3k wheelset can be a sustainable business. But a 10k rolling chassis might not be a sustainable business model. Let me explain: When you have a crash-replacement type policy with a 10k bike module (frame, wheelset, bars, etc), Enve has to take the whole hit if they deem the incident valid for a replacement whereas when a customer used to have a Trek bike with enve wheels, Trek would absorb the portion for the frameset, shimano the groupset and Enve the wheels. This bundling is practical for the client and helps enve sell components but it exposes them to a big payout for a customer that has to exercise their crash replacement policy. Sometimes less is better
How much do you think they should charge? $1200. What do you think they should do, move all their manufacturing in China?! Explain to me, I really am curious, how do you make wheels in America hand built with a lifetime warranty cheaper? How exactly do you make cheaper wheels if you wanna have a pair wheels where you can directly communicate with the person that built your wheels ….how do you make them cheaper? How do you make wheels where if I crash I call Enve and for $50 they will send me a brand pair of wheels…?
In my view ENVE's business model is largely unsustainable. Making stuff in the US when China are making them to an equivalent standard at a fraction of the cost is a recipe for lay offs and then bankruptcy.
Enve did not make stuff in US, maybe in the old-old-old times. But right now, only the wheels are made. And maybe the one-piece stem-handlebar but not sure about that.
@hambini ALWAYS takes the pessimist view because that's his entire brand and it's wearing thin. You're a fucking tosser, mate. I think that's how they say it over there
For a custom geometry US made frame they’re really not that expensive, these aren’t taiwanese made bikes like the major brands more comparable to parlee
@@carltonholmes8061 based on the fact that the shop I work at has sold a few, you’re obviously wrong, not everyone is in the same financial situation and for some it’s a drop in the bucket
I tried an ENVE seatpost. 27.2mm zero offset. Went through three… THREE… all replaced, none of which were actually round. All of which caused clicking in the frame seat tube. Returned and bought a Giant seatpost (at the time still made 27.2 seatposts) for a quarter of the price of the ENVE. 12 years later, zero issues.
Companies being bought and sold is quite normal, especially when a company is already owned by a private equity. That’s how private equities make money.
I like Enve but the prices are ridiculous. Plus they are now doing clothing and stuff which I couldn’t care less. However their crew that attend the Gravel events are just Park City style arrogant. Im just moving to other brands which are cheaper and offer same performance and have nicer people.
Amer Sports is a company from Finland they had several sport brands such as Mavic and Suunto. Amer itself has changed ownership and the new management is optimizing their brand portfolio, they sold Suunto and now Enve. My take is that Amer sold it because they lack the expertise to make the brand grow and there are no synergy with the other brands in the group. Amer needs the cash , Enve has a great future ahead if managed correctly
It is true that Amer Sports is registered in Finland, however, it is owned by Chinese ANTA Sports, Tencent and a couple of other parties. Before Amer turned into sports it was in the business of importing cigarettes. I agree that the most likely reason for them selling ENVE was that they did not see enough growth potential in the brand and possibly the entire cycling industry as they also as mentioned exited Mavic previously. It's funny how a Chinese owned company is behind the balls used in the NFL and many of the college games without anyone calling out the quality of the equipment...
These companies have priced themselves out of the market, they only have themselves to blame. When you rely on getting profits out of $300 carbon stems or $400 handlebars you greatly reduce your list of potential customers, especially in times like these. I doubt the cost of manufacturing all those parts in China, which ALL of them do (except maybe for Time/Look) even after including duties etc., is half the price they sell.
A sign of the Silicon Valley effect - where physical product companies try to ‘scale’ like digital product and service companies and ‘grow’ while racking up massive debt. The model often fails for many companies and especially for those attempting this in a niche where the total addressable market is relatively small and highly fragmented.
I just bought a set of 29” carbon wheels. I was considering several high end companies including Enve. I ended up with We Are One Triads, of course, price at 30% off was a consideration. I get that they’re super high end, but they were $1200 more for a set
Short version, based in reality- the private equity group that has owned Enve since 2016, has decided that they were not profitable enough, quickly enough, and so has chosen to sell Enve to a wealthy investor. Said investor purchased the company for undisclosed terms. Enve isnt going anywhere for the foreseeable future, and speculation that there are issues here is rank speculation. Cannondale has 'laid off' *5* people, so of course the sky is falling. In corporate terms, a 'lay off' or 'RIF' (reduction in force) is quite common, even when things are going well.
Yea I don’t see them going under they have a good consumer base, I am speaking on my literal experience with my shops sales and questions or demands from consumers which is absolute zero. Now this is my store and we have other wheel brands, like roval and Princeton. But also I work in a shop 5 days out of the week and speak to other bicycle shop owners, I ride with other shop sales and mechanics. And also talk to distributors and hear what they have to say as well. But I never said they are going out of business. I said the same thing you said about them that company saw them not profitable and they wanted out. As for cannondale I have had people reach out to me and usually company’s will always downplay there downsizing and report smaller numbers. But also in my video if you watched it. I said that all companies do this I even referenced google, Amazon, Microsoft. This is normal because there was a demand for employees 2 years ago and now there is a correction
I ve' known exactly why the owner sold her Enve Company :) She knew that, in 2016 or 2017 ? her Enve company was at the top. Since then decline, or I would say the other cheaper options as good as Enve. I am the Enve owner by the way XC , All Mountain, Enduro, Gravel and 3.4 rim brake and disc versions.
I mean its hard because I am sure they made a nice forutne during pandemic time, but then if companies are looking to grow or produce from those numbers it is impossible and maybe thats why, they only look at numbers declining
You said the delta steerer for the Cannondale made it lighter? That's not correct. If you compare the fork weight even against "mid" spec framesets from every other manufacturer, a 400+g fork is still on the heavy side. I think they did it for aero? To keep the head tube narrow.
@@GCPerformance18 it's a heavier fork than the last gen 3 s6 Evo disc. And a fair bit more than forks from current gen competitiors. The triangle shape allows the hoses to go around the steerer without a wider head tube for clearance.
