Russell White hdr and DLSS are my favorite advancements in the visual delivery I have seen in awhile. Watching my performance improve by nearly 50% on the average in games that employ DLSS 2.0.
@@jm8080ful DLSS 2.0 is looking like it should be possible on any game now with TAA as the games using DLSS 2.0 all have TAA as an option i believe. the thing is DLSS currently has to be programmed in, DLSS 3.0 will also need to be programmed in it wont just appear out of nowhere but if its so easy to program in like... even more so than DLSS 2.0 then that will make it a no brainer for most developers and that right there will be the game changer, developers NEED a solution for aliasing, nvidia just has to make it the easiest and best option, so good the devs would be mad to turn it down. AMD could still also stand in the way, cant see them being too happy with a game advertising their partnership using DLSS whether it uses TAA or not they might still be a firm blockade in the road for some games.
Digital Foundry is made a joke recently with how they covered Halo Infinite... "Everything is under a SHAAAAAAADOOOOW..." When the character is hit by direct sunlight. Derp. Then all the defenders of the console tries to run that narrative that everything is under a shadow.
Nintendo would be insane not to leverage their relationship with Nvidia for some form of DLSS support in a Switch upgrade or successor. That points been raised by DF multiple times already but, it just makes so much sense for any portable console from this point on, don't you think?
@ Same way cheap console got DEM CUDA cores, refinement, research and moola. Nintendo has said that Switch's life will be long, assuming 8 years, meaning 2025. As it is Switch is running on a 2015 revealed hardware, if for Nintendo Nvidia makes proper custom tech by 2024/2025, that is released in 2026, it can easily be PS4 Pro Levels. Phones already have outrageous RAM at 12 GB and power around 1.5TFlops which is midway between PS4 and Xbone base. Assuming newer architechture, 16GB RAM, 4.5TFLOPS (in 5 more years from 1.5TFLOPS), AND DLSS 3.0 if it will exist, it will be pretty good.
@ Yes they look cartoony but are 1080p games running on a 4K TV sitting next to the PS5/Xbox Series X. Just the ability to scale BOTW to 4K DLSS from 1080p would be massive
I'm SO GLAD that Alex showed the difference between 'sharpening' and checkerboard/dlss. There are a lot of people who are in some way, misinformed about how sharpening works, and its great to see a learned person like Alex teach us the difference with proper visual examples. You sir, are providing great education for free. Thank you!
BiteU141 You are right but you are not giving CAS enough credit. Look at Alien Isolation on Switch vs ps4. It runs at a lower resolution on switch but with TAA and CAS it is nearly impossible to tell which is which and it looks just as sharp as the ps4 version.
Also, Alex did not show DLSS problems found on threads that discuss CAS vs DLSS; (water, mummy ) The inertia that some people have about the comparisons of CAS vs DLSS 1.0 sums up the noise that fanboys attack each other. CAS in its class is really good; DLSS 2.0 is in another class as a full reconstruction algorithm; Most visual problems in these comparisons come from TAA insane blur, maybe the TAA part of the checkerboard is the issue on the moss example, so the history of the technique and where R&D is going would be a nice topic for next time @Alex!
I think a lot of developers will use DLSS 3.0 which is said to be coming out along with new GPUs from Nvidia. DLSS came out and it was a joke then Nvidia worked on it and by DLSS 2.0 it is proving to be a game changing feature as it has been able to give better visuals then native 4K along with better performance. I know that the rumor going around is that DLSS 3.0 will work on any game that uses TAA (though not my favorite AA).
@@doc7000 i think they stated that it will be easy to port to games that already use taa, but it will still require some tweaking by the developers to fully implement it.
Masster Wushu I’m aware they’re using Nvidia Tech but Nintendo isn’t exactly know for grabbing newest tech he’ll in the Wii U they threw a Max processor from 1993 or some shit I feel as though it won’t happen because the requirements to be “DLSS” eligible would require proprietary hardware and that’s not something they’ll look into. DLSS might not end up in a Nintendo platform for maybe a decade. Even in the switch the GPU they threw in there runs at half power or less due to power restraints and heat
Tim Lehr it’s gonna need more than a few Tensor cores to have enough power to have a good DLSS implementation. He says in the video it’s only possible because of how many. But I mean I guess, I’m done
Speaking as a games vfx artist, gosh dang do TAA and upscalers mess up my work. VFX usually is very high-contrast, moves very quickly, and is frequently transparent, none of these features play nicely with image reconstruction that relies on consistent depth and motion vector data to work. I wish that we people living in translucency land got half the love that the environment artists get. If I could, I would run all particle effects without any AA at all. That might sound extreme, but remember that particle effects rarely actually have geometric edges, so we get our AA from bilinear texture sampling. Even when there are geometric edges, what resolves as meaningless and distracting pixel crawl on static geo, at worst looks like sparkling for small, high-contrast vfx elements like sparks or debris. Aliasing shimmer only hurts image quality when it is unintentionally implying motion where there is none, which is almost never the case for VFX.
As a VFX artist myself, I wholeheartedly agree too. Before even entering the professional industry, I still remember the very first Xbox having the possibility to trick the MSAA hardware to render particles at ‘half the pixel shaders computation wise’ but still output to the full frame buffer (something like what offscreen render particles achieve but on a hardware level), effectively reducing the cost of large smoke transparent particle systems (and mostly used on that since smoky blobs are soft low-res bilinear filtered effects anyways). The TAA and upscalers do make a number, the only useful case is maybe the heavy rains examples where it’s all chaotic, these artifact trails could actually help maybe, albeit it’s kinda out of control and totally random. Maybe a starting point would be to mix specific transparent objects (vfx mostly) as a post process after the up-scaling has happened, there will be an extra full screen fill-rate cost to pay (although on high end hardware I think this is not really an issue anymore, I’m currently on mobile devices land) and the potential of blended zones looking lower res (either 1080p for DLSS or only one of the frame for checkerboarding). There were GPU Gems and GPU Pro articles on both offscreen-upscaled effects and transparency as a post process, don’t really know what’s he current state on that nowadays.
@@korsol there's no real difference between the boxes. They all run basically the same code at the end of the day. If you're picking between Microsoft and Sony, you're picking between their business practices, studio partnerships, and UI.
13:12 That flickering is one of the biggest turnoff in graphics. GTA V is a big example. i always wanted something to come and eliminate that. Nice to See DLSS is doing that.
Aliasing has always been the worst part of video game graphics to me. New games finally getting to a realistic "smoothness" without being overly blurry is fucking awesome
Try to play Destiny 2. The flickering is insane, no matter the resolution. Bungie needs a TAA solution cause FXAA and SMAA won't cut it (specially because they use the cheapest version of both. A High quality FXAA maybe would fix the problem, but they don't allow you to even try with reshade).
DLSS in Death Stranding is by far the highest quality "AA" available in game. Both TAA and AMD CAS have ridiculous ton of aliasing, the game seems to be very prone to aliasing in general, while DLSS has literally none, not even in distant landscape. It has some of these motion artifacts you mentioned as trailing, this is quite a significant issue because it happens with many other thin objects like cables or posts, or around Sam's hair when against even background like water or sky, but better that than what TAA offers, blurry aliased picture. And this is even before your consider the performance. I am using DSR and DLSS to play at ultrawide 4K (5184x2160 with an aspect ratio of 3840x1600 display) and I am mostly in high 70s on 2080 Ti, with some debanding from Reshade that also snatches around 5% of performance. This kind of a performance is unimaginable in any regular AAA game at this resolution on a single GPU, with picture quality this sharp with virtually no AA. Even in some older games that work well with something like MSAAx8 + SGSSAAx4 you cannot get this little aliasing, and this will take away 50%+ of performance instead of giving you similar amount like DLSS. This is the biggest deal in all of this, you get much better image quality and like 40-50% performance boost on top of that. Compared with using high quality AA, your performance is more than double for at least the same quality.
