yeah. honestly THIS should have been season 3. The fandom kinda died down after how much of a dissapointment season 3 was anyway. i can barely remember what happens in 3. wayyy too late
I can't believe they put EVERYTHING the fans wanted for years in a single season! You are right, it is too little too late, because all of this should have happened before! I am shocked and I can't even be happy about it, because now I don't care
@@sejsuper4660 We get Lila as an actual accomplice to Hawk Moth. We get arguably the single-greatest event to justify Chloe's "corruption arc" when Lila humiliates Chloe by teaching a 'secret dance to summon Ladybug'. These two episodes also culminate in Marinette's adherence to "You can never be HERO again" as a general rule. We get Marinette giving the Snake miraculous to Luka, the Horse miraculous to Max, the Dragon miraculous to Kagami, the Monkey miraculous to Kim. We learn Master Fu's origin, how he lost the Butterfly and Peacock miraculouses. This episode also has Hawk Moth figure out who the Guardian is, kinda forcing Marinette to become the next Guardian sooner rather than later. We learn that Gabriel Agreste will not always be Hawk Moth...which on one hand is "Yeah, duh"...but also it's quite often the case that when VILLAIN is defeated in LAST EPISODE, that's the end of all conflict Also we also get "Cat Blanc" where we find out that if Marinette and Adrien begin dating while Gabriel is Hawk Moth, then Gabriel will manipulate them into revealing themselves and such. Also, this is the start of Marinette pushing Cat Noir away and relying on other heroes. And all of this is topped off with Chloe's literal working with Hawk Moth after she's been given the Bee Miraculous... cementing that Chloe is beyond redemption. ----- Counting that up, we're looking at literally only 10 episodes that advance the plot and story and characters. Maybe we can get the total as high as 16 if we include "New side-character is introduced". But, still, a whopping 10 episodes of "filler"...plus what's 'padding out' other episodes. Yeah, a lot of Season 3 needed to happen during Season 2. And, thus, a lot of Season 4 needed to happen in Season 3. (Hell, until I began rewatching the series with a friend who wanted to watch it, I had been remembering Season 2 and even Season 3 events as though they happened in Season 1.)
@@leavemealone802 On the other hand, I heard Asstruc is no longer on the show, so there might be hope. Anyone: "Asstruc sucks!" He left. Someone: "Really? I might watch it now."
Hot Take: Am I the only one who finds Zoe boring? Don't get me wrong, she's one of the kindest people in the show, and I know I'd like her if she were some stranger I met in real life. I just don't think she's a very interesting character. (No hate to anyone who likes her, though) Edit: Turns out, this isn't a hot take. I just kind of assumed it was because I got a lot of backlash the last time I voiced this opinion.
I personally have met a lot of people who felt this way, myself included... I wish I liked Zoé because I like the idea of Chloé having a sister but, the way they introduce Zoé feels out of nowhere, and her character feels flat.
@@MechanizedAngelz For me, I think part of the issue is also that she feels more like a self-insert fanfic character than anything else. (I mean, think about it. She's Chloe's American half sister who moves to Paris because she didn't fit in at her old school, but she immediately fits with Marinette and her friends and is given a Miraculous almost as soon as she arrives.)
@@totalcattitude4339 Yeah she feels very much like a Take That to people who genuinely liked Chloe and wanted her to develop. So instead of writing a genuinely interesting and compelling character arc for her, Astruc just made up an already good version as if that would fix anything
I just hate that Chloe doesn't get redemption, but also the way Astruc talks about her is pretty disgusting. He implied that Chloe is straight up evil and doesn't have trauma from her emotional neglect, and is just whiny. There's just so much awful to unpack in that small statement. But then again, what have we come to expect?
the only reason i kept going on with the show (particularly when i was not aware of the fandom and the history behind the show) was when i finally started seeing hints of Chloe developing. We love a good “meangirl”, but we love a conflicted meangirl even more esp when she becomes self aware. i guess that'll have to wait more :(
For real i remember when he told his fans neglects and parental abuse is not that bad on twitter basically shaming every abuse victim ever just to insult Chloe's fans, he literally created this character i don't get why he have such a hatred for this fictional child and especially why he have such a massive need to attack other people's experiences in order to do so his fan nonetheless. I try to remember he's not one making the entire show but it's so hard every single time this man tweets.
@Marinette thomas has literally compared chloe fans to sexual predictors. you cannot say he loves her because he doesnt and he has gone on several twitter rants about how bad chloe is.
As far as Chloe is concerned I wish she had just stolen and kept the Bee miraculous and just been an antihero who helps ladybug and cat noir and they begrudgingly accept help when they need it. That way she stays confrontational but doesn't join shadow moth. She was the only one who had resisted him in the past. I did not like that they downplayed that with people breaking free of full akumatization in this season.
I actually agree, Chloe was never fully evil you can see that in season 2, she's not a black and white character, Ladybug hurt her but it's hard to believe she would've gone fully to Hawkmoth's side. Chloe becoming an anti hero as Queen Bee also would've been way more interesting to watch.
This would have been such a good direction after her choosing to work with Hawkmoth. They could potentially still do it, though. The closest Hawkmoth has ever come to actually reaching his goal was when he got assistance from Chloe (and he actually DID reach it when he worked with Felix), so now that he has all of the Miraculouses I get the feeling he'll try to recruit her again. Hopefully she'll get the Miraculous back and come to her senses, switching sides again.
While I do think it would have made sense for Chloe to do this, heck she even tried, it clearly wouldn't have lasted because Ladybug knows who she is, where she lives, and where she would have gone.
Chloe resisting the akuma was misinterpreted, she only resisted because she believed Ladybug would give her the power of the bee, a power she assumed she was entitled to, but she wasn’t, a miraculous is not someones right to use and Chloe alone refused to understand that the bee was not hers to keep, she couldn’t have that power whenever she wanted. When she finally realized Ladybug would not give her the power she wanted to believe ladybug wrongfully took from her, which she didn’t, it never belonged to Chloe, she did not hesitate to betray Ladybug, showing that Chloe’s only motivation for not betraying the heroes, was power, not selflessness, she only wanted the power and attention that came with being a hero, which is why we never saw her making effort to be good on her own without superpowers. Chloe’s “character development” was misinterpreted, they were just moments where she was willing to say or do the right thing, but those moments never made her want to change who she was. Chloe’s message was that some people just don’t want to change and she alone was an example of someone who can drag others into a toxic relationship by having others focus on her potential good and suffering, rather than the ongoing cruelty she continued to express to others.
The finale is basically the rumbling. -giant, crushing humanoid monsters -red sky -the villain talking to everyone at once -Bryce Papenbrook as the protagonist -a lot of betrayal and doublecrossing -Bryce Papenbrook as the anagonist
I feel like Miraculous Ladybug can't decide whether or not it wants to be a serious arc-based show like Avatar or a light-hearted standalone show like Phineas and Ferb or the Ben 10 Reboot.
I would definitely recommend Callimara's redesign of the characters and the show. It's SOOOO much more interesting and makes more sense. ETA: Also, while I agree with her issues on the show, I also agree with Negative's perspective on the show too. Like some of the writing of this show is such a fine line between good and bad. Like it was bad that all of Chloé's development just trashed just because, but at the same time yes, I also think her doubling down on being terrible is interesting. And Zoe is....idk tbh. And Felix.....FELIX, hands down, the MOST COMPETENT CHARACTER. Like my boi is getting things done and getting what he wants and I love it
was going to share this too! she has great redesigns for the characters and her re-writes of the shows main characters, side characters and villains are much better than what the show is giving us as if rn i definitely suggest that you check it out Negative (and anyone else who might be reading this) it’s definitely worth it imo
@@mrcapybara I ADORE her redesign if Lila. God I loved the outfit and story-redesign she did. I think it would also fit in Canon regardless of her Gabrielle redesign
@@ChaoticNalilitoMC Lila’s redesign is definitely one of my favorites. i think the way Cali rewrote her suits Lila so well and the villain arc that i think the show was attempting for her. AND FELIX TOO! his was amazing, she made him even more villainy esc and i really like it. he’s a great villain both in Canon and in Cali’s rewrite and i like him a lot better than Gabriel
@@ChaoticNalilitoMC EXACTLY! and i love the idea of how Flairmidable (idk if that’s how you spell it) is his costume for when he’s like pretending to be on LB’s side but then his costume changes once he’s revealed to be working with/for Hawkmoth, and the German Shepherd definitely suits him!
Chloe was assassinated. Re-watch Miraculer, Queen Wasp, Zombizou, MALEDIKTATOR, Anti-bug, and even the terrible Miracle Queen Season Finale. She's genuine. She genuinely cares about what she did wrong even when Ladybug's not around, even when she thinks nobody else is paying attention to her. Playing with Sabrina, smiling at her best friend when she's given genuine affection, asking her trash mom why she doesn't love her daughter, giving Ms. Bustier a birthday gift without anyone else knowing, desperately apologizing to her father for hurting him, and even asking for Hawkmoth to de-akumatize her parents before she joins the dark side. Heck, the ONE time she hurts someone in season 3 is because Lila MANIPULATED her and she was having a breakdown about being neglected by her hero again. (AKA her Ladybug is now her mom in her mind) She was getting BETTER. They never once had her give a malevolent smirk behind her actions. Even when she throws a tantrum and Marinette takes the Bee off her, Chloe looks miserably over at Pollen. Not the power in Ladybug's hand, but the new kwami companion/friend she's going to loose without it. She's an anti-hero and could have been the Sympathetic Villain since Hawkmoth is not sympathetic in the least. The man's full of shit.
Hawkmoth is sympathetic, but only in his motives and how he got to where he is. Not always in what he does, since he’s keeping himself drowned in his own obsession. If he’d simply leave and appreciate the things he has, he’d be happy. But he won’t, he can’t. He NEEDS his wife.
"When is Chloe ruined?" Season 3. Season 4 is just flanderization. I mean she now makes Sabrina do her homework in her closet and run to school after her (the writers do not care about Sabrina at all). And somehow, her father is now her victim instead of enabler. Everything in season 4, from her becoming worse to being replaced to actively working with Hawkmoth and Lyla is just an inevitable consequence of the season 3 finale. You can't really say this season ruins her. It works with what it has. As for the whole getting booted off the team thing, that's more on Ladybug. She says it's because her identity is revealed, but, seeing how that's clearly not a problem with the other heroes (despite the fact that if Hawkmoth was just a little smarter, it very much would be), it feels like she was just lying and should have just come out and said it was because she didn't trust Chloe, which would have been completely understandable instead of spending a season telling the audience one thing and then spending the next acting like it's not a big deal. Replacing Chloe with her nicer, better in every way, sister that just came into existence this season and turns into a glorified background character after her two episodes is merely icing on the cake. As for her relationship with her mother, where do I begin - Yes Marinette the key to helping this clearly abused child who has taken on their abusers behavior is to reunite them over how heinous and hated they are. That will surely be good for Chloe.
When they make her father fear Chloe and we’re supposed to be like “omg Chloe is so evil!” But we’re all actually like “wtf you’re a shit dad you’re failing your daughter”
Casual fact: if you noticed there was a classic but intelligent detail in making Adrien have the Cat Miraculous when Felix has the Dog Miraculous, they both look the same but the personalities are so different from eachother that you could compare it as...you guessed it, like Cats and Dogs. Although...strangely I feel like the personalities fit more in the opposite Miraculous, like Adrien has more of a "Dog" personality (Being loyal and goofy) and Felix having the "Cat" personality (Being calm and calculated), either way it's a nice play of themes and views and I love to see it.
Gotta say, this hand fan Negative's got now has got to be the most flashy and excessive prop he's used so far. And I am ALL for it, that little flick noise it makes when he opens it up is just perfect for dramatic effect
@@ImmaWhoopyourAss you're right its just not that obvious to people who arent avid viewers, but if you look closely there is a nonbinary sticker on their mic :3
I don't agree that "Chole make sense" she really doesn't *because* Astruck just reversed her whole character development leaving massive logic holes. I'm sorry but this whole "her mom loves her now so she have a choice not to be bad person" is kinda bs, Chloe is very young girl that was heavily abused by both of her parents presumably since early childhood, neglected and forced to fight for affection and her arc was actually talking about it until Astruc -no joke- said on twitter being abused as a child is "not that bad some people doesn't have legs" and now this part of her character is being ignored if not erased. What's even funnier is that it's not ignored with Zoe, she's allowed to talk about being abused and act traumatized because she doesn't act on it too much and gets magically healed in same episode she's introduced. Putting aside fact show accidently shamed abuse victims it's just bad writing and approach to writing kids because yeah 14 year olds are still kids, Chloe is a kid and Astruc is very weird about admitting that.
also hasnt he admitted Chloe is based on a childhood bully of his and thats why he refuses to let Chloe grow out of being a shallow one sided bully character?
