The writing every day myth has been my biggest obstacle as a new writer! It’s a sure fire way to burn myself out, and it’s taken me so long to figure out WHY I was struggling to write every day, day in, day out in the midst of part time work and full time school! So awesome to hear you guys bust this myth!
@Dad Songs Right! It's a balance... sometimes, discipline IS key. If you only wait to write when your creative planets align perfectly... well yeah, not good. But on the flip side, forcing yourself, to the point where all creativity dries up isn't ideal either. I guess the idea is to know yourself, and know what you need on a case by case basis! :D
Personally I found the only reason I actually finished my book was because I was doing 1000+ words a day. I think that comes down to a number of factors though. I'm working on an epic fantasy on the same kind of scale as ASOIAF or LOTR so I have an enormous word count pushing 200k. To get through that it takes a certain measure of dedication. I needed to just commit to getting the ideas I had down on paper and fortunately I have a fairly clear goal of what happens and where it's going. Setting a daily goal gave me more incentive to keep going and not give up.
@@bartandaelus359 that's awesome!! Yeah it depends on the context - but that's awesome that you were able to give the project exactly what it needed. And it was a choice that benefitted you!
I do try to keep myself at a daily goal. But the reason I do it is very personal....If I personally don't write every day I lose contact with my WIP. Some days I write crap, done days I write gold. But I do manage to get something down to work with. I'm of the mind there are no wasted words... writing something, anything, gets me thinking about my project and developing the idea. However that is me personally, that in no way means I'm more of a writer than anyone else.
1st myth: _"You have to be good at writing to be a good writer."_ Me: *Just kill me now.* Timestamps: 1:18: You have to be good at righting to be a good writer 3:47 You need a unique plot. 8:23 You need to write daily (true if you have black/ asian parents🙋♂️) 11:28 You need a likeable character 12:47 You need a detailed outline ( Is she drunk, or....) 21:54: You have to satisfy your reader 23:43 Youre too young Idk why Im doing this at 4Am, but youre welcome. Gn, sleep tight, dont let the horrific Wattpad fanfictions bite❤️
"People went through wars and stuff, they weren't writers, they weren't' spending their days Making PINTEREST BOARDS FOR THEIR "WIP. Something happen that made them NEED TO WRITE THE STORY" Amen Katie!
This is actual writing advice I heard from authors: 1. For feminist story your female must have man related problems 2. For an adventure/war story you must kill off a main character in order to be realistic or it will upset readers to see all characters survive in the end. (war is understandable)
My 2 cents: killing off a character is so tricky. Killing my 1st character is still gut-wrenching every time I read that scene lol. My MC needed a close character to go. It has a purpose and they were never set up as a sacrificial lamb. They had a great part in book 1, died in 2nd. Readers want it to be real, some crave happier endings than others. No one wants the guy that had 2 lines to die because we don't care enough.
The killing of a character is mostly so you don't end up with a Twilight situation where there was a huge buildup to a battle scene, and then they just didn't fight. They solved it with words basically. The one side character that died is mostly just annoying and unfair. The reader wants to feel like the happy ending is earned, regardless of the genre. You don't necessarily need to kill them but make them go through something at least internally to get to the ending.
Thank you so much, the last tip means a lot to me as a teenager I always feel like I'm so under qualified to share my writing or even to write sometimes. Thank you for motivating me and keeping me sane!
The part where you said your protagonists shouldn't be likable really made sense. Sherlock Holmes, very true. Even The Joker, Mafia's,...etc are examples too.
Or never too old to write and publish. I’m only going to be turning 30 but still I’ve only just begun. But hey I sincerely found what I want to do with my life and it’s making tremendous improvements in every aspect and it feels great!
This was very helpful, thanks. I've been feeling disqualified lately. Btw, both of your shirts are adorable and I loved that you mentioned Marvel and Downtown Abbey ( I like those films, obviously lol).
