I have used the Silver Steel bio-wad 32 gr #5s on dusky grouse, ruffed grouse, and snowshoe hare at moderate ranges. The on-game performance was very good.
The Gun Shop I believe so, in 7.5 and 9. I've not bought any for a little bit but they are still advertising them. I've been loading my own - 9 steel 28g over lovex SO15 @ 1350 fps. Lovely jubbly.
Nice to see that someone with a decent soap box has an interest in such an unpopular topic. Please, more of these. Hopefully you'll be able to bring also the new iterations into the public eye. Even thought they are not always perfect.
I personally only practice with fiber wads and steel shot. For business when it’s allowed it’s lead and plastic. I most certainly don’t mind the extra cost but the performance is important. My guns except for my Typhoon leave clay sized holes in the pattern, although I’m not the greatest shot especially with left to right crossing, this effect is noticeable to other shooters as well. (My Typhoon eats these things and makes very consistent patterns with 1 in 8 or so wads coming apart, (although not really affecting the pattern). Are the semi-autos leaking pressure and thus preserving the wads, because my double guns eat these with surprising regularity.
Could you do a video update of the different cartridges that are available now in 2023. Since EU has made hunting with almost lead impossible. I have gone the all copper route with Barnes TSX in my hunting rifle. But I haven’t so much experience with the lead alternatives. I hunt for rock ptarmigan and steel is a ricochet disaster waiting to happen when shooting with mountain rock in the background.
This is so amazing im heading straight to the range to celebrate, with my Glock 19, M&P40, and Colt 45 1911. God bless the English bill of Rights on which our bill of Rights were based on.
It certainly was, Unfortunatly for us Brits our bill of rights has four words yours doesent, ""Subject to the law" which means politicians can change gun law at will
This lead ban is a load of old boots. Its another nibble away at the sport of shooting, take enough nibbles and there is nothing left, which is the plan i reckon.
I may have agrred with you a few years ago, but a lot of research has led me to belive that perhaps there is some merit in reducing our lead use. Working on a larger film on the subject at the moment to look at both sides of the arguement.
We use Lead because we've always used Lead; it readily available, relatively cheap, very easy to work and mold and the density gives us the required energy carrying capacity. However, it is proven to be environmentally toxic and we took it out of our petrol and paint many years ago..and found alternatives. No one accused the anti-lead lobby of trying to stop us driving or stop decorating things, we just need to work on making alternative solutions workable, affordable and, most importantly, acceptable !
We used lead because it was ideal. It was dense, commonly available, reasonably priced, malleable, which allowed it to pass through choked barrels, and also when it struck the target, it deformed allowing the shot to dump its energy into the target. Not very important with clays but very important with game. I have heard nothing good about game shooting with steel, it passes through the bird without dumping its energy, akin to shooting deer with fmj bullets. The only health issues i have heard with lead is people breaking teeth when eating game. Never heard of anything else. My father worked with lead, as i have from time to time, no issues with either of us.
@@realvictim It is not that toxic. In a raw form its pretty safe. Yes do not eat it. Otherwise it does not cause any problem at all. There are far more dangerous things than lead. You can dig up old musket balls and they are still the same.
I have a new Miroku mk70 which is steel proof but I'm reluctant to use steel because of scratching the barrel. I've asked many so called experts does the shot stay in the cup or fibre wad or does it make contact with the inside of the barrel and not one person can give me a straight answer
I wouldn’t worry about scratching in the barrel - it is unbelievably rare and just a negative touted by those who have probably never even used it! There is rare occasions where the shot can leave the cup in a plastic wadded steel from what I have been told - but it is very unlikely, extremely unlikely to scratch your barrels.
@@tgsoutdoors Thanks for the info I used Gamebore super steel in the clubs loaners and they didn't worry much but it's only because mine is new. Basically the reason for steel is it's cheap. I don't think many people are worried about a lead ban just yet
I’ve been thinking more and more about switching to steel, but I can’t seem to find a clay load as most of the local grounds require fibre wads. Any suggestions?
Nothing yet - they day will come very soon that someone will bring one out. Eleys bio wad will work into the clay range soon. Other manufacturers are working on top secret stuff too!
