More Death in the bicycle industry!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 เม.ย. 2024
- A look after the demise of the bicycle industry with yet another well known player biting the dust!
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Long live rim brakes and mechanical shifting.
Rim brake is long dead
They'll stay alive, just like people using carburetors on their classic cars.
*Coaster brakes are still out there too😂
@@rauli386 Nope@!
Bring back 5 speed cassettes and downtube shifters!
2nd that.Keeping my 90s and millenial bikes!
The bike industry has forgotten its roots. The appeal of cycling to me has always been utility, economy of movement, and mechanical simplicity. Bikes were all relatively simple and affordable until the last few years when the proprietary tech and marketing bs took over.
...and bicycle riders have forgotten tradition.
Nearly everyone has a $1000 road bike. They're significantly better than the junky $700 bikes I sold in 2005 and cheaper accounting for inflation
You are confusing "the biking industry" and "road bike manufacturers" - global bikes sales are record high and commuter bikes are not expensive at all. Belt driven commuter bikes today are as simple and zero maintenance as imaginable.
@@veganpotterthevegan agree 100%. There's a huge difference between road cyclists "wants" and "needs". You can get a very, very capable road bike for 2.000$ but many aspire to buy a Tour de France model. Also, so many buy new bikes every year. I buy a new Ultegra-class bike every 10-15 years - and they run like clock works until retirement. Also makes the initial price matter little.
If you think QA/QC in the bike industry is bad wait until I ream technical support! It's hilarious!
Can't wait. My LBS recently had multiple failures, high end gear. They need to send back from the Scram company
tech support is going to just be an AI soon
Price gouging because company profits come first. $8k for a top of the line quality bike 10 years was an aspirational goal that actually made sense if you were into the sport. $16k or more just doesn’t make sense……
Yep. I have been saying this forever. Veblen Goods, they got greedy and tried to justify the outrageous price increases with Research and Development and all the other bull$hit marketing lingo. CYCLING IS THE NEW GOLF as I coined a long time ago. I almost sold my Tarmac SL3 but glad I didn't because it weighs 16.14 lbs with pedals, cages and garmin mount. I would have to pay $12K for a disc brake Specialized at that weight. My 2022 Orbea with Ultegra Disc is over 20lbs with crap stock wheels.
I Live in UK..a decent bike with DI2...relatively good wheels ..and quality frame costs a minimun of £8000..guess what no one is buying....bikes in shop windows for months..bikes few can service with disc brakes and internal cables..not to mention the tubeless nonesense..which few people can cope with...Yep bike industry is finished..bring back cheap steel bikes that kids can afford...
People said this during the last crash too
My son bought a Giant TCR Advanced Pro 2 which has Shimano 105 and carbon wheels for £3000. Awesome bike.
The bike industry had it right for a very long time. Then it seems like the new breed came along and thought they could do it better. They went the proprietary fiddly high tech and hidden cables route, and chased the high end of the market. Which was very lucrative for awhile. But made everything from low to mid range much more expensive, and much harder to work on and fix it yourself. But now with inflation and the cost of living crisis, many people who otherwise would, can't really afford to get into road cycling, so aren't buying. Without the numbers, the grass roots, the bike industry may be in big trouble over the next few yrs. Simplify or die?
.
F 'em...
Let the name-brand
manufacturers fail.
Maybe it will be a lesson
to up-and-coming
companies how not to
treat their customers.
Rapha announced layoffs also. Too expensive for a jersey!
Used to have sale twice a year. Now they are sending me discount codes every week.
Funny thing: not one single Rapha product made in the uk
@@korsveienStill not buying their overpriced shite, it’s still overpriced even with a coupon 😂
Find a 10-12 year old bike, aluminum or carbon, ultegra or dura ace mechanical rim, shimano or mavic 10 speed wheelset.
Top of the line in its day.
$1-2k. Done.
Absolutely right!
If you use your brain and look around you find these deals! 👌
Or even high quality vintage steel.
Sad for Stages because my cranks are working great. Trek is digging its own grave, because I (and I am sure many others) would have bought one or more of their bikes if they were sort of competitive, but they are the most expensive and heaviest on the market. Also Scott, BMC, Specialized, Bianchi... all too expensive. There is no space for so many aspiring Louis Vuittons on the market.
I’ve been told by somebody in the industry that the very top end of the market is doing fine, people with money always have money so Colnago and Pinarello for example are doing well.