Been very happy with every ENVE product I've ever purchased. I run their wheels and bars on my road bike and bars on my gravel bike. I see lots of complaints below about there frame pricing but there frames are cheaper than SWorks and those things are everywhere.
I ordered my SuperSix Evo 2 in June 2024 from my LBS. I was told End of 2024 delivery. Then Feb, 2025. Then May 2025. Then Oct/Nov 2025. I have cancelled my order and bought something else. I wanted it! but I can't wait forever....
I order a Scott Foil pro in novembre they told me i receive my bike in april and now they said september or maybe october and Will be à 2025 it's crazy 😮
yea I saw his video I do not know where he got his info from, its tough to see that happening, specialized dabbled before in big box stores and it did not work out, enter merida back in the day... but walmart owners do like cycling, they even sell zipp wheels on there website, so we just have to wait and see
i don’t think this means anything. sometimes investment firms needs to realize a return on their investments. especially after holding it for 8 years. depends on their investment strategy/whats sort of returns their own investors expect.
I am sure that pro cyclist love certain bikes and accessories but I believe for the most part, if they funded and supported by certain bike manufacturers and brand accessories,, they will use them because of the support and adverts and it's free.
10,000 bike that goes 40kmh on average yep. After this he’s still going to yap about the high performance vehicle vs a regular road car analogy. Its been years now dude no matter the bike everyone’s average speed would be just 30kmh to 40kmh. Still the same.
I had a 1992 DeRosa with Campy 8 Record in my shop. It sold for $5600 last week. Have a Specialized Tarmac with Dura Ace from 2017 also. Asking $900. Will soon drop price to $750. Carbon is for tennis rackets.
That said, hookless are stupid. I own a pair of 4.5s, the hooked version, and I just bought a pair of Ninevelos, and they are impressive, and cost a lot less.
It's crazy how cycling youtube is so far away from riding your bikes that channels give economic status of companies producing wheelsets. Who the hell cares? GO RIDE A BIKE
The recession officially hits in 10 months. That company is merely getting out of it before massive losses hit. I remember doing conferences last year with a lot of companies preparing for this year and 2025. I'm feeling it because the work I did last year is dramatically different from this year. I haven't worked nowhere near what I did last year. It's only going to get worse.
Enve may well have been sold to the new owners simply for a profit, if they were bought for $50m before they really came into the spotlight under Pog, it’s potentially more likely they’ve been sold for more than $50m and the umbrella co saw it as an opportunity to unload a complex small part of their collective brands at a solid price. Not all ships are sinking right now. I don’t own or have interest in any enve products but understand how the umbrella brand has potentially built value into Enve by way of contracts and advertising that would increase its value.
Affordable readily upgradable bikes that can attract both athletes and casual riders and be customized towards either end of the riding spectrum. Make 2 quality baseline frames ((one off-road, one on road)) that can be customized towards almost any cycling category lowers manufacturing cost and the number of SKUs Bring in new young riders, and push innovation in the upgradable components categories, super deep aero front forks, cranks, cockpits, seatposts etc. SPECIALIZED Allez, I'm looking at you 👌
The problem is that theyre owned by a capital company. A normal company buys raw materials, does a manufacturing, sells to a customer. But an "owned" company like enve that has to make an extra layer of profit for the private equity company. No matter what you do, theres an extra doubling of the cost because that parasite company pulls a bunch of the profit out that otherwise just wouldnt happen. Remove the private equity parasite and BOOM your cost are cut in half.
That’s not how it works, private equity is the management team where shareholder equity is realized. PE might dedicate less money to reinvestment depending where in the business cycle the company is to their strategy.
@@galenkehler again, private equity is realizing the shareholder equity. They don’t charge a fee, it’s their job to create value from the company. It’s not another layer of distribution.
I won't lie, my dream bike is equipped with an Enve Cockpit and a aero wheelset but that's the problem. I can in no way justify paying that kind of money for, let's be honest, a vanity add on.
Big fan of your content. Very peculiar market that like the current motorcycle market is suddenly *INSANELY* competitive because of the collapse of the EU, Japan and China so enormous downward pricing pressures unlike anything ever seen in this Industry. Interesting and remarkable jump in Garmin which is a huge fitness products Company so that bodes very well for the US Industry still imo. Not really sure where the innovation is as Mountain Bikes remains the last Big Thing in this market starting most famously with Trek and Canondale indeed.
Usually when someone buys it is a good thing as they usually want the revenue. Occasionally they want the brains in a company but not likely in this case.
I doubt it, I think walmart has there own things going on, there are always rumors out there and also walmart has always been into the cycling scene and even selling zipp wheels on there website but I mean I think right now there is more going on in the world and I do not see them to buy specialized at this moment.... specialized has dabbled before into big box stores and it did not work out with them in the past, thats where merida had to come in and save them
Hey GC, did you see Tadej Pogacar crash in today's stage 2 of the Giro? His tire came off !! Granted, he flatted and was trying to get round a turn, but if he were on a proper hooked wheel this wouldn't have happened. Enve and their hookless wheels tried to take out the GOAT; I'm ok if they go bankrupt.
@@GCPerformance18 Pon bought Dorel Sports from Dorel Industries which owned all those brands (under Dorel Sports). The sale included all bicycle brands under Dorel Sports. "The transaction consisted of the sale by Dorel of 100% of the shares of its indirect wholly-owned subsidiary companies comprising Dorel Sports as well as certain related assets." - Dorel, 4 Jan 2022
Cannondale’s delay to release a new System Six was a tell tell sign. Then they dropped a $14,000 Lab 71 bike 🤣🤣🤣. EF Pro Team and Rapha are keeping them afloat. The Synapse is a joke on the latest versions
You can usually tell who’s riding an ENVE or whose bike is decked out in ENVE parts 😂😂 They’re the ones telling you that the company won’t go away. They just hoping at this point.
yes all retail is right now selling stuff at below cost sales, and loosing money juust to get money back meanwhile not making profit and not being able to pay for cost of business it is getting bad
Santa Cruz Reserve came into the wheel/rim market like a rugby player. No pads, no helmets, just big balls and ready to smash anything in its way. Half the price of Enve and a no questions lifetime warranty. Enve are known for their stiffness and epic failures and only 5 years warranty. Deprella lost the WC overall and suffered a serious injury because of a catastrophic rim failure a few years ago. In the UK you just don't see Enve on bikes and I think thats the consumers voting with their wallets. I run 2 carbon reserve rims on my poppy trail bike and an alloy reserve rim on the back of my Enduro bike. When I go disk road I will get the Reserve aero wheels without question.
