I think it's weird the thing on the pack of the Captain's backpack is called an Iron Halo and grants an Invuln Save, but these guys who have the same thing poking out of their backpack dont receive an invuln...
I feel like this unit was designed for 9th edition, where Captain's/HQ's gave off Aura's. Now all they do is protect the captain so he can buff them protecting him. Not very interesting.
I was expecting them to have a rule that made the captain's ability work in an aura like how it does for the hive tyrant which would have been interesting. I think GW doesn't understand how people use characters in 10th. It's like they assume we pick the character we want to take, then choose a unit to buff them not the other way around.
Yeah they're kinda pointless now. The only command squad that makes sense is the Deathwing Terminator one because it's threatening on its own, so a character only adds to it
I still think they canned an SM Codex 2.0 in late 9th edition when they saw that their schedule had been messed up beyond recovery by COVID - Guard and WE ended up being released mere months before 10th edition hit, and either the SM 2.0 would have been even closer than that, or it would have _pushed_ Guard/WE even closer than that (which in hindsight, given the outcry about them as-is, would have been Not Optimal(tm)). The rumors were all there about it for a fair while, and then they released SM army boxes with no apparent rhyme nor reason. If some of these releases had been planned for late 9th edition, then you might be right.
"Master of none" unit. The inflexibility of it's wargear options really hurts. "No model - no rules" was the worst thing that happened to this game, especially when GW produces miniatures without much options.
I think there is some benefit to NMNR, I was sick of GW slapping a bunch of Datasheets in a codex with no legitimate way to field them either because they don't make the models anymore or they haven't even got around to making them yet. As a long time primary tyranid player, that sucked.
People don’t remember how annoying it was to learn your unit had a strictly better build only to realize that there was no way to actually build those options without buying another kit or the upgrade sprue had been discontinued three years ago by forge world
To be honest I like the idea of having Kor'Sarro Khan with them! Advance and charge with two melee characters that have precision, a +1 to wound, rerolling hit rolls with oath of moment, and lethal hits if you can add a lieutenant? Very expensive, but definitely a fun thought!
plus, that's 4 dudes +Kor'Sarro + a bladeguard LT for even more/harder melee damage, if you want to either blend meq or give teq a hard time (at least before the teq strikes back).
These guys would be brilliant and very fluffy if they could lead a squad like a Guard command squad can. You’d have to price it well but that would feel more consistent.
I think the kit looks great and has a very sweet spot for Uriel Ventris. I intend to use this as ultramarines, running: - marneus calgar, biologis, 6 agressors in deepstrike thanks to Uriel - Uriel leading this, instead of some action monkey intercessor for some mid board « presence »
Gorgeous models, but fixed wargear is rubbish. Personally, I'm really not happy with how Games Workshop has dealt with the old Company Veterans of prior editions. At least prior to this model release, you could slot them into Command Squads, which still had some of the flexibility. Now? Locked wargear to a heavy bolter and bolter. No idea what I'm doing with my meticulously kitbashed Veterans now.
Assuming that the Ancient can still be used separately, this box gives you an Ancient and a Captain for far less than buying them separately, and you can make a full unit out of them if you want.
@@boozeybatman Sadly, it's not on the list of units an Apothecary can join. A Captain can (and, in fact, pretty much has to or teh unit dies!) but an Apothecary can't be. I'm hoping that they'll errata that, just for me.
@@boozeybatmanRAW, you could, except looking at the list of units the Apothecary can join, and the list of characters that CH says can lead it, they don’t have the other’s unit name listed. Probably because of the Apothecary’s rule. I doubt it’s an oversight like the Dark Angels characters not being able to join+lead a command squad
Strange how easy it would be to give more factions veteran units. Csm have legionaries and chosen. Marines have 9 billion sheets of the exact same unit but some are veteran. Having 2 units share the same mini but have different rules/points would def be a benefit to players with less models.
maybe add some optional attachments to demarcate difference on the sprue, like trygon vs trygon prime. Upgrade kits like noise marines are a possibility but they are always overcosted, considering you get no new models, and another unnecessary inconvenience.
Sisters are a great example of why not to do it. It works for Marines, where hundreds of years of combat experience can justify a major jump in abilities. Less so for others.
Sad it can't really work like Calgar does and his vitrix honour guard, in that you can't attach it to other units the Captain can attach it to, even if they limited it to like 5 man units. That would probably give it more play and options.
I was trying to work this out and couldn't come up with a reason attach Calgar. Rather run him with Aggressors. Still going to pick the kit up on a discount.
Honestly I like that they arent overpowered at one thing. The game needs more units like this that aren't just there to ruin another player's turn. They have a lot of flavour and interest, thats something modern marine armies need more than anything else.
Love this unit so much! Finally some classic, oldschool stuff, a typical command Squad. I will convert mine all with winged helmets and 30k ccolors, have them accompany Azrael (if that will be allowed but I guess it will), so I can pretend that Lion forces Azrael to have a guard of Redeemed, so that he can see that they are indeed his brothers. I hope you also can attach a Primaris Apothecary to make them even tougher.
@@Pers0n97 Dude I play this game for 20 years now. Yes I know how the previous command squad looked like. And no I don´t bother to remember every single detail. I know that the champion used a blade and a small parrier shield. That we had a banner and an apothecary, as well as special weapons and such. So you happy now that you know soooo much more than I do? Here have some internet points for it.
