I served my apprenticeship on the EMD (and smaller rolls royce,Leyland ,Gardner and cat) .I still enjoy the sound of an EMD notching up under load. An old mate of mine had a Winton Car,built in the 1800's.
I worked on the switch engines george bacukman of relco, (old 3 finger george) bought back in 79. the old alco's that threw coal bits out of the exaust. Turning oil filters and tripping out individual cylinder with the grasshopper valve. Inspecting cylinder walls by standing upside down in the cylinders. At 18 that was the shit!
I was just as surprised, you wouldn't think something that had been sitting that long would sound like that but there was a lot of effort which made it that way. Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Grandpa served as a Machinist Mate during WWII on DE-244 (Otterstetter). Hearing that engine run brings to my mind so many of his stories. Like while shooting at a sea mine, it exploded too close to the ship. Shrapnel went right thru the hull into the engine room. Apparently, above the waterline. Grandpa never really seemed to have much confidence in the gunners abilities to hit much. I'm thinking that the hole might have been close to his station or bunk. Thank you guys so much for sharing this.
Thanks for watching and the kind words! That's a very neat story from your grandfather. I met a former USS Otterstetter sailor who was a volunteer on the USS Slater some years ago.
@@SpeakerPolice it's not that engines to day are made bad or cheap it's that not all engines are made for the same purpose just like big diesel engines made to pull stuff have to made sturdier then a small car or truck wouldn't benefit of having an engine like this in the engine bay it doesn't make sense nor would it be practical so i guess a lot of those people who think those old engines are better then today's would rather still be using steam powerd cars ,trains,ships etc are just plain Antiquated people
@@GOBRADON502 I don't think electronically controlled engines made with thinner, cheaper alloys will last as long as purely mechanical units made of cast iron. It doesn't have to do with the use case so much as it does the build quality. A similar argument could be made for TV sets...today's modern flat panels will absolutely be garbage 50 years from now :/
After spending 21 years in navy ship engine rooms as an Electricians Mate and engineering watch officer, the look and sounds of that old Cleveland generator are like music to my ears. Sounds like old home week to me. Thank all of you at the naval museum for keeping our history alive.
That engine sounds damn good. The technology required to build those diesels back in the 1940s boggles the mind still today. It's nice to see the art of restoring these engines to working order is alive and well. These masterpieces of engineering are our nation's history and have to be preserved.
Ran an old ferry boat that had two of those from a DE, along with the DC generators and motors with reduction gear. Cheap cylinder heads from Texas were always cracking until we figured out previous crew had firing pressures too high. When we scrapped them they were worn out, 1988. The fish boat that got one said it was the best engine they ever had, cracked block and all. Hey, it would run all the time. I met the guy who designed it. Old timer came through for a ride, what a treat. He did it in something like 6 months for the war. Parts always available from various sources.
When I worked at Titan Tire Bryan Ohio they had an old diesel engine from a WWII destroyer. They would run it during thunderstorms for backup electrical power for control power for the boilers. That beauty was about twice that size and I loved running it. Prime this handle for fuel on this side. Prime this handle on the other side for fuel. Set the throttle to 3 clicks and then hit the air start. 90% of they time she would fire first time. The other 10% you had to start all over again. Man never more than twice. Wish I had bothered to pay more attention to the build tag
After WWII many marine engines were repurposed to various shoreside jobs. I always enjoy hearing about the applications they were placed into for their second life. Thanks for sharing that info and watching the video!
@@bargu The Cleveland engine line in it's entirety was incredibly over built. The modern 710 series EMD engines are updated versions of this 80 year old design. Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Asher, you all should be so proud. I am so happy you went for the service generator over the emergency. I can imagine it was a lot more work. But, it was worth it.
I worked as an electrician in a power plant on Diego Garcia in 1975. We had 5 or 6 Fairbanks and Morse 10 cylinder opposing piston submarine engines turning 4160 Volt generators. The engine room was beautiful. Im still working as an electrician in a power production capacity. Over 40 years at Lockheed Martin. Thank you Navy!
I will always love the sound, simplicity and durability of a two stroke diesel engine. The first truck I ever drove was a '69 GMC Brigadier with a Detroit two stroke diesel.
I didn't realize Brigadier's were that old. Two strokes were powerful engines, but just way too much pollution and noise. Personally, I prefer Cummins diesels.
@@ffjsb. I'm not a fan of Cummins, to many times being left at the roadside by an ISX engine with either an emissions system problem or catastrophic internal failure. Small Cummins engine for like a pickup or a Jeep sure I like those, but not a large commercial engine. I prefer Detroit for large commercial engines, specifically the 60 series as my preferred engine or the DD15 as the more modern and acceptable replacement.
@@huntsbychainsaw5986 Never seen a Cummins have a catastrophic internal failure. We use them in a lot of our fire apparatus. Any truck with modern emissions or computers can have problems. My LEAST favorite are IH/Navistar engines, I've seen three have catastrophic water pump failures over 30 years. And they just don't seem to have the power that other engines have.
Feeling those engines start up never gets old! Firefighter’s engines can still be ran up anytime we have the personnel, and even our chief engineer agrees that there’s just nothing like it!
Thanks for watching! I would love to see a video of the Firefighter's engines. I've always thought she was a beautiful boat with a great story. Cheers!
@@FixAndForget I’ll post a vid I took of what ended up being a fail. The ailment ended up being an airbound fuel line, it was fixed a relatively short time later
One of these days I'll get around to posting a video of the engine at speed and carrying a load. It's a totally different sound and quite a scream! Thanks for watching!
it seems to me that the all mechanical engines run very well when properly tuned, i have a Massey Ferguson 230 from the 70's that is all mechanical that my dad and my grandad rebuilt and it doesn't even smoke when running
That's because new diesels run more thier timing advanced... so your get more pronounced knocking or pinging, even gasoline engines are moving in this direction as it is more efficient.
@@gtb81. not if it is designed to work like that... diesels are typically and almost all of them except very old ones with very delayed timing (and lost power due to this) knock. Gasoline engines will have to be beefed up for compression ignition to work there.... Mazda and Toyota have engines coming that are going to hit in the 40-45% efficiency range which is very high near theoretical peak. Here's my 353 Detroit running, you can clearly hear the knock th-cam.com/video/1-m9qpruyO8/w-d-xo.html
A delight for the ears and for the eyes! Well done to you and the team for the work you have done to keep a piece of history alive! Greetings form the UK!
The Alert was last in Portland, OR. She is in really tough shape as she has not hauled in over 50 years. The Morris is in Rio Vista, CA and belongs to Liberty Maritime Museum. She had a 2 million refit 20 years ago and was repowered at the time.
there are a few of the old 268's still around, that engine and the old 567's were legendary engines for their reliability they carried us through ww2 and beyond. the parts were of beautiful quality.
They are incredibly over built pieces of equipment. That combined with their extraordinary simplicity are the reasons why they are still with us. Thanks for watching!
Looks and sounds beautiful! Bravo! The sound of a healthy, large displacement 2-stroke diesel when cold is just music! I love that mix of sounds and that injection knock!
Thanks for watching! My favorite part of the old Cleveland and EMD engines is the whine from the gear driven blower, it turns into quite the scream at rated RPM (1,200).
@@bmthnow12 Thanks for watching! The engine is a 2-stroke Cleveland diesel 8-268A. Most 2 stroke diesel engines are set up like this one, 4 exhaust valves (2 per rocker), a unit injector, and scavenging air ports in the center of the liner with a blower or some kind of forced induction system.
@@bmthnow12 Just as Mr. Spalding said, 2-stroke. All the 2-stroke diesels I am aware of have similar arrangements, either 2 or 4 valves per cylinder, all are exhaust, full speed cams, ported cylinders for intake, unit injectors and a scavenging blower. Cleveland, Detroit/GMC, EMD, Alco , etc.
Even without reading about this engine I immediately recognized it as the granddaddy of my bus's Detroit 6V92. It's amazing how such a strong family lineage extended from before WW2 to the 1990s. Wonderful! I grew up with Napier Deltics and Commer TS3s, so a 2-stroke diesel is always music to my ears.
