Love this fella from Norwich. And it is really good to learn how it all works. It does make you wonder whether any external investment should be allowed at all. If they were all operating off the same budgets then philosophy and organisation and quality would win out. As it is, it amazes me to realise that Norwich are the only club in the PL without external investment
I agree, how is anyone okay with their club being owned by business men who only care about profit or a human rights abusing state? I think fan ownership is the way forward, even if it means a drop in quality, football should be about community, passion and solidarity, not just who has the most money
Most championship sides and even some league 1 sides have far richer owners. It's amazing they're competitive at all considering the owners are worth around 30M combined.
Yeah ban premier league investment sounds great in theory but in reality the quality would drop like a stone and some other league would use the premier league as a tuck shop
@@jimboslice4468 that's my point, I would prefer the quality to drop if it meant football could be owned by the fans and was actually about the football rather than who has the most money. Obviously it's just my opinion but who cares how good the players your club can buy are if that money comes from exploitation, environmental destruction or, in the case of Newcastle, a state currently committing genocide in Yemen.
@@antony558 1) You presume the rich owners don't care about their clubs. Most do. 2) you presume fan-owned club= well-run club. I present to you, Schalke 04.
Everyone hates nepotism in football but Delia Smith appointing her son Dean was definitely the right choice. The recent interview they both did on North Norfolk Digital really painted a bright future for Norwich.
Genuinely the presenting level and indepth analysis of the TIFO crew is the best around right now, far more entertaining and incisive than what is shown on TV.
Just remember this comment from Super Hans in the very last episode of peep show 'Norwich are never gonna win the league, but they still turn up every week, don't they, the pricks'.
McLean definitely not Prem quality, struggled to get in the team in the championship, suits Smiths longer ball style but not a long term solution (from a frustrated Norwich Fan)
JJ's an Aberdeen fan and still thinks of Mclean as an attacking mid because he scored a lot of goals for them in that position in Scotland. Norwich, for going on three years now, have used Mclean exclusively as a central midfielder. In the championship he was a box to box midfielder, able to do more attacking because Skipp was there covering the defence but now in the prem Mclean's contribution is largely defensive because we don't have an out and out DM.
Let’s hope this continues to age like milk! Big difference since this was filmed, especially in the last couple of games, is that we are now playing a 4-4-2 and not trying to play through the lines in possession (in fact, we are probably the most direct side in the league atm). Sargent playing wide in defence but joining the front two when we are in position to attack.
had no idea this channel existed as a fan of the regular channel. maybe give it a little more video and description promotion, because even as a football mad individual, you are getting lost in the algorithm for views that aren't direct from your social media/The Athletic. got SO MUCH CONTENT now though to catch up on! Cheers guys!
I think JJ nailed it at 20:47 but they didn’t really elaborate on it. The defensive midfield ‘6’ is so crucial to not only a newly promoted team, but a team that wants to build from the back. Norwich replaced alex tettey (Norwich legend) and Ollie skipp (3rd best player last year, now starts for Spurs) with normann who’s looked good but couldn’t stay fit, and gilmour, who has quality but lacks the physicality and defensive nous to play as the deepest midfielder for a team that doesn’t have the ball for the majority of the game. In terms of breaking the cycle, yo-yos don’t go up and down forever. If norwich got 2-3 consecutive seasons in the prem, they’d suddenly be a very attractive option for potential investors. If norwich got 2-3 consecutive years in championship, without parachute payments there will be 14-15 clubs with bigger budgets than theirs, and they could require another 2018/19-esque miracle to break back out. For this reason it’s understandable why they didn’t mind being a “top 26 team” even though that aim has since changed to “top 17 team”
The PL is awash with dirty money - oil barons, hedge funds. Norwich is owned by Delia. She bakes cakes. Dear little Norwich. A football club run the right way.