@@40kVallinYeah... I don't believe you. Every single things you have said so far sounds like the exact kind of thing a poser culture vulture would say, down to this very last and cringy attempt at pretending "I played for 20 years". Even the fact that you keep bringing up apothecary and specifically the apothecary, when it's a point many have brought up in the comment, tells me you have no idea wtf you are talking about and are just repeating what you think will look convincing. This thing is 4 monopose minies. 1 guy with a bolter, one guy with a heavy bolter, a champion and an ancient. The old command squad was about bundling together all the characters into... yknow, a command squad. Then it evolved into bundling together a bunch of specialist each with a unique look and role in the chapter to broadcast buff the army. This thing GW dropped on us is nothing, NOTHING like that outside of the fact that it has a guy with a banner. Now stop posing, it's embarrassing for both of us when you try to establish you fake up creds by bringing up old minies you clearly never touched, especially when it's to praise the toxic sludge GW is pumping out.
Unable to attach an apothecary to it? I’ll end up getting them for my Dark Angels, for thematic and nostalgic purposes. I absolutely love that ancient! For my Black Templars I’m struggling to see how they will fit in to my crusade from a thematic sense?
As a UM player, I’m not mad about putting Uriel with this unit and holding home objective. He fits the Jack of all trades profile, the deep strike has decent value, and they will do roughly the same work as Sternguard, but better work in the fight phase. Then it makes that Aggressor/Calgar/Biologis with BD block imminently more useful due to deep strike, and you have free strat use to cover the lack of CP farming for having Marneus off the board early.
I don't quite get what you mean in your last sentence. Ventris doesn't give free strats and Calgar can generate CP perfectly fine while in Deep Strike.
@@UltraMeanMarines Edit: Guess I'm wrong. I didn't realize his ability needs him to be "on the battlefield". I suppose reserves units don't fall under that. Very much so, he wouldn't if he was in a transport but there is nothing stopping characters or units from using their abilities while in reserves. Rules Commentary: Reserves Units: Any unit that starts the battle in a location other than the battlefield, and is not embarked within a Transport that starts the battle on the battlefield, is considered to be a Reserves unit. When a Reserves unit is set up on the battlefield, it counts as having made a Normal move that phase. Any Reserves units that have not been set up on the battlefield by the end of the battle count as destroyed. *Units can still use rules and abilities while in Reserves.*
Didn't buy it myself although a cool kit, I have already made myself an ancient with banner and I have the company champion, plus a decent amount of captains, so I can just borrow a couple of Sternguard and you have the unit if I ever want to play it, but just not sure what it is there for. I feel like it would more interesting if it had like 'super attachment' options, in that you could attach this to a Captain, but can still attach him and his bodyguard to other units, that might create some more interesting options.
Honestly, these just seem like a fun unit for me to use in a Crusade guarding my custom Captain. You could really do a good narrative with a squad of 5-6 heroes
Great idea. Also, notice how everyone positive about this unit used the word "fun", everyone down on it is unhappy because it can't kill double its points cost every turn! Sad times.
@@georgeflecknell GTFO. There is nothing fun in that unit. People like the models and the idea of a command squad, but this unit does a shit job at fulfilling the fantasy of a command squad.
I think theses guys could be really nice in dark angel if azrael gets to join them since like them he's a shooty/melee character while giving them a 4+ invul and since he's already mostly here the it's CP generator ability as long as he's alive, a thing he would be alongside 4PV save 3+/4++ -1 to wounds rolls models :)
Honestly I bought them just because I’m super stoked to paint them up and try to make them look better than my army. Running them in-game was secondary but I think a basic captain next to them ought to make an OK midfield objective holder with some threat. Maybe a Templars’ marshal w/ combi weapon. Or the captain in the kit is probably good too.
I like the idea that you can attach characters to the unit instead of captains, give me more reason to make a "counts as" captain for each character for my custom chapter
This unit is very symptomatic of everything wrong with modern GW. It's a bunch of monopose models, without any options, that come with a generic characters we already have 79 versions of, and all these guys have random gears that do not syngergize in the slightest. First of all, this unit should have been a 5-10 man squad. It should have come with enough gear option to fit multiple playstyle. Some heavy firepower (at least 2 heavy weapon per 5 men). Some Storm shields for heavy bodyguard duty. Some mele weapon for a mele unit. As it stand, this unit is literally pointless, just a mediocre bitbox for sergeants (mediocre because it's all monopose with barely any options). The only way to fix that unit and make it usable would be to make it a character buff broadcast system, turning the character buff of characters joining them into an aura. Ho, and make apothecary be able to join that unit (just don't turn their buff into aura).
yeh they are pretty useless because there are so many better options. The only thing they got going is that they are a bit good at everything. so tactically flexible. but because you run an army and not a single unit, you will simply do that by having different units with different roles in your army and make sure that your leaders are in units where the synergy works best. So again, the company heroes lose. Consider the option of giving them a rule where the leaders in the unit's abilities become aura's again. yes this completely turns away from the idea of 10th£. however it would make this unit actually interesting.
The kit alone looks good, I’d buy that just for the models. The rest can be effectively made at home if you have enough skill with kitbashing and using green stuff. The other issue is that the old comp command was essentially multiple separately released models that were discontinued and combined. What will happen to the individual kits for the captain and ancient?
I don't know why I believed the whole unit would have been able to join units with the captain, but I understand what kind of brick I would get to face
So that new Raven Guard detachment can put these 4 plus a Captain and LT right in the center of the board turn one. Could be an interesting build with the bonus OC and some fat models.