The Cleveland engines are closer to their larger EMD cousins but the resemblance to Detroit engines is also very strong. I recently began watching TH-cam videos by a guy who travels around and works on vintage buses and their Detroit engines. Very cool stuff. Thanks for watching!
I think we had the same engines on the USS Kittiwake ASR-13. She was launched in 1945 and commissioned in 1946, but I was part of the decommissioning crew in 1994. Thanks for the video. It brings back memories of my snipe days.
That's one awesome genset power plant!!! Wow I've never seen inside one of those and its amazing the technology it has just from the brief overview of the cylinder head! Never knew they had the roller camshaft in the head which is pretty brilliant and it lessens the pushrods and I was blown away to see that it was a roller cam no less because they didn't start to be used in the racing industry until the mid 80s and production vehicles in the late 80s early 90s! The fact they were using this kind of technology in military equipment makes me wonder WTF they'd have today if that's 80+ yrs old now lmao! Sounds like it'd brand new after having sat for that long, incredible stuff!
They have a very nice stainless steel type look to them. The 3cyl Cleveland in the next engine room forward of this one, has sat with the sump full of saltwater and the rods/bearings in that engine still shine.
Thanks for watching and the kind words! When the engine is idling in preparation to be brought to speed and loaded I don't wear ear protection so I can detect any slight abnormalities, the overall sound volume is very low at this point. When the engine is at speed or when I'm blowing it down the plugs go in, it becomes incredibly loud.
Very cool. I saw the Stewart when I was in Galveston last year although didn't go on board. Glad to see that this old 2-stroke is still a runner. I'm a fan of the big EMD 2-stroke diesels that followed afterward. Especially the 16-645
Wow thank you so much it is so cool to hear that engine run and to hear that history come alive again. It is a wonderful tribute the men who ran and maintained these ships during the war even though they are no longer hear we can remember what they did My grandpa would have so loved to hear that engine running he served aboard the USS HUSE D.E.145 in WW2
Thanks for watching and taking the time to tell your story. I really appreciate hearing things like that, makes all the volunteer hours much more worth it. Cheers 🍻
I'm from Seattle, where Hatch & Kirk, current owners of the CLEVELAND nameplate have their headquarters. In the late 1970s, I worked as a relief oiler for Washington State Ferries. At that time, they had three boats w/ CLEVELAND power plants, EVERGREEN STATE, KLAHOWYA & TILLICUM. These were built in Seattle in the late 1950s, very good ships. The mains were a pair of 16-278As, DC diesel-electric. The auxiliaries were a pair of 8-268As turning 900, on 150 KW AC generators. I'm told by old-timers that 268As were notorious for drinking lube oil. I got through an 8-hour shift w/ this 1 unit, never had to add a drop of lube oil. When I related this story to a diesel mech., he identified me as a pathological liar, until I told him it only turned 900, and was freshly rebuilt. The perfomance of main propulsion plant was very impressive - the responsiveness of the 16-278As was near-instant, no matter how quickly the load was applied. Long before DEADLIEST CATCH, ( 1960s & "70s,) surplus ARMY and NAVY FS ships (Freighter Small) were a popular platform for conversion to mobile floating crab processors. These had a pair of 6-278As for main engines, + a pair of 3-268As (100 KW @) 1200 for ship's service power. In the orig. configuration, these were DC, probably 220V.
Thank you very much for the information! So many Cleveland engines went to work after the war in all sorts of different applications. I envy the 900 RPM sets, that 300 RPM makes a big difference. I purchased the very last 268a parts from H&K for this engine, they have since discontinued it unfortunately. Thanks for watching!
Back in 2011 I bought an old m35a2 which had the Hercules all fuel in it. Thing had sat for 10 years. Changed fuel filters and put fresh fuel in it and 2 12 volt batteries and she fired up the second try. I really miss that old beast. Dead reliable. She really sang at 1800 rpm/ 48 mph.
Thanks for watching! I had the opportunity to drive one a few years back, it was a great time. I've always thought it would be a cool project to put a series 71 or 92 Detroit in one. They are great trucks although the air over vacuum brakes leave a little to be desired.
@@FixAndForget yeah, the single circuit brake system could be questionable. Made one pay attention on the pre trip and make sure the parking brake worked right. I also got to work on a couple of ARRF Oshkosh trucks that had the 8V92T in them. My big boy squirt toys I called them. They'd get up to 70 mph in 58 seconds and come to a dead stop in 147 feet and could pump 1500 gallons of foam in a minute and a half. Not bad for something made in the early 70s.
It's been a while but I think Cleveland might have still been independent when this engine was built. Regardless, the engines GM acquired with the Winton/Cleveland acquisition certainly helped carry them into the future and was at least one of the 5 stars belonging to the General! Thanks for watching!
The engine is one of 4 generators on the USS Stewart (DE-238) in Galveston, TX. The Stewart is a WWII museum ship and isn't going anywhere any time soon. Check out the website and thanks for watching! www.galvestonnavalmuseum.com/
Joe Ford back then, when they made something they made it to last. Sadly now days we live in a greedy society so they make things with cheap materials and with the mind set of making a product not last very long so you will buy more.
Carson Hoover you have to consider who's buying too. Most people just want to turn the key and go. Never give a second thought about care or maintenance. Even the best made machine will quickly become worthless junk without proper care.
That's just not true. These days 200k miles is something an engine is expected to do without serious repairs. 80 years ago, you would have to rebuild it several times before you even got close to that mileage.
Thank you! It's a neverending process but also very rewarding. The big objective now is to visually restore the space so it looks as good as it did in 1945.
The old Cleveland engines are very similar to modern EMD 710 series engines. Not much has changed in the development of large 2-stroke diesel engines in the last 80 years. Thanks for watching!
Justin Higgina Hell even the old Allison V12 aircraft engine used a roller set up on its over head cam 4 valves !!! Something even the "fabled" RR Merlin did NOT have !!!!
We had two V16_278A main engines and one 8-268A ships service generator engine in both the forward and after enginerooms on LST 1161. The 8-268A was rated at 450 HP at 1200 RPM. Or 300 KW. This was in the early 1960s.
That's very interesting. One day I'll make a trip to a LST museum. Not sure if any have the Cleveland engines or all EMD and Detroit Diesel. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for watching! The mains on the submarine (also part of the museum) are old enough to still be branded "Winton". Not sure if Winton is directly responsible for the Detroit line of engines, but they certainly are for EMD.
In the US Army I trained on EMD 6V268A engines. They ran like tops. I also know a gentleman in The Bahamas who owns a tug powered by a 6-268. It must be the smallest series that Cleveland or EMD made.
That's very cool. I've only seen a 6-567 EMD before, nothing smaller than that. If your friend needs a hand with his tug in the Bahamas, let me know, I spend most of my time in FT. Lauderdale. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for watching and the kind words! With the engine cold and less than ~400PSI a little bit of starting fluid does the job, of course not enough to damage anything.
I've never worked on an Alco before but might volunteer some of my time to a different museum to try and get one of theirs running again after a few years of sitting. Thanks for watching!
A person has to wonder how current diesels will do after sitting idle for 72 years. I betting not so well. Back in the 80's when I was in the USN a lot of the engineroom equipment on newer built ships was designed in the 1930's:navy brass thought if it was good enough then and proved itself why change. Good thought process as far as I'm concerned.
It depends on your priorities. The old two stroke engines were simple and powerful and didn't even need an electrical system to operate which makes them inherently resistant to a nuclear EMP. The military still uses them in many applications. BUT, the shortfall is that they are loud and not very fuel efficient and, as some people mentioned, they can runaway under certain conditions and destroy themselves quite spectacularly. It used to happen in locomotives occasionally. They were OK when fuel was dirt cheap. But, now that cost has to be taken into consideration. So, simplicity has given way to efficiency.