I had been running a 5700XT while playing DS, but moved over to a 2070 Super and the DLSS was definitely an improved image over FidelityFX CAS on the AMD card. FFX CAS was impressive and sharp, but it reminded me a little of the PS2/PS3 era where Sony was uber sharp, but had shimmering due aliasing artifacts. I can’t wait for RDNA2 to hit and see AMD’s answer to ray tracing and deep learning.
AMD CAS is not a form of anti aliasing. It's a sharpening solution, all it does is render the game at 70% native res and apply sharpening on top, bypassing things like HUD and other buffers. It doesn't do any reconstruction.
@@AlfaHazard Btw, do you have an AMD GPU? I've been trying to improve the AA in this game, but I think it's just not possible. ReShade + NFAA/DLAA/BIAA improves it a little bit, but this game, damn, it's a jagged lines fest all around. I gave up and accepted it - sad. I wish I got an 2070 instead of the 5700XT.
Maybe in the future we will get dlss as a toggle on the control panel, dlss 3.0 is already said to be way easier to implement and I don't see it as a stretch for them to target having it as an option that you can use in every game without any developer support needed
Yea, I can see developers firing up the game with DLSS for the first time and saying "ha ha, hey, what''s that trails?... humm, you know what? they don't look bad... they don't look bad at all" XD
@@alexanderulv3886 Crysis, I have never prayed to you before. I have no tongue for it. All that matters is my PC stood against high resolution and ray tracing. Thats whats important. Performance pleases you Crysis, so grant me one wish! Grant me high FPS! And if you do not listen, then to hell with you!
I used to think rtx cards were a gimmick but dlss is insane, and the performance improvements in 3d rendering are really impressive too, ill have to save money for a little longer 😅
@Peter Connell I can notice the difference without zooming in. The flickering of edges I hate that this is somthing I always hated I would notice that immediately on PS4 PRO.
The particle streaks were the first thing I noticed that was off, but with the aesthetic of this game they really don’t bother me on the things floating to the sky. I think if you didn’t know any better you would just think it was some cool effect coming off them
DLSS 2.0 is undoubtedly a fine technological advancement, but to be fair to the PS4 pro and checkerboarding it's over 3 years old now and costs £300...so it's very good for the cost 👍🏻
@@AlphaDwg If checkerboard was developed for better hardware, then it could perhaps rival it, not sure. Since it was made for ps4 pro's architecture, which is equivalent to a weaker RX 480. Think about trying to deliver 4k on that hardware. Quite impressive.
@@GrainMuncher it's just better there is no need to make excuses about it. The only thing you can defend is maybe Nvidia was inspired by the idea of reconstruction that Sony did. They took the time to develop a whole generation of hardware for it and just do it better. It even had to go through a whole bad 1.0 phase before it got to what it is now.
@@Androx5000 yeah i thought to myself also works as a cool effect, but it does change it to looking spirit like particles from hmm what are those things, is it a fly or what, so yeah can give a diff vibe change ones vision...but yeah maybe they even ignored it because it still looked intended vs a graphical glitch
DLSS is shit. Checkerboad rendering is, by far, the preferred method. It uses way less resources and looks almost as good. The tradeoff for DLSS isn't worth it. Not even close.
4 years ago a lot of people were laughing because ps4 pro wasn’t Native 4k, but never realized this was the future because how less expensive is to render bigger resolutions 🤷🏽♀️
I wouldn’t mind checkerboard 4k 60fps next gen. Most people don’t even notice and from having played both checker boarded and native 4K the difference is really minimal especially when done right unlike rdr2 on PS4 pro.
H. E. M. This is the way to go, it’s just too expensive to render native 4k, while DLSS 2.0 is already proving how pointless native resolution is with a good reconstruction method can improve performance while looking like native 4k.
The great thing about DLSS is that it relies on an externally trained model that can be improved without the game needing to change anything. And the upcoming DLSS 3.0 improves a lot in the respect that it can upscale to a higher resolution from what it was given, compared to 2.0 going from 1440p to 4k here. Exciting times, hopefully this type of rendering gives GPUs more room to breathe, a much needed respite from exploding pixel demand.
@@NicolasSilvaVasault I don't think so. at least not to the same degree. Nvidia uses special hardware while AMD chose to make the CU's do INT operations. This is smart from AMD because it means the GPU is cheaper to make and works fully even if the game doesn't support the technology.
@@codethis2875 AMD is actually taking the software route compared to the brute force hardware route that Nvidia took. FidelityFx+Upscaling already boosts frame rates in Death Stranding comparable to that of DLSS Quality mode. All they need to do, is improve on the image quality and make it as close to Native as possible.
@@kishaloyb.7937 Fidelity is horrible, you can't even compare it to a proper temporal reconstruction. AMD will use machine learning too. Microsoft already demoed something similar.
@@codethis2875 I'm not saying that FidelityFx is better than native or even DLSS 2.0, all I'm saying is for a image up-scaling feature running on compute shader, it does a pretty good job of maintaining a stable image quality while also boosting the overall performance. Not to mention that it runs on all recent GPUs available in the market. No doubt, AMD will improve image quality using ML in the future, and if that can run on all current GPUs, then thats gonna be very good for us consumers. I've used both FFX and DLSS in Monster Hunter World Iceborne and Death Stranding, DLSS 2.0 is clearly superior in DS from a bench-marking perspective when you zoom in 400% to see the difference. But from a normal gamer's pov, there is not much of a difference to talk about except that one image is a bit sharper than the other one.
Amazing video Alex! I love these things. Reconstruction is the future for sure, DLSS 2.0 is like magic. Hope Microsoft can do something similar for Lockhart/Series S and make the 1080p-1440p resolution much better.
I mean for what it is meant to run on, the Checkerboarding technique, still does a fantastic job. I have to give it to the engineers who achieved this. However, clearly, as computing becomes cheaper, I am totally digging deep learning techniques of upscaling. Kudos to nVIDIA for doing such a fantastic job and I hope it becomes more widely adopted. @Digital Foundry @Alex man this was a fantastic comparison. So much effort was put into it and the analysis was in depth. Keep up the good work and the quality, you folks rock!
Alex really understands to make great videos. He goes into great detail and never fails to present all that in a very entertaining way. I always look forward to his videos. Viele Grüße und Danke!
I have to wonder if Alex's scar is a Germanic dueling scar get got at the Austrian University he attended. There is a growing underground dueling scene in various German, Swiss and Austrian Universities, and it origins harken back centuries when those dueling scars were seen as a sign of manliness and respect, and it was not uncommon for upper class men to actually go out of their way to get dueling scars.
Are you serious? I think this a thing of the past and nothing I have ever encountered in my normal life as a German citizen. It's called "Schmiss" and has been basically extinct since the end of the German Reich. Alex probably has the scar from a simple accident or OC'd PC blowing up in his face! :P
@@DigitalDesires87 I'm 99.7% certain its NOT a dueling scar. But maaaaybe just maaaaybe. There have been recent news articles and investigative journalism about dueling clubs reemergence in multiple universities across Germanic speaking countries. It origins are not with the Reich, it predates the Reich by centuries. Accounts of it taking place back in 1566. Similar to how the Swasticka has its origins with East asia, but once the Nazi's unfortunately adopted it, they perverted the symbol and the symbol probably predate Nazis by a millenia or two. Participants in these dueling clubs are not Nazi sympathizers as far as I've read.
