tiktok, clout, & crime
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 พ.ค. 2023
- Last month a video from Ken Waks came across my for you page talking about how he was almost abducted when leaving a bar. Little did I know it would turn into a multi state murder theory and a plug for his startup Foresyte. Let's talk about how addictive clout can be and how to tank your credibility in a few weeks time.
Update: I got a copyright claim and had to clip out Kens apology tiktok so here it is: www.tiktok.com/@ken/video/723...
/ ken
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www.tiktok.com/@meredithmlync...
www.tiktok.com/@justintimefor...
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#tiktok #kenwaks #swellentertainment - บันเทิง
I miss when true crime was a niche interest that we were ashamed of
Holy shit agreed
I'm in a few death groups, but we don't air this shit out they post some horrendous stuff in those groups.
When was that? True crime as a genre has existed for decades. It was huge on the radio before the TV era...
@@beetothebop123 while it was always sensationalized, previously there wasn’t such a large group of people trying to involve themselves into the crime. Now everyone believes they are a detective.
same
This Guy: I'm publicly investigating a serial killer in my area.
Also This Guy: A stranger knocked on my door in the middle of the night so I opened it.
Right he was like "I didn't recognize him so I without hesitation opened it and started talking to him."
Like if you're gunna lie do a better job than that lmao.
At least say you talked to him through the door or on a intercom.
This is a man who never watched Death Note.
And he nonchalantly gave away where abouts he lived & worked to a massive audience 😬
He really pissed me off with the "they know better than to target women" and "women are too smart to get kidnapped". I know he didn't mean it in a bad way, but it just pushes the idea that women aren't being targeted as much as we actually are, like just because its not in the news women aren't being abducted/assaulted/killed on a daily basis. And it implies that the women who are victims aren't 'smart', and puts the responsibility on them. Again, he didn't mean to say that, but it just shows you need to think before you say stuff like that
yeah, as man I would be too suspicious of why someone was trying to give me a ride. his reasoning doesn't make any sense.
yeah that was such a bad comment. “women are too smart to be kidnapped” ???? bruh
he seems like hes very removed from how “crime” works in general. the video where he said he “cracked the case” ??? this isnt svu
The clear implication that women have gotten used to living in fear and that we're good at avoiding trouble because we're just intrinsically made for this type of lifestyle is... It's Beasts of the Southern Wild level offensive.
EXACTLY, well said
The idea that the police brought in some crime fanfiction goon from tiktok to help them with "mapping" is some of the goofiest sh*t I've ever heard. The guy's whole persona feels like a fake tumblr story.
Couldn't have said it better
the idea that the police wouldn't already know where people went missing/were found and be able to connect patterns too
Yes like for all of the true crime fanatics out there now, or tv shows or movies the police have NO PROBLEM mapping out this stuff. I swear, the Internet should have made people smarter but it’s like the opposite is happening. How can people just believe everything they hear? I’d have thought or hoped most would spot his bullshit from a mile away.
Also my friends and I always had guys in cars trying to pick us up after the bar. That may not be what’s happening here but I also don’t believe everyone claiming it’s happened to them so casually and say nothing about this terrifying thing unless the subject comes up. All of this “I heard…” is just rumour or wanting to feel involved most of the time. And spread misinformation like what happened in my small city.
We had a couple terrible murders where I live. 3 actually but one was deemed an accident until the exhumed the body. And the woman was never charged even though she’s the one who held the chloroform (or similar drug) rag on her face which killed her. The couple videotaped the girls. The woman was on trial first but then a media blackout was put in place to make sure nothing got out and he got a fair trial. What happened to these girls was horrific but the rumors of what were on the tapes were much more depraved and sick then what happened in real life. Like I cannot imagine the family overhearing stuff that put horror movies to shame about your daughter and it’s not real. Just an asshole looking for attention.
the implication that cops can't make... a map is so galling lmao
I feel like if they actually did bring him in it would be on suspicion because he was mapping all the crimes and keeping detailed lists
When women are routinely pushed to take rides with strangers, it's just life. When it happens twice to one guy, it's obviously organized predators who must be stopped.
It's unfair and makes me really sad... 😢
As someone who was legitimately almost murdered on a college campus and reported it to the authorities it was a freaking nightmare having to deal with not only the police publicizing the case but when social media at the time got a hold of it they went crazy because of how strange the incident was. It was terrible because not only do you get harassed and reminded about the assault by the police trying to “help”, but you have news outlets and random people pretending to be investigators or the news trying to contact you and your family for more details. I used to be a fan of true crime content but the jr detectives it spurs out of the woodwork has been something that has made me dislike the genre as a whole.
Damn! I hope you’re okay, it’s really hard to come back from traumatic experiences, I hope you’re doing well. All the best - Elstree.
So sorry you went through that. Not only did you have the trauma of the attempted murder, but so many people wouldn’t just leave you to process and move on as best you could. I can’t even imagine how awful that must’ve been. Thank you for sharing this- more people need to know the impact this shit can have on victims. Best wishes to you.
Oh god i'm so sorry this happened to you! My mother was almost in a mass shooting in an engineering school, like she left right before it happened and the shooter targetted women, and i cant even imagine what it would be like if this had happened today. I hope you're staying safe!
One of the things about Ken’s “story” that should have been an early red flag is all this talk about how useful his mapping was. As somebody who works in local government and uses a lot of GIS/ ESRI mapping most GIS technicians could map that stuff in an afternoon. There’s no way the Chicago police don’t already have a very detailed GIS map for tracking crime scenes. In my office we use GIS to track utilities, permits, property info, etc. Adding some info about crime locations is nothing complicated
Yeah !! I am taking an intro class to ArcGIS and haven’t even finished it, but I would be able to make a much more professional map than him 😂
I was wondering about this, thanks for your insight.
An afternoon? If they(CPD) are running a live version it should take minutes to get a much better map than that. You don't even need ESRI. QGIS is open source and free and basically does the same thing(without the ArcGIS infrastructure).
