Same..... Im a 64 year old non binary lesbian. I feel this. Can't wait to read the book. I was exmo way before there was ever a community to offer support. So glad to see people come together.
As a missionary long ago, we were told if the Mountain Meadows Massacre comes up when we were teaching a contact, "you shut your mouths, get them back on the discussions, or leave". It was that moment I realized that there is a lot of disingenuousness at work by the leaders and authorities of the church. People like Quinn and you guys, and so many others verify the lies that underpin the secret workings of the church. I thank you for this.
I'm laughing and crying my way through this book, I was fortunate to meet DM Quinn, he loved hearing my drag stories.. doing shows on Saturday Nights to raise money for the HIV/AIDS Community then going to Church the next morning...wondering if I have any makeup residue still left on my face. Liquid eyeliner is impossible to remove! Lol Thank you for sharing MS! Big Hugs!
My mother often says, "Ad hoc ergo proptor hoc." Correlation does not equal causation. I had no idea it was a rare thing to say because I heard it a lot. She encouraged questioning everything...except the Mormon church, of course. She was at BYU about the same time as Quinn so make of that what you will. Thank heavens she saw the light about age 60 and followed 4 of her 5 children out of the church.
Regarding Quinn not revealing to his soon-to-be wife of his homosexuality, many Mormon leaders would counsel men dealing with issues of being gay not to say anything to anyone about being gay, especially to a young women he may be considering for marriage. That is what I was counseled and I know of others given that same counsel.
It was what I was counseled to do too. The stake president told me sex with a woman was so wonderful it would change me. So why scare her off? Thankfully I knew he was wrong and I never married. But plenty of men did. The church is responsible for many broken homes. Many suicides.
His book Mormon & The Magic World View changed my life. I found the book in the 1990s in a public library while browsing. If I only had 1 book to read for the rest of my life, this would be it.
I've been looking forward to this episode since I saw the notification of its drop. Can't wait to jump in. The history of the church is a part of deconstruction that broke my heart (and I'm sure thousands more) I had already lost my faith before I dug into studying the history so I'm eternally grateful for MS and many others who are willing to discuss the uncomfortable history.
WOW! ----What a great interview. I'm not LDS, but my best friend is. I have ordered this book as a gift for him. I am still a Bible believing Christian, and am saddened by how few who leave the LDS church discover a faith in Jesus Christ as Savior or a deep relationship with Him. It would be great to interview someone who has left the LDS church and found a new Faith elsewhere. Thankyou and I will continue to support your channel.
I think what is so moving about this is his beautiful writing, deep thinking, and the self reflection of his conflict. I definitely want to read this book.
I used to live near the Mormon Temple this channel is a great way for me to challenge those kids that try to recruit for the cult. Also I. Point it calls itself the Mormon Temple of Toronto and is in the suburbs. I've been there 3 times and was creeped out by how they all tried to recruit for MLMs each time too.
In my youth in Utah in the 1970’s (I’m not LDS) the term Lamanite was used freely in conversation with my Mormon friends. Now it’s seemingly almost a taboo word.
Again another brilliant video, I didn’t know about Michael Quinn when I was in the church, but when I was on my mission in the Arcadia California mission, from 1980-1982. One Saturday when we had a get together for our missionary meeting. Some return missionaries came to it. And told us about “ Adam god doctrines” and that god came down to Mary, to bring about the birth off Jesus. So we had two stories about the church. I was offered a very large book , which to us , was anti Mormonism. But we didn’t take it. Wish I did now ! These guys we’re going around every district missionary meeting on Saturday morning. So everyone got to here about it. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing, I was confused. Four years later my and I left the church.
Another great show. Thank you. Regarding information about post-manifesto polygamy, contact the LDS Family Search Centre, in Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada. Also contact the Lethbridge Public Library and the Cardston Temple Archives. Utah polygamists came to southern Alberta in the late 1870s to continue the practice and settled at Aetna. They evaded joining confederation until 1905-when there were finally enough non-LDS settlers to outnumber them. Some relocated to Bountiful, British Columbia, while others continued the practice in secret well into the 1930s. They began construction on the Cardston Temple in 1914 in order to continue to perform polygamous sealings in secret. The Cardston Temple was dedicated in 1923 by Heber J. Grant. The local Blood and Blackfeet Tribes had an unusual relationship with the Mormon settlers to say the least. Mormon missionaries were teaching the Natives about the Millenarism of Joseph Smith’s D&C 130:14-17. “Chief Wovoka” or Jack Wilson by his English name, taught many tribes to make Ghost Shirts that would repel bullets and to dance the Ghost Dance in order to usher in the reincarnation of Jesus Christ in 1890 as, “…the white Holy Men told him it was soon to come”. -Seeker of Visions, Lame Deer and John Fire, Richard Erodes, page 228. There was also an aggressive adopt a “half-breed” LDS program where the children of local Native women were taken and given to adoptive LDS settlers to raise to lighten their skin through the generations. Which white men impregnated them remains a mystery. Disturbingly, the Native adoptions continued well into the late 20th century within the mainstream LDS church throughout Canada and the US…but that’s a whole new can of Mormon worms.