It's really interesting to me that rashica wasn't really mentioned at all. He was Werder Bremen's lifeline when he played there but appearently his move to the Prem didn't work out at all...Same with Sargent, but even Bremen fans weren't sold on him. At least Norwich isn't Greuter Fürth-fucked with 6pts out of 20 games
Rasicha's not got a goal involvement in the league yet, but Norwich play much better with him in the team. He's been very unlucky with a few of his chances and obvioisly his injury didn't help as he was out for like 2 months.
Rashica took a few games to settle but soon after looked like the dangerous attacking threat we sorely needed. Unfortunately he then got injured for a month or 2, but has recently come back and made an immediate positive impact
I try to make an effort not to cut in on these things, but I think when JJ was butchering Norwich’s quality near the start, Milot probably deserved a highlight.
After JJ highlighted certain Prem-quality players at the start, I would have loved to have heard Michael's thoughts on Gilmour, McLean & Krull being highlighted and Rashica & Normann not; Michael would have just torn JJ apart right there and then 😅 A Norwich fan and On The Ball regular listener.
As an American, I'm happy to admit I'm more interested in what he can offer the national team. That said, he needs to perform at the club level to get his spot back in the usmnt. Therefore, up the canaries! Up the American!
@@Prederick I feel like Norwich and Fulham yo-yo in parallel with each other every year. Like they’re sharing a place in the Premier League and get a year each together. When was the last time they played a league game against each other??
Honestly the most interesting thing this season is how bad Norwich have been while still being reasonably in touch with everyone else in the league. An absolutely damning indictment of how poor the bottom of the Premier League is this year
Would be really interesting to see a video what kind of model a club should adopt if they're looking to get promoted from the championship and then establish themselves in the prem. Fulham and Norwich's models (quite different) seem to mean that they can't string together a few years in the prem and just swap around between themselves, Middlesbrough splashed out a few years ago and were dreadful, Watford just try and sustain success through new manager boosts... What approach could actually be sustainable and successful in the long term? Villa spring to mind, but they have owners who are quite happy (for now) to sink as much into the club as they are allowed - what happens when FFP prevents investment (Everton), or they get bored/fed up with pumping money into the club for it to not work out?
I think it’s very hypocritical that we criticise Norwich for being financially cautious and sensible, while at the same time bemoaning PSG, Man City etc, for spending ridiculous amounts of money and getting angry when clubs like Derby or Bury go into administration because they are financially irresponsible.
26:45 this is a point that a lot of fans from low table premier league clubs could take on board. Be careful what you wish for, enjoy the wins when they come, and sometimes it’s nice being a respected club at a certain level. Sometimes you don’t need to shoot for the stars and compete for Europe
Norwich as a benevolent force is the way I think of it, they buy cheap and have the option to develop players at both a premier league and championship level.
An Edge of Tomorrow reference on a football discussion about Norwich? Sign me up. And it is hard to sustain a club model like this, but spending a lot doesn't guarantee PL safety also. Fulham's destroying the Championship currently, but they were also pretty rubbish in the PL last time. I think Brighton has the right balance, but even so, if it's true that Norwich's budget is THAT significantly lower, then it might be difficult to even do things like Brighton. Winning the Championship every time you get relegated is pretty fun though.
Love the content and guests as always, just a small thing in terms of shooting--I think the wide angle is great, but the shot is a little awkward. One of the lights kind of just blocks out JJ, and the tactics board on the right third of the screen isn't quite engaging enough visually to make the shot worthwhile. Love cutting to it for more variety, but would like to see another look in an upcoming video! Cheers!
I like to compare being a Norwich fan right now, with relegation looming, as what it is like when you have your first really shitty week at work at your first proper job. You start to think, "is this it? Is this all I can expect from now on?". Finding a pleasant answer to that means finding your happiness elsewhere.
Don't think Krul is prem level anymore. Its not like their results are down to him, but there's a goal in every two or three games that could have been saved by a good keeper. He even tried out for the Euros and Turkey exposed him quite badly in a 4-2 WCQ loss last spring.