@@2drealms196 I didn't mean that it came from the Reich, but the practice mostly ended at the same time WWII did. There are still duels today, but far less and without injuries to the face. It also takes no place in our normal culture. Nobody knows about it today. But it's definitely a cool back story for a cool looking scar, yes! :P
Alex, you are such a great Addition to the DF-Team. Honestly, its Richs and your Videos that i appreciate the most. Also the depth of the information you two provide is fantastic. Not to say, that Johns and Toms Videos arent top notch in their own rights. You all bring something unique to the table and i dont want to miss any of DFs Videos. Keep up the good work.
DLSS 2.0 is obviously the winner here, but it has never been as good as in Death Stranding before. My 2080 Ti can't hold 4k60 when playing Control with DLSS for example. But DS runs like a charm. You can also further increase sharpness with Nvidia Freestyle.
@@assassinxxx65 Last time I tried it was at the beginning of the year, after they improved the DLSS. Did they improve even further? I only tried with maxed out settings. The game ran fine and at 60 90% of the time, but dropped below 60 in some locations.
Jensen would escape getting burned at the stake by using the solar arrays on the roof of Nvidia HQ to power a computer and a large display and fake his own burning. Those HDR raytraced flames on a Gsync display would easily fool the medieval peasantry . Soon Jensen would simulate his own resurrection with Gameworks and before you know he would have the peasants in the palm of his hand chanting "the more you buy the more you save".
The bevel reflection was actually the same as in the native 4K mode. Looks like DLSS changes the original a bit there + the „partical trail“ issue is another part where the original is changed.
That will change once we stuff enough tensor cores onto the GPUs. Its not so much preparation as it is pre-calculations. Things DLSS could very well be doing itself with enough hardware.
Great video Alex. Nitpick, DLSS 2.0 in quality mode uses an internal resolution of 1527p at 4K, half the total number of pixels. So it uses the same number of pixels as checker board rendering, they are the just evenly spaced in both dimensions. Balanced mode uses one third of the pixels, 1247p, and performance mode uses one quarter of the pixels, 1080p. They discuss this in the nvidia GTC talk.
Actually this is a funny mistake I think in the NV presentation - as you can Pixel count the edges in quality Mode DLSS 2.0 in any game where it Breaks and get 1440p. Also, in this game, Control, and Wolfen Young blood you can have access to the game config file or console to see the internal resolution Scaler before DLSS 2.0 applies, and for all of them, it is 68% or 1440p! Control or Wolfenstein even allow you to change it to any internal resolution you want basically
@@DigitalFoundry Wow. Thanks for letting me know. I'm surprised they give access to the internal resolution. I wonder if it's adjustable on a per frame basis. Do you think we could get dynamic resolution DLSS?
If you zoom 400% into the background you can clearly make out the details of finely crafted DF mug. The accompanying shrine dedicated to crysis can also be clearly seen- laughing in the face of checkerboard rendering! 😄
We really need a vendor-agnostic version of DLSS 2.0. RTX is solved, it is just DXR or Vulkan-RT and all Intel or AMD GPUs can enable it when they get the driver update / hardware for it. DLSS 2.0 is too proprietary for a long-term centuries-long solution for the art form.
Time for my daily dose of deep dive into video game technology. DF, you have single handedly made me more knowledgeable about both Xbox and Playstation consoles than anything I have read on Google over the years!
cerny has - ssd prowess - exclusives - Good manners with his employees on stage - Optimization for only one hardware - Relaxing voice ready FIGHT!!!...
The more I watch DLSS 2.0 the more it impresses me. I mean we don't even need native 4k now how crazy is that. If we get something similar for fps we might be able to afford ray tracing even better!
The main issue with DLSS and Death Stranding is its present inability to resolve raindrop particles. It’s a very crucial part of the game and against anything other than a very dark background you just can’t see it. Native plus TAA resolves them perfectly. I also think Alex undersells just how egregious the trails are. When you get to the mid game you build roads, and those roads are absolutely teeming with those ascending particles. It looks an absolute mess in motion. Such a shame because otherwise DLSS IQ is a miracle.
This is still basically first generation tech when game engines start giving depth data to the tensor cores with acceleration and thing like that pretty soon we will have dlss that works for res and frame rate search up lucas arts force unleash 2 frame rate upscale.
King Marco Louis III as I say it’s a miracle and 90% of the time I play with DLSS on (even at 1080p it noticeably monsters the competition in terms of image quality), I really hope they can fix the issues I mention. Frame rate upscaling sounds mind bending and I love it.
Wow! What a coincidence. Just this morning I was thinking about this exact topic and had the question about what's preferable, and ideal when going into next-gen. From what I've seen, I assumed DLSS but wanted to know more. Thanks for this; great insight.
I dont see how the use of motion vector info being fed into the algorithm can be eliminated. Unless DLSS can predict where objects will be in the next frame using screen space info because Nvidia built a time machine into their GPUs I dont see optimizations being gone completely. Although maybe another AI program can help devs optimize it xD.
@@fiftyfive1s410 None of this is optimization. They are pre-calculations. They don't optimize anything. The amount of work required for the rest of the process is still exactly the same as before. Less work is not being done. Its just being done at different times. Learn what that word means. both of you. Secondly, how do you think motion vectors are found? By hand? No lol. The GPU can very well do it with the right hardware. The problem is there isn't enough tensor cores on our modern day GPUs to do both. A TPU could easily do the work. But consumers won't be seeing those for years.
@@Wylie288 1. Yeah I know optimization wasn't the right word to use. 2. Yeah sorry. On second analysis of what I said I realised I was getting DLSS, an upscaling technique, confused with a traditional rendering pipeline. However I still dont understand how DLSS can work without motion vector data being fed into the algorithm, care to explain?
Very impressive what nVidia managed to do with DLSS2.0, but the cost is huge in silicon and the reward is rather limited, only few games support DLSS and the performance lost because of the tensor cores is just too high.
How so ? RT cores and Tensor cores meant an increase of around 20% in die area, even if you ignore the area taken for RT cores : If you take a GPU and add 20% more shaders you get,at most, 20% mor performance( most likelly less than that) If you take a GPU and add 20% area in tensor cores you get between 50% to 100% more performance.. The only limitation is not beeing used in many games ( yet)
Odd that you didn't mention how DLSS 2.0 has ringing artifacts. You can most easily see this as a thin white outline on black edges against some non-white material, like text on Sam's backpack. It's mostly subtle except for cases like high contrast edges, again, such as text.
AMD needs a similar tech if they want to be competetive. Otherwise, big Navi will be at a disadvantage even if it has enough raw power to match Ampere. Mid cycle refreshes of next gen consoles should also implement some sort of AI upscaling for 4K 60fps visuals with no compromise to image quality. Imagine horizon forbidden west running at 4k 60.
Agreed, it seems that the motion vectors are really key in how DLSS looks stable while blending previous frames. AMD and the other game engine companies need to look into this
@@Robertt422 They can use DirectML, but without the dedicated hardware, it'll have to use RNDA cores, which will take resources away from the rendering pipeline.
