Word of warning (I'm an electrician) most of the time you'll have no where near as much room to work as this bloke. Usually you'll have your head jammed under a sink or will be reaching behind a stinking toilet (depending where the stop tap is) and you'll have to struggle and persevere to pull the clamp tight onto the pipe with fingers as it wont be possible to psychically get a pair of pliers into the confined space!
Discovered that today with our main water pipe into the corner of our kitchen. Our house was built in the late 1960s and still has the original earthing clamp and cable which over time has become corroded and ineffective. I was literally laying inside the cupboard trying to squeeze my arms through a tiny aperture in the corner unit! What a pain!
The pipe as it enters the property is plastic. Surely that means it is NOT an extraneous conductive part and therefore does not require MAIN bonding ? Perhaps it needs supplementary bonding I'm not sure?
If you want to start an argument, join an electricians forum and ask a question about it ;-) I too don't see the point in doing it, but the regs say that you must (or they did the last time that I checked). Thanks for the comment
@@ultimatehandyman Thanks a lot for your reply. I watch most of your videos and really like them. Perhaps I'll now subscribe 8-) Unfortunately I'd already followed your advice but nobody there will answer the question ! www.electriciansforums.net/threads/main-bonding-for-incoming-plastic-pipe.190405 Closest I've got is JW's excellent bonding video which implies you don't need it BUT that is no good if your sparky is doing an EICR and insists it needs doing ! Really having trouble getting the truth on this.
@@Mike-ur7xk A few years back, I remember a thread in an electrical forum and someone ended up bonding to the plastic water pipe- because it said it must be done in the regs. There is a lot of confusion between the actual Law, regulations and recommendations. If you look at the latest edition of the (IEE- now IET) wiring regulations, it is suited more to a lawyer, rather than electrician. Thanks for the comments
good exlanation of how to do it....how about why its needed ? also the cable should be terminated with a crimped on lug or at least wrapped around the screw in the tightening direction....a pushed in cable as shown is to easy to pull out....and yes i am a grumpy old spark
Yeh I'd prefer a crimp too, problem with crimps is that snowflakes try and make them with pliers, and then decide that crimps are stupid. Especially Americans.
Do you need separate 10mm2 earth cables from the gas meter and water pipe to the consumer unit or can you use one cable and connect the gas and water pipes (in my case both close together in the kitchen cupboard. Also, if you cant use a clamp on a lead gas pipe (mines a 1960's property) supplying the boiler and fire, how can I earth these? THANKS
If I remember rightly they have to be separate cables. I'm not sure about the bonding of the gas lead pipe- they are really thin and would be damaged by the earth clamp.
You can use one cable as long as it isn't cut on its way past the first bonding point. It's a bit fiddly but you have to cut a short section of the green and yellow half way along the cable without chopping the copper conductors. That bit of exposed copper goes under your first BS951 clamp and then onto your next bonding position. It used to be Regulation 528.3.3, but probably a different number now.
Thanks, there was a lot of debate about this years ago as the electricians used to argue about it saying that the 17th edition regs said that the incoming water pipe had to be bonded. There were even some electricians putting the earth clamp on the plastic pipe (if they were posting the truth in their comments).
Ultimate Handyman Yeah I've been on many forums where this debate continues. A lot of sparkies get confused as to the purpose of equipotential bonding. No harm adding it though
The incoming water used to be bonded because the pipe used to be metal (often lead around here), MDPE is a plastic pipe and so it's a bit pointless bonding it as it is not conductive.
It is a good video but diyers still shouldn't do this az they can't check that the resistance complies (granted it probably will) and they wouldn't know what CSA of cable to use.
There is no common sense in the regulations, I have even heard of electricians putting the earth clamp onto plastic MDPE pipe- as it says you have to in the regs. Thanks for the comment 👍
Good job on the video, nice and clear and complete. Thank you, great refresher before I start installing the gas pipe for a back-up generator.
Thanks for the comment 👍
Helpful video thanks. Fixing a leak in downstairs toilet and needed to make sure how to reconnect the earth 👍
You are welcome
Thanks for the comment 👍
Word of warning (I'm an electrician) most of the time you'll have no where near as much room to work as this bloke.
Usually you'll have your head jammed under a sink or will be reaching behind a stinking toilet (depending where the stop tap is) and you'll have to struggle and persevere to pull the clamp tight onto the pipe with fingers as it wont be possible to psychically get a pair of pliers into the confined space!
Discovered that today with our main water pipe into the corner of our kitchen. Our house was built in the late 1960s and still has the original earthing clamp and cable which over time has become corroded and ineffective. I was literally laying inside the cupboard trying to squeeze my arms through a tiny aperture in the corner unit! What a pain!