@@gigglemuggz. Yeah, he has said on twitter that Chloe was based of a childhood bully, someone who he never forgave. He also said something along the lines of, how bullies never really change. So Chloe will just never have the redemption arc she deserves
Bit of an issue, Pumpkin. While Zoe was abused by the neglectful mother, Chloe was spoiled by the submissive father. Seriously, your whole tangent is undermined with one quote. Chloe: "DADDYYYY!!"
I read the title of this video and I thought almost immediately: “You are either very brave, or very foolish.” I’ve expressed my feelings towards the Chloe situation before. But I don’t say this a lot.. I’m okay with the idea of Chloe not being redeemed. I’m also okay with her doubling down on her villainy. But the problem is that they didn’t make her a better villain, they made her a joke. I can’t take her seriously when she’s on screen and every time she gets akumatized now I just get frustrated and think about what could have been. She could have been an anti-villain or even an anti-hero. Heck, she didn’t need a miraculous and she still could have been a better person. But she’s not effective as a villain. I’m not sure if Ladybug or Chat Noir takes her seriously as a villain anymore either.
@@47ratsinahoodie Don’t get me wrong, a redemption arc would have been great. But they didn’t want that (for reasons beyond me-) but the LEAST they could have done was gone her a good villain arc. And they didn’t even give her that.
@@redballoon9007 Yeah, like if it was a scrapped redemption, at least own up to it being poorly written, instead of trying to play it off as a "well written" betrayal.
Miraculous is truly the most undeveloped show I have ever watched and it should develop and add new elements so we can meaning me love this show 1000000 times more than I do now but still love miraculous don't know why but love it and good job show on actually making marrinette see the reality of being a secret superhero while balancing real life
@Marinette Miraculous is a C- show. Its true that you can watch phineas and ferb out of order but even if you did, tbere is development. At the end all the episodes are conected and have an effect in the series final
@ They are blinded by their love for the show much like i was 6 years ago.I used to like the show and i watched until season 4, but i just suddenly didnt want to watch the show and stopped
The one thing I will say about Zoe, is the line "I love acting, but then I was acting all the time, it was too much!" That hit close to home for me... so I got attached to her pretty quick there, but I can definitely see how for anyone who doesn't get punched in the gut by that line they relate to way too much, she's a really bland, random character
I could relate too but they did nothing with that and she did become a boring and random character. They introduced something interesting then proceeded to forget about it. She seldom appeared after two episodes so she is boring now but if they decide to develop this further, it could be good but I doubt they would
I feel like after the wishmaker episode, they forgot Luca knew who they were, and I was in the turtle position whispering like a crazy person that “Luca knows! Luca knows!” And before you ask, yes, I am totally fine.
I actually thought this was a worst season. Absolutely couldn't handle Marinette and I was really, really annoyed with them sidelining Adrien's character for absolutely no reason. Anyways, at least it finally made me give up on this show.
If I tell you I stopped watching it since before the episode 5 of this season got released? Like I saw and read about it, (... wait, I think it was even before that!) and it just made me see the main characters being ruined completely... even my parents hate Mari! The Adrien thing... omg THAT'S the second reason why I stopped altogether with this show.
I think the Adrien thing was just her being a guardian who thought she could handle everything… hopefully they resolve it in s5 considering how s4 ended and Mari was just under stress but yeah some of her behaviour was just unacceptable
I've been SO frustrated with Marinette's character for a long time, and it's past the point you can justify it with her being a teenage girl. The thing that really made this season good was all of the plot progression that FINALLY happened. It's really difficult seeing all the good things that could have come out of the show had it been handled better.
Chloe failed to reform, but it was way, WAY too quick, especially after having five whole episodes of her going through the arc. Also- brother in law broke me dude😂💙 Oh and hell yes I’d be a therapist for a bit supervillain sign me up! Also… Zoe is honestly just the redeeming qualities of Chloe in a vessel, which is why she’s boring and doesn’t add a lot.
Exactly, people liked Chloe because she had some redeeming qualities but also flaws (aka spice). A dish without spice is boring and bland, even if it has the base of being good.
I know right. Even Adrien was all for a possible wedding between his father and Natalie. Well at least we know what Season 5 will be focused on aside from side episodes
27:02 This sent me 🤣 I love Gabriel Agreste. I love how all of his evil villainy is, at its heart, a love story lol. Honestly, I think the characters are so wasted on a kids show and it makes me so angry. But, alas, that is what fanfiction is for. I stopped watching this back in season two or early season three, I can't even remember, but your take on season 4 was the most entertaining thing I've seen in a while. I actually kind of want to watch now. And I agree, Felix is amazing. And Gabriel needs therapy. 😆
The season was great in my opinion. The thing that bugged me the most is that Zoe was an unnecessary character, her only purpose is so the bee miraculous can have a holder - she honestly didn’t need to be there at all. Like damn if they wanted to carry on expanding more on to Chloe’s family and their story they could’ve done that without adding a whole new character. They could’ve carried on doing that through chloe(which they started doing in earlier seasons, with like introducing her mother to the story and shedding some light on why she is the way she is). For me this is a way better and cohesive, especially since we get no hint of Zoe in the earlier seasons. To me I feel like Chloe had potential to be an interesting character but instead we got a boring place holder. I kind of see Chloe as this like anti hero(???) like bakugo from mha. THIS WOULDVE ADDED SO MUCH MORE DYNAMIC TO THE SUPERHERO TEAM😭😭(I loved how sassy she was as queen bee, also the abstract concept behind the bee miraculous is subjection, it was made for her😭😭), Still gonna keep watching the show tho, looking forward to the big reveal that doesn’t get undone😩 Great video again!! Always looking forward to the next ones💋💋💋
Exactly, Astruc was so concerned with making people hate Chloe that he went and forced himself to make a new character last minute to have the bee miraculous 🤣
Exactly! He lost Kagami, Chloe and Nino! The show writers do not deserve a mercy of praise! But a slap across the face! Considering season 5. Yeah. Adrien still deserves better.
I can't be the only one who was completely underwhelmed at Alyas reaction. Like, after Mari revealed to her, I'm glad she consoled her immediately with a hug. But then the next episode, its just, normal? Youre not shocked or anything?
Felix’s finale plan is even more amazing when you think in context of the sentimonster theory. *quick run down* The theory states that both Aiden and Felix are sentimonsters based on moments like Aiden giving in to Shadowmoth’s power, Gabriel playing with his ring when demanding stuff from Aiden, Gabriel threatening Felix with the snap of his fingers, and many more odd scenes. Felix didn’t just trick Ladybug, he won his full autonomy with no more strings attached.
I’d also take that villain assistant job if the villain in question is nice to their minions. I’m not going to be in a negative relationship again. Legend: also the villain is hot. My aroace self: Then my smile will be fully genuine.
Everything is expensive now a days. I would totally take a job as a secretary for an evil villain who’s giving great paid and work benefits. Get that bread then leave.
I originally put this show on for my 4 year old.... and suddenly ive watched all 4 seasons by myself.. i even got my husband into it lol This show is such a pleasure as much as its infuriating
I totally understand what you are talking about being the friend in your friends' group, (usually me) that organizes everyone's time so that all of your group can hang out at the same time, but you only get recognition for that, only when you complain about it. Also, I love the way that you spoke about jobs really touched my heart. Because I have Cerebral Palsy and I can't work in the "traditional" way, but I always put in a 110% into my job
I personally felt that Adrian's arc for the season felt off. I felt like in the Catwalker episode the writers conflated his feelings of directionlessness and self-worth with his (creepy) adoration with Ladybug.
What they SHOULD HAVE done is have a lot more coherent romantic building between the two side-love interests (read: Luka for Marinette, Kagami for Adrien) throughout Season 3. Dating in all but name, until the S3 finale. Then when they have the official labels, S4 E1 and E2 would be a better/more-coherent defense to their "can't date anyone" situation. ---- For Chloe's character arc, the problem tends to arise from three conditions. 1. The show HATES presenting things chronologically. Thus there are episodes in even S1 and S2 where Chloe is not complete trash, coming before and after episodes where her actions result in all of her classmates being punished while she gets away without even a slap-on-the-wrist. 2. Thus it's near impossible to discern whether she is in fact getting worse, or if she might be gearing towards redemption. 3. This comes to a head with Zoe...who is spontaneously created to literally fill the role that a preexisting character (Chloe) could have filled. And her lack of character otherwise... Like, it makes sense and is good writing. But it comes quite obviously as the consequence of the show's prior bad writing, and ignores all the potential that it sets up SOLELY to rebuff the aforementioned bad writing. It's...I've been technically writing a review on BlogSpot, and the most-frequent phrase I end up writing when I have to mention Chloe is "GAAAHHH!!!...and this is the epitome of that. ----- "You can do everything right and still lose. ...That's life." Hmmm... Foreshadowing! Would I do exactly what Nathalie was doing, as an assistant to a nihilistic DILF hell-bent on destroying the world? Yes. The massive salary and benefits would just be a bonus.
I really enjoyed season 4, especially the finale and now i can't wait to see how Ladybug and Cat Noir will defeat Hawk Moth and get all of the Miraculous back in season 5!
I hope that Season 5 is the last season...at least with Gabriel as Hawk Moth/Shadow Moth. Ideally, as like a "stinger"/"cliffhanger" after the finale, Felix becomes the new Hawk Moth; Lila and Chloe join him as henchmen. Also, ideally, Marinette and Adrien reveal their identities to each other sometime before the finale...allowing Marinette to reconcile her friendship with Cat Noir and her love for Adrien, letting them be the best possible version of each other. Because so long as Ladybug is too busy swooning over Adrien, she can't win.
@@dariusbrown7870 Yes I know I've seen clips from the French dubs of the final episodes of season 5 including the stupid thing about Adrien, Felix and Kagami being Sentimonsters.
I won’t lie, while I feel sad for Chloe with being abused by her mom, I kind of agree with Negative. Those were things she did. While the writers didn’t have to make those choices and could’ve made others it doesn’t feel unrealistic to Chloe’s character of her to do all those things. That girl needs therapy, not to be a superhero.
True but I do feel like her no longer being a superhero could have been handled way better since she's not going to get therapy in the show (and I don't mean that as, the show would never show therapy, I mean it as Astruc would never show Chloe in therapy because he genuinely doesn't think she was a victim of abu$e). If Chloe was causing so many Akuma attacks and Mari knew this, you would think she would see Chloe's excitement and desire to be a superhero and use that to get Chloe to stop antagonizing people. It would kind of be a dick move but Mari should have 100% used being Queen Bee against Chloe for the better of herself and Paris. As Ladybug, remind Chloe to be good and after each mission, praise her efforts. As Mari, ask Chloe here and there, "What would Ladybug do?" whenever she starts to be mean (and then after some time change to, "What would Queen Bee do?") and mention that Chloe seems nicer and happier (which is important because Chloe believes she can only be happy if she's mean to others, like Audrey, so tying that happiness to being kind would probably put it into Chloe's head that she'll feel genuinely happy when she's as nice as Ladybug). Which yes, is technically a redemption but is handled better, and that's what I'm getting at. Ofc this could be too complicated for Miraculous writers to pull off but it always irked me that Mari recognized how bad it was that Chloe was antagonizing people and causing them to get akumatized but then also did basically nothing as Ladybug to coax Chloe to goodness. Like if Mari was just Mari and Chloe showed hints of being good, I wouldn't really expect Mari to force herself to be the one to try and help her. But Mari is also Ladybug, Paris' most important hero (lets be honest, the show hardly cares about Chat anymore, much as I love him) so if she can significantly lower Hawkmoth's chances of akumatizing people, *why wouldn't she take that chance?!* Plus it could also lead into Lila becoming a more prominent villain. There's so much potential here but Astruc just follows one or two stories/ideas without expanding on anything that's brought up, if that makes any sense. It's just so bizarre to me that all of that potential for super interesting and complex characters is often thrown out the window by this show.
Honestly what he said about Chloe actually does make perfect sense, she was sympathetic because she couldn’t win her mothers love which messed up her views on relationships but when she finally did get it her mothers bad behavior just rubbed off on her again so of course she didn’t change, honestly I feel kind of stupid for not fully thinking that thought through before.