I always go ahead and look forward to GC Perfomance's content, as he always goes ahead and provides valuable, relevant content. This is a good opportunity for folks to go ahead and look out for a deal on a Melee frame, and go ahead and jump on one for a custom build, as that's likely the direction that ENVE is gonna go ahead and go.
This is why you just can't afford to make some labor intensive products in the United States. If you do, your appeal will be to a niche market share in many cases.
Sure ENVE Wheels are expensive but they worth the price. Bought a 2nd Blur CC from a friend with enve wheels and loving them so far. No problems at all.
yes, not like I dont speak to cannondale workers from the company and also retailers as well, I think you forget I work daily in this industry.... its not just youtube
Goddamn, watch now the sharks representing China companies go after prey…. GC I have a questions how do you know Enve is in trouble? Do you know something that we don’t know, I am curious?! Pogacar was given the option of picking any wheel he wanted for his bike he chose Enve. Hookless, with 28 tires. ;)
Yea I can’t fight that. And they have money, but I’m just speaking with my personal sales and demand for the wheels. People seem to forget that I work daily in a shop and talk to other shops and reps, and I hear similar things about enve. But honestly enve brand is a strong brand with dedicated consumer base. And the best rider in the world is dominating on it
@@GCPerformance18 GC, let me explain my position… let me start by saying Fuck the previous owner of Enve… Let me also say Fuck the new owner of Enve. What I do care is the brand that Enve use to be and I hope under new management becomes, and most importantly I do care for all those super talented American boys and girls that work at Enve. Who majority of them are cyclist. The true last standing cycling ‘Merican mother fucking company. Specialized and Zipp just like every other greedy bitch company from US has moved most of their manufacturing in China. You my friend have become a mother fucking boss of TH-cam cycling content. When you say shit, the world of cycling hears…. you feel me?! Nobody knows what happened to Enve and why it was sold, few people commented how this is a very typical transaction in venture capital space. Maybe they are in trouble many not, but we simple don’t know yet because there isn’t any public information, again yet…. As far as Enve wheels go i don’t think they have any issue selling them. If Enve has a problem it has to come from other products such as their undertaking to move into frame building and clothing. Not sure if you know but they produce a shit ton of clothing products at stupid expensive price. Now if you gonna talk anything bad about Enve here it goes… talk about something tangible… like the new hub they introduced and nobody knows about it because they don’t want to piss off everyone who purchased SES wheels last year and now their wheels have the old model hub. And the new hub Grant let me tell you, it’s a fucking masterpiece of hubs, in my humble opinion the best new product introduced in the market in long time… and it sounds mean…. By far the meanest sounding hub ever. Here is another thing maybe you should talk shit about how bike shops are trying to sell 1200 dollar Enve cockpits bullshitting clients how they are the same ones as the one Pogacar uses…. Etc… bullshit the new fucking cockpit is aero stem combined with SES ar handlebar. Pogaca rides a special unique cockpit aero stem aero handlebar. Last think I will say is this: the new Enve 4.5 with innerdrive hubs are the best wheels in the market, by far. You should give them a try. They are hookless but who gives a shit nothing will happen to you… I am just as heavy as you and I ride Bay Area roads at -10 without ever having an issue. Enve 4.5 are better than Roval Rapids second generation and way, way better than any fucking NSW bullshit Zipp makes. Cheers. Happy ridding.
@charlesmansplaining Charles with all due respect Enve 4.5 were developed for the exact roads that Tadej will ride in the Giro. The sole reason why he is taking corners faster this year is those wheels. No bullshit, those wheels flare to 31mm with 28 mm tires, and 33 with 30 mm tires, and also they are incredible stable. Remember Enve’s are not light wheels, they measure to 1500 grams with tape. Any test Hambini did on Zipp about flex and how soft they are on Enve it’s a complete opposite. There is 0 flex or softness in the upper hoop/ bead area. Tadej is ridding the most advanced hookless wheels in the market with brand new developed hubs from Enve. Now as far as crash goes I wouldn’t be surprised if he crashes, I guarantee it won’t be from the wheels or his equipment, but there is a very likely possibility his competitors or some paid fucking scumbag, pushes him off the road… Neither Jonas, Roglic or Remco where on hookless wheels and almost lost their life few weeks ago… again, UAE gave him the option to buy any wheels he chose to ride, he chose Enve. Any wheel!
So, Tadej didn’t crash… you owe an apology to Enve. A guy from Florida trying to teach the world why hookless is dangerous?!I bet you have never ever ridden a hill or descended but somehow convincingly presents Enve wheels as dangerous but at the same time strongly believes china wheels are safe. Hypocrisy….?!