@Rick Delair I disagree with you. 2 stroke engines have a high power to weight co-efficient compared to 4 stroke engines. But they are not as efficient, especially the older ones. Here is more information: mechanics.stackexchange.com/questions/25049/what-makes-two-stroke-engines-less-fuel-efficient-than-four-strokes
You cannot change physics. 2 stroke is less thermally efficient than a 4. The Otto cycle is less efficient than the Atkinson cycle. The only way a 2 stroke is more efficient is in an opposed piston design. The have no cylinder head to loose heat to and have a higher thermal efficiency. They still don't have the greatest emissions. I work with a bunch of 2 stroke tanks that leave a haze of exhaust when accelerating or climbing. The 4 strokes there smoke depending on model. The 6bt Cummins that the British military replaced the massive 6.57l RR 2 strokes with improved range, slightly more power and slightly better hill climb ability while being lighter. I like 2 stroke as much as the next guy, but understand it's positives and negatives. You can't use large ship engines as an example when comparing because they do not operate no in the same manner. Yes, they have 50+% thermal efficiency but they are completely hydraulically operated.
Let me get this straight, 4 valves per cylinder, unit injectors in cylinders, back in 1942? Remarkable technology considering we still design modern diesels in much the same way!
Thanks for watching! These Cleveland engines share many similarities to modern EMD units which are based off of the original Winton/CDED design. The 4 valve heads and unit injectors first made their appearance even earlier in the 1930's.
Thanks for watching! The museum has been closed for close to a year now unfortunately. The engine rooms are also off the tour route. If you do ever make it out that way, let me know here and I'll see about getting you in. Thanks!
@@FixAndForget wow! That would be my dream! Being visually impaired, well I first have to find someone to drive me that far LOL, but that would totally make my day!
Detriot engines have many similarities with the much larger Cleveland line (both are GM products), although Cleveland engines are closer to EMD, the resemblance is still there. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for watching! That is a very common misconception. Unlike gas engines, almost all 2 stroke diesel (and all slow speed engines) have exhaust valves. Intake air is drawn in through ports in the cylinder liner and exhaust gas exits through conventional valves. A quick Google search will help to clear this up for you!
That's very cool, I've yet to hear about them being repurposed for work on the rigs! Was it an 3,8,12 or 16 cyl motor you worked on? Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget Straight 8 cyl. 2 stroke. It powered a gen. motor off a sub. The power engines were White 8 cyl. engines built in the 40's as was the rig. Those didn't have forced lube to the upper valve train so twice a shift you had to remove 4 side plates and fill them with oil on each of the 4 800 hp. engines. That was drip feed and constant loss. They decided to scrap the rig when you could stick a screwdriver thru the sub frames.
@@odatmatt again, that is some really cool stuff. The USS COD, a WWII sub museum in Cleveland Ohio has the same inline 8cyl Cleveland generator, still in running condition. The guys up there were a big help in getting this on running.
@@FixAndForget It powered all of our electrical needs, Another Noble Drilling rig had Sub generator motors powering the drawworks used to pull the drill pipe out of the hole.
I worked on a Cleveland diesel just like that, was an 8- 268A And there was a 3- 268 A was a Generator engine. Takes a series of steps to make that thing run. I remember valves for oil bleed air to start And for blowing it down each individual cylinder. Also there was a hand held pyro with a probe that could give you a reading so you could tell if that cylinder was firing each valve cover was polished kinda neat big 2 cycle. It was in a mine sweeper turned into pleasure craft Was owned by the famous man they called "The Duke" . I do believe these engines were used in Locomotives in that Era.
Thanks for watching! The Stewart has 2 8-268A engines and 2 3-268A engines onboard. All are generators. I'm very surprised by how many people have commented that they worked on these engines. It's incredible how long these things stayed around and the applications they were used in after the war.
I am hoping in the near future to be working on the restoration of a ship with two of these. Installed in 1942, and still there today. Thanks for this... I and my crewmates have this to look forward to if we get the ship.
Our 8-268A sat between two 16-268a's in USS Rasher after engine room. A little nervous in the bilge between them looking at all those crankcase relief valves.........
That's the same setup as the USS COD who's crew still has the 8 and both 16's running today. I can't imagine how you guys worked down there, I have enough trouble working in a "spacious" engine room. The Gato class boat that sits next to this ship at the same museum had one of the 16's and the 8 removed in 1952. Thanks for watching!
Don’t know if it’s the same company but my father had a Cleveland 4 cylinder he used for a log splitter and multiple other farm projects and that thing went for years. I remember us kids wanted to rip it apart in his shop and he says keep your hands off that one.
That's a pretty neat story! The Cleveland diesel engine division made 3,8,12, and 16cyl engines. However, even the 3cyl was rather massive and probably a little big for a log splitter. Thanks for watching!
Might have had some air in the fuel system that caused a momentary pre-ignition knock but that cleared up after a few seconds. Thanks for watching and the kind words!!
The USS Cavalla SS-244 is a museum submarine berthed next to the Stewart and it had 4 16-278A engines. It was common practice for scrapyards to remove the propulsion equipment from them and resell it to other uses. There are a few Fairbanks and Cleveland powered tugs up on the great lakes and Mississippi river. I knew RTC in New York had a few of them a few years back. Glad to hear there are a few left still working! Thanks for watching!
Very nice! I always wondered at the designation for these engines, all the other Detroit/EMD 2 strokes were named for their cylinder displacement in cubic inches with the exception of the Clevelands. I had a chance years ago to buy a 3-268 gen set, I always regret passing it up. No idea what I would have done with it, but it was really cool. Same guy also had a Packard PT boat engine, I REALLY regret not buying that one.
The Cleveland engine line was the predecessor to EMD. Lessons learned went into the design of EMD and the result was an engine family almost identical to this one. That could be said all the way up to the basic principles of the EMD 710 series engine. Thanks for watching!
I made a visit to the U.S.S. Cod a world war two submarine, and I believe they had two or three of these Cleveland made Engines in her. The Sub is docked in down town Cleveland ,Ohio!
The Chief of the Boat on Cod, Darrell Flint, was a big help in getting this engine running. The Cod has 1 auxiliary 8-268a generator that runs and 2 of the 4 main generators (16-278a) that also run. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for watching! It was pretty cool seeing and hearing about 2 years work all come together in a few short seconds. It came down to the wire since just a few hours after I got it running I had to go back to sea for 4 months!
Thanks for watching! There are few major differences between the old Cleveland engines and modern day EMD 710 series motors, the basic operating principals and designs haven't changed much in the last 80 years. I think they had been using roller rocker arms since sometime in the 30's. Pretty neat stuff!
I can use the same 1940s EMD 567 rocker arm part number and cross reference it to a modern 710. I'd say they still make things to last. Maybe not in consumer products, but in industrial stuff they do.
@@---sx9qx one of the reasons why I chose to work on EMD products. Build to last, bullet proof, doesn't require a degree in rocket science to work on. Thanks for watching!
Yeah that's bullshit would you really want this thing in a new car you would get 5 miles to the gallon what do you drive by the way I'm betting it's pretty new so I rest my case
You’re half right. The quality control and metallurgy of new engines far surpasses the old stuff but it’s the federally mandated emissions systems that are prematurely killing modern diesel engines. Just about any of the new class 8 diesels would run 2 million miles if they weren’t being prematurely destroyed by the emissions garbage.
@@prevost8686 And newer diesels are being built lighter for fuel efficiency... which isn't a good thing in a marine diesel. A bit of extra weight helps smooth an engine down and stretches it's life.
@@charlesangell_bulmtl the engine you're talking about is not plausible nor would it be productive in a modern automobile it's to small it wouldn't have the power to weight ratio
I'll take a new Ford 5.0L DOHC direct injection V-8 with a conservative 460 H.P. any day over the Ford 289 C.I. barely 200 H.P. in my '65 Mustang. The modern 5.0L has way, way more power, better fuel efficiency, 98% less emissions, and longer life/reliability. 289 was good in its day, but that is 50 year old technology. The same goes for Chevy and Chrysler.
I ask myself the same question. However I'm much more surprised with how positively many have reacted. I really appreciate all of it. Thanks for watching!
Thanks boss! The large C02 extinguisher and intake damper are precautions I take with any large 2 stroke engine I work with. One of these days I'll post a video of the engine at rated speed with a load on it. It really screams at 1,200 RPM.
@@AntonyThorburn A number of circumstances can cause this style of 2-stroke engine to run away. The most common are stuck injector racks, diesel in the lube oil, and bad seals on the blower (supercharger).