Agh, the outline!!! I literally put off writing for 2 decades, because when I went to my teacher asking for writing advice or resources, the only information she gave me was to "create a plan". I guess she meant an outline, but having been 13 years old, and experience with just a 1-dimentional planning, like to-do lists, I could not imagine cramping my ideas into one "to-do list". At that time I could not imagine that the teacher could be wrong, and I had no other idea where to look for information (times without internet in my country). I have decided then and there that writing books is not for me. I mean, how am I supposed to know how my book is going to end from the get-go? Not to mention, that teacher made it sound more like a chore and another assignment than something to be actually enjoyed. Then, 20 years later, I find Brendan Sanderson's writing classes and I am ready to give it another shot.
you should do whatever would feel good for YOU. If you want to outline another book, go for it. There are no rules to art. Let your heart speak. :) Thank you for being here in the community
For my money, I’m always of the mind of fathoming another story. The next one, the next one.... Real life is simply too dismal to not at least constantly create my own Worlds, EVEN WHILE ITS TRUE that my writing tends toward dismal storytelling; it’s at least more in our control than the world as we know it.
I relate to your way of writing Kate! I am somewhere in the middle as well. Not really one or the other. Even when I plot, I change it up occasionally mid write!
I completely disagree with only writing when you feel like it. If I only write when I feel like it, I'll spend all my time playing video games. I spent 5 years "not feeling like it" after my last book. So now I spend at least 15 minutes every day writing. It keeps my story fresh and alive in my mind. And when I "feel like it" I write for a couple hours and I don't spend the first half hour rereading and trying to remember where I left off because I haven't sat down to work for weeks.
Ahhh yes! I read so many books that have genres i like but dont make me feel anything, whereas there are books that i dont even like the genre but they make me feel something and i love them
On the idea of "satisfying your reader": there was a TV show some years ago that I loved the first season of. However, I was so satisfied with how that season ended that I've never cared to go watch any more. Continuing on with the characters feels like it would ruin the perfect ending I already got from the writers and performers.
Yeah, I just became an official teen, (which was kinda shocking for my friends cuz they thought I already was one cuz I act like it!) and myth number 7 hit me hard! I kinda blanked out when Abbie said it cuz I was like, "Can they see into my soul?????" Thanks a bunch guys. You rockk!
I never understood this idea/advice that you have to write everyday. When I first heard about it, it irked (as I've been writing stories every since I could remember to form sentences) me as it didn't make sense to why I'll have to write when I might get stuck. Getting stuck then would cause frustration and possibly not me willing to write. Like you guys, I'll write when I'll feel it or when a scene nags at me that causes me to write with excitement and exploration when writing (depends on the story though as like you Kate, I'll see these visualizations over and over constantly in my head, even when I'm not writing). There have been elementary school kids who have published their children's books and even chapter books, so yeah, anyone can really write and publish at any age.
Personally I find it incredibly important to my process to write (nearly) every day. It helps me keep up the momentum and I find if I stop the scene will feel really odd when I return to it. I find it helps give me structure to my day as well. I also find it easier to finish a project by fixing the mistakes I've made in an edit than just staring at a blank page I didn't write on because I didn't feel like it.
Finishing my first novel at 52. I write for 4 hours every Saturday and Sunday morning due to having a sin in sports and a demanding career. I took a weekend off after finishing my first draft.
Yes, yes, yes Abbie! Please do a case study on Sherlock! Plus, CJ Ellis from The Best of Enemies is another good example of unlikable "likeable" characters.