Was thinking about this!! And even a private investigator could make a map very easily considering it’s all public record, there’s no reason they’d need him
I was gonna say, there has to be a way to move that from a database to a map in moments, and the most they'd be hiring anyone for that would be data entry from paper or various digital sources into one database -- so, an entry-level data entry job...
I'm a criminology grad student and I think a lot of your observations about the "smiley face gang" and trying to create a boogieman were spot on! Honestly one of my biggest problems with true crime content is it can way too quickly devolve into dehumanizing the people who've lost their lives and the loved ones they left behind, so thank you for highlighting them!
there just ... _is smiley face graffiti_ kind of all over.
I love true crime. It feeds that morbid curiosity as well as gives me an idea of what to watch out for in a lot of casea, but I can only listen to the ones that pay respects to the victims and stop making the monsters sound like some book villian. I absolutely HATE it when the person who committed the crime or the murder is talked about in any way other than "this man is horrible and here's why" and the victims are, at best, a second thought...
my mom sorta works with the legal side of cases that are often covered in TC and stuff, and there’s a reason she simply can’t stomach mainstream TC content. When you’re actually forced to listen to families plead and cry for their loved ones and kids back, when you have to sit through the most graphic, uncensored evidence of horrible things being done to people everyday to the point you can’t drink a brand of beverage anymore because it showed up in a child abuse evidence video, when you have to look the perpetrators in their faces and try your best to see them as humans for the sake of the case, etc, content like mainstream TC loses all of its glamour and “omg so spooky!!1!” Charm to it that people love to indulge in for some reason. If only they saw the ugly aftermath of it all rather than gawking at it like empty shock content.
Maybe it’s those sinister “nice guys”?
On your point about people finding comfort in the idea of a serial killer-absolutely. I think this is why a lot of people also fall into the conspiracy theory rabbit hole. It’s easier for us to accept some kind of grand sinister scheme rather than understand that sometimes awful things happen and are completely out of our control. It’s all about trying to reclaim some form of control in our often uncontrollable world
You can apply this to so many conspiracy theories
It's because conspiracy theory is reductionism, in its core. And reductionism is comfortable because it takes complex explanations and complex problems and blames it all on a single thing. Same thing they're doing here
I think a lot of people get into true crume because of the appeal of being "smarter" than all the victims. Which is a terrible way to look at true crime.
Him being like “they came to ME and asked me to join the investigation” gives off “I have a girlfriend who goes just goes to a different school” vibes
Imagine a tech bro calling the tragic death of your son/brother/partner/friend a STORY and CONTENT
I think the reason people would rather it's a serial killer is because one person will eventually die or be arrested but societal problems require systematic solutions which are hard and expensive.
And they might have to admit they could be part of the problem.
@@tatiana4050 yup. THIS is why. Much more than anything else.
@@tatiana4050 or alternately (in the case of fascist orgs), they don’t have to admit something far scarier is on the horizon.
As a Chicagoan there is something weird going on down here I believe. But to go from “this guy is trying to help” to then go “how can I make this profitable” is so horrible.
What do you think is going weird?
@@null9546 Lots of stories of cars trying to "give rides" just hanging outside bars and asking people if they need a ride. Two separate people told me it happened to them, one person it happened twice
@@amandaburton5868 Got it. My sister is moving out to Chicago for college and since we dont know anything about the place other than visiting a few times, trying to learn as much as I can to help her out
@@null9546 Chicago is huge, so depending on where in Chicago she is going you could be in a dense urban area or suburbs and everywhere in between
same, iv been hearing some things from friends on the force. something is going on. theyre not saying anything or making any kind of psa (even just about being safe, not any specifics).
I did have a manic episode a few years ago, where I was convinced there was a dog kidnapping ring in my city and I was obsessively helping find lost dogs. This went on for a couple of months until I was finally able to unfocus my fixation on trying to bring down this kidnapper ring
Deeply glad I don’t use TikTok and it didn’t exist when I was unmedicated and mania was really bad
In my manic episode I believed I was the reincarnation of the virgin Mary. Luckily my craziness was contained in a discord server where my friends realized my delusions and kept me from doing crazy stuff. Social media is terrifying. I couldn't imagine if I had broadcast my illness to the world
My friend had a similar situation with the Champlain Tower collapse. He went so far, he flew to Florida! He was determined to find evidence that it was a terrorist attack. It was awful to watch. He finally snapped out of the mayhem when he caught Covid. That slowed him down to regain control over sensationalism in the news
I remember having a manic episode when I was teen that came about due to those crazy ass conspiracy theories all over the internet. I genuinely believed that pizzagate scandal back in the 2010s and made myself so fucking paranoid. I remember some of those youtubers who revolved their content around it sharing symbols that we needed to be on the lookout for that allegedly child predators used to identify one another and went nuts looking at anything in my town that might be one of those symbols. Fucked me up pretty damn bad. I had to be pulled away from the internet for a few months just to bring myself back down. Needless to say I unsubscribed all those channels.
mine had me being targeted by and escaping serial killers lol i was a literally a god that could outsmart them
Fully agree re the "comfort in serial killers" thing. If it's a horror movie-style villain, you can follow the "rules" and not get harmed or killed.
And once you get rid of him you're okay to feel "safe" again. You never ever have to worry about it anymore 🤩
And it gives a convenient scapegoat for scarier things like COVID and fascist orgs.
If this is anything it's most likely gang related robberies, so a Boogeyman can still easily be established, just not the one white liberals may prefer
I think this is why so many women go through a true crime phase. While you can learn some stuff about protecting yourself from this kind obsession that’s helpful, you can still end up screwed even if you “follow all of the rules.”
People are just so disconnected from reality. They hear about a true crime case and get invested as if it’s a tv show. Meanwhile there are very real victims being affected, yet these people couldn’t care less. It’s gross. It’s weird. And I’ll never understand how excited people get about it all.
I remember seeing people talking about a young woman's murder and that they didn't agree with who the police had brought in because it was so "boring" compared to their theories. Absolutely insane.
@Morley That's so messed up. I watch true crime, but I hate it when people turn it into some reality tv spectacle. These are real victims with people who love and care about what happened to them.