I cut my teeth in the Navy on these two stroke work horses. EMD 12-278A,Cleveland 8-567 and more. They required very little maintenance needed and always reliable.
This must be the closest to the sound of the original Winton engines as used in early diesel locomotives, but I would have liked some exhaust sound in the video as well.
One of these days I will post another video of the engine at speed and carrying a load, I'll include an exhaust clip on that one. If you want to see a few now, click on my account under the video, I have some raw footage of the engine on there with some exhaust clips as well. Kinda sounds like a hit and miss engine after the muffler. Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget I check them out, the figure 268 denotes displacement per cylinder like EMD did? I had been checking the web for surviving locomotives whit the Winton 201A diesels in them, but currntly none of them is operational. I hope there wil be one in the future, because this engine had a significant rol in the birth of the diesel locomotive in the United States.
Not sure where this one was installed, had 8-268a’s as ships service generators on Fleet Tugs built in 42/43 Also 3-268a’s for emergency and towing power. 12V278a for main propulsion.
Thanks for watching! There are few major differences between the old Cleveland engines and modern day EMD 710 series motors, the basic operating principals and designs haven't changed much in the last 80 years.
Thanks for watching! There are few major differences between the old Cleveland engines and modern day EMD 710 series motors, the basic operating principals and designs haven't changed much in the last 80 years.
Basically it is an EMD diesel engine. Until 1962 the division was known as the Cleveland Diesel Engine Division of General Motors. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Diesel_Engine_Division
Curious about the Hp and RPM's. The two valve lifters must be for exhaust valves just like the 2 stroke GM diesels. The center tappet probably for the fuel injector.
Rated speed is 1200, approximately 500 HP. 4 exhaust valves and the center rocker is for the injector. Cleveland/Winton was bought by GM in 1930 so this is a "GM" engine. Thanks for watching!
I was at the USS Stewart a day ago but the engine room was locked I didn't even know that it had this engine for the generator I just knew that it had a couple of Fairbanks Morse opposed piston 2 stroke diesels for the main engines I do know that the USS Cavalla submarine next door has four Cleveland diesel 267 V16 2 strokes
Over about a 2 and a half year period I inspected, repaired, and rebuilt the necessary components to get the engine running. The biggest issues were actually the auxiliary systems supporting the engine such as piping, pumps, and the start air compressor. The injectors and engine blower were rebuilt by me on the ship as well. Thanks for watching!
Beautiful old engine, I worked for GM in Australia on the modern EMD's and smaller 2 strokes, the Cleveland is just beautiful
I served my apprenticeship on the EMD (and smaller rolls royce,Leyland ,Gardner and cat) .I still enjoy the sound of an EMD notching up under load. An old mate of mine had a Winton Car,built in the 1800's.
@@Mercmad That's very cool. Also one of my favorite parts of working with these engines. Thanks for watching!
did you ever know Earl Nemic
I worked on the switch engines george bacukman of relco,
(old 3 finger george)
bought back in 79. the old alco's that threw coal bits out of the exaust. Turning oil filters and tripping out individual cylinder with the grasshopper valve. Inspecting cylinder walls by standing upside down in the cylinders. At 18 that was the shit!
Quite the experience! Thanks for watching!!
This thing sounds great! I was amazed at how smooth it was running.. you could tell every cylinder was firing.
I was just as surprised, you wouldn't think something that had been sitting that long would sound like that but there was a lot of effort which made it that way. Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Hey Larry, I like your last name!
Grandpa served as a Machinist Mate during WWII on DE-244 (Otterstetter). Hearing that engine run brings to my mind so many of his stories. Like while shooting at a sea mine, it exploded too close to the ship. Shrapnel went right thru the hull into the engine room. Apparently, above the waterline. Grandpa never really seemed to have much confidence in the gunners abilities to hit much. I'm thinking that the hole might have been close to his station or bunk. Thank you guys so much for sharing this.
Thanks for watching and the kind words! That's a very neat story from your grandfather. I met a former USS Otterstetter sailor who was a volunteer on the USS Slater some years ago.
Shrapnel through the hull....hence the name "Tin Can"
Sat idle for 70 years, yet fired up as though it had been run yesterday. They definitely don't make 'em like this anymore
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
In 70 years they'll say the same thing about the engines of today. ;)
@@boringpolitician I'm not sure the engines of today will last 70 years...but the ones that are already 40 and 50 might still be around then :P
@@SpeakerPolice it's not that engines to day are made bad or cheap it's that not all engines are made for the same purpose just like big diesel engines made to pull stuff have to made sturdier then a small car or truck wouldn't benefit of having an engine like this in the engine bay it doesn't make sense nor would it be practical so i guess a lot of those people who think those old engines are better then today's would rather still be using steam powerd cars ,trains,ships etc are just plain Antiquated people
@@GOBRADON502 I don't think electronically controlled engines made with thinner, cheaper alloys will last as long as purely mechanical units made of cast iron. It doesn't have to do with the use case so much as it does the build quality. A similar argument could be made for TV sets...today's modern flat panels will absolutely be garbage 50 years from now :/
After spending 21 years in navy ship engine rooms as an Electricians Mate and engineering watch officer, the look and sounds of that old Cleveland generator are like music to my ears. Sounds like old home week to me. Thank all of you at the naval museum for keeping our history alive.
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
That engine sounds damn good. The technology required to build those diesels back in the 1940s boggles the mind still today. It's nice to see the art of restoring these engines to working order is alive and well. These masterpieces of engineering are our nation's history and have to be preserved.
Thanks for watching! I absolutely agree, it's also a great experience working on them, cool to see how technology has improved over the years.
You hear that sound? It sounds like...Victory!
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Ran an old ferry boat that had two of those from a DE, along with the DC generators and motors with reduction gear. Cheap cylinder heads from Texas were always cracking until we figured out previous crew had firing pressures too high. When we scrapped them they were worn out, 1988. The fish boat that got one said it was the best engine they ever had, cracked block and all. Hey, it would run all the time. I met the guy who designed it. Old timer came through for a ride, what a treat. He did it in something like 6 months for the war. Parts always available from various sources.
Best diesel builder ever that not many ever heard of the Cleveland was a huge part of winning ww2.
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
When I worked at Titan Tire Bryan Ohio they had an old diesel engine from a WWII destroyer. They would run it during thunderstorms for backup electrical power for control power for the boilers. That beauty was about twice that size and I loved running it.
Prime this handle for fuel on this side. Prime this handle on the other side for fuel. Set the throttle to 3 clicks and then hit the air start. 90% of they time she would fire first time. The other 10% you had to start all over again. Man never more than twice. Wish I had bothered to pay more attention to the build tag
After WWII many marine engines were repurposed to various shoreside jobs. I always enjoy hearing about the applications they were placed into for their second life. Thanks for sharing that info and watching the video!
Back when diesels were simple and well built.
Simple enough for me to work on! Thanks for watching.
Modern engines might not be simple, but an military naval engine of that size will be extremely well built.
@@bargu The Cleveland engine line in it's entirety was incredibly over built. The modern 710 series EMD engines are updated versions of this 80 year old design.
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Asher, you all should be so proud. I am so happy you went for the service generator over the emergency. I can imagine it was a lot more work. But, it was worth it.
Andrew, I never would have attempted it, let alone complete it without your help and guidance. I'll never forget that. Thanks again boss!
Thank you for waking the old girl up. She still sings like a song bird, and I bet a million hours more of reliable service left in her pistons.
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Well put, there's nothing like the sound of a large marine deisel engine :)
@@BillSikes. I agree. Thanks for watching!
Navy taught me about these engines ! 61-65 @ used that knowledge till i retired 2010 👍👍🤛🤛 Thanks Navy ⚓️
Very cool. Thanks for watching!
I worked as an electrician in a power plant on Diego Garcia in 1975. We had 5 or 6 Fairbanks and Morse 10 cylinder opposing piston submarine engines turning 4160 Volt generators. The engine room was beautiful. Im still working as an electrician
in a power production capacity. Over 40 years at Lockheed Martin. Thank you Navy!