I think that Chloes character being ruined WAS when she worked with Hawkmoth in that incident, that was the line she crossed that didnt gel with the character wed seen up until now, she had been characterised from the start as a massive fan of Ladybug, someone who wanted to be liked but didnt know how to get positive attention and so went for any attention at all and idolised the hero beloved by the entire city. Moreover the developments with her becoming Queen Bee seemed to be saying that Marinette had faith in the part of Chloe that wanted to be good, and her managing to work with the team seemed to prove her right to even if she was still full of herself. But then Astruc is declaring that high school bullies can never ever change and shes suddenly doing unforgivable things? Yeah, that was the ruining of Chloe for me, season 4 was just doubling down on it
Soooo... Have you ever seen the theory that Adrien is a sentimonster controlled by Emily's ring? That explains a lot of behaviors like not going out to join Ladybug because his father ordered him not to leave, the scene were Kagami confronts him about obbeying orders and mostly the scene where Adrien goes toe to toe with his father to imediatly after take orders from Nathaly, who now have the ring...
A little detail, ephemeral was after wish maker so luka knows cat noir and ladybug. And when su han told ladybug to know cat noir identity luka almost tells something but then holds hid own harm very tightly to not tell
This show hasn't even finished and it needs a reboot, someone take it and remake it please., this has a huge potential to be a great story if not told by the current people handling it. But after this season I realised what the issues actually is, they're winging it, that's why there's so much filler and the story is all over the place, they're making it as they're going and testing out here and there, that'll also explain the amount of back tracking that they're doing. A show should never work like this, it's either episodic and you can work on it how you like for episode to episode or it's lore based, in which case you can't just "wing" it.
i say once it ends, they hand this project to toei animation for a reboot and there for create the die hard anime series fans want dating back to 2012 when the ladybug promo video got leaked. be it this series FOR the older AUDIENCE. 16-18 and OVER. with the original characters!! LIKE FELIX OUR CANON FELIX (not current gremlin felix) ( i hate how THOMAS claims how chole and felix are bad characters when he's the one making it out to seem that way. anyway thats another tale, which we all know.) i've heard people commenting how they dont like felix character (from the pv) because he's "cold'" and he's not as "nice" as adrien. but thats what makes him an INTERESTING character. YOU WANNA KNOW WHATS UNDER HIS SHELL. what makes him crack. i want to see how there relationship will play out, between felix, and pv marinette. i'm chuckling right now because i can see why marinette was so intrigued by him in the pv. she's probarly thinking to herself : " their's got to be more to him than this." she's willing to get to know the GUY she's willing to get through those layers. peel by peel. (sherk reference, heh) who cares if he's stuck up, for her, she's probably taking this as a challenge! " challenge accepted" i can hear her say.
if they ever do a reboot... i want the plot to be develop well, and for everything to be run smoothly. everythings a mess the relationship between adrien and marinette is so funny to me because nothing is delvelop (no suprise there, as i was speaking) how did these two go from classmate enemies (we saw them arguing about the gum) to aquaintance (which makes sense) to "FRIEND" you just mET how do you--- i kinda dont blame adrien since he was homeschooled and doesnt enage with others so he doesnt have that kinda of idea. a friendship is build overtime. and you just know, you know. ugh, and dont get me started with : "she's just a friend" that line just kills it for me. friends how exactly?? we dont get to see them interact with EACH OTHER through out the show is what drives me mad. so your telling me marinette has a feelings for some guy who she doesnt even know well on a certian level. if that makes sense. understanding someone on a deeper level that could happen over time once you both get to know one another. but its just crazy to me. though, i shouldnt be to hard on her, though for that umbrella scene i mean who wouldnt fall "in love" if you put it that way with that type of scenery. overall, settling the umbrella scene aside, i'm thinking to myself here, she's crushing on him look wise. i remember a friend of mine felt an attract towards this guy at school and got up the courage to talk to him and once they got to get acquaintaced she soon realized she didnt felt the same way she had felt before. the guy was good looking sure, but his personality threw her off. my point exactly here with these two characters. i just hope it wont happen with felix and bridgette as we fans call her :3 if it were to ever become a reality.
i dont trust zag any less than thomas but i'm gonna have to handle it to the guy. i think he's a better choice in "Direction" for the anime. will soon figure that ourselves once the awakening movie is release. (correct me if i'm wrong but i heard it got delayed again....?) anyway, if their were to be reboot i just wish they revisit that old concept with 2D animation (since nowdays we dont get to see that anymore) and orginally planned characters. the whole CONCEPT like gabriel's name originally being "RICHARD" and his name ending with SPINX. his last name may not make sense at first glance. but with the help of google. moths scienctfic name : "sphingidae" also called : SPHINX" colloquially called "Hawk moths" celver isnt it? ALSO HIS 2D DESIGN LOOKS WICKED. credit to the animator who worked on his depiction. THOSE LAVENDER EYES!! or is it just the glass behind him that gives that illusion? dont know, all i know is HE'S VICIOUS YES SIR REE ALSO CAN WE TALK ABOUT their transformation SEQUENCE CHEF KISS MWAH. NONE OF THAT WEIRD MOVEMENTS PFFFFFT. FELIX SUIT IS OUTSTANDING I"M SORRY TO THOSE WHO DONT LIKE IT, BECAUSE I LOOOOOOOVE IT! THE DETAILS on the ears ( THEY MOVE) and tHE TAIL which i didnt put much attention to untill WAAAAy laater on when people mentioned these little details. ALSO LOOK AT HIS FEEEEeT. FOOT PADS..... THE DETAILS i'm telling YOOOU ooooh i also love the design on felix RING its beautiful. i personally love black cats and dont think their bad luck so when i see anything black cat related i geek out. hmmm what else... the volumize of hair when he's chat LOVE GO CRAZY WITH IT LOL adore ladybugs costume design, who needs to much spots anyway? a LADY only has between three or five spots if i'm correct. unlike the other design she has no spots on her mask and i think it should remain that way but i think later on thomas added them with his other designs for loss of spots. meh, i'm hopeful jeremy and thomas come into some agreement and show some art concepts to the fans and vote. or have the fans help out and do some sort of art contest and whoever wins gets their concept used in the series. they really should let the fans let out their ideas openly. and not dimiss them. *ahem ahem* Thomas.
ALSO OMG THE MIME HE GIVES ME CHILLS EVERYTIME HE's in the LIME LIGHT again, spectular design. just wasted. i'm sure he's origin story goes farther than what we ended up with. they should do something with him like the joker....???? but not ENTIRELY SINCE HIS CHARACTER HAS TO BE ITS OWN THING... he should have a tragic back story idk... something between those lines i feel. what i meant was they should get SOME inspiration from the joker and make it their own. NOT DO THE OPPOSITE AND MAKE A COPY AND PASTE. also, was the mime always that PURPLE???? i dont recall so.... HE LOOKS LIKE A KIDS GRAPE JUICE BOX HAHAHA ALSO DOESNT HE REMIND ANYONE OF BON VOYAGE??? FROM THE INCREDIBLES. Mr pigeon too is deserving of a good back story. also, his design in the cgi show is not pleasing to the eyes. this and many other cases shows how much better the series could have been better off in 2D. my sincere apologies to all for such big paragraphs. i have so much to write hehe. i really hope we get a reboot, best regards.
Omg I loved the season 4 ending! Also btw, could you make one of your future videos about the show "Mia and me"? I love that show and would like to hear your take on it and how/why it ended! And also yes I would love to be a secretary for a hot evil dude and make six figures with all the privileges 😎
Honestly, as someone who watches it with their brain turned off... It IS fun! 😂💕 Edit: also, yes, will absolutely take the assistent to the villain job
Miraculous is those type of shows that we need to use for study purposes: how would you "fix" this train-wrack? Other shows on this list are TD series and HGS Just to be clear, is not really fixing, is just re-creating the show in a way that works better than the original source. Some shows might be bad and lacking in a lot of areas, but there is nothing to shame about. Creators make the choices they believe it were right at the time, and is important to make mistakes. So yeah, no bashing any of those shows even if it is fun to make fun of the bad elements, we shouldn't use the mistakes to shame the creation process itself.
6:35 Actually it doesn’t, it just allows for Hawkmoth to use both powers at once. All he did in this episode is akumatized a shared object between the girls Edit 1: 14:04 This was a weird one as the episode was based off of a season 2 episode that was scrapped
Actually when the thunder struck in that last scene in Risk it's a french saying that basically boils down to she fell in love when the thunder struck. It happens in season one in the umbrella scene too. So the blush is her flustered panic of oh no he's hot
I really want to see Adrien doing what he wants to do and being his own person and not doing literally everything his father tells him to do and I would love Adrien to tell his father that he doesn’t want to be a model, that would be a really good character growth for him becoming his own person and telling his father things that he would 100% be mad at him for but I would still love that because so far in the show it doesn’t show Adrien telling his father how he feels about everything he tells Adrien to do, only when he’s cat noir, I still think it’s really funny when Adrien as Cat noir told Gabriel to stop standing their like salt and just do what he tells him to do in Simon Says in season 1, I would love him to do that as Adrien and see his reaction to Adrien standing up for himself, and I’m wondering if I’m the only one who still hates and has zero respect for Gabriel after what he did in Cat blanc, I don’t care if he doesn’t act like that when he finds out fr because I will still always hate him and I wouldn’t be suprised if it happens when Gabriel’s miraculous is taken away when the show ends so Adrien finds out who Hawmoth/Shadowmoth is, and Gabriel may or may not know who cat noir is but regardless even if he does he wouldn’t be able to use Adrien’s emotions after finding out he’s hawmoth against him would I would like because they don’t forget who he is, especially Adrien because he should be the first one to permanently know
I just wanna say in the season 4 finale, the thunder plays in the background as LB looks at CN. I take that as a clear sign Lb has fallen for CN. I’ll be disappointed if this isn’t used in regards to the reveal etc. cause they solved the love square by having lb now liking CN.
i did not go into this expecting “one of us! one of us! give us your! boys love recommendations!” i giggled out loud, i am very glad to have found this channel
The last 10 minutes of the last episode WAS amazing! That doesn't redeem the rest of the season for me, though. Also, you forgot to talk about Astruc's weird grudge against Chloe in the video. I was looking forward to you having to explain a grown man's hatred towards a underage fictional character. Especially when you start to realize that they kinda reset the status quo back to season 1, with only Cat Noir and Ladybug being heroes and Hawkmoth being the villain again. And they also had Cat Noir learn NOT to be jealous of the other heroes about 4 or 5 times...only to give him exactly what he wanted all season and being the only hero in Ladybug's life again. Kind of a mixed message. Let's break down some of my problems: The out of order episodes: This was a BIG one this season. Personally, I watched it as it aired on Disney Channel. They aired the episode where Gabriel destroyed his Magical Charm before the episode where he GOT it in the first place. Dearest Family aired before Qilin even showed up for the first time. And I don't think it's Disney not caring, it seemed like it aired that way EVERYWHERE. This is a big problem, and ZagToons needs to get it's act together. This is just unprofessional, airing whatever episodes get done first. If you're going to be ambitious and have more complex continuity, you NEED to get these episodes to air in order. It definitely affected my enjoyment of the show. Luca and Kagami: Totally wasted. They didn't even DO anything with these characters in new relationships. They backpedals SO HARD on this. Why even have this as a plotline if you'll spend all of the first two episodes of the season getting rid of it? Luca finding out everyone's identities: This isn't a BIG problem, because it COULD go somewhere SOMEDAY. But, it didn't really go anywhere now. So...right now it's kind of pointless. We'll see if it goes somewhere interesting or gets becomes completely irrelevant. Chloe: Le SIGH...Yeah, this is a sore point. And maybe the problem is the story we COULD have had, not the story we actually GOT at any point, but it just seems like such a waste. During season 2, it really seemed like her character was softening. And her mother...isn't a great person, but she's a more COMPLEX "demanding boss" than Chloe is. Chloe seemed to just copy her superficially without understanding WHY her mother was so demanding. But, any complexity was completely lost this season (and that probably started with the S3 finale, fine). She's SO over-the-top evil now. Lila: She...really didn't do much of anything this season. She's not really needed in the story, honestly. They COULD just give Chloe her plot points, and that'd probably be more interesting. And Felix is FAR more interesting than either of them. The Magical Charms: Completely pointless. Shadow Moth just had to...TRY HARDER and he was able to get around them? If he had to do something clever or go on a training mission or something I'd be okay with it. But this...was just lazy and pointless. The charms themselves are pretty though, I'd buy one for a dollar. Cat Noir was whiny all this season. I already mentioned it, but he shouldn't have gotten his way at the end. Again, they got rid of all the other heroes we spent all season building up. And shoved half of their reveals into ONE episode, because they didn't have enough time to spotlight everyone. They keep writing in excuses for why Cat and Ladybug can't learn each other's identities. It's getting old. And it's not especially convincing, since you won't let them move on with Luca and Kagami either. You won't let them move forward in any way, they're just stuck with this status quo. The Rooster: This single MIraculous breaks the setting. You can get ANY superpower you want. Why didn't anyone use this earlier?! Why didn't Ladybug just use it to teleport the Miraculous back to her or find the Moth and Peacock? It's potentially SO OVERPOWERED! Hawkmoth's going to find a way to lose: Hawkmoth now has access to the time-travelling Rabbit and any-power Rooster...this show should literally be over yesterday! He doesn't even really NEED the Cat and the Ladybug anymore! Just go back in time to save your wife! Or give yourself the power to HEAL your wife! Or give yourself the power to make a exact copy of your wife with all her memories but without the injury! Does the Mouse work in tandem with the Rooster? Then you can give yourself multiple powers at the same time in order to do ANYTHING you need to do! Just use ALL of them at once and become a near-GOD (fine, this wouldn't work, since they've established most people can't handle THAT many Miraculous). I assume they'll contrive reasons why he can't do any of this, but he really should be able to. But, you know what he's GOING to most likely do? He'll probably hand out these Miraculous to villains of the week like a idiot and lose them one by one...like a IDIOT! But, I'll admit, this season has some good points too. Felix was a MVP! Just sliding in, being the best character in the show, and then sliding out like a boss! I worry about how they'll ruin him. Alya's arc was kind of interesting. Having to go into hiding was..possibly interesting. They didn't really DO a lot with it. But it was a development that wasn't totally backpedaled, I'll take it. Low-key learning that Marinette get's her planning ability from her Mom was kind of great in Qilin. This is why she's the perfect holder for Ladybug, her Feng Shui abilities are in her blood. If she can just learn to calm down, she'd be GREAT. And, yeah, Glaciator 2 the Marinette/Cat episode is one of the best episodes in this series. I've come too far to stop now. I'll definitely check out Season 5 and the movie. But...yeah, I think this is the first season where I realized this show was a little janky. Yeah, I know, it took me a while...