Feels very Only Murders in the Building
I think there are tons of people who consume true crime media to cope with trauma or even try to desensitize themselves after a traumatic event. So many people genuinely care about the victims. It can be comforting to feel that others would've cared or helped if they'd known. There's a lot of bonding and support that happens in respectful creators' comment sections on here.
I'm biased though, and I do think most of it is exploitative. The food ones are soo upsetting.
Can't help but wonder if the craze is as huge in countries with stricter privacy laws, and if it's big here because we're so isolated from each other. Wish there was a way for families to request removal of content about their loved ones or at least remove identifying info.
There does also seem to be a right-wing fear-mongering bias in a lot of true crime content, and it's disgusting imo to see it in comments and reviews. Cycle of abuse type beat.
as someone with bipolar 1 i‘ve noticed that it’s very common for people to say someone might be “having a manic episode” when they want to avoid saying they’re lying & therefore potentially being a bad person. it’s weird & it feeds into this idea that people with mental health stuff going on don’t really understand what they’re doing, which is negatively impactful in all sorts of ways. especially without any evidence i am grateful that you decided not to do this, lol
I think some people would rather believe a person is suffering from mental illness that clouds their judgement, than someone is lying for their own gain. Totally agree that the impacts of this aren’t good
agreed. also, obv i can’t say what was rly happening with him, but to me the likelihood someone is manic vs. a liar is just so low for the former in comparison to the latter. even if BD is under-diagnosed, the number of ppl with it or experiencing mania for any reason is so much lower than the number of ppl running around just straight up lying lol.
i got into a stranger’s car once. i was in an abusive relationship and one night after we left the bars, my ex decided to just drag me down the street by my hair and then took my car keys and my phone and left me stranded in a place i wasn’t familiar with all while i was drunk. long story short i ended up walking kinda where i thought his house was and by this time it was like 4-5am. this man pulled up in a truck next to me and said there was a guy behind me that’s been following me and asked if i needed a ride. this was actually the scariest situation i’ve ever been in because obviously my first thought was “okay, they’re probably working together and they’re doing this to get me in the truck.” then my next thought was “what if they aren’t working together and i’m really being followed by this dude & this is the only chance i have to safety??” THEN i thought “what if i’m not even being followed and this man is just trying to take advantage of me???” .. i literally had all of those thoughts in the span of like 5 seconds. i ended up just trusting him and i got in his truck and he drove me to my ex’s house so i could get my shit and go home. that’s the only time i’ve ever done that. i was 21! so young and so scared. i’m 26 now and i think about that time often. there’s SO many ways that scenario could’ve played out. it truly is scary being a young woman out alone. i’m just blessed that i haven’t ended up in a horrible situation bc i used to go out alone all the time.
that sounds so scary and I'm glad you got back safely. We all do dumb shit and its so hard to look back on in hindsight, especially if we did the dumbshit under the influence of alcohol or adrenaline or drugs. I was trying to figure out how if I were in a similar situation (as you or the truck driver), it would feel safe. The truck driver could have called the non-emergency police as soon as he saw you were being followed. And then allowed you to borrow his phone to call the police back yourself or call a ride. And then stayed with you however you both felt comfortable until a ride arrived. We don't all get it right but hopefully this thought helps a passerby who sees a stranger in potential distress.
@@kathrynsteller oh wow. that’s such a smart idea!!! i wish i would’ve thought of that back then 😭 thank you for commenting this!!! i also hope it can help someone either in my past position, or someone just trying to help. i didn’t even think about calling the cops or anything i just wanted to get back home & go to sleep. i eventually pressed charges on my ex for a different situation and he got 2 years in jail so i guess that’s something.
I’m glad you’re safe ❤️
@@DiMagnolia thank you!🥹💕
I'm soo glad you're okay!! Please don't be hard on yourself over it. You were most likely in fight or flight and you were surrounded with dangerous options. I'm impressed you were able to think of some possible consequences! The stress hormones our bodies release literally affect our ability to think clearly. We will always wish we handled things better but in reality we handled it to the best of our ability at the time. ❤
I'm so sorry you were with someone that caused you to go through that. You deserve so much better!
the police would never, and i mean NEVER, work with someone who is posting live updates about an investigation. it is so dangerous on multiple levels to post the things he does, and i know no police department would be a part of it. they may have asked to see his data, or at least given him a conversation, but this man is absolutely not involved to the level he thinks he is.
True crime is vapid comfort material. Its easier to think about serial killers that can be categorized as ‘singular evil’ instead of things more obviously caused by deep systemic issues like mass shootings, school shootings, patriarchy, poverty, capitalism, and r*pe culture.
👆🏽
Yeah, but you can’t then turn real ongoing investigations into a boogie man story just because it’s easier to accept than the potential of other truths. Which is seemingly what this guy has done
Unless it's those damn illegal immigrants!! (/sarcasm)
I think it also has a certain "not in my backyard" factor because it's like "woah i can't believe that this person had terrible things done to them... Not me tho. I'm fine. That wouldn't happen to me" or "that wouldn't happen to me because i know how this happens"
bloody oath mate
I don't think it's just a lack of critical thinking; Clout Chasing/Main Character Syndrome conditions people to only look inward, and they're so blindsided by it that they don't realise the implications of their actions, or the effect it has on others.
I genuinely think this guy thinks he's the only one who can solve the case, so much so that he'll completely upend a professional investigation to do it.
totally agree, it reminds me of the Tiffany Ferg video that came out yesterday that made me feel hella uncomfortable. it's so weird seeing people who should be aware completely risk the safety of others for views.
@@emschlef omg I thought I was going crazy because I was going to comment on it and the video I had just watched wasn't there, and she hadn't said anything about it and I got so confused!
@@emschlefwait, what Tiffany ferg video? Did she spread misinformation? Or was she talking about someone who did?
Reminds me of when they went after Jeffrey Marsh. Which is probably still going on for all I know. Over NOTHING (other than being queer, of course)
@@unouni2548 The comments were overwhelming negative so I'm not surprised.