A nice touch is to label the cables "water" and "gas" at the main earth terminal for the benefit of the sparky that does the next inspection & test.
👍
The pipe as it enters the property is plastic. Surely that means it is NOT an extraneous conductive part and therefore does not require MAIN bonding ? Perhaps it needs supplementary bonding I'm not sure?
If you want to start an argument, join an electricians forum and ask a question about it ;-)
I too don't see the point in doing it, but the regs say that you must (or they did the last time that I checked).
Thanks for the comment
@@ultimatehandyman Thanks a lot for your reply. I watch most of your videos and really like them. Perhaps I'll now subscribe 8-) Unfortunately I'd already followed your advice but nobody there will answer the question ! www.electriciansforums.net/threads/main-bonding-for-incoming-plastic-pipe.190405 Closest I've got is JW's excellent bonding video which implies you don't need it BUT that is no good if your sparky is doing an EICR and insists it needs doing ! Really having trouble getting the truth on this.
@@Mike-ur7xk A few years back, I remember a thread in an electrical forum and someone ended up bonding to the plastic water pipe- because it said it must be done in the regs. There is a lot of confusion between the actual Law, regulations and recommendations. If you look at the latest edition of the (IEE- now IET) wiring regulations, it is suited more to a lawyer, rather than electrician.
Thanks for the comments
good exlanation of how to do it....how about why its needed ?
also the cable should be terminated with a crimped on lug or at least wrapped around the screw in the tightening direction....a pushed in cable as shown is to easy to pull out....and yes i am a grumpy old spark
Yeh I'd prefer a crimp too, problem with crimps is that snowflakes try and make them with pliers, and then decide that crimps are stupid. Especially Americans.
The best earth clip for that size cable is one with a 2screw type clamp , no need to use a lug.
Thanks for the comment
Do you need separate 10mm2 earth cables from the gas meter and water pipe to the consumer unit or can you use one cable and connect the gas and water pipes (in my case both close together in the kitchen cupboard. Also, if you cant use a clamp on a lead gas pipe (mines a 1960's property) supplying the boiler and fire, how can I earth these? THANKS
If I remember rightly they have to be separate cables.
I'm not sure about the bonding of the gas lead pipe- they are really thin and would be damaged by the earth clamp.
You can use one cable as long as it isn't cut on its way past the first bonding point. It's a bit fiddly but you have to cut a short section of the green and yellow half way along the cable without chopping the copper conductors.
That bit of exposed copper goes under your first BS951 clamp and then onto your next bonding position.
It used to be Regulation 528.3.3, but probably a different number now.
Use a constant-force spring clamp for lead pipe.
Great video, must the other end go the main junction near the consumer unit or can it be attached to a nearby outlet's earth?
Roger S
Yes, the other end needs connecting to the main earthing terminal, which will be near the consumer unit.
Is it bad that my garage (separate from the house) does not have an earth conductor? Just a 16 amp MCB protecting it in the house.
Its all just one circuit for the garage sockets and lights, the property is around 80 years old so I guess things were not built to todays codes.
Thank you so much... no wonder we were getting a little shock in the shower
Great photography of it!
to do a proper job the 10mm needs a proper crimped lug
The water supply didn't need bonding - you have an MDPE supply so cannot introduce a potential into the property.
Thanks, there was a lot of debate about this years ago as the electricians used to argue about it saying that the 17th edition regs said that the incoming water pipe had to be bonded. There were even some electricians putting the earth clamp on the plastic pipe (if they were posting the truth in their comments).
Ultimate Handyman Yeah I've been on many forums where this debate continues. A lot of sparkies get confused as to the purpose of equipotential bonding. No harm adding it though
Blimey are they still arguing about it now ;-)
Thanks for the comments
What's an MDPE supply mate?
The incoming water used to be bonded because the pipe used to be metal (often lead around here), MDPE is a plastic pipe and so it's a bit pointless bonding it as it is not conductive.
Excellent video. Thank you.
Great video
Glad you enjoyed it
Thanks for the comment 👍
Do I need to remove the service fuse to do this?
No, you do not.
Thanks for the comment
It is a good video but diyers still shouldn't do this az they can't check that the resistance complies (granted it probably will) and they wouldn't know what CSA of cable to use.
it looks like your pipe converts to plastic pipe ...... the rest of the installation in the house wont be earthed. Surely?
There is no common sense in the regulations, I have even heard of electricians putting the earth clamp onto plastic MDPE pipe- as it says you have to in the regs.
Thanks for the comment 👍