yuta's was by directly seeing the fight with Sukuna)
While Sukuna obtained DIRECTLY and RELATED TO GOJO the way to counter the infinite void.
Sukuna entered the fight with a series of advantages that Gojo did not have. Not only was he using Megumi's stolen techniques, such as the 10 shadows, but he also had prior knowledge of Gojo's *limitless*, something Gojo did not possess in relation to Sukuna. This allowed Sukuna to be able to plan his attacks more effectively, resulting in his victory. Furthermore, Sukuna was able to keep his distance and heal himself during the fight, taking advantage of abilities that were not originally his. Gojo, on the other hand, did not know that Sukuna's domain could be opened, which put him at a disadvantage from the start. If both had had the same level of preparation, the balance would have been different. Such as using the "basketball" domain from the start, or using "fallen petals" in the event that the MS destroyed the UV, making the cuts not deep, thus not being in real danger in the first place.
*Logical Aspects*
Gojo fought against a powered-up Sukuna, who not only had access to stolen skills, but also vast knowledge about Gojo's weaknesses. Despite all these advantages, Gojo came very close to winning. This shows that, had Sukuna not had those additional cheats, Gojo would likely have emerged victorious. The Sukuna in his original Heian era form, while stronger in physical terms, would not have had the strategic adaptations that made the fight so difficult for Gojo.
*Conclusion*
In short, Sukuna managed to beat Gojo thanks to a set of external factors, including Megumi's stolen techniques and his knowledge about Gojo's *Limitless* weaknesses. Without these advantages, the fight would have been different, and Gojo, with his innate abilities, would likely have won in a more balanced matchup.
Gojo never felt like he was in any real danger, in the manga it's mentioned that it wasn't until Mahoraga broke his infinity that the possibility of losing his mind really came about, and even then, that possibility excited him, thrilled him, even pleased him. While Sukuna, as soon as he saw some difficulty, canonically felt fear and yelled at Mahoraga to do something.
A quick correction, Black flashes are NOT luck based, (they are luck based for every character that isn't very fast) but they occur when cursed energy is applied within 0.000001 seconds of a physical hit. So, with Gojo's speed its less luck and more skill.
Its worth noting that gojo likely didnt actually display his powers outside of the prison realm. None of his powers or abilities would cause prison realm to get heavy, however some one standing right there holding prison realm has an anti gravity technique that he primarily revearses to cause more gravity.
Kenjaku made it heavy in order to make sure he could get Mahito, hoping mahito would get stronger.
Prison realm looked like gojos eyes because the eye color likely changes to thwt of whoever is trapped.
8:30 you could say that prison realm doesn't allow you to die unless you wanted to suicide
It really doesn’t seem like Kenjaku taught Sukuna domain amp. Yea, it’s really a stomp. Kenjaku, whose opinion definitely counts, thought a 14 finger Sukuna would beat Shibuya Gojo. And that makes sense. If Meguna, who’s physically worse, could clash evenly with a buffed Gojo, then a physically stronger Sukuna using domain amp should be stronger. He still wins domain clashes, and this time there’s no Mahoraga stopping him from using fire arrows. Those definitely matter. Sukuna hitting him with fire arrows while Gojo is trying to recover his ct is gonna break the simple domain, which means Gojo is gonna get hit by shrine even more. Or if Sukuna shoots out the giant waffle cuts he did against Kashimo while he’s domain amped and Gojo doesn’t have his domain buff. Since he’s free to use any ct now instead of using ten shadows in the shadows, pun intended
This is before I watch the video.
As a Gojo fan I still think Heian Sukuna could win. He would fastly understand he can't touch Gojo, so he would engage him in domain battles. Is said battles, as opposed by Meguna, Heian Sukuna would not play as risky and try to dodge more as that would be his only way to beat Gojo realistically without claiming he knows DA and stuff like that xd. Sinse Sukuna does not play as risky, and has 4 arms that would sorta make up for the difference in H2H skill it is very likely that Sukuna can force Gojo to fry his brain because of repeated DE with just two domains of his own, rather than 3, he would also never suffer the effects of Unilimed Void. Don't get me wrong, the battle will still be extremely hard, Sukuna would most likely engage him more in combat before expanding his domain in an attempt to learn how to beat him, and also to have fun. Even after expanding his DE he would be suprised that Gojo can teleport and be caught off guard. But ultimately I think Sukuna would win a hard-extreme diff win, but still a win!
