They are likely NOT fake, but factory rejects, thus the different depth impressions for pin 1. During the quality check, even real factories reject hundreds or even thousands of chips which either have some physical or electronic defect. Then some unscrupulous dealers go dumpster diving, get these for literally for free and sell them for a profit, screwing the end user in the process. Shame on them!!
If we are talking about IR2153 I still remember my first attempt to build a resonant inverter based on your approach. I failed miserably back then but I also have learnt a lot. It was before I went to the University. Now I finished Uni and for the final projects I created two fully working power electronics devices: a resonant inverter and an active rectifier. Just wanted to thank you for sharing your knowledge as it helped me a lot in the beginning. Keep it up!
I am currently finishing my Electrical Engineering degree and trying to learn a lot beyond it because I love it. You shall know that your approach and your channel in general is one of the most interesting, serious, funny, and inspiring of all I saw. I greatly appreciate your efforts! Keep on sharing your talent! Thank you! Best regards and Shalom from Israel.
What a stupid fake. You are right, everyone who buys this and tests it in time will notice it especially because of the missing diode. Their hope is probably that the buyers protection runs out before you notice, which can happen if you are also waiting for other parts first.
@Mai Mariarti high end spec parts get from mouser/digikey - though they've been burned once or twice themselves. Common parts and some rare ones get from eBay US sellers
They're probably remarked factory rejects that didn't pass QC. So rather than scrap them, they slap some new marking on them and onto ebay they go. With that said, the genuine article can be had for around 1.50 USD in small quantities from reputable sources. Double the cost, but at least you know your getting a name-brand part that actually works.
I had the same experience a couple of years a go. A Chinese seller sent me some counterfeit Communist IR2153 and wasted me hours and hours of time. Later I found out that they can't counterfeit SMD version of the IR2153 chip. Since then I always use the SMD chips.
I received last week a pack of 10 IR2153 I bought from Aliexpress, but didn't have time to do anything with them. I didn't expect problems because I ordered the old version but, after this video, I will have to test them, before I use any them in a real circuit - Thanks for the heads-up!
@@DiodeGoneWild Someone sands off the old markings, adds new markings, sells it on ebay for €0.60 and still makes a profit? Those chinese sweat shops must be a total mess.
mojoblues66 - Yes. When you live in a s***-hole communist country like China and get paid literally pennies per day, your country can sell items at rediculously low prices and still make a profit.
That happened to me. They remark cheap versions for expensive versions so they can charge more. I ordered expensive ST MOSFETs with protection, and they sent a remarked IR base model.
I agree with you 100% The only way these people will ever learn is if the don't make money. I always get a complete re fund. I know it takes time but it's the principle if nothing else, and a test before use is a must!
Does anybody remember back in the day there was "poly paks" that sold "hobbyist" grade. The parts were often from "floor sweeps" I.e. parts that fell to the floor during production. We all new that they were sketchy, but they didn't go as far as re-marking them. Which is just outright fraud.
Relabelled chips are getting increasingly common on eBay and similar type trading sites. In view of the political situation in Hong Kong, I have decided that I am not going to trade with China where I have a choice. I don’t like to bring politics into the comments section of this channel, but as the channel often has products that originate from China I don’t think this should be a problem. Of course, due to the shear number of products manufactured in China, and due to sellers not always making it clear where the product was manufactured, trying not to buy products made in China will be considerably more difficult than it should be.
Dear Dan, I watch all your videos, I like even more the videos where you reverse engineer power sources and do your analysis. I would like to make a request, leave subtitles on as this would help me a lot and other people who have hearing impairment. Congratulations for all videos posted.
Perhaps the weirdest part is that, looking on Digi-Key at the moment, the IR21531D is actually substantially *cheaper* than the IR2153, and with much, much more of them in stock.
In China there is a huge industry for producing recycled ICs and mosfets. Checkout Taobao or AliExpress. You have choices arranging from new imported, new fake produced working, new fake not working, recycled from machine un-processed but tested, recycled detailed processed and tested, recycled still on board not tested, and finally the ones you got which are recycled processed failed. If you just buy the recycled unprocessed ones they are usually better quality than the knockoff new produced ones. But somehow they are not available on eBay.
I don't order things anymore on Ebay etc, only from professional suppliers like, digikey, Mouser, Farnell, TME, RS online. Jut not worth having the hassle of blowing your whole design up by fake chips. What's really weird with these, is that the numbers on every single IC is exactly the same.
I do that too. When designing a circuit, I need my components to match their datasheets, especially if it's a part I'm unfamiliar with. Granted, you have to spend more money but you know you are paying for a high quality and original part. One less thing to worry about.
@@Asyss_Complex unless you are getting parts directly from the original manufacturer you have no idea what you are getting. Even squeaky Aussie Dave got bum parts from Digikey once. There's just that much counterfeit merch in the market now. Unless you see it rolling off the line there's no way of knowing anymore.
Some chips can be obsolete, or unobtainable at the moment, if you go the 'established electronic pusher way' - unfortunately. A way to (hopefully) get original chips is by doing research, looking up datasheets and own/google pictures of the chip - and then comparing to the picture shown on ebay/aliexpress/... Avoid those who look different, and yes - the differences can be huge, other times it can just be the depth of engraving, font type, text location, hole/notch location, etc that gives a hint about faked validity. It is not easy, in fact - it is an art to call out some chip frauds - just like Mona Lisa and Picasso paintings. Doing research, judging prices, etc takes a lot of time - waiting for (fake) chips to arrive, debugging/rebuilding, complaining, re-ordering and repeating takes longer and is more expensive.
@@duronboy2 Bullshit. I think merchants have some idea who they're buying from, but they just don't care, which is just as deplorable. Merchants do have a responsibility to make sure customers aren't defrauded.
