It's funny when you think about it - everyone knows that this storyline saved and defined Green Arrow as a character, but I only now learned that Green Lantern was on the verge of cancellation. For all we know, this run also saved Hal Jordan from obscurity and helped GL become one of DC's top properties.
@hehoneverhits You’re absolutely right. Hal Jordan was thought of as the old guy with the gray hair. I remember how shocked I was that the “Reign of the Supermen” event crossed over into Green Lantern’s series (# 46 I think?) because his character has such a low profile in 1992. Geoff Johns not only resurrected Hal Jordan, he restored him to a prominence the character had never really had previously.
I've always considered Green Arrow's liberal politics to be a socially acceptable variation of Robin Hood's code of "robbing from the rich to give to the poor." Arrow was always intended to be a modern day Robin Hood, but could never embrace Robin's outlaw ways for obvious reasons. However, as a passionate liberal, he could stand up up for the "little guy" against "The Man" (or "The System"), and these are the stories where this began.
I met and talked with Neal Adams at NY Comicon regarding this series-within-series. He basically said what you cited regarding his drug issue idea preceding Stan Lee's Spider-man "non-code issues." He was grateful that the Spider-man issues opened the door for his and Denny's story regardless of the timing. He's a great guy and he was generous with his time at the con.
@None of Your Business - Neal Adams carrying dirty diapers with him when he travels is a proven urban legend. So, I find your version of events...suspect.
Neal Adams does give Stan Lee credit for being the first to break the Comic Code Authority's strangle hold on the industry with those Amazing Spider-Man issues.
Great overview and commentary. The omnibus of this run is being reprinted with a Nov. 5, 2024 release. I have long heard about this run but came along too late to read it in its time. Looks like a Mod Squad-inspired take, as that series also addressed social issues with conflicts between the characters. I love that show so hope I'll enjoy this celebrated run. It's PC to say those three-panels are legendary, but among who? I think most fans would put the sequence of Spidey lifting up the debris way ahead of this. Your graphic skills and narration were amazing, and the content insightful and informative. Thanks!
I owned this material in various printings over the years, but never the original issues. Never was overly hyped about the stories, but the art was certainly in a class by it's self.
It is also worth noting that Gil Kane worked on the Spiderman drug story series at Marvel, and that was initiated by the US Dept of Health, Education and Welfare.
I learned about societal expectations. Phew. For me, at the idea of societal expectations are not forced upon me or many people at the very least. Instead the term "societal expectations" depends for many people in their lives and ideals. As in what is going to happen or believing how people will become in society. Not to be forced or pressured. It just takes time. This is what happened to many generations ago as well.
I believe Margaret Thatcher wanted to deal against corruption in the political landscape of Britain. She doesn't want to embrace this view. Margaret Thatcher is not having it.
I might be wrong, but I don't think that the O'Neil/Grell issues have ever been collected. Which is a shame, considering how great Mike Grell's solo Green Arrow run is.
On a related note, the recent Green Lantern 80th anniversary 100 pg spectacular contained a short piece by O'neil and Grell, done just for that book. Possibly the final material O'neil had published before his passing
It's not true that the Spider-man drug story was the first newsstand comic book without the Comics Code Authority seal in fifteen years. Even discounting Warren Magazines which were comics in every way except paper dimensions, Dell and Gold Key comics did not carry the seal, either.
It was more than a little preachy. I was an eleven year old kid and it made me mad. It wasn’t balanced. The duo of creators were in love with no powers super heroes which is weird. The art was fantastic and carried the books.
I don't know, everyone is saying how great it is that O'Neal balanced conservatism and liberalism but it sounds like he just leaned the narratives left.
I am a fan of Marvel comics, but I love DC Comics because of the things that this video demonstrates. The wiliness that DC Comics had to experiment with their characters and the williness to tell distinct types of stories and take risks. Look at Alan Moore on Swamp Things, Grant Morrison's the Invisibles, Animal Man and his superhero stories, The Specter, Statman and Hitman in the 90s, Vertigo Comics, and the Waller vs. WildStorm from its Black Label. Mature comics. Yes DC Comics had make mistakes and had its misfires but Marvel is too pedestrian with its comics.