I will always love the sound, simplicity and durability of a two stroke diesel engine. The first truck I ever drove was a '69 GMC Brigadier with a Detroit two stroke diesel.
One of the most distinct engine sounds for sure. Thanks for watching.
@@FixAndForget There is a very distinct difference between the sound of the Cleveland or EMD diesels and the Detroit two stroke diesel as well.
I didn't realize Brigadier's were that old. Two strokes were powerful engines, but just way too much pollution and noise. Personally, I prefer Cummins diesels.
@@ffjsb. I'm not a fan of Cummins, to many times being left at the roadside by an ISX engine with either an emissions system problem or catastrophic internal failure. Small Cummins engine for like a pickup or a Jeep sure I like those, but not a large commercial engine.
I prefer Detroit for large commercial engines, specifically the 60 series as my preferred engine or the DD15 as the more modern and acceptable replacement.
@@huntsbychainsaw5986 Never seen a Cummins have a catastrophic internal failure. We use them in a lot of our fire apparatus. Any truck with modern emissions or computers can have problems. My LEAST favorite are IH/Navistar engines, I've seen three have catastrophic water pump failures over 30 years. And they just don't seem to have the power that other engines have.
Feeling those engines start up never gets old! Firefighter’s engines can still be ran up anytime we have the personnel, and even our chief engineer agrees that there’s just nothing like it!
Thanks for watching! I would love to see a video of the Firefighter's engines. I've always thought she was a beautiful boat with a great story. Cheers!
@@FixAndForget I’ll post a vid I took of what ended up being a fail. The ailment ended up being an airbound fuel line, it was fixed a relatively short time later
Absolutely! I had a very similar issue with this engine after adding a modern Racor style filter. It happens!
@@FixAndForget ours was cause by the boat just sitting for a while
that thing is so old yet it sounds 10x better than any new diesel engine you can get today, incredible!
One of these days I'll get around to posting a video of the engine at speed and carrying a load. It's a totally different sound and quite a scream!
Thanks for watching!
it seems to me that the all mechanical engines run very well when properly tuned, i have a Massey Ferguson 230 from the 70's that is all mechanical that my dad and my grandad rebuilt and it doesn't even smoke when running
That's because new diesels run more thier timing advanced... so your get more pronounced knocking or pinging, even gasoline engines are moving in this direction as it is more efficient.
does it effect life at all?
@@gtb81. not if it is designed to work like that... diesels are typically and almost all of them except very old ones with very delayed timing (and lost power due to this) knock. Gasoline engines will have to be beefed up for compression ignition to work there.... Mazda and Toyota have engines coming that are going to hit in the 40-45% efficiency range which is very high near theoretical peak. Here's my 353 Detroit running, you can clearly hear the knock th-cam.com/video/1-m9qpruyO8/w-d-xo.html
A delight for the ears and for the eyes!
Well done to you and the team for the work you have done to keep a piece of history alive!
Greetings form the UK!
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
I worked as the engineer on both the Cutter Morris and the Cutter Alert and they both had 8-268A's. Great engines.
Thanks for watching! I wasn't aware that those Cutters had CDED motors, that's really neat. Do you know what became of them?
The Alert was last in Portland, OR. She is in really tough shape as she has not hauled in over 50 years. The Morris is in Rio Vista, CA and belongs to Liberty Maritime Museum. She had a 2 million refit 20 years ago and was repowered at the time.
The Alert sunk in Portland.
I saw that, very sad. I hate to say it but I think there might be a few other historic cutters in trouble up there. Thanks for watching!
there are a few of the old 268's still around, that engine and the old 567's were legendary engines for their reliability they carried us through ww2 and beyond. the parts were of beautiful quality.
They are incredibly over built pieces of equipment. That combined with their extraordinary simplicity are the reasons why they are still with us.
Thanks for watching!
Jim. BE PROUD OV YOUR COUNTRY.... AS I AM..
Looks and sounds beautiful! Bravo!
The sound of a healthy, large displacement 2-stroke diesel when cold is just music! I love that mix of sounds and that injection knock!
Thanks for watching! My favorite part of the old Cleveland and EMD engines is the whine from the gear driven blower, it turns into quite the scream at rated RPM (1,200).
Its definitely a 4 stroke you have both valves and camshaft
@@bmthnow12 Thanks for watching! The engine is a 2-stroke Cleveland diesel 8-268A. Most 2 stroke diesel engines are set up like this one, 4 exhaust valves (2 per rocker), a unit injector, and scavenging air ports in the center of the liner with a blower or some kind of forced induction system.
@@bmthnow12 Just as Mr. Spalding said, 2-stroke. All the 2-stroke diesels I am aware of have similar arrangements, either 2 or 4 valves per cylinder, all are exhaust, full speed cams, ported cylinders for intake, unit injectors and a scavenging blower. Cleveland, Detroit/GMC, EMD, Alco , etc.
Even without reading about this engine I immediately recognized it as the granddaddy of my bus's Detroit 6V92. It's amazing how such a strong family lineage extended from before WW2 to the 1990s. Wonderful! I grew up with Napier Deltics and Commer TS3s, so a 2-stroke diesel is always music to my ears.
The Cleveland engines are closer to their larger EMD cousins but the resemblance to Detroit engines is also very strong. I recently began watching TH-cam videos by a guy who travels around and works on vintage buses and their Detroit engines. Very cool stuff. Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget B-G-M (I love his new shop in Tenn)
@@misters2837 Pretty cool stuff 😎
I Love it, old guy using a screwdriver to detect knocks.
John Barron - Stethoscope the old way .
Works beautifully
He might be using it to see if he can feel/hear the injectors pulse.
@@avman2cl- He listens for scratches and click sounds.
We still do it to this day. Works great.
So great watching history come back to life! Great video 👍
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
I think we had the same engines on the USS Kittiwake ASR-13. She was launched in 1945 and commissioned in 1946, but I was part of the decommissioning crew in 1994. Thanks for the video. It brings back memories of my snipe days.
No problem. Thanks for watching! I will hopefully have some more videos of this engine in the coming months.
That's one awesome genset power plant!!! Wow I've never seen inside one of those and its amazing the technology it has just from the brief overview of the cylinder head! Never knew they had the roller camshaft in the head which is pretty brilliant and it lessens the pushrods and I was blown away to see that it was a roller cam no less because they didn't start to be used in the racing industry until the mid 80s and production vehicles in the late 80s early 90s! The fact they were using this kind of technology in military equipment makes me wonder WTF they'd have today if that's 80+ yrs old now lmao! Sounds like it'd brand new after having sat for that long, incredible stuff!
Thanks for watching!
finish of the forged conn rods of Cleveland Diesel was museum quality-art
They have a very nice stainless steel type look to them. The 3cyl Cleveland in the next engine room forward of this one, has sat with the sump full of saltwater and the rods/bearings in that engine still shine.
No Hearing protection? Beautiful machine. When America built great stuff.
Thanks for watching and the kind words! When the engine is idling in preparation to be brought to speed and loaded I don't wear ear protection so I can detect any slight abnormalities, the overall sound volume is very low at this point. When the engine is at speed or when I'm blowing it down the plugs go in, it becomes incredibly loud.
What!??
Hahah I've said that countless times. Thanks for watching!
Very cool. I saw the Stewart when I was in Galveston last year although didn't go on board. Glad to see that this old 2-stroke is still a runner. I'm a fan of the big EMD 2-stroke diesels that followed afterward. Especially the 16-645
Next time you're around let me know and I'll show you around. Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget I think we're going to try to get down there again this year. Probably late summer. Would be very cool to get a real tour!