Edit: After watching the video, there is only one thing I disagree with two things. One is that Gojo got any stronger in that one month between him being released and the battle with Sukuna, I do however agree that a Post Prisonrealm Gojo definitely got stronger as compared to his Shibuya Self. And two I disagree eith you implying pre Prisonrealm Gojo would not be able to flip the conditions of his DE, he absolutely would, the only thing he would be unable to do is imgaine his domain so small as to trap Sukuna isidr it.
That said if we were comparing 15F Meguna to Shibuya Gojo, I would say it would go basically the same as 20F Meguna vs Prisonrealm Gojo, Sukuna would be getting ragdolled as he was in his 20F Form but ultimately would get what he needs to win in the end. As for Heian Sukuna vs Shibuya Gojo, I think it goes in the way I described up above with Sukuna possibly beating Gojo with a single domain not even needing to open multiple, he would also most likely shred Gojo making this a low-mid diff win for Heian Sukuna xd.
People tends to forget Sukuna didn't just want to kill gojo but also wants to modify his cleave.... sukuna's plan was simply take damage get mahoraga to adopt and learn an application to bypass infinity...and throughout the fight sukuna was doing just that....and if it was Hein era sukuna he will try a different plan and he will not fight how he did in magumi's body
@@nirbanjyotidas5828 exactly xd
I’m so glad there are smart sukuna fans who actually state facts because people glaze gojo too much and talk down on sukuna like he doesn’t have the most op ct in the show 🙏
As was said, physical condition is very important. So i feel that the only reason why gojo had an advantage in close combat is because sukuna didnt train with megumi or yuji's body. In my opinion, that also implies that sukuna with 20 fingers would be more powerful in close combat with yuji rather than with megumi.
😂😂😂do we imagine what would have happened if gojo never got that prison realm experience to help with that very small domain
he still could flip the internal and external conditions and like everybody forgets just escape ms.
@@monschi1715 wldnt that quicken the brain damage he does to himself cz we know he caps out at 5 domains... if and this is a ver big fat if he didnot get that prison realm experience wld he have figured out how to make that tiny domain b4 his 5 tries get done..
@@briansam5681 Yeah but ppl forget gojo doesnt need to engage de battles bc he could simply escape ms. The external and internal con switched de is just bc it could help at some point. Engaging in de battle was an huge disadvantage for gojo in general. Then not forgetting sukuna had such an advantage of knowing all of gojos powers.
@@monschi1715 sukuna dint do anything new... used slashes nd ten shadows which gojo olready knew about
@@monschi1715running out of a domain seems out of character for gojo..way out of character .
does heian era sukuna have any way around infinity cause the only reason gojo put it down in the fight is because maho was gonna adapt it and i just feel like we left out his biggest hax. not to mention that if we say that the sure hit from domains gets passed infinity whats to say he doesn't use falling blossom emotion to negate the effects. If we are being real and not just riding either character the biggest reason gojo lost is he was too cocky its his largest character trait. He was beating megunas ass and thats while having to be extra strategic about how he used his abilities cause of maho i dont see a world that heian era sukuna wins cause he has more energy and stronger attacks. The whole reason sukuna took megumi's body was to get maho so he wouldnt have to deal with infinity one of his highest iq feats. idk man id love to hear some thoughts on this cause i dont see anyone talking about it in the comments good vid tho!!
In the whole discussion you forgot about infinity. Even if Sukuna could use domain amplification he couldn't use his CT so he would be able to punch Gojo but not use slashing. All of his cursed tools and cursed technique won't be able to pass infinity except the one that Toji used. Also, Gojo is not just infinity, blue, red and purple he could also use other basic techniques like black flash, falling blossom emotion and other basic jjk techniques.