I plan on having these guy bodyguard Vulkan He'Stan so he can throw around his Forgefather buff/debuff, which will then get utilised by a separate 10-man squad of Infernus marines led by a regular captain (for free Immolation Protocols). Results in 10d6 S6 autohits that reroll to-wound with Devastating Wounds
The unit is cool but Rites of Battle just gets so much more value in other units. The only strategem I see being worthwhile with RoB is Armour of Contempt to make them tankier. It's strange that an Apothecary cannot join them. It also bugs me that the two bolt rifles are different profiles so you need to roll them separately
I like the models for flavour, but I wish they had options. Being able to go full melee or full shooting would be better than having 1 melee specialist and 3 shooty dudes in the squad.
I find this unit very annoying having the 1 marine n standard bearer with different boltguns... why didn't they both just have master crafted bolters. N then you're not rolling for each individual gun....🫤
i truly want to sit these guys in a unit with he'stan and sit them firmly in the middle of my board to take an objective and be a useful buffing squad.
If they were cheap as heck points wise and had something they could project put rules wise to surrounding troops and vehicles they would be great but they don’t have anything like that they got some extra wounds some mediocre shooting and worse combat… right now the only way i would be tempted to cart them out would be if their points cost dropped to the same amount of points as 5 reavers they might be worth it, outside of that its a trap and it sucks… is a pretty decent captain and standard bearer tho, would say the same thing about the heavy bolter lad if there was a way to take him not in that fucking squad…
They’re cool, but I feel their cost paired with their drawbacks makes them take a back seat compared to other units. Intercessors do more shooting damage, assault intercessors do a tiny bit more melee damage, and Sternguard Vets do WAY more damage in shooting. I picked these guys up to be a bodyguard for Uriel Ventris, but I think I’ll be returning them, and instead guarding my captain with either Intercessors or Sternguard Vets. Because yeah, these heroes are tough, sure, but what good is that if they can’t effectively do anything while alive?
I don’t like this Company Heroes squad. I’d prefer if this was a collection of characters and “reinforcements” that could be attached to existing squads, similar to a heavy/special weapon model. For example, Heavy Intercessors can equip one Heavy Bolter, so I’d prefer to assign the Company Hero with the MC Heavy Bolter to an Intercessors squad. Same with the Company Hero with the MC Power Sword: Assign him to an Assault Intercessor squad. That way the Company Hero will compliment the squad it’s attached to instead of being a mixed ranged, melee, and support squad. Thinking about using the Company Heroes this way also makes me wish the official WH40K app had the feature to assign Characters as Leaders to specific units and to display that assignment in the Export List view. This would also be useful for verifying a Character is valid as Leader for specific units - instead of having to check its Leader tab. I’ve noticed that Auspex Tactics has mentioned the Apothecary Biologis being given the Bolter Discipline enhancement and assigned as Leader to a Desolation Squad, but it cannot do that because they’re not a Gravis unit. If the app allowed Leaders to be assigned to units and showed an error message for invalid choices, it would help a lot with list building.
This reminds me a lot of the old 4th edition style command and veteran squads, where you could give basically anyone any weapon, even if it made no sense and had no synergy, except that GW has decided to mandate poor decisions. It's a godawful, poorly designed unit that kinda defeats the entire concept of a command squad. Since everyone else is saying how they wished the unit worked, I'll throw my lot in: I wish they weren't actually a true unit, and instead were a single slot that was split up immediately on deployment and assigned individually to different units (like apothecaries in the Horus Heresy). They could function as neat half characters to provide small buffs and extra attacks. That being said, I'm tempted to pick it up for the models. There is a lot of potential for splitting the box up and using each model for different units. I play Templars, and so have some very unorthodox units built out of our vast collection of bits. I've been tempted to turn my extremely fancy intercessors into Sterguard, and could use the heavy bolter guy and bolt rifle guy for that purpose. The standard bearer could make a great ancient, and the champion could make a great alternative sword brother for someone who owns too many crusader squads and wants some variety.
This looks like a few models that weren't put into production with other boxed kits for the veterans and ancient, then the champion is a late FOMO reaction, and the captain targets collectors. If the command squad could link in with another squad, even basic troops, then I would consider the new command squad a potential buy. To use this in a list, you would essentially need an unused captain with an extra 95 points. I do not see that as an issue, because as of the time of my comment, ballistus dreadnoughts are 150.
As a da player id probbly pick them to be azrael or lazerus honour guard then add a leiu for lethal hits and stick them in my repulsor executioner infact thats exactly what il do as it can transort 6 hot dog! What I don't understand is. And this needs some clearing up: the ancient can swap his boltar and combat weopon for a power weopon as a single model. Can this one? Are we limited to just the heavy boltar or will other be available? Ie plasma cannon etc
i think the heros should be split off and used in lieu of squad sargents. Like the special heavy bolter with a heavy bolter squad, the vet and Banner with a tac squad, the assualt champion with an assault style squad. treating them less as an 'A Team' style of play but rather Squad heros. it would also be interesting to swap out the sargents for more powerful models.
Honestly, if you had more characters who can point at other units and give buffs or have auras, it'd make more sense. The fact they have fixed wargear kind of kills the unit, especially as the advantage of the Champion is ruined by the fact it buffs melee in a unit that doesn't even have chainswords.
Idea of the command squad seems off given this edition with characters and aura. Maybe if the command squad allowed the captain to "issue a command" or ability to another squad theyre not in? But this reeks of old design with no place in a new edition Cool models though
Well apothecary can be attached instead of a lieutenant with a captain or chapter master now so no reason why you couldn't run them that way. I just tend to like my apothecary now with hellblasters
I'm deff running 1. I run uriel for my tournament list and ready don't like my 5 man stern guard unit for him. They will be my home field defenders with oc2 and good counter charge if needed
Does anyone know of a battle report on YT in which this unit is used? I got this kit as a gift, I'm building it up now. Just curious to see how it is being used.