Once I bought 10 pcs of IRFP460. Each was from different batch (even the marking was different), measured D-S drop was from 0.01V up to 0.3V - each has completly different value. It was in 2015 or so, when the IRFP460 was expensive even in China. Seller marked them as used one. However they seems to be working fine. I've used them in a few HB drivers. Another story was when I bought an LM step-down buck driver. It was supposed to handle 3Amps, however exploded when I draw more than 1.5Amps (bought 2 pcs, both exploded). I've changed them for the same chip from local store and everything was working fine when I was drawing 3Amps.
Oh my friend. Thanks for this video. I'm going through the same agony around these chips. Instead of Ebay, I shopped in various electronic stores (I'm from Serbia). However retailers from these stores seem to be buying from Ebay as well. It cost me two expensive pairs of MOSFET drivers. I still don't know where to buy the original IR21531D.
I fondly remember when I bought a 7808 regulator from a local electronics store, the device didn't work, I checked the voltage and it turned out to be a relabeled 7805. Fortunately it wasn't the other way around :P..
Generic parts like that can get misprinted and why it was there in the first place. Probably not intentional (like in this video) but still a bum part. Cheap butt I am I would have sharpied out the wrong number and used it as a 7805 somewhere! Edit Second thought it might be an intentional relable as 7808 are far more rare imo.
I have purchased capacitors from the same seller which were supposed to be new but when they turned up they were used and still carrying a 16V charge on them! I complained to them and they asked me to destroy the capacitors and send them a picture of them destroyed but I told them that I had always thrown them out and they refunded my money anyway. I purchased other capacitors from one of their other listings and they turned up as advertised. After looking at the pictures of the bad capacitors on their listing, they did look like they could have been used but I took what they listed them as and pretty much got exactly what was in the pictures. So at least with this seller I know that if it doesn't look right in the pictures, probably best to avoid it. But should anything turn up bad, at least I know that they will refund my money and communication was good 👍. I guess that the people behind the listing have to work off what information they are given from the warehouse and they have to make the judgement call of is the buyer trying to get it for free or is it actually true? Not all Chinese sellers are trying to rip people off, most of them are actually good business operator's and owners, the bad ones are available in every country. Once you find the right supplier, try and stick with them and you can't go wrong.
The eBay sellers usually state that the chips are "generic" in the description, though they show a picture of the original at the top of the page. "Generic" could mean used, out of spec, relabeled - counterfeit or actually generic. it's a total crap shoot. At least 90% of the chips I have bought on eBay are not authentic. Most of the time the chips work and are fine for hobby use, if you don't push then to their limits. Using sockets on your PCBs makes it easier to change out faulty chips. If you need the real thing, then you have to buy from Digikey, Mouser or similar and pay the big price.
Used to have the same issues at computer shows back in the day, esp. when the first Pentiums came out. Lots of fakes so had to inspect everything before purchase.
Sadly, this is still quite commonplace today. I recall having read on one of the PC enthusiast websites (I think it was Serve the Home) where there was a remarking scam involving some of Intel's higher-end Xeon processors. The remarkers would take things like Sandy Bridge or Ivy Bridge processors and re-mark them by machining down the heat spreaders and laser engraving the marks of original Haswell and Broadwell parts and then try to re-sell those remarked chips on Amazon for the same as or more than the real bona fide Xeons. I think it made headlines on several PC-centric channels including Linus Tech Tips for a good while. It IS possible to get genuine parts for relatively cheap, but you MUST do your due diligence when shopping on eBay and Amazon. I've bought Intel and AMD processors for my CPU collection from vendors on Amazon for as little as $3 to $17 each, but I always make a conscious effort to research who I'm buying from. I make certain to look at their reviews and overall rating and I try to ensure that who I'm buying from is located in the United States where I live. That way, I can justify having some reasonable expectation that I can get a problem sorted out without too much trouble. Also, I can have a reasonable expectation that the vendors I'm buying from are honest and forthcoming and won't pull something so dastardly and dishonest as selling me a remarked CPU. It's not a guarantee, but it has greatly increased my odds of getting something that's both under my strict $25 maximum limit AND a genuine part that's been proved "Used - Tested, working". But I will NEVER buy ANY Intel or AMD processor from a Chinese vendor. Maybe LEDs or resistors, but not something big-ticket like a CPU. The risks of getting stung by a remarking scam are far too high even when the chips are bought simply for a collection of "museum pieces" that aren't going into working systems.
One of the reasons that they remark is because they have a bunch of lower spec (less desirable) components and can remark them as higher spec components to sell them for a premium price. I got burned purchasing older EPROMs on E-bay on the chip it said they were 90ns CMOS and in reality were 200ns NMOS. A few of the chips still had the original markings showing through. Which prompted me to read the unerasable chip ID code with my programmer. Which told me not only were they not made by ST as labeled they were made by National Semiconductor. They still worked fine as the slower access time (and extra current consumption that comes with NMOS) wasn't an issue but it still ticked me off.
Yeah, I've bought from that seller with the blue fabric background too. FWIW, I don't believe it's the eBay seller that fakes the parts, I think they are also being scammed. They've always been good at refunding but I have a feeling a lot of people just don't bother asking and just throw the parts away. Another seller was less helpful, wanted me to return an RF transistor to China for a refund, postage would cost more than the part, then they demanded I smash it up and send pics instead, the case was made from beryllium oxide
I have had similar problem. I have ordered 20 power MOSFETS IRF140?, declared for 170A. I've put some in my circuit wihout test. Result: short ciruit. Then I decided to test all remaining MOSFETS out of circuit. All of them were shorted. Ordered, like in your case, cheap from Chine, free shipping.