He got 4 arms two use domain amplification other two use curse tool
CT burnout, you forgot about this and once the infinity merchant looses his shield then its game over as we saw in the real fight
@@alexweah8396 If he manages to use domain amplification and cursed too together the Gojo can increase his infinity output which he used to destroy Hanami.
@@Katalin04 CT burnout is when DE is used which Gojo can restore.
@@durgeshkirpal460 thats what we saw in the manga, i am talking about the posibility of sukuna letting the cleave and dismantle hit gojo while using kamutoke or flame arrow as he is able to keep a domain up while using domain amp
When you think about it, our muscles are literally Mahoraga
When gojo talked about him losing to sukuna even without ten shadows i always thought he meant sukuna just turning back to his true form as
In the domain battle gojo would have lost if sukuna just turned back as he would have refreshed and just used a domain and won never using ten shadows
I love your vids, and I really hope to see Full power Gojo vs Heian Sukuna
Let’s consider if Gojo had the battle experience of Sukuna, is this fight even close? Gojo was only challenged like the three times in his life. He is arguably more of a prodigy.
Probably, but this debate centers on talent vs hard work. Gojo undoubtedly surpasses Sukuna as the most talented and gifted sorcerer. But Sukuna compensates with combat experience and knowledge. Disregarding one of Sukuna's crucial aspects is unfair and undermines the argument.
Consider a scenario where Sukuna had Six Eyes, is this fight even close? May sound absurd, but it mirrors the flaw in this argument.
Gotta disagree with Gojo being more of a prodigy. Sukuna has been cited by Angel to only require a glance at a Jujutsu skill in order to understand/replicate it. Gojo couldn’t learn RCT, even with the Six Eyes, until he was on the verge of death.
Time not moving in the prison realm says otherwise
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Crazy how when Yuta said that Hakari is stronger, everyone said that he is being humble but when Gojo said the same thing for Sukuna, suddenly ppl vote against him??
Ppl need to realise that Gojo was being humble there. And even then he said that with a 50-50 chance of him losing lol.
The only thing Sukuna held back against Gojo was his true form. He was going all out INSIDE MEGUMI'S BODY. He had no reason to hold back his output as he literally had a "reset to full health" button ready.
A true not holding back Sukuna which Gojo mentioned he would lose against would have been Sukuna with true form + TS which obviously would be stronger than Gojo. But only true form Sukuna vs Gojo will be a very close fight.
Bro THANK YOU so much for actually having some sense throughout this thread. Hein area sukuna is literally a bad matchup for gojo and meguna literally was trying to survive gojo after the domain clashes. Mahoraga saved this man 3 times. Literally begged mahoraga to upgraded his technique.
People when they realise sukuna was using gojo as a training arc.... sukuna wasn't even focus in fighting with gojo he was learning what mahoraga did and modifying his technique 😂...if sukuna was in Hein era form the fight would end in 5 chapter lmao
@@nirbanjyotidas5828 U guys will literally say anything to defend Sukuna lol 😂. If wut u said is the case then why did SUKUNA FELT NERVOUS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN 1000 YEARS 🤣?? Like imagine feeling nervous in ur training arc xd. Thats the wildest take I've seen in a while. At least make it make sense.
fun fact its either hinted or stated that kenny met sukuna and taught himthings in the heain era aka domain amp finger split not confirmed simple domain and more
Sukuna literally admits he’s not him, he wouldn’t have been able to beat Gojo w/o Mahoraga and Sukuna can’t go all out against Gojo because none of his many techniques could get by infinity and transforming back into his heian era form to heal is cool but doesn’t change his inability to get by infinity. Sukuna loses w/o Mahoraga protecting and teaching him, the extra power of the chanting and arms doesn’t matter if he can’t land hits
THANK YOU BRUH! Straight facts
how do you expect gojo to lose without slash across reality, the infinity carries him so much
Domain expansion goofball
Domain expansion and da
tbh when most people refer to gojo vs heian sukuna im pretty sure they're implying post prison realm gojo since thats way more interesting and thats the version meguna beat
all prison realm did was enable gojo to visualize himself in tiny space. the flipping of the domain conditions is just specific to gojo and sukuna because of their mastery of jujutsu. Also DE is about refinement and they're equal in refinement, sukuna and gojo would always tie where their domains overlapped, it would've always been a conditions chess match.