china literally makes wheels for a lot of the companies and then the companies assemble them in usa or Taiwan or wherever, they are also copying a hooked design that has been around for ever. I have traveled to California to ride the mountains over there in morgan hill around specialized for dealer events and rode mountains over there. It has nothing to do with wheel failing, when a rim has a hook it looks and secures that tire bead into the wheel, if a rim is hookless it is literally just strait carbon and now you rely all on tire companies to maintain tolrences and literally that connection is all based on friction from a tire bead to rim wall, the tire is too skinny, hookless designs like cars and or airplane tires are based off a structured tire that can literally hold shape and stand by itself with a massive heavy wire bead, you have companies in a race for light tires that can fold and want customer to run lower psi. what can happen is you get a slow leak that pressure or friction can get loose a complete delamination..... the industry wants to push hookless onto consumers saying it makes the wheels cheaper and easier to make so it benefits the consumer when really we have not seen any price decrease if anything price increase, they say because of hookless they can make lighter wheels, and then this is not true because companies are coming out with hooked wheels like princeton grits 4045 that weigh 1208 grams hooked, and also the tires you need to run for hookless are a third heavier then stock tube tires..... its something that is no benefit to the consumer and only benefits the manufacturer, you can make a rim with a hook and achieve whatever you want for low psi, tubeless or weight for the consumer. but these companies are all about agendas pushing new tech on consumers to prove its the new best thing. my father has owned this bike store for 42 years, I have worked here for 15 years, I have seen and adopted many trends some with pushback, mountain bike disc brakes, road bike disc brakes, the 27.5 faze, the mountian bike 6fattie faze, all these trends. but this is just craziness that they push this for road bikes
@@GCPerformance18 Who said hookless is lighter? Do you even know why hookless are used for road? Let me explain, hookless is made to make the bike safer and compliant for 0 other reasons. You can descend way faster with a hookless wheels. Tadej is not that great of a descender, that’s why he has to push over 600 watts descending, to make up for the his lack of skill, he just doesn’t have it, ( not everyone can be Cancellara) it’s ok he makes up riding like a mad man after he comes out of the corner. The only reason he is riding enves is to catch up to Jonas, remember Tadej sliding like if he had skiis on campi with shitty tires trying to keep up with Jonas last year. Enve provides extra with for him to descend with more confidence, which is why he chose to ride them. Enve wheels are not light. Tadej’s wheels are 1550 grams for a pair. Now with new hub they are under 1500 but not by much(if you want a story to shit on Enve, you could talk about how they changed their hub design for the same set of wheels without telling anyone). Hookless wheels are made to make the rider feel more compliant and comfort.
You are doing a disservice to both of these companies with your clickbait title. People will not watch your video and but think you have the inside scoop and avoid these products.
the thumbnail and title are relative, enve was sold, and honestly is a company is profitable and doing well you would not sell it, cannondale downsized there workforce but they said 1% it has been more then 1 percent
I have a store that sells enve products and have live customers coming in, and the fall off of enve for our store is huge, there i sno demand from it..... the numbers in our store have gone way down from what they were.... mainly for the reason of hookless, this
yea this is the case I know tons of people who run enve stuff and I have worked on there product for a long time and it always is quality, there no doubt about this
Enve recently released some cycling clothing. They're trying to diversify. There will always be a high end market and that's what they are catering. They aren't going anywhere.
You mean $3000 wheelsets aren't a sustainable business model?
3k wheelset can be a sustainable business. But a 10k rolling chassis might not be a sustainable business model. Let me explain:
When you have a crash-replacement type policy with a 10k bike module (frame, wheelset, bars, etc), Enve has to take the whole hit if they deem the incident valid for a replacement whereas when a customer used to have a Trek bike with enve wheels, Trek would absorb the portion for the frameset, shimano the groupset and Enve the wheels.
This bundling is practical for the client and helps enve sell components but it exposes them to a big payout for a customer that has to exercise their crash replacement policy.
Sometimes less is better
How much do you think they should charge? $1200. What do you think they should do, move all their manufacturing in China?! Explain to me, I really am curious, how do you make wheels in America hand built with a lifetime warranty cheaper? How exactly do you make cheaper wheels if you wanna have a pair wheels where you can directly communicate with the person that built your wheels ….how do you make them cheaper? How do you make wheels where if I crash I call Enve and for $50 they will send me a brand pair of wheels…?
The market/consumer will decide if they value a $3000 set of wheels. Whoops, looks like they’ve already decided…
Dude, it’s Patrick!
Love their stuff but cannot afford any of it as their prices are ridiculous. 😮
In my view ENVE's business model is largely unsustainable. Making stuff in the US when China are making them to an equivalent standard at a fraction of the cost is a recipe for lay offs and then bankruptcy.
Enve did not make stuff in US, maybe in the old-old-old times. But right now, only the wheels are made. And maybe the one-piece stem-handlebar but not sure about that.
You mean $3000 wheelsets aren't sustainable?
At the price points they sell things and with the proliferation of (good) cheaper options from China, they are at best a boutique brand at this point.
@@rand_kk I think their tag line was "hand made in Ogden Utah" or something like that
@hambini ALWAYS takes the pessimist view because that's his entire brand and it's wearing thin. You're a fucking tosser, mate. I think that's how they say it over there
I honestly cannot believe how expensive the enve framesets are. Doesnt surprise me they're in trouble
For a custom geometry US made frame they’re really not that expensive, these aren’t taiwanese made bikes like the major brands more comparable to parlee
@@ethancushing3398 People still wont pay that price.
@@ethancushing3398 The American people have gone more to value for their dollar over the old American made concept.
They ain't forcing you to buy it tho
@@carltonholmes8061 based on the fact that the shop I work at has sold a few, you’re obviously wrong, not everyone is in the same financial situation and for some it’s a drop in the bucket
I tried an ENVE seatpost. 27.2mm zero offset. Went through three… THREE… all replaced, none of which were actually round. All of which caused clicking in the frame seat tube. Returned and bought a Giant seatpost (at the time still made 27.2 seatposts) for a quarter of the price of the ENVE. 12 years later, zero issues.
Companies being bought and sold is quite normal, especially when a company is already owned by a private equity. That’s how private equities make money.
I like Enve but the prices are ridiculous. Plus they are now doing clothing and stuff which I couldn’t care less. However their crew that attend the Gravel events are just Park City style arrogant. Im just moving to other brands which are cheaper and offer same performance and have nicer people.
I only buy their stuff at huge discount (70-80% off). It's not bad, but not top of the line either.