![[TH] 2024 PMSL SEA W2D1 | Fall | ต่อเนื่อง ในสัปดาห์สอง](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ElcO9uC_Dbk/mqdefault.jpg)
"Hello, and welcome to 'Norwich are f**ked!'"
"This was filmed before Norwich beat Everton."
GOD I love Tifo IRL.
And now the Watford result 😂
What this video perfectly shows is that, while in-depth tactical analysis is really good, you do just have to say "we're f***ed" sometimes
P
Norwich is in 17th? Not fucked
@@finngrunfeld2077 pushin 🅿️
Definitely not f&@£ed as it stands. 💚💛😆
@@michaeljbailey As a Villa fan, I really hope they aren't for Dean Smith's sake
JJ's "It's cuz the team sucks" had me dead and is just too true sadly
And just before that, he announced: "I think I've identified the problem."
I’m sorry your dead now
2:37
Love this fella from Norwich. And it is really good to learn how it all works. It does make you wonder whether any external investment should be allowed at all. If they were all operating off the same budgets then philosophy and organisation and quality would win out. As it is, it amazes me to realise that Norwich are the only club in the PL without external investment
I agree, how is anyone okay with their club being owned by business men who only care about profit or a human rights abusing state? I think fan ownership is the way forward, even if it means a drop in quality, football should be about community, passion and solidarity, not just who has the most money
Most championship sides and even some league 1 sides have far richer owners. It's amazing they're competitive at all considering the owners are worth around 30M combined.
Yeah ban premier league investment sounds great in theory but in reality the quality would drop like a stone and some other league would use the premier league as a tuck shop
@@jimboslice4468 that's my point, I would prefer the quality to drop if it meant football could be owned by the fans and was actually about the football rather than who has the most money. Obviously it's just my opinion but who cares how good the players your club can buy are if that money comes from exploitation, environmental destruction or, in the case of Newcastle, a state currently committing genocide in Yemen.
@@antony558 1) You presume the rich owners don't care about their clubs. Most do.
2) you presume fan-owned club= well-run club. I present to you, Schalke 04.
Everyone hates nepotism in football but Delia Smith appointing her son Dean was definitely the right choice. The recent interview they both did on North Norfolk Digital really painted a bright future for Norwich.
I hope this is a joke, as dean is not delia's son
@@anubhav111196 It's a joke
@@anubhav111196 Wooshy Wooshy Woosh-Woosh!
Have to admit I was thinking “What do you mean Dean is Delias son?!”…then I seen North Norfolk Digital 😂
lol, i actually googled to verify this.. u got me
Norwich’s form is stuck in the scattergram
🎵Norwich city is stuck inside the scattergram 🎵
@@TSTypeR 🎵A Scattergram is a plot🎵
🎵Of point referencing two🎵
🎵Variables! 🎵
Trust tifo to put up a "Norwich are fucked" video only for them to somehow get two wins on the bounce. You really could write it.
YUP ,that aged well
Next year in the same date I’m expecting the same analysis about Fulham when they inevitable replace Norwich and went down again the following season.
And then the year after we back to Norwich as usual ofc.
Fulham are really the anti-Norwich in terms of model though
west brom are probably a better comparison. Fulham are more akin to watford
And about mitrović being the Messi of Championship, and not quite as good as Messi vs teams in the premier league
@@whittar Feel like that could well become an infinite loop. Norwich and Fulham will never again meet one another in the football league.
Norwich are the most consistent team in their finishing positions, 21st, 20th and 21st in the last three seasons
Good grouping🎯
I stumbled on their match against Crystal Palace from December and loved the fans doing the 'let's pretend we scored a goal' chant and action.
JJ looks rather distressed at someone else playing with his tactics board.
Genuinely the presenting level and indepth analysis of the TIFO crew is the best around right now, far more entertaining and incisive than what is shown on TV.