The same guy tells me the bottom of the market is fucked because everyone who bought a cheap bike in vivid times will probably never buy another one - most sitting in sheds not being used. The middle sector is suffering due to over supply and too expensive for the middle market buyer.
@@huwsalway4099makes sense
I meant Covid times, sorry!
Prices dictate any market and the cycling industry has inflated prices beyond control and now the dust is settling !
A top notch carbon bike should not fetch more than 6000 € in my opinion - Scott’s addict RC ultimate pro is 16000 € . How many can afford 16000 € on a bike ? Yes , of course, you’ll find cyclists but this is not the norm .
I think in this current predicament finally the consumers will stand to gain !
No, a top notch bike no more than 3000 dollars, a new honda 500 NX is 7500 dollars how a simple bike can cost the price of a motorbike ?
The high prices of bikes and parts, especially since the lock down year, are becoming unsustainable, as most everyday non-racing cyclists have little motivation to spend 5K, 10K, or more for a machine used for recreation or transportation. The edging out of simple rim brakes and mechanical group sets in favor of hydraulic brakes and electronic transmission systems, combined with a shift from affordable steel and aluminum alloy frames to the carbon fiber frames preferred by racers, has shifted much of the bicycle offerings into a very "niche" group of cyclists. Not only is the entry cost very pricey, but the costs of maintaining the more complex systems are high. I miss the days when you could find nice steel framed bicycles in bike shops, featuring Reynolds, Columbus, or Tange frames and high end mechanical group sets.
I would hope that groupset prices drop as a result of Chinese competition. There really isn't much in them engineering wise and they have been massively overpriced for far too long.
Exactly, make variable speed drives for Escooters, but to move a chain 10cms, 3 times as much!
1000 dollars for a full Di2 105 would make me maybe consider to upgrade from 11 speed 105, but 1800 dollars it’s just out of the question.
I agree 100%. Shimano needs to drop their prices on electronic groups. It's cheaper for them to produce them than mechanical groups but they still want to gouge the consumers. In all this time the electronic groups have been out there is no way it makes sense that a 4K big screen TV should cost less than a couple of components that make your chain switch gears on a bicycle. It's not ground breaking tech anymore.
@@charlesmansplainingwhere is your proof that an electronic group set is cheaper than mechanical (or as I think, you are guessing)?
I think you need to realise how cheap electronic components are from China. WiFi and Bluetooth chips are literally cents. To actuate a function of movement is an extremely simple task, with low current motors. The housings, bearings, and moving parts would be more.
I'm going to sound like an old geezer here. While I do have a carbon cx bike with ultegra di2 and carbon tubeless wheels, my main road bike is a Marinoni brazed steel Columbus SPX frame with mostly dura ace 9sp and open pro mavic wheels. The bike weighs around 22 pounds but doesn't feel any less lively or agile than my carbon bike. The ride of a good steel bike is truly exceptional. Don't laugh if you've never experienced it. More young enthusiasts need to experience that for themselves. I just need to do something about that 39x23 granny gear. Ugh
Agree that classic steel bikes are a great ride.
Titanium also,a lighter steel bike😀.
My Bianchi Columbus genius is the sweetest
ride with Campy and Celeste of course😁
That's a sweet ride
Sounds a lot like my Peter Mooneys also with the same granny. I don't have any real mountains in my area though.
I accuse the cult of Strava with the data obsession of KOM, watts, heart rate, FTP etc etc. Normal cyclists just don't need internal cabling, more than 9 speed cassettes, hydraulics, electronic shifting, tubeless, £80 tyres etc etc etc. As others have said here, economy, simplicity and freedom have been lost to innovation and watts.
Lance Armstrong made Trek
Yes
Epo doping made Lance Armstrong. Cheating, lying low life. An ugly stain on America.
I've said before they were making cycling a niche market by charging outrageous prices for bikes. But now, with products coming out of China and purchasing directly from the mfg through aliexpress/temu and the increase of cheap ebikes, the customer base is going to dwindle exponentially.
Interesting news. I guess I've dodged a bullet.
I was about to pull the trigger on a Stages Single-Sided crank based power meter, and I spotted them for sale at US$200 a pop.
However, the arrival of the Favero Assioma Pro MX-1 persuaded me to hold fire.