Imagine if Dwayne McDuffie didn't pass away when he did and JLA Unlimited continued a little longer...bet you he would have did a versioxn this with Stewart, Queen, and......Kara Zor El......?😮
Superman: "Darkseid intends to destroy the Earth with his Anti-Life equation!" Green Arrow: "Then we must stop him at any cost. I don't religiously pay my taxes just to have someone destroy my planet!" Green Lantern: "You say that because, being rich, you don't mind giving money to the State. There are others who can't afford so many luxuries and yet, politicians still take their money, you know?" Superman: "Guys..." Green Arrow: "Without taxes we wouldn't have roads, sewers and many other things that make life easier, you know?" Green Lantern: "So what? If I don't give my money away willingly, it's still theft, no matter what it's used for." Superman: "Guys..." Green Arrow: "Your financial situation is good enough to easily give away a small percentage of your earnings each month, Hal. It's not that bad for you!" Green Lantern: "But it's not as stable as that of a rich man like you, you know? Also, Carol wants with all her soul that I get her pregnant. How do you want me to give the love of my life a child if the money that should support my son is spent by the president's at parties?! Anyway, I don't think you care about the baby my girl wants, considering that you didn't care at all about the one that Dinah had in her womb for only 4 weeks..." Superman: "Guys!" Green Arrow: "Dinah is a grown and responsible woman! She can do whatever she pleases with her body!" Green Lantern: "That "My body, my rules" philosophy means sh*t if it's at the cost of the life of someone who can't even defend themselves. If both of you made a mistake, then grow up and take responsibility for your actions!" Superman: "Guys!" Green Arrow: "How curious that you care about beings that have not yet been born, while you don't mid about all the children who die of misery for not being able to enter America!" Green Lantern: "Any foreigner is welcome as long as they do so following the Law. If you allow them to enter without the legal procedures, you are inviting them to not respect the law at all!" Superman: "GUYS!!!!" Green Lantern/Arrow: "WHAT?!" Superman: "Darkseid has destroyed the Earth while you were arguing..." Green Lantern/Arrow: "...He started it" *Point to each other*
I remember how "powerful" that scene in the first issue was when I was a child. Now that I've grown some, I realize that the guy for some reason didn't realize who GL was and what he actually did, and didn't seem to think he himself was a native of Earth, and was saved along with the rest of the fricking planet most times GL went into action. Hal never did ANYTHING for a specific "white" person other than Carol Ferris, so was the old guy offering to date Hal?
It would have been way more iconic a moment if in response to "what about muh oppression" GL would have said "I've saved your ass dozens of times along with everyone elses, and you're asking me what I've done for you? What have you done for me, Mr. Victim? That's what I thought. You're welcome, btw." Then GL flies off as the black man says " Motherfu..."
It's not perfect but the black man does reference GL's world saving ability. He just points out that GL has the ability to do more...if he cares to. Many in GL's position would ignore the plea but some would become stronger heroes.
@@notfromhere8889 That's ridiculous. The old geezer never once suggests what Hal's ring would be capable of doing, since he has no clue. Likely what he's hoping for is the soft fascism that Inza Nelson employed as Dr. Fate, which was ultimately shown to be a step too far. The old coot should be GRATEFUL that the Earth he LIVES on was saved repeatedly, rather than whining about his personal issues.
The books were very much of their time. An approach to telling a different kind of story with Hal (conservative) dealing with Oliver (liberal) over issues relevant to the audience. Problem was, comics fans want rock'm sock'm evil aliens who don't resemble anyone even remotely recognizable to real world counterparts. Head in the sand? Sure. But there are other places where con vs lib issues can be hashed out. I, for one, never forgave Denny and Neal making Speedy addicted to drugs. Being raised in the 50s, I see comics as "Funny Books" there to escape the humdrum of everyday problems. That said, you've done a damn fine job, as always, of encapsulating a chunk of Comics History. Thanks for that!