Also, about prison realm, time doesn't exist there, meaning there's no healing there. you are essentially as you were phyiscally. for example if gojo did fifteen push ups, he wouldn't feel it, he could do millions and still nothing. time doesn't exist. there's no forward or backwards. it's why he can't get hungry, or thirsty, or need to pee or poop, your body is essentially in stasis. that's how prison realm works. gojo describes it as feeling busy but it passing in the blink of an eye. prison realm is just mentally really tasking. hope this helps.
Personally i just think sukuna is just stronger than gojo point blank. the margin is small but thats what i think it is. sukuna would've always figured something out i think. Remember angel saying if sukuna finds another way to bypass infinity he would win. Gojo is just a really hard matchup tbh the combo of his talent, infinity then add six eyes is ridiculous, gege wrote himself into a corner but sukuna had to be stronger. if the fought 10 times sukuna would probably win 6/7 out of 10.
There is a plot hole in the fight, there is no way Gojo would’ve not seen the World Bisecting Slash, because of the fact the Six Eyes Sees and distributes techniques on a Molecular Level
Does that mean that using your Logic Toji is stronger than maki because he is more muscular now ghat I think about how are maki and a Toji equal I know the author wrote that but apart from a few people in JP the rest of the world is normal so body mass and hight even weight classes are a thing and didn’t maki just get her heavanly restriction a couple of months ago and Toji was born with it. Come to thing of it if maki and Toji lost their amp from their heavenly restriction Toji would win after all a jacked middle age man vs a 16 year old girl is pretty obvious so if they have the same amp the outcome should be the same how is this a debate 😵💫
Sorry but that is a terrible analogy
How so I mean logic works the same way in the jjk world so honestly since yoji is a middle aged man and maki is a 16 year old girl if they fought Toji would win even if they both get the same boost the outcome would be the same did I miss something like Toji was born with his ability and maki just got it a couple of months ago
There is a specific part where I am quite aganist what the video says and many stuff follow from that.
As far as we know consuming fingers add extra CE to sukuna's tank but we don't know if it increase his CE output... actually given how powerful sukuna is in his first consumed fingers compared to the rest of the special grades we saw... I think Sukuna once reincarnated had always his full output at his disposal but with a far limited tank of CE to use it with... if this is true 15 Fingers Sukuna and 20 Finger sukuna (or 19+ mummy) are equally powerful, just with less fuel to work with... but given that this fights hardly end because one of the fighters run out of CE this is a meaningless difference...This would explain why Sukuna was confident to defeat Gojo when they met soon after the Prison was lifted... For sukuna it made no difference having or no those extra fingers)... Also the canon statement of the fingers become stronger over time makes no sense (but this is not a problem of the video, but actually of the original material) because it would mean that depending on how much time passed 20 fingers Sukuna would have been far different in strenght by that... but not even once after that first statement something like that was said of him or any other cursed object (like the death paintings for example).
Now an interesting part, I am not sure the extra arms/mouths will produce differences in the DE, but let's assume it does... I think once this happen, Gojo will simply change strategy and not keep attempt a domain clash with Sukuna... Like if Sukuna beated Gojo in activating the Domain or Gojo dies there... or he could always flee the Domain Area and force sukuna to dispell the domain to keep fighting him...and without Gojo showing him how to recover from a burnt CT... the fight could go weirdly because Sukuna will be in his Domain uncapable of harming Gojo(who is out) but knowing that dismissing the Domain will leave him (relativelly) powerless aganist Gojo for a while... Gojo could even force sukuna to dismiss his domain shooting a purple at him from outside... without the 10 S, Gojo has not the issue of not using option to avoid the Adaptation as he did in the original
It's possible (maybe also probable) that Original Sukuna would win aganist gojo without the 10 Shadows but it will be overall harder for him
I am not surprised with how broku got tones of stuff wrong in this video. Black clover is just his special suit.
He did not need the 10 shadows to be Gojo and his origin form their domain expansions probably aren't a tie and he could probably outright. That's what Gojo was saying.
What do you think about Kashimo with CT vs hakari ?