Im afraid nvidia may be one of the few companies with enough r&d muscle to make something this amazing, but if amd can match it will be a huge boost to consoles
DLSS takes the cake with the visuals. But I have to give props to checkerboarding. DLSS has room to take advantage of much superior hardware, compared to the 2016 mobile gpu PS4 Pro is running on.
Checkerboard and temporal injection have allowed Pro to massively overachieve. Pro games were in the conversation every year for Best Graphics awards when in terms of hardware on paper they should have never had a single nominee compared to X1X and PC. They won a warehouse full of graphics awards for just Horizon alone.
Yeah I bought it 3 days ago and been playing for 3 days straight. It’s been out for a week or two now. Games very addicting, but give it about 4-5 hours since the intro is a very slow burn before it gets going for real
It's amazing how good PS4 pro checkerboard is for an old console that don't have machine learning to implement DLSS. I bet PS5 will have solution like DLSS using AMD solution and Sony proprietary solution.
There's no AMD solution like this at the moment. And won't be for a while since you can't just create it overnight. Nvidia was investing in the AI research for more than a decade before DLSS became a thing and even then first version of DLSS was pretty bad.
does PS5 support machine learning? I haven't seen anything about it and they haven't mentioned it at all. Guess we will find out in august when they finally show what's under the hood
@@AlphaDwg It does support it but not much compared to Nvidia , even Xbox SX has direct ML and DSSL by software . PS5 will also has its own proprietary . and also Sony are well known for for their AI upscaling for their camera image sensor
Looking forward to the future of DLSS and other similar tech. If enough games support DLSS 3.0 that will probably push me to upgrade from my 1080ti. Would be great to get DLSS or similar on the PS5. Glad I finally subbed to patreon. I've been enjoying the high quality downloaded videos.
Alex's hair was brought to you by DLSS 2.0 in Quality mode. :)
Arm or head?
@@jaymzx2587 Arm hair when paused at 4k looks to be the upgraded DLSS 3.0? Head hair is checkboard still.
I want some Digital Foundry merch, i like that shirt
@@nrolling7192 Shirt? I'm holding out for the wig. That'll surely pull the ladies. :)
Mine are always at Ultra Performance Mode :/
DLSS2.0 is a gamechanger .....magical shit
Wait to see what DLSS 3.0 brings :)
Russell White hdr and DLSS are my favorite advancements in the visual delivery I have seen in awhile.
Watching my performance improve by nearly 50% on the average in games that employ DLSS 2.0.
Yeah Dlss2.0 is just crazy
If DLSS 3.0 rumors is to be believed then we ain't seen nothing yet, I mean working on any game with TAA?! now THAT is a game changer.
@@jm8080ful DLSS 2.0 is looking like it should be possible on any game now with TAA as the games using DLSS 2.0 all have TAA as an option i believe. the thing is DLSS currently has to be programmed in, DLSS 3.0 will also need to be programmed in it wont just appear out of nowhere but if its so easy to program in like... even more so than DLSS 2.0 then that will make it a no brainer for most developers and that right there will be the game changer, developers NEED a solution for aliasing, nvidia just has to make it the easiest and best option, so good the devs would be mad to turn it down. AMD could still also stand in the way, cant see them being too happy with a game advertising their partnership using DLSS whether it uses TAA or not they might still be a firm blockade in the road for some games.
It’s the small touches I love about Digital Foundry.
The candle shrine to Crysis in the background for example xD
XD
Of course Alex would have a Crysis shrine.
Crysis is a benchmark, I couldnt recommend it as a game. It looks fantastic though and I understand why DF dote upon it.
If it wasn't as a product placement for this video, I would agree with you.
@@scubasausage i could definitely recommend it as a game, it's brilliant
70k away from a million. You guys deserve it.
I cant believe they arent well over a million already
Been here since they only had like 200k. The growth spiked this year.
Absolutely agree. They simply are the best. Love being here 👍🏻
@@darkknight2864 OG
Holy shit feel like they were just at 600k
First that Crysis: Remastered intro and then this! F*cking glorious!
Love this channel for the tech insides and the awesome humour!
It's almost necessary to have humor given the technical nature of their in depth analysis
Digital Foundry is made a joke recently with how they covered Halo Infinite...
"Everything is under a SHAAAAAAADOOOOW..."
When the character is hit by direct sunlight. Derp.
Then all the defenders of the console tries to run that narrative that everything is under a shadow.
Nintendo would be insane not to leverage their relationship with Nvidia for some form of DLSS support in a Switch upgrade or successor.
That points been raised by DF multiple times already but, it just makes so much sense for any portable console from this point on, don't you think?
The Shape believe me Nvidia will find away they don’t want Nintendo going to AMD when amd already have ps and Xbox.
@ Same way cheap console got DEM CUDA cores, refinement, research and moola.
Nintendo has said that Switch's life will be long, assuming 8 years, meaning 2025. As it is Switch is running on a 2015 revealed hardware, if for Nintendo Nvidia makes proper custom tech by 2024/2025, that is released in 2026, it can easily be PS4 Pro Levels. Phones already have outrageous RAM at 12 GB and power around 1.5TFlops which is midway between PS4 and Xbone base.
Assuming newer architechture, 16GB RAM, 4.5TFLOPS (in 5 more years from 1.5TFLOPS), AND DLSS 3.0 if it will exist, it will be pretty good.
@ Yes they look cartoony but are 1080p games running on a 4K TV sitting next to the PS5/Xbox Series X. Just the ability to scale BOTW to 4K DLSS from 1080p would be massive
Gotta look at the price of Nvidia GPU that's able to do this. You think you can get it cheap enough to slap it into a $300 console?
@@DarkExternalHeart You can if Sony asked them to make it. We consumers pay end price. Sony or MS pays per 100 million units at close to cost price
I'm SO GLAD that Alex showed the difference between 'sharpening' and checkerboard/dlss.
There are a lot of people who are in some way, misinformed about how sharpening works, and its great to see a learned person like Alex teach us the difference with proper visual examples.
You sir, are providing great education for free. Thank you!
BiteU141
You are right but you are not giving CAS enough credit. Look at Alien Isolation on Switch vs ps4. It runs at a lower resolution on switch but with TAA and CAS it is nearly impossible to tell which is which and it looks just as sharp as the ps4 version.
Also, Alex did not show DLSS problems found on threads that discuss CAS vs DLSS; (water, mummy ) The inertia that some people have about the comparisons of CAS vs DLSS 1.0 sums up the noise that fanboys attack each other.
CAS in its class is really good;
DLSS 2.0 is in another class as a full reconstruction algorithm;
Most visual problems in these comparisons come from TAA insane blur, maybe the TAA part of the checkerboard is the issue on the moss example, so the history of the technique and where R&D is going would be a nice topic for next time @Alex!
Still killing it with the intros
Lol at the candle shrine
The *C R Y S I S S H R I N E*
Wow i actually thought those particle trails were just part of the game when i was playing.
Me too lol. I just assumed they did that as a visual cue.
Me squinting at my phone: hmmm yes the graphics look like graphics.
Lol I thought it was just me
That's why the zoom in these vids is always appreciated.
The difference is pretty noticable even on mobile or do you have a 4 inch screen?
@@s_for_short2400 probably blind as a bat
@psykosonikwarrior ive got an android from 2015
I think DLSS 2.0 looked better in most instances, lets hope we see more games make good use of this in the future.
I think a lot of developers will use DLSS 3.0 which is said to be coming out along with new GPUs from Nvidia. DLSS came out and it was a joke then Nvidia worked on it and by DLSS 2.0 it is proving to be a game changing feature as it has been able to give better visuals then native 4K along with better performance. I know that the rumor going around is that DLSS 3.0 will work on any game that uses TAA (though not my favorite AA).
