Extreme wood bending with ammonia
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ส.ค. 2024
- Bending wood with ammonia is not really DIY, but I show the process, which is extremely effective. There is also a commercial product that is pre-treated flexible wood, which hardens after being clamped in the desired shape.
boingboing.net/...
Hmm, it seems the product may no longer be available -- I can't find it at Inventables.
www.inventable...
Pre-treated flexible wood product patent:
www.google.com...
Hi ben!
Regarding your corrosion issues : if you manage to make your ammonia really anhydrous (for instance, by dissolving a tiny bit of sodium in it and distilling it again), you shouldn't get any serious corrosion issues with it.
What happens is that ammonia dissolves the passivation layer that forms on many metals. Normally, the reaction can't go any further than that : the pKa of an amide is way to high for it to give protons that could oxydize your metal.
How ever, if water is present, now you have labile protons available. The reaction that takes place is the standard dissolution of a metal in an acid, with its thermodynamics further driven by the formation of ammonia complexes with the resulting metal cations.
(That is why copper corrodes in ammonia solutions, even without O2 around, and despite the fact "regular" acids cannot dissolve it).
Also, regarding the aluminium, I wouldn't trust it for storing ammonia that still has water in it : the basicity of the solution might be sufficient to dissolve the aluminium oxide layer into aluminates, and quickly corrode the reactive aluminium metal underneath.
Try putting aluminium foil in aqueous ammonia, and you'll see hydrogen starting to bubble off. Granted, ammonia and water proportions are completely different here, but I still definitely would not trust it.
Really thorough and interesting explanation, ty
I can just imagine the stress and mental monologue that was going on during your mad dash for a container :P Excellent video as always. Just remember, no storing supercritical methanol in aluminum.
Ryan Willis Thanks! Did you see my video about supercritical methanol for aerogel drying? I was very surprised about the reaction with aluminum. I forget if I showed in the video what happened to the aluminum parts that were contained within the steel chamber, but the high-surface area aluminum screen completely disappeared!
Yeah, that's what I was referring to. I love weird reactions like that, you never expect them.
Sounds like the Al reacted with the methanol to make an alkoxide salt : aluminium alkoxide.
The same happens with alkali metals and alcohols.
I have been a wood worker for nearly 30 years and you sir are the first person I have EVER encountered that takes wood working to the molecular level. My mind is bent similar to the cork screw piece in the display picture. Whoa! Very interesting but far beyond anything I will ever need in my line of work. Your crazy smart.
This is so cool! I love hearing about the real world encounters like busted freezers and broken brass, too. Hope to find out about that dollar!
That's a great idea. By the way here are the best woodworking plans online: QualityWood.xyz
Great video, I didn't know ammonia-treated wood was that flexible! The brilliant blue corrosion you described on the safety valve is of the tetraamminecopper(II) ion, most likely the hydroxide. Storing the ammonia in the aluminium bottle might be OK if it's dry ammonia but seeing as it is wet it is definitely not a suitable permanent storage device because you can get ammonium tetrahydroxoaluminate forming due to the presence of ammonium hydroxide.
In the agricultural market, anhydrous ammonia is transported and used as a fertilizer in massive quantities. Trucks which were set up for hauling propane are converted for hauling ammonia by removing all brass components and replacing them with stainless steel.
A PVC tube with capped ends, (one glued and the other using a plastic bag as a gasket) has contained my ammonia well for about two years. No idea if it's appropriate, but its been sufficient so far. Definitely works wonders with bending. Thanks for the video!
I would love to spend an afternoon or two just talking with this guy...he is so knowledgeable about so many things...and he explains and describes things in a plain language that anyone can understand...even a dork llike me.
Ben: Your style of education has set my mind on fire. Nurons are under rapid fire, its a blessing and a curse because I can't turn it off. But you should be proud of yourself your work is building solid foundations for all of your students. Its amazing how big of an impact a good educator has on everyone's life life they cross. Thanks much more than I can express.
This is one of the most uniquely informative videos on TH-cam.
Respect.
Ben, you should keep a video camera recording in your workshop whenever you work with anhydrous ammonia. It could make for some interesting viewing when unexpected things happen, and (should the unthinkable happen) it could help the authorities figure out what happened! Your videos are the best thing on TH-cam.
NileRed making transparent wood and you’re making cool ammonia bent wood.
Love this
It's great to see people such as yourself experimenting -- getting it wrong sometimes, not declaring you have all the answers, just the true spirit of exploration and discovery. Thanks.