Hakari dies pretty quickly but then it's a stalemate since Kashimo's ct would kill him.
Heian Era Sukuna can use his hand signs and mount incantations and amplify his domain effective output , that way he can create even stronger domains and break gojos domain. The only win condition for gojo is if sukuna is playing around without taking care of himself , but knowing sukuna , he would only take risks if he knows he can win. Gojo is always inferior to sukuna
Chants don't buff domains 😂...when have you even seen that?
Only binding vows do... chants only buffs his own techniques which would be useless against infinity anyways...
It's like you people don't even read the manga😂...
@@osas2kul chants can improve one's effective output , which can help him cast even more powerful domain with greater output , what do u think happens if sukuna domain output increases? It'll break gojo's domain way to sooner & gojo would be forced to use domain multiple times until he can't which is game over for him.
@@suraajgogeta5390 You chatting rubbish fam
Chants don't do anything for a domains😂...they only alter their domains through binding vows not chants...
If I'm wrong...tell me an instance... any instance that has ever happened?😂
@@osas2kul It was never shown till now so there's no instance , but since domain are cast by user, his effective output is domains effective out. So its safe to say signs and incantations can amp domain output
@@suraajgogeta5390 Bro you assuming...if it hasn't been shown...then it doesn't exist...
Sukuna used binding vows to increase his domain's slashing output by decreasing his domain radius... chanting does nothing for a domain boost...
Stop it with the assumptions...
We will never really know until we see sukuna’s curse technique
I believe this debate is too early sukuna fingers were getting stronger and after 1000 years he's probably stronger than Heian era version
Also heian era sukuna have weapons we already know that one of them can control lighting but we don't know what the spear can do
Mistranslation. The presence of his fingers was getting stronger
@@Zokalex even if you're right we still don't know what the spear can do
Gojo had this man screaming for Maharoga or however you spell it.
I don't see how casting a domain would be any faster with more arms and an extra mouth, it's not as if it's a technique like hollow people where you have incantations and hand signs
a few points
one possible argument for sukuna at 20fingers not being stronger/ faster than 15fingers is that we know CE reinforcement has clear limits and 20f sukuna already has more than 2x the CE of gojo at the very least so his CE reinforcement with only 75% his CE should still be maxed and you can say the remaining fingers would buff his techniques output.
another thing is gojo after getting unsealed said his training consisted of mental training to fight megumi any him being relative to 15finger sukuna in speed and strength makes no sense then since we wouldnt have gotten stronger in the timeskip besides the barrier techniques being refined and mental training(unless you believe my 15finger sukuna having maxed out reinforcement theory)
one more thing is that gojo did blatantly outspeed 20finger sukuna many times in the fights and he while being cut up by MS was still moving relative to sukuna and fighting him on even ground despite sukuna being over 120% cause of his domain buff.
also DA being able to nullify purple is a very far fetched thing since DA didnt even fully nullify a red which didnt explode.
sukuna also being able to do DE handsigns early is a maybe since gojos DE hand sign is shorter than sukuna(requires one hand only) so i doubt he would be able to cast it before gojo also casts his due to gojo also being able to see the spark which for DE would be very noticeable
also heian sukuna being stronger than meguna at 20f is kinda weird cause of what we know about CE reinforcement being able to amp you to a point. Kashimos "perfection" probably just means that sukuna's body is now perfected to handle doing multiple things at once(hand signs,chanting) so it becomes perfect for fighting. You can argue he got jacked that would improve the base physicals tho
all in all good video very informative
side note the domain clash would also be weirder since now sukuna has no info on gojos domain and they were equal in refinement and there is no megumi who can tank the sure hit here and stuff so its kinda weird how the sure hits would overlap or whatnot and once gojo strengthens the outer shell sukuna would take much longer to break it since now he cant use a binding vow to increase its output by turning the sure hit inside off and touching gojo. sukuna can use simple domain but sukuna is arrogant and might just think he can tank UV not knowing what it does and simple domain doesnt last at all against a domain so sukuna would be on the back foot either he spams simple domains so save himself or he takes longer to break gojos barrier
Firstly, Shibuya Gojo and Gojo after release are still the same guy, for some stupid reason people are divided because his clothes are torn and he is jacked. They can't see that after the Prison Realm, Gojo wore his jacket again and talked to Gaku Ganji. He looks exactly the same, just in stupid baggy clothes. Yes, Gojo trained for 1 month, which is something we never get to see, plus his Domain shrinking technique, which he might have learned from the Prison Realm.