The odd thing is that, as John Broome had written the character from 1959-'70, you would expect Hal Jordan to be more liberal (or at least humanistic) in his outlook. The character had been willing to buck authority (The Guardians) to do what was right, and was respected by the Guardians for doing so..
@@johnminehan1148 I'd argue that both Hal and Ollie are both liberals but from two different strands. Hal being more of a classical liberal, while Ollie is more of a social liberal or social democrat. They both have the same goals in terms of freedom, but the former believes in retributive justice, while the latter is rehabilitative justice.
The thing is, John Broome, when he was writting the book, had done "relevant" stories like GL #69, which concerned student protests and change or GL # 12, which concerned a thinly disguised version of the Challe Putsch is France in 1962 (set in 58,000 AD). (Broome was living in Paris at the time.) As Broome (and Fox) had handled the charactor, Hal Jordan was always seen as an "outside the box," decisive guy who tried to balance the "needs of the many" with the "needs of the few." That is why O'Neil handling of the charactor after # 76 never rang true t me and dd not tally with O'Neil's own earlier stories like # 72.
@@johnminehan1148 Now that makes pre-O'Neil/Adams Hal Jordan even more of a liberal, in the philosophical sense; that is, he sounds more like a Hegelian liberal who tries to have it both ways by increasing human flourishing.
@@CosmoShidan I think Broome based Jordan on USAAF Fighter Pilots he had served with in WWII, confident, brave, idealistic and a bit overbearing and hyper-competitive. There is something of the popular image of John Kennedy in the portrayal.
@@beefgravystudios I'm sure none of those women who don't share their views have been attacking them... inconceivable. It's all naughty feminists causing trouble!
@@noneofyourbusiness4616 Naughty feminists causing trouble just need their cellulite covered ass spanked by a firm but fair male hand to remind them how to treat others.
Dark Wolf I agree gl saves all of 2814 which means he’s saved the world over and over . And that the people couldn’t solve their own problem seemed kinda dumb
'Arguably the most famous three panels in comic book history." No.....just no. Not even close. Any random 3 panels out of Dark Knight or Watchmen or many other masterpieces would be much more famous than these three panels.
Watchmen and Dark Knight wouldn’t have happened if this run never happened. Watchmen is filled with political symbolism and questions against the modern superhero trope. Rorschach’s character literally expresses how his fascism impacts his morals and acts of heroism. Gotham has always been used as a device for anti-fascism and he corruption impacts life.
Man. You’re making SJWs sound pretty good. But no. Comics aren’t allowed to tackle sociopolitical issues. They have to be about absolutely nothing and have no message at all! Unless of course I agree with it, in which case it’s good. Are Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns also SJW comics?
@@britshell I don't really like books that are preachy, but comics are a narrative art form where the artist can choose to make a story about whatever. Discrediting any and every book because someone tells you it's SJW propaganda is just plain stupid. Seeing opposing views in any media and actually thinking about it instead discrediting it because you're told by others that it's stupid might help you stop being a little boy with his dad's shoes on.
@@shortstuf1105 I bet you would change your tune if you disagreed withe message of the book. But since it confirms your bias you say we should all read it and take it's message into consideration.
@@britshell I honestly think it's very important to look at opinions that completely go against your morals/values and consider why you think the way you think. Most of my friends are polar opposites to me politically and in regards to thoughts on social issues. Do I only talk about politics or thoughts on social issues? No. But I think those conversations and experiences with media are extremely important to not exist in a constant circle of confirmation with no outside or controversial opinions.
@@alfieingrouille1528 Actually, you are right. At least it was counter culture back then, and being done by mostly competent people.. not hacks and shills.
That image of the two screaming in each other's faces is one of the most enduring in the entire industry.