5:59 That looks like one of those photorealism drawings.
many moons ago I found myself teaching chemistry to hairdressing students and this process reminds me of hair perms and disulphide bridges being broken and reformed....cool.
Jeff Watt I’m a hairdresser and that is exactly what I was thinking of during this video.
bloodwood, maple, walnut ... so basically you chose woods that through steam bending dont bend well at all. awesome
Nice! I question your classification of DIY though. You did it all yourself. If you're talking about the dangerous aspect of it, plenty of DIY is dangerous: DIY high voltage power supplies and DIY car repair come to mind. Maybe you just mean that you don't recommend others do this.
RimstarOrg I was thinking almost the same thing. At another level, if we put certain parameters on DIY, we limit ourselves to what we can do and lower our expectations. DIY is all about defying expectations of what we can do, as individuals and as a broad community, without relying on commercial industry. Who says we shouldn't handle hazardous chemicals if we use safe practices?
Tom Hill Some times it requires more than one person to be safe with chemicals. There is dangerous and then there are things a hundred times more dangerous, or a thousand times more dangerous. It's important to know which is which so that you can make that decision. Some things are so dangerous that it is not wise to do in your home, because it's hard to be safe in such a chaotic environment. Some things are so dangerous that it really helps to have an entire team of individuals all with safety on their mind. Again this doesn't mean that you can't DIY (as in not a commercial industry) but maybe you shouldn't do it alone, and if you do choose to do it, perhaps with individuals with experience. Anhydrous ammonia can make a space so dangerous that nobody can get in to help you when something goes wrong, like a fire you can't put out, also blindness and a slow suffocation as you can't find your way out while your throat closes up. There are other meaningful projects that are much much less risky, like building a jet engine bicycle, your own wooden rollercoaster. Comparably those projects are, quite safe.
Don't think the dangers of anhydrous ammonia are under stated this isn't like saying gasoline or battery acid is dangerous. It boils at about -25 and becomes a toxic gas that will try to mix with any water present that includes your water in your eyes nose mouth and lunges. Damaging the membranes and can and will cause death. This really isn't something that you want to play with at home. I have about 2 tons of the stuff at work that I deal with daily and I for sure dont want it in my house or neighborhood.
RimstarOrg Working with ammonia is not safe for anyone but the most cautious, especially anhydrous, a minor mistake you could be blind, it attacks the water in your skin,esp. your eyes 90% water, burns your lungs. You will probably be found on the floor, in bad to worst shape. A major mistake the whole neighborhood will have to be evacuated.
I subscribed at "I added a glass viewport so I could see if anything interesting was going on ..." Haha, love it.
I liked this video. My employer uses anhydrous ammonia to keep the freezer and produce cold (warehouse). They make us sign all kinds of documents so we are aware that if there is an ammonia leak, its extremely lethal. The paintball canister was brilliant improvisation too.
Years ago, there was an artist (Japanese, if I recall), who made some "sculptures" by bending logs into various shapes using some secret method. These were largish logs - like a foot in diameter or more and several feet long. Are you familiar with this artist, and do you think it was this technique that was used?
so at this moment I have a piece of steamed poplar hard wood in a form
It is roughly 2" thick poplar, which will be curved to match the wall under a spiral staircase
It is 2" thick because it will be the door (little closet door) food under the staircase
I have to wait up to 7 days for it in the form
and even then, this is the 2nd time I've steamed it
steaming wood takes a long time
this ammonia method looks like a HUGE TIME SAVER!
Would be nice to see some side by side comparisons of the two processes.
I love the farewells in these videos.
Many years ago, when I did a lot of machining, I learned that aluminum sometimes contains copper impurities in the form of tiny flecks of copper. I'd find those flecks while buffing a piece to a polish in once direction a bit too long. The copper flecks created a V shape in the metal since the copper is harder and the aluminum softer.
Now, years later, I've also learned that in early apothecaries, copper "verdigris" (used as a medicinal ingredient) was created in the lab by mixing honey and salt, smearing it on a sheet of copper, and suspending the doped copper over a shallow dish of ammonia for a prolonged period. Aside from really stinking up my kitchen, the technique does work, though slowly, so copper and ammonia do produce the blue-green fuzz known by that name.
Take those two thoughts and add them together, and I can imagine that the tiny flecks of copper in lower grade aluminum would indeed react with ammonia, producing microscopic deposits of copper sulfate crystals. Would that affect the effectiveness of your pressure vessel? Possibly.