Amer Sports is a company from Finland they had several sport brands such as Mavic and Suunto. Amer itself has changed ownership and the new management is optimizing their brand portfolio, they sold Suunto and now Enve. My take is that Amer sold it because they lack the expertise to make the brand grow and there are no synergy with the other brands in the group. Amer needs the cash , Enve has a great future ahead if managed correctly
Yea I can see that too
It is true that Amer Sports is registered in Finland, however, it is owned by Chinese ANTA Sports, Tencent and a couple of other parties. Before Amer turned into sports it was in the business of importing cigarettes. I agree that the most likely reason for them selling ENVE was that they did not see enough growth potential in the brand and possibly the entire cycling industry as they also as mentioned exited Mavic previously. It's funny how a Chinese owned company is behind the balls used in the NFL and many of the college games without anyone calling out the quality of the equipment...
These companies have priced themselves out of the market, they only have themselves to blame.
When you rely on getting profits out of $300 carbon stems or $400 handlebars you greatly reduce your list of potential customers, especially in times like these.
I doubt the cost of manufacturing all those parts in China, which ALL of them do (except maybe for Time/Look) even after including duties etc., is half the price they sell.
A sign of the Silicon Valley effect - where physical product companies try to ‘scale’ like digital product and service companies and ‘grow’ while racking up massive debt. The model often fails for many companies and especially for those attempting this in a niche where the total addressable market is relatively small and highly fragmented.
There are selling there 1 Piece Handlebar for $ 1600 up here in Canada this is 1 reason the Company is Failing
I just bought a set of 29” carbon wheels. I was considering several high end companies including Enve. I ended up with We Are One Triads, of course, price at 30% off was a consideration. I get that they’re super high end, but they were $1200 more for a set
Short version, based in reality- the private equity group that has owned Enve since 2016, has decided that they were not profitable enough, quickly enough, and so has chosen to sell Enve to a wealthy investor. Said investor purchased the company for undisclosed terms.
Enve isnt going anywhere for the foreseeable future, and speculation that there are issues here is rank speculation.
Cannondale has 'laid off' *5* people, so of course the sky is falling. In corporate terms, a 'lay off' or 'RIF' (reduction in force) is quite common, even when things are going well.
Yea I don’t see them going under they have a good consumer base, I am speaking on my literal experience with my shops sales and questions or demands from consumers which is absolute zero. Now this is my store and we have other wheel brands, like roval and Princeton. But also I work in a shop 5 days out of the week and speak to other bicycle shop owners, I ride with other shop sales and mechanics. And also talk to distributors and hear what they have to say as well. But I never said they are going out of business. I said the same thing you said about them that company saw them not profitable and they wanted out. As for cannondale I have had people reach out to me and usually company’s will always downplay there downsizing and report smaller numbers. But also in my video if you watched it. I said that all companies do this I even referenced google, Amazon, Microsoft. This is normal because there was a demand for employees 2 years ago and now there is a correction
I was surprised to see ENVE plotted in the "mass market" quadrant of that graph by Anta Sports (instead of the high-end market quadrant).
I ve' known exactly why the owner sold her Enve Company :)
She knew that, in 2016 or 2017 ? her Enve company was at the top.
Since then decline, or I would say the other cheaper options as good as Enve.
I am the Enve owner by the way XC , All Mountain, Enduro, Gravel and 3.4 rim brake and disc versions.
I mean its hard because I am sure they made a nice forutne during pandemic time, but then if companies are looking to grow or produce from those numbers it is impossible and maybe thats why, they only look at numbers declining
You said the delta steerer for the Cannondale made it lighter? That's not correct. If you compare the fork weight even against "mid" spec framesets from every other manufacturer, a 400+g fork is still on the heavy side. I think they did it for aero? To keep the head tube narrow.
I thought the delta steerer was made lighter
@@GCPerformance18 it's a heavier fork than the last gen 3 s6 Evo disc. And a fair bit more than forks from current gen competitiors. The triangle shape allows the hoses to go around the steerer without a wider head tube for clearance.
@@GCPerformance18wrong
Been very happy with every ENVE product I've ever purchased. I run their wheels and bars on my road bike and bars on my gravel bike. I see lots of complaints below about there frame pricing but there frames are cheaper than SWorks and those things are everywhere.
enve makes great gravel wheels
I ordered my SuperSix Evo 2 in June 2024 from my LBS. I was told End of 2024 delivery. Then Feb, 2025. Then May 2025. Then Oct/Nov 2025. I have cancelled my order and bought something else. I wanted it! but I can't wait forever....
I order a Scott Foil pro in novembre they told me i receive my bike in april and now they said september or maybe october and Will be à 2025 it's crazy 😮
Yea I have heard cannondale is lacking on inventory
Also heard Walmart buying Specialized 😅
I heard Wal-Mart was buying 49% of Trek. Just waiting hear it repeated before believing.
EVO1 Cycling covered it on his channel
@@EVO1Industries yep, saw it there but where did he get that info?
@@m.talley1660 no clue but he said something about having family at bike companies before. I guess we wait for an article or if they deny it.
yea I saw his video I do not know where he got his info from, its tough to see that happening, specialized dabbled before in big box stores and it did not work out, enter merida back in the day... but walmart owners do like cycling, they even sell zipp wheels on there website, so we just have to wait and see
i don’t think this means anything. sometimes investment firms needs to realize a return on their investments. especially after holding it for 8 years. depends on their investment strategy/whats sort of returns their own investors expect.
I am sure that pro cyclist love certain bikes and accessories but I believe for the most part, if they funded and supported by certain bike manufacturers and brand accessories,, they will use them because of the support and adverts and it's free.
10,000 bike that goes 40kmh on average yep.
After this he’s still going to yap about the high performance vehicle vs a regular road car analogy. Its been years now dude no matter the bike everyone’s average speed would be just 30kmh to 40kmh. Still the same.
I had a 1992 DeRosa with Campy 8 Record in my shop. It sold for $5600 last week. Have a Specialized Tarmac with Dura Ace from 2017 also. Asking $900. Will soon drop price to $750.
Carbon is for tennis rackets.
Ridiculous prices on handlebars. No wonder they are not profitable. Why will I spend thousands of dollars on an Enve bike. Smh.
If it's a PE firm they have to exit after a period of time. They have contracts with their LPs, and have to pay them out.
With the bad press lately regarding hookless rims was it for a profit or loss is the question.