Tifo IRL and especially Joe Devine are so much different from the Tifo football videos and I love it. Perfect balance of funny and serious
Check out the podcast if you haven't already, very similar tone
"In your face Tifo IRL!" -- Josh Sargent
Just remember this comment from Super Hans in the very last episode of peep show 'Norwich are never gonna win the league, but they still turn up every week, don't they, the pricks'.
McLean definitely not Prem quality, struggled to get in the team in the championship, suits Smiths longer ball style but not a long term solution (from a frustrated Norwich Fan)
JJ's an Aberdeen fan and still thinks of Mclean as an attacking mid because he scored a lot of goals for them in that position in Scotland. Norwich, for going on three years now, have used Mclean exclusively as a central midfielder. In the championship he was a box to box midfielder, able to do more attacking because Skipp was there covering the defence but now in the prem Mclean's contribution is largely defensive because we don't have an out and out DM.
Mount quality would be limited if he was used in number 6 with no license to go forward either
Let’s hope this continues to age like milk! Big difference since this was filmed, especially in the last couple of games, is that we are now playing a 4-4-2 and not trying to play through the lines in possession (in fact, we are probably the most direct side in the league atm). Sargent playing wide in defence but joining the front two when we are in position to attack.
Aged like milk
had no idea this channel existed as a fan of the regular channel. maybe give it a little more video and description promotion, because even as a football mad individual, you are getting lost in the algorithm for views that aren't direct from your social media/The Athletic.
got SO MUCH CONTENT now though to catch up on! Cheers guys!
I think JJ nailed it at 20:47 but they didn’t really elaborate on it. The defensive midfield ‘6’ is so crucial to not only a newly promoted team, but a team that wants to build from the back. Norwich replaced alex tettey (Norwich legend) and Ollie skipp (3rd best player last year, now starts for Spurs) with normann who’s looked good but couldn’t stay fit, and gilmour, who has quality but lacks the physicality and defensive nous to play as the deepest midfielder for a team that doesn’t have the ball for the majority of the game.
In terms of breaking the cycle, yo-yos don’t go up and down forever. If norwich got 2-3 consecutive seasons in the prem, they’d suddenly be a very attractive option for potential investors. If norwich got 2-3 consecutive years in championship, without parachute payments there will be 14-15 clubs with bigger budgets than theirs, and they could require another 2018/19-esque miracle to break back out. For this reason it’s understandable why they didn’t mind being a “top 26 team” even though that aim has since changed to “top 17 team”
This is fantastic content! Much better than anything on SKY or BT
I love how Norwich just found all the form
I can't express how much I love TIFO great show today, great journalists and Michael Bailey was excellent on the show!
This video seems to have catalysed Norwich’s upturn! Keep it up guys ;)
Really enjoyed this guys!
they have now won 2 on the trot lol
A very interesting point brought up by the Norwich reporter, the problem of inflated internal payments during promotion.
The PL is awash with dirty money - oil barons, hedge funds. Norwich is owned by Delia. She bakes cakes. Dear little Norwich. A football club run the right way.
A football club that's going down
Not necessarily the right way in order to survive
This aged horribly
Shouldn't get to ahead of myself , Norwich winning 2 in a row and one away is maybe the least likely thing to have ever happened.
My comment aged horribly!!!!
I was hoping for more uncle Damien (pardon my spelling) anecdotes, would've been quite special if Joe got him on as a guest for this episode
won both matches since this was made
They heard about the video and took it personally
I'm enjoying these club review videos with the athletic correspondents and would love to see more of them 👍
It's really interesting to me that rashica wasn't really mentioned at all. He was Werder Bremen's lifeline when he played there but appearently his move to the Prem didn't work out at all...Same with Sargent, but even Bremen fans weren't sold on him.
At least Norwich isn't Greuter Fürth-fucked with 6pts out of 20 games
Actually they did mention Rashica at 11:00
@@anubhav111196 Ah you're actually right :D Guess I completely missed that. Maybe I skipped ahead just right there
Rasicha's not got a goal involvement in the league yet, but Norwich play much better with him in the team. He's been very unlucky with a few of his chances and obvioisly his injury didn't help as he was out for like 2 months.