Great comment ! ☺️ idk if you’ve watched evolution yet so spoilers - I find it funny how you predicted how Gabe would use the bunny miraculous 😂 it’s was so accurate
I disagree with the assessment of Mayor Bougois' offer to cold-store his step-daughter's dreams. He's a man that's SO THOROUGHLY hen-pecked that to him that IS a compassionate gesture. Zoey then goes on to show him that his dreams are important too, and the rest of the season has him subtly getting back into the film industry in the background. I honestly would not be surprised if, when he's inevitably akumatized in season 5 the plot revolves around that. As for working for a super villain: Is the villain Hank Scorpio? Because I would work for Hank Scorpio. Conversely, I would NOT work for Lex Luthor or Norman Osborn, and I'd have to think long and hard about working for Doom. Blanket statements for something like this are VERY hard.
You do provide an interesting perspective to the season even if the video is late. Of course I skipped through some of it (especially tangents. I won’t tell you which ones they are because they’re a part of you in a sense, so I’ll just continue to skip over them). But yeah, I like that your pov is unique from other analysts’ POVs. Listening to other peoples perspectives helps brain dead people like me gather more opinions and see which ones I agree with more 😆
Miraculous will only fully get better once they actually make Chat Noir and Ladybug equals. They give Adrian some time in the spotlight and some character development. And they redeem Chloe and give Kagami some respect.
Bruh, when I tell u I absolutely cheered for Felix when I watched the finale.. my boi is on a mission and is the only SMART person in this show. Him and Luka are my faves💙💛
19:18 Surprised you didn't mention how weird they made Juleka this season. See, originally, she spoke normally, but then she got a bit of weird fladerization...by having her speak in a VERY weirdly mumbled way that the audience can't understand her...but the other characters DO. They repeat what she last said...it's like freaking Lassie. XD
I honestly believe that South Africa gets the short end of the stick. Our season 4 ended with the "reveal" episode and here I'm seeing the season ended way better. First we get new episodes 3 months after they air everywhere else and now this.
Chloé being replaced by Zoe feels like a slap to the face. I'm currently on a rewatch on Season 3 and she had SO much character and potential; she genuinely wanted to do good and she was the first to break away from Shadowmoth's influence. Zoe has no personality.
Honestly a lot of what happened this season could've and should've happened earlier imo. Zoe honestly feels like the same character as Chloe but just a rushed redemption since they have the same conflicts at heart; wanting to be accepted by their terrible families except Chloe doesn't have a dream and is fine being mean. If they just gave her that she'd be redeemed basically, so Zoe just feels like a cheap knock off they made so they could have new Bee holder. I mean other than that she's cute ig but bland. I loved Marinette this season but I'm so mad they kept Lukanette and Adrigami only for one whole episode. Adrien/Chat Noir's arc felt really messy and annoying for me since they kept trying to establish he was important when they never established he was on the same level as ladybug in the first place. He doesn't give her the support Alya does because he doesn't know her identity, his powers aren't on the same level as her and reduced to a one-shot cataclysm per episode. Heck for being the most powerful miraculous in the box she has tons more abilities than him. Honestly I'm not sold on the whole "she needs him" thing it feels like they're shoving it down our throats for the sake of their relationship.
I am so glad that you made a video of the latest season. I missed so much after hurting my back. You're reviews are always great so it's a great combo!
Funny how when Chloe broke the rules, she get no redemption yet we excuse Alya and nino cuz of puppy love.. bad enough Chloe has mother issues. But mannn
Thank you so much for this video! The way you Broke down and recapped this season just made me rethink it all and made me even more hypef for the next season which is soon!
The video is finally here!! Sorry to hear about this trouble it put you through! I agree with you that this is the best season by far, and 100% Felix is the smartest decision they've ever made in this show. He is the only character I care about at this point since everyone else just makes me tired, and this is the first time I've been excited to see what's next.
Haven’t watched the video yet but the title took me really off-guard XD S4 is admittedly kinda a train wreck, but honestly thinking about it it probably is the best in overall quality yeah (though it DOES have my 3 least favorite episodes so I have to dock it somewhat for that…)
I feel like what they did with Chloe was just bad all around. Like if they wanted to keep her a villain, great! Don't give her so much sympathetic backstory and a glimpse of redemption. If they wanted to make her a sympathetic villain, great! But don't set her up with the bee miraculous, but do keep the backstory. I would have loved to see her as some sort of anti hero, like a third party that works for both sides, but they don't let her have enough redeeming qualities that make you cheer her on. And then they added in Zoe with little character intrigue, making it seem like she wasn't planned at all. And if that's the case then it's like she was added in to appease the people who wanted a redemption arc for Chloe without any of the effort of making it good. They had so many interesting paths ahead of them and instead they decided to stomp through the pristine grass between the paths instead, ruining it for everyone.
I came back to this video while waiting for the second half of season 5, and its still great and i love it. I appreciate your overall view of the show and its progression. Cant wait when you do your overview on the fifth season. You're doing great! Thanks.
Now I just really only watch Calimara redesign series of the show, its super good and I 100% recommend it if you are frustrated with the route the show went. She really shows all this potential the show had.
God, that was a show that felt like there was at least one person who REALLY wanted to make a good show, but was hamstrung by it NEEDING to be a kids show. "By the Hammer of Harmon" "By the Star of Gygax", etc. Like, there was plenty of world building and neat character _concepts_, but they just told the most uninspired stories with them. That Game of Thrones reference in the last episode was hilarious though.
you bring me joy. Legitimately, I find your videos entertaining and you always manage to make my day when i come across your videos. I just wanted you to know that for some reason.
15:29 - 16:01 This is honestly so relatable. Except for the fact that my friends usually cancel on me thank you so much for venting I appreciate it. I didn't know I needed that 😊
12:46 Really? Rose's storyline about her battling a serious illness (that seems like cancer) was boring? But besides that and her getting the pig miraculous (and Cat Noir surprisingly tried to commit you-know-what), I'm inclined to agree with you there. The rest of the episode was kind of forgettable.
Adrian not knowing what he wants to do when he's an adult hit me in the feels because I only have two more years in high school and my parents keep telling me I'll go to college but I'm not sure if I'm willing to waste four more years of my life also I don't even know if I want to go anywhere😐
I like the chole arc thing that happened because in some cartoons doesn’t this happen to some ani hero/ villain anyway? I can’t wait to see what’s in store for season 5.
I like how the absolute boredom of season 2 and 3 not counting the last few episodes of 3 helped set up 4 to be extremely interesting in comparison. Its like being kicked so extremely low that when the quality of a 7/10 hits, it hits hard, letting you go from a "lets slog through this" to "omg this show might be interesting again"
Damn I loved this video and really wish I knew where to watch the show because this season does seem amazing, especially those last couple episodes you talked about.
This season needed to happen a WHOLE lot sooner. Too little, too late.
yeah. honestly THIS should have been season 3. The fandom kinda died down after how much of a dissapointment season 3 was anyway. i can barely remember what happens in 3. wayyy too late
If this season was season 2 it would’ve been perfect tbh
I can't believe they put EVERYTHING the fans wanted for years in a single season!
You are right, it is too little too late, because all of this should have happened before!
I am shocked and I can't even be happy about it, because now I don't care
@@sejsuper4660 We get Lila as an actual accomplice to Hawk Moth. We get arguably the single-greatest event to justify Chloe's "corruption arc" when Lila humiliates Chloe by teaching a 'secret dance to summon Ladybug'. These two episodes also culminate in Marinette's adherence to "You can never be HERO again" as a general rule.
We get Marinette giving the Snake miraculous to Luka, the Horse miraculous to Max, the Dragon miraculous to Kagami, the Monkey miraculous to Kim.
We learn Master Fu's origin, how he lost the Butterfly and Peacock miraculouses. This episode also has Hawk Moth figure out who the Guardian is, kinda forcing Marinette to become the next Guardian sooner rather than later.
We learn that Gabriel Agreste will not always be Hawk Moth...which on one hand is "Yeah, duh"...but also it's quite often the case that when VILLAIN is defeated in LAST EPISODE, that's the end of all conflict Also we also get "Cat Blanc" where we find out that if Marinette and Adrien begin dating while Gabriel is Hawk Moth, then Gabriel will manipulate them into revealing themselves and such. Also, this is the start of Marinette pushing Cat Noir away and relying on other heroes.
And all of this is topped off with Chloe's literal working with Hawk Moth after she's been given the Bee Miraculous... cementing that Chloe is beyond redemption.
-----
Counting that up, we're looking at literally only 10 episodes that advance the plot and story and characters. Maybe we can get the total as high as 16 if we include "New side-character is introduced". But, still, a whopping 10 episodes of "filler"...plus what's 'padding out' other episodes.
Yeah, a lot of Season 3 needed to happen during Season 2. And, thus, a lot of Season 4 needed to happen in Season 3. (Hell, until I began rewatching the series with a friend who wanted to watch it, I had been remembering Season 2 and even Season 3 events as though they happened in Season 1.)
@@leavemealone802
On the other hand, I heard Asstruc is no longer on the show, so there might be hope.
Anyone: "Asstruc sucks!"
He left.
Someone: "Really? I might watch it now."
Hot Take: Am I the only one who finds Zoe boring? Don't get me wrong, she's one of the kindest people in the show, and I know I'd like her if she were some stranger I met in real life. I just don't think she's a very interesting character.
(No hate to anyone who likes her, though)
Edit: Turns out, this isn't a hot take. I just kind of assumed it was because I got a lot of backlash the last time I voiced this opinion.
I personally have met a lot of people who felt this way, myself included... I wish I liked Zoé because I like the idea of Chloé having a sister but, the way they introduce Zoé feels out of nowhere, and her character feels flat.
@@MechanizedAngelz For me, I think part of the issue is also that she feels more like a self-insert fanfic character than anything else. (I mean, think about it. She's Chloe's American half sister who moves to Paris because she didn't fit in at her old school, but she immediately fits with Marinette and her friends and is given a Miraculous almost as soon as she arrives.)
I hate her, shes so boring to me I hate how they made her character and what she represents
@@totalcattitude4339 Yeah she feels very much like a Take That to people who genuinely liked Chloe and wanted her to develop. So instead of writing a genuinely interesting and compelling character arc for her, Astruc just made up an already good version as if that would fix anything
@@ButterflyScarlet Oh yeah... I forgot about that part... 😬
I just hate that Chloe doesn't get redemption, but also the way Astruc talks about her is pretty disgusting. He implied that Chloe is straight up evil and doesn't have trauma from her emotional neglect, and is just whiny. There's just so much awful to unpack in that small statement.