Finally someone who gets it. Probably was time to realize the investment for their investors and market headwinds further solidified the decision
ENVE is toast private equity is the death of a business
"Cannondale is a medium manufacturing company with 500 employees"
So 5 employees were laid off and it made the news? Omfg
They laid more than that off in the UK alone, take the 1% with a pinch of salt.
This is normal for companies to downplay there downsize and never admit there real numbers
Yes
@charlesmansplaining not quite, they made a cost cutting exercise and completely eliminated the UK office.
You mean 800 for a dropper post is too cheap 👎 greedy companies
Tons of people ride enve bikes and wheels here in tucson
$ 4500 for an enve frameset is a bit much. You can get a whole bmc for less than that.
I think they come with a handlebar and stem too
That said, hookless are stupid. I own a pair of 4.5s, the hooked version, and I just bought a pair of Ninevelos, and they are impressive, and cost a lot less.
The last good ENVE SES lineup was the third-generation, the last one with hooked rims and brake tracks for rim brake configurations.
We sold more enve hooked wheels
Post-covid will wipe half of the brands from the market I guess, hopefully for good.
Sadly I feel like this next year will be many many many corporations going through the same thing. The pain has only begun :(
ENVE owners/leadership sees where the bicycle industry is headed, and are cashing out before the crash. What better time to sell than now?
Also, ENVE to move most/all manufacturing to SEA. Mark my words.
What are you selling instead of enve? Other brands or the bikes come with good wheels? Or consumer take a step down?
It's crazy how cycling youtube is so far away from riding your bikes that channels give economic status of companies producing wheelsets. Who the hell cares? GO RIDE A BIKE
Yea I show off bikes and tips but sometimes people don’t care. It seems all the new bikes are too high price.
Add a zero to that Cannondale reorganization .
That’s what I figured
Amer have been long in the game of owning sports entities - Arcteryx, Salomon etc. Big names.
The recession officially hits in 10 months. That company is merely getting out of it before massive losses hit. I remember doing conferences last year with a lot of companies preparing for this year and 2025. I'm feeling it because the work I did last year is dramatically different from this year. I haven't worked nowhere near what I did last year. It's only going to get worse.
Enve may well have been sold to the new owners simply for a profit, if they were bought for $50m before they really came into the spotlight under Pog, it’s potentially more likely they’ve been sold for more than $50m and the umbrella co saw it as an opportunity to unload a complex small part of their collective brands at a solid price. Not all ships are sinking right now. I don’t own or have interest in any enve products but understand how the umbrella brand has potentially built value into Enve by way of contracts and advertising that would increase its value.
yea, that also makes sense as well
Can anyone comment if CRW $1800 wheelsets are equivalent if not better than ENVE 3K wheels?
I ride the craft wheels on my tarmac, they are my go to wheel, and IO choose them over every other industry wheel out there and it is by chocie
Who knew that catering to the boutique cycling poser doesn't pay dividends when the economy goes south? 🤔
Probably says more about Amer Group than Enve, tbh
I mean like I said if the enve was producing money and profitable why would a company sell them.
@@GCPerformance18 Opportunity cost. They weren't making money as fast as other investments could.
Affordable readily upgradable bikes that can attract both athletes and casual riders and be customized towards either end of the riding spectrum.
Make 2 quality baseline frames ((one off-road, one on road)) that can be customized towards almost any cycling category lowers manufacturing cost and the number of SKUs
Bring in new young riders, and push innovation in the upgradable components categories, super deep aero front forks, cranks, cockpits, seatposts etc.
SPECIALIZED Allez, I'm looking at you 👌
There’s some rumor thos morning of walmart buying Specialized
I have heard this, but who knows
I thought it was trek they were buying?
I got that same Supersix Evo for $4000 on sale in PDX.
Hook the rest of us up with that deal.
@@ChadMcCan-eg9km river city bikes.
Just bought the new Cannondale Scalpel..it's awesome. Hopefully Cannondale is managing things correctly.
these companies make great bikes just tough times right now
So that’s why Litespeed bikes is giving a free enve rim upgrade right now!
Litespeed... Talk about a company that has gone through some changes over the last 25 years.
The problem is that theyre owned by a capital company. A normal company buys raw materials, does a manufacturing, sells to a customer. But an "owned" company like enve that has to make an extra layer of profit for the private equity company.
No matter what you do, theres an extra doubling of the cost because that parasite company pulls a bunch of the profit out that otherwise just wouldnt happen.
Remove the private equity parasite and BOOM your cost are cut in half.
That’s not how it works, private equity is the management team where shareholder equity is realized. PE might dedicate less money to reinvestment depending where in the business cycle the company is to their strategy.
@@derekmattice3077 and they do this for free?
@@galenkehler again, private equity is realizing the shareholder equity. They don’t charge a fee, it’s their job to create value from the company. It’s not another layer of distribution.
Think of it like owning a stock, as it increases in value wealth increases but you don’t realize a profit until you close your position on that stock.
I won't lie, my dream bike is equipped with an Enve Cockpit and a aero wheelset but that's the problem. I can in no way justify paying that kind of money for, let's be honest, a vanity add on.
Amer is gonna be selling $600 budget wheelsets in no time.
lmfao they just rip off there designs and make new ons
Anytime i hear 5k for a road bike is fantastic price point ..that tells me everything i need to know about the state of the cycling industry 😅😅
What do you think will be the next big news in the bike industry?
Are you hearing the rumors about Specialized and Walmart? What are your thoughts?
Big fan of your content. Very peculiar market that like the current motorcycle market is suddenly *INSANELY* competitive because of the collapse of the EU, Japan and China so enormous downward pricing pressures unlike anything ever seen in this Industry. Interesting and remarkable jump in Garmin which is a huge fitness products Company so that bodes very well for the US Industry still imo. Not really sure where the innovation is as Mountain Bikes remains the last Big Thing in this market starting most famously with Trek and Canondale indeed.