The amount of people on Tiktok who were defending him and praising him was insane! If anyone called him out their comment section would be full of people saying “well at least he’s doing something. You’re just sitting at home doing nothing.” His comment section was full of people telling him he’s a good person and he should be hired by the police. I was baffled to say the least.
He's causing harm. Doing nothing is better than doing shit that causes harm.
I honestly think it’s because so many people on tiktok are YOUNG. Not that only young people will fall for this, but I definitely think people with less education and life experience - and kids fit that description - are more likely to fall for this kind of thing and completely ignore any common sense or argument against it. Especially if they become a fan of the creator and feel they have some personal stake in defending his character. They don’t understand that the “something” he’s doing - spreading bullshit on tiktok - is *at best* nothing, and at worst actively harmful.
Also tiktok is just absolutely rife with misinformation in general, which doesn’t help.
similar to how mr beast fans react when you point out the flaws in his charitable actions, it's annoying as hell
Sometimes things need to be left to the professionals. You know, like *active police investigations*
@@caitlynr7295 I agree. I think older people are just as likely to fall for this crap, they’re just not (on average) doing so on TikTok.
I HATE when people immediately start taking about serial killers when there’s almost always like. Absolutely no evidence that there is a serial killer. Someone I knew was murdered and it was being talked about all over and all anyone would do was try to make her death into a serial killer case. It was like no one cared that she was dead, just that something that they thought was interesting might be going on.
The fact that he's going after people talking about his story proves he does not feel he did anything wrong, but instead apologized because he got bad press.
Seriously his apology was "sorry I got too invested."
My guy that was NOT the problem
I know someone that accepted a ride home from a bar, and when the driver found out this person wasnt the gender they thought they were, they stabbed her in the chest, and punched her in the face so hard she needed reconstructive surgery. Thankfully she was able to escape the vehicle at a red light, and got immediate medical attention. It was really, really sad though.
As a trans guy this scares me so much, it’s something we have to fear all the time and in my old job I just had to go along when dudes thought I was a woman and hit on me because they would turn violent if I tried to explain otherwise. Not having had too surgery while having been on T for a long time it’s difficult because people can’t tell my gender so they get angry often.
❤ sending love and healing to you and your friend 💛🌼
I just will never understand how clueless someone would have to be to take a ride from an absolute stranger. It's beyond well documented many instances where people usually women got kidnapped, assulted and/or murdered. I guess if you're sheltered enough you would never think something like that can happen to you. It is horrible what happen to your friend and people shouldn't have to experience such tragedy to learn the world has many nasty people who will do unthinkable things.
This sadly happens quite a bit. I'm in LA and we've had some crimes like this before but the LAPD keeps it fairly hush hush if I had not been in Stonewall I don't think I would have heard about some of these murders. Also I find out these types of hate crimes are under reported largely because they don't list it as such on the police report and since they're listed usually as the gender they were assigned reading through the reports isn't always clear. There was a whole group investigating this a few years back to try to get accurate numbers. I'd say most of the US probably under reports these crimes along with most sexual assault crimes.
Why were they accepting rides from strangers in the first place? That seems like the first rule of going anywhere: don't get into a stranger's car.
the "comfort serial killer" thing is so real. I live in a city with a river running right through the center of it including the area where all the bars are. Plenty of people will walk home by the river every night and every once in a while someone will fall or jump in and later be found drowned. There is a persistent urban legend of a serial killer deliberately pushing people in and I can see how that is a less scary thought. A single culpable person can be done away with, but losing your footing while intoxicated with no one around to see or hear can't.
There is a man on tiktok who has gained a following claiming these killings are a network of serial killers. I know exactly where you are talking about. The river isn't exactly hard to access from the sidewalk
We have had two young men go missing within 6 months of each other in relative location in minnesota this past year and the comments were going into conspiracy immediately. Claiming it’s the smiley face killers. Disregarding the fact that both men had been drinking before going home alone. It’s infuriating and I cannot imagine what those families go through reading nonstop nonsense while their worlds are falling apart.
I’ve heard POC creators talk about a serial killer in Chicago long before this guy came along. They always put the family and victims first and focused on calling out the incompetence of the system
Exactly. The "smiley face killer" is more urban legend than confirmed serial killer, but other people have been covering it for years, and many of them maintain a mindful and respectful coverage for the families who've lost loved ones. It's crazy to me when people only want to sensationalize a story that has impacted real people.
Honestly, seems like a good place to be a serial killer. Lot of murders seemed to go unsolved there
I'm not completely convinced about the whole smiley face killer thing, but yes there's very likely a serial killer or a group going after young black girls here. Its been going and getting pretty much no attention. The men turning up in rivers now i think is separate. Totally separate typical description of those victims but the age/sex/demographic of the men being found is all somewhat similar
My family is from Chicago and for scope, though my great grandmother is alive and I have been to Chicago…I have never met her. It’s understood the neighborhood she lives people can’t just drive in as it’s a territory populated with organized crime groups. My parents literally built their family with the concept, “We will not live in Chicago.” It’s way more complicated then that but that’s all I can or will really say. But we are working class people of color, the dangers this guy just now noticed about highly populated areas of extreme economic disparity…we’ve been well aware.
@@AnABSOLUTEBarbarian Have you ever been able to talk to her? Like through phone or email? Does she know you exist? Sorry for all the questions, it's just crazy to me that you can't just go and see her 😅
I don’t believe much in tiktok anymore. Anytime i see something like this i immediately call bullshit and ignore it.
There’s something about tiktok that seems to spawn and propagate wild (relatively, in the grand scheme) low-stakes conspiracies
Bullshit until proven factual is the best way to deal with claims made on TikTok and Twitter. Everything is automatically fake or a lie to me until enough evidence can prove its legitimacy
Same I’ve been off that app for a while now bc of nonsense like this.
I’m quite lucky I’ve never actually been on the app. So when I hear about stuff like this, it’s all new to me.
i went through the same thing with tumblr some years ago. after that experience, it made me very nervous to see people using tiktok as a news source! glad to see you've had a change of heart
what gets me is that there are a lot of missing people in these states and counties. but nobody is willing to be realistic about the losses in any capacity. its always blamed on some sort of serial killer or a sex trafficking ring or a gang, when in reality people go missing for dozens of reasons. like you said, there are just random acts of cruelty in the world. its sad, and harsh, but true. not everything is organized crime. not everything is solved with one swish of a wand and the arrest of a single individual. thats not how the world works.
