SC2 - Clem vs. Serral - DH Masters: Winter 2020 - Playoffs - EU
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ม.ค. 2025
- In today's matches at DreamHack SC2 Masters: Winter 2020
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Iron sharpens iron. These Europeans will just continue to improve. I'm just happy the skill gap between korea and the rest of the world is closing and is not being taken in conversations even.
Tjat's because of the best koreans moved on to other, more profitable games
@@sparrow56able Like what and who?
Couldn't agree more. I think Starcraft is so much more interesting when the level of the games being played isn't divided by region lines. While I've always loved watching any and all kinds of Starcraft, I do remember thinking that non-Korean matches were a bit lackluster compared to the actual best.
No more "Clem just needs to improve _______". He's officially God-Tier.
no such thing as gx or improvx or not, any s perfx
I mean, I definitely think he needs more experience playing at such a high level. If you saw his set against Serral before this one, he was quite easily picked apart by cheese tactics. I feel like he won't die to that very easily when he's been playing at the top for another year. The same thing goes for Reynor. He's been absolutely incredible for a couple years, but he needed more consistency against the best players.
If you watched Serral in 2018 and 2019 you would know he's just fkcing around. no micro at all, he is just dumping forces into widow mine. Serral has always been so careful about being resource efficient and he didn't do that in these game at all. The casters doesn't know shit about player's play style just saying stupid things. Plus its only playoff stage, its clearly that he doesn't want to show too much. Plus Serral won the event which double proves what i said.
@@michaelzhang2514 and now he lost to Clem again at Katowice, lol
Would be nice if the title would include the round of the play off this is from...like this its a bit confusing with matchups occuring twice in upper and lower brackets
Which one is this?
From losers final liquipedia.net/starcraft2/ESL_Pro_Tour/2020/21/Masters/Winter/EU
you can easily see its a different match because serral has his hoodie up
I swear the anger in Serral's eye after game 2 defeat, he might have destroyed his keyboard off camera.
35:02
Serral with the F bomb xD
Everyone: Widowmines + Stempack + Liberators are broken
Reality: Clem targets Bainlings + Multi-drops + Scouts with Reaper from minute one + Beats back creep + Forever Aggressive = Win
still broken)
@@zombiboy666 Clem too OP, Blizzard pls nerf him
@@zombiboy666 Clem beat Reynor without even using mines. But hey I'm sure you can find another unit to blame and call op when your race lost
I love how commentators have been biased towards Serral.
I mean Clem played like a god here. Yet you still blame Serral's mistakes...
I was going to say the same thing until I saw this comment. They completely disregard that SC2 is the game it is 'cause no one will ever be at 100% win rate. Commentators were being total dirt bags with comments.
Rot is very SC2 knowledgeable but has always irked me.
I think most or all SC2 commentators have an issue of being slow to move on from saying what they've been saying for a while. Like in this case, they're used to presenting Serral as semi-unbeatable so that's what they fall back on under pressure. From this, if Serral is losing -> Serral's playing worse than usual is an easier idea than "Clem is playing well enough to beat Serral even when Serral's playing well".
Not bashing on the commentators here at all though, I think this is normal for anyone in their position to do.
So I haven't been following sc closely but just curious if clem would or is dominating in the korean scene like serral did in top form?
@@James-uk4xi As of right now yeah he would be a nightmare to them. Whats funny is Clem hasnt even come close to peaking yet. Dudes very young.
Damn great 1st game. I've never seen serral picked apart like that after being so far ahead
I know right it's like staying on first tier units for 15 minutes should lose you the game or something
Young clem has a bright future ahead
ESL/DH - would be great to actually hear the commentary at the end of the matches too, as well as potential player interviews. Dont cut them this harshly
Nah im not here to waste time on watching them talk watch on twitch replay than
TWITCH
Serral is shooketh :(
:)
serral is i think suffering from 1st loss syndrome....like the ones boxers are experiencing, after he lost to reynor his confidence seemed shocked
i think that was super exhausting match for him, he played pure bane ling for majority of the match fighting massive amount of widowmines.
yeah serrals mental game seems to be really weak right now :
such an amazing game
I think using that Clems game 4 push gonna rip out heads in the ladder, that might work even against toss quite well. For real that is really hard to scout and figure out. Only 1/1/1 in base and still strong push.
if you got the medivac micro to pull it off, below masters i think you wont see the same effect
I don't really understand why they were criticizing Serral's tech switches so much in game 1. He was going for Ultras when Clem's army was a lot more Marine-heavy, but Clem started making Marauders. Then after Serral started his Spire tech against Marauders, Clem switched back into heavier Marine Widowmine. Lurker tech seemed to make a lot of sense to me, given the army composition he was facing.