I don’t know how much I agree with this first one that you guys offer.... how many writers are out there making money because they know that accessible writing is the thing that will get people to buy? (I mean to be fair, how many writers are making a living, period, from their writing?) Not to say that there aren’t still writers who enjoy writing beautiful prose, and not to say that there aren’t people who enjoy reading that sort of thing. But it definitely stands to reason that people vastly tend to prefer clear prose, almost workman prose. Frankly, stylists get very little respect in todays market, in comparison to those who just get the story out there. I don’t really see your Edith Whartons or your Toni Morrisons or anything like that in the current spring of new writers. Patrick rothfuss is the closest we have, particularly for the new crop of fantasy writers, anyway. And, well... Rothfuss. 😬
I do the outline method that Kate does. Because I have an idea of one special thing about a character that's internal conflict and then I work on that. Usually I get an exciting plot idea on the way and then I just make a few plot point notes and everything in between I write out of the blue like a panser and I change the plot points a bit sometimes too. And I like live the story almost as if it's in my own life. And I feel everything the characters feel as I like write scenes down that come up in my head. Like a plotter. Then I write the story like that. A total Hybrid. 😂 💖💕👍
I think the myth about having to write an original plot is very common. I don't know how many times I've had people advice me to just think of a way to tweak classic stories to make them my own. If you can come with a good tweak that's great but what hasn't been done at this point? I think 600k plus books get published every year at this point... really all you can rely on is your characters, forget about trying to find something new under the sun.
Someone can objectively be a good writer. In my opinion the people that can't see that are too immature to be unbiased enough to look at writing objectively.
I dont agree with the: Characters dont have to be "likable". I strongly advise this though. Because Ive read books and seen films where the mc has internal conflict goes throughout a transformation and changes for the better in the end but they... Arent likable. And... I dont mean to be harsh but I'll take 100 days of sunlight as an example because its closer to you: Tessa is very generic. I cant name a thing special or likable in her personality. Sure she has this thing of being "super-tidy" and being overcomplicated about certain stuff but it isnt that special or particularly likable. While Weston is full of quirks and likable traits that keeps you engaged like "waiting 5 sec to talk" or "asking about everything" "not thinking before speaking" are things that make him way more likable than Tessa simply because they were more emphasized throughout the book.
I don't think forcing myself to write every day is a good idea - writing is my hobby, not my job... For professional writers, it can work, but not for us, who write only because we enjoy it.
The ability to write prose absolutely matters, but the definition of 'good' is much broader and more fundamental than many new writers realize. Craft is necessary, style is subjective. (In case anyone heard that first myth and thought "yay I don't have to care about prose at all anymore.'')
"Write when you're inspired" can be unrealistic advice for the many writers who rarely feel 'inspired.' For most people, inspiration doesn't finish books, sitting down and doing the work does. Not that writing every day is realistic either, but there's a balance between writing when you feel like it and having the diligence to sit down and do it anyway. Professional writers don't have the luxury of relying on inspiration most of the time, and of that's where a writer wants to be they should get used to it now.
I also feel that you are never too old to write, I am in my 40's and I am loving it!
I'm 65. I wrote in my teens and then focused on raising a family and am just getting going again!
"I don't really write anything down or plan anything" 😂😂😂
.
.
.
Me too, Kate. Me. Too.
You are a regular eh?
The writing every day myth has been my biggest obstacle as a new writer! It’s a sure fire way to burn myself out, and it’s taken me so long to figure out WHY I was struggling to write every day, day in, day out in the midst of part time work and full time school! So awesome to hear you guys bust this myth!
I am going through it and came to the conclusion of just getting rid of it
@Dad Songs Right! It's a balance... sometimes, discipline IS key. If you only wait to write when your creative planets align perfectly... well yeah, not good. But on the flip side, forcing yourself, to the point where all creativity dries up isn't ideal either. I guess the idea is to know yourself, and know what you need on a case by case basis! :D
Personally I found the only reason I actually finished my book was because I was doing 1000+ words a day. I think that comes down to a number of factors though. I'm working on an epic fantasy on the same kind of scale as ASOIAF or LOTR so I have an enormous word count pushing 200k. To get through that it takes a certain measure of dedication. I needed to just commit to getting the ideas I had down on paper and fortunately I have a fairly clear goal of what happens and where it's going.
Setting a daily goal gave me more incentive to keep going and not give up.
@@bartandaelus359 that's awesome!! Yeah it depends on the context - but that's awesome that you were able to give the project exactly what it needed. And it was a choice that benefitted you!