Wow thank you so much it is so cool to hear that engine run and to hear that history come alive again. It is a wonderful tribute the men who ran and maintained these ships during the war even though they are no longer hear we can remember what they did My grandpa would have so loved to hear that engine running he served aboard the USS HUSE D.E.145 in WW2
Thanks for watching and taking the time to tell your story. I really appreciate hearing things like that, makes all the volunteer hours much more worth it. Cheers 🍻
I'm from Seattle, where Hatch & Kirk, current owners of the CLEVELAND nameplate have their headquarters. In the late 1970s, I worked as a relief oiler for Washington State Ferries. At that time, they had three boats w/ CLEVELAND power plants, EVERGREEN STATE, KLAHOWYA & TILLICUM. These were built in Seattle in the late 1950s, very good ships. The mains were a pair of 16-278As, DC diesel-electric. The auxiliaries were a pair of 8-268As turning 900, on 150 KW AC generators. I'm told by old-timers that 268As were notorious for drinking lube oil. I got through an 8-hour shift w/ this 1 unit, never had to add a drop of lube oil. When I related this story to a diesel mech., he identified me as a pathological liar, until I told him it only turned 900, and was freshly rebuilt.
The perfomance of main propulsion plant was very impressive - the responsiveness of the 16-278As was near-instant, no matter how quickly the load was applied.
Long before DEADLIEST CATCH, ( 1960s & "70s,) surplus ARMY and NAVY FS ships (Freighter Small) were a popular platform for conversion to mobile floating crab processors. These had a pair of 6-278As for main engines, + a pair of 3-268As (100 KW @) 1200 for ship's service power. In the orig. configuration, these were DC, probably 220V.
Thank you very much for the information! So many Cleveland engines went to work after the war in all sorts of different applications. I envy the 900 RPM sets, that 300 RPM makes a big difference. I purchased the very last 268a parts from H&K for this engine, they have since discontinued it unfortunately. Thanks for watching!
Back in 2011 I bought an old m35a2 which had the Hercules all fuel in it. Thing had sat for 10 years. Changed fuel filters and put fresh fuel in it and 2 12 volt batteries and she fired up the second try. I really miss that old beast. Dead reliable. She really sang at 1800 rpm/ 48 mph.
Thanks for watching! I had the opportunity to drive one a few years back, it was a great time. I've always thought it would be a cool project to put a series 71 or 92 Detroit in one. They are great trucks although the air over vacuum brakes leave a little to be desired.
@@FixAndForget yeah, the single circuit brake system could be questionable. Made one pay attention on the pre trip and make sure the parking brake worked right.
I also got to work on a couple of ARRF Oshkosh trucks that had the 8V92T in them. My big boy squirt toys I called them. They'd get up to 70 mph in 58 seconds and come to a dead stop in 147 feet and could pump 1500 gallons of foam in a minute and a half. Not bad for something made in the early 70s.
That is truly a delight to see and hear. Thank you for sharing this moment.
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Ah yes I love these old engine start ups! Now that’s a land mark for reliability and quality
Thanks for watching!
General Motors. Back when the General had 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟 5 stars and proud of it , and earned it.
It's been a while but I think Cleveland might have still been independent when this engine was built. Regardless, the engines GM acquired with the Winton/Cleveland acquisition certainly helped carry them into the future and was at least one of the 5 stars belonging to the General! Thanks for watching!
Beautiful, ...it's the well worn saying. ''They don't make them like they used to''.
Absolutely right. Thanks for watching!
I know nothing about Diesel engines, nor the use of this specific one. But I found it fascinating!
The engine is one of 4 generators on the USS Stewart (DE-238) in Galveston, TX. The Stewart is a WWII museum ship and isn't going anywhere any time soon. Check out the website and thanks for watching!
www.galvestonnavalmuseum.com/
Now that is a relic worthy of a very well looked after retirement! Its massive, and puts to shame todays high powered but fragile alternatives!
Thanks for watching! She is very well looked after these days indeed.
They really made engines out of quality materials back in the day.
Joe Ford back then, when they made something they made it to last. Sadly now days we live in a greedy society so they make things with cheap materials and with the mind set of making a product not last very long so you will buy more.
They needed to win a war
Carson Hoover you have to consider who's buying too. Most people just want to turn the key and go. Never give a second thought about care or maintenance. Even the best made machine will quickly become worthless junk without proper care.
That's just not true. These days 200k miles is something an engine is expected to do without serious repairs. 80 years ago, you would have to rebuild it several times before you even got close to that mileage.
@@wtfiswiththosehandles even just the seventies and sixties you'd need a rebuild every 30-40k on engines
Wow, nice to see all that effort resulting in a running engine. Keep up the good work :)
Thank you! It's a neverending process but also very rewarding. The big objective now is to visually restore the space so it looks as good as it did in 1945.
roller rockers all them years ago gotta love it
The old Cleveland engines are very similar to modern EMD 710 series engines. Not much has changed in the development of large 2-stroke diesel engines in the last 80 years.
Thanks for watching!
Justin Higgina Hell even the old Allison V12 aircraft engine used a roller set up on its over head cam 4 valves !!! Something even the "fabled" RR Merlin did NOT have !!!!
We had two V16_278A main engines and one 8-268A ships service generator engine in both the forward and after enginerooms on LST 1161. The 8-268A was rated at 450 HP at 1200 RPM. Or 300 KW. This was in the early 1960s.
That's very interesting. One day I'll make a trip to a LST museum. Not sure if any have the Cleveland engines or all EMD and Detroit Diesel. Thanks for watching!
Winton was the original company. Gm bought them. Renamed to Cleveland engine. Then later Detroit and emd
Thanks for watching! The mains on the submarine (also part of the museum) are old enough to still be branded "Winton". Not sure if Winton is directly responsible for the Detroit line of engines, but they certainly are for EMD.
In the US Army I trained on EMD 6V268A engines. They ran like tops. I also know a gentleman in The Bahamas who owns a tug powered by a 6-268. It must be the smallest series that Cleveland or EMD made.
That's very cool. I've only seen a 6-567 EMD before, nothing smaller than that. If your friend needs a hand with his tug in the Bahamas, let me know, I spend most of my time in FT. Lauderdale.
Thanks for watching!
Very impressive two-stroke straight-8 diesel sound! I built a replica of this engine with Legos and it has the realistic sound!
Haha thanks for watching!
Great work guys, not the easiest task, trying to start a large marine engine on a limited supply of compressed air
Thanks for watching and the kind words! With the engine cold and less than ~400PSI a little bit of starting fluid does the job, of course not enough to damage anything.
@@JP-et8iq
Wow, what a story, I'm glad you got that old tug boat started and moved out of the way
@@JP-et8iq That's an awesome story! Maybe one day someone will leave me something like that.
brings back memories from the Navy days.... air start ALCOS'
I've never worked on an Alco before but might volunteer some of my time to a different museum to try and get one of theirs running again after a few years of sitting. Thanks for watching!
A person has to wonder how current diesels will do after sitting idle for 72 years. I betting not so well. Back in the 80's when I was in the USN a lot of the engineroom equipment on newer built ships was designed in the 1930's:navy brass thought if it was good enough then and proved itself why change. Good thought process as far as I'm concerned.
It depends on your priorities. The old two stroke engines were simple and powerful and didn't even need an electrical system to operate which makes them inherently resistant to a nuclear EMP. The military still uses them in many applications. BUT, the shortfall is that they are loud and not very fuel efficient and, as some people mentioned, they can runaway under certain conditions and destroy themselves quite spectacularly. It used to happen in locomotives occasionally. They were OK when fuel was dirt cheap. But, now that cost has to be taken into consideration. So, simplicity has given way to efficiency.
@Rick Delair I disagree with you. 2 stroke engines have a high power to weight co-efficient compared to 4 stroke engines. But they are not as efficient, especially the older ones. Here is more information: mechanics.stackexchange.com/questions/25049/what-makes-two-stroke-engines-less-fuel-efficient-than-four-strokes
Here is an explanation of what is a runaway diesel engine: th-cam.com/video/W3dKbtGLM9g/w-d-xo.html
You cannot change physics. 2 stroke is less thermally efficient than a 4. The Otto cycle is less efficient than the Atkinson cycle. The only way a 2 stroke is more efficient is in an opposed piston design. The have no cylinder head to loose heat to and have a higher thermal efficiency. They still don't have the greatest emissions. I work with a bunch of 2 stroke tanks that leave a haze of exhaust when accelerating or climbing. The 4 strokes there smoke depending on model.
The 6bt Cummins that the British military replaced the massive 6.57l RR 2 strokes with improved range, slightly more power and slightly better hill climb ability while being lighter.