Rodi doesn't know wtf he's talking about when he critcizes pros; it's like he doesn't understand the meta.
Serral should have utilized his tech....He just wasted money on buildings he never even used
@@RoseGold-Playa His tech was countered over and over by Clem's tech rotations. If he doubled down on the tech he invested in, he would've lost way sooner.
@@Aurumai That's bs He stayed on ling-bane and that cost him the game. Just as it should You shouldn't be able to win a 9 minute+ game off the back of the first 2 units you can produce it's his fault for not make broodlords after he made the spire...instead he made mass lings in a panic and wasted all his banked rss
what is the point of proxying the armory if they are gonna see factory on reactor?
Because opening reactor into hellions for mineral line harass is it's own thing...the armory tells you that you will soon be dealing with hellbats and not just hellion run bys
@@derrickmelton5844 Or Widow Mines too!
are you kidding me, Clem is insane
Well done Clem!!!!! French represent :)
Serral gets way too emotional these days. He needs to find his cool again
yeah, he should talk to another master zerg of emotion from the past, Idra. Learn to release some of that emotion in the form of ultra game rage. Idra's rage game is out of this world. I swear, we watch Idra more for his rage than for his game play, because no one does it better.
@@pokerchannel6991 Ahhh IdrA, those were the days!!
yeah he was stone cold in 2018 if he wants to dominate again he needs to get to that state again.
ah the rise and fall of EG IdrA... brings back good old memories.
@@redisulejmani9925 but now if he loses 1 match everyone will talk about it for weeks
Serious question: Why does rotty roll the "r"?
He's doing it on purpose... Rolled R's are common in Spanish and French. Don't know the reason as well though.
@@Justbleed434 Unless we don't have the same definition for rolled R's, in France we don't do that :)
Clem is the better TvZ player today… He can beat any zerg, he now must improve his TvT et TvP to hope to beat the koreans in the next few years
He will have his rematch with Maru tonight, probably. So we will see how things are going for him against one of the best Terran players
@@tigera6 what event? Is it still DH?
@@Justbleed434 DH Global Finals, its the continuation of the DH region tournament , with winner/top players from each region play in GSL-style tournament.
Clem has probably the top 3 best TvP in the world, I dunno why people keep questioning his TvP, he's beaten every Korean at some point, he's just not perfectly consistent which doesn't happen unless you're multiple tiers better than your opponents. No Terran is *that* consistent in the matchup.
@@martinertlschweiger8218 In Maru's prime he had a 85 percent winrate lol.
(2016 Proleague he finished 22-4 including the play offs)
the panic ling production screwed him, he needed to make the tech work
so... are we going to start talking about broken widow mines or.....?
No because they are not broken
Finally
Terran has way more options thus more micro potential,
Ling Bane vs bio/mines is getting old, the micro/splits/focusfire are too good. Time to switch it up and
and what mate???
It looks like Serral is really sloppy in dealing with Widow mines unlike his usual self
why?
Ooff, this game 2. Don't get me wrong, Clem is amazing and deserves every praise, but with these Widow mines it felt almost unfair. Just a couple of good hits on ling/bane blobs could end a game easily. And it does not require much skill to use, but needs almost perfect attention, reaction and mechanical skills to avoid. The single 20 supply hit during the engagement at 33:00 basically lost Serral the game.
The next best terran in two years...or maybe currently CLEM is the best terran
Serral is so Salty haha
Hillarious
Mines are so braindead holy crap
I think the smug Italian fella has broken Serral :(
French
@@mechwurm he meant Reynor
@@mechwurm low IQ
steamrolled :P
Banelings got nerfed but Windowmines are fine? lmao.
Widow mines have to burrow, banelings are mobile widow mines.
CWtheBEASTT yes, widow mines with infinite cooldown, 1 range, and no detection required to kill... but hey, no friendly fire. Mines are busted.
Widowmines are wayyyyy to OP.
@@eskimo708 Lol ya’ll need to cry some more about a unit that isn’t even close to busted.
lets have a deal remove drill claws but ALSO REMOVE BURROW UPGRADE OF LURKER? DEAL??