And without context, it's hilarious.
"Fighting the good fight."
That artwork was done years later, though.
It's funny when you think about it - everyone knows that this storyline saved and defined Green Arrow as a character, but I only now learned that Green Lantern was on the verge of cancellation. For all we know, this run also saved Hal Jordan from obscurity and helped GL become one of DC's top properties.
You know, that's a good point. Green lantern could have gotten canceled and faded away to obscurity if this experimentation hadn't occurred.
In an alternate universe this run never happened and GL was cancelled. Instead of a GL shirt in my closet I have a Plastic man shirt.
@hehoneverhits You’re absolutely right. Hal Jordan was thought of as the old guy with the gray hair. I remember how shocked I was that the “Reign of the Supermen” event crossed over into Green Lantern’s series (# 46 I think?) because his character has such a low profile in 1992. Geoff Johns not only resurrected Hal Jordan, he restored him to a prominence the character had never really had previously.
I've always considered Green Arrow's liberal politics to be a socially acceptable variation of Robin Hood's code of "robbing from the rich to give to the poor." Arrow was always intended to be a modern day Robin Hood, but could never embrace Robin's outlaw ways for obvious reasons. However, as a passionate liberal, he could stand up up for the "little guy" against "The Man" (or "The System"), and these are the stories where this began.
R.I.P. both Mr's O'Neil and Adams.
6:40 funny. For a guy called “Speedy”, heroine certainly isn’t the drug you’d expect him to get hooked on.
I met and talked with Neal Adams at NY Comicon regarding this series-within-series. He basically said what you cited regarding his drug issue idea preceding Stan Lee's Spider-man "non-code issues." He was grateful that the Spider-man issues opened the door for his and Denny's story regardless of the timing. He's a great guy and he was generous with his time at the con.
Awesome. I've been told he's a very charismatic gentleman that interacts very well with the fans. Good to hear another story that confirms this.
@@StrangeBrainParts he once cut me off in traffic, and when I protested he threw a dirty diaper in my face
@@noneofyourbusiness4616 I am very sorry to hear this...i'm sure that was an emotionally polarizing incident. Please hang in there!
@None of Your Business - Neal Adams carrying dirty diapers with him when he travels is a proven urban legend. So, I find your version of events...suspect.
@@StrangeBrainParts It was actually a copy of the comic "Mr. T and the T-Force," but it read like a dirty diaper.
Neal Adams does give Stan Lee credit for being the first to break the Comic Code Authority's strangle hold on the industry with those Amazing Spider-Man issues.
Great overview and commentary. The omnibus of this run is being reprinted with a Nov. 5, 2024 release. I have long heard about this run but came along too late to read it in its time. Looks like a Mod Squad-inspired take, as that series also addressed social issues with conflicts between the characters. I love that show so hope I'll enjoy this celebrated run. It's PC to say those three-panels are legendary, but among who? I think most fans would put the sequence of Spidey lifting up the debris way ahead of this. Your graphic skills and narration were amazing, and the content insightful and informative. Thanks!
I owned this material in various printings over the years, but never the original issues. Never was overly hyped about the stories, but the art was certainly in a class by it's self.
i always heard about this storyline but didnt know the specifics. Thanks a lot!
Thanks for watching! I'm glad I could clarify the series for you.
Thanks for choosing this one. Shows people can work together and be friends despite differing political views. What a concept.
Who would win in a battle of wits: Big green magic space cop man, or one green pointy-sticked beardy anarchy boi?
What I'd give for a softcover trade of that book!
"This veracity of the anecdote is...difficult to confirm." :)
It is also worth noting that Gil Kane worked on the Spiderman drug story series at Marvel, and that was initiated by the US Dept of Health, Education and Welfare.
I learned about societal expectations. Phew. For me, at the idea of societal expectations are not forced upon me or many people at the very least. Instead the term "societal expectations" depends for many people in their lives and ideals. As in what is going to happen or believing how people will become in society. Not to be forced or pressured. It just takes time. This is what happened to many generations ago as well.