Hmm, i run DA and BA so i am going to have to wait to really see how good they are. I trust only results on the table and i do not put faith in math hammer and theories. I will buy then of course sense i am huge in collecting and painting as well.
My big gripe with this until is that you can't change their wargear to suit the character they are meant to be protecting. It'd also be nice if they could actually protect some other characters. Ah well.
naja 3 Sternguard, 1 banner, 1 Captain also garnicht so schlecht wenn man nicht bei GW direkt kauft würde ich fast sagen wenn man noch nicht viele oder keine Marines hat ist die bo kein schlechtes upgrade für ne Combatpatrole box
I picked up a box today. They were on my list from when they were teased. I know they are not the most powerful unit I can place my Marshal in (Black Templars) but their rule of cool is very high, plus I enjoy kit-bashing, and these guys will be fun to kit-bash to look more Black Templar-ish. Obviously I've come around on them for using them with my Black Templars. ;)
First - not buying the kit unless I get it super cheap because I already have the company command squad for "counts as" Second - unless Seth can join, I wouldn't be taking this squad anyway.
Great models. Will buy them definitively but not from GW. All-rounder units always tend to suck in 40K. You would get the most out of them by fielding the minis in board games such Deathwatch Kill Team or in unique small points 40k scenarios. Think of the A-Team taking out trash mobs.
Calgar joining this unit would be pretty tasty. He gets the two Vitrix guard, so that’s a load more attacks and more wounds to get through. He gives minus one to hit, plus the minus one to wound. Add a melee lieutenant and it would hit pretty hard. Bit of fun rather than competitive, but could catch a few people out with how tanks that would be.
I do miss the days of Melta Command Squads, but I'm glad I wasn't the only one that thought of big meatshields for Calgar. Although Bladeguard are still probably better.
The lack of any aura or anything is really not helpful for it. It's a very cool kit, and I might field it in a super fluffy game. But for the moment, I would just be picking this up as purely a hobby project
My question is if you can add an apothecary to the unit rather than a lieutenant. An apothecary in company heroes would be appropriate and have MASSIVE returns.
I like the premise of the veterans being representative of the three doctrines, but the end result feels really confused as to what the actual point of the unit is. And it's yet another example of a primaris unit with like five weapon types to keep track of which doesn't help. At least they look nice I suppose haha
If this unit could attach to another unit ala Imperial Guard, it would almost be an auto include. Attach to Sternguard and the shooting compliments it while giving them extra melee punch. Attach to Bladeguard and the melee compliments them while the shooting adds a nice buff. Alas that is not to be.
I just want this kit because its like getting all the expensive 35$ individual units for much much cheaper.
i was actually surprised that this kit isnt >100€
If only it still had an apothecary
It's like 98 in Australia :(
@@guardsmenmrdew4286that’s not horrid for aus much better than heavy intercessors
Gonna make me buy bladeguard to get the lion? Jokes on you, that's 3 HQs now
I think it's weird the thing on the pack of the Captain's backpack is called an Iron Halo and grants an Invuln Save, but these guys who have the same thing poking out of their backpack dont receive an invuln...
GW just totally ignored cool nuance like Iron Halo for a while. They just use it as "cute little armor detail" now.
When the models look this good there no need to give the "rules to sell the models" treatment
Imma participate in a Mega battle (Tyranic war theme) gonna field these guys for that.
DA could use this with Azrael leading them to get a 4++ , make them a super tank objective holder
Me too I was thinking this or lazerus
Super competitive, probably not.
Some fun combos and cool models at relatively low cost compared to indocidual characters? You bet.
I feel like this unit was designed for 9th edition, where Captain's/HQ's gave off Aura's. Now all they do is protect the captain so he can buff them protecting him. Not very interesting.
I was expecting them to have a rule that made the captain's ability work in an aura like how it does for the hive tyrant which would have been interesting. I think GW doesn't understand how people use characters in 10th. It's like they assume we pick the character we want to take, then choose a unit to buff them not the other way around.
Yeah they're kinda pointless now. The only command squad that makes sense is the Deathwing Terminator one because it's threatening on its own, so a character only adds to it
I still think they canned an SM Codex 2.0 in late 9th edition when they saw that their schedule had been messed up beyond recovery by COVID - Guard and WE ended up being released mere months before 10th edition hit, and either the SM 2.0 would have been even closer than that, or it would have _pushed_ Guard/WE even closer than that (which in hindsight, given the outcry about them as-is, would have been Not Optimal(tm)). The rumors were all there about it for a fair while, and then they released SM army boxes with no apparent rhyme nor reason. If some of these releases had been planned for late 9th edition, then you might be right.
@@tigirus4656 Making that part of the ancients ability would be pretty cool.
@@tigirus4656it would also be interesting if they worked like cryptothrals , where they join as part of a different unit
"Master of none" unit.
The inflexibility of it's wargear options really hurts.
"No model - no rules" was the worst thing that happened to this game, especially when GW produces miniatures without much options.
Still charging as much as they would for a kit with three frames though, don’t you worry!
Word
Cry babies started whining about how complicated the game was, so now we get no more wargear points and wargear options
I think there is some benefit to NMNR, I was sick of GW slapping a bunch of Datasheets in a codex with no legitimate way to field them either because they don't make the models anymore or they haven't even got around to making them yet. As a long time primary tyranid player, that sucked.
People don’t remember how annoying it was to learn your unit had a strictly better build only to realize that there was no way to actually build those options without buying another kit or the upgrade sprue had been discontinued three years ago by forge world
Wait, does Calgar get to keep his Victrix Guard while attached to company heroes as well?