But then again, what have we come to expect?
Agreed, but you accidentally left out the C in Chloe's name for the first sentence.
the only reason i kept going on with the show (particularly when i was not aware of the fandom and the history behind the show) was when i finally started seeing hints of Chloe developing. We love a good “meangirl”, but we love a conflicted meangirl even more esp when she becomes self aware. i guess that'll have to wait more :(
For real i remember when he told his fans neglects and parental abuse is not that bad on twitter basically shaming every abuse victim ever just to insult Chloe's fans, he literally created this character i don't get why he have such a hatred for this fictional child and especially why he have such a massive need to attack other people's experiences in order to do so his fan nonetheless.
I try to remember he's not one making the entire show but it's so hard every single time this man tweets.
@@papkinn The character was based off of this girl who used to bully him when he was smaller
@Marinette thomas has literally compared chloe fans to sexual predictors. you cannot say he loves her because he doesnt and he has gone on several twitter rants about how bad chloe is.
As far as Chloe is concerned I wish she had just stolen and kept the Bee miraculous and just been an antihero who helps ladybug and cat noir and they begrudgingly accept help when they need it. That way she stays confrontational but doesn't join shadow moth. She was the only one who had resisted him in the past. I did not like that they downplayed that with people breaking free of full akumatization in this season.
I actually agree, Chloe was never fully evil you can see that in season 2, she's not a black and white character, Ladybug hurt her but it's hard to believe she would've gone fully to Hawkmoth's side. Chloe becoming an anti hero as Queen Bee also would've been way more interesting to watch.
This would have been such a good direction after her choosing to work with Hawkmoth. They could potentially still do it, though. The closest Hawkmoth has ever come to actually reaching his goal was when he got assistance from Chloe (and he actually DID reach it when he worked with Felix), so now that he has all of the Miraculouses I get the feeling he'll try to recruit her again. Hopefully she'll get the Miraculous back and come to her senses, switching sides again.
While I do think it would have made sense for Chloe to do this, heck she even tried, it clearly wouldn't have lasted because Ladybug knows who she is, where she lives, and where she would have gone.
YAS!!! That is so good
Chloe resisting the akuma was misinterpreted, she only resisted because she believed Ladybug would give her the power of the bee, a power she assumed she was entitled to, but she wasn’t, a miraculous is not someones right to use and Chloe alone refused to understand that the bee was not hers to keep, she couldn’t have that power whenever she wanted. When she finally realized Ladybug would not give her the power she wanted to believe ladybug wrongfully took from her, which she didn’t, it never belonged to Chloe, she did not hesitate to betray Ladybug, showing that Chloe’s only motivation for not betraying the heroes, was power, not selflessness, she only wanted the power and attention that came with being a hero, which is why we never saw her making effort to be good on her own without superpowers. Chloe’s “character development” was misinterpreted, they were just moments where she was willing to say or do the right thing, but those moments never made her want to change who she was. Chloe’s message was that some people just don’t want to change and she alone was an example of someone who can drag others into a toxic relationship by having others focus on her potential good and suffering, rather than the ongoing cruelty she continued to express to others.
The finale is basically the rumbling.
-giant, crushing humanoid monsters
-red sky
-the villain talking to everyone at once
-Bryce Papenbrook as the protagonist
-a lot of betrayal and doublecrossing
-Bryce Papenbrook as the anagonist
Wait a minute……
*attack on titan theme song starts playing*
unlike the rumbling, Bryce Papenbrook plays two different people here
Oh wow. I didn't know eren was voiced by him in the dub. I only watched the sub. That's cool though.
you forgot Nagito komaeda
How often do l make jokes about chemistry? Periodically.
I hate that I chuckled at this.
Noble pursuits such as this are a real gas.
Okay, that was pretty clever.
I feel like Miraculous Ladybug can't decide whether or not it wants to be a serious arc-based show like Avatar or a light-hearted standalone show like Phineas and Ferb or the Ben 10 Reboot.
It’s obvious what all the fans want though right? GIVE US ARCS
Wow that's the first time I heard someone call atla a serious show
I would definitely recommend Callimara's redesign of the characters and the show. It's SOOOO much more interesting and makes more sense.
ETA: Also, while I agree with her issues on the show, I also agree with Negative's perspective on the show too. Like some of the writing of this show is such a fine line between good and bad. Like it was bad that all of Chloé's development just trashed just because, but at the same time yes, I also think her doubling down on being terrible is interesting. And Zoe is....idk tbh. And Felix.....FELIX, hands down, the MOST COMPETENT CHARACTER. Like my boi is getting things done and getting what he wants and I love it
was going to share this too! she has great redesigns for the characters and her re-writes of the shows main characters, side characters and villains are much better than what the show is giving us as if rn
i definitely suggest that you check it out Negative (and anyone else who might be reading this) it’s definitely worth it imo
@@mrcapybara I ADORE her redesign if Lila. God I loved the outfit and story-redesign she did. I think it would also fit in Canon regardless of her Gabrielle redesign
@@ChaoticNalilitoMC Lila’s redesign is definitely one of my favorites. i think the way Cali rewrote her suits Lila so well and the villain arc that i think the show was attempting for her. AND FELIX TOO! his was amazing, she made him even more villainy esc and i really like it. he’s a great villain both in Canon and in Cali’s rewrite and i like him a lot better than Gabriel
@@mrcapybara yeeeessss. YEEESSS. FELIX! Even the idea of making his costume like a German Sheppard fits the canon and UGH, so good
@@ChaoticNalilitoMC EXACTLY! and i love the idea of how Flairmidable (idk if that’s how you spell it) is his costume for when he’s like pretending to be on LB’s side but then his costume changes once he’s revealed to be working with/for Hawkmoth, and the German Shepherd definitely suits him!
Chloe was assassinated.
Re-watch Miraculer, Queen Wasp, Zombizou, MALEDIKTATOR, Anti-bug, and even the terrible Miracle Queen Season Finale. She's genuine. She genuinely cares about what she did wrong even when Ladybug's not around, even when she thinks nobody else is paying attention to her. Playing with Sabrina, smiling at her best friend when she's given genuine affection, asking her trash mom why she doesn't love her daughter, giving Ms. Bustier a birthday gift without anyone else knowing, desperately apologizing to her father for hurting him, and even asking for Hawkmoth to de-akumatize her parents before she joins the dark side. Heck, the ONE time she hurts someone in season 3 is because Lila MANIPULATED her and she was having a breakdown about being neglected by her hero again. (AKA her Ladybug is now her mom in her mind) She was getting BETTER.
They never once had her give a malevolent smirk behind her actions. Even when she throws a tantrum and Marinette takes the Bee off her, Chloe looks miserably over at Pollen. Not the power in Ladybug's hand, but the new kwami companion/friend she's going to loose without it.
She's an anti-hero and could have been the Sympathetic Villain since Hawkmoth is not sympathetic in the least. The man's full of shit.
To me, Hawk Moth is sympathetic just on a mediocre level.
Hawkmoth is sympathetic, but only in his motives and how he got to where he is. Not always in what he does, since he’s keeping himself drowned in his own obsession. If he’d simply leave and appreciate the things he has, he’d be happy. But he won’t, he can’t. He NEEDS his wife.
Season 5 starts tomorrow.
Would like to see the creators step it up again this season.
Wait it does???
@@Rose_Riot yeah there's gonna be a special release of the first episode tomorrow, although it's going to be Portuguese
Isnt the movie season 5
@@FaytTheXpert no....
@@FaytTheXpert The feature film is a retelling of the first season.
"When is Chloe ruined?"
Season 3. Season 4 is just flanderization. I mean she now makes Sabrina do her homework in her closet and run to school after her (the writers do not care about Sabrina at all). And somehow, her father is now her victim instead of enabler.
Everything in season 4, from her becoming worse to being replaced to actively working with Hawkmoth and Lyla is just an inevitable consequence of the season 3 finale. You can't really say this season ruins her. It works with what it has.
As for the whole getting booted off the team thing, that's more on Ladybug. She says it's because her identity is revealed, but, seeing how that's clearly not a problem with the other heroes (despite the fact that if Hawkmoth was just a little smarter, it very much would be), it feels like she was just lying and should have just come out and said it was because she didn't trust Chloe, which would have been completely understandable instead of spending a season telling the audience one thing and then spending the next acting like it's not a big deal.
Replacing Chloe with her nicer, better in every way, sister that just came into existence this season and turns into a glorified background character after her two episodes is merely icing on the cake.
As for her relationship with her mother, where do I begin - Yes Marinette the key to helping this clearly abused child who has taken on their abusers behavior is to reunite them over how heinous and hated they are. That will surely be good for Chloe.
Say it louder, for the people in the back!
When they make her father fear Chloe and we’re supposed to be like “omg Chloe is so evil!” But we’re all actually like “wtf you’re a shit dad you’re failing your daughter”
Bro-You said what was on my mind!
Thank you!!! Smooth brain fans are hating on such an amazing season for no reason!
@Marinette I meant as the Bee Miraculous holder.
Casual fact: if you noticed there was a classic but intelligent detail in making Adrien have the Cat Miraculous when Felix has the Dog Miraculous, they both look the same but the personalities are so different from eachother that you could compare it as...you guessed it, like Cats and Dogs.
Although...strangely I feel like the personalities fit more in the opposite Miraculous, like Adrien has more of a "Dog" personality (Being loyal and goofy) and Felix having the "Cat" personality (Being calm and calculated), either way it's a nice play of themes and views and I love to see it.
Gotta say, this hand fan Negative's got now has got to be the most flashy and excessive prop he's used so far.
And I am ALL for it, that little flick noise it makes when he opens it up is just perfect for dramatic effect
Don't they use they/them pronouns? I might be wrong but just saying.
@@ImmaWhoopyourAss I'm pretty sure it was he/they last time I checked, but I remember em saying they don't really care which one is used
@@ImmaWhoopyourAss you're right its just not that obvious to people who arent avid viewers, but if you look closely there is a nonbinary sticker on their mic :3
@@ImmaWhoopyourAss they may have changed it since I last checked, but on their Tumblr they said ppl are free to use any pronouns for them
@@ImmaWhoopyourAss - Negative uses all the main pronouns. He/Him, She/Her and They/Them.
All hands down Filex is definitely the best character in the show.
As a villain yes, but for side characters it would probably go to Luka or kagami
Filex sounds like a window cleaner lol
Yes he is, a better hero than ladybug and Adrian.
•picks up Luka, Kagami, Felix, Juleka, Nathaniel, and Marc and then runs with them because they are too good for this show•
Agreed, he is amongst other characters the good characters in this show. I found myself wanting for him to succeed more than the main heroes, oof xd
I don't agree that "Chole make sense" she really doesn't *because* Astruck just reversed her whole character development leaving massive logic holes.
I'm sorry but this whole "her mom loves her now so she have a choice not to be bad person" is kinda bs, Chloe is very young girl that was heavily abused by both of her parents presumably since early childhood, neglected and forced to fight for affection and her arc was actually talking about it until Astruc -no joke- said on twitter being abused as a child is "not that bad some people doesn't have legs" and now this part of her character is being ignored if not erased. What's even funnier is that it's not ignored with Zoe, she's allowed to talk about being abused and act traumatized because she doesn't act on it too much and gets magically healed in same episode she's introduced. Putting aside fact show accidently shamed abuse victims it's just bad writing and approach to writing kids because yeah 14 year olds are still kids, Chloe is a kid and Astruc is very weird about admitting that.
Yep. Chloe's got fucked over because of astruc's stupid vendetta against her.
also hasnt he admitted Chloe is based on a childhood bully of his and thats why he refuses to let Chloe grow out of being a shallow one sided bully character?
Astruc projects so much hatred on Chloe is really uncomfortable
Like, bro who hurted you?
@@gigglemuggz. Yeah, he has said on twitter that Chloe was based of a childhood bully, someone who he never forgave. He also said something along the lines of, how bullies never really change. So Chloe will just never have the redemption arc she deserves
Bit of an issue, Pumpkin. While Zoe was abused by the neglectful mother, Chloe was spoiled by the submissive father. Seriously, your whole tangent is undermined with one quote.
Chloe: "DADDYYYY!!"
I read the title of this video and I thought almost immediately: “You are either very brave, or very foolish.”
I’ve expressed my feelings towards the Chloe situation before. But I don’t say this a lot..
I’m okay with the idea of Chloe not being redeemed. I’m also okay with her doubling down on her villainy. But the problem is that they didn’t make her a better villain, they made her a joke. I can’t take her seriously when she’s on screen and every time she gets akumatized now I just get frustrated and think about what could have been.