I believe Margaret Thatcher wanted to deal against corruption in the political landscape of Britain. She doesn't want to embrace this view. Margaret Thatcher is not having it.
ace video, as always!
Thanks! I'm glad you enjoyed it.
7:50 I always looked at this cover as Hal getting a little back at Ollie with that statement.
I love this part of the sliver age green lantern
Did you cover the Mike Grell issues immediately afterward too?
I might be wrong, but I don't think that the O'Neil/Grell issues have ever been collected. Which is a shame, considering how great Mike Grell's solo Green Arrow run is.
@@Maxwell03 It just came out in hardcover. It's called "Space Travelling Heroes" would love a revie.
@@tonyyoung3985You're right. Although the final few issues still aren't collected. To my knowledge it's up in the air if they will be reprinted.
On a related note, the recent Green Lantern 80th anniversary 100 pg spectacular contained a short piece by O'neil and Grell, done just for that book. Possibly the final material O'neil had published before his passing
It's not true that the Spider-man drug story was the first newsstand comic book without the Comics Code Authority seal in fifteen years. Even discounting Warren Magazines which were comics in every way except paper dimensions, Dell and Gold Key comics did not carry the seal, either.
I have the ominous of this run I love it was so good I kinda need to reread it
Omnibus..?.
Ah yes, the All in the Family of DC Comics
Adams did do a drug story . . . . in the second Deadman story in Strange Adventures in 1967 and the CCA approved it for some reason.
It was more than a little preachy. I was an eleven year old kid and it made me mad. It wasn’t balanced. The duo of creators were in love with no powers super heroes which is weird. The art was fantastic and carried the books.
I don't know, everyone is saying how great it is that O'Neal balanced conservatism and liberalism but it sounds like he just leaned the narratives left.
I am a fan of Marvel comics, but I love DC Comics because of the things that this video demonstrates. The wiliness that DC Comics had to experiment with their characters and the williness to tell distinct types of stories and take risks. Look at Alan Moore on Swamp Things, Grant Morrison's the Invisibles, Animal Man and his superhero stories, The Specter, Statman and Hitman in the 90s, Vertigo Comics, and the Waller vs. WildStorm from its Black Label. Mature comics. Yes DC Comics had make mistakes and had its misfires but Marvel is too pedestrian with its comics.
Imagine if Dwayne McDuffie didn't pass away when he did and JLA Unlimited continued a little longer...bet you he would have did a versioxn this with Stewart, Queen, and......Kara Zor El......?😮
I'm trying to read preview catalogs from 2004-2006 hahaha they're hard to find was hoping someone could assist
I love how this run balances the two political views without forcing one.
Now that's how you do politics.
*ahchoo* someone must have invoked false equivalence, that always makes my nose act up
@@koushiro86 ?
Superman: "Darkseid intends to destroy the Earth with his Anti-Life equation!"
Green Arrow: "Then we must stop him at any cost. I don't religiously pay my taxes just to have someone destroy my planet!"
Green Lantern: "You say that because, being rich, you don't mind giving money to the State. There are others who can't afford so many luxuries and yet, politicians still take their money, you know?"
Superman: "Guys..."
Green Arrow: "Without taxes we wouldn't have roads, sewers and many other things that make life easier, you know?"
Green Lantern: "So what? If I don't give my money away willingly, it's still theft, no matter what it's used for."
Superman: "Guys..."
Green Arrow: "Your financial situation is good enough to easily give away a small percentage of your earnings each month, Hal. It's not that bad for you!"
Green Lantern: "But it's not as stable as that of a rich man like you, you know? Also, Carol wants with all her soul that I get her pregnant. How do you want me to give the love of my life a child if the money that should support my son is spent by the president's at parties?! Anyway, I don't think you care about the baby my girl wants, considering that you didn't care at all about the one that Dinah had in her womb for only 4 weeks..."