I like 2 stroke as much as the next guy, but understand it's positives and negatives.
You can't use large ship engines as an example when comparing because they do not operate no in the same manner. Yes, they have 50+% thermal efficiency but they are completely hydraulically operated.
If you want to see a runaway 2 cycle Detroit diesel, check out this: th-cam.com/video/JxLb3Yqqds4/w-d-xo.html
Let me get this straight, 4 valves per cylinder, unit injectors in cylinders, back in 1942? Remarkable technology considering we still design modern diesels in much the same way!
Thanks for watching! These Cleveland engines share many similarities to modern EMD units which are based off of the original Winton/CDED design. The 4 valve heads and unit injectors first made their appearance even earlier in the 1930's.
Wow! Just that sound! beautiful. I'm in Fort Worth, I'll have to somehow come and check that beauty out!
Thanks for watching! The museum has been closed for close to a year now unfortunately. The engine rooms are also off the tour route. If you do ever make it out that way, let me know here and I'll see about getting you in. Thanks!
@@FixAndForget wow! That would be my dream! Being visually impaired, well I first have to find someone to drive me that far LOL, but that would totally make my day!
Awesome sound from it , puts newer diesel engines to shame !!
Thanks for watching!
I spent 30 yrs working on the detroit two strokes from the 2-53 to the 16v149tib and you can tell this old bird is a two stroke
Detriot engines have many similarities with the much larger Cleveland line (both are GM products), although Cleveland engines are closer to EMD, the resemblance is still there. Thanks for watching!
A two stroke with valves, I don’t think so 🤔
Thanks for watching! That is a very common misconception. Unlike gas engines, almost all 2 stroke diesel (and all slow speed engines) have exhaust valves. Intake air is drawn in through ports in the cylinder liner and exhaust gas exits through conventional valves. A quick Google search will help to clear this up for you!
Brings back good memories of when I was an engineer on an old 1945 tug boat with a Hamilton Diesel.
Thanks for watching! I am not familiar with Hamilton engines, I'll have to look them up, thanks!
@@FixAndForget I engineered on a few old rugs ta also had Buda. GM
I meant Buda, General Motors and Fairbanks Morse. I reay enjoyed the FB engines.
@@carlatamanczyk3891 This ship has 4 10cyl FB main engines. Very unique engines.
@@FixAndForget Good old times.
Ran an old Cleveland like this for a light plant engine on a West Texas Drilling rig in the 70's.
That's very cool, I've yet to hear about them being repurposed for work on the rigs! Was it an 3,8,12 or 16 cyl motor you worked on?
Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget Straight 8 cyl. 2 stroke. It powered a gen. motor off a sub. The power engines were White 8 cyl. engines built in the 40's as was the rig. Those didn't have forced lube to the upper valve train so twice a shift you had to remove 4 side plates and fill them with oil on each of the 4 800 hp. engines. That was drip feed and constant loss. They decided to scrap the rig when you could stick a screwdriver thru the sub frames.
@@odatmatt again, that is some really cool stuff. The USS COD, a WWII sub museum in Cleveland Ohio has the same inline 8cyl Cleveland generator, still in running condition. The guys up there were a big help in getting this on running.
@@FixAndForget It powered all of our electrical needs, Another Noble Drilling rig had Sub generator motors powering the drawworks used to pull the drill pipe out of the hole.
And it runs about as good as she did fresh off the line no doubt 👍
I like to think so. Thanks for watching!
I don't know what the engine is mounted in but I am very impressed that it still runs after all this time. These are time-tested true art.
Thanks for watching! This is one of 4 generators on a WWII DE ship. Check video description for more information.
I worked on a Cleveland diesel just like that, was an 8- 268A And there was a 3- 268 A was a Generator engine. Takes a series of steps to make that thing run. I remember valves for oil bleed air to start And for blowing it down each individual cylinder. Also there was a hand held pyro with a probe that could give you a reading so you could tell if that cylinder was firing each valve cover was polished kinda neat big 2 cycle. It was in a mine sweeper turned into pleasure craft Was owned by the famous man they called "The Duke" . I do believe these engines were used in Locomotives in that Era.
Thanks for watching! The Stewart has 2 8-268A engines and 2 3-268A engines onboard. All are generators. I'm very surprised by how many people have commented that they worked on these engines. It's incredible how long these things stayed around and the applications they were used in after the war.
That is so cooooool, just watching the valves opening and closing.
Thank you so much! Check out some of the other videos on the channel. I might go back and start this engine up again sometime in 2022!
I am hoping in the near future to be working on the restoration of a ship with two of these. Installed in 1942, and still there today. Thanks for this... I and my crewmates have this to look forward to if we get the ship.
Asher.spalding@gmail.com let me know if you need help. Best of luck!
Our 8-268A sat between two 16-268a's in USS Rasher after engine room. A little nervous in the bilge between them looking at all those crankcase relief valves.........
That's the same setup as the USS COD who's crew still has the 8 and both 16's running today. I can't imagine how you guys worked down there, I have enough trouble working in a "spacious" engine room. The Gato class boat that sits next to this ship at the same museum had one of the 16's and the 8 removed in 1952.
Thanks for watching!
This Engine @ the 278s helped win WW2 . 👍👍🤛🤛⚓️
It absolutely did. Thanks for watching!
Don’t know if it’s the same company but my father had a Cleveland 4 cylinder he used for a log splitter and multiple other farm projects and that thing went for years. I remember us kids wanted to rip it apart in his shop and he says keep your hands off that one.
That's a pretty neat story! The Cleveland diesel engine division made 3,8,12, and 16cyl engines. However, even the 3cyl was rather massive and probably a little big for a log splitter. Thanks for watching!
Smoothly running, slight knock.
Might have had some air in the fuel system that caused a momentary pre-ignition knock but that cleared up after a few seconds.
Thanks for watching and the kind words!!
Moran Towing, New York, had these in a few boats. I was told that they came from submarines. They sounded like a sewing machine in the engine room.
The USS Cavalla SS-244 is a museum submarine berthed next to the Stewart and it had 4 16-278A engines. It was common practice for scrapyards to remove the propulsion equipment from them and resell it to other uses. There are a few Fairbanks and Cleveland powered tugs up on the great lakes and Mississippi river. I knew RTC in New York had a few of them a few years back. Glad to hear there are a few left still working!
Thanks for watching!
Very nice! I always wondered at the designation for these engines, all the other Detroit/EMD 2 strokes were named for their cylinder displacement in cubic inches with the exception of the Clevelands. I had a chance years ago to buy a 3-268 gen set, I always regret passing it up. No idea what I would have done with it, but it was really cool. Same guy also had a Packard PT boat engine, I REALLY regret not buying that one.
One of these days I'll post some more videos of my 8-268a.
for the high speed the valves move,this engine is an 2 stroke . the sound is same same as an EMD. (same as the locomotives). 4 valves + injector
The Cleveland engine line was the predecessor to EMD. Lessons learned went into the design of EMD and the result was an engine family almost identical to this one. That could be said all the way up to the basic principles of the EMD 710 series engine.
Thanks for watching!
amazing that this engine is older than any living human being and it fires right up like it ran yesterday
It took me about 2 and a half years to get her ready but when it was time, she went.
Thanks for watching!
Um, 1942 is not that long ago. My father and my grandmother are both alive and older than 72.
@@senormedia it was a joke
I think right around 80 is when old equipment turns the corner of being "old" and "ancient". Thanks for watching!
I made a visit to the U.S.S. Cod a world war two submarine, and I believe they had two or three of these Cleveland made Engines in her. The Sub is docked in down town Cleveland ,Ohio!
The Chief of the Boat on Cod, Darrell Flint, was a big help in getting this engine running. The Cod has 1 auxiliary 8-268a generator that runs and 2 of the 4 main generators (16-278a) that also run.
Thanks for watching!
Gorgeous piece of engineering!
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
I've,worked on 268,,@278,s for 40+years ____heck ov experience __ww2.engines.
Thanks for watching! It is a very worthwhile experience indeed.
I love old iron like that! They just don’t make’em like that anymore.