Power mosfets are faked very frequently. If you buy any from china, always put all of them through a component tester at a minimum. For example I ordered some IRFP260N and they were not shorted, but broken so that only the internal reverse diode was working. I had already suspected issues when I ordered them, so I made sure to test them immediately.
I feel bad, but I couldn’t help cracking up at that wave form at 3:18. Such a weird thing to see. It seems like such a crazy amount of work to sand off the old markings, then have fake ones laser etched on for like $6. And, like you said, they’ll easily be caught and have their eBay stores shut down. Very weird.
Ebay stores are just resellers. They don't produce parts and they don't even know they're fake. If you set up a jig for 100's of thousands of parts on a conveyor then it's not much work at all.
@@BRUXXUS Actually I take that back. I'm sure merchants are well aware of rampant counterfeiting that happens in China. They just ignore it. I think cheating is ingrained in Chinese and Indian culture more than others.
When ordering cheap components from ebay or aliexpress it's important to keep your expectations low... And to check them on arrival when the order can still be disputed.
A lot of chinese sellers on eBay don't even ship anything these days and hope people forget that they ordered stuff from them because of super long delivery times and the current situation around the world.
It was easy to find the seller and they have some negative feedbacks saying that the semiconductors were fake or bad or relabelled. You did not left a negative feedback which is very important. And you must open the case where you tell eBay that those ICs were fake. Always read the feedbacks. If there are negs saying that the item was fake, do not buy. Anyway, You’ll get your money back but not any compensation if it broke something.
DGW, have you tried to measure the thickness of the packages with micrometer or calipers? Of course there might be natural difference in thickness between devices from the different batches but anyway...
Not only this ic many ic's including timer 555,IRF540N, ATMEL 89S52 etc..every duplicate is available in market.Sometimes its very difficult to identify the genuine components..
Had bad experience purchasing semiconductors from ebay too. Replaced the one from my electronic load and it failed around 70-80w whereas the original (the load is from china too) was happy with >200w for a very long time.
i have also been duped, buying tl082's from aliexpress... they were opamps, but the slew was worse than a lm358 or a lm301... and certainly not a tl082
is it possible that they dissolve the solder chemically, and then replate the legs? If you did it with huge batches then the per-component cost would be very low.
I've had this problem over and over. After about 5 times too many I now just buy from TI, Mouser, Digi-Key... some stuff is OK on ebay but it is very much caveat emptor.
Good review, Diode! Many chinese ebay sellers just dont care about honesty! I made very bad experience with many electronic parts bought from ebay. Lastly i had some bad infineon mosfets but it doesn't matter what parts - they are nearly all fake! I had fake with voltage regulators, comparators, Opamps, transistors, even capacitors and super-capicitors - all fake and not worth the money. Most of them work to a certain point but never keep the specs of the datasheet. You just dont know what you get and risk destroying all other components of a circuit or even burn your house. I changed buying behavior and order from LCSC. Its also a chinese seller but with original components and a very good price. Everything you find on ebay with a cheaper price is most probably fake or counterfeit. The only way for the chinese to learn is giving them bad feedback and claim your money back! its a shame ebay doesn't take any measures against this fraudulent practice!
the ebay sellers, who are drop shippers and never even see the goods they are selling (they just list stock on ebay and pass orders and payments minus their cut onto huge warehousing & mailing services, who supply you the goods) have no idea when they're selling fake stuff. its just that batches of faulty or fake chips, QC failures, factory rejects, salvaged/recycled chips, and every other flavour of sub-standard stuff occasionally makes it into that supply line because its utterly cut to the bone on cost at every opportunity. which is great in some ways, if I had bought all the electronics stuff I've got from china ebay over the years at full domestic retail price I'd probably be living in a cardboard box under a motorway bridge. but it also leads to situation like this.
Unfortunately eBay is riddled with sellers that sell fakes even after you tell them the parts are counterfeit. I've been through them all and the best seller is Total parts (3163) I always get good mosfets, diodes and chips from him. He's more expensive but worth it.
I had that happen once. I got two lm338 (1.2-32V @ 5A) voltage regulators but, inside it was an lm317 (1.25-37v @ 1.5A) . Big difference. Of course, they were Chinese fakes. It ended well but a pain. Good video, too bad you got stung though.
Amazing they can make money on this stuff. Most of them are e-waste that they de-solder, make the pins all look mostly new and re-label the chips. Crazy. Even the pins on some of the desoldered chips they somehow make look almost new.
Rub the top with an acetone swab to reveal if they have been black topped. I work on authentication process. They cheat for profit, typically chip brands components remarked as OEM brands. I see this all time and some times even worse.
HERE IS SOMETHING YOU DIDN'T TEST. A real 2153 has a shutdown feature by shorting the timing capacitor. This is clearly stated in data sheet as a way to shutdown. Doth outputs will go low when the cap is shorted. I have a number of FAKE ones wher the H will go low and the LO will go high. In many circuits this will not be an issue except it is in mine. I'd take your slow ones and missing diodes in a heartbeat if they would just shut down correctly. Please test yours to also see if that is an issue.
I wouldn't be surprised if they are IR2151 (even older chip) marked as IR21531D. I don't mind buying used chips, as long they are not tempered with. At least I know what I am getting.
I bet someone didn't realize the difference when sorting them from recycle. Someone else probably saw a bunch with - "1D" and went with it while setting the laser engraver.
Those chips are not probably not ewaste as there isn't any solder on the pins. On ewaste they straighten pins and spot weld new pins on the broken pins. Then the pins are dipped in solder to hide the repairs. They are probably generics and factory rejects that have been relabeled to the more expensive "D" specification and the IRF name . I wouldn't mind if they sold the generics with their original markings. When I buy 10 chips for a dollar or two I expect them to be generic, but the relabeling makes them a real problem.