Thank you for bringing up the woman man differences because I legit rolled my eyes when I saw him talk about being invited for a ride when that happens to every girl ever way more than twice lmao I didn’t say anything because I didn’t want everyone to get mad at me, but like I really couldn’t stand watching everyone comfort him and pat him on the back but when it happens to women it’s always “oh my god I would never leave a bar alone” and “you need to watch your drinking if your leaving early!” “That happened to me once, that’s the last time I wear headphones outside ha” etc etc etc and it never bothered me really until now watching everyone coddle him.
I'm with you, was having the same feeling!
I seriously cant imagine how some people are so CARELESS. I will accidentally bump into someone in the grocery store, apologize, and then go on to eventually think about them and i hope i didnt ruin their day lol.
THANK YOU for bringing up how the police not disclosing every detail of an active investigation IS CRUCIAL TO THE INVESTIGATION. i am very rarely on the side of police, but when these tiktok detectives start going "the poilce aren't telling us enough of what they know!!" HAVE YOU CONSIDERED THAT THAT IS BECAUSE THEY CAN'T HAVE THE PERPETRATOR KNOW WHAT THEY KNOW??? some people are so entitled it makes them straight up stupid
Went on a date with a guy- he wanted me to meet his sister and said he’d drive. I politely said I’d rather drive myself. He asked why- genuinely confused- and I explained. He was horrified and we drove separate cars to the lunch spot. His sister (she basically raised him) was super sweet. We didn’t end up on another date but we’re friends to this day
Thought I’d share a nice story to cut through some of the scares
I think your serial killer analogy is actually brilliant.
It makes total sense, and this is how we usually end up, unfortunately, with scapegoats in our culture- _if all our fears_ and anxieties can be laid at the feet of one single boogeyman, it's MUCH easier to digest than a deep-seated character flaw simmering _undetectable_ within many men: misogyny and the capacity to hurt women.
Right.
The podcast "You're Wrong About" talks about the comfort in serial killers alot in alot of their episodes about serial killers, moral panics, and criminal justice. I highly highly recommend
as someone who lived in chicago and has had people try to pick them up for a ride in broad daylight, ken's content always seemed sus to me bc the whole ploy of asking someone for a ride (and happens to both men and women) has gone on for a very long time and it seemed ridiculous to think it was the work of a serial killer or anything esp since the argument is that bc their bodies get dumped in the lake or river whereas anyone that knows things about stats or crime knows a) serial killers are not very common and even the ones we know about are rarely confirmable (like its rly hard to tell how many victims a given killer has) b) drowning is a lot more common than ppl realize and esp when ppl are drunk. like the CPD are not great, like all cops, but its highly unlikely they would shrug their shoulders at a serial murder of affluent to middle class white guys.
its also like you said concerning how comforting the idea of a serial killer is or people trying to solve or connect things, its partially the reason people are So invested and vulnerable to conspiracies whether its something harmless like birds arent real to something extreme like q stuff bc they want to Solve and find a greater pattern which just isnt there, life is not a puzzlebox.
It's literally based on an Urban Legend, but its not to say it happens. Though I think the river bodies might be a stretch we all know the Chicago River has been a dumping ground for awhile people think it'll hide the evidence.
Wait isn't the whole "birds aren't real" conspiracy satire?
As someone who has stumbled out drunk of many popular Chicago bars over the years I cannot even count the amount to gypsy cabs that have tried to give me rides. I think anyone from Chicago could call bs right away same thing with Jesse smollet, no one was running around during the polar vortex buddy.
@@kieranskyyes it is. The guy who came up with it is a performance artist.
I have issue with your statement "serial killers are not very common and even the ones we know are not confirmable"
OK so first, the current FBI crime lab and police estimation is that currently there are 3 - 4,000 active serial killers. That's using the FBI definition of serial murder as two or more murders with a period of rest in between.
Secondly "rarely confirmable" is weird wording. If you mean the full extent of someone's body count is often unconfirmed - no. That's true for those who've claimed high numbers (Bundy, Gary Ridgway, Samuel Little) but the most recent data on this is the FBI Crime Lab, 81% of serial killers have a confirmed body count that matches their confession. That's confirmed by DNA. And on top of that the overwhelming majority of serial killers confess, roughly 8 out of ten. They're usually cognisant of that they can't continue with their murders and are happy that they can finally brag about the things they've done, or they're ashamed of it and want it off the conscience (rarer but does happen)
If you mean that serial killers are unconfirmed generally - also no. Going back to the same crime lab report, serial murder is one of the strongest evidentiary crimes. There's usually multiple forensic and circumstantial pieces of evidence tying them to their murders, which coupled with their confession leads little room for doubt.
I wrote about a serial murder in college, so it's a subject I know too much about. I agree with your points but I think both of the serial killer ones are misinformed.
So happy you’re covering Ken Waks! I’ve had bad experiences with him in the Bay Area when we lived there. He’s so fake!!
in some of his videos he seems super mentally unwell too. Reminds me of those silicone valley guys who go psycho after going down the adderall hole
@@gleebybooer he’s a walking definition of a Silicon Valley tech bro 😖😖
@@IlanaPinsky He definitely gave off that vibe. Glad I wasn't wrong in my assessment of him.
@@nonamepainter Hey! It's a long story, but here's a TLDR version. He became besties with this girl I used to be friends with and we had a bad falling out. Once I became a content creator, she started hate-watching me and would share my content with him to make fun of me (especially when I was training for a bikini comp). It was obvious to tell she was sharing my IG stories because I can see who watches and he wasn't following me and I saw he was mutuals with her. He would unfollow and follow me all the time, and send me a lot of DMs which may look normal and friendly, but they were totally fake and not genuine. Ran into him once at synagogue because she brought him and he walked over and hugged me pretending to be excited to meet me. I made a tiktok about it but didn't share the screenshots of our convos.