For Sukuna fans and arguments: You only rely on 'What if' to this date. Sukuna bypassing Infinite is always a question, and 'What if' also leads towards him not being able to do anything against Gojo. Secondly, the author makes Gojo say those words, 'Like Sukuna didn't give anything, was holding back,' when just one chapter ago, Sukuna felt fear/unease for the first time in his life, while Gojo was Black Flashing him everywhere, knocking him out, etc. Gojo also commented, 'Thanks for taking it seriously.' So, if holding back is a definition of getting knocked out, then my comprehension level may be different from yours.
Thirdly, the whole fight was Gojo adjusting to Sukuna, then you call it making it sound like the other way around. Gojo got 0 intel from his group (for some stupid absurd reason when they had a 1-month time period together). Meanwhile, Sukuna had all the intel from Yuji and Megumi, plus Kenjaku, who already had all the info about Gojo, despite Kenjaku himself not being able to deal with him, but of course, Sukuna could. Sukuna was already prepared from 100%, whereas Gojo came with 0%, giving his best there is to give.
i mean he quite literally held back his true form so i dont know what to tell you
@@BlackJack32.God you fruadkuna fans are being cursed by the reading comprehension devil. When sakuna transformed back into his original body he lost the 10 shadows lol. He literally would've never been able to bypass infinity besides da, and he probably still wouldn't have been better at h2h against gojo.
@@treyvondavis3503He wouldve due to four srms and chants and amped domain and even gojo said he loses without the ten shadows.
@@treyvondavis3503 gojo said sukuna held back you gon argue to the guy with 6 eyes Buddy just mad sukuna won
Never been this early before. Sup Broku!
Bro took a lot of liberties and there was a lot of bias in this videos
Sukuna in yujis body < Gojo = Meguna < Heiyen era Sukuna (Only because of him having advantage in Domain expansion fights, i can't see a world where sukuna could possibly beat gojo with just domain amp and his 4 arms)
That's my opinion about it
Chants wouldn't increase domain strenght aka the barrier( that wouldn't be a factor cuz sukuna as an open barrier domain) but what it does increase is the domain surehit strength as your surehit is your CT & chants increase CT strength. So 20f true form sukuna would most likely(100% would win) win the surehit battle against gojo or break gojo domain from the outside before the 3min 9s, thus gojo losing either way.
Not the mention the fact if sukuna spam 20f chanted flame arrow at gojo while gojo already as his RCT runninng at MAX output against MS, bro would be cooked( I don't see how he would have time to heal his CT or last long in MS if that as the case).
why would chants boost youre de or ct when youre output hasnt dropped? theres a reason why the subtraction thing was broad out and someone like gojo could us emax output blue without chants.Also calling the name of the de is already the chant. When has sukuna shown to be able to use his ct when using his de? There should be a reason why he can use de and da at the same time bc the physical shrine contain the ct know.
@@monschi1715
1. Chants has nothing to do with your output. Clearly gojo didn't have lowered output at start of fight when he fire off that 200% purple but the chants still boost his CT to 120% and true form sukuna was constantly using chants to boost his CT reguardless of his output( bro output clearly was high).
2. Chants would be impossible for gojo to do inside his domain. 1. He would need to endlessly chant to match his domain duration & form hands sign which he can't chant endlessly cuz he as human heart & lungs( stress his lung & heart and kill himself) and can't form hand signs while doing h2h( doesn't have extra arms) only sukuna can do that.
3. Chants don't restore output like black flash( this is while only time its stated gojo output returned, was when he hit a black flash), it only boost Ct output so it as nothing to do with your output( CE you have) and chants aren't good for combat for human cuz u would be busy chanting and it would slow u down( require u to focus on the chant) thats while gojo only use chants when no one was attacking him and he had distance from them aka when punch maho and it couldn't move & he outed sukuna with black flash , end of fight when he had distance from them and start of the fight.