Excellent video and you pointed out some really helpful ways to identify possible fakes. I recently ordered and received 10 MAX7000 CPLD devices from a Chinese Ebay seller. My suspicions were raised when they all had identical date codes, but like you show the plastic packages had different pin 1 "dimples" and different markings on the bottom. It was clear that they had been sanded down, the top pained black, then they were then laser etched. The strange thing is that I tested all 10 devices (they are sort of like tiny FPGAs) and they all were the marked device (these devices contain id information). So they were the correct devices. So why go to the effort to remark them, to change the speed grade??? I don't mind buying reclaimed devices, but I am pretty annoyed to get remarked devices. In this case the parts were good, but I have also bought non-working fake parts. Also sadly Ebay don't give a **** about the sellers of fake devices. Yes it is easy to claim back your money, but that doesn't cover the wasted time and effort taken to test the devices and re-order genuine ones.
I currently have a small package containing a V20 processor coming out of California. It was shipped off nearly three days ago and as I write this it is still sitting at the origin post office.
Year ago a bought 20pcs 74hc32 on aliexprs with badly laser engraved markings. Fortunately i was able to prove that they ware fakes and got refund. Few month later i found that i can buy those chips locally and cheaper.
What a shame, dishonest people make buying parts very risky :-( I have looked at chips on ebay and did not like the quality of the printing, or identical codes on slightly different chips.
I think you may have disproved your own point. You didn't finely scrutinize the chips before using one, and I don't think most people would. If they were actually the part advertised, you probably wouldn't have noticed. Having said that, what they do is terrible. I hope you got your money back. For many things I prefer getting used parts because IMHO they are less likely to be counterfeit.
eBay gives you the option to report as "Fake or Counterfeit Item" and will close their account after 3 of those reports. Of course, this seller has created multiple accounts to avoid that, but once your account is closed, you can't use the same PayPal, name and address. So it makes it a lot more difficult to the holder of the account to scam people. On the other hand, that sanding and remarking of ICs is very labor intensive and time consuming job. If you subtract the shipping and Ebay fees from the $5.50 they sell those for, it's under $3 they make per sale.
Thankfully we haven't that problem in Poland... cause we haven't e bay XD I mean even when i tried i couldn't find local Polish version, and even if exist them is in shadow of "local" website.
the only way to get reliable components is sadly to pay more on the established sources, most of them online. Never on Ebay or aliexpress ... one always risks to buy a fraud on those sites.
This is exactly why I would never think to order any electronic component off eBay. Only use reputable electronic parts distributors such as Farnell/Digikey/RS/Mouser. eBay is just a waste of time, especially if they’re coming from China - you can almost guarantee that you’re getting some dodgy parts.
Because the chip markings have been sanded off. Using acid cannot replace the material that is no longer there. Electronupdate doesn't check chip markings using acid.
"I was very excited about it so I forgot to be suspicious."
I felt that
it happens to everyone of us, that's for sure
They are likely NOT fake, but factory rejects, thus the different depth impressions for pin 1.
During the quality check, even real factories reject hundreds or even thousands of chips which either have some physical or electronic defect. Then some unscrupulous dealers go dumpster diving, get these for literally for free and sell them for a profit, screwing the end user in the process. Shame on them!!
You can even say that about women
If we are talking about IR2153 I still remember my first attempt to build a resonant inverter based on your approach. I failed miserably back then but I also have learnt a lot. It was before I went to the University. Now I finished Uni and for the final projects I created two fully working power electronics devices: a resonant inverter and an active rectifier. Just wanted to thank you for sharing your knowledge as it helped me a lot in the beginning. Keep it up!
I am currently finishing my Electrical Engineering degree and trying to learn a lot beyond it because I love it. You shall know that your approach and your channel in general is one of the most interesting, serious, funny, and inspiring of all I saw. I greatly appreciate your efforts! Keep on sharing your talent! Thank you! Best regards and Shalom from Israel.
In this chinese chips the "Diode gone wild"
nice
Good one !
Good
no the diode gone missing for one of the chip.
What a stupid fake. You are right, everyone who buys this and tests it in time will notice it especially because of the missing diode.
Their hope is probably that the buyers protection runs out before you notice, which can happen if you are also waiting for other parts first.
I usually get burnt by this. Or I don't have time install it..
@Mai Mariarti high end spec parts get from mouser/digikey - though they've been burned once or twice themselves. Common parts and some rare ones get from eBay US sellers
They're probably remarked factory rejects that didn't pass QC. So rather than scrap them, they slap some new marking on them and onto ebay they go. With that said, the genuine article can be had for around 1.50 USD in small quantities from reputable sources. Double the cost, but at least you know your getting a name-brand part that actually works.
They can be fashioned into a nice brush for a cat.
That are you kidding me wave form was hella funny....One of the reasons why i love coming here. Your humor is off the charts.
I had the same experience a couple of years a go. A Chinese seller sent me some counterfeit Communist IR2153 and wasted me hours and hours of time. Later I found out that they can't counterfeit SMD version of the IR2153 chip. Since then I always use the SMD chips.
Hey man! I know that you wrote your original comment over 3 years ago, but now I am curious, why can't they counterfeit the SMD IR2153?
I received last week a pack of 10 IR2153 I bought from Aliexpress, but didn't have time to do anything with them. I didn't expect problems because I ordered the old version but, after this video, I will have to test them, before I use any them in a real circuit - Thanks for the heads-up!
Try rubbing some acetone on them, you might reveal the original markings if they weren’t sanded off.
definitely sanded off.