I do try to keep myself at a daily goal. But the reason I do it is very personal....If I personally don't write every day I lose contact with my WIP. Some days I write crap, done days I write gold. But I do manage to get something down to work with. I'm of the mind there are no wasted words... writing something, anything, gets me thinking about my project and developing the idea. However that is me personally, that in no way means I'm more of a writer than anyone else.
1st myth: _"You have to be good at writing to be a good writer."_
Me: *Just kill me now.*
Timestamps:
1:18: You have to be good at righting to be a good writer
3:47 You need a unique plot.
8:23 You need to write daily (true if you have black/ asian parents🙋♂️)
11:28 You need a likeable character
12:47 You need a detailed outline ( Is she drunk, or....)
21:54: You have to satisfy your reader
23:43 Youre too young
Idk why Im doing this at 4Am, but youre welcome. Gn, sleep tight, dont let the horrific Wattpad fanfictions bite❤️
I appreciate your effort.
@@captainpinky8307 Glad _someone_ actually appreciates me an all I do **fake ass **_"sniff sniff"_*
"People went through wars and stuff, they weren't writers, they weren't' spending their days Making PINTEREST BOARDS FOR THEIR "WIP. Something happen that made them NEED TO WRITE THE STORY" Amen Katie!
omg my favorite part of the whole episode! YES
@@delanceydays totally agree with you LOL!
Nothing better than a half-hour writing lecture
This is actual writing advice I heard from authors:
1. For feminist story your female must have man related problems
2. For an adventure/war story you must kill off a main character in order to be realistic or it will upset readers to see all characters survive in the end. (war is understandable)
This is WILD o_o
My 2 cents: killing off a character is so tricky. Killing my 1st character is still gut-wrenching every time I read that scene lol. My MC needed a close character to go. It has a purpose and they were never set up as a sacrificial lamb. They had a great part in book 1, died in 2nd. Readers want it to be real, some crave happier endings than others. No one wants the guy that had 2 lines to die because we don't care enough.
2. Sounds like GRRM said this
The killing of a character is mostly so you don't end up with a Twilight situation where there was a huge buildup to a battle scene, and then they just didn't fight. They solved it with words basically. The one side character that died is mostly just annoying and unfair. The reader wants to feel like the happy ending is earned, regardless of the genre. You don't necessarily need to kill them but make them go through something at least internally to get to the ending.
Thank you so much, the last tip means a lot to me as a teenager I always feel like I'm so under qualified to share my writing or even to write sometimes. Thank you for motivating me and keeping me sane!
The part where you said your protagonists shouldn't be likable really made sense. Sherlock Holmes, very true. Even The Joker, Mafia's,...etc are examples too.
Or never too old to write and publish. I’m only going to be turning 30 but still I’ve only just begun. But hey I sincerely found what I want to do with my life and it’s making tremendous improvements in every aspect and it feels great!
Love it. I discovered my love for writing at 35 :)
I love your videos and thank you for debunking those myths! I feel validated as a newbe writer
This was very helpful, thanks. I've been feeling disqualified lately. Btw, both of your shirts are adorable and I loved that you mentioned Marvel and Downtown Abbey ( I like those films, obviously lol).
I’ve been writing thinning “I love this... but I don’t know if it’s any good.” Thank you for all of these myths!
Agh, the outline!!!
I literally put off writing for 2 decades, because when I went to my teacher asking for writing advice or resources, the only information she gave me was to "create a plan". I guess she meant an outline, but having been 13 years old, and experience with just a 1-dimentional planning, like to-do lists, I could not imagine cramping my ideas into one "to-do list". At that time I could not imagine that the teacher could be wrong, and I had no other idea where to look for information (times without internet in my country). I have decided then and there that writing books is not for me. I mean, how am I supposed to know how my book is going to end from the get-go? Not to mention, that teacher made it sound more like a chore and another assignment than something to be actually enjoyed. Then, 20 years later, I find Brendan Sanderson's writing classes and I am ready to give it another shot.