I'm confused. As ponient as the personal struggle is, if they are already knowledgeable of the falsehood of the faith origins, why the struggle to be accepted by the false leaders ?
Anyone know why D. Michael Quinn named his son Moshe? It’s the Hebrew equivalent of Moses, but DMQ was not to my knowledge a scholar of the Bible or Hebrew.
Wow, D. Michael Quinn found a post-manifesto polygamy book in his local LDS chapel library?! Libraries, even LDS chapel libraries (i.e. extremely low quality libraries), can be dangerous for those too invested in certain narratives.
I am sorry to hear you had a devastating breakup. I don’t know if it will help or not, but listening to the Mormon Stories episodes may help you understand more about your ex especially if religion played a part in the breakup. You can search for specific things like dating outside the Faith or return missionaries or attitudes about marriage. Best wishes.
@fussyrenovator7551 yeah, it was really weird. I mean, like, I was a sociology major in college. I'm open...plus, I'm a bhudist. So? He was so hateful. Why?
Well, isn't there the famous case where a boy killed himself because he felt so guilty about masturbating. Queer or not queer, Mormon teachings can have very negative consequences for the lives of its victims.
Equal Rights Amendment. It was a proposed amendment to the Constitution that would have protected rights for women in the workplace and other arenas of life. It narrowly missed being approved in the late 1970s. A Mormon woman named Sonia Johnson was a vocal supporter of it. She was excommunicated from the church for doing so.
The Equal Right Amendment. For a hot minute, we women were trying to get an amendment to the US Constitution to give equal rights for women (the ability to own property separate from husbands, equal pay for equal work, etc etc. ) unfortunately, it never got the votes to pass.
So may I "gather" from all these videos that these people still "believe" in the LDS church (and its gospel in general, 1st vision, bom, restoration, etc) But just don't agree with some of the people, programs, or administrations and past history?
Wish I could pay attention to what is being said but all I can hear is John BREATHING! I honestly wish so badly that he could learn to breathe quietly. I have misophonia and his loud ass breathing drives me insane. F
@@mormonstories the spirit told me 😂 But for real though, your breathing man.. it’s painful for me. I legit want to listen to the podcast and I’m very interested in what’s being said but every time I hear you inhale it’s like an electric shock and it’s rage inducing. I can only listen in short bursts before it’s too much. Misophonia is a bitch
I really appreciate what John has done for the ex-mormon community. However, I think that you should come back to Jesus Christ. It seems like when people leave the Mormon Church they need something else, and sometimes that's something else is the religion of education.
The Church does such a good job inoculating members against other beliefs. It's hard to latch on to a similar system. You know how they all work at that point.
Disappointed to hear that US Solicitor General, founding BYU law school dean & BYU Pres Rex E Lee (@1:25" mark) was instrumental in writing amicus brief doc that gave GAs rationalization to kill ERA! Read Rex's book Marathon of Faith & purchased several copies for friends & family. Rex's book details his battle w/ cancer. Used to have a lot of respect for Rex. Not so sad now that cancer got him 2nd time, after he relapsed. KARMA.
The quality and quantity of content from Mormon Stories lately is 🔥. So many important stories! Thank you
Same..... Im a 64 year old non binary lesbian. I feel this. Can't wait to read the book. I was exmo way before there was ever a community to offer support. So glad to see people come together.
As a missionary long ago, we were told if the Mountain Meadows Massacre comes up when we were teaching a contact, "you shut your mouths, get them back on the discussions, or leave". It was that moment I realized that there is a lot of disingenuousness at work by the leaders and authorities of the church. People like Quinn and you guys, and so many others verify the lies that underpin the secret workings of the church. I thank you for this.
What is the Mountain Meadows Massacre? This is something I haven't heard about....of course😮😮 😮😮😮😮
Really!?
I'm laughing and crying my way through this book, I was fortunate to meet DM Quinn, he loved hearing my drag stories.. doing shows on Saturday Nights to raise money for the HIV/AIDS Community then going to Church the next morning...wondering if I have any makeup residue still left on my face.
Liquid eyeliner is impossible to remove! Lol
Thank you for sharing MS! Big Hugs!
My mother often says, "Ad hoc ergo proptor hoc." Correlation does not equal causation. I had no idea it was a rare thing to say because I heard it a lot. She encouraged questioning everything...except the Mormon church, of course. She was at BYU about the same time as Quinn so make of that what you will. Thank heavens she saw the light about age 60 and followed 4 of her 5 children out of the church.