She could have been an anti-villain or even an anti-hero. Heck, she didn’t need a miraculous and she still could have been a better person. But she’s not effective as a villain. I’m not sure if Ladybug or Chat Noir takes her seriously as a villain anymore either.
This ^^ After some thinking, I decided I didn't care if Chloe had a redemption either, I just wanted her to have good writing and they didn't do that
@@47ratsinahoodie Don’t get me wrong, a redemption arc would have been great. But they didn’t want that (for reasons beyond me-) but the LEAST they could have done was gone her a good villain arc. And they didn’t even give her that.
@@redballoon9007 Yeah, like if it was a scrapped redemption, at least own up to it being poorly written, instead of trying to play it off as a "well written" betrayal.
Miraculous is truly the most undeveloped show I have ever watched and it should develop and add new elements so we can meaning me love this show 1000000 times more than I do now but still love miraculous don't know why but love it and good job show on actually making marrinette see the reality of being a secret superhero while balancing real life
@Marinette Do you even know what you are watching? It is episodic but also serialized, so it is supposed to develop the main story meaningfully.
@Marinette Phineas and Ferb was formulatic and even they developed their characters and moved the plot forward, slowly but good.
@Marinette dude, what are you even talking about???? it have no sense at all.
@Marinette Miraculous is a C- show.
Its true that you can watch phineas and ferb out of order but even if you did, tbere is development. At the end all the episodes are conected and have an effect in the series final
@ They are blinded by their love for the show much like i was 6 years ago.I used to like the show and i watched until season 4, but i just suddenly didnt want to watch the show and stopped
The one thing I will say about Zoe, is the line "I love acting, but then I was acting all the time, it was too much!" That hit close to home for me... so I got attached to her pretty quick there, but I can definitely see how for anyone who doesn't get punched in the gut by that line they relate to way too much, she's a really bland, random character
I haven’t watched S4 but just that one clip was a lot on me. It takes a lot of work to stop being so fake.
I could relate too but they did nothing with that and she did become a boring and random character. They introduced something interesting then proceeded to forget about it. She seldom appeared after two episodes so she is boring now but if they decide to develop this further, it could be good but I doubt they would
I like Season 4 due to the fact that Hawkmoth is a kids show villain that actually won in the end!
Wait hold up he WHAT????
I suppose that is kind of rare these days.
@@coal9205 You need to catch up before s5 comes out tomorrow
I was absolutely happy that he won in season 4!!! Marinette deserved to fail!!!
No he didn't
I feel like after the wishmaker episode, they forgot Luca knew who they were, and I was in the turtle position whispering like a crazy person that “Luca knows! Luca knows!”
And before you ask, yes, I am totally fine.
I actually thought this was a worst season. Absolutely couldn't handle Marinette and I was really, really annoyed with them sidelining Adrien's character for absolutely no reason. Anyways, at least it finally made me give up on this show.
If I tell you I stopped watching it since before the episode 5 of this season got released? Like I saw and read about it, (... wait, I think it was even before that!) and it just made me see the main characters being ruined completely... even my parents hate Mari! The Adrien thing... omg THAT'S the second reason why I stopped altogether with this show.
I think the Adrien thing was just her being a guardian who thought she could handle everything… hopefully they resolve it in s5 considering how s4 ended and Mari was just under stress but yeah some of her behaviour was just unacceptable
I think it was pretty bad mainly just cause of how it handled all these more interesting plot ideas
Same. Like this just felt like a showcase of all the worst parts of Ladybug as a whole.
I've been SO frustrated with Marinette's character for a long time, and it's past the point you can justify it with her being a teenage girl. The thing that really made this season good was all of the plot progression that FINALLY happened. It's really difficult seeing all the good things that could have come out of the show had it been handled better.
Chloe failed to reform, but it was way, WAY too quick, especially after having five whole episodes of her going through the arc. Also- brother in law broke me dude😂💙
Oh and hell yes I’d be a therapist for a bit supervillain sign me up!
Also… Zoe is honestly just the redeeming qualities of Chloe in a vessel, which is why she’s boring and doesn’t add a lot.
Exactly, people liked Chloe because she had some redeeming qualities but also flaws (aka spice). A dish without spice is boring and bland, even if it has the base of being good.
I know right. Even Adrien was all for a possible wedding between his father and Natalie. Well at least we know what Season 5 will be focused on aside from side episodes
27:02 This sent me 🤣 I love Gabriel Agreste. I love how all of his evil villainy is, at its heart, a love story lol. Honestly, I think the characters are so wasted on a kids show and it makes me so angry. But, alas, that is what fanfiction is for. I stopped watching this back in season two or early season three, I can't even remember, but your take on season 4 was the most entertaining thing I've seen in a while. I actually kind of want to watch now. And I agree, Felix is amazing. And Gabriel needs therapy. 😆
The season was great in my opinion. The thing that bugged me the most is that Zoe was an unnecessary character, her only purpose is so the bee miraculous can have a holder - she honestly didn’t need to be there at all. Like damn if they wanted to carry on expanding more on to Chloe’s family and their story they could’ve done that without adding a whole new character.
They could’ve carried on doing that through chloe(which they started doing in earlier seasons, with like introducing her mother to the story and shedding some light on why she is the way she is). For me this is a way better and cohesive, especially since we get no hint of Zoe in the earlier seasons.
To me I feel like Chloe had potential to be an interesting character but instead we got a boring place holder. I kind of see Chloe as this like anti hero(???) like bakugo from mha. THIS WOULDVE ADDED SO MUCH MORE DYNAMIC TO THE SUPERHERO TEAM😭😭(I loved how sassy she was as queen bee, also the abstract concept behind the bee miraculous is subjection, it was made for her😭😭),
Still gonna keep watching the show tho, looking forward to the big reveal that doesn’t get undone😩 Great video again!! Always looking forward to the next ones💋💋💋
Exactly, Astruc was so concerned with making people hate Chloe that he went and forced himself to make a new character last minute to have the bee miraculous 🤣
@@47ratsinahoodie it’s ridiculous honestly😭😭
@@47ratsinahoodie
so Chloe’s the laughingstock not the creator
Yeah this whole season was just.... "Poor Adrien", the show. Every single episode something horrible was happening to the poor guy..
Exactly! He lost Kagami, Chloe and Nino! The show writers do not deserve a mercy of praise! But a slap across the face! Considering season 5. Yeah. Adrien still deserves better.
@@FeligamiAdrizoeSworaBunnydolloverhated Marinette deserved better still deserves better
@@noorbohamad5796Not after the season 5 finale. She doesn’t. She did forgive a terrorist after all.
I can't be the only one who was completely underwhelmed at Alyas reaction. Like, after Mari revealed to her, I'm glad she consoled her immediately with a hug. But then the next episode, its just, normal? Youre not shocked or anything?
Felix’s finale plan is even more amazing when you think in context of the sentimonster theory.
*quick run down*
The theory states that both Aiden and Felix are sentimonsters based on moments like Aiden giving in to Shadowmoth’s power, Gabriel playing with his ring when demanding stuff from Aiden, Gabriel threatening Felix with the snap of his fingers, and many more odd scenes.
Felix didn’t just trick Ladybug, he won his full autonomy with no more strings attached.
I’d also take that villain assistant job if the villain in question is nice to their minions. I’m not going to be in a negative relationship again.
Legend: also the villain is hot.
My aroace self: Then my smile will be fully genuine.
Felix was the original concept character for Cat Noir before Adrian back when Ladybug was an 2D animation in production.
Everything is expensive now a days. I would totally take a job as a secretary for an evil villain who’s giving great paid and work benefits. Get that bread then leave.
I originally put this show on for my 4 year old.... and suddenly ive watched all 4 seasons by myself.. i even got my husband into it lol
This show is such a pleasure as much as its infuriating
Also, id take the job lol
I totally understand what you are talking about being the friend in your friends' group, (usually me) that organizes everyone's time so that all of your group can hang out at the same time, but you only get recognition for that, only when you complain about it. Also, I love the way that you spoke about jobs really touched my heart. Because I have Cerebral Palsy and I can't work in the "traditional" way, but I always put in a 110% into my job
Kagami voice actor is Faye Mata. Voice of Petra on Fire Emblem Three Houses and Warriors Three Hopes. So precious !!!! ❤
Felix is Gabriels nephew, not his brother in law lmao
It's been since season 2 that any episode has made me feel anything that wasnt rage, this season's finale was too good for this show
I personally felt that Adrian's arc for the season felt off. I felt like in the Catwalker episode the writers conflated his feelings of directionlessness and self-worth with his (creepy) adoration with Ladybug.
What they SHOULD HAVE done is have a lot more coherent romantic building between the two side-love interests (read: Luka for Marinette, Kagami for Adrien) throughout Season 3. Dating in all but name, until the S3 finale.
Then when they have the official labels, S4 E1 and E2 would be a better/more-coherent defense to their "can't date anyone" situation.
----
For Chloe's character arc, the problem tends to arise from three conditions.
1. The show HATES presenting things chronologically. Thus there are episodes in even S1 and S2 where Chloe is not complete trash, coming before and after episodes where her actions result in all of her classmates being punished while she gets away without even a slap-on-the-wrist.
2. Thus it's near impossible to discern whether she is in fact getting worse, or if she might be gearing towards redemption.
3. This comes to a head with Zoe...who is spontaneously created to literally fill the role that a preexisting character (Chloe) could have filled. And her lack of character otherwise...
Like, it makes sense and is good writing. But it comes quite obviously as the consequence of the show's prior bad writing, and ignores all the potential that it sets up SOLELY to rebuff the aforementioned bad writing. It's...I've been technically writing a review on BlogSpot, and the most-frequent phrase I end up writing when I have to mention Chloe is "GAAAHHH!!!...and this is the epitome of that.
-----
"You can do everything right and still lose. ...That's life."
Hmmm... Foreshadowing!
Would I do exactly what Nathalie was doing, as an assistant to a nihilistic DILF hell-bent on destroying the world? Yes. The massive salary and benefits would just be a bonus.
I really enjoyed season 4, especially the finale and now i can't wait to see how Ladybug and Cat Noir will defeat Hawk Moth and get all of the Miraculous back in season 5!
I hope that Season 5 is the last season...at least with Gabriel as Hawk Moth/Shadow Moth. Ideally, as like a "stinger"/"cliffhanger" after the finale, Felix becomes the new Hawk Moth; Lila and Chloe join him as henchmen.
Also, ideally, Marinette and Adrien reveal their identities to each other sometime before the finale...allowing Marinette to reconcile her friendship with Cat Noir and her love for Adrien, letting them be the best possible version of each other. Because so long as Ladybug is too busy swooning over Adrien, she can't win.
@@onijester56 you are partially correct
*just ladybug sadly.
@@dariusbrown7870 Yes I know I've seen clips from the French dubs of the final episodes of season 5 including the stupid thing about Adrien, Felix and Kagami being Sentimonsters.
@@TheCommenterDragon Adrian is the only who doesn’t know the truth by the end either!
I won’t lie, while I feel sad for Chloe with being abused by her mom, I kind of agree with Negative. Those were things she did. While the writers didn’t have to make those choices and could’ve made others it doesn’t feel unrealistic to Chloe’s character of her to do all those things. That girl needs therapy, not to be a superhero.
True but I do feel like her no longer being a superhero could have been handled way better since she's not going to get therapy in the show (and I don't mean that as, the show would never show therapy, I mean it as Astruc would never show Chloe in therapy because he genuinely doesn't think she was a victim of abu$e). If Chloe was causing so many Akuma attacks and Mari knew this, you would think she would see Chloe's excitement and desire to be a superhero and use that to get Chloe to stop antagonizing people. It would kind of be a dick move but Mari should have 100% used being Queen Bee against Chloe for the better of herself and Paris. As Ladybug, remind Chloe to be good and after each mission, praise her efforts. As Mari, ask Chloe here and there, "What would Ladybug do?" whenever she starts to be mean (and then after some time change to, "What would Queen Bee do?") and mention that Chloe seems nicer and happier (which is important because Chloe believes she can only be happy if she's mean to others, like Audrey, so tying that happiness to being kind would probably put it into Chloe's head that she'll feel genuinely happy when she's as nice as Ladybug). Which yes, is technically a redemption but is handled better, and that's what I'm getting at.