J. I see you do a lot of shooting 🤦🏼♂️😂, that cool, and I have a question, what kind of ear silencer you use in this video?? I lost my last and looking for new pair 🙄 and yours looks good, I mean low slim profile I guess
Ive recently seen a vid by Geof Garret, think he tested some Eley cartriges that were steel shot and bio degradable plastic wads, put one in a bottle, within a few hours was mush.. Also shot very well. Take a look and let us have your opinion please. Looked very good. Great vids Johnny, like em all....
Urgh steel. Less shot and less muzzle energy, less penetration and less killing potential, rust and react badly in stomach acid.... Can't ban shotguns? Ok, lets just reduce their potential muzzle energy instead. That is what this is all really about!
Lead and plasitc will be banned all over, sooner than later, both at ranges and for hunting. Lot's of classic guns out there!Please do an episode on With and old classic sde by side shotgun. I have a Purdey from 1928 and need to know what to do!Thank you for very informative videos
Why don't you shoot these cartridge at ballistic jell block at a fixed distance and then compare same brand / size in lead measure the distance of penetration which will then give a true indicator of striking force / power of steel to lead ?
Thanks for showing John, unfortunately my o/u is 2 3/4 and not flur de lys - I've been having some joy with Eley VIP Steel 32g 5's just not going long range wise. Otherwise I have the 36 and 42g mammoths in my SXP. 🤞 They come out in a fibre wad soon!!!!!!!!
The golf industry have been making tees out of biodegradable corn derived plastic for years. Perhaps that's the move. Also, I know you work with your hands, but since you're also presenting with them, I'd like to suggest a nail brush and some mechanics soap. :)
Never have an MRI scan if you think you have ingested steel shot, not to mention your Dentists bill. Ill stick to making my own lead shot, good informative video though
@@wholeNwon For your information. Shot either steel or lead can lie in pockets in the stomach/bowel and never does move. My own father has a small pocket of lead shot in his bowel which he has been informed by a consultant is nothing to worry about .
@@woodsman2433 I suppose that it's possible for a piece of shot to lodge for long periods of time in a colonic diverticulum. It has been reported with things like chicken bones but I cannot find a single report of shot in the medical literature thus far. Your father's doctor might wish to report it...could be a guaranteed publication to add to his resume. I'll email an old classmate who practiced radiology for 30 years and ask him.
@@woodsman2433 Heard from my friend and both he and his colleagues have seen all sorts of foreign bodies, metallic and otherwise, retained in various parts of the alimentary tract...even an undigested mushroom stuck in a diverticulum mistaken for a polyp. So, you're right and I learned some things today. Thanks.
BASC and pals have dropped the ball. They came out with a voluntary proposal without bothering to ask shooters or cartridge and gun manufacturers first. Rank amateurs.
The price is a disincentive to purchase when compared to lead shot. Consider its actually cardboard, when compared to the price of plastic too? It’s going to take a while to get accepted and I think that will only really happen should lead shot actually gets banned.
I have used the Silver Steel bio-wad 32 gr #5s on dusky grouse, ruffed grouse, and snowshoe hare at moderate ranges. The on-game performance was very good.
I recently got into shooting and you’ve taught me a lot thanks 🙏🏻
Glad to hear it, thankyou!
The gamebore super steel comp 7 1/2 with fibre wads are my favourite clay load. They pattern like a printed dot matrix and I've hit 60yard crossers.
Do they still make them?
The Gun Shop I believe so, in 7.5 and 9. I've not bought any for a little bit but they are still advertising them. I've been loading my own - 9 steel 28g over lovex SO15 @ 1350 fps. Lovely jubbly.
How much were they sir
Nice to see that someone with a decent soap box has an interest in such an unpopular topic.
Please, more of these.
Hopefully you'll be able to bring also the new iterations into the public eye. Even thought they are not always perfect.