Please excuse the roundabout way I get to my point. I'm a science enthusiast of many disciplines and all self-taught, so I don't always take the most direct route.
How does this compare to steam-bending of wood? I know that process is often used by crafters and even shipwrights.
pauljs75 11 bending wood with ammonia for years. As far as I know it may go back to the 60 or earlier. However, I'm not sure how it was started.
Its shity and cunts uo yoyr nice wood, CHEERS. Use steam ,not amminia, steam needs to be maybe 2 psi, while this weirdo, jeeze. HAVE A GOOD NIGHT. I'm fead up.
@@garyhoney2013 Do you use regular ammonia? How do you use it to bend wood?
@@ryanb1874 dude, you just murdered the English language.
In reference to 4:18 Doesn't heat up occur due to pressurization of the chamber. You drew it to a slight vacuum but adding the chemical using vacuum drag has the same effects as pressurizing a container which causes heat.
Great Channel! I just watched the Led/Contact lens video and a couple of others and thought you might find my experience interesting. I had cataracts lenses replaced with prosthetic lenses. After the first was done, being a bit of a 'layperson scientist' I went into a darkened room with a 'black light.'. The left eye, still with natural lens saw small circle of illumination. The right eye ; lens replaced a few hours prior, saw the entire small room illuminated. I then looked on the internet and yes, some people were finding the same result. There is even talk of the character of the paintings of Monet's work shifting to bluer after a cataract was removed. Interesting stuff as is your channel. Thanks, Travelin2wit
What could possibly go wrong, eh? Interesting vid. Thanks.
I'm so glad I discovered this channel I learn something new in every video
I wonder how much of this is actually due to the chemical reaction. I make bentwood jewellery, and you can bend a veneer strip into a ring with only about 40 minutes soaking in boiling water, and I know that steam bending can be used on much heftier pieces (although I've never done it personally, so I can't give specifics). I imagine being heated all night long would produce some impressive bending, so it may just be the prolonged heat and moisture.
Even katara couldn't do that on a full moon.
First - use wood that has been spilt, to avoid grains not going all the way from end to end. And when bending, strap something all the way around the bent wood, so the grains that might start to crack loose, are held in place.
The trick of the product you mention seems to be in it being compressed.Bendable Wood is a cold-bendable compressed wood that enables the creation of dramatic and unique bentwood parts using thick, solid, quality hardwood lumber. This is a different process, where the wood is extremely compressed. There is another youtube video demonstrating the product and giving some saw instructions.
Hope Nile Red sees this video per his new Halloween '23 video on bulletproof wood. Saw his video just now and instantly remembered this video which has been on my mind off and on for years. :)
Really interesting! Thanks for sharing!
The wood bending certainly is neat but the story about the container exchange was the surprise winner in the video. I'll bet that old timey gas mask got some use.
You used alot of woods that typically doesn't bend well at all. So this is a lot more impressive than most people probably think.
I would like to see it compared to traditional steam bending for those woods. Hard to say if there is a real advantage other than temperature.
Teflon tape isn't for sealing threads, contrary to popular belief. I have been in the heating and air conditioning trades for well over 30 years. Pipe dope of various types should be used to seal the threads. Teflon tape was introduced as a lubricant for the threads so that another 2 or so threads could be gotten into the fitting. I rarely use Teflon tape at all. If you use pipe dope instead of teflon tape, you can draw down a vacuum as deep as you'd like in a tiny pipe chamber like the one you were using in this video.
Correct! Teflon tape seals nothing except your uninformed brain... Now, as far as the vacuum..... Rarely do HVAC guys leave a pump on long enough.... let alone down to Torr. In actuality once you get below 200 microns the hoses start gassing..... (decomposing)
It's good enough for sealing against water.
Tezcax and many other things... Maybe not the best in a vacuum with refrigerant, don't know...never had it fail in any water, oil, or air situation...
I wonder how this compares with steam bending?
Interesting video, thanks!
I wanted to ask about the grain direction of the pieces of wood you bent successfully vs the soft wood (pine?). Wood that's steam bent tends to fail along the growth rings, and the soft wood looked to have failed in that way, or possibly the hardened pitch in the pine functioned as a vapor block. Did you happen to notice if the hardwood you bent well was parallel or perpendicular to the growth rings or if you managed both orientations well?