Absolutely! Something really neat working on an engine made with a lot of brass. Thanks for watching!
The hair on my arms just stud up and gave me chills I can only imagine what it would be like be there and be the One that got it running 🎵
Thanks for watching! It was pretty cool seeing and hearing about 2 years work all come together in a few short seconds. It came down to the wire since just a few hours after I got it running I had to go back to sea for 4 months!
@@FixAndForget 2ys ? That's determination congratulations 🕰️🍾
@@louisedwards6681 Thanks!
Roller rocker arms astonishing for that era , like mentioned dont make stuff to last nowadays
Thanks for watching! There are few major differences between the old Cleveland engines and modern day EMD 710 series motors, the basic operating principals and designs haven't changed much in the last 80 years. I think they had been using roller rocker arms since sometime in the 30's. Pretty neat stuff!
I can use the same 1940s EMD 567 rocker arm part number and cross reference it to a modern 710. I'd say they still make things to last. Maybe not in consumer products, but in industrial stuff they do.
@@---sx9qx one of the reasons why I chose to work on EMD products. Build to last, bullet proof, doesn't require a degree in rocket science to work on.
Thanks for watching!
Super !! It runs like a dream now.
Thank you! It all ended way better than expected. Thanks for watching!
Old engines are better than new crap
Yeah that's bullshit would you really want this thing in a new car you would get 5 miles to the gallon what do you drive by the way I'm betting it's pretty new so I rest my case
You’re half right. The quality control and metallurgy of new engines far surpasses the old stuff but it’s the federally mandated emissions systems that are prematurely killing modern diesel engines. Just about any of the new class 8 diesels would run 2 million miles if they weren’t being prematurely destroyed by the emissions garbage.
@@prevost8686
And newer diesels are being built lighter for fuel efficiency... which isn't a good thing in a marine diesel.
A bit of extra weight helps smooth an engine down and stretches it's life.
@@charlesangell_bulmtl the engine you're talking about is not plausible nor would it be productive in a modern automobile it's to small it wouldn't have the power to weight ratio
I'll take a new Ford 5.0L DOHC direct injection V-8 with a conservative 460 H.P. any day over the Ford 289 C.I. barely 200 H.P. in my '65 Mustang. The modern 5.0L has way, way more power, better fuel efficiency, 98% less emissions, and longer life/reliability. 289 was good in its day, but that is 50 year old technology. The same goes for Chevy and Chrysler.
30 year Waukesha VHP mechanic here. ( Factory Trained )
I approve
Thanks for watching and the expert approval!
Wow 72 years and still keeps on ticking 😊🇺🇸
Thanks for watching!
You’re welcome
Why would someone thumbs down this video ?
I ask myself the same question. However I'm much more surprised with how positively many have reacted. I really appreciate all of it. Thanks for watching!
Maybe they are Diesel engine salesman who are trying to sell modern computerized engines.
I like how he said "yeah, in case she runs away". Plate for the intake please...hahaha. Holy cow that engine sounds MINT! ! ! !
Thanks boss! The large C02 extinguisher and intake damper are precautions I take with any large 2 stroke engine I work with. One of these days I'll post a video of the engine at rated speed with a load on it. It really screams at 1,200 RPM.
runs away! over turbos do that... too much AIR!
@@AntonyThorburn A number of circumstances can cause this style of 2-stroke engine to run away. The most common are stuck injector racks, diesel in the lube oil, and bad seals on the blower (supercharger).
@@FixAndForget thank you. Strange thing.
A thing of beauty.
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
I cut my teeth in the Navy on these two stroke work horses. EMD 12-278A,Cleveland 8-567 and more. They required very little maintenance needed and always reliable.
Thanks for watching!
Iwas on the YF885 at keyport wash. had two 8268aw/ twin disc reduction/reverse they were the best running engine
That's very neat, I have only worked on Cleveland units in generator applications. I've always wanted to see one in a propulsion application.
Ahhh, that wonderful sound of diesel power!
It doesn't get old.
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for sharing this! Great job, incredible engine!
Thanks for watching and the kind words!
Good job keep the rpm up till you got oil upstairs
They have a manual hand prelube pump so before you crank it and fire it you would pump the manual oil pump prelube it so no dry starts
Totally right. Thanks for watching!
Now this is quality!
Thanks for watching! Old school quality!
This must be the closest to the sound of the original Winton engines as used in early diesel locomotives, but I would have liked some exhaust sound in the video as well.
One of these days I will post another video of the engine at speed and carrying a load, I'll include an exhaust clip on that one. If you want to see a few now, click on my account under the video, I have some raw footage of the engine on there with some exhaust clips as well. Kinda sounds like a hit and miss engine after the muffler.
Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget I check them out, the figure 268 denotes displacement per cylinder like EMD did?
I had been checking the web for surviving locomotives whit the Winton 201A diesels in them, but currntly none of them is operational. I hope there wil be one in the future, because this engine had a significant rol in the birth of the diesel locomotive in the United States.
Everything was built to work for along time back then. This proves it
Thanks for watching!
Rebuilt 4, 12-567A's diesel electric ocean going tug. 1939 vintage.
The A models were neat with the rectangular crankcase covers. Old-school
holy moly 72 years!!!!!
Thanks for watching!
3:06 very cool cam setup
Thanks for watching! I am personally not very happy with much of the video recording of this video but it's better than nothing.
Not sure where this one was installed, had 8-268a’s as ships service generators on Fleet Tugs built in 42/43 Also 3-268a’s for emergency and towing power. 12V278a for main propulsion.
Thanks for watching! Please see video description for more info on this engine.
The setup you described also reminds me of Cannon class DEs 2 8-268a, 2 3-268a, and 4 16-278a Clevelands.
Any further updates from DE-238? 😀 Hopefully give the Engine Room a good scrub, degrease, and polish!
Thanks for watching! Unfortunately no work has happened since December 2018. I'll get back there one day.
Bravo.I love Detroit Diesel two strokes engines.
The Cleveland engines are closer to their larger EMD cousins but the resemblance to Detroit engines is also very strong. Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget These are the precursor to the EMD engines. Detroit Diesel did have some small part in the making of these engines at one time.
I thought this engine looked like an EMD. After reading the description, I see why that would be.
Great work. Just subscribed!
Thanks for watching! There are few major differences between the old Cleveland engines and modern day EMD 710 series motors, the basic operating principals and designs haven't changed much in the last 80 years.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Diesel_Engine_Division
If I didn't know better I swear that was an EMD 2 stroke... 4 exhaust valves, fuel injectors right in the middle.
Thanks for watching! There are few major differences between the old Cleveland engines and modern day EMD 710 series motors, the basic operating principals and designs haven't changed much in the last 80 years.
Basically it is an EMD diesel engine. Until 1962 the division was known as the Cleveland Diesel Engine Division of General Motors.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Diesel_Engine_Division
It’s like a symphony and you are the conductor
That's a great way to say it. Thanks for watching!
Curious about the Hp and RPM's. The two valve lifters must be for exhaust valves just like the 2 stroke GM diesels. The center tappet probably for the fuel injector.
Rated speed is 1200, approximately 500 HP. 4 exhaust valves and the center rocker is for the injector. Cleveland/Winton was bought by GM in 1930 so this is a "GM" engine. Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget Thank you. I am surprised about 4 valves... would have put money on only 2.
I was at the USS Stewart a day ago but the engine room was locked I didn't even know that it had this engine for the generator I just knew that it had a couple of Fairbanks Morse opposed piston 2 stroke diesels for the main engines I do know that the USS Cavalla submarine next door has four Cleveland diesel 267 V16 2 strokes
Thanks for watching. Stewart has 4 generators. Two like this and two 3 cylinder 268a series.
One presumes the engine was first striped down, carefully inspected and rebuilt before hand? But that's great it fired up pretty much right away.
Over about a 2 and a half year period I inspected, repaired, and rebuilt the necessary components to get the engine running. The biggest issues were actually the auxiliary systems supporting the engine such as piping, pumps, and the start air compressor. The injectors and engine blower were rebuilt by me on the ship as well.
Thanks for watching!
@@FixAndForget Sterling effort! Well done
@@bmused55 Thanks boss!