4. Just imagine gojo trying to chants while been attacking by sukuna, bro would pick a alot of punching from sukuna while trying to chants as he wouldn't be able to defend himself. This is why the manga hype up sukuna true form up as being prefection for jujustu and there better advantage for jujustu than it meaning it better than any other amps, 6eyes and DE amp. ( its basically hitting an infinite black flash for sukuna)
JOGOAT BEATS BOTH OF THEM
Also, 15F Meguna wasn’t equal to Gojo. He clearly wasn’t trying to kill him and it’s logical to assume he’s not at full power in that moment
There is no verson of Gojo that can defeat Sukuna. Sukuna would not underestimate his opponents, he 100% would no let Gojo inflict Infinit Void on him, for the sake of argument lets say Final Battle Gojo clashes with Heian Sukuna and they tie again until Sukuna slashes the 1st barreir then Sukuna can spam flame arrow, kamutoke and anything else that he has before Gojo can recover.
the finger aren't exponential it is just that they need a time to recover they're power
5:12 lol who said that? Gojo obviously got stronger in the prison realm. Didnt Gojo say he was training. Like when he died he said it. "I was training this body to the limit"
gojo saying sukuna didnt try his hardest isnt concrete evidence
Heian Sukuna vs Gojo is like pinning a Chad against a Adonis
I'm stupid so could you give this creature the information about who is Adonis?
@@davidsamarra2053Gojo. To refer to a guy as Adonis is basically implying he’s the perfect man, with a flawless physique, and you get the gist. Perfect in every way. Where Heian Sukuna is a Chad, Gojo is one step higher by being compared to a god.
@@chillguy7687 ah ok thank you.
@davidsamarra2053 I think he meant sukuna but imma say Gojo
Its crazy how persons think that sukuna in his original forma (einan era only) beat gojo becuz he has more arms and another mouth. We witness gojo fighting against, sukuna, maha, and the other shikigami, thats six arms and still held his own. And sukuna couldve manifested his mouth on his body (just like in the anime and maha fight) but he choose not to do so cuz it wouldne have done anything significant just like him not using his ct against gojo infinity. His form doesnt dictates his chances of winning since from the start sukana already had 100% information on gojo while gojo didnt knew anything about sukuna, without that prior knowledge the chances increases of gojo wining, which is fair.
Gojo saying that. Was literally gege destroying gojos whole character. Straight up murdered him.
sukuna in megumi's body is the strongest form of sukuna cuz of a simple math sukuna at shibuya was 15 fingers and it was implied that jogo is about 8 fingers of sukuna,but sukuna in megumi's body has magohara which way stronger than jogo so (jogo=8 fingers20 finger sukuna)
Kashimo's CT was so powerful that Sukuna was forced to reincarnate into this form yet people are always slandering him 🙃 weakened or not, it's an impressive feat
about gojo can't change domain conditions if he's never been traped inside the prison realm , in my opinion the only thing gojo learn from it aside of physical strength is to shrink his domain to basketball size and keep the inside bigger , and changing other condition of the barrier like make the outside Stronger than the inside is something he can do even he didn't get traped inside the prison realm, and if sukuna's finger get stronger by time that's mean the current real form manga sukuna is stronger than the Hein era sukuna , that's doesn't mean either win easily but it will be interesting fight and maybe better fight
gojo hopped on cycle in the prison realm
I have 3 mains contentions with this video...
Firstly, we both know damn well that Gojo was lying through his teeth when he said that Sukuna was stronger than him.
Secondly, there's no solid evidence that Gojo got stronger from the Prison Realm besides him looking stronger. It could very well have been a stylistic chance.
Thirdly, you keep saying that Sukuna in his Heian Era form would be stronger than he is now, but I find that highly incorrect. As you previously stated, his Fingers get stronger every single day - and it's been over 1000 years since he split his Soul. I find it highly likely that his differential in power between his Meguna form and his Heian Era incarnation would be significantly different to Gojo's Shibuya and Shinjuku forms.