Sure, it's almost twice the price. But I can swap it from bike to bike in seconds if I want. And it;s still a fraction of the price of any other MTB-style power meter pedal.
Plus, it's a sealed, rechargeable unit, so there's less/zero risk of water getting in through a loose battery cover.
It's a shame Stages has gone extinct. But, the did pioneer the idea of less pricey powermeters, so max kudos!
Cheers
Stages definitely helped push prices down but you dodged a bullet not buying one. Other than Garmins early pedals, they had the most warranty claims of any PM I sold...worked at one of the top Stages retailers in the US and they kept me very busy
@@veganpottertheveganThat's also the impression I got. But, the low price of US$199 almost persuaded me to give the Gen 3 a try in the hope that they'd solved most of the issues.
As an old mountain biker who rides SPD MTB pedals on the road, I was also attracted to the Garmin Rally Pedals. But, they also seem to be fraught with faults (water ingress, etc) and technical foibles. Plus they weren't inexpensive.
Favero looks like it has nailed it with the new MX Pro models. Every review I've seen rates them highly. And the prices are lowest on the market for pedal-based power meters.
I'll give them six months or so to bed in and then decide. If people are still in love with the MX Pros, I'll probably go for the one-sided model.
Cheers
I've had a left sided stages since 2017. Great product. No issues at all, apart from the odd high reading after hitting bumps on downhills at 70kph when it thinks u've done a revolution and reads like 1400w's. I wonder if what also hurt stages was the fact that any pm on a right sided shimano crank, just couldn't read accurately due to their weird unsymmetrical shape? I was going to buy one until I read about this problem. I assume many others did too which probably lost them a lot of sales. And may have hurt their perception by default?
Quality brand bicycle parts are super cheap nowadays. It's just up to the bicycle brands to actually offer nice bicycles with those parts to their customers.
Most powermeters are still very expensive compared to any other bicycle components, and brands like stages and others restrict themselves to the high-end market.
I’m in the uk someone else put out a video saying UK bike sales are at a 39 year low .I’m 59 when growing up almost every kid had a bike which needed to be replaced regularly because kids grow.I don’t see many kids on bikes nowadays the numbers have been declining for years.We also have an ever increasing population so more cars on the road.Many of these newer car drivers never rode bikes on the road as kids.Its my perception that the roads are now much more dangerous for cyclists,mainly due to angry almost homicidal motorists.If I had young kids I wouldn’t be buying them a bike to ride on the road.Add to this bike prices and the current cost of living it seems inevitable that the bike industry will have to downsize
So so true, unfortunately 👍
Companiea do not die. Unless they are US corporates, with more rights than humans.
😂
Even if I won the lottery, the bike industry doesn't really make the sort of stuff I like anymore, it's all planned obsolescence proprietary landfill e-waste, except freestyle BMX, the most conservative, traditional cycling discipline left today, where a bike is still a bike, with metal. The chain of my BMX would be able to cut through most of the latest and greatest crap.
The best description of why bicycles are not selling. Escooters have taken over the places that bicycles were dominant.
Stages is a good powermeter. I have mine since 2015. It bee through rough rainy season with alot of humidity. Battery last 5 days(not switching off) but it working.
An interesting point about electric scooters but I’m not sure this is the core issue in the troubles of the bike industry. Too much focus on the “Formula 1” buyer, yes. 🤨
It'd be smart to almost give 2020 models away just to bring in new riders. I rarely see anyone under 35 in any of my local bike shops and this is NYC.
Took some friends in today, they took one look at all the Pinarellos and just new they could'nt afford to ride, no need to even see the prices, I rarely see 20 somethings on propper road bikes in the city, just tacky e-bikes and city bikes mostly SMH
Still use mine. Worked perfectly for 6 years.
Haven't bought anything new recently, i just stick to vintage domestic produced bicycles that was made here in Norway from the 80s and down, i realized that they actually offer all that i want, they're very durable, comfortable with a relaxed geometry kitted with a sprung saddle and they're utilitarian, racks, stainless steel full coverage fenders was standard then and a solid kick stand that never breaks. In addition to that, they're so much more fun to ride than new bikes and they're cool as hell, modern bikes are like modern cars, they lack character, they just do do it for me.
I've never seen power meters as a thing needed to cycle and improve fitness. I'm sure they have had their place for some racers but I've raced and won races and never used a power meter. So these companies making them won't be missed by me.