Yessir
And they all get the -1 damage. So those become some tough guards
To be honest I like the idea of having Kor'Sarro Khan with them! Advance and charge with two melee characters that have precision, a +1 to wound, rerolling hit rolls with oath of moment, and lethal hits if you can add a lieutenant? Very expensive, but definitely a fun thought!
plus, that's 4 dudes +Kor'Sarro + a bladeguard LT for even more/harder melee damage, if you want to either blend meq or give teq a hard time (at least before the teq strikes back).
Mandatory unit to escort Vulkan + apothecary in the mid-board, I’m calling it
Apothecaries can only be attached to certain units already and unless they update that list they won't be able to join this new unit.
These guys would be brilliant and very fluffy if they could lead a squad like a Guard command squad can. You’d have to price it well but that would feel more consistent.
It would also work if they did the same thing as cryptothrals
so they all get iron halos but not the 4+ invul that comes with it?
I think the kit looks great and has a very sweet spot for Uriel Ventris.
I intend to use this as ultramarines, running:
- marneus calgar, biologis, 6 agressors in deepstrike thanks to Uriel
- Uriel leading this, instead of some action monkey intercessor for some mid board « presence »
Gorgeous models, but fixed wargear is rubbish.
Personally, I'm really not happy with how Games Workshop has dealt with the old Company Veterans of prior editions. At least prior to this model release, you could slot them into Command Squads, which still had some of the flexibility. Now? Locked wargear to a heavy bolter and bolter. No idea what I'm doing with my meticulously kitbashed Veterans now.
I’m honest mad they didn’t include them in the first company rules. They fit in super well as a tanky and flexible unit alternative to terminators.
Yup good point. They are vets afterall.
Assuming that the Ancient can still be used separately, this box gives you an Ancient and a Captain for far less than buying them separately, and you can make a full unit out of them if you want.
could prob use the champ and 2 vets to extend a sternguard squad too.
Yup, as it stand this thing looks like a wonky discount for ancient and captain, with 3 bodies you could use for other units.
Yeah thats what I was going to use them for. And they are great looking models too
They need to be able to accept an Apothecary alongside the Captain. That's teh classic Command Squad, and it'd just make it look and feel *right*.
Maybe its because they want Space Wolves be able to use this unit.
There's no reason you can't add an apothecary and a captain to this unit.
@@boozeybatman Sadly, it's not on the list of units an Apothecary can join. A Captain can (and, in fact, pretty much has to or teh unit dies!) but an Apothecary can't be. I'm hoping that they'll errata that, just for me.
Totally agree. Since as it stand this unit is only good at being a captain bodyguard, being able to add an apothecary would make sens.
@@boozeybatmanRAW, you could, except looking at the list of units the Apothecary can join, and the list of characters that CH says can lead it, they don’t have the other’s unit name listed.
Probably because of the Apothecary’s rule. I doubt it’s an oversight like the Dark Angels characters not being able to join+lead a command squad
I was hoping this unit was going to be able to join another like an enchanted body guard. Something like the cryptothralls from Necrons
That ie exactly how I assumed they would work, and the reason I aimed to buy some. Now I know that isn't how they work, I don't see what the point is.
Strange how easy it would be to give more factions veteran units. Csm have legionaries and chosen. Marines have 9 billion sheets of the exact same unit but some are veteran. Having 2 units share the same mini but have different rules/points would def be a benefit to players with less models.
maybe add some optional attachments to demarcate difference on the sprue, like trygon vs trygon prime. Upgrade kits like noise marines are a possibility but they are always overcosted, considering you get no new models, and another unnecessary inconvenience.
Grey knight troops are a great example of this
Sisters are a great example of why not to do it. It works for Marines, where hundreds of years of combat experience can justify a major jump in abilities. Less so for others.
@@adept5500 dude thats a hard larp. I would say veteran guardsmen would be more lethal than marines.
@@jazzy4830 definitly
Sad it can't really work like Calgar does and his vitrix honour guard, in that you can't attach it to other units the Captain can attach it to, even if they limited it to like 5 man units. That would probably give it more play and options.
I was trying to work this out and couldn't come up with a reason attach Calgar. Rather run him with Aggressors. Still going to pick the kit up on a discount.
I like the models. Wish it gave captains an aura effect. Like run captains in units or rum them with this and an aura.
Honestly I like that they arent overpowered at one thing. The game needs more units like this that aren't just there to ruin another player's turn. They have a lot of flavour and interest, thats something modern marine armies need more than anything else.
tell that to the eldar, but I agree, I like them for this too
What modern marines need is more flexible units, and this pile of monopose, no wargear jank isn't that.
Love this unit so much! Finally some classic, oldschool stuff, a typical command Squad. I will convert mine all with winged helmets and 30k ccolors, have them accompany Azrael (if that will be allowed but I guess it will), so I can pretend that Lion forces Azrael to have a guard of Redeemed, so that he can see that they are indeed his brothers. I hope you also can attach a Primaris Apothecary to make them even tougher.
... have you ever seen a "classic, oldschool, typical command squad"?
If you ever had, you'd realize this is nothing like that.
@@Pers0n97 Yeah I know that the Apothecary is missing and other stuff, but this is as close as we will get.
@@40kVallin Oh... so you really don't know wtf you are talking about.
@@Pers0n97 Dude I play this game for 20 years now. Yes I know how the previous command squad looked like. And no I don´t bother to remember every single detail. I know that the champion used a blade and a small parrier shield. That we had a banner and an apothecary, as well as special weapons and such. So you happy now that you know soooo much more than I do? Here have some internet points for it.
@@40kVallinYeah... I don't believe you.
Every single things you have said so far sounds like the exact kind of thing a poser culture vulture would say, down to this very last and cringy attempt at pretending "I played for 20 years".