Superman: "Guys!"
Green Arrow: "Dinah is a grown and responsible woman! She can do whatever she pleases with her body!"
Green Lantern: "That "My body, my rules" philosophy means sh*t if it's at the cost of the life of someone who can't even defend themselves. If both of you made a mistake, then grow up and take responsibility for your actions!"
Superman: "Guys!"
Green Arrow: "How curious that you care about beings that have not yet been born, while you don't mid about all the children who die of misery for not being able to enter America!"
Green Lantern: "Any foreigner is welcome as long as they do so following the Law. If you allow them to enter without the legal procedures, you are inviting them to not respect the law at all!"
Superman: "GUYS!!!!"
Green Lantern/Arrow: "WHAT?!"
Superman: "Darkseid has destroyed the Earth while you were arguing..."
Green Lantern/Arrow: "...He started it" *Point to each other*
I think that page with the three panels with the black man is the most powerful page in all of comic book history
I remember how "powerful" that scene in the first issue was when I was a child. Now that I've grown some, I realize that the guy for some reason didn't realize who GL was and what he actually did, and didn't seem to think he himself was a native of Earth, and was saved along with the rest of the fricking planet most times GL went into action. Hal never did ANYTHING for a specific "white" person other than Carol Ferris, so was the old guy offering to date Hal?
😂😂I thought I was the only one that realized how strange that scene was.
I always just found it dumb.
It would have been way more iconic a moment if in response to "what about muh oppression" GL would have said "I've saved your ass dozens of times along with everyone elses, and you're asking me what I've done for you? What have you done for me, Mr. Victim? That's what I thought. You're welcome, btw." Then GL flies off as the black man says " Motherfu..."
It's not perfect but the black man does reference GL's world saving ability. He just points out that GL has the ability to do more...if he cares to. Many in GL's position would ignore the plea but some would become stronger heroes.
@@notfromhere8889 That's ridiculous. The old geezer never once suggests what Hal's ring would be capable of doing, since he has no clue. Likely what he's hoping for is the soft fascism that Inza Nelson employed as Dr. Fate, which was ultimately shown to be a step too far. The old coot should be GRATEFUL that the Earth he LIVES on was saved repeatedly, rather than whining about his personal issues.
Speedy...What’s in a name?
GA as a leftist, except he shot boy scout which clearly was a symbol of government in Miller's view.
😎 cool
Is anyone watching this in 2022
The distribution did not like the book. Comics journal
"The fascism of the leftists" bruh
literal nonsense, a perfect fit for fantasy comics
@@koushiro86 delusional
You know it can happen right?
Fascism isn’t exclusive of the right
The books were very much of their time. An approach to telling a different kind of story with Hal (conservative) dealing with Oliver (liberal) over issues relevant to the audience. Problem was, comics fans want rock'm sock'm evil aliens who don't resemble anyone even remotely recognizable to real world counterparts. Head in the sand? Sure. But there are other places where con vs lib issues can be hashed out. I, for one, never forgave Denny and Neal making Speedy addicted to drugs. Being raised in the 50s, I see comics as "Funny Books" there to escape the humdrum of everyday problems. That said, you've done a damn fine job, as always, of encapsulating a chunk of Comics History. Thanks for that!
The odd thing is that, as John Broome had written the character from 1959-'70, you would expect Hal Jordan to be more liberal (or at least humanistic) in his outlook. The character had been willing to buck authority (The Guardians) to do what was right, and was respected by the Guardians for doing so..
@@johnminehan1148 I'd argue that both Hal and Ollie are both liberals but from two different strands. Hal being more of a classical liberal, while Ollie is more of a social liberal or social democrat. They both have the same goals in terms of freedom, but the former believes in retributive justice, while the latter is rehabilitative justice.