I’m thinking we should make this change to the High Templar, too weak to use right now.
• if they stand still, they go cloaked and auto-cast storm
• reduce storm cost to 22 mana so that they can cast it every 40 seconds
• double storm damage to 160
• make all the damage happen at once
• increase splash radius to 1.75
• increase movement speed to be faster than Zealot, almost Stalker
• should be a tier 2 unit so - only Twilight Council required to make them
Sure, meanwhile, can we triple the HP of all the infantry units from Terran so that they dont die IMMEDIATELY to storm? Also give them +2.0 speed (like in a speed zone) whenever not in battle. I am all in for amazing ideas like yours.
I feel the oracle is also a little neglected
I'd suggest:
Pulsar Beam no longer uses energy
Oracle movement speed increased 1.5x
Pulsar Beam damaged increased to 45
Stasis Ward/ Revelation no longer use energy.
Oracle is now a permanent detector.
Oracle now permanently cloaked.
Oracle is invulnerable.
What you think?
I agree, also give Broodlords 5 more range and tactical jump to make them playable again
Clem is an monster, the new champ is here it seems, please Terrans now its the time to stop your whining alltogether...
All I see here are zerg tears
T OP? I don't think so. There's not much changes since the Z domination era, aside from the removal of infested terran.
Just T and P players are getting better. P players are now good at using skytoss and storm, T players are good at managing bio while utilizing lib and mech at the same time. This is where Byun lacks, he's good in bio but not mech.
Meanwhile, Serral is not as patient as he was. And i also think Clem is very good at constantly pushing opponents, doing a lot of multitasking. Like, he's a genius and can do a lot of tactics at the same time.
Is this a joke? There are a ton more changes than that. And the deciding factor in all of these games was widow mines. Braindead op unit 100%
@@blackfangofargentina well Clem beat Reynor without even using your "braindead op unit"
Gotta fins another unit to blame Mr Silver Zerg
@@stumpelrielzchen4143 how can you think that Clem not going for heavy mine play vs reynor says anything about the balance of mines? These 2 things are entirely independent of each other. Not related at all. Nice rank projection too, but unlike you I calibrated plat my first season of sc2 ever last year. You could have tried to counter my argument, but instead you said "but he didn't use mines in this other game", then called me silver. You're a joke
@@stumpelrielzchen4143 the very first time I touched this game I was already 1k mmr above silver. Nice projection though. I'm sure you're a gold terran, all proud of yourself for being terrible at the game
@@blackfangofargentina You literally said widow mines were the deciding factor in all of the games implying that Clem only won because he was using a "broken" unit. So me saying he wins against top tier zergs like Serral or Reynor without using the "broken" unit makes a lot of sense. As a Dia 1 Terran player who is Diamond with all 3 races and watches a lot of professional games I can safely say that widow mines can very mich be countered and are hard to use in an efficiant way like Clem. Now I might not be in a position to shit on your game knowlage since I'm only about a league higher (if what youre saying is true) but your mindset truely is like that of a silver player
Everyone complaining about widow mines in this comment section is braindead....Saying that widow mine harass "drop & forget" like you don't actively have to watch each drop & burrow them. Then they talk about how when they play against widow mines they're actively watching the mine drop fly towards their mineral line but can't stop it, maybe if you stopped spamming the broken army composition that is Mass lingbane & made hydras you could just shoot it out of the sky, the reason the mine drop is so effective is because your failing to make the right army comp to counter & you suck at the game. Still being on the first tier of units should be punished by higher tier unit play like this. Also, do you think we make mines because they are broken? No, we make widow mines because even though it could destroy our army as well it's the only way to stop braindead zergs from overwhelming you with Their A-click army...then they complain Like they couldn't just presplit against mines. This man serral stayed on The first tier units the entirety of the first game and still managed to make it 15 minutes before being forced out of it
Lmao he was more than 10 k minerals behind when he actually started even considering making a higher tier unit How are you even complaining about your race you...Oh I know it's because you want to play a completely broken race and cry whenever an actual counter to your imbalance presents itself
12:44 600 scratches per minute`
Widow mines saved clem
... because they're broken as shit and incredibly easy to use
@@blackfangofargentina LOL
@@blackfangofargentina gold player spotted (at best)
You realize Clem won against Reynor without even using mines? But hey I'm sure you can find another unit to blame and call it op when your race doesn't win
@@stumpelrielzchen4143 nice projection. I was plat the first time I touched this game. Sitting comfortably in diamond enjoying my time. It's real sad that you don't even have an argument, you're just saying "he doesn't always only play heavy mine strats". That's the entirety of the point youre making. It's meaningless. It's 100% a useless point. Mines can be imbalanced, and Clem can not play heavy mine every game. Those are in no way mutually exclusive. Keep projecting tho lol
the main problem for serral is his mentality, imo
seems to be the case right now. even tho back in the day I felt like it was one of his strong points.