I think the plywood and particle board failed because the glue/resin used retards the absorption of moisture into the wood beyond the exposed edge of the piece, which is why they are such stable products; but it's interesting to note that ammonia gas will not soften resin/glue. Also with plywood, the board plies are laid in alternate grain direction, opposing directions every other layer, so it may have failed anyway.
Glad you got the cylinder issues sorted! Lathe speed threading... that deserves to be a new sport ;)
What is with the dollar bill? Don't leave us hanging!
Auhydride SPOILER ALERT! It's gonna shrink, I think.
***** great scott D:
I wanna know about the dollar bill too!
Cristiano G. It's in the picture for size reference.
Auhydride It's in the picture for size reference.
How did you get from "I have some dry ammonia" to "Let's try bending some wood with it" ? google patent search?
Zarouszz I did a wood-bending project a few years ago, and saw a forum posting wherein someone claimed that spraying Windex on the wood (very thin plywood) would help it bend as the piece was slowly pulled into shape. It seems that Windex may help slightly by simply wetting the wood, but the ammonia content is so much lower than the water content, the contribution of flexibility from the ammonia is almost nothing. I did more research and learned the professionals use ammonia to get the wood really flexible. I've had the idea in the back of my mind for a while.
Applied Science Is this possible because the ammonia denatures the protiens in the wood, making it more bendable? Im still a student but that would be my educated guess. I would like to know more about this process even though I wouldn't be crazy enough to produce the ammonia needed.
NotaPro He discusses his theory at 5:50
Applied Science Lignin is soluble in water in alkalic conditions. It might be, that the ammonia gas works its way into the wood via diffusion, dissolutes in water inside of your wood samples and dissolves part of the lignin.
Zarouszz You're one of them chicken came before the egg people...
Dear god, dude. You're gonna get in some serious shit with all these high pressure things you do.
Stay safe buddy.
I'm curious how green hardwood would react compared with dried/cured. Also wondering about younger branches (as they have a higher water content). what about still-living saplings? There's artists who grow living chairs and such by training saplings into a shape, like functional lifesized bonsai; perhaps this could be implemented if the saplings are potted.
Thanks Ben! I'd been told about this wood-bending process, but hadn't tried it out. Given the similarities to steam bending (minus the heat), how would this experiment have differed using off-the-shelf 30% ammonia solution under vacuum/pressure and/or heat? [I would guess that water would help relieve tension in the wood fibers and enhance penetration of the ammonia]
Is the treated wood flexible enough to attempt to bend compound curves such as a bowl shape with this process?
anhydrous ammonia is used in heavy industry as a refrigerant.
Ammonia supposedly attacks aluminum oxide, but not metallic aluminum. Some people have suggested household ammonia (3% aqueous, I believe) for removing stuck aluminum seatposts from bicycles, but it seems a bit unlikely, given the surface area and concentration of ammonia.
When the ammonia gas expands into the pressure chamber it cools down. (That is how refrigerators work) That is probably the reason why you get condensation at that point.
The pressure chamber will then be cold. After the chamber is sealed and you let it sit for a while, it will go back to room temperature, and the pressure will increase.
I think the bendable wood product you mention is made by compressing steamed wood lengthwise by about 20%, and as long as the wood is kept wet, it can be cold bent. The compression allows the outside of the curve to stretch. It is at puretimber.com. There are electron micrographs showing before and after compression!
..."then i threaded this aluminum cap faster than I've ever threaded anything in my life..." LOL
Alluminum serves well, the metals that you should be aware of, are: Cobalt, Copper, Nickel, Cadmium, Silver, Zinc.
Alluminum is not capable of forming a complex salt with ammine ligand. However, if it is oxidised, it might (maybe) react with NH3OH - a weak alkali. But the Al(OH)3 is insoluble, so the reaction stops anyway
I'm so impressed by your videos! You're an inspiring person!
Aluminum is just fine for anhydrous ammonia. We use it all the time in refrigeration applications. I have several evaporator coils made completely out of aluminum.
The "rain" was condensing ammonia and water. The heat was the condensing ammonia releasing it heat of vaporization as it condenses into the aqueous solution.
there is also ammonia fuming of wood for bringing out the iridescence. its amazing
Be careful with the aluminium tank and ammonia if you have also water inside. Aluminium is able to react easily with bases (with sodium hydroxide the reaction is quite strong and dangerous, with a large emission of hydrogen) and if your ammonia is not dry (most probably is not) you have also ammonium hydroxide in that tank. Now, if it is too much ammonium hydroxide and concentrated, that means you have a little bomb in your house. Hard to say when it will explode. Please, try to change with a steel tank.