I like my road bike with rim brakes and mechanical shifters more than my road bike with disc brakes and electronic shifter.
Using the Stages power meter on one of my bikes. Crossing fingers it will continue to work for several years... 😐 somewhat addicted to power meters.
Kona is another major brand to face the grim reaper.
My Kona Kahuna still going strong after 12 years.
I wouldn't shed a tear if some of the 'Big Guns' bite the dust. The way they treat customers with their lack of choices and rapacious greed for profits is unacceptable for me. My CANYON CF SLX 8.0 (6.7 kg, A $4700) is now 8 years old and in excellent condition. If I would have to buy a similar bike in that category now I would have to spend more than double the price with features I would hate to have (disc brakes, DI2, internal cables in handlebar etc.) with little or no choice. I'll keep my bike as long as possible.
Other sports have this issue as well, like golf. The pros use continually more exotic equipment and the sport begins to be significantly different for the elite compared to the enthusiast. It becomes too expensive to use something similar to your favorite pro.
Why did Stages go bust? too many staff and high wages most likely
I am curious what the correlation looks like for standards. That is, are the brands that are continuing with long used industry standards remaining more profitable than the companies that are jumping to new “standards” or proprietary components that don’t enhance value for the typical rider.
With existing standards tooling is paid off or amortized over larger production volumes and the engineering and manufacturing personnel know a few things about optimizing the manufacturing processes. Are the engineering development costs and low volumes of unique designs disproportionately high even for the high prices of high end models?
I am intrigued by enhancing efficiency by stacking marginal gains but doubling the purchase price to save a few kilograms of weight or a couple watts of resistance isn’t a good value proposition for someone who isn’t trying to earn a paycheck on the bike.
With the bike industry, there are very few standards why there are so many people manufacturing all sorts of gadgets, bits, and pieces. It is pretty low regulation. Even the UCI is not a quality standard, just a design standard. This is why we see so much rubbish in the industry. The stuff Hambini refers to is component or fitment standards, which is industry wide, not bicycle specific.
I was referring specifically to fitment standards, meaning dimensions and compatibility. Cassette splines are an obvious example. It was reaching the point that derailure hangers are as unique as finger prints. The UDH may be a step back towards standardization. How many different splines exist now for cranks? How many different designs are out there for screwing or pressing bearings into bottom bracket? Can you count on any LBS to have the right style brake pads in the same material as the pads that have already embedded in your discs? Etc, etc, etc. Compared to most other consumer products bikes and components seem to be doing fine with controlling quality and consistency. Tire manufacturers and a certain crank producer could do better.
I wonder how many more names will bite the dust before the year is out?
I predict quite a few
Huffy is killing it right now. USD 250 for a fully kitted out bicycle for the ordinary rider.
I have a Stages left crank power meter. I wonder if STRAVA could find a way to connect to the meter so I can still use it. I agree that the industry has forced itself into a corner, the end product although it may be very good has become very expensive, this has backfired because sales are down, people would rather wait until a top line bike is three or four years old and buy at a reduced cost. People are not stupid, money doesn't grow on trees, unless you are the US federal reserve. it is becoming increasingly hard to hold a good paying job these days, there is uncertainty in the air so the cyclist will make his dollar stretch a little further by being a decisive purchaser. One great off-spin of all this is the amount of high end bikes that have started popping up on the second-hand market 25-50% of the cost of the original purchase price, YES!
Really good bikes were always expensive. When I was a kid, I always wanted a Schwinn Paramount. I settled for a Schwinn Varsity, then a Schwinn World Voyager instead. Both of those bikes combined were cheaper than a Paramount. I now have a Trek Emonda Sl6 Pro, mechanical brakes, but carbon fiber frame, disc brakes, and internal cable routing. I paid $4,400 but it's worth it. These new bikes stop better, climb better, and shift better, and are lighter than a Paramount ever was. And yes, I still have some steel framed bikes! I wish I still had the Schwinns, but just for sentimental reasons. I need the newer bike to keep up with the young bucks.
Cycling is a boom-and-bust business. There was overproduction during COVID-19, and now the channels are stuffed with expensive inventory. This is not limited to the Bike Industry, by any means. By the way, Trek will make it, but it has a very rocky year ahead.
"He giveth power to the faint; and to them that have no might he increaseth strength.
Even the youths shall faint and be weary, and the young men shall utterly fall:
But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint."