@@DiodeGoneWild Someone sands off the old markings, adds new markings, sells it on ebay for €0.60 and still makes a profit? Those chinese sweat shops must be a total mess.
Most like sanded off, which explains the shallow pin-1 marking.
mojoblues66 - Yes. When you live in a s***-hole communist country like China and get paid literally pennies per day, your country can sell items at rediculously low prices and still make a profit.
@@Samuel-km5yf
True
XD
Appreciative the audits of microprocessors!
That happened to me. They remark cheap versions for expensive versions so they can charge more. I ordered expensive ST MOSFETs with protection, and they sent a remarked IR base model.
I agree with you 100% The only way these people will ever learn is if the don't make money. I always get a complete re fund. I know it takes time but it's the principle if nothing else, and a test before use is a must!
Does anybody remember back in the day there was "poly paks" that sold "hobbyist" grade. The parts were often from "floor sweeps" I.e. parts that fell to the floor during production. We all new that they were sketchy, but they didn't go as far as re-marking them. Which is just outright fraud.
I use to buy poly packs all the time, wish they were still around. Also stuff from H.J. Knapp in Largo, FL..
Relabelled chips are getting increasingly common on eBay and similar type trading sites.
In view of the political situation in Hong Kong, I have decided that I am not going to trade with China where I have a choice. I don’t like to bring politics into the comments section of this channel, but as the channel often has products that originate from China I don’t think this should be a problem. Of course, due to the shear number of products manufactured in China, and due to sellers not always making it clear where the product was manufactured, trying not to buy products made in China will be considerably more difficult than it should be.
China is the IP theft capital of the world. China is literally a parasite of planet Earth.
No curious cat! :(
:(
Dear Dan, I watch all your videos, I like even more the videos where you reverse engineer power sources and do your analysis. I would like to make a request, leave subtitles on as this would help me a lot and other people who have hearing impairment. Congratulations for all videos posted.
Perhaps the weirdest part is that, looking on Digi-Key at the moment, the IR21531D is actually substantially *cheaper* than the IR2153, and with much, much more of them in stock.
In China there is a huge industry for producing recycled ICs and mosfets. Checkout Taobao or AliExpress. You have choices arranging from new imported, new fake produced working, new fake not working, recycled from machine un-processed but tested, recycled detailed processed and tested, recycled still on board not tested, and finally the ones you got which are recycled processed failed. If you just buy the recycled unprocessed ones they are usually better quality than the knockoff new produced ones. But somehow they are not available on eBay.
I don't order things anymore on Ebay etc, only from professional suppliers like, digikey, Mouser, Farnell, TME, RS online.
Jut not worth having the hassle of blowing your whole design up by fake chips.
What's really weird with these, is that the numbers on every single IC is exactly the same.
if the date of manufacture and the factory is the same then all the numbers will be the same. there are no serial numbers on chips.
I do that too. When designing a circuit, I need my components to match their datasheets, especially if it's a part I'm unfamiliar with. Granted, you have to spend more money but you know you are paying for a high quality and original part. One less thing to worry about.
But if you can make content out of it...
@@Asyss_Complex unless you are getting parts directly from the original manufacturer you have no idea what you are getting. Even squeaky Aussie Dave got bum parts from Digikey once. There's just that much counterfeit merch in the market now. Unless you see it rolling off the line there's no way of knowing anymore.
Some chips can be obsolete, or unobtainable at the moment, if you go the 'established electronic pusher way' - unfortunately.
A way to (hopefully) get original chips is by doing research, looking up datasheets and own/google pictures of the chip - and then comparing to the picture shown on ebay/aliexpress/...
Avoid those who look different, and yes - the differences can be huge, other times it can just be the depth of engraving, font type, text location, hole/notch location, etc that gives a hint about faked validity. It is not easy, in fact - it is an art to call out some chip frauds - just like Mona Lisa and Picasso paintings.
Doing research, judging prices, etc takes a lot of time - waiting for (fake) chips to arrive, debugging/rebuilding, complaining, re-ordering and repeating takes longer and is more expensive.
Could you please let us know the name of the supplier that sold them to you. Thanks
So what would you do with them?
@@JahanZeb1976 send them anthrax
@@JahanZeb1976 avoid buying from them
The ebay seller probably has no idea. They just bought some cheap chips. Whoever pulled this off probably knows how buyers will not be happy.
@@duronboy2 Bullshit. I think merchants have some idea who they're buying from, but they just don't care, which is just as deplorable. Merchants do have a responsibility to make sure customers aren't defrauded.
Once I bought 10 pcs of IRFP460. Each was from different batch (even the marking was different), measured D-S drop was from 0.01V up to 0.3V - each has completly different value. It was in 2015 or so, when the IRFP460 was expensive even in China. Seller marked them as used one. However they seems to be working fine. I've used them in a few HB drivers. Another story was when I bought an LM step-down buck driver. It was supposed to handle 3Amps, however exploded when I draw more than 1.5Amps (bought 2 pcs, both exploded). I've changed them for the same chip from local store and everything was working fine when I was drawing 3Amps.
Mr diode is an actuall diode 😂😘💡➖⏯️ (diode symbol)
Oh my friend. Thanks for this video.
I'm going through the same agony around these chips. Instead of Ebay, I shopped in various electronic stores (I'm from Serbia). However retailers from these stores seem to be buying from Ebay as well.
It cost me two expensive pairs of MOSFET drivers. I still don't know where to buy the original IR21531D.
I said this before, saying it again now. Best Dany on the web.
Very informative and interesting video.
I fondly remember when I bought a 7808 regulator from a local electronics store, the device didn't work, I checked the voltage and it turned out to be a relabeled 7805. Fortunately it wasn't the other way around :P..