Bogdan Stoica photo 55photo
Sorry you’ve not a clue and uneducated comments should be kept to yourself so you don’t badly influenced others incorrectly. Large ammonia industrial refrigeration plants of 100 - 100,000kw, most with water in the ammonia routinely use aluminium both in tube heat exchangers and as gasket materials because superior qualities in these applications.
Thanks for the interesting video! I think you can use water instead of ammonia. Heat the wet wood and then bend them.
vinegar with a little peroxide can dissolve alluminum, but the metal in that and even soda cans is usually treated and coated. Not sure how ammonia reacts to it though.
Woodworkers use a leather strap over the strip of wood to be bended to avoid it to split. The leather helps bending the outer layer of wood.
If your ammonia is not completely dry (as you suspect is the case) it will definately attack aluminium as all strongly alkaline aqeous solutions do. You can easily verify this by pouring a little concentrated ammonia solution in an aluminium cup. You'll see the aluminum darken, and small bubbles of hydrogen will form as the metal is being oxidised in the strongly alkaline solution (give it a minute to dissolve the oxide layer first).
Interesting. I took a tour of Great Lakes Banjo in Ann Arbor Michigan in the early 70's, and I believe they were bending their banjo rims with this method.
Don't want to sound daft here, but it looks like the walls of that aluminium tank are bowing outwards. Was it like that to start with?
Cool demo.
Thank you for this very informative clip. I remember reading about this process many years ago, but it was described as an obsolete technology, once used on an industrial scale for furniture production. I'd searched for info on the topic to no avail. Your presentation confirms my take on the basics involved.
A couple of quick questions: have you experimented with maximum thicknesses? What about time required in relation to thickness? Did you run into any serious discoloration problems with any particular species? Sorry...I'm clearly trying to pick your brain...
Your comment about the soft wood braking instead of bending made me wonder if it might be the resin in soft wood that was inhibiting the process ?? Just a thought, I could be talking from the wrong end of my anatomy !!
Aluminum is ok to use with ammonia as our relief valves on our bulk tanks are made of it . But not shure what type of aluminum it is (ie what alloys are added )but it seems quite soft like pure aluminum as the threads are easy to gall .
The spiral hardwood would make a decent wine bottle holder. And considering high end winos, you could probably catch a couple hundy for a simple yet elegant spiral bottle holder. Consider the time and effort, it might be worthwhile :)
Thanks for doing the dollar bill trick! I never had a chance to do this at my old job, but I always heard about it.
aluminum acts as a catalyst for reactions between hydrocarbons. An unrelated tidbit of info. An aluminum waste tank on an industrial site was used for years without a problem until a construction crew emptied some solvents into the container. The tank got warm, hot, glowed red and then exploded. = summary of the most interesting chemistry lecture that I ever sat through.
Hello Ben. This video caught my eye, in part, because I bend wood all the time, in my work as a guitarmaker. Quick question, if the wood is soaked in a water/ammonia bath/solution, for a few days, would that help with bending? Just curious. Thank you for your videos.
+Tsiorba Guitars Luthier: Classical Flamenco Guitar Repair I believe soaking wood in water/ammonia (window cleaner) will soften the wood mostly because of the water. Soaking the wood in anhydrous (dry) ammonia causes it to become soft via a different chemical process. I haven't tested it, but I suspect soaking in water is just as effective as window cleaner.
+Applied Science
Thanks for the video .We got a special project at the university,We need to make a"wood" leaf spring for a powerriser (jumper)!
Is there any other way to bend the wood like this ?
Any advice how to put the component together !
4 mm dick Hard wood ,then 4 mm soft wood (twice) and least glass fiber und TAPE:D:
I am going to test it with my 80 kg .....
thanks for your time :)
The blue powdery compound is likely hexamminecopper(II) complex, though how ammonia acts as oxidant I can't imagine. Try a flame test with a bit of the scrapings. A peacock blue flame would confirm the presence of copper.