The thing is, John Broome, when he was writting the book, had done "relevant" stories like GL #69, which concerned student protests and change or GL # 12, which concerned a thinly disguised version of the Challe Putsch is France in 1962 (set in 58,000 AD). (Broome was living in Paris at the time.) As Broome (and Fox) had handled the charactor, Hal Jordan was always seen as an "outside the box," decisive guy who tried to balance the "needs of the many" with the "needs of the few." That is why O'Neil handling of the charactor after # 76 never rang true t me and dd not tally with O'Neil's own earlier stories like # 72.
@@johnminehan1148 Now that makes pre-O'Neil/Adams Hal Jordan even more of a liberal, in the philosophical sense; that is, he sounds more like a Hegelian liberal who tries to have it both ways by increasing human flourishing.
@@CosmoShidan I think Broome based Jordan on USAAF Fighter Pilots he had served with in WWII, confident, brave, idealistic and a bit overbearing and hyper-competitive. There is something of the popular image of John Kennedy in the portrayal.
5:58 Well, it looks like he was spot on about the feminist movement. So called liberated women hate either men and their feminine nature.
Spoken like someone who hasn't had listened to what women are saying and prefers to watch TH-cam videos which reinforce his fears and resentments.
I sincerely doubt that YOU ever listened to a liberal woman long enough to know what she thought!
They also attack other women that don't share their views
@@beefgravystudios I'm sure none of those women who don't share their views have been attacking them... inconceivable. It's all naughty feminists causing trouble!
@@noneofyourbusiness4616 Naughty feminists causing trouble just need their cellulite covered ass spanked by a firm but fair male hand to remind them how to treat others.
God this run is overrated
Dark Wolf it’s a half ass attempt
Dark Wolf the people praising it cause they are told it’s good . I read it and it’s boring af
Dark Wolf I agree gl saves all of 2814 which means he’s saved the world over and over . And that the people couldn’t solve their own problem seemed kinda dumb
I read and I loved it
I thought #76 was solid and #89 is close to a masterpiece, the rest are well intentioned but uneven.@@itsnotme987
'Arguably the most famous three panels in comic book history." No.....just no. Not even close. Any random 3 panels out of Dark Knight or Watchmen or many other masterpieces would be much more famous than these three panels.
Watchmen and Dark Knight wouldn’t have happened if this run never happened. Watchmen is filled with political symbolism and questions against the modern superhero trope. Rorschach’s character literally expresses how his fascism impacts his morals and acts of heroism. Gotham has always been used as a device for anti-fascism and he corruption impacts life.
Bro is mad
But comics aren't supposed to have politics
No one has ever said that wdym by that?
The first SJW comic... ugh.
Man. You’re making SJWs sound pretty good.
But no. Comics aren’t allowed to tackle sociopolitical issues. They have to be about absolutely nothing and have no message at all! Unless of course I agree with it, in which case it’s good.
Are Watchmen and The Dark Knight Returns also SJW comics?
@@elijahfordsidioticvarietys8770 When you grow up you will understand.
@@britshell I don't really like books that are preachy, but comics are a narrative art form where the artist can choose to make a story about whatever. Discrediting any and every book because someone tells you it's SJW propaganda is just plain stupid. Seeing opposing views in any media and actually thinking about it instead discrediting it because you're told by others that it's stupid might help you stop being a little boy with his dad's shoes on.
@@shortstuf1105 I bet you would change your tune if you disagreed withe message of the book. But since it confirms your bias you say we should all read it and take it's message into consideration.
@@britshell I honestly think it's very important to look at opinions that completely go against your morals/values and consider why you think the way you think. Most of my friends are polar opposites to me politically and in regards to thoughts on social issues. Do I only talk about politics or thoughts on social issues? No. But I think those conversations and experiences with media are extremely important to not exist in a constant circle of confirmation with no outside or controversial opinions.
The woke stuff back in the day was just as cringe as now.
Nah it was way better back then
@@alfieingrouille1528 Actually, you are right. At least it was counter culture back then, and being done by mostly competent people.. not hacks and shills.