Ofc this could be too complicated for Miraculous writers to pull off but it always irked me that Mari recognized how bad it was that Chloe was antagonizing people and causing them to get akumatized but then also did basically nothing as Ladybug to coax Chloe to goodness. Like if Mari was just Mari and Chloe showed hints of being good, I wouldn't really expect Mari to force herself to be the one to try and help her. But Mari is also Ladybug, Paris' most important hero (lets be honest, the show hardly cares about Chat anymore, much as I love him) so if she can significantly lower Hawkmoth's chances of akumatizing people, *why wouldn't she take that chance?!* Plus it could also lead into Lila becoming a more prominent villain. There's so much potential here but Astruc just follows one or two stories/ideas without expanding on anything that's brought up, if that makes any sense. It's just so bizarre to me that all of that potential for super interesting and complex characters is often thrown out the window by this show.
Therapy and a real friend.
Addendum: A real friend who ain’t a pushover.
Honestly what he said about Chloe actually does make perfect sense, she was sympathetic because she couldn’t win her mothers love which messed up her views on relationships but when she finally did get it her mothers bad behavior just rubbed off on her again so of course she didn’t change, honestly I feel kind of stupid for not fully thinking that thought through before.
I think that Chloes character being ruined WAS when she worked with Hawkmoth in that incident, that was the line she crossed that didnt gel with the character wed seen up until now, she had been characterised from the start as a massive fan of Ladybug, someone who wanted to be liked but didnt know how to get positive attention and so went for any attention at all and idolised the hero beloved by the entire city. Moreover the developments with her becoming Queen Bee seemed to be saying that Marinette had faith in the part of Chloe that wanted to be good, and her managing to work with the team seemed to prove her right to even if she was still full of herself. But then Astruc is declaring that high school bullies can never ever change and shes suddenly doing unforgivable things? Yeah, that was the ruining of Chloe for me, season 4 was just doubling down on it
Soooo... Have you ever seen the theory that Adrien is a sentimonster controlled by Emily's ring? That explains a lot of behaviors like not going out to join Ladybug because his father ordered him not to leave, the scene were Kagami confronts him about obbeying orders and mostly the scene where Adrien goes toe to toe with his father to imediatly after take orders from Nathaly, who now have the ring...
Not to forget he not knowing what he wanted to be when he was a kid, being the perfect twin of his COUSIN and all those shenanigans.
A little detail, ephemeral was after wish maker so luka knows cat noir and ladybug. And when su han told ladybug to know cat noir identity luka almost tells something but then holds hid own harm very tightly to not tell
Him referring to Felix as Gabriel‘s brother-in-law instead of his nephew😂 15:12
This series feels like a literal circle to me.
This show hasn't even finished and it needs a reboot, someone take it and remake it please., this has a huge potential to be a great story if not told by the current people handling it. But after this season I realised what the issues actually is, they're winging it, that's why there's so much filler and the story is all over the place, they're making it as they're going and testing out here and there, that'll also explain the amount of back tracking that they're doing. A show should never work like this, it's either episodic and you can work on it how you like for episode to episode or it's lore based, in which case you can't just "wing" it.
i say once it ends, they hand this project to toei animation for a reboot and there for create the die hard anime series fans want dating back to 2012 when the ladybug promo video got leaked. be it this series FOR the older AUDIENCE. 16-18 and OVER. with the original characters!! LIKE FELIX OUR CANON FELIX (not current gremlin felix) ( i hate how THOMAS claims how chole and felix are bad characters when he's the one making it out to seem that way. anyway thats another tale, which we all know.) i've heard people commenting how they dont like felix character (from the pv) because he's "cold'" and he's not as "nice" as adrien. but thats what makes him an INTERESTING character. YOU WANNA KNOW WHATS UNDER HIS SHELL. what makes him crack. i want to see how there relationship will play out, between felix, and pv marinette. i'm chuckling right now because i can see why marinette was so intrigued by him in the pv. she's probarly thinking to herself : " their's got to be more to him than this." she's willing to get to know the GUY she's willing to get through those layers. peel by peel. (sherk reference, heh) who cares if he's stuck up, for her, she's probably taking this as a challenge! " challenge accepted" i can hear her say.
if they ever do a reboot... i want the plot to be develop well, and for everything to be run smoothly. everythings a mess the relationship between adrien and marinette is so funny to me because nothing is delvelop (no suprise there, as i was speaking) how did these two go from classmate enemies (we saw them arguing about the gum) to aquaintance (which makes sense) to "FRIEND" you just mET how do you--- i kinda dont blame adrien since he was homeschooled and doesnt enage with others so he doesnt have that kinda of idea. a friendship is build overtime. and you just know, you know. ugh, and dont get me started with : "she's just a friend" that line just kills it for me. friends how exactly?? we dont get to see them interact with EACH OTHER through out the show is what drives me mad. so your telling me marinette has a feelings for some guy who she doesnt even know well on a certian level. if that makes sense. understanding someone on a deeper level that could happen over time once you both get to know one another. but its just crazy to me. though, i shouldnt be to hard on her, though for that umbrella scene i mean who wouldnt fall "in love" if you put it that way with that type of scenery. overall, settling the umbrella scene aside, i'm thinking to myself here, she's crushing on him look wise. i remember a friend of mine felt an attract towards this guy at school and got up the courage to talk to him and once they got to get acquaintaced she soon realized she didnt felt the same way she had felt before. the guy was good looking sure, but his personality threw her off. my point exactly here with these two characters. i just hope it wont happen with felix and bridgette as we fans call her :3 if it were to ever become a reality.
i dont trust zag any less than thomas but i'm gonna have to handle it to the guy. i think he's a better choice in "Direction" for the anime. will soon figure that ourselves once the awakening movie is release. (correct me if i'm wrong but i heard it got delayed again....?) anyway, if their were to be reboot i just wish they revisit that old concept with 2D animation (since nowdays we dont get to see that anymore) and orginally planned characters. the whole CONCEPT like gabriel's name originally being "RICHARD" and his name ending with SPINX. his last name may not make sense at first glance. but with the help of google. moths scienctfic name : "sphingidae" also called : SPHINX" colloquially called "Hawk moths" celver isnt it? ALSO HIS 2D DESIGN LOOKS WICKED. credit to the animator who worked on his depiction. THOSE LAVENDER EYES!! or is it just the glass behind him that gives that illusion? dont know, all i know is HE'S VICIOUS YES SIR REE ALSO CAN WE TALK ABOUT their transformation SEQUENCE CHEF KISS MWAH. NONE OF THAT WEIRD MOVEMENTS PFFFFFT. FELIX SUIT IS OUTSTANDING I"M SORRY TO THOSE WHO DONT LIKE IT, BECAUSE I LOOOOOOOVE IT! THE DETAILS on the ears ( THEY MOVE) and tHE TAIL which i didnt put much attention to untill WAAAAy laater on when people mentioned these little details. ALSO LOOK AT HIS FEEEEeT. FOOT PADS..... THE DETAILS i'm telling YOOOU ooooh i also love the design on felix RING its beautiful. i personally love black cats and dont think their bad luck so when i see anything black cat related i geek out. hmmm what else... the volumize of hair when he's chat LOVE GO CRAZY WITH IT LOL adore ladybugs costume design, who needs to much spots anyway? a LADY only has between three or five spots if i'm correct. unlike the other design she has no spots on her mask and i think it should remain that way but i think later on thomas added them with his other designs for loss of spots. meh, i'm hopeful jeremy and thomas come into some agreement and show some art concepts to the fans and vote. or have the fans help out and do some sort of art contest and whoever wins gets their concept used in the series. they really should let the fans let out their ideas openly. and not dimiss them. *ahem ahem* Thomas.
ALSO OMG THE MIME HE GIVES ME CHILLS EVERYTIME HE's in the LIME LIGHT again, spectular design. just wasted. i'm sure he's origin story goes farther than what we ended up with. they should do something with him like the joker....???? but not ENTIRELY SINCE HIS CHARACTER HAS TO BE ITS OWN THING... he should have a tragic back story idk... something between those lines i feel. what i meant was they should get SOME inspiration from the joker and make it their own. NOT DO THE OPPOSITE AND MAKE A COPY AND PASTE. also, was the mime always that PURPLE???? i dont recall so.... HE LOOKS LIKE A KIDS GRAPE JUICE BOX HAHAHA ALSO DOESNT HE REMIND ANYONE OF BON VOYAGE??? FROM THE INCREDIBLES. Mr pigeon too is deserving of a good back story. also, his design in the cgi show is not pleasing to the eyes. this and many other cases shows how much better the series could have been better off in 2D. my sincere apologies to all for such big paragraphs. i have so much to write hehe.
i really hope we get a reboot, best regards.
Now I shall patiently wait for you to react to TOH s2
Omg I loved the season 4 ending! Also btw, could you make one of your future videos about the show "Mia and me"? I love that show and would like to hear your take on it and how/why it ended! And also yes I would love to be a secretary for a hot evil dude and make six figures with all the privileges 😎
Honestly, as someone who watches it with their brain turned off... It IS fun! 😂💕
Edit: also, yes, will absolutely take the assistent to the villain job
Miraculous is those type of shows that we need to use for study purposes: how would you "fix" this train-wrack?
Other shows on this list are TD series and HGS
Just to be clear, is not really fixing, is just re-creating the show in a way that works better than the original source. Some shows might be bad and lacking in a lot of areas, but there is nothing to shame about. Creators make the choices they believe it were right at the time, and is important to make mistakes.
So yeah, no bashing any of those shows even if it is fun to make fun of the bad elements, we shouldn't use the mistakes to shame the creation process itself.
And RWBY
Ah yes, High Guardian Spice. My favorite show ft. sexist behavior and horrible other things, too.
How about just DO NOT TRASH TALK STOP TRASH TALKING
6:35 Actually it doesn’t, it just allows for Hawkmoth to use both powers at once. All he did in this episode is akumatized a shared object between the girls
Edit 1: 14:04 This was a weird one as the episode was based off of a season 2 episode that was scrapped
Actually when the thunder struck in that last scene in Risk it's a french saying that basically boils down to she fell in love when the thunder struck. It happens in season one in the umbrella scene too. So the blush is her flustered panic of oh no he's hot
Nice to hear the show is improving.
It really isn't. If anything, it gotten worse.
It's not
The story is getting better but animation is falling
Nani?!
They only put this in to reel ex-fans back in again I’m sure after these few episodes it will go back to its shit writing
I really want to see Adrien doing what he wants to do and being his own person and not doing literally everything his father tells him to do and I would love Adrien to tell his father that he doesn’t want to be a model, that would be a really good character growth for him becoming his own person and telling his father things that he would 100% be mad at him for but I would still love that because so far in the show it doesn’t show Adrien telling his father how he feels about everything he tells Adrien to do, only when he’s cat noir, I still think it’s really funny when Adrien as Cat noir told Gabriel to stop standing their like salt and just do what he tells him to do in Simon Says in season 1, I would love him to do that as Adrien and see his reaction to Adrien standing up for himself, and I’m wondering if I’m the only one who still hates and has zero respect for Gabriel after what he did in Cat blanc, I don’t care if he doesn’t act like that when he finds out fr because I will still always hate him and I wouldn’t be suprised if it happens when Gabriel’s miraculous is taken away when the show ends so Adrien finds out who Hawmoth/Shadowmoth is, and Gabriel may or may not know who cat noir is but regardless even if he does he wouldn’t be able to use Adrien’s emotions after finding out he’s hawmoth against him would I would like because they don’t forget who he is, especially Adrien because he should be the first one to permanently know
I just wanna say in the season 4 finale, the thunder plays in the background as LB looks at CN. I take that as a clear sign Lb has fallen for CN. I’ll be disappointed if this isn’t used in regards to the reveal etc. cause they solved the love square by having lb now liking CN.
Hello Bask 😌
@@stargirl_niaa lol
i did not go into this expecting “one of us! one of us! give us your! boys love recommendations!” i giggled out loud, i am very glad to have found this channel
The last 10 minutes of the last episode WAS amazing! That doesn't redeem the rest of the season for me, though. Also, you forgot to talk about Astruc's weird grudge against Chloe in the video. I was looking forward to you having to explain a grown man's hatred towards a underage fictional character.
Especially when you start to realize that they kinda reset the status quo back to season 1, with only Cat Noir and Ladybug being heroes and Hawkmoth being the villain again.
And they also had Cat Noir learn NOT to be jealous of the other heroes about 4 or 5 times...only to give him exactly what he wanted all season and being the only hero in Ladybug's life again. Kind of a mixed message.