Regarding Quinn not revealing to his soon-to-be wife of his homosexuality, many Mormon leaders would counsel men dealing with issues of being gay not to say anything to anyone about being gay, especially to a young women he may be considering for marriage. That is what I was counseled and I know of others given that same counsel.
It was what I was counseled to do too. The stake president told me sex with a woman was so wonderful it would change me. So why scare her off?
Thankfully I knew he was wrong and I never married.
But plenty of men did. The church is responsible for many broken homes. Many suicides.
His book Mormon & The Magic World View changed my life. I found the book in the 1990s in a public library while browsing. If I only had 1 book to read for the rest of my life, this would be it.
Totally, it's a paradigm shifter.
My thoughts as well
I've been looking forward to this episode since I saw the notification of its drop. Can't wait to jump in. The history of the church is a part of deconstruction that broke my heart (and I'm sure thousands more) I had already lost my faith before I dug into studying the history so I'm eternally grateful for MS and many others who are willing to discuss the uncomfortable history.
Much respect for this panel and for Mr. Quinn👏
D. Michael Quinn was a true hero for being so honest and being so true to himself. RIP Mr. Quinn
WOW! ----What a great interview. I'm not LDS, but my best friend is. I have ordered this book as a gift for him. I am still a Bible believing Christian, and am saddened by how few who leave the LDS church discover a faith in Jesus Christ as Savior or a deep relationship with Him. It would be great to interview someone who has left the LDS church and found a new Faith elsewhere. Thankyou and I will continue to support your channel.
Mormon Stories in the past year have been so fun and engaging. Keep up the good work!
Can’t wait for this one. Love these shows.
What’s it about?
I am so excited to read this book. I honestly feel proud of D. Michael Quinn and the life that he lived. A wonderful human. ❤️❤️❤️
I was a student of Michael Quinn. I loved him.
Always watching Mormon Stories because John is the only one who can put me to sleep.
I think what is so moving about this is his beautiful writing, deep thinking, and the self reflection of his conflict. I definitely want to read this book.
I used to live near the Mormon Temple this channel is a great way for me to challenge those kids that try to recruit for the cult. Also I. Point it calls itself the Mormon Temple of Toronto and is in the suburbs. I've been there 3 times and was creeped out by how they all tried to recruit for MLMs each time too.
Brampton Temple
This is such a cool episode. I am dying laughing sometimes with glee. I am totally celebrating a reckoning of the truth coming due. Yay!
Excellent and interesting presentation. Absolutely priceless book.
Love all this! What a remarkable human
Great episode! I am looking forward to reading this book. Its a lighter topic than many.
In my youth in Utah in the 1970’s (I’m not LDS) the term Lamanite was used freely in conversation with my Mormon friends. Now it’s seemingly almost a taboo word.
Just bought it! Will be reading soon!
Great show!!!! Thx!!!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
The scholarship behind Magical World View has no peers
Good morning!!🎉
Again another brilliant video, I didn’t know about Michael Quinn when I was in the church, but when I was on my mission in the Arcadia California mission, from 1980-1982. One Saturday when we had a get together for our missionary meeting. Some return missionaries came to it. And told us about “ Adam god doctrines”
and that god came down to Mary, to bring about the birth off Jesus. So we had two stories about the church. I was offered a very large book , which to us , was anti Mormonism. But we didn’t take it. Wish I did now ! These guys we’re going around every district missionary meeting on Saturday morning. So everyone got to here about it. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing, I was confused. Four years later my and I left the church.
Awesome as usual
Never heard of D Michael Quinn, but his story appears to parallel the story of Elizabeth Smart's dad.
Hey everyone 👋
At apprx 1:03 per historical church leaders "that knew" things:
see EXCELLENT Mormon Stories episode with historian Shannon Caldwell Montez. 👏
I recommend!
Another great show. Thank you. Regarding information about post-manifesto polygamy, contact the LDS Family Search Centre, in Lethbridge, Alberta, Canada. Also contact the Lethbridge Public Library and the Cardston Temple Archives. Utah polygamists came to southern Alberta in the late 1870s to continue the practice and settled at Aetna. They evaded joining confederation until 1905-when there were finally enough non-LDS settlers to outnumber them. Some relocated to Bountiful, British Columbia, while others continued the practice in secret well into the 1930s. They began construction on the Cardston Temple in 1914 in order to continue to perform polygamous sealings in secret. The Cardston Temple was dedicated in 1923 by Heber J. Grant.
The local Blood and Blackfeet Tribes had an unusual relationship with the Mormon settlers to say the least. Mormon missionaries were teaching the Natives about the Millenarism of Joseph Smith’s D&C 130:14-17. “Chief Wovoka” or Jack Wilson by his English name, taught many tribes to make Ghost Shirts that would repel bullets and to dance the Ghost Dance in order to usher in the reincarnation of Jesus Christ in 1890 as, “…the white Holy Men told him it was soon to come”.