SL8 is a Walmart bike 😅😅😅
Aero nose cones
Winspace going down. Don't quote me haha
ENVE, formerly EDGE, has always produced parts
Usually when someone buys it is a good thing as they usually want the revenue. Occasionally they want the brains in a company but not likely in this case.
I was steered away from Enve because they were a new company. Glad I listened to a pro racers advice.
Amer is currently restructuring and enve definitely doesn’t fit in the new concept
Any truth to the rumors that Walton brothers are buying Specialized bike business?
I doubt it, I think walmart has there own things going on, there are always rumors out there and also walmart has always been into the cycling scene and even selling zipp wheels on there website but I mean I think right now there is more going on in the world and I do not see them to buy specialized at this moment.... specialized has dabbled before into big box stores and it did not work out with them in the past, thats where merida had to come in and save them
The himod is better than lab71 😂
Hey GC, did you see Tadej Pogacar crash in today's stage 2 of the Giro? His tire came off !! Granted, he flatted and was trying to get round a turn, but if he were on a proper hooked wheel this wouldn't have happened. Enve and their hookless wheels tried to take out the GOAT; I'm ok if they go bankrupt.
Thought mavic owned Enve?
Should have sold to Walmart like Spesh 😉
lets see if that is true, I do not see it yet
Cannondale is owned by the same company that owns Mongoose, GT, Schwinn
They are owned by pon so I do not know if pon owns mongoose
@@GCPerformance18 Pon bought Dorel Sports from Dorel Industries which owned all those brands (under Dorel Sports). The sale included all bicycle brands under Dorel Sports.
"The transaction consisted of the sale by Dorel of 100% of the shares of its indirect wholly-owned subsidiary companies comprising Dorel Sports as well as certain related assets." - Dorel, 4 Jan 2022
Cannondale’s delay to release a new System Six was a tell tell sign. Then they dropped a $14,000 Lab 71 bike 🤣🤣🤣.
EF Pro Team and Rapha are keeping them afloat. The Synapse is a joke on the latest versions
You can usually tell who’s riding an ENVE or whose bike is decked out in ENVE parts 😂😂 They’re the ones telling you that the company won’t go away. They just hoping at this point.
Rats leave sinking ships, so they don't drown.
I heard the system 6 is going away.
I could see that. I am seeing a lot of companies ditch the two bike system and go for the all purpose bike
All retail, regardless of the product they sell, is on a death spiral. Amazon is the reason.
yes all retail is right now selling stuff at below cost sales, and loosing money juust to get money back meanwhile not making profit and not being able to pay for cost of business it is getting bad
Very informative interesting video 👍👍
Well, they ditch rim brakes...
That’s not market
Santa Cruz Reserve came into the wheel/rim market like a rugby player. No pads, no helmets, just big balls and ready to smash anything in its way. Half the price of Enve and a no questions lifetime warranty. Enve are known for their stiffness and epic failures and only 5 years warranty. Deprella lost the WC overall and suffered a serious injury because of a catastrophic rim failure a few years ago. In the UK you just don't see Enve on bikes and I think thats the consumers voting with their wallets. I run 2 carbon reserve rims on my poppy trail bike and an alloy reserve rim on the back of my Enduro bike. When I go disk road I will get the Reserve aero wheels without question.
I always go ahead and look forward to GC Perfomance's content, as he always goes ahead and provides valuable, relevant content.
This is a good opportunity for folks to go ahead and look out for a deal on a Melee frame, and go ahead and jump on one for a custom build, as that's likely the direction that ENVE is gonna go ahead and go.
$1200 one piece bars
This is why you just can't afford to make some labor intensive products in the United States. If you do, your appeal will be to a niche market share in many cases.
Sure ENVE Wheels are expensive but they worth the price.
Bought a 2nd Blur CC from a friend with enve wheels and loving them so far. No problems at all.
So what?
ENVE vs Deda i chose Deda.
Your takes on these BRAIN articals are a joke!
yes, not like I dont speak to cannondale workers from the company and also retailers as well, I think you forget I work daily in this industry.... its not just youtube
Goddamn, watch now the sharks representing China companies go after prey…. GC I have a questions how do you know Enve is in trouble? Do you know something that we don’t know, I am curious?!
Pogacar was given the option of picking any wheel he wanted for his bike he chose Enve. Hookless, with 28 tires. ;)
Yea I can’t fight that. And they have money, but I’m just speaking with my personal sales and demand for the wheels. People seem to forget that I work daily in a shop and talk to other shops and reps, and I hear similar things about enve. But honestly enve brand is a strong brand with dedicated consumer base. And the best rider in the world is dominating on it
@@GCPerformance18 GC, let me explain my position… let me start by saying Fuck the previous owner of Enve… Let me also say Fuck the new owner of Enve.
What I do care is the brand that Enve use to be and I hope under new management becomes, and most importantly I do care for all those super talented American boys and girls that work at Enve. Who majority of them are cyclist. The true last standing cycling ‘Merican mother fucking company. Specialized and Zipp just like every other greedy bitch company from US has moved most of their manufacturing in China.
You my friend have become a mother fucking boss of TH-cam cycling content. When you say shit, the world of cycling hears…. you feel me?! Nobody knows what happened to Enve and why it was sold, few people commented how this is a very typical transaction in venture capital space. Maybe they are in trouble many not, but we simple don’t know yet because there isn’t any public information, again yet…. As far as Enve wheels go i don’t think they have any issue selling them. If Enve has a problem it has to come from other products such as their undertaking to move into frame building and clothing. Not sure if you know but they produce a shit ton of clothing products at stupid expensive price.
Now if you gonna talk anything bad about Enve here it goes… talk about something tangible… like the new hub they introduced and nobody knows about it because they don’t want to piss off everyone who purchased SES wheels last year and now their wheels have the old model hub. And the new hub Grant let me tell you, it’s a fucking masterpiece of hubs, in my humble opinion the best new product introduced in the market in long time… and it sounds mean…. By far the meanest sounding hub ever.