Generic parts like that can get misprinted and why it was there in the first place. Probably not intentional (like in this video) but still a bum part. Cheap butt I am I would have sharpied out the wrong number and used it as a 7805 somewhere! Edit Second thought it might be an intentional relable as 7808 are far more rare imo.
I have purchased capacitors from the same seller which were supposed to be new but when they turned up they were used and still carrying a 16V charge on them! I complained to them and they asked me to destroy the capacitors and send them a picture of them destroyed but I told them that I had always thrown them out and they refunded my money anyway. I purchased other capacitors from one of their other listings and they turned up as advertised. After looking at the pictures of the bad capacitors on their listing, they did look like they could have been used but I took what they listed them as and pretty much got exactly what was in the pictures. So at least with this seller I know that if it doesn't look right in the pictures, probably best to avoid it. But should anything turn up bad, at least I know that they will refund my money and communication was good 👍. I guess that the people behind the listing have to work off what information they are given from the warehouse and they have to make the judgement call of is the buyer trying to get it for free or is it actually true? Not all Chinese sellers are trying to rip people off, most of them are actually good business operator's and owners, the bad ones are available in every country. Once you find the right supplier, try and stick with them and you can't go wrong.
The eBay sellers usually state that the chips are "generic" in the description, though they show a picture of the original at the top of the page. "Generic" could mean used, out of spec, relabeled - counterfeit or actually generic. it's a total crap shoot. At least 90% of the chips I have bought on eBay are not authentic. Most of the time the chips work and are fine for hobby use, if you don't push then to their limits. Using sockets on your PCBs makes it easier to change out faulty chips. If you need the real thing, then you have to buy from Digikey, Mouser or similar and pay the big price.
Used to have the same issues at computer shows back in the day, esp. when the first Pentiums came out. Lots of fakes so had to inspect everything before purchase.
Sadly, this is still quite commonplace today. I recall having read on one of the PC enthusiast websites (I think it was Serve the Home) where there was a remarking scam involving some of Intel's higher-end Xeon processors. The remarkers would take things like Sandy Bridge or Ivy Bridge processors and re-mark them by machining down the heat spreaders and laser engraving the marks of original Haswell and Broadwell parts and then try to re-sell those remarked chips on Amazon for the same as or more than the real bona fide Xeons. I think it made headlines on several PC-centric channels including Linus Tech Tips for a good while. It IS possible to get genuine parts for relatively cheap, but you MUST do your due diligence when shopping on eBay and Amazon. I've bought Intel and AMD processors for my CPU collection from vendors on Amazon for as little as $3 to $17 each, but I always make a conscious effort to research who I'm buying from. I make certain to look at their reviews and overall rating and I try to ensure that who I'm buying from is located in the United States where I live. That way, I can justify having some reasonable expectation that I can get a problem sorted out without too much trouble. Also, I can have a reasonable expectation that the vendors I'm buying from are honest and forthcoming and won't pull something so dastardly and dishonest as selling me a remarked CPU. It's not a guarantee, but it has greatly increased my odds of getting something that's both under my strict $25 maximum limit AND a genuine part that's been proved "Used - Tested, working". But I will NEVER buy ANY Intel or AMD processor from a Chinese vendor. Maybe LEDs or resistors, but not something big-ticket like a CPU. The risks of getting stung by a remarking scam are far too high even when the chips are bought simply for a collection of "museum pieces" that aren't going into working systems.
apart frrom everything else i love your accent, i really enjoy it
It’s a dirty pleasure
One of the reasons that they remark is because they have a bunch of lower spec (less desirable) components and can remark them as higher spec components to sell them for a premium price.
I got burned purchasing older EPROMs on E-bay on the chip it said they were 90ns CMOS and in reality were 200ns NMOS. A few of the chips still had the original markings showing through. Which prompted me to read the unerasable chip ID code with my programmer. Which told me not only were they not made by ST as labeled they were made by National Semiconductor. They still worked fine as the slower access time (and extra current consumption that comes with NMOS) wasn't an issue but it still ticked me off.
They are most likely rejects from the production line that have been pinched.
I would prefer used pulls over lucky dip every time thanks Dany
Yeah, I've bought from that seller with the blue fabric background too.
FWIW, I don't believe it's the eBay seller that fakes the parts, I think they are also being scammed.
They've always been good at refunding but I have a feeling a lot of people just don't bother asking and just throw the parts away.
Another seller was less helpful, wanted me to return an RF transistor to China for a refund, postage would cost more than the part, then they demanded I smash it up and send pics instead, the case was made from beryllium oxide
I have had similar problem. I have ordered 20 power MOSFETS IRF140?, declared for 170A. I've put some in my circuit wihout test. Result: short ciruit. Then I decided to test all remaining MOSFETS out of circuit. All of them were shorted. Ordered, like in your case, cheap from Chine, free shipping.
Power mosfets are faked very frequently. If you buy any from china, always put all of them through a component tester at a minimum. For example I ordered some IRFP260N and they were not shorted, but broken so that only the internal reverse diode was working. I had already suspected issues when I ordered them, so I made sure to test them immediately.
I feel bad, but I couldn’t help cracking up at that wave form at 3:18. Such a weird thing to see.
It seems like such a crazy amount of work to sand off the old markings, then have fake ones laser etched on for like $6. And, like you said, they’ll easily be caught and have their eBay stores shut down. Very weird.
Ebay stores are just resellers. They don't produce parts and they don't even know they're fake. If you set up a jig for 100's of thousands of parts on a conveyor then it's not much work at all.
@@executive I didn't really think of it that way. That would make a lot more sense.
@@BRUXXUS Actually I take that back. I'm sure merchants are well aware of rampant counterfeiting that happens in China. They just ignore it. I think cheating is ingrained in Chinese and Indian culture more than others.