-Seeker of Visions, Lame Deer and John Fire, Richard Erodes, page 228.
There was also an aggressive adopt a “half-breed” LDS program where the children of local Native women were taken and given to adoptive LDS settlers to raise to lighten their skin through the generations. Which white men impregnated them remains a mystery. Disturbingly, the Native adoptions continued well into the late 20th century within the mainstream LDS church throughout Canada and the US…but that’s a whole new can of Mormon worms.
From my atheist plot of view 😮it’s so interesting to listen to your podcasts ❤
I'm confused. As ponient as the personal struggle is, if they are already knowledgeable of the falsehood of the faith origins, why the struggle to be accepted by the false leaders ?
I would like to see this channel address the whole “Moor”man name, and “Moro”ni Angel.
Pint of view ❤ 1:08:03
What??? Apostles no longer allowed to keep journals? Wow!!!!
Could someone please bring me up to speed on who the Tanners are?
Anyone know why D. Michael Quinn named his son Moshe? It’s the Hebrew equivalent of Moses, but DMQ was not to my knowledge a scholar of the Bible or Hebrew.
I was wondering the same thing. Maybe there's a way to directly contact him and see if he ever asked his dad about this?
My word....your hair looks silky, John. ❤
Wow, D. Michael Quinn found a post-manifesto polygamy book in his local LDS chapel library?! Libraries, even LDS chapel libraries (i.e. extremely low quality libraries), can be dangerous for those too invested in certain narratives.
I fell deeply I. Love with a very devout morman. This went on for three years. We broke up. I'm devastated. Is there anyone I can talk to?
You escaped a cult. Feel relieved.
I am sorry to hear you had a devastating breakup. I don’t know if it will help or not, but listening to the Mormon Stories episodes may help you understand more about your ex especially if religion played a part in the breakup. You can search for specific things like dating outside the Faith or return missionaries or attitudes about marriage. Best wishes.
@@jlcl96 morman stories has been a comfort
@fussyrenovator7551 yeah, it was really weird. I mean, like, I was a sociology major in college. I'm open...plus, I'm a bhudist. So? He was so hateful. Why?
John, you don’t seem like yourself. Are you feeling alright?
Well, isn't there the famous case where a boy killed himself because he felt so guilty about masturbating. Queer or not queer, Mormon teachings can have very negative consequences for the lives of its victims.
💞
I think they will either have to change their policy or they won't survive
What is the ERA?
Equal Rights Amendment. It was a proposed amendment to the Constitution that would have protected rights for women in the workplace and other arenas of life. It narrowly missed being approved in the late 1970s. A Mormon woman named Sonia Johnson was a vocal supporter of it. She was excommunicated from the church for doing so.
@@markchollak2784 Thanks for the info!
The Equal Right Amendment. For a hot minute, we women were trying to get an amendment to the US Constitution to give equal rights for women (the ability to own property separate from husbands, equal pay for equal work, etc etc. ) unfortunately, it never got the votes to pass.
So may I "gather" from all these videos that these people still "believe" in the LDS church (and its gospel in general, 1st vision, bom, restoration, etc) But just don't agree with some of the people, programs, or administrations and past history?
Moshe, do you have a sister named Harley?
Wish I could pay attention to what is being said but all I can hear is John BREATHING! I honestly wish so badly that he could learn to breathe quietly. I have misophonia and his loud ass breathing drives me insane. F
How do you know it’s me?
@@mormonstories the spirit told me 😂
But for real though, your breathing man.. it’s painful for me. I legit want to listen to the podcast and I’m very interested in what’s being said but every time I hear you inhale it’s like an electric shock and it’s rage inducing. I can only listen in short bursts before it’s too much.
Misophonia is a bitch
@@mormonstories😂😂
I’ve never even noticed his breathing.. idk about that 😂
I really appreciate what John has done for the ex-mormon community. However, I think that you should come back to Jesus Christ. It seems like when people leave the Mormon Church they need something else, and sometimes that's something else is the religion of education.
John Delin is doing just fine and is happy without being involved in the Mormon Cult Church, thank you.
The Church does such a good job inoculating members against other beliefs. It's hard to latch on to a similar system. You know how they all work at that point.
All you do is preach in the comments where it’s not welcomed and you’re infringing on this space, how disgusting, selfish, and arrogant of you
Disappointed to hear that US Solicitor General, founding BYU law school dean & BYU Pres Rex E Lee (@1:25" mark) was instrumental in writing amicus brief doc that gave GAs rationalization to kill ERA! Read Rex's book Marathon of Faith & purchased several copies for friends & family. Rex's book details his battle w/ cancer. Used to have a lot of respect for Rex. Not so sad now that cancer got him 2nd time, after he relapsed. KARMA.