Even the fact that you keep bringing up apothecary and specifically the apothecary, when it's a point many have brought up in the comment, tells me you have no idea wtf you are talking about and are just repeating what you think will look convincing.
This thing is 4 monopose minies. 1 guy with a bolter, one guy with a heavy bolter, a champion and an ancient.
The old command squad was about bundling together all the characters into... yknow, a command squad. Then it evolved into bundling together a bunch of specialist each with a unique look and role in the chapter to broadcast buff the army.
This thing GW dropped on us is nothing, NOTHING like that outside of the fact that it has a guy with a banner.
Now stop posing, it's embarrassing for both of us when you try to establish you fake up creds by bringing up old minies you clearly never touched, especially when it's to praise the toxic sludge GW is pumping out.
Unable to attach an apothecary to it? I’ll end up getting them for my Dark Angels, for thematic and nostalgic purposes. I absolutely love that ancient! For my Black Templars I’m struggling to see how they will fit in to my crusade from a thematic sense?
You forgot Azrael, who is the best chapter master to join them
As a UM player, I’m not mad about putting Uriel with this unit and holding home objective. He fits the Jack of all trades profile, the deep strike has decent value, and they will do roughly the same work as Sternguard, but better work in the fight phase. Then it makes that Aggressor/Calgar/Biologis with BD block imminently more useful due to deep strike, and you have free strat use to cover the lack of CP farming for having Marneus off the board early.
I don't quite get what you mean in your last sentence. Ventris doesn't give free strats and Calgar can generate CP perfectly fine while in Deep Strike.
@@macewindu4428 Marneus does not generate CP whilst in reserves.
@@UltraMeanMarines
Edit: Guess I'm wrong. I didn't realize his ability needs him to be "on the battlefield". I suppose reserves units don't fall under that.
Very much so, he wouldn't if he was in a transport but there is nothing stopping characters or units from using their abilities while in reserves.
Rules Commentary: Reserves Units: Any unit that starts the battle in a location other than the battlefield, and is not embarked within a Transport that starts the battle on the battlefield, is considered to be a Reserves unit. When a Reserves unit is set up on the battlefield, it counts as having made a Normal move that phase. Any Reserves units that have not been set up on the battlefield by the end of the battle count as destroyed. *Units can still use rules and abilities while in Reserves.*
Didn't buy it myself although a cool kit, I have already made myself an ancient with banner and I have the company champion, plus a decent amount of captains, so I can just borrow a couple of Sternguard and you have the unit if I ever want to play it, but just not sure what it is there for. I feel like it would more interesting if it had like 'super attachment' options, in that you could attach this to a Captain, but can still attach him and his bodyguard to other units, that might create some more interesting options.
Honestly, these just seem like a fun unit for me to use in a Crusade guarding my custom Captain. You could really do a good narrative with a squad of 5-6 heroes
Great idea. Also, notice how everyone positive about this unit used the word "fun", everyone down on it is unhappy because it can't kill double its points cost every turn! Sad times.
@@georgeflecknell GTFO.
There is nothing fun in that unit.
People like the models and the idea of a command squad, but this unit does a shit job at fulfilling the fantasy of a command squad.
I think theses guys could be really nice in dark angel if azrael gets to join them since like them he's a shooty/melee character while giving them a 4+ invul and since he's already mostly here the it's CP generator ability as long as he's alive, a thing he would be alongside 4PV save 3+/4++ -1 to wounds rolls models :)
Honestly I bought them just because I’m super stoked to paint them up and try to make them look better than my army.
Running them in-game was secondary but I think a basic captain next to them ought to make an OK midfield objective holder with some threat. Maybe a Templars’ marshal w/ combi weapon. Or the captain in the kit is probably good too.
I like the idea that you can attach characters to the unit instead of captains, give me more reason to make a "counts as" captain for each character for my custom chapter
This unit is very symptomatic of everything wrong with modern GW.
It's a bunch of monopose models, without any options, that come with a generic characters we already have 79 versions of, and all these guys have random gears that do not syngergize in the slightest.
First of all, this unit should have been a 5-10 man squad. It should have come with enough gear option to fit multiple playstyle.
Some heavy firepower (at least 2 heavy weapon per 5 men).
Some Storm shields for heavy bodyguard duty.
Some mele weapon for a mele unit.
As it stand, this unit is literally pointless, just a mediocre bitbox for sergeants (mediocre because it's all monopose with barely any options).
The only way to fix that unit and make it usable would be to make it a character buff broadcast system, turning the character buff of characters joining them into an aura.
Ho, and make apothecary be able to join that unit (just don't turn their buff into aura).
yeh they are pretty useless because there are so many better options. The only thing they got going is that they are a bit good at everything. so tactically flexible. but because you run an army and not a single unit, you will simply do that by having different units with different roles in your army and make sure that your leaders are in units where the synergy works best. So again, the company heroes lose. Consider the option of giving them a rule where the leaders in the unit's abilities become aura's again. yes this completely turns away from the idea of 10th£. however it would make this unit actually interesting.
I used the command squad back in the day, but I think the Bladeguards + Ancient is a whole lot cooler of a bodyguard unit now.
Would have been cool to see the command squad go to a 10 man unit or be able to attach to another squad like bladeguard or sternguard.
The kit alone looks good, I’d buy that just for the models. The rest can be effectively made at home if you have enough skill with kitbashing and using green stuff. The other issue is that the old comp command was essentially multiple separately released models that were discontinued and combined. What will happen to the individual kits for the captain and ancient?