Very interesting, and I have a question; once you bend the wood into shape and let the ammonia dissipate, what sort of concentration of ammonia is left, if any, in the wood? The reason I ask is I am interested in using a bent wood dowel as a pipe stem for an extra-long "wizard pipe" and I would be concerned that some ammonia might be left and therefore hazardous to put in one's mouth.
primatebuddy The ammonia is a gas, so with enough time, it will completely dissipate from the wood. I've noticed the wood samples that I bent in this video smelled like ammonia for a couple days, with it still being detectable but at a very low level for another week. If you give it another week after that, you should be fine.
+primatebuddy I was wondering the same, for the same reason after watching this clip.
After some (a lot...) googling i discovered that it depends on a lot of factors.
Al tough i do not feel like writing an essay here, so i will end with:
The longest time i can conclude that it would take for it to become "safe" would be around 1 and a half month. (with 1 week added due to unknown factors) how ever like Applied Science says, almost all woods would be safe after 3 weeks.
after bending and drying in ambient conditions, toss your pipe stem in a vac chamber and heat it up to 150 f or so. voila, no more ammonia in your wood. if permeation will put it in, it will just as handily remove it, lol. of course, the stem will have to contact the chamber wall to actually get heat transfer under vac, so do it before finish sanding and such, just in case it causes a blemish
I came here to ask about this application. Sounds like briar would be a great candidate for this.
You are right the ammonia attacks the hyrogen bridges in the cellulose (Hemicellulose).
The NH3 attacks very fast. At 30°C the structur looks like C6H12O5(NH3)2 above it looks C6H12O5(NH3).
When the NH3 evaporates the cellulose structure changes.If you put yet water on it you will get the old Cellulose-I Structure.
presumably theres no safer compound to neutralize the hydrogen bonds in the cellulose?
You sir are a King among men
lignan vitae, African black wood.. would be neat to try in this. it was used for the same qualities you mentioned in the video.. used in the first high precision clocks, predecessor of the first practical naval time-pieces, to combat friction.
aluminum will gradually solvate in liquid ammonia via an electride process. will work for a while but there is serious risk of catastrophic decompression over time. for more info wikipedia electrodes and alkalides. very interesting stuff. don't know the specifics about your aluminum. some aluminum alloys may have differing reactions to liquid ammonia. there is little risk of solivation from hot gasses.
+ Applied Science Can you try two pieces of laminated wood? Would they still stick together after being soaked in in the ammonia gas over night? Would the glue stay intact and flex as freely as the hardwood?
I could make a planet bending or nature release joke, but that would be beneath me. I think.
Although late to the party, when using any corrosive gas or liquid using Teflon or sealant is not recommended. Instead using a PTFE sealant in tape or liquid compound. At Home Depot it's yellow thread sealant tape (Oakey Yellow PTFE Tape) or ReactorSeal Tru-Blu with PTFE. Never use Teflon tape for any gas line threads.
+John Doe Teflon is just a brand name for PTFE.
Just discovered your channel with this video ..WOW, fun stuff indeed! I look forward to exploring more of your efforts here, thank you!
Another video of exceptional quality, thank you!
Thanks, this is an excellent video and an excellent reference!
Isn't concentrated ammonia-water called ammonium hydroxide? And isn't that cheap as dirt? And isn't that much easier to work with? Would that work?
Walter Clark ammonia water is called that. but it's inaccurate because the equilibrium is aaaall the way towards "just" aqueous ammonia, which is how it should be called. it wouldn't work because high-pressure gas is a completely different beast then a simple aqueous solution.
As a chemist with a bit of common sense i can say that it's a bad idea to heat up a pressurized canister of anything above room temperature. If you do be ready for the potential of an explosion (not saying it will happen, it's just a possibility which increases the more you heat it).
Jesse LeBlanc As a chemist you should know all pressure vessels have a huge safety margin plus pressure relief valves. But a release could be deadly, I would pipe the relief valve to a pail of water for added insurance.
Nice - good use of common items although you seem to have the knowledge, like stainless steel etc., to do this stuff. Very good, I liked the anhydrous ammonia vid.
Could you please tell me ?what or how did you got into this project. This is my first visit and I think you are more curious about our planet than I am. This is to me is top shelf good work thanks for all your hard research.