They may not be perfect - but the more support shooters put behind them the more development and money the manufacturers will put into them
I personally only practice with fiber wads and steel shot. For business when it’s allowed it’s lead and plastic. I most certainly don’t mind the extra cost but the performance is important. My guns except for my Typhoon leave clay sized holes in the pattern, although I’m not the greatest shot especially with left to right crossing, this effect is noticeable to other shooters as well. (My Typhoon eats these things and makes very consistent patterns with 1 in 8 or so wads coming apart, (although not really affecting the pattern). Are the semi-autos leaking pressure and thus preserving the wads, because my double guns eat these with surprising regularity.
Could you do a video update of the different cartridges that are available now in 2023. Since EU has made hunting with almost lead impossible.
I have gone the all copper route with Barnes TSX in my hunting rifle. But I haven’t so much experience with the lead alternatives. I hunt for rock ptarmigan and steel is a ricochet disaster waiting to happen when shooting with mountain rock in the background.
I've been shooting steel for a number of years with great success
Put them through a patanmaster coke the difference is night and day
The code black tubes are the ones thay have the wad stripers in them
Can you test: Gamebore dark storm precision steel. No. 3's and 4's. I cant can't get my hands on them yet. But I like the concept.
I home load by oltering the speed the patern changes .also the choke will change it to
This is so amazing im heading straight to the range to celebrate, with my Glock 19, M&P40, and Colt 45 1911. God bless the English bill of Rights on which our bill of Rights were based on.
It certainly was, Unfortunatly for us Brits our bill of rights has four words yours doesent,
""Subject to the law" which means politicians can change gun law at will
@@ThePhil543 well that's supposed to be at least in our government where the Supreme Court steps in.
This lead ban is a load of old boots. Its another nibble away at the sport of shooting, take enough nibbles and there is nothing left, which is the plan i reckon.
I may have agrred with you a few years ago, but a lot of research has led me to belive that perhaps there is some merit in reducing our lead use. Working on a larger film on the subject at the moment to look at both sides of the arguement.
We use Lead because we've always used Lead; it readily available, relatively cheap, very easy to work and mold and the density gives us the required energy carrying capacity. However, it is proven to be environmentally toxic and we took it out of our petrol and paint many years ago..and found alternatives. No one accused the anti-lead lobby of trying to stop us driving or stop decorating things, we just need to work on making alternative solutions workable, affordable and, most importantly, acceptable !
We used lead because it was ideal. It was dense, commonly available, reasonably priced, malleable, which allowed it to pass through choked barrels, and also when it struck the target, it deformed allowing the shot to dump its energy into the target. Not very important with clays but very important with game.
I have heard nothing good about game shooting with steel, it passes through the bird without dumping its energy, akin to shooting deer with fmj bullets.
The only health issues i have heard with lead is people breaking teeth when eating game. Never heard of anything else. My father worked with lead, as i have from time to time, no issues with either of us.
You should probably ask the Romans about that...
@@realvictim It is not that toxic. In a raw form its pretty safe. Yes do not eat it. Otherwise it does not cause any problem at all. There are far more dangerous things than lead. You can dig up old musket balls and they are still the same.
I have to respect them for pushing the technology on a bit.
What semi auto you using is it ata
An Armsan Paragon Grande
@@tgsoutdoors thanks for quick reply
Wonder why you can't get a clay load in a fibre shot cup might be a better pattern.
Cost I suppose, the clay market is more price driven than the game market
Can you get a high spec steel 20g shell ?
Nice film again. But would have liked to have seen the 70yd shot patern.
Anyone else see the flame come out the barrel at 8:00 mins
I wonder how hard is going to be to sell a non steel shotgun now!
Very hard
I have a new Miroku mk70 which is steel proof but I'm reluctant to use steel because of scratching the barrel. I've asked many so called experts does the shot stay in the cup or fibre wad or does it make contact with the inside of the barrel and not one person can give me a straight answer
I wouldn’t worry about scratching in the barrel - it is unbelievably rare and just a negative touted by those who have probably never even used it!
There is rare occasions where the shot can leave the cup in a plastic wadded steel from what I have been told - but it is very unlikely, extremely unlikely to scratch your barrels.