I don't think you should be quoting someone without giving us some kind of context. What is this all about, anyway?
@@PaulWhitcomb-ty6md Wayno said he was getting old. You don't need to lose strength with age. That's Isaiah Chapter 40 vs 29-31. Be encouraged.
Makes sense to me. 👍🏼👍🏼
Its a shame Stages didn't develop a pedal based solution.. Pete
New felt vrs and frs out now. Check em out.
Disk brakes on road bikes which are inferior to their rim brwke preddessesors. Proprietary parts, planned obseleence, more difficult to repair for no real benefits.
Also you can buy bikes and components direct from China. Also both EScooters and Ebikes competing with regular bikes.
Why are roads bikes 10 …15 k …That’s the real question..
Best investment was my Quarq.
You’re actually stating what Hambini said in his video yesterday? By the dot. Weird man….
Dude you should really step out of "bike industry" to see it clear. People don't buy $2000 bikes to just move from A to B. People buy it to exert themselves, to get fit, to race (or at least get a feel of it). E-scooters do not have this effect. It's for completely different people. Just for going from A to B, what's wrong with a car ? If it's just few kms, what's wrong with a $200 utility bike ? The bike industry is having a price problem. The marketing cost and the greed is pushing the prices. They treat riders like idiots. What they are wrong is they assume all their customers are general populations, who know nothing about the bike, and can be tricked into believing whatever they push. However no general population will buy a $5000 bike. These people are experts. They do their homework before anything. It's like to sell some pseudo-science products to a room of NASA scientist. It just won't work.
You mentioned affordability. What I want to see (and what I wanted to see when Chinese carbon first came on the market) is a verified tally of the mark-up of these over-priced bikes. If Chinese workers are getting paid next-to-nothing, and since the group sets (often un-branded) on these bikes are nothing to write home about, I want to see just what a $4,000 bike costs to produce and ship to the U.S. If it comes to around $800.00-$900.00, then something needs to change.
Regarding the e-"bikes", I think a doctor's note should be required to buy one. In my opinion, they are only for the elderly and infirm. Anyone else on one, I have no respect for. Exercise (and sweating) are good for us.
I agree. Our bodies are meant to do hard work. There is no cheating that design. You will only get more lazy and no benefit. Some idiots argue that point but I don't listen to idiots. I'm 67 in great shape still and I attribute that to riding a bike that doesn't have a motor.
What can these old brands really do?? Lower their prices?? So if you bought a premium bike from brand X last year and paid $10,000.. would you feel like pushing that brand this year because they sell the same bike at $7,500?? Really?? Rgr
I'm actually a bit pleased that the bicycle industry is getting hammered. They deserve it. Not the individuals, but the overall "industry"
I think they got arrogant and decided they could make us buy what THEY wanted us to buy. Pay a few you Tubes, put out some sketchy data, stop making tried and true components and only sell what they figured would bring the biggest profits.
Well guess what? It's not working anymore..All the 'money is not an issue' gang seems to be supplied with Gucci bikes now and us normals are hanging on to our affordable serviceable light and simple bikes. Or taking our cash to motorcycles or electric pretend bikes.
I've adjusted my 10+ year old carbon colnago fit about 4 times this year so far, and replaced name brand outrageously priced components with Asian parts. It functions as I want it and fits fine now. A few hours with a tape, allens, a few test rides and all is good till the next time I want to try adjustment. Swapped from durace 9 to Ultegra 11 a few years ago. Same carbon rim brake wheels for 11years, do fine on 25 tubulars.
So, Bike Industry, make some more equipment like my old Colnago, my Ridley, my Look, my Time, my Orbea, etc etc, all of which I used the same components on, all built from bare in a few hours. Take your fiddley proprietary expensive bikes with you when you go broke.
Don Hanson
Skateboarding industry is taking a shit as well. Death of all kinds of Culture with the lock down boot lick bs.
The whole reason people buy bikes is to get around cheaply and simply.
Speciality bikes are supposed to be a novelty. So if a company just makes novelty bikes, they will fail.
The cycle company's have got greedy and stops marketing and nt everyone wants eltronic gearing to expensive ☿ gearing is better
Question that I'm interested in finding out is how is marketing going to backtrack and hype up bikes with simpler old school tech. Or will the marketing just quietly go away and we will simply go see what the bike shop has to offer when we want to buy a bike, like we used to do back when I became a cyclist.