Let's break down some of my problems:
The out of order episodes: This was a BIG one this season. Personally, I watched it as it aired on Disney Channel. They aired the episode where Gabriel destroyed his Magical Charm before the episode where he GOT it in the first place. Dearest Family aired before Qilin even showed up for the first time. And I don't think it's Disney not caring, it seemed like it aired that way EVERYWHERE. This is a big problem, and ZagToons needs to get it's act together. This is just unprofessional, airing whatever episodes get done first. If you're going to be ambitious and have more complex continuity, you NEED to get these episodes to air in order. It definitely affected my enjoyment of the show.
Luca and Kagami: Totally wasted. They didn't even DO anything with these characters in new relationships. They backpedals SO HARD on this. Why even have this as a plotline if you'll spend all of the first two episodes of the season getting rid of it?
Luca finding out everyone's identities: This isn't a BIG problem, because it COULD go somewhere SOMEDAY. But, it didn't really go anywhere now. So...right now it's kind of pointless. We'll see if it goes somewhere interesting or gets becomes completely irrelevant.
Chloe: Le SIGH...Yeah, this is a sore point. And maybe the problem is the story we COULD have had, not the story we actually GOT at any point, but it just seems like such a waste. During season 2, it really seemed like her character was softening. And her mother...isn't a great person, but she's a more COMPLEX "demanding boss" than Chloe is. Chloe seemed to just copy her superficially without understanding WHY her mother was so demanding. But, any complexity was completely lost this season (and that probably started with the S3 finale, fine). She's SO over-the-top evil now.
Lila: She...really didn't do much of anything this season. She's not really needed in the story, honestly. They COULD just give Chloe her plot points, and that'd probably be more interesting. And Felix is FAR more interesting than either of them.
The Magical Charms: Completely pointless. Shadow Moth just had to...TRY HARDER and he was able to get around them? If he had to do something clever or go on a training mission or something I'd be okay with it. But this...was just lazy and pointless. The charms themselves are pretty though, I'd buy one for a dollar.
Cat Noir was whiny all this season. I already mentioned it, but he shouldn't have gotten his way at the end.
Again, they got rid of all the other heroes we spent all season building up. And shoved half of their reveals into ONE episode, because they didn't have enough time to spotlight everyone.
They keep writing in excuses for why Cat and Ladybug can't learn each other's identities. It's getting old. And it's not especially convincing, since you won't let them move on with Luca and Kagami either. You won't let them move forward in any way, they're just stuck with this status quo.
The Rooster: This single MIraculous breaks the setting. You can get ANY superpower you want. Why didn't anyone use this earlier?! Why didn't Ladybug just use it to teleport the Miraculous back to her or find the Moth and Peacock? It's potentially SO OVERPOWERED!
Hawkmoth's going to find a way to lose: Hawkmoth now has access to the time-travelling Rabbit and any-power Rooster...this show should literally be over yesterday! He doesn't even really NEED the Cat and the Ladybug anymore! Just go back in time to save your wife! Or give yourself the power to HEAL your wife! Or give yourself the power to make a exact copy of your wife with all her memories but without the injury! Does the Mouse work in tandem with the Rooster? Then you can give yourself multiple powers at the same time in order to do ANYTHING you need to do! Just use ALL of them at once and become a near-GOD (fine, this wouldn't work, since they've established most people can't handle THAT many Miraculous). I assume they'll contrive reasons why he can't do any of this, but he really should be able to. But, you know what he's GOING to most likely do? He'll probably hand out these Miraculous to villains of the week like a idiot and lose them one by one...like a IDIOT!
But, I'll admit, this season has some good points too.
Felix was a MVP! Just sliding in, being the best character in the show, and then sliding out like a boss! I worry about how they'll ruin him.
Alya's arc was kind of interesting. Having to go into hiding was..possibly interesting. They didn't really DO a lot with it. But it was a development that wasn't totally backpedaled, I'll take it.
Low-key learning that Marinette get's her planning ability from her Mom was kind of great in Qilin. This is why she's the perfect holder for Ladybug, her Feng Shui abilities are in her blood. If she can just learn to calm down, she'd be GREAT. And, yeah, Glaciator 2 the Marinette/Cat episode is one of the best episodes in this series.
I've come too far to stop now. I'll definitely check out Season 5 and the movie. But...yeah, I think this is the first season where I realized this show was a little janky. Yeah, I know, it took me a while...
Great comment ! ☺️ idk if you’ve watched evolution yet so spoilers -
I find it funny how you predicted how Gabe would use the bunny miraculous 😂 it’s was so accurate
Linus absence what’s the reason
@Marinette Ah the copium.
You my friend are delusional
@Marinette Yeah, that's not true.
I disagree with the assessment of Mayor Bougois' offer to cold-store his step-daughter's dreams. He's a man that's SO THOROUGHLY hen-pecked that to him that IS a compassionate gesture. Zoey then goes on to show him that his dreams are important too, and the rest of the season has him subtly getting back into the film industry in the background. I honestly would not be surprised if, when he's inevitably akumatized in season 5 the plot revolves around that.
As for working for a super villain: Is the villain Hank Scorpio? Because I would work for Hank Scorpio. Conversely, I would NOT work for Lex Luthor or Norman Osborn, and I'd have to think long and hard about working for Doom. Blanket statements for something like this are VERY hard.
You do provide an interesting perspective to the season even if the video is late. Of course I skipped through some of it (especially tangents. I won’t tell you which ones they are because they’re a part of you in a sense, so I’ll just continue to skip over them). But yeah, I like that your pov is unique from other analysts’ POVs. Listening to other peoples perspectives helps brain dead people like me gather more opinions and see which ones I agree with more 😆
27:50 Luka already knows that Adrien is chat noir. I dont see why they had to go about this in a roundabout way
Luca should've been a main character
Miraculous will only fully get better once they actually make Chat Noir and Ladybug equals. They give Adrian some time in the spotlight and some character development. And they redeem Chloe and give Kagami some respect.
Thank you for making these recap videos because it physically hurts to watch this show, but I’m still interested in the plot
Bruh, when I tell u I absolutely cheered for Felix when I watched the finale.. my boi is on a mission and is the only SMART person in this show.
Him and Luka are my faves💙💛
19:18 Surprised you didn't mention how weird they made Juleka this season. See, originally, she spoke normally, but then she got a bit of weird fladerization...by having her speak in a VERY weirdly mumbled way that the audience can't understand her...but the other characters DO. They repeat what she last said...it's like freaking Lassie. XD
I honestly believe that South Africa gets the short end of the stick. Our season 4 ended with the "reveal" episode and here I'm seeing the season ended way better. First we get new episodes 3 months after they air everywhere else and now this.
Chloé being replaced by Zoe feels like a slap to the face. I'm currently on a rewatch on Season 3 and she had SO much character and potential; she genuinely wanted to do good and she was the first to break away from Shadowmoth's influence. Zoe has no personality.
Honestly a lot of what happened this season could've and should've happened earlier imo. Zoe honestly feels like the same character as Chloe but just a rushed redemption since they have the same conflicts at heart; wanting to be accepted by their terrible families except Chloe doesn't have a dream and is fine being mean. If they just gave her that she'd be redeemed basically, so Zoe just feels like a cheap knock off they made so they could have new Bee holder. I mean other than that she's cute ig but bland. I loved Marinette this season but I'm so mad they kept Lukanette and Adrigami only for one whole episode. Adrien/Chat Noir's arc felt really messy and annoying for me since they kept trying to establish he was important when they never established he was on the same level as ladybug in the first place. He doesn't give her the support Alya does because he doesn't know her identity, his powers aren't on the same level as her and reduced to a one-shot cataclysm per episode. Heck for being the most powerful miraculous in the box she has tons more abilities than him. Honestly I'm not sold on the whole "she needs him" thing it feels like they're shoving it down our throats for the sake of their relationship.
I am so glad that you made a video of the latest season. I missed so much after hurting my back. You're reviews are always great so it's a great combo!
Funny how when Chloe broke the rules, she get no redemption yet we excuse Alya and nino cuz of puppy love.. bad enough Chloe has mother issues. But mannn
so what like what’s the point of in the whole what about thing you people been doing and please just don’t like grammar police me or whatever
Thank you so much for this video! The way you Broke down and recapped this season just made me rethink it all and made me even more hypef for the next season which is soon!
That Jean-Luc Picard reference in a miraculous ladybug episode as a cross over made me feel so seen 😭 I'd love to hear you talk about star trek
The video is finally here!! Sorry to hear about this trouble it put you through! I agree with you that this is the best season by far, and 100% Felix is the smartest decision they've ever made in this show. He is the only character I care about at this point since everyone else just makes me tired, and this is the first time I've been excited to see what's next.
Haven’t watched the video yet but the title took me really off-guard XD S4 is admittedly kinda a train wreck, but honestly thinking about it it probably is the best in overall quality yeah (though it DOES have my 3 least favorite episodes so I have to dock it somewhat for that…)
Got some weird vibes from Zoe in the thumbnail. Something like: "Oh Adrien! You wanna do what to me? How romantic!"
26:30 man's on his way to becoming the next pokemon villain
I feel like what they did with Chloe was just bad all around. Like if they wanted to keep her a villain, great! Don't give her so much sympathetic backstory and a glimpse of redemption. If they wanted to make her a sympathetic villain, great! But don't set her up with the bee miraculous, but do keep the backstory. I would have loved to see her as some sort of anti hero, like a third party that works for both sides, but they don't let her have enough redeeming qualities that make you cheer her on. And then they added in Zoe with little character intrigue, making it seem like she wasn't planned at all. And if that's the case then it's like she was added in to appease the people who wanted a redemption arc for Chloe without any of the effort of making it good. They had so many interesting paths ahead of them and instead they decided to stomp through the pristine grass between the paths instead, ruining it for everyone.
its similar to how in scooby doo there are random uncles brothers or cousins just appearing conveniently every so often
I came back to this video while waiting for the second half of season 5, and its still great and i love it. I appreciate your overall view of the show and its progression. Cant wait when you do your overview on the fifth season. You're doing great! Thanks.
I relate to your friend rant so god dang hard that I ended up busting out laughing. Also, great video by the way. Love your content.
Now I just really only watch Calimara redesign series of the show, its super good and I 100% recommend it if you are frustrated with the route the show went. She really shows all this potential the show had.
Have you heard of this show called Mysticons I think it fits perfectly for the type of shows you cover
God, that was a show that felt like there was at least one person who REALLY wanted to make a good show, but was hamstrung by it NEEDING to be a kids show. "By the Hammer of Harmon" "By the Star of Gygax", etc. Like, there was plenty of world building and neat character _concepts_, but they just told the most uninspired stories with them. That Game of Thrones reference in the last episode was hilarious though.
you bring me joy. Legitimately, I find your videos entertaining and you always manage to make my day when i come across your videos. I just wanted you to know that for some reason.
15:29 - 16:01 This is honestly so relatable. Except for the fact that my friends usually cancel on me
thank you so much for venting I appreciate it. I didn't know I needed that 😊
12:46 Really? Rose's storyline about her battling a serious illness (that seems like cancer) was boring?
But besides that and her getting the pig miraculous (and Cat Noir surprisingly tried to commit you-know-what), I'm inclined to agree with you there. The rest of the episode was kind of forgettable.
Fun fact: the fillers were in different order in different languages
When a video stars with a joke like that, you immediately know it's going to be amazing
Not seen the video yet. literally saw the end of Season 4 with my kid yesterday can't wait to hear your take on it.
I have been waiting for this for so longgg
I realized a parallel between Gabriel(MLB) and Pucci(JJBA: Stone Ocean)
am i the only one who realized hawk moth is voiced by the same person who voices zongli from genshin
Adrian not knowing what he wants to do when he's an adult hit me in the feels because I only have two more years in high school and my parents keep telling me I'll go to college but I'm not sure if I'm willing to waste four more years of my life also I don't even know if I want to go anywhere😐
I like the chole arc thing that happened because in some cartoons doesn’t this happen to some ani hero/ villain anyway? I can’t wait to see what’s in store for season 5.
wait until he hears abt the adrien is a sentimonster theory
I like how the absolute boredom of season 2 and 3 not counting the last few episodes of 3 helped set up 4 to be extremely interesting in comparison.
Its like being kicked so extremely low that when the quality of a 7/10 hits, it hits hard, letting you go from a "lets slog through this" to "omg this show might be interesting again"
I've been waiting so loooooong for this vid. Thanks for making it Negative Legend! Thiz iz greaaattt!!! 😄😄😄
Here he is. The only guy to make Season 4 look good.
it is SO surreal hearing Cat Noir sounding like Eren Jeager from Attack on Titan. I know its the same VA but still
I gave up half way through & now you’ve single handedly ignited my passion for this again! Thank you!
Damn I loved this video and really wish I knew where to watch the show because this season does seem amazing, especially those last couple episodes you talked about.