I don't know why I believed the whole unit would have been able to join units with the captain, but I understand what kind of brick I would get to face
i made it ! first on a Auspex comment !!!!
also great vid, keep up the great work brother.
Honestly it should be a unit that gives off and aura
So that new Raven Guard detachment can put these 4 plus a Captain and LT right in the center of the board turn one. Could be an interesting build with the bonus OC and some fat models.
I plan on having these guy bodyguard Vulkan He'Stan so he can throw around his Forgefather buff/debuff, which will then get utilised by a separate 10-man squad of Infernus marines led by a regular captain (for free Immolation Protocols).
Results in 10d6 S6 autohits that reroll to-wound with Devastating Wounds
The unit is cool but Rites of Battle just gets so much more value in other units. The only strategem I see being worthwhile with RoB is Armour of Contempt to make them tankier. It's strange that an Apothecary cannot join them. It also bugs me that the two bolt rifles are different profiles so you need to roll them separately
Apothecaries can't revive any characters and they are all characters. so there's no use for him anyway I guess.
I like the models for flavour, but I wish they had options. Being able to go full melee or full shooting would be better than having 1 melee specialist and 3 shooty dudes in the squad.
I find this unit very annoying having the 1 marine n standard bearer with different boltguns... why didn't they both just have master crafted bolters. N then you're not rolling for each individual gun....🫤
Give them Sternguard or Bladeguard options... It was so easy.
i truly want to sit these guys in a unit with he'stan and sit them firmly in the middle of my board to take an objective and be a useful buffing squad.
If they were cheap as heck points wise and had something they could project put rules wise to surrounding troops and vehicles they would be great but they don’t have anything like that they got some extra wounds some mediocre shooting and worse combat… right now the only way i would be tempted to cart them out would be if their points cost dropped to the same amount of points as 5 reavers they might be worth it, outside of that its a trap and it sucks… is a pretty decent captain and standard bearer tho, would say the same thing about the heavy bolter lad if there was a way to take him not in that fucking squad…
Uriel Ventris would be a great character to lead the command squad.
Do enjoy these kinds of units just wish it had maybe a few mire veterans to tag along
They’re cool, but I feel their cost paired with their drawbacks makes them take a back seat compared to other units. Intercessors do more shooting damage, assault intercessors do a tiny bit more melee damage, and Sternguard Vets do WAY more damage in shooting. I picked these guys up to be a bodyguard for Uriel Ventris, but I think I’ll be returning them, and instead guarding my captain with either Intercessors or Sternguard Vets.
Because yeah, these heroes are tough, sure, but what good is that if they can’t effectively do anything while alive?
Fiddly unit to play. Good to paint. Display cabinet not TT for me.
I don’t like this Company Heroes squad. I’d prefer if this was a collection of characters and “reinforcements” that could be attached to existing squads, similar to a heavy/special weapon model. For example, Heavy Intercessors can equip one Heavy Bolter, so I’d prefer to assign the Company Hero with the MC Heavy Bolter to an Intercessors squad. Same with the Company Hero with the MC Power Sword: Assign him to an Assault Intercessor squad. That way the Company Hero will compliment the squad it’s attached to instead of being a mixed ranged, melee, and support squad.
Thinking about using the Company Heroes this way also makes me wish the official WH40K app had the feature to assign Characters as Leaders to specific units and to display that assignment in the Export List view. This would also be useful for verifying a Character is valid as Leader for specific units - instead of having to check its Leader tab. I’ve noticed that Auspex Tactics has mentioned the Apothecary Biologis being given the Bolter Discipline enhancement and assigned as Leader to a Desolation Squad, but it cannot do that because they’re not a Gravis unit. If the app allowed Leaders to be assigned to units and showed an error message for invalid choices, it would help a lot with list building.
How much do you want to be this kit is the new "bundle filler", the one kit they will shove in EVERY SINGLE SPACE MARINE BUNDLES from now on?
This reminds me a lot of the old 4th edition style command and veteran squads, where you could give basically anyone any weapon, even if it made no sense and had no synergy, except that GW has decided to mandate poor decisions. It's a godawful, poorly designed unit that kinda defeats the entire concept of a command squad. Since everyone else is saying how they wished the unit worked, I'll throw my lot in: I wish they weren't actually a true unit, and instead were a single slot that was split up immediately on deployment and assigned individually to different units (like apothecaries in the Horus Heresy). They could function as neat half characters to provide small buffs and extra attacks.
That being said, I'm tempted to pick it up for the models. There is a lot of potential for splitting the box up and using each model for different units. I play Templars, and so have some very unorthodox units built out of our vast collection of bits. I've been tempted to turn my extremely fancy intercessors into Sterguard, and could use the heavy bolter guy and bolt rifle guy for that purpose. The standard bearer could make a great ancient, and the champion could make a great alternative sword brother for someone who owns too many crusader squads and wants some variety.
While I haven't read every 40k book published, but usually these "command squads" are going to die in stories. I'd rather not bother fielding them.
This looks like a few models that weren't put into production with other boxed kits for the veterans and ancient, then the champion is a late FOMO reaction, and the captain targets collectors.
If the command squad could link in with another squad, even basic troops, then I would consider the new command squad a potential buy.
To use this in a list, you would essentially need an unused captain with an extra 95 points. I do not see that as an issue, because as of the time of my comment, ballistus dreadnoughts are 150.
40£ = $48
40€ = $42
Charges us $65 in the US.
GW have always been and always will be, the villain.