@@doc7000 It would be absolutely massive if they managed to make it work plug and play in any TAA game, but that's a bit too optimistic I think.
@@doc7000 Dlss 3.0 is just wish, I don't think it would be that sumple
@@doc7000 i think they stated that it will be easy to port to games that already use taa, but it will still require some tweaking by the developers to fully implement it.
Will dlss 3.0 be available only for ampere cards ?
Hope we see DLSS on the next Switch generation. Really think that will be the way forward for the platform.
I would love it, however it won’t happen
They are partnered with Nvidia. It’s definitely in their future.
Masster Wushu I’m aware they’re using Nvidia Tech but Nintendo isn’t exactly know for grabbing newest tech he’ll in the Wii U they threw a Max processor from 1993 or some shit
I feel as though it won’t happen because the requirements to be “DLSS” eligible would require proprietary hardware and that’s not something they’ll look into. DLSS might not end up in a Nintendo platform for maybe a decade. Even in the switch the GPU they threw in there runs at half power or less due to power restraints and heat
I think it should be feasible if Nvidia designs a low power mobile SoC with a few Tensor Cores.
Tim Lehr it’s gonna need more than a few Tensor cores to have enough power to have a good DLSS implementation. He says in the video it’s only possible because of how many. But I mean I guess, I’m done
Speaking as a games vfx artist, gosh dang do TAA and upscalers mess up my work. VFX usually is very high-contrast, moves very quickly, and is frequently transparent, none of these features play nicely with image reconstruction that relies on consistent depth and motion vector data to work. I wish that we people living in translucency land got half the love that the environment artists get. If I could, I would run all particle effects without any AA at all. That might sound extreme, but remember that particle effects rarely actually have geometric edges, so we get our AA from bilinear texture sampling. Even when there are geometric edges, what resolves as meaningless and distracting pixel crawl on static geo, at worst looks like sparkling for small, high-contrast vfx elements like sparks or debris. Aliasing shimmer only hurts image quality when it is unintentionally implying motion where there is none, which is almost never the case for VFX.
A really great comment here
As a VFX artist myself, I wholeheartedly agree too.
Before even entering the professional industry, I still remember the very first Xbox having the possibility to trick the MSAA hardware to render particles at ‘half the pixel shaders computation wise’ but still output to the full frame buffer (something like what offscreen render particles achieve but on a hardware level), effectively reducing the cost of large smoke transparent particle systems (and mostly used on that since smoky blobs are soft low-res bilinear filtered effects anyways).
The TAA and upscalers do make a number, the only useful case is maybe the heavy rains examples where it’s all chaotic, these artifact trails could actually help maybe, albeit it’s kinda out of control and totally random.
Maybe a starting point would be to mix specific transparent objects (vfx mostly) as a post process after the up-scaling has happened, there will be an extra full screen fill-rate cost to pay (although on high end hardware I think this is not really an issue anymore, I’m currently on mobile devices land) and the potential of blended zones looking lower res (either 1080p for DLSS or only one of the frame for checkerboarding).
There were GPU Gems and GPU Pro articles on both offscreen-upscaled effects and transparency as a post process, don’t really know what’s he current state on that nowadays.
You guys have any insight or comments on ps5 and xbox series x for us ?
@@korsol why the fuck would they?
@@korsol there's no real difference between the boxes. They all run basically the same code at the end of the day. If you're picking between Microsoft and Sony, you're picking between their business practices, studio partnerships, and UI.
13:12
That flickering is one of the biggest turnoff in graphics.
GTA V is a big example.
i always wanted something to come and eliminate that.
Nice to See DLSS is doing that.
Same for me
Aliasing has always been the worst part of video game graphics to me. New games finally getting to a realistic "smoothness" without being overly blurry is fucking awesome
Try to play Destiny 2. The flickering is insane, no matter the resolution. Bungie needs a TAA solution cause FXAA and SMAA won't cut it (specially because they use the cheapest version of both. A High quality FXAA maybe would fix the problem, but they don't allow you to even try with reshade).
We've had stuff to remove that flickering for over a decade.
@@aweigh1010 No, it's called sparse grid super sampling and down sampling.
DF is the best game industry outlet period. The amount of passion they put into their work is unprecedented.
DLSS in Death Stranding is by far the highest quality "AA" available in game. Both TAA and AMD CAS have ridiculous ton of aliasing, the game seems to be very prone to aliasing in general, while DLSS has literally none, not even in distant landscape. It has some of these motion artifacts you mentioned as trailing, this is quite a significant issue because it happens with many other thin objects like cables or posts, or around Sam's hair when against even background like water or sky, but better that than what TAA offers, blurry aliased picture.
And this is even before your consider the performance. I am using DSR and DLSS to play at ultrawide 4K (5184x2160 with an aspect ratio of 3840x1600 display) and I am mostly in high 70s on 2080 Ti, with some debanding from Reshade that also snatches around 5% of performance. This kind of a performance is unimaginable in any regular AAA game at this resolution on a single GPU, with picture quality this sharp with virtually no AA. Even in some older games that work well with something like MSAAx8 + SGSSAAx4 you cannot get this little aliasing, and this will take away 50%+ of performance instead of giving you similar amount like DLSS. This is the biggest deal in all of this, you get much better image quality and like 40-50% performance boost on top of that. Compared with using high quality AA, your performance is more than double for at least the same quality.
I had been running a 5700XT while playing DS, but moved over to a 2070 Super and the DLSS was definitely an improved image over FidelityFX CAS on the AMD card.
FFX CAS was impressive and sharp, but it reminded me a little of the PS2/PS3 era where Sony was uber sharp, but had shimmering due aliasing artifacts.
I can’t wait for RDNA2 to hit and see AMD’s answer to ray tracing and deep learning.
I've been saying for months that DLSS 2.00 is the real shit, now people are just realizing it !!!
Agree, DLSS really is the most impressive technique I have seen in recent years for gaming
AMD CAS is not a form of anti aliasing. It's a sharpening solution, all it does is render the game at 70% native res and apply sharpening on top, bypassing things like HUD and other buffers.
It doesn't do any reconstruction.
@@AlfaHazard Btw, do you have an AMD GPU? I've been trying to improve the AA in this game, but I think it's just not possible. ReShade + NFAA/DLAA/BIAA improves it a little bit, but this game, damn, it's a jagged lines fest all around. I gave up and accepted it - sad.
I wish I got an 2070 instead of the 5700XT.
Such a shame we won‘t get DLSS 2.0 in older titles. Especially heavily modded titles could need the performance boost.
Well, try to persuade nvidia to open source their algorithms, then we can have DLSS standardized => win for all users/gamers
... Morrowind with Mods...
maybe with dlss 3.0 exclusively on ampere they can make it just work in most title with compatible api just like RIS
Krteczeq Nvidia said that DLSS 3.0 will work on any titles with TAA.
Maybe in the future we will get dlss as a toggle on the control panel, dlss 3.0 is already said to be way easier to implement and I don't see it as a stretch for them to target having it as an option that you can use in every game without any developer support needed
Haven't played the PS4 version, so thought the trails were intentional and looked good/made sense. :)
Yea, I can see developers firing up the game with DLSS for the first time and saying "ha ha, hey, what''s that trails?... humm, you know what? they don't look bad... they don't look bad at all" XD
@Thinh T I thought that that was the strand the title refer to
I can't take my eyes off crysis lit with small candle lights on his right side...