@@TheVirtualObserver You and me both! This whole scandal confirms my experiences with him from 2018 and 2019.
That seems way too calculated to be a manic episode, especially once the backlash occurred Waks backed down and offered a halfhearted apology instead of doubling down or anything like that.
Agree 100%, it was most definitely for marketing and clout
Having to edit to make it more apparent for the bird brains that I agree with the op
exactly! just because someone does messed up shit for clout doesn't mean they're manic
@@who__cares__ I think that’s what they’re saying it doesn’t seem like mania it seems calculated
I’d be careful about speculating about other people’s (possible) manic episodes. Everyone’s manic episodes are individual, and present in different severities in different ways.
But I do agree that the way he handled the backlash seemed calculated, and that’s something that can be pointed out as bad regardless of if he is/was manic or not.
@@oldshoes5199 isn’t it just as rude then to speculate that he IS having a manic episode?
Imagine he’s actually stumbled onto some sort of criminal “organization” and they can literally just watch his videos and find out what they know about and just pivot😅 like, “thanks for the heads up tik tok guy!” * continues to crime wit a different MO *
Like anything beyond the initial PSA is benefitting no one except for curious internet strangers and the person committing the crimes if they’re true.
Like the Idaho murders, I saw a lot of troubling comments with the Lori vallow case, specifically with the Law and Crime channel. Live-streaming audio of the trials (which is whatever, I don’t feel any particular way about it.) but people in the live feed speculating a conspiracy because the judge wouldn’t let anyone film the trial, treating the trial like a spectator sport, completely ignoring the fact that a family tragically lost so many family members. We’ve really commodified true crime.
this whole thing gives me an idea for a dark comedy where it's all these dudes freaking out over experiencing danger for the first time in the ways that every woman in the US (and many other places Im sure) have been dealing with since childhood.
A dangerous looking woman won't take no for an answer with implications of violence if it's an adamant no?
*Off with her head!*
Honestly, this just feels like the natural conclusion of where the true crime thing ends up-- no one treats victims of crime as actual people, no one respects the grieving families, and it just becomes about the thrill of the chase. As someone who's survived things that could be considered "true crime," I am routinely disgusted by this "community" and its lack of compassion. At the same time, I'm unsurprised. I live near a different major metropolitan area and already have seen stuff online theorizing about crimes here being connected. It's vile.
Agreed. My girlfriend's family experienced a horrific crime that resulted in a death. They're absolutely traumatized over it and did everything in their power to try and stop the crime. It was too late. There were multiple TikToks made about it and everyone in the comments were absolutely bashing their family for not doing enough, but in reality they didn't know and the US legal system failed them. When they saw these videos, they were absolutely crushed, and it was awful to watch. I hope people who make videos like this realize it opens so many wounds and brings criticism or conspiracies to the mourning family that just want to grieve and recover.
honestly that first guy everything he said about his own experiences was so blanty lied about and sesationalized to sell his app its beyond evil. it also gives big LA gangs going to go hunt down markiplier energy. Edit to add the victims are real and it is tragic but I extremely doubt that this guy is anything more than a con man who saw a great thrift in selling crime to tik tok as something for them consume.
Huh???
@@thatoneperson8154 it was an old tumblr chain where a few posts were made saying that we need to warn markiplier that the la gangs were hunting down content creators as part of a big murder summer jamborie basically.
Lookup “Warn Markiplier” if ur confused
There’s a disturbing aspect to this case that no one seems to be talking about: he referred to these suspicious people offering free rides as “Gypsy cabs.” That’s not what a “Gypsy cab” is. Historically, they were cars driven mostly by immigrants who for a variety of reasons could not get a hack license. These rides are *not* free. Although they do still exist to some extent, they have mostly disappeared thanks to ride-share apps making it easier and legal to pick up fares. And of course, the word “Gypsy” is derogatory. Ken could easily have worked up his viewers to go after a segment of society who are already marginalized and maligned in our country.
I have a few friends in Chicago, so I actually passed one of Ken's videos on to one of them and asked if this was a known concern in his circle (that being gay muscle queens.) Said friend wrote it off as a very non-problem and said to me something along the line of "This kind of thing just happens here." To be fair, he's not wrong. Madison, WI has similar deaths every year thanks to the mix of drinking culture and large bodies of water. 🤷🏻♂
I think he believes he's in a true crime drama and lost touch with reality
That's what I was thinking! Like his daydream of being on a detective show was becoming true with this. He was playing a character. Treated it as an escape room type of thing
“The clout sauce, if you will”
I've experienced something as a guy as well, I was somewhat drunk and accidentally stepped into the women bathroom but left my drink outside, and while I was going number 2 my drink got spiked with what later turned out to be mdma. I was fine but it did not escape my attention that the only reason I was fine, is because I'm a guy and I have good friends who, when they found me blacked out called an ambulance. And healthcare is free, but that's a total aside.
I appreciate you talking about this Amanda. I think he hyped this up to the nth degree. People shouldn't be scared of Chicago, but should still have street smarts.
My experience with “Internet Sleuthing” was with the Casey Anthony case. The more I interacted with them the more it seemed they were fame and power-seeking and potentially mentally ill. And Casey Anthony is still “free”.
Idk if it’s right to put “mentally ill” on a list alongside “fame and power-seeking.” Like it may be better to keep those in separate sentences so ppl don’t think you’re linking them? I hope that makes sense
@@VultureSkins he just seems strung out on something lol
9:07 Also it should be noted that some of those smiley faces were upwards of 200 meters away.
This video was so interesting! I was so confused by him integrating the app. I think with it being called "Foresight," it being a travel app, and the context, I would not be surprised if a lot of people downloaded it because they thought it was a safety app. I don't know if that was planned or not, but either way it was tasteless to include a brand deal while covering an active case.
Really appreciate the graciousness of Amanda's content warnings. On top of the solid content.
I love the careful thought she gives to sentences that say something sensitive that could be misconstrued. She's a class act.
Ken experienced what women experience every day and went down a manic rabbit hole that then he realized he could use to help his app. He was always a con. People in the true crime community with EMPATHY & use logic (instead of using it as an entertainment who dun it?) have known for a long while the "Smiley Face Killer" network is not a real thing. It just isn't.
Also, Ken does seem to have an affinity for nose candy. No judgment on what people want to do recreationally, but it can make people spiral as we have seen him do.
the devilish smirk when Amanda said "he did a girl boss thing" made my day
lmaooo kaz rowe just uploaded a video about historical misinformation on tiktok it’s not a good day for tiktok in youtube video essays
I just watched that, it's so good! 😊
The thing is there is a conversation worth having about police not taking cases seriously and what civilians can do but that isn’t what happened. I’m honestly pretty pissed of right now because there a lot of criticism to be had against police and how crimes are handled but this situation completely missed those points.
Clicking away from this video for mental health reasons, but giving a shout-out to Amanda first! Thanks for always giving a content warning at the beginning of videos like this and reassuring that it's okay for people like me to give them a skip if it makes us uncomfortable. It's really appreciated and helpful, and you're a really cool person for taking the time to do it.
As a transman, and I feel safer walking alone at night than I did before I transitioned. I’ve never been approached at night, no men have asked me to help the, with their car, I don’t get offered free stuff as often as before and it’s very serious. I’m very concerned he’s making most of these videos just to promote business and clout is terrible.
Hearing this kind of thing all the time & it’s heartbreaking.
I am a white, straight Australian dude so things like this are a consistent albeit tragic reminder of how good I have it - despite any personal struggles, ultimately I’m very lucky.
I hope your transition has left you happier & more content, mate (:
Will always be an extremely fucking loud ally lol
Same lol
He was because after his first 2 videos he turned it into a serial killer story and keeps promoting his app
Yep it sucks but it definitely happens. You go out enough, you probably will experience it.
I mean this dude is “traditionally “ desirable
Are you desirable? If not
Then we’re comparing apples to tomatoes 😅
as someone who is a student at the university of idaho, thank you for saying what that. it was beyond triggering and infuriating to be on the internet at the time because it is not for entertainment, it is our real life and community
The fact he brought the Smiley face killer theory honestly killed it completely. That's a theory that so many experts tore apart as 1. Pareidolia as many times the 'smiley face' was no more than like a water stain, etc. A lot of times it sounds like it might be someone drunk who fell into the water.
when I lived in Boston there was a very similar rumor going around about a serial killer killing young men in the area and throwing them in the river, but it was pretty clear that it was a series of tragic but unrelated accidents from people just getting too drunk. I definitely think there's a weird comfort in the "serial killer" idea because that pins it all on one figure and isn't as unpredictable or sudden so it makes it easier for people to grapple with, which I feel is why it seems to happen so much
Agreed. I think people just don’t want to admit that when you get drunk you might do stupid things (like swimming in a large body of water). But the idea of being able to blame a boogeyman is somehow an easier way of coping, I guess?
This was so well handled and informative. Thank you for addressing this in such a respectful and responsible way!
She did such a great job. It had so many tricky aspects to it. I’m kinda pissed there’s only 2 likes on your comment.
What is throwing me the most about all of this is that he went from "hey stranger danger don't trust the intentions of someone you don't know" to "yeah so this random person showed up at my place and I just opened the door and trusted that they are a private investigator and now I'm working with them" like ????????? What happened to stranger danger, sir???
This sort of reminds me of social media posts where people will warn you of places or methods of being kidnapped for human trafficking. Like, facebook posts warning you not to park at certain places or how to break out of zipties. I think it creates this "us versus them" dichotomy where you feel like the person giving you the advice is trustworthy, will give you guidance, looks out for you, etc. And then obviously the intent is to get clout and money by capitalizing on the fears and death of others. Btw I love how thorough you are 💕
I personally worry Ken is going through some sort of major manic episode. I do NOT say this as an excuse for his horrible actions and mishandling of multiple families’ tragedies, but I think it’s a possible explanation.
I say this because, leading up to his videos about the crimes, he was talking about having breakthroughs, a breakdown, and then about working 20 hours a day, etc - and _then_ when his claims got crazier and crazier…detectives at his door, FBI recruiting him, etc… I think he seems believable because, possibly, HE DOES believe it.
Again, not an excuse at all, but mania could explain the delusions of grandeur, the unusual and loose connections he’s making, the confabulation (if he does indeed believe what he’s saying), and more.
Also, re: others in other comments saying it seems too calculated to be mania: I wouldn’t be so sure.
Many people who are manic, or even psychotic, can seem completely lucid. Intelligence, narcissism (as a trait), and so on can really impact how a breakdown appears.
Also, people CAN be both assholes & liars AND manic. I just see too many little tells on the neurological side, as far as an increase in loose connections and other things.
Agree. When the second clip played of him talking about asking for a promotion, I thought, "he has the same affect as the first video." That's...not a typical reaction to those different situations.
Hallucinations also aren't unknown with bipolar and this seems way more probable than his deliberately lying, and all these things seem like prime territory for that--people he interacts with alone, especially late at night, that it seems like other people in his life have not met, often in ways that don't leave evidence for later corroboration.
Oh ues, those manic episodes where he gets brand deals and shills for his app.
The man is a conman. He played you
I’m still watching so maybe you mention this, but I think it’s really interesting that his complaint was about his safety and being offered a ride, when the app he’s developing wants to know your every location/event.
Thank you so much for making a video about this! He has been all over my fyp and I felt really alone in finding what he is doing so problematic since his comment sections were (at least in the beginning) only full of praise. It’s important that we talk about these cases and demand justice for the victims, but this is really not the way :/
There's difference between interest in ongoing stories and actively getting in the way of police investigations
really great video, swell. im just 10 mins in and i really appreciate your nuanced but very clear delivery.
Thanks for making this video. I didn’t know the extent of his actions and the severity of this situation and just started to follow him on instagram because I thought he was raising awareness for a serious issue. It’s really concerning that people will go to these lengths to get ‘attention’.
tbh (i haven’t finished the vid yet so you might say this) i think part of the comfort of thinking that there’s a serial killer or a gang of serial killers is the idea that these deaths all go unsolved because there’s some super smart mastermind behind it all, not because of systemic issues like police incompetence or things of the like
Thank you for your hard work! I love your videos and always listen to them while walking my dogs.