Rashica took a few games to settle but soon after looked like the dangerous attacking threat we sorely needed. Unfortunately he then got injured for a month or 2, but has recently come back and made an immediate positive impact
I try to make an effort not to cut in on these things, but I think when JJ was butchering Norwich’s quality near the start, Milot probably deserved a highlight.
Can each member of tifo give us a tour of their fm saves?
what timing this video is! just after norwich win and just before they win again!!
What problem?
Well this has aged well
After JJ highlighted certain Prem-quality players at the start, I would have loved to have heard Michael's thoughts on Gilmour, McLean & Krull being highlighted and Rashica & Normann not; Michael would have just torn JJ apart right there and then 😅
A Norwich fan and On The Ball regular listener.
Josh Sargent took offense to being left out of JJ's good players section
Exactly the reaction I was hoping for.
As an American, I'm happy to admit I'm more interested in what he can offer the national team. That said, he needs to perform at the club level to get his spot back in the usmnt. Therefore, up the canaries! Up the American!
You feel bad for Norwich. Too good for the Championship but not good enough for the Prem. The forever yoyo club.
Speaking as a Fulham fan, yes, I know that awful, awful sensation.
To be fair, you can only be a yo-yo club for so long, eventually you will either be good enough or completely fucked
@@Prederick I feel like Norwich and Fulham yo-yo in parallel with each other every year. Like they’re sharing a place in the Premier League and get a year each together. When was the last time they played a league game against each other??
@@harrymcmullen2227 I might be wrong, but it was the 12/13 season?
@@valsan1323 17/18 when fulham first came up
I'd love to see a similar video about Watford. So many coach changes
This aged well lol. After watching this, I've half started to route fot them.
Honestly the most interesting thing this season is how bad Norwich have been while still being reasonably in touch with everyone else in the league. An absolutely damning indictment of how poor the bottom of the Premier League is this year
Was really hoping to see Uncle Damien on the panel
such a great video; and michael is super likeable. can't wait for more!
This is aging well
Would be really interesting to see a video what kind of model a club should adopt if they're looking to get promoted from the championship and then establish themselves in the prem. Fulham and Norwich's models (quite different) seem to mean that they can't string together a few years in the prem and just swap around between themselves, Middlesbrough splashed out a few years ago and were dreadful, Watford just try and sustain success through new manager boosts... What approach could actually be sustainable and successful in the long term? Villa spring to mind, but they have owners who are quite happy (for now) to sink as much into the club as they are allowed - what happens when FFP prevents investment (Everton), or they get bored/fed up with pumping money into the club for it to not work out?
Good to hear about not a top 6 team. Would love some videos on championship clubs
Norwich as of January 21, 2022 has escaped the relegation zone.
I love how chaotic tifo irl is in contrast to the original channel
If Michael Bailey is on Tifo, does that mean Joe Devine is going to appear on On The Ball? Hopefully with Uncle Damian.
Wow. This should definitely happen.
@@michaeljbailey Joe is very good at turning anything into an advert for The Athletic if nothing else!
And now norwich have back to back wins and are out of the relegation zone
Classic timing
As a Hammers fan can I ask you to do a "why West Ham will never make it to the Champions League" next?
No offence to Antonio but they need a prolific striker I think.
This was filmed before Norwich beat Everton and Watford.
I think it’s very hypocritical that we criticise Norwich for being financially cautious and sensible, while at the same time bemoaning PSG, Man City etc, for spending ridiculous amounts of money and getting angry when clubs like Derby or Bury go into administration because they are financially irresponsible.
Football fans are fickle
Yes. This all over.
See the brain dead click baiting baffoons known as Talksport!
Norwich beat Watford 3-0 away just to annoy Joe.