@@tgsoutdoors Thanks for the info I used Gamebore super steel in the clubs loaners and they didn't worry much but it's only because mine is new. Basically the reason for steel is it's cheap. I don't think many people are worried about a lead ban just yet
I’ve been thinking more and more about switching to steel, but I can’t seem to find a clay load as most of the local grounds require fibre wads. Any suggestions?
Nothing yet - they day will come very soon that someone will bring one out.
Eleys bio wad will work into the clay range soon.
Other manufacturers are working on top secret stuff too!
@@tgsoutdoors what price
What's that jacket?!
J. I see you do a lot of shooting 🤦🏼♂️😂, that cool, and I have a question, what kind of ear silencer you use in this video?? I lost my last and looking for new pair 🙄 and yours looks good, I mean low slim profile I guess
These are Custom Fit Guards, the Duo Model.
Ive recently seen a vid by Geof Garret, think he tested some Eley cartriges that were steel shot and bio degradable plastic wads, put one in a bottle, within a few hours was mush.. Also shot very well. Take a look and let us have your opinion please. Looked very good.
Great vids Johnny, like em all....
We have a video on those coming out soon!
@@tgsoutdoors Brill, look forward to that..
Urgh steel. Less shot and less muzzle energy, less penetration and less killing potential, rust and react badly in stomach acid.... Can't ban shotguns? Ok, lets just reduce their potential muzzle energy instead. That is what this is all really about!
Lead and plasitc will be banned all over, sooner than later, both at ranges and for hunting. Lot's of classic guns out there!Please do an episode on With and old classic sde by side shotgun. I have a Purdey from 1928 and need to know what to do!Thank you for very informative videos
What are the barrel thicknesses and how much pressure will you expose it to?
Why don't you shoot these cartridge at ballistic jell block at a fixed distance and then compare same brand / size in lead measure the distance of penetration which will then give a true indicator of striking force / power of steel to lead ?
We do have a plan for that - but it does require a serious level of planning!
Great!!
Thanks for showing John, unfortunately my o/u is 2 3/4 and not flur de lys - I've been having some joy with Eley VIP Steel 32g 5's just not going long range wise. Otherwise I have the 36 and 42g mammoths in my SXP. 🤞 They come out in a fibre wad soon!!!!!!!!
The golf industry have been making tees out of biodegradable corn derived plastic for years. Perhaps that's the move. Also, I know you work with your hands, but since you're also presenting with them, I'd like to suggest a nail brush and some mechanics soap. :)
I think a box of disposable gloves would be an easier option for him!
i would love to see a 55 yard penetration test comparing lead and steel
cut to chase the lead will penetrate the steel not so much. I've been duck hunting with steel for years it is a poor replacement for lead.
Never have an MRI scan if you think you have ingested steel shot, not to mention your Dentists bill.
Ill stick to making my own lead shot, good informative video though
Ingested? Your GI tract has stopped moving? No more bowel movements?
@@wholeNwon For your information. Shot either steel or lead can lie in pockets in the stomach/bowel and never does move.
My own father has a small pocket of lead shot in his bowel which he has been informed by a consultant is nothing to worry about .
@@woodsman2433 I suppose that it's possible for a piece of shot to lodge for long periods of time in a colonic diverticulum. It has been reported with things like chicken bones but I cannot find a single report of shot in the medical literature thus far. Your father's doctor might wish to report it...could be a guaranteed publication to add to his resume. I'll email an old classmate who practiced radiology for 30 years and ask him.
@@woodsman2433 Heard from my friend and both he and his colleagues have seen all sorts of foreign bodies, metallic and otherwise, retained in various parts of the alimentary tract...even an undigested mushroom stuck in a diverticulum mistaken for a polyp. So, you're right and I learned some things today. Thanks.
@@wholeNwon You never stop learning Rufus
BASC and pals have dropped the ball. They came out with a voluntary proposal without bothering to ask shooters or cartridge and gun manufacturers first. Rank amateurs.
The price is a disincentive to purchase when compared to lead shot. Consider its actually cardboard, when compared to the price of plastic too? It’s going to take a while to get accepted and I think that will only really happen should lead shot actually gets banned.
Harder to make this cardboard cup than to mould wads perhaps?
The price is a disincentive, but it’s not bismuth money!
Lead far better