How AM2R and Samus Returns remade Metroid 2
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ก.ย. 2017
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Game Boy classic Metroid 2 has been completely remade by two different teams. So how did AM2R and Samus Return update the gameplay of this retro title, and how did they capture that original game’s tone?
Sources
Nintendo of America Issues Takedown Request on AM2R, Ending the Project | Nintendo Life
www.nintendolife.com/news/2016...
A Maze of Murderscapes: Metroid II | Gamasutra
www.gamasutra.com/blogs/SRHol...
Games shown in this episode (in order of appearance)
Metroid II: Return of Samus (Nintendo, 1991)
Super Metroid (Nintendo, 1994)
Metroid Fusion (Nintendo, 2002)
Metroid: Other M (Team Ninja and Nintendo, 2010)
Metroid (Nintendo, 1986)
AM2R (Milton Guasti, 2016)
Metroid: Samus Returns (MercurySteam and Nintendo, 2017)
Super Mario Land (Nintendo, 1989)
Bayonetta (PlatinumGames, 2009)
Metroid: Zero Mission (Nintendo, 2004)
Far Cry 2 (Ubisoft Montreal, 2008)
Far Cry 3 (Ubisoft Montreal, 2012)
Music used in this episode
Title (AM2R)
Initial Descent (AM2R)
Golden Temple (AM2R)
Hydro Station (AM2R)
Industrial Complex (AM2R)
Forlorn Descent (AM2R)
Flooded Complex (AM2R)
Main Caves (Metroid II)
Birabuto Kingdom (Super Mario Land)
Sub Caves 1 (Metroid II)
Caverns 3 (Metroid: Samus Returns)
Lower Brinstar (Metroid: Samus Returns)
Industrial Complex (AM2R)
The Nest (AM2R)
The Baby Metroid (Metroid II)
The Last Metroid (AM2R)
Baby Metroid (Metroid: Samus Returns)
Initial Descent (AM2R)
Credits (AM2R)
Contribute translated subtitles - amara.org/v/C3BEt/ - เกม
That graphic work you did at 8:15 demonstrating the scope of the world on the GB screen was beautiful man.
Agree. Absolutely gorgeous.
Truely
Glad I'm not the only one who can appreciate awesome video editing.
Not only fantastic editing, but just a great way of demonstrating said scope. Really cool to see it portrayed that way
This reminds me of when I first played Metroid 1 on the Wii I think when I was 5-6. Had to have my dad who is a big Metroid fan like I am now help me draw a map.
You know, I've played through Metroid 2 several times (even back before Super Metroid existed, if you need to know my age), and I never really thought about the fact that the final few areas were devoid of creatures. At first, it gave a sense of foreboding, but it went on so long that I just found it uninteresting. If I thought about it at all, I probably would have assumed that it was just that the game developers ran out of time or something.
It never occurred to me that they were doing some environmental storytelling.
I didn't play Metroid 2 but AM2R and by the end I really thought the lack of enemies was the calm before the storm, implying a bigger boss fight was looming around the corner. To my disappointment, it was only Samu's ship waiting to go back home.
I really enjoyed AM2R, though.
@@patricioart4301 I guess RIdely was for people like you then
@@patricioart4301 samus scans the final boss stating that it's the final boss
The same thing was done in super metriod. In new tourian after you pass the boss elevator you find all these shapes of other lifeforms that fall to dust when you touch them. Literally the only thing alive down there are other metriods and mother brains mechanical equipment.
@@patricioart4301 even the logbook makes you think so. It literally says something like "only the most capable life forms survive in this environment", they make you think this shit is getting serious business.
A major moment that AM2R totally misses is seeing the metroid counter increase when you see the egg for the first time. In AM2R, if you pause the game or look at the total, those larval metroids are actually part of your total count from the beginning. You loose the whole "they're still breeding" effect from the GB game.
yes indeed good catch , a simple yet terrifying mechanic....
You underestimate how dumb I am, completely missing that detail and yelling, "TF YOU MEAN THERE'S EIGHT MORE"
I think they may have fixed that in more recent updates, sorry for the 6 year old reply
@@sansthedarkmodeskeleton8440 they did, I'm currently replaying the game several times and they added a short cutscene where the camera zoom in on the egg and the counter goes up by eight, all that with a creepy music. It's honestly frightening the first time you play
The broken Chozo statue in SR actually appears much earlