Excellent breakdown. This illuminates why owning one's own airplane is not for just anyone. It isn't now and it wasn't sixty years ago when I started flying. In reality, it's probably more of a hobby that can be useful, and like any hobby, it's probably going to be more expensive than a person expects/hopes it to be. To really be able to afford to fly regularly, it takes at least a slightly upper middle class income (without a lot of side debt). As for "flying was cheaper back then", I'm not all that sure that it was. For comparison, I'll use minimum wage then and now as a guide. Back when I first started flying the minimum wage was .75/hr. and a Cherokee rented for $18/hr. That amounts to rental being twenty four times minimum wage. I think that minimum wage is currently $7.25/hr. times twenty four is $174.00. I just checked at a local flight school and their rate for an Archer is $160/hr. Those numbers are relatively near the same.
That's a great numbers, but they are just in a vacuum. People's main expenses now are on housing. If you look at the difference in income and housing costs, it is now many times greater than before. People just have less money for "hobby". That's the point
@@danielrossy7453 Even this comment by me is a "floater" of sorts. I realize that folks now have less money for a hobby percentage-wise than they did back then. One might also look at what we now do with the money that we have. Back then, I had no phone. I had no cable television. I had no internet (naturally). I also couldn't have begun to afford a mortgage on a home at whatever the rate was then. A few years after the period I'm mentioning, I see that it hit 18.63%. What I did do was buy an older small mobile home and park it where my lot rent was covered by my working for the farmer on my only "day off". In reality, my biggest expense by far was my housing cost. I simply paid for it indirectly (for the lot) and directly by the note on the mobile home. Flying for most of us is a hobby that takes money that would otherwise be spent for something else. I fit into that group where the expense of flying is not really a realistic activity long term. I might be able to afford it for a short time, but not for long. It's simply a choice for me now and when it becomes too expensive or foolish financially, then I will cease doing it.
Daniel. I hope that I didn't leave the impression that I could actually afford flying. I'm only playing with it for a short time while looking over my shoulder for the inevitable visit by the grim reaper. It's likely that he's becoming a bit impatient at waiting. If he doesn't get busy, I'm going to be tapped out before he serves notice.
@@ytorwoody Thank you for your message. I truly appreciate your honesty and the humor you bring to such a topic. It's inspiring to see you embracing your passion for flying, even if just for a short time. Your positive attitude is something we can all learn from. Wishing you all the best and hoping you continue to find joy in every moment.
The rule of thumb I've been told was unless you are flying more than 80-100 hours a year, you are better off renting. A flying club or fractional ownership would surely bring these down. I think what is shows is that unless you will fly a lot - more than 100+ hours a year - sole ownership is not cost effective. Do you allow sale/leaseback at your flight school? I know some do this, e.g. you buy the plane and lease it to the flight school as a way of spreading out the fixed costs. $100-$125/hour then would be reasonable (e.g. what you pay to fly, all-up)?
That is true, one thing I didn't mention in the video is that the planes tend to hold their value well so you can typically recapture the purchase price at least. We do not do lease backs, it's a creative solution but less than ideal for all parties involved. There are some who do well with buying a plane and building time and then selling. However some may find it difficult to find a consistent CFI, keep the plane out of maintenance, and to manage their own training program. Bottom line is airplanes are expensive! If you are going to buy a plane the best thing you can do is find someone who has done it before and ask for their help/advice.
@@pilotessentials "planes tend to hold their value well" Yes, I think this would have been good to point out, as you mention. FWIW, overall this is a very informative video and it's good to see some realistic numbers out there.
You forgot the random AD that grounds your plane for part availability and the 12K to do the work. Not to mention subscriptions like gps and forefight.
Do airports charge a fee for landing? Do states or counties charge a fee for flying? Does the FAA charge a fee for flying? Is it possible to randomly fly just because above your hometown?
Actually, multi-engine vs single engine piston vs turbo-prop would make a good next video. Trade-offs between speed vs cost per hour, but also cost per mile. For instance, if I'd fly from KSNA to KRBD with the family, it would take a long time in a cheap (per hour) but slow plane like a Cessna 152, but it would go a lot quicker and therefore maybe cheaper overall in a faster plane, even if the cost per hour is higher due to higher fuel burn and higher maintenance costs.
You are definitely correct in the miles per seat costs of smaller aircraft. As a rough guess for cross-country, my C-150 will burn 6 GPH at 90 MPH. So two people get 30 miles per gallon each. A Cessna C-172 or a Piper Cherokee/Warrior will need 9 GPH or so at about 125 MPH. That puts the 4 seats getting almost 55 miles per gallon each. A six place Bonanza will use 12 GPH (approximately) and travel at 165 MPH or better. That makes each seat get almost 83 miles per gallon. Unless you have a very, very small family and don't mind short hops, a C-150 is a pretty poor choice for long distance travel, no matter what the final cost is. Not only are your miles per seat somewhat more expensive, your time spent on the ground refueling, stretching, waiting for the weather, etc. becomes significant. Not only that, when the winds are not in your favor, a 60 MPH ground speed is not unusual. That means more stops, and a significant rise in trip expense. I really enjoy having a C-150, but I am also very realistic about its capabilities. It was all that I could "almost" afford, and feel blessed to know that it's mine.
I would ask about the $18.50 hr engine cost as it looks like that presumes a zero time engine at purchase and 2000 hours obtained prior to OVH. "If" you already have 500 or 1000 hours on the engine at purchase you might need a little higher reserve than $18.50. Not expert advice as I am not an owner but I have received multiples of hours in 172's trading maintenance and annuals for flight time. A different route than ownership for sure.
I was a licensed pilot for 40 years and I can honestly say, I would never recommend folks purchase a plane- unless you are very wealthy- I rented a plane, I never owned.
What if you buy a plane and rent it out for other pilots that need for instance to making flying hours to get at least the minimum that is required. You can also have pilots that want to earn some money and fly with passengers and need a plane for that so they pay you a hourly fee so you can earn a littlebit each time to cover costs. If you buy a more modern plane with digital screens and Garmin 1000 I assume you can fly IFR with ILS instead only VFR flying with a typical 172. Buying a much more modern Cessna can be very expensive but I think if you also rent it out many pilots will use it for training flights. So instead you make a huge investment and pay yearly a lot of money for maybe 100 flying hours. Is owning and automatically renting out the best solution to keep the costs at a bare minimum? You want at the end not only the fixed costs back but also a profit. I would prefer going for flying a Cessna with Garmin 1000 so you have much more awareness where you fly. You can make a flight plans, fly even if the weather isn't great at some sectors and you can trust your instrument's to get not lost because planning and using only paper cards and something happens if you are at an unfamiliar place if you take for instance a long 5 hour flight. So a Cessna equipped with modern equipment and using a Flypad you don't have to be afraid if reading a paper chart isn't your strongest point where navigation is a very important point to be able to fly. But relying somewhat on what you have is not the biggest deal isn't it?
Hello! I don't personally do instruction except for our CFI classes occasionally. Parrish Aviation is our flight school though if you are interested in instruction, our CFI team is fantastic!
Hey Ben! great question. It was a super hard decision to make but ultimately I felt that focusing on building my own business was going to better suit my desires for a career than working as an airline pilot. It's not a decision I took lightly and it's definitely not a decision everybody should make, but I get to be home at night with my family, work on my own schedule, and build a business that positively impacts my local community.
hi, I am a young lover of planes I have a question can u be a pilot that flight commercial airlines. and own a private Cessna 172 because. me and my dad were. investigating and commercial pilots flight 102 days a year so in the spare time can u fly a Cessna? 👍 (edited) so then u get over 2000 flight hours how much is that cost
We can make a video on that in the future. Big things to look for are Air Frame Total Time (AFTT), Engine time (SMOH), read through the maintenance logs and make sure there is nothing missing from the date of manufacture and that the plane has been maintained properly. Be careful if it has not flown for long periods of time. Get a title search, get a pre-buy inspection, do a test flight before you close the deal. If it's your first time, it would be a good idea to find someone who has done it before to advise you through the process. Hope that helps!
![SAFEPLANET - ดาวเคราะห์ [ THE PLANET ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4X1XL3I_k3c/mqdefault.jpg)
Great video, in many ways this video helps keep you....grounded 😅 in your decision making process.
Good one! Haha
Excellent breakdown. This illuminates why owning one's own airplane is not for just anyone. It isn't now and it wasn't sixty years ago when I started flying. In reality, it's probably more of a hobby that can be useful, and like any hobby, it's probably going to be more expensive than a person expects/hopes it to be. To really be able to afford to fly regularly, it takes at least a slightly upper middle class income (without a lot of side debt).
As for "flying was cheaper back then", I'm not all that sure that it was. For comparison, I'll use minimum wage then and now as a guide. Back when I first started flying the minimum wage was .75/hr. and a Cherokee rented for $18/hr. That amounts to rental being twenty four times minimum wage. I think that minimum wage is currently $7.25/hr. times twenty four is $174.00. I just checked at a local flight school and their rate for an Archer is $160/hr. Those numbers are relatively near the same.
That's a great numbers, but they are just in a vacuum. People's main expenses now are on housing. If you look at the difference in income and housing costs, it is now many times greater than before. People just have less money for "hobby". That's the point
@@danielrossy7453 Even this comment by me is a "floater" of sorts. I realize that folks now have less money for a hobby percentage-wise than they did back then. One might also look at what we now do with the money that we have. Back then, I had no phone. I had no cable television. I had no internet (naturally). I also couldn't have begun to afford a mortgage on a home at whatever the rate was then. A few years after the period I'm mentioning, I see that it hit 18.63%. What I did do was buy an older small mobile home and park it where my lot rent was covered by my working for the farmer on my only "day off". In reality, my biggest expense by far was my housing cost. I simply paid for it indirectly (for the lot) and directly by the note on the mobile home.
Flying for most of us is a hobby that takes money that would otherwise be spent for something else. I fit into that group where the expense of flying is not really a realistic activity long term. I might be able to afford it for a short time, but not for long. It's simply a choice for me now and when it becomes too expensive or foolish financially, then I will cease doing it.
@@ytorwoody cool story! I think it's still there - you should be homeless to afford flying :)
Daniel. I hope that I didn't leave the impression that I could actually afford flying. I'm only playing with it for a short time while looking over my shoulder for the inevitable visit by the grim reaper. It's likely that he's becoming a bit impatient at waiting. If he doesn't get busy, I'm going to be tapped out before he serves notice.
@@ytorwoody Thank you for your message. I truly appreciate your honesty and the humor you bring to such a topic. It's inspiring to see you embracing your passion for flying, even if just for a short time. Your positive attitude is something we can all learn from.
Wishing you all the best and hoping you continue to find joy in every moment.
Bought a new one. Love it! Highly recommend owning a personal aircraft!
Totally agree! What do you primarily use yours for?
@@pilotessentialsI should clarify it was not a cessna 172, but I use my 2023 Vashon Ranger for charity flight missions such as Pilots N Paws mission.
The rule of thumb I've been told was unless you are flying more than 80-100 hours a year, you are better off renting. A flying club or fractional ownership would surely bring these down. I think what is shows is that unless you will fly a lot - more than 100+ hours a year - sole ownership is not cost effective.
Do you allow sale/leaseback at your flight school? I know some do this, e.g. you buy the plane and lease it to the flight school as a way of spreading out the fixed costs. $100-$125/hour then would be reasonable (e.g. what you pay to fly, all-up)?
That is true, one thing I didn't mention in the video is that the planes tend to hold their value well so you can typically recapture the purchase price at least.
We do not do lease backs, it's a creative solution but less than ideal for all parties involved.
There are some who do well with buying a plane and building time and then selling. However some may find it difficult to find a consistent CFI, keep the plane out of maintenance, and to manage their own training program.
Bottom line is airplanes are expensive!
If you are going to buy a plane the best thing you can do is find someone who has done it before and ask for their help/advice.
@@pilotessentials "planes tend to hold their value well" Yes, I think this would have been good to point out, as you mention. FWIW, overall this is a very informative video and it's good to see some realistic numbers out there.
You forgot the random AD that grounds your plane for part availability and the 12K to do the work.
Not to mention subscriptions like gps and forefight.
Do airports charge a fee for landing? Do states or counties charge a fee for flying? Does the FAA charge a fee for flying? Is it possible to randomly fly just because above your hometown?
Really good video! Thanks for sharing
Actually, multi-engine vs single engine piston vs turbo-prop would make a good next video. Trade-offs between speed vs cost per hour, but also cost per mile. For instance, if I'd fly from KSNA to KRBD with the family, it would take a long time in a cheap (per hour) but slow plane like a Cessna 152, but it would go a lot quicker and therefore maybe cheaper overall in a faster plane, even if the cost per hour is higher due to higher fuel burn and higher maintenance costs.
You are definitely correct in the miles per seat costs of smaller aircraft. As a rough guess for cross-country, my C-150 will burn 6 GPH at 90 MPH. So two people get 30 miles per gallon each. A Cessna C-172 or a Piper Cherokee/Warrior will need 9 GPH or so at about 125 MPH. That puts the 4 seats getting almost 55 miles per gallon each. A six place Bonanza will use 12 GPH (approximately) and travel at 165 MPH or better. That makes each seat get almost 83 miles per gallon.
Unless you have a very, very small family and don't mind short hops, a C-150 is a pretty poor choice for long distance travel, no matter what the final cost is. Not only are your miles per seat somewhat more expensive, your time spent on the ground refueling, stretching, waiting for the weather, etc. becomes significant. Not only that, when the winds are not in your favor, a 60 MPH ground speed is not unusual. That means more stops, and a significant rise in trip expense.
I really enjoy having a C-150, but I am also very realistic about its capabilities. It was all that I could "almost" afford, and feel blessed to know that it's mine.
I would ask about the $18.50 hr engine cost as it looks like that presumes a zero time engine at purchase and 2000 hours obtained prior to OVH. "If" you already have 500 or 1000 hours on the engine at purchase you might need a little higher reserve than $18.50. Not expert advice as I am not an owner but I have received multiples of hours in 172's trading maintenance and annuals for flight time. A different route than ownership for sure.
you made it look so easy
I was a licensed pilot for 40 years and I can honestly say, I would never recommend folks purchase a plane- unless you are very wealthy- I rented a plane, I never owned.
It is like aviation trys to push out the working man/women owning a plane.
hi Pilot,
you rock and you are really helping there, take care of yourself
ciao,
Farid
What if you buy a plane and rent it out for other pilots that need for instance to making flying hours to get at least the minimum that is required. You can also have pilots that want to earn some money and fly with passengers and need a plane for that so they pay you a hourly fee so you can earn a littlebit each time to cover costs.
If you buy a more modern plane with digital screens and Garmin 1000 I assume you can fly IFR with ILS instead only VFR flying with a typical 172. Buying a much more modern Cessna can be very expensive but I think if you also rent it out many pilots will use it for training flights. So instead you make a huge investment and pay yearly a lot of money for maybe 100 flying hours. Is owning and automatically renting out the best solution to keep the costs at a bare minimum? You want at the end not only the fixed costs back but also a profit.
I would prefer going for flying a Cessna with Garmin 1000 so you have much more awareness where you fly. You can make a flight plans, fly even if the weather isn't great at some sectors and you can trust your instrument's to get not lost because planning and using only paper cards and something happens if you are at an unfamiliar place if you take for instance a long 5 hour flight. So a Cessna equipped with modern equipment and using a Flypad you don't have to be afraid if reading a paper chart isn't your strongest point where navigation is a very important point to be able to fly. But relying somewhat on what you have is not the biggest deal isn't it?
Great video. Would like to know what your cost are if I wanted to hire you for about a one hour flight (I'm in DFW).
Hello! I don't personally do instruction except for our CFI classes occasionally. Parrish Aviation is our flight school though if you are interested in instruction, our CFI team is fantastic!
Great info. I'm curious though... if you don't mind sharing. Why the switch from the airlines to flights cool owner?
Hey Ben! great question. It was a super hard decision to make but ultimately I felt that focusing on building my own business was going to better suit my desires for a career than working as an airline pilot. It's not a decision I took lightly and it's definitely not a decision everybody should make, but I get to be home at night with my family, work on my own schedule, and build a business that positively impacts my local community.
hi, I am a young lover of planes I have a question can u be a pilot that flight commercial airlines. and own a private Cessna 172 because. me and my dad were. investigating and commercial pilots flight 102 days a year so in the spare time can u fly a Cessna? 👍 (edited) so then u get over 2000 flight hours how much is that cost
So, basically... It's cheaper to rent.
?
Where do you look to get hanger space. I am a student in your school and looking to buy a plane.
Great video
Thanks!
Could be a Toy for some or an asset for other. Either way these are the numbers.
How do you know if the Cessna you're looking to buy is actually a good deal? Do you have any advice on buying a used plane?
We can make a video on that in the future. Big things to look for are Air Frame Total Time (AFTT), Engine time (SMOH), read through the maintenance logs and make sure there is nothing missing from the date of manufacture and that the plane has been maintained properly. Be careful if it has not flown for long periods of time. Get a title search, get a pre-buy inspection, do a test flight before you close the deal. If it's your first time, it would be a good idea to find someone who has done it before to advise you through the process. Hope that helps!
@@pilotessentials would like to see this video in the near future.
Not too many people can afford this cost! Here in Canada the cost is much much more!
Wait…. The engine overhaul is nearly $40,000?
Yes we just received one back this week, it was $45k
@@pilotessentials sheeesh man! Well, renting isn’t all that bad, is it? 😂
You didn’t mention the taxes after purchasing the aircraft.
And there goes my hopes😂
Cheaper to rent !
Flying 100 hours costs only 4k more than flying 50? Damn. Get out and fly!
Really how does any middle class common working person afford flying/owning a plan???
Can't! It's unaffordable now.
This video is a carrot for his $249 aircraft buyer videos. Make you know its a marketing gimmick
Way lower than actual...