Here is another thing maybe you should talk shit about how bike shops are trying to sell 1200 dollar Enve cockpits bullshitting clients how they are the same ones as the one Pogacar uses…. Etc… bullshit the new fucking cockpit is aero stem combined with SES ar handlebar. Pogaca rides a special unique cockpit aero stem aero handlebar.
Last think I will say is this: the new Enve 4.5 with innerdrive hubs are the best wheels in the market, by far. You should give them a try. They are hookless but who gives a shit nothing will happen to you… I am just as heavy as you and I ride Bay Area roads at -10 without ever having an issue. Enve 4.5 are better than Roval Rapids second generation and way, way better than any fucking NSW bullshit Zipp makes.
Cheers. Happy ridding.
@charlesmansplaining Charles with all due respect Enve 4.5 were developed for the exact roads that Tadej will ride in the Giro. The sole reason why he is taking corners faster this year is those wheels. No bullshit, those wheels flare to 31mm with 28 mm tires, and 33 with 30 mm tires, and also they are incredible stable. Remember Enve’s are not light wheels, they measure to 1500 grams with tape. Any test Hambini did on Zipp about flex and how soft they are on Enve it’s a complete opposite. There is 0 flex or softness in the upper hoop/ bead area. Tadej is ridding the most advanced hookless wheels in the market with brand new developed hubs from Enve. Now as far as crash goes I wouldn’t be surprised if he crashes, I guarantee it won’t be from the wheels or his equipment, but there is a very likely possibility his competitors or some paid fucking scumbag, pushes him off the road…
Neither Jonas, Roglic or Remco where on hookless wheels and almost lost their life few weeks ago… again, UAE gave him the option to buy any wheels he chose to ride, he chose Enve. Any wheel!
@charlesmansplaining sorry I didn’t watch Giro… what happened, did he crash…. wait maybe at the tour… oh no that happened too…. 🤦♂️
I can’t believe how expensive bikes are. Literally just to get on something DECENT is minimum $800 now. Insane.
Does any bicycle brand stand on their own? Not being owned by some big ass company? 😂
Benotti of Germany. Rgr
Do you own a time machine to go back 25 years?
i have been asking envy to make a one piece mountain bike stem bar for 3 years now if they want my money they need to make it 😩🥺
lmao I am sure they will get into it, right now road is heavy seller
So, Tadej didn’t crash… you owe an apology to Enve. A guy from Florida trying to teach the world why hookless is dangerous?!I bet you have never ever ridden a hill or descended but somehow convincingly presents Enve wheels as dangerous but at the same time strongly believes china wheels are safe. Hypocrisy….?!
china literally makes wheels for a lot of the companies and then the companies assemble them in usa or Taiwan or wherever, they are also copying a hooked design that has been around for ever. I have traveled to California to ride the mountains over there in morgan hill around specialized for dealer events and rode mountains over there. It has nothing to do with wheel failing, when a rim has a hook it looks and secures that tire bead into the wheel, if a rim is hookless it is literally just strait carbon and now you rely all on tire companies to maintain tolrences and literally that connection is all based on friction from a tire bead to rim wall, the tire is too skinny, hookless designs like cars and or airplane tires are based off a structured tire that can literally hold shape and stand by itself with a massive heavy wire bead, you have companies in a race for light tires that can fold and want customer to run lower psi. what can happen is you get a slow leak that pressure or friction can get loose a complete delamination..... the industry wants to push hookless onto consumers saying it makes the wheels cheaper and easier to make so it benefits the consumer when really we have not seen any price decrease if anything price increase, they say because of hookless they can make lighter wheels, and then this is not true because companies are coming out with hooked wheels like princeton grits 4045 that weigh 1208 grams hooked, and also the tires you need to run for hookless are a third heavier then stock tube tires..... its something that is no benefit to the consumer and only benefits the manufacturer, you can make a rim with a hook and achieve whatever you want for low psi, tubeless or weight for the consumer. but these companies are all about agendas pushing new tech on consumers to prove its the new best thing.
my father has owned this bike store for 42 years, I have worked here for 15 years, I have seen and adopted many trends some with pushback, mountain bike disc brakes, road bike disc brakes, the 27.5 faze, the mountian bike 6fattie faze, all these trends. but this is just craziness that they push this for road bikes
@@GCPerformance18 Who said hookless is lighter? Do you even know why hookless are used for road? Let me explain, hookless is made to make the bike safer and compliant for 0 other reasons. You can descend way faster with a hookless wheels. Tadej is not that great of a descender, that’s why he has to push over 600 watts descending, to make up for the his lack of skill, he just doesn’t have it, ( not everyone can be Cancellara) it’s ok he makes up riding like a mad man after he comes out of the corner. The only reason he is riding enves is to catch up to Jonas, remember Tadej sliding like if he had skiis on campi with shitty tires trying to keep up with Jonas last year. Enve provides extra with for him to descend with more confidence, which is why he chose to ride them. Enve wheels are not light. Tadej’s wheels are 1550 grams for a pair. Now with new hub they are under 1500 but not by much(if you want a story to shit on Enve, you could talk about how they changed their hub design for the same set of wheels without telling anyone). Hookless wheels are made to make the rider feel more compliant and comfort.
You cant go wrong with Specialized! ☺️
You are doing a disservice to both of these companies with your clickbait title. People will not watch your video and but think you have the inside scoop and avoid these products.
the thumbnail and title are relative, enve was sold, and honestly is a company is profitable and doing well you would not sell it, cannondale downsized there workforce but they said 1% it has been more then 1 percent
Clickbait. You have no relevant information regarding the Enve transaction but why let that stop you from making a video about it.
I have a store that sells enve products and have live customers coming in, and the fall off of enve for our store is huge, there i sno demand from it..... the numbers in our store have gone way down from what they were.... mainly for the reason of hookless, this
You watched it!
i enjoy enve i am willing to pay extra for North America made stuff
yea this is the case I know tons of people who run enve stuff and I have worked on there product for a long time and it always is quality, there no doubt about this
Enve recently released some cycling clothing. They're trying to diversify. There will always be a high end market and that's what they are catering. They aren't going anywhere.
Yea I see the same, they are well established