Its the Crisis shrine, he prays to it daily to get consistent FPS when above 1080p.
It kinda looks like the collectors edition too.. I remember I was so hyped when I actually got it in the mail 1 week before release!
Laughed out loud when I saw it
@@alexanderulv3886 Crysis, I have never prayed to you before. I have no tongue for it. All that matters is my PC stood against high resolution and ray tracing. Thats whats important. Performance pleases you Crysis, so grant me one wish! Grant me high FPS! And if you do not listen, then to hell with you!
That's his left side ;)
DLSS is a big improvement over checkerboarding, very impressive, just need to get an RTX card lol.
@Peter Connell no , the difference is with the fps ! from 30fps to 60fps using dlss 4k
@Peter Connell Or by having big monitor and good eye sight.
Does It also work on GTX 1k series?
I used to think rtx cards were a gimmick but dlss is insane, and the performance improvements in 3d rendering are really impressive too, ill have to save money for a little longer 😅
@Peter Connell I can notice the difference without zooming in. The flickering of edges I hate that this is somthing I always hated I would notice that immediately on PS4 PRO.
I love the Crysis altar in the background
in loving memory lol
Even better imagining how he has to manually light those candles every time he makes a video lol.
dorime
Shrine :)
@@radekseky4571 *every morning
FTFY
The particle streaks were the first thing I noticed that was off, but with the aesthetic of this game they really don’t bother me on the things floating to the sky. I think if you didn’t know any better you would just think it was some cool effect coming off them
DLSS 2.0 is undoubtedly a fine technological advancement, but to be fair to the PS4 pro and checkerboarding it's over 3 years old now and costs £300...so it's very good for the cost 👍🏻
Agreed, for its "price" checkerboarding is good but from an image comparison its like a little light brother to dlss2
Seems like you covered all the pros and cons but the image quality for DLSS is clearly a mile ahead.
Well checkerboard was done on a weak 2016 system, DLSS uses top of the line Tensor cores from 2018 hardware
@@GrainMuncher if you used checkerboarding on the same GPU DLSS would still come out on top.
AlphaDwg of course, but the difference would be smaller since DLSS has more room for improvement due to the vastly superior hardware
@@AlphaDwg
If checkerboard was developed for better hardware, then it could perhaps rival it, not sure.
Since it was made for ps4 pro's architecture, which is equivalent to a weaker RX 480. Think about trying to deliver 4k on that hardware. Quite impressive.
@@GrainMuncher it's just better there is no need to make excuses about it. The only thing you can defend is maybe Nvidia was inspired by the idea of reconstruction that Sony did. They took the time to develop a whole generation of hardware for it and just do it better. It even had to go through a whole bad 1.0 phase before it got to what it is now.
That trail in floating criptos matches the game aesthetics so well that I thought it was supposed to be there all along ... lol
I only came here for the candle lit Crysis box.
Probably the best ever beginning to a DF video
Love your content! Keep up the good work!
DLSS is real magic. Death Stranding looks amazing with DLSS, even better than native 4K in motion.
yeah except those streaks it leaves
Visual glitches are patchable, though.
@@melxb it kinda adds to that eerie vibe the game has ;) but yeah hope it's fixed
@@Androx5000 yeah i thought to myself also works as a cool effect, but it does change it to looking spirit like particles from hmm what are those things, is it a fly or what, so yeah can give a diff vibe change ones vision...but yeah maybe they even ignored it because it still looked intended vs a graphical glitch
DLSS is shit. Checkerboad rendering is, by far, the preferred method. It uses way less resources and looks almost as good. The tradeoff for DLSS isn't worth it. Not even close.
4 years ago a lot of people were laughing because ps4 pro wasn’t Native 4k, but never realized this was the future because how less expensive is to render bigger resolutions 🤷🏽♀️
Hey you make a good point!
Looking at Halo: Infinite, I guess MS did not get the memo...
I wouldn’t mind checkerboard 4k 60fps next gen. Most people don’t even notice and from having played both checker boarded and native 4K the difference is really minimal especially when done right unlike rdr2 on PS4 pro.
H. E. M. This is the way to go, it’s just too expensive to render native 4k, while DLSS 2.0 is already proving how pointless native resolution is with a good reconstruction method can improve performance while looking like native 4k.
@@lacasadelvideojuego3880 I hope we could see next checkerboard version in PS5, or some of new AMD features against nvidia DLSS
I love Alex’ contributions to DF, always going into details and nice technical explanations
OMG the intro hahaha! Love it! Keep it going DF!
The great thing about DLSS is that it relies on an externally trained model that can be improved without the game needing to change anything. And the upcoming DLSS 3.0 improves a lot in the respect that it can upscale to a higher resolution from what it was given, compared to 2.0 going from 1440p to 4k here. Exciting times, hopefully this type of rendering gives GPUs more room to breathe, a much needed respite from exploding pixel demand.
i'm just hoping amd can do the same move
@@NicolasSilvaVasault I don't think so. at least not to the same degree. Nvidia uses special hardware while AMD chose to make the CU's do INT operations.
This is smart from AMD because it means the GPU is cheaper to make and works fully even if the game doesn't support the technology.
@@codethis2875 AMD is actually taking the software route compared to the brute force hardware route that Nvidia took. FidelityFx+Upscaling already boosts frame rates in Death Stranding comparable to that of DLSS Quality mode. All they need to do, is improve on the image quality and make it as close to Native as possible.
@@kishaloyb.7937 Fidelity is horrible, you can't even compare it to a proper temporal reconstruction. AMD will use machine learning too. Microsoft already demoed something similar.
@@codethis2875 I'm not saying that FidelityFx is better than native or even DLSS 2.0, all I'm saying is for a image up-scaling feature running on compute shader, it does a pretty good job of maintaining a stable image quality while also boosting the overall performance. Not to mention that it runs on all recent GPUs available in the market. No doubt, AMD will improve image quality using ML in the future, and if that can run on all current GPUs, then thats gonna be very good for us consumers.
I've used both FFX and DLSS in Monster Hunter World Iceborne and Death Stranding, DLSS 2.0 is clearly superior in DS from a bench-marking perspective when you zoom in 400% to see the difference. But from a normal gamer's pov, there is not much of a difference to talk about except that one image is a bit sharper than the other one.
OMG that fighting screen with Cerney was awesome!
Man, I love the new funtime intros from you guys, keep it up and thanks again for a great video 😊 👍 💕
Fantastic work as always! Thanks Alex, very interesting.
Amazing video Alex! I love these things. Reconstruction is the future for sure, DLSS 2.0 is like magic. Hope Microsoft can do something similar for Lockhart/Series S and make the 1080p-1440p resolution much better.
DLSS2 is so god damn awesome. All devs need to use it. It can save so much performance that can be used for framerate and better graphics.
Every big title game coming out SHOULD honestly use it. Made Control playable and D. Stranding is another fantastic example
Thanks Alex, I was looking forward to this video 😀
Great Job Alex/DF. Thanks!!
7:00 Love the subtle Hitman Paris show music in the background 😁
Now this is quality content!
I mean for what it is meant to run on, the Checkerboarding technique, still does a fantastic job. I have to give it to the engineers who achieved this. However, clearly, as computing becomes cheaper, I am totally digging deep learning techniques of upscaling. Kudos to nVIDIA for doing such a fantastic job and I hope it becomes more widely adopted.
@Digital Foundry @Alex man this was a fantastic comparison. So much effort was put into it and the analysis was in depth. Keep up the good work and the quality, you folks rock!