Hey @tifo plz do a detailed video on brighton and their tactics they show variety in the way they set up and the fluidity plz....
26:45 this is a point that a lot of fans from low table premier league clubs could take on board. Be careful what you wish for, enjoy the wins when they come, and sometimes it’s nice being a respected club at a certain level. Sometimes you don’t need to shoot for the stars and compete for Europe
I always assumed Joe did support Norwich
Michael Bailey = legend
Fantastic episode!
Idah and Omobamidele are good at least
Norwich as a benevolent force is the way I think of it, they buy cheap and have the option to develop players at both a premier league and championship level.
I thought uncle Damian would be here
Love how Chelsea fans will still pretend Gilmour is as class as Skipp was for them
Love these videos, I feel for the pain behind Michael's eyes.
i agree on the players however i think normann is mid table pl quality rashica too
2:46 is the highlight of the video... 🤷🏻♂️
Like for the "This was recorded before Norwich battered Everton" correction.
An Edge of Tomorrow reference on a football discussion about Norwich? Sign me up.
And it is hard to sustain a club model like this, but spending a lot doesn't guarantee PL safety also. Fulham's destroying the Championship currently, but they were also pretty rubbish in the PL last time. I think Brighton has the right balance, but even so, if it's true that Norwich's budget is THAT significantly lower, then it might be difficult to even do things like Brighton.
Winning the Championship every time you get relegated is pretty fun though.
Michael Bailey the 🐐🐐🐐
Guys did someone remember the FIFA 19 song wich started like „so were should I begin“ when the guy with mac said this on the 1 minute?
Mathias Normann is class - need more talk on him.
The Tom Cruise movie Joe is referring to is Edge of Tomorrow - an excellent sc-fi action movie that's terribly underrated.
If ever subscribe to The Athletic, It'd be only because I love Tifo so much
That was excellent. Michael Bailey was sensational.
Thanks Joshua, I’m going to clip this!
Print it, frame it. You earned it mate... so nice to hear from a high quality journalist.
The entire awkward Tom Cruise digression had me in knots!
Love the content and guests as always, just a small thing in terms of shooting--I think the wide angle is great, but the shot is a little awkward. One of the lights kind of just blocks out JJ, and the tactics board on the right third of the screen isn't quite engaging enough visually to make the shot worthwhile. Love cutting to it for more variety, but would like to see another look in an upcoming video! Cheers!
That ICE. LAND. EVERYWHERE. edit was art
I want to meet Joe Divine... Such a funny man!
Cucumbers.
In 2023 Andrew Omobamidele did in fact go to Nottingham Forrest but for £11 million not 8
Edge of Tomorrow is a great film, Joe
…cucumbers
I’m so glad Tifo IRL embraced the surrealism of Joseph Bovine.
You guys should do a feature on Sheffield Wednesday. The last 8 years has been a hell of a ride!!
Now we need a video on Burnley
This was an amusing vid, hope they stay up for some reason :)
The film joe was referencing is called the edge of tommorow would recommend a watch
A newton's cradle except the 3 balls are named Norwich, West Brom and Fulham & each end of the spectrum are the championship and the Premier league
This has aged quickly, and poorly. 2 wins OTBC.
Scary Dean Smith drawing
Cucumbers
cucumbers
Love this! Please do Reading and Derby next. The championship points deduction boys
Up the boys!
Is Burnley also going fo have a comeback if you guys do a video on them?
I like to compare being a Norwich fan right now, with relegation looming, as what it is like when you have your first really shitty week at work at your first proper job. You start to think, "is this it? Is this all I can expect from now on?". Finding a pleasant answer to that means finding your happiness elsewhere.
Don't think Krul is prem level anymore. Its not like their results are down to him, but there's a goal in every two or three games that could have been saved by a good keeper. He even tried out for the Euros and Turkey exposed him quite badly in a 4-2 WCQ loss last spring.
Norwich have the players to be a posession dominant team but set up to be a counter attacking team.