Very interesting - thanks! 👌
One question remaining: what´s the behavier of the ammonized wood against e.g. acetic acid? Does it become flexible again at room temperature?
rather than sweating over finding a suitable bottle, just make a flask from your schedule 80 pipe pieces. use epoxy as "thread dope" along with the teflon tape if you're worried about seepage. it's hot rolled steel, entirely. schedule 40 will work just fine as well, btw ( i use schedule 40 in 150 psi air systems all the time, as well as for fittings on a sandblaster working at the same pressures, so it would in no way be "right on the edge of failure"). if you can weld, then just dry fit threaded parts and run sealing beads.
ludditeneaderthal kinda becomes critical that u have an air tight weld at that point, no? An episode of Mythbusters comes to mind, where some tanks were welded but did not hold pressure
Ken Oakleaf
it's all a matter of 2 factors, mechanical strength, and "chemically tight enough joints". so, i can have a mechanically strong fit-up that leaks like a sieve (undoped pipe joints), i can have a really chem tight fit-up that will break if you look at it cross-eyed (a filled light bulb). but, look what i suggested above. threaded pipe joints, sealed threads, AND "sealing bead" welds. belt, suspenders, AND sock garters, my friend. now, if we are using operational pressures close to ultimate yield of our pipes and threads, such a scheme is, indeed, "critical". welds weaken surrounding structure in many cases, usually by adding stresses. but, if our working pressure is around 10% of "ultimate yield", it's "more" in a few ways. so, yes, with butt and lap weld joints, "DIY welded pressure vessels" can be kinda grenade-esque, especially if you're not really up to the task of safely testing it. make it welds on already mechanically robust fit-ups, FAR less so, until you court disaster even if perfectly made. doped sched 40 is rated for 150 psi live dry steam, if memory serves correctly. that's 10 atmospheres. it's also VERY hot, at least in comparison to pumping around water, or air, or hydraulic oils. that's why that same sched 40 joint is just fine for 2000 psi hydraulics, though with a different dope on the threads. a 12 gauge "squirrel load" makes about 13k psi, yet is easily contained in a "zip gun" made from 3/4 inch black "iron" pipe and a couple threaded fittings available at any home despot. constant pressures at such levels, of course, would be entirely different, especially when we consider the joints are ONLY mechanical in our "zip gun"(the shell prevents gas in the joints). so, having expanded (sorry for being so verbose, lol), get my point?
Pine contains a resin, which might be why it didn't soften as much as the other woods?
Similar effect you get if let the wood in water steem. May be is needed only heat and water to loose chemical bond in the wood.
Have you tried this process with bamboo?
Could you do this with cloudy ammonia?
Cool vid but you skipped the part where you emptied the vessel of ammonia and extracted the wood. Rather a vital part. Also, what safety gear and precautions did you take beyond the gloves? Intrigueing difference between the pine and hardwood. Would be interesting to figure that one out. Can't remember if walnut and bloodwood are open-celled like red oak or not. That would at least partially explain it. If you tried white oak and red oak I think that would be difinitive as white oak is closed-cell.
Not to be a spoiler, but there was a book of magic tricks I had as a kid and one of the tricks was soaking a US dollar bill in ammonia and ironing it. It shrinks down rather drastically I think. The trick was to get someone in the audience to give you a bigger bill and do some slight of hand to swap it out for the ammonia soaked one before ironing it :)
Could you use a carbon fiber tank for your ammonia? I know that the SCBA tanks have an aluminum liner, but I've got to believe that you can find a tank that is just carbon. Just a thought...cool video. I love your channel; your videos have been useful to me more than once.
nice work, love your great explanations! Most tubers are lacking that
Teflon coatings have been formulated to handle many corrosive substances. You might enjoy looking into it. I read a how to book that used anhydrous ammonia and he had some discussion about Teflon coatings but it has been a few years and I don't remember all the details. The gist of it was to avoid lab glass and use cheaper and more widely available materials.
Also if you end up with water in the pressure vessel anyway why is it critical to use anhydrous ammonia? Is it possible to bump up the 30% solution by chemically drying(lye or lime too maybe) it but keeping enough water to fully dissolve the ammonia? Then you might avoid having to worry about corrosion causing leaks in cylinders. If wood bends adequately with steam alone a partial process may bring the procedure into the reach of mere mortals who are cautious but don't have a fume hood.
On the topic of fume hoods. Are they just vented outside or do they have some filtration? I've got a nature thing going on and smoke and fumes vented to the bird zone won't really work for me anyway.
Main issue with ammonia and copper and copper alloys isn't actual corrosive but stress corrosion cracking... Like what happened to the safety valve.
your "applied science" youtube name is so modest compared to what this channel is actually capable of
So where’s the video with the dollar bill?
you can bend balsa wood just by soaking it in ammonia/window cleaner with ammonia a lot of model builders use this technique