Infesters need a buff. No one uses them anymore.
queens and infestors have been hit hard with the nerf gun
GG ZERGS
👍🏼
😲
How about we make widow mines die on detonation again or decrease their splash radius. They’re insanely strong.
I agree the blast radius on them is crazy and the damage for how simple they are to use. Put a few down and if the enemy isnt paying attention kill 20 zerglings with one mine and you dont even have to click on them.
@@goatfish480 you can make the same argument for banelings though. Make a few banelings and if the terran isnt scrambling to split or kite his marines then you can kill a bunch of them quickly
@@arcem84 no you can't, you have to move the banelings. You can just drop mines and forget about them for free value. They are far too easy to use. Splash radius and damage should be reduced
@@blackfangofargentina Zerg: a-move banelings into terran bio and if they dont split and kite marines they're fucked. Terran: drop mines from medivacs and manually burrow each one, or burrow one and if the zerg doesnt notice they're fucked. Notice how both takes the same amount of micro and force the other player to take some steps to prevent getting a bunch of their units killed. And I dont know if you noticed, but a baneling drop into a mineral line are able to usually kill more workers than widow mine drops because of the targeting system of widow mines and because baneling drops trigger as soon as theyre out of the dropperlord
@@blackfangofargentina Dont forget widow mines do friendly fire damage, and often do that against marines fighting zerglings
Halfway into game 1 and im already annoyed by Nathanias and Rotti trying to call things as if they know better than Clem and Serral. Watching the rest of this on mute. ESL please tell these guys to check their egos. Theyre literally diamond level game knowledge. I could literally find people in diamond league who would be better at calling these plays. So they shouldnt try to call plays at this level. Would be a lot better casting if they just stuck to talking about what is actually happening.
agreed, way too much speculation...
the biased commentary is unbearable
Clem's TvZ is fantastic
Why the fuck do they keep saying each others name gay bois
Serral has stopped being the best player since 2018
Yep back then was zero was super overpowered with 10 range nueral
wrg
clem is the best T plyer for now...
The way rotti casts is annoying. It's really whiney
game is ruined now
Terran patch, can0't believe with 66 SCV vs 90.... Mule is broken, widow mine is broken, range of Liberator is broken and also the steampack timing
If its so op go and play it and win some tournaments.
The only thing that's broken is the widowmine
Nah when Z always win, zerg OP, when T win, T OP. I think the game is well balanced
I think zerglings need to be less fast off creep they too fast and im a zerg main. Thats the true op
@@Tchachitos so true, and lings run-by is insanely annoying at every stage of the game
serral getting too old
yeah washed up :DDDDDDDDDD
God, Widow Mines are such a bad unit. They undoubtedly need a change. Watching that nobrainer unit being randomly spread around the map, killing 30 Zerglings while needing zero attention feels just wrong. At the same time, Widom Mines require maximum attention from your opponent to get countered.
Widow mine drops are so annoying too. Even if you pay attention, you still lose a huge amount of mining time and likely a couple drones to trigger the mines.
You are underestimating how hard it is to properly execute those mine drops. Clem is an absolute beast for being able to do three mine drops at the same time.
So much about Terran is broken, it's not even funny.
@@hgoshev Didnt say Terran is broken. I said Widow Mines are a bad designed unit
It's not like the widow mine is a surefire way of dealing splash, obviously the way you position them and micro your bio make a difference. And remember that they can deal massive friendly fire too, they're a high risk high reward unit. They could change the unit so that it is not so unstable, but that would make engagements less decisive for either side.
Clem > Innovation, maru, gumiho
Only vs Z. But he is getting better fast.
Gumiho? Emm..
Except Maru beat him head to head. Hold your break a bit on that.
TY VS CLEM will be the greatest match
@@DanialJang-y2y That will be great!
TY's TvT is in such an epic place right now but Clem's micro with ping is no slouch and he has all the momentum in the world!