Hey Kate and Abbie, what do I do while I'm letting my book sit? Like can I outline other book?
you should do whatever would feel good for YOU. If you want to outline another book, go for it. There are no rules to art. Let your heart speak. :) Thank you for being here in the community
Thank you so much kate! I love watching your videos, they make my day!
For my money, I’m always of the mind of fathoming another story. The next one, the next one....
Real life is simply too dismal to not at least constantly create my own Worlds, EVEN WHILE ITS TRUE that my writing tends toward dismal storytelling; it’s at least more in our control than the world as we know it.
I relate to your way of writing Kate! I am somewhere in the middle as well. Not really one or the other. Even when I plot, I change it up occasionally mid write!
I completely disagree with only writing when you feel like it. If I only write when I feel like it, I'll spend all my time playing video games.
I spent 5 years "not feeling like it" after my last book.
So now I spend at least 15 minutes every day writing. It keeps my story fresh and alive in my mind. And when I "feel like it" I write for a couple hours and I don't spend the first half hour rereading and trying to remember where I left off because I haven't sat down to work for weeks.
Ahhh yes! I read so many books that have genres i like but dont make me feel anything, whereas there are books that i dont even like the genre but they make me feel something and i love them
On the idea of "satisfying your reader": there was a TV show some years ago that I loved the first season of. However, I was so satisfied with how that season ended that I've never cared to go watch any more. Continuing on with the characters feels like it would ruin the perfect ending I already got from the writers and performers.
Yeah, I just became an official teen, (which was kinda shocking for my friends cuz they thought I already was one cuz I act like it!) and myth number 7 hit me hard! I kinda blanked out when Abbie said it cuz I was like, "Can they see into my soul?????" Thanks a bunch guys. You rockk!
good job ladies - very helpful
Keep these podcasts coming.
I never understood this idea/advice that you have to write everyday. When I first heard about it, it irked (as I've been writing stories every since I could remember to form sentences) me as it didn't make sense to why I'll have to write when I might get stuck. Getting stuck then would cause frustration and possibly not me willing to write. Like you guys, I'll write when I'll feel it or when a scene nags at me that causes me to write with excitement and exploration when writing (depends on the story though as like you Kate, I'll see these visualizations over and over constantly in my head, even when I'm not writing). There have been elementary school kids who have published their children's books and even chapter books, so yeah, anyone can really write and publish at any age.
Personally I find it incredibly important to my process to write (nearly) every day. It helps me keep up the momentum and I find if I stop the scene will feel really odd when I return to it. I find it helps give me structure to my day as well.
I also find it easier to finish a project by fixing the mistakes I've made in an edit than just staring at a blank page I didn't write on because I didn't feel like it.
Omg, i enjoy this! SUBSCRIBED!!!!
What if people tell me I am good but I think I am not? Also how do I connect with masses to get reviews?
I don’t think it’s important to be good at writing if i have great stories to tell ❤️
Everything comes with time
Btw love your podcasts💕
Finishing my first novel at 52. I write for 4 hours every Saturday and Sunday morning due to having a sin in sports and a demanding career. I took a weekend off after finishing my first draft.
Yes, yes, yes Abbie! Please do a case study on Sherlock! Plus, CJ Ellis from The Best of Enemies is another good example of unlikable "likeable" characters.
What aesthetics is the best (your opinions)? My story ideas (the MC's aesthetics): adventurecore, bloomcore, cyberpunk, fantasy/suspense or summer
22:35 yeah but breaking bad tho
I don’t know how much I agree with this first one that you guys offer.... how many writers are out there making money because they know that accessible writing is the thing that will get people to buy? (I mean to be fair, how many writers are making a living, period, from their writing?) Not to say that there aren’t still writers who enjoy writing beautiful prose, and not to say that there aren’t people who enjoy reading that sort of thing. But it definitely stands to reason that people vastly tend to prefer clear prose, almost workman prose.
Frankly, stylists get very little respect in todays market, in comparison to those who just get the story out there.
I don’t really see your Edith Whartons or your Toni Morrisons or anything like that in the current spring of new writers.