Great analysis!!
This is the best intro I've ever seen.
Watch the Final Fight video and the end of it.
12:14 - that Hitman Paris runway music tho
THANK YOU!!! Was wracking my brain where the hell I've heard that music before
Excellent analysis. Thank you very much Alex!
Ahahaha. Intro was so good I had to watch it several times.
Good work 👍
Alex really understands to make great videos. He goes into great detail and never fails to present all that in a very entertaining way. I always look forward to his videos. Viele Grüße und Danke!
I have to wonder if Alex's scar is a Germanic dueling scar get got at the Austrian University he attended. There is a growing underground dueling scene in various German, Swiss and Austrian Universities, and it origins harken back centuries when those dueling scars were seen as a sign of manliness and respect, and it was not uncommon for upper class men to actually go out of their way to get dueling scars.
Are you serious? I think this a thing of the past and nothing I have ever encountered in my normal life as a German citizen. It's called "Schmiss" and has been basically extinct since the end of the German Reich.
Alex probably has the scar from a simple accident or OC'd PC blowing up in his face! :P
@@DigitalDesires87 I'm 99.7% certain its NOT a dueling scar. But maaaaybe just maaaaybe. There have been recent news articles and investigative journalism about dueling clubs reemergence in multiple universities across Germanic speaking countries. It origins are not with the Reich, it predates the Reich by centuries. Accounts of it taking place back in 1566. Similar to how the Swasticka has its origins with East asia, but once the Nazi's unfortunately adopted it, they perverted the symbol and the symbol probably predate Nazis by a millenia or two. Participants in these dueling clubs are not Nazi sympathizers as far as I've read.
Too bad he's a Microsoft shill
@@2drealms196 I didn't mean that it came from the Reich, but the practice mostly ended at the same time WWII did. There are still duels today, but far less and without injuries to the face. It also takes no place in our normal culture. Nobody knows about it today. But it's definitely a cool back story for a cool looking scar, yes! :P
Bruh I would love to watch a fighting game between company ceos
Lisa Su hits you with that big a* diamond ring.
Cerny’s special move: audio engineering class jutsu
Jensen defend move: leather jacket deflect
sony don't need xbox hitting them self on there own face.
A NEW CHALLENGER APPROACHES...
LISA! SU!
"Get ready for Threadripper!"
@@rinkumultani6515 A new challenger enters the octagon. Make noise for the faaaaaanboyyyyy.
Alex, you are such a great Addition to the DF-Team. Honestly, its Richs and your Videos that i appreciate the most. Also the depth of the information you two provide is fantastic. Not to say, that Johns and Toms Videos arent top notch in their own rights. You all bring something unique to the table and i dont want to miss any of DFs Videos. Keep up the good work.
hhaha that intro was absolutely incredible! Thank You!
i love that we they use music for the paris mission in hitman 2016 for some parts
I love the way that Valves from Tiberian Sun attacks you.
DLSS 2.0 is obviously the winner here, but it has never been as good as in Death Stranding before. My 2080 Ti can't hold 4k60 when playing Control with DLSS for example. But DS runs like a charm. You can also further increase sharpness with Nvidia Freestyle.
because DLSS varies from game to game, this is the problem with DLSS and its use of pre rendered frames
@@123TheCloop TAA? Checkerboard rendering? You forgot those two?
@@sheikhrayan9538 neither require additionally hardware to function. DLSS does. hence it varies from game to game.
Are you using the latest patch for control ? bcz my 2070 can run it 4k at average 60fps with 1080p rendering in DLSS
@@assassinxxx65 Last time I tried it was at the beginning of the year, after they improved the DLSS. Did they improve even further? I only tried with maxed out settings. The game ran fine and at 60 90% of the time, but dropped below 60 in some locations.
Have been waiting for this one
Thank you very much for your technical explanations. Very much appreciated
DLSS 2.0 hope to see more contend on this topic
If Nvidia existed in the medieval times, it would be burned for being a witch
Cattiest sage by using intel 10 series chips instead of wood
Suddenly Thermi back in 2010 makes a lot of sense.
Jensen would escape getting burned at the stake by using the solar arrays on the roof of Nvidia HQ to power a computer and a large display and fake his own burning. Those HDR raytraced flames on a Gsync display would easily fool the medieval peasantry . Soon Jensen would simulate his own resurrection with Gameworks and before you know he would have the peasants in the palm of his hand chanting "the more you buy the more you save".
THANK YOU for using left-to-right comparisons!! Yay! :-)
Woah! This was the video I was waiting for! Thank you, Alex
I am so deeply in love with DLSS 2.0!!!
Wow you are really feeling it! Now we need another iteration or an additional one which can be applied to any game 👌
The bevel reflection was actually the same as in the native 4K mode. Looks like DLSS changes the original a bit there
+ the „partical trail“ issue is another part where the original is changed.
ICEMANZIDANE the LOD popin was also much more noticeable with DLSS but that may be a difference in the PC version of the Decima engine
Awesome stuff once again...
Another great video
JENSON WINS! FLAWLESS VICTORY!
DLSS needs prepreparation in the form of motion vectors to be done in engine, but the output image is clearly superior
That will change once we stuff enough tensor cores onto the GPUs. Its not so much preparation as it is pre-calculations. Things DLSS could very well be doing itself with enough hardware.
What is a motion vector?
@@adamkallin5160 he explained it in the video
Perfect, this and your recent Halo video are exactly the kind of content I come to you guys for.
Great video Alex. Nitpick, DLSS 2.0 in quality mode uses an internal resolution of 1527p at 4K, half the total number of pixels. So it uses the same number of pixels as checker board rendering, they are the just evenly spaced in both dimensions. Balanced mode uses one third of the pixels, 1247p, and performance mode uses one quarter of the pixels, 1080p. They discuss this in the nvidia GTC talk.
Actually this is a funny mistake I think in the NV presentation - as you can Pixel count the edges in quality Mode DLSS 2.0 in any game where it Breaks and get 1440p. Also, in this game, Control, and Wolfen Young blood you can have access to the game config file or console to see the internal resolution Scaler before DLSS 2.0 applies, and for all of them, it is 68% or 1440p!
Control or Wolfenstein even allow you to change it to any internal resolution you want basically
@@DigitalFoundry Wow. Thanks for letting me know. I'm surprised they give access to the internal resolution. I wonder if it's adjustable on a per frame basis. Do you think we could get dynamic resolution DLSS?
If you zoom 400% into the background you can clearly make out the details of finely crafted DF mug. The accompanying shrine dedicated to crysis can also be clearly seen- laughing in the face of checkerboard rendering! 😄
We really need a vendor-agnostic version of DLSS 2.0. RTX is solved, it is just DXR or Vulkan-RT and all Intel or AMD GPUs can enable it when they get the driver update / hardware for it. DLSS 2.0 is too proprietary for a long-term centuries-long solution for the art form.
we kinda have it in the works. it's called directML
Great video
Time for my daily dose of deep dive into video game technology. DF, you have single handedly made me more knowledgeable about both Xbox and Playstation consoles than anything I have read on Google over the years!
The real question is, does DLSS produce that same ghosting effect in Richard's hands moviments????
Dude, Jensen got:
- Leather Jacket
- RTX
- "It just works"
- Cooking skills
Cerny is in trouble.
10 GIGARAYZ!
@@CaveyMoth No mere mortal.