Pretty sure most drunk people they find dead in rivers fall into them. I really don't think it's some organised crime thing
Drunk people drowning in rivers is a tale as old as human civilization
The first vid i saw was the one where he shows the map with the bodies that had been found and stuff. I thought It was a bit 'true crimey' but potentially just a guy doing a good thing. He really did just keep escelating though.
Its like those viral Reddit stories that start out believable but then as they get attention they grow more and more attention grabbing until you get to the point where everyone is clapping
It really does make me sad that people feel the need to frame stories of creepy men as "I was almost trafficked" or "I escaped a serial killer." Like if you just say someone was creepy to you in public that's not enough to be taken seriously. Or it really is true crime priming people's brains to expect these things
his actions come off so disingenuous. its like he’s baiting for a netflix documentary by trying to make this into some major ~conspiracy~
Very glad this topic is hitting the radar of larger channels. I have some friends in Chicago (I’m not American) so I was like omg you need to be extra careful. They should still be careful, but I feel like I was played.
Just wanted to say thank you for giving me the heads up at the beginning about what you were going to be discussing before going into any detail because I always look forward to your new videos but I can’t handle this type of topic so.
I had a friend introduce me to this guy's content and I immediately thought something was up when I saw the video where he says he's been brought onto the smiley investigation - firstly, that's just weird in every way, but also this is the guy who's basically created a whole brand (both personally and literally) off his scary experience with a stranger, and he's telling me he opened the door to a stranger after 8pm?? I feel like that either says something about his mental state throughout this whole ordeal, since he seems to have forgotten the reason he started, or something about how fake a lot of this has been.
You do such a good job of trying to come from a neutral place with every subject you cover, even if you have passionate opinions about it. I think that’s one of the things that makes your content so great. When I watch your videos I know you’re going to give your honest take and you’re going to try to be as reasonable and fair as possible. Happy to see your channel growing. 😊
Great vid. I love your coverage style and this is one of your best
Being from Chicago the whole “serial killer” thing that has recently blew truly pissed me off. Because black women have been targeted for decades. They’re a bunch of serial killers in the city. No matter who you are be safe!
Woof. In my occupation, I deal with processing Search Warrants, and there is no way the police are working with this man. They know how to write an NDO, and they use them as much as they can, because they know that you can change the investigation if the suspect knows you're looking at all. This is... really sad. It's a horrible evolution of the true crime genre. These victims aren't a source of entertainment, and it's so awful to watch them get made into just that.
I was looking at your monitor in the back thinking "why does she have a dead rat there"? Then I remembered of your tiara. 😅
I love seeing your flower crown from renn on the background lol. I got one from the same vendor and the older guy there is the one who makes them, the lady who sold me mine said she’s had hers for 20 years!! I did all the renn stuff you did except for the holding bar lol. Loved that vid!
I saw the initial video you showed and then the second one(?) idk if it is the same but some other guy tagged him and was investigating a serial murder/ disappearance. This dude said he too was almost abducted twice in the same area. (Update: you placed the video at 10:00 )
I didn’t pay attention past that I’m not in the same area I sent it to my friends for awareness nothing past that. This is so crazy glad you made this video!!!
There’s a difference between spreading awareness vs hey imma cause mass panic and then profit off of their fear. People (supposedly) actually died. Parents, siblings, friends, and children lost someone close to them and making their loss look like a fantastical story of the boogie man…
This is so strawman ngl. I hope he gets some help for his paranoid behaviours
bro thinks he's the protagonist of a detective anime
I wanted to follow all of this but it was overwhelming af. Ty for breaking it down.
As a young woman - I have never left a bar or concert drunk/high and NOT been offered a ride from a stranger (always a man.) I don't drink anymore, but when I did, men would buy me drinks and make jokes about roofying me. When I was dating another girl, they'd ask us for a threesome. When I went out alone, they'd joke about raping me. All upsetting and uncomfortable, but I would just walk away.
If all of this was ONLY indicative of "serial killers" then we have more serial killers than not, lol
I remember when I was in high school and I used to read true crime books. I’d get called weird and that I was sick for taking an interest in these things. It is BAFFLING seeing people making a living off of exploiting others’ misery.
Same with me and that was like 30 years ago. It was not popular. But I read them 1) To learn how to be safe. If someone survived how did they do It. 2)I found the entire process of how they caught the killer so interesting. It seems people now treat it as a fun puzzle to solve but it’s ridiculous because the police don’t release everything. So it’s like they just make stuff up. It’s disgusting because the victims were loved by family, friends, partners. They were funny, hated rom-com movies, had favorite bands, a dog they loved, hated their ears etc. They were all of us. Not just bodies or victims. How does this become “fun”.
@@phoenixgirl70 Bailey Sarian is a prime example of exploiting these cases
7:32 i think the comfort phrasing makes sense! will also say that the image creation of serial killers as a whole adds into the propagation of missing white woman syndrome in news/pop culture since ppl are willing to latch onto the idea of serial killers but forget about the messed up things minorities go through even in death u-u wasn't familiar w ken's whole thing until this video and i can't help but think about that in this case of seeing a guy blur the line btwn true crime and snake oil marketing in the name of clout
I remember this story happening in La Crosse, Wisconsin in 2000. This is a tale as old as time.
I wouldn't be surprised if a few months down the line he gives an update like "sorry! Turns out there was a carbon monoxide leak in my apartment and now my head is clear and I don't believe in this anymore"
love how some folks try to connect it to similar cases in other cities when what they're actually observing is the very common and tragic phenomenon of drunk people walking home from nearby bars, falling into rivers and drowning. "it's happening so much!" yeah your examples are all huge cities with big populations so statistically speaking it's gonna happen more.
"Working for a start up where hes the marketing department"
thats what makes me not trust him because of what the internet has conditioned me to think
yesss i’ve been waiting for ur vid on this!!
I love your coverage of basically everything. 🖤