When ordering cheap components from ebay or aliexpress it's important to keep your expectations low... And to check them on arrival when the order can still be disputed.
Wow, ebay is so useless for electronics nowadays. You can't even trust anyone... What a shame.
Yeah, i bought 5pcs of 2008 IC from the ebay and just 2 were working correctly.
Hey remember my comment about the fake components during last uploaded video?.... lmao
Hey remember my comment from last week's video?.... lmao
A lot of chinese sellers on eBay don't even ship anything these days and hope people forget that they ordered stuff from them because of super long delivery times and the current situation around the world.
It was easy to find the seller and they have some negative feedbacks saying that the semiconductors were fake or bad or relabelled. You did not left a negative feedback which is very important. And you must open the case where you tell eBay that those ICs were fake. Always read the feedbacks. If there are negs saying that the item was fake, do not buy. Anyway, You’ll get your money back but not any compensation if it broke something.
All of the ICs are good. Not all are what the marking says!
Old 555 741 .. all found a new home. They usually throw in a good one.
My friend bought 100 Attiny chips from china (and not quite cheap) that were just epoxy and wire legs, at least you have 1 gate driver :D
DGW, have you tried to measure the thickness of the packages with micrometer or calipers? Of course there might be natural difference in thickness between devices from the different batches but anyway...
Not only this ic many ic's including timer 555,IRF540N, ATMEL 89S52 etc..every duplicate is available in market.Sometimes its very difficult to identify the genuine components..
Had bad experience purchasing semiconductors from ebay too. Replaced the one from my electronic load and it failed around 70-80w whereas the original (the load is from china too) was happy with >200w for a very long time.
i have also been duped, buying tl082's from aliexpress... they were opamps, but the slew was worse than a lm358 or a lm301... and certainly not a tl082
You can get the ir21531dpbf from mouser but the shipping will be expensive
Helpful video 👍
So now I know what happens to the contents of the waste bin on the IR21531 production line, which didn't pass quality test...
is it possible that they dissolve the solder chemically, and then replate the legs? If you did it with huge batches then the per-component cost would be very low.
Probably yes. I don't know where else would they get heaps of old chips with no solder on them.
Just bought 10pcs IR2153 from China yesterday. I also have some left from a reliable source. Now I am curious what will arrive..
Power them in a breadboard and see the waveforms on an oscilloscope before blowing your transistors...
Good job man love u from India Punjab Amritsar nice information
I've had this problem over and over. After about 5 times too many I now just buy from TI, Mouser, Digi-Key... some stuff is OK on ebay but it is very much caveat emptor.
your cat must have realized you were frustrated
not even a cat scan
Good review, Diode! Many chinese ebay sellers just dont care about honesty! I made very bad experience with many electronic parts bought from ebay. Lastly i had some bad infineon mosfets but it doesn't matter what parts - they are nearly all fake! I had fake with voltage regulators, comparators, Opamps, transistors, even capacitors and super-capicitors - all fake and not worth the money. Most of them work to a certain point but never keep the specs of the datasheet. You just dont know what you get and risk destroying all other components of a circuit or even burn your house. I changed buying behavior and order from LCSC. Its also a chinese seller but with original components and a very good price. Everything you find on ebay with a cheaper price is most probably fake or counterfeit. The only way for the chinese to learn is giving them bad feedback and claim your money back! its a shame ebay doesn't take any measures against this fraudulent practice!
conclusion: verry dodgy
@Против Глобал what??
@Против Глобал okk
the ebay sellers, who are drop shippers and never even see the goods they are selling (they just list stock on ebay and pass orders and payments minus their cut onto huge warehousing & mailing services, who supply you the goods) have no idea when they're selling fake stuff. its just that batches of faulty or fake chips, QC failures, factory rejects, salvaged/recycled chips, and every other flavour of sub-standard stuff occasionally makes it into that supply line because its utterly cut to the bone on cost at every opportunity. which is great in some ways, if I had bought all the electronics stuff I've got from china ebay over the years at full domestic retail price I'd probably be living in a cardboard box under a motorway bridge. but it also leads to situation like this.
Unfortunately eBay is riddled with sellers that sell fakes even after you tell them the parts are counterfeit. I've been through them all and the best seller is Total parts (3163) I always get good mosfets, diodes and chips from him. He's more expensive but worth it.
I had that happen once. I got two lm338 (1.2-32V @ 5A) voltage regulators but, inside it was an lm317 (1.25-37v @ 1.5A) . Big difference. Of course, they were Chinese fakes. It ended well but a pain. Good video, too bad you got stung though.
Why dont they sell empty plastic boxes? It is cheaper
Amazing they can make money on this stuff. Most of them are e-waste that they de-solder, make the pins all look mostly new and re-label the chips. Crazy. Even the pins on some of the desoldered chips they somehow make look almost new.
Rub the top with an acetone swab to reveal if they have been black topped. I work on authentication process. They cheat for profit, typically chip brands components remarked as OEM brands. I see this all time and some times even worse.
those seem sandpapered.
HERE IS SOMETHING YOU DIDN'T TEST. A real 2153 has a shutdown feature by shorting the timing capacitor. This is clearly stated in data sheet as a way to shutdown. Doth outputs will go low when the cap is shorted. I have a number of FAKE ones wher the H will go low and the LO will go high. In many circuits this will not be an issue except it is in mine. I'd take your slow ones and missing diodes in a heartbeat if they would just shut down correctly. Please test yours to also see if that is an issue.
I hate fake parts. Got some mislabeled resistors from Ebay. Took me too long to figure out why my circuit wasn't working.
I wouldn't be surprised if they are IR2151 (even older chip) marked as IR21531D. I don't mind buying used chips, as long they are not tempered with. At least I know what I am getting.