@@cavegoblin101 Manliness is measured in RT-OPS.
cerny has
- ssd prowess
- exclusives
- Good manners with his employees on stage
- Optimization for only one hardware
- Relaxing voice
ready FIGHT!!!...
@@nahuelcutrera Don't forget that he has the shadow people on his side.
Good work 👏
Alex's breakdowns are the main reason I'm subbed
The more I watch DLSS 2.0 the more it impresses me. I mean we don't even need native 4k now how crazy is that. If we get something similar for fps we might be able to afford ray tracing even better!
dlss looks stunning even 540p
The main issue with DLSS and Death Stranding is its present inability to resolve raindrop particles. It’s a very crucial part of the game and against anything other than a very dark background you just can’t see it. Native plus TAA resolves them perfectly.
I also think Alex undersells just how egregious the trails are. When you get to the mid game you build roads, and those roads are absolutely teeming with those ascending particles. It looks an absolute mess in motion. Such a shame because otherwise DLSS IQ is a miracle.
This is still basically first generation tech when game engines start giving depth data to the tensor cores with acceleration and thing like that pretty soon we will have dlss that works for res and frame rate search up lucas arts force unleash 2 frame rate upscale.
Then thats the game needing more work to implement DLSS properly because its not been given all the information. Hopefully an update will fix it
Imraan Omar I hope so
King Marco Louis III as I say it’s a miracle and 90% of the time I play with DLSS on (even at 1080p it noticeably monsters the competition in terms of image quality), I really hope they can fix the issues I mention. Frame rate upscaling sounds mind bending and I love it.
excellent video
Wow! What a coincidence. Just this morning I was thinking about this exact topic and had the question about what's preferable, and ideal when going into next-gen. From what I've seen, I assumed DLSS but wanted to know more. Thanks for this; great insight.
As having never played DS except on the PC, I thought those trails were totally normal. I just thought it was part of the game as an effect lol
Hope DLSS3.0 can be easier for devs to use in games. Special optimization for each game is after all a hard thing to achieve.
I dont see how the use of motion vector info being fed into the algorithm can be eliminated. Unless DLSS can predict where objects will be in the next frame using screen space info because Nvidia built a time machine into their GPUs I dont see optimizations being gone completely. Although maybe another AI program can help devs optimize it xD.
@@fiftyfive1s410 None of this is optimization. They are pre-calculations. They don't optimize anything. The amount of work required for the rest of the process is still exactly the same as before. Less work is not being done. Its just being done at different times. Learn what that word means. both of you.
Secondly, how do you think motion vectors are found? By hand? No lol. The GPU can very well do it with the right hardware. The problem is there isn't enough tensor cores on our modern day GPUs to do both. A TPU could easily do the work. But consumers won't be seeing those for years.
@@Wylie288 1. Yeah I know optimization wasn't the right word to use.
2. Yeah sorry. On second analysis of what I said I realised I was getting DLSS, an upscaling technique, confused with a traditional rendering pipeline. However I still dont understand how DLSS can work without motion vector data being fed into the algorithm, care to explain?
I'll be honest, i have no idea what you guys are talking about but i still watch your vids cuz they make me feel smart. Keep it up love your work
Wow this is Deep. I’m Learning a lot from your Sampling of these graphics.
Very impressive what nVidia managed to do with DLSS2.0, but the cost is huge in silicon and the reward is rather limited, only few games support DLSS and the performance lost because of the tensor cores is just too high.
How so ?
RT cores and Tensor cores meant an increase of around 20% in die area, even if you ignore the area taken for RT cores :
If you take a GPU and add 20% more shaders you get,at most, 20% mor performance( most likelly less than that)
If you take a GPU and add 20% area in tensor cores you get between 50% to 100% more performance..
The only limitation is not beeing used in many games ( yet)
Odd that you didn't mention how DLSS 2.0 has ringing artifacts. You can most easily see this as a thin white outline on black edges against some non-white material, like text on Sam's backpack. It's mostly subtle except for cases like high contrast edges, again, such as text.
I love these videos. I wish I had a fraction of understanding of development that the DF guys have
I love the addition of the little Crysis shrine on the desk
I want Cerny to fight Jensen MK style after that intro :(.
Lisa Su is a DLC character....
Cerny uses "Next-gen Punch!"
Jensen uses "RTX Reflections!"
"Next-gen Punch" deflected! Cerny has hurt himself!
The more you die the more you save
AMD needs a similar tech if they want to be competetive. Otherwise, big Navi will be at a disadvantage even if it has enough raw power to match Ampere. Mid cycle refreshes of next gen consoles should also implement some sort of AI upscaling for 4K 60fps visuals with no compromise to image quality. Imagine horizon forbidden west running at 4k 60.
Yes but not with dedicated HW. You dont want to pay more money for DLSS instead of having a faster GPU for all games.
@@OrjonZ pay more money for reliability as well.
Agreed, it seems that the motion vectors are really key in how DLSS looks stable while blending previous frames. AMD and the other game engine companies need to look into this
@@Robertt422 They can use DirectML, but without the dedicated hardware, it'll have to use RNDA cores, which will take resources away from the rendering pipeline.
Im afraid nvidia may be one of the few companies with enough r&d muscle to make something this amazing, but if amd can match it will be a huge boost to consoles
Great explanation
Awesome video as always. And I really loved dlss 2.0 I hope we can see more games using this technology soon. Really makes difference in my rtx 2070.
DLSS takes the cake with the visuals. But I have to give props to checkerboarding.
DLSS has room to take advantage of much superior hardware, compared to the 2016 mobile gpu PS4 Pro is running on.
Checkerboard and temporal injection have allowed Pro to massively overachieve. Pro games were in the conversation every year for Best Graphics awards when in terms of hardware on paper they should have never had a single nominee compared to X1X and PC. They won a warehouse full of graphics awards for just Horizon alone.
The only thing missing from this pc masterpiece is ray tracing
I'm glad you guys have given this game the attention it deserves. Definitely my favorite game from 2019.
This is the most professional intro I've ever seen in my life.
Death Stranding is out on PC? Finally, I can play this excellent and unique strand-type game!
Yeah I bought it 3 days ago and been playing for 3 days straight. It’s been out for a week or two now. Games very addicting, but give it about 4-5 hours since the intro is a very slow burn before it gets going for real
It was already unique and excellent when I played it a year ago uh ^^
It's amazing how good PS4 pro checkerboard is for an old console that don't have machine learning to implement DLSS. I bet PS5 will have solution like DLSS using AMD solution and Sony proprietary solution.
AMD doesn't have the tensor cores needed for efficient image reconstruction using AI, there won't be a console equivalent this generation.
There's no AMD solution like this at the moment. And won't be for a while since you can't just create it overnight. Nvidia was investing in the AI research for more than a decade before DLSS became a thing and even then first version of DLSS was pretty bad.
@@satnav9699 well CU unit actually has ML equivalent to it . Is not just as robust like in Nvidia comand unit.
does PS5 support machine learning? I haven't seen anything about it and they haven't mentioned it at all. Guess we will find out in august when they finally show what's under the hood
@@AlphaDwg It does support it but not much compared to Nvidia , even Xbox SX has direct ML and DSSL by software . PS5 will also has its own proprietary . and also Sony are well known for for their AI upscaling for their camera image sensor
Been waiting since the PC release to see this video, game changing for sure.
Looking forward to the future of DLSS and other similar tech. If enough games support DLSS 3.0 that will probably push me to upgrade from my 1080ti. Would be great to get DLSS or similar on the PS5. Glad I finally subbed to patreon. I've been enjoying the high quality downloaded videos.