As a da player id probbly pick them to be azrael or lazerus honour guard then add a leiu for lethal hits and stick them in my repulsor executioner infact thats exactly what il do as it can transort 6 hot dog! What I don't understand is. And this needs some clearing up: the ancient can swap his boltar and combat weopon for a power weopon as a single model. Can this one? Are we limited to just the heavy boltar or will other be available? Ie plasma cannon etc
i think the heros should be split off and used in lieu of squad sargents. Like the special heavy bolter with a heavy bolter squad, the vet and Banner with a tac squad, the assualt champion with an assault style squad. treating them less as an 'A Team' style of play but rather Squad heros. it would also be interesting to swap out the sargents for more powerful models.
Honestly, if you had more characters who can point at other units and give buffs or have auras, it'd make more sense. The fact they have fixed wargear kind of kills the unit, especially as the advantage of the Champion is ruined by the fact it buffs melee in a unit that doesn't even have chainswords.
Idea of the command squad seems off given this edition with characters and aura. Maybe if the command squad allowed the captain to "issue a command" or ability to another squad theyre not in? But this reeks of old design with no place in a new edition
Cool models though
Disappointed that they can't take an Apothecary instead of a Lieutenant. Because THAT would make them a pretty good damage sink... I think
Well apothecary can be attached instead of a lieutenant with a captain or chapter master now so no reason why you couldn't run them that way. I just tend to like my apothecary now with hellblasters
So how come calgar can join in even though he's in gravis but tor can't? and if gravis can join why can't terminator characters? like Lysander?
I'm deff running 1. I run uriel for my tournament list and ready don't like my 5 man stern guard unit for him. They will be my home field defenders with oc2 and good counter charge if needed
Honestly feel like these are a huge disappointment. Was hoping the command squad would get the primaris treatment.
Does anyone know of a battle report on YT in which this unit is used?
I got this kit as a gift, I'm building it up now. Just curious to see how it is being used.
Hmm, i run DA and BA so i am going to have to wait to really see how good they are. I trust only results on the table and i do not put faith in math hammer and theories. I will buy then of course sense i am huge in collecting and painting as well.
My big gripe with this until is that you can't change their wargear to suit the character they are meant to be protecting. It'd also be nice if they could actually protect some other characters. Ah well.
high marshal helbrecht with Company Heroes with 10 Sword Bros. lmao Hahahahahah
It would be better if they still had the apothecary
I wish they could be leaders for tactical squads. It would be a reason to take tactical squads.
Before you attache the captain can you attaché an apothecary to the captain first like the lieutenant or aswell as lieutenant?
Can someone explain what the chest symbol of the veteran with the bionic arm means?
So are they good? They seem like a copy of sternguard veterans at this point.
I want a new Gabriel Seth to put in this squad for my Flesh Tearers.
they are just as mid as the rest of the codex. the whole army is still to pillow fisted...
So why are eldar warlocks 120pts for 4 models?
Honestly, feels sad lacking tech and apothecary.
I think... They just look pretty and I want to paint them...
They're also a nice bot of bots to make personalized units
Captain/ chapter master and appothocary at the same time wonder if can be added
naja 3 Sternguard, 1 banner, 1 Captain also garnicht so schlecht wenn man nicht bei GW direkt kauft würde ich fast sagen wenn man noch nicht viele oder keine Marines hat ist die bo kein schlechtes upgrade für ne Combatpatrole box
Hahaga “pointless” cos GW uses power level
One day blood angels will get something to attach to…
I picked up a box today. They were on my list from when they were teased. I know they are not the most powerful unit I can place my Marshal in (Black Templars) but their rule of cool is very high, plus I enjoy kit-bashing, and these guys will be fun to kit-bash to look more Black Templar-ish. Obviously I've come around on them for using them with my Black Templars. ;)
First - not buying the kit unless I get it super cheap because I already have the company command squad for "counts as"
Second - unless Seth can join, I wouldn't be taking this squad anyway.
Great models. Will buy them definitively but not from GW.
All-rounder units always tend to suck in 40K. You would get the most out of them by fielding the minis in board games such Deathwatch Kill Team or in unique small points 40k scenarios. Think of the A-Team taking out trash mobs.
$22/model aud is fucking insane
Azrael seems interesting with these guys.
These will look great as SWORD Brethren for My Black Templars and with High Marshall Helbrecht
Rules or not I’m happy to paint them
Calgar joining this unit would be pretty tasty. He gets the two Vitrix guard, so that’s a load more attacks and more wounds to get through. He gives minus one to hit, plus the minus one to wound. Add a melee lieutenant and it would hit pretty hard. Bit of fun rather than competitive, but could catch a few people out with how tanks that would be.
I do miss the days of Melta Command Squads, but I'm glad I wasn't the only one that thought of big meatshields for Calgar. Although Bladeguard are still probably better.
The lack of any aura or anything is really not helpful for it. It's a very cool kit, and I might field it in a super fluffy game. But for the moment, I would just be picking this up as purely a hobby project
It’s definitely a fun centerpiece unit for a collection & casual games, but I’m doubtful they’d be remotely relevant in competitive play.
My question is if you can add an apothecary to the unit rather than a lieutenant. An apothecary in company heroes would be appropriate and have MASSIVE returns.
Brother nothing is sicker than a captain, lieutenant and a command squad crusading out the back of an impulsor with the company banner flying high
I like the premise of the veterans being representative of the three doctrines, but the end result feels really confused as to what the actual point of the unit is. And it's yet another example of a primaris unit with like five weapon types to keep track of which doesn't help. At least they look nice I suppose haha
Can the apothecary join the unit?
If this unit could attach to another unit ala Imperial Guard, it would almost be an auto include. Attach to Sternguard and the shooting compliments it while giving them extra melee punch. Attach to Bladeguard and the melee compliments them while the shooting adds a nice buff. Alas that is not to be.