Patrick rothfuss is the closest we have, particularly for the new crop of fantasy writers, anyway. And, well...
Rothfuss. 😬
Rothfuss's editor recently said they haven't heard from him in 3 years.
I think Alix Harrow (10,000 Doors of January) and Katherine Arden (Bear and Nightingale) both have beautiful prose.
I agree. I don't write everyday. It's unrealistic to put that kind of pressure on yourself. That doesn't mean you aren't a writer.
I dare contest that the unique plot of Tenet blew me away. But I like the characters too. But the plot was really cool I thought.
I do the outline method that Kate does. Because I have an idea of one special thing about a character that's internal conflict and then I work on that. Usually I get an exciting plot idea on the way and then I just make a few plot point notes and everything in between I write out of the blue like a panser and I change the plot points a bit sometimes too.
And I like live the story almost as if it's in my own life. And I feel everything the characters feel as I like write scenes down that come up in my head. Like a plotter. Then I write the story like that. A total Hybrid. 😂
💖💕👍
Love this!
First comment???
I love the channel and the advice you guys give. That their is not one way to do this
We're so glad it's encouraging! Thank you for being here, friend 🙏
Flip side of number 7… too old?
That’s how I’m feeling.
yeah I think I believe that I am too young, too unexperienced to let the world see my work.
I finished nanowrimo 2020 in 10 days. But I loathe the advice to write every day!
thank you
I think the myth about having to write an original plot is very common. I don't know how many times I've had people advice me to just think of a way to tweak classic stories to make them my own. If you can come with a good tweak that's great but what hasn't been done at this point? I think 600k plus books get published every year at this point... really all you can rely on is your characters, forget about trying to find something new under the sun.
I really love this podcast! You two are amazing!!! Keep up the great work!
Someone can objectively be a good writer. In my opinion the people that can't see that are too immature to be unbiased enough to look at writing objectively.
The ONE day I leave my phone at home for morning drop-off 😜
I dont agree with the: Characters dont have to be "likable". I strongly advise this though. Because Ive read books and seen films where the mc has internal conflict goes throughout a transformation and changes for the better in the end but they... Arent likable. And... I dont mean to be harsh but I'll take 100 days of sunlight as an example because its closer to you:
Tessa is very generic. I cant name a thing special or likable in her personality. Sure she has this thing of being "super-tidy" and being overcomplicated about certain stuff but it isnt that special or particularly likable. While Weston is full of quirks and likable traits that keeps you engaged like "waiting 5 sec to talk" or "asking about everything" "not thinking before speaking" are things that make him way more likable than Tessa simply because they were more emphasized throughout the book.
You guys are cool. Are you looking for a bass player? I’d totally join your band.
Hallmark movies all have the same type of plot but it's the characters who make it unique... you know how it ends but you watch it anyway...
I don't think forcing myself to write every day is a good idea - writing is my hobby, not my job... For professional writers, it can work, but not for us, who write only because we enjoy it.
What about being too old to publish your first book?
Oops. I'm a plot person and I don't like most of the MCU because of the same plot reason.
Two of my sisters and I are trying to guess: Who is older? 😊🤔
Making Pinterest boards makes you a writer? Remind me to never read anything you've ever written. I can't stand this procrastinative nonsense.
U R never 2 young. Well im 2 months old and publishing my book 1B3. 😂🤣
The ability to write prose absolutely matters, but the definition of 'good' is much broader and more fundamental than many new writers realize. Craft is necessary, style is subjective. (In case anyone heard that first myth and thought "yay I don't have to care about prose at all anymore.'')
"Write when you're inspired" can be unrealistic advice for the many writers who rarely feel 'inspired.' For most people, inspiration doesn't finish books, sitting down and doing the work does. Not that writing every day is realistic either, but there's a balance between writing when you feel like it and having the diligence to sit down and do it anyway. Professional writers don't have the luxury of relying on inspiration most of the time, and of that's where a writer wants to be they should get used to it now.