I bet someone didn't realize the difference when sorting them from recycle. Someone else probably saw a bunch with - "1D" and went with it while setting the laser engraver.
they go for quantity, not quality. 50% is good enough.
Those chips are not probably not ewaste as there isn't any solder on the pins. On ewaste they straighten pins and spot weld new pins on the broken pins. Then the pins are dipped in solder to hide the repairs. They are probably generics and factory rejects that have been relabeled to the more expensive "D" specification and the IRF name . I wouldn't mind if they sold the generics with their original markings. When I buy 10 chips for a dollar or two I expect them to be generic, but the relabeling makes them a real problem.
Thanks
Excellent video and you pointed out some really helpful ways to identify possible fakes.
I recently ordered and received 10 MAX7000 CPLD devices from a Chinese Ebay seller. My suspicions were raised when they all had identical date codes, but like you show the plastic packages had different pin 1 "dimples" and different markings on the bottom. It was clear that they had been sanded down, the top pained black, then they were then laser etched. The strange thing is that I tested all 10 devices (they are sort of like tiny FPGAs) and they all were the marked device (these devices contain id information). So they were the correct devices. So why go to the effort to remark them, to change the speed grade???
I don't mind buying reclaimed devices, but I am pretty annoyed to get remarked devices. In this case the parts were good, but I have also bought non-working fake parts.
Also sadly Ebay don't give a **** about the sellers of fake devices. Yes it is easy to claim back your money, but that doesn't cover the wasted time and effort taken to test the devices and re-order genuine ones.
I currently have a small package containing a V20 processor coming out of California. It was shipped off nearly three days ago and as I write this it is still sitting at the origin post office.
Any luck yet ?
@@vidasvv Yes it left the post office Friday evening.
Year ago a bought 20pcs 74hc32 on aliexprs with badly laser engraved markings. Fortunately i was able to prove that they ware fakes and got refund. Few month later i found that i can buy those chips locally and cheaper.
I see no cat! What did you do with the car?
thank you sir this is what am facing now thank you sir
Maybe try to make a rontgen pictures of those damaged chips... It may be interesting if we can see someting... but it is a small chance
He has declared that he isn't going to use his x-ray machine anymore.
You are amacing!
I stopped purchasing silicon from China, I order from Digikey or Mouser now, and I don't have to wait 6 weeks for shipping...
I ordered some IGBTs from Ebay, from 2 different sellers, about 3 months ago, nothing arrived.
@@DiodeGoneWild Yeah, but you should receive a refound then
@@DiodeGoneWild Are there any tracking numbers that you received? When is the last update of tracking for those products?
What a shame, dishonest people make buying parts very risky :-(
I have looked at chips on ebay and did not like the quality of the printing, or identical codes on slightly different chips.
They could show you a perfect picture, but sent something completely different.
I think you may have disproved your own point. You didn't finely scrutinize the chips before using one, and I don't think most people would. If they were actually the part advertised, you probably wouldn't have noticed.
Having said that, what they do is terrible. I hope you got your money back. For many things I prefer getting used parts because IMHO they are less likely to be counterfeit.
eBay gives you the option to report as "Fake or Counterfeit Item" and will close their account after 3 of those reports. Of course, this seller has created multiple accounts to avoid that, but once your account is closed, you can't use the same PayPal, name and address. So it makes it a lot more difficult to the holder of the account to scam people.
On the other hand, that sanding and remarking of ICs is very labor intensive and time consuming job. If you subtract the shipping and Ebay fees from the $5.50 they sell those for, it's under $3 they make per sale.
Maybe some ne555. Lol
Try the RX inspection at the hospital.
Can make osiloskop from phone android, how android work.. and for 12 volt
I stopped 3years before buying electronics from eBay...
Also closed my eBay account...
Why not use a non-obsolete gate driver?
IR2153(1) is not obsolete. And if it gets obsolete, you can use IRS2153(1)D.
you need to apply to to the European song contest for the most unusual accent.
Thankfully we haven't that problem in Poland... cause we haven't e bay XD
I mean even when i tried i couldn't find local Polish version, and even if exist them is in shadow of "local" website.
You are not missing anything good.
How does someone in their right minds sell fake chips?
Its sad what people are doing for quick cash these days.
what's not fake on e bay ???
Ebay is the Internets garbage dump.
I can't help but wonder how relabeling such cheap chips can be even profitable.
economy of scale
Large scale and poor cheap workers.
@@DiodeGoneWild I mean… wouldn't all that recycling make much more money it these chips were labeled honestly?
@@pvc988 not in China
pvc I guess they have figured that the dollar or two more they get for re-marking these as the 1D variant is worth their while.
You put in alarming because I ordered 10 transistors from eBay .. so let's see are we going to be in same case.. lol
0:52 that offer still has the same description, price and photo on ebay, anybody can find it. Strangely enough the seller has 99.3% rating
Diode Gone Missing
Nice video 😊👍
the only way to get reliable components is sadly to pay more on the established sources, most of them online. Never on Ebay or aliexpress ... one always risks to buy a fraud on those sites.
This is exactly why I would never think to order any electronic component off eBay. Only use reputable electronic parts distributors such as Farnell/Digikey/RS/Mouser. eBay is just a waste of time, especially if they’re coming from China - you can almost guarantee that you’re getting some dodgy parts.
Cucumber make colour replacing for banana. ........... it's may be same taste.... but without tong...
At least they look like new 😀
yess
why you just dont use acid like electronupdate to see chip markings, to see if chip is fake or real
Because the chip markings have been sanded off. Using acid cannot replace the material that is no longer there.
Electronupdate doesn't check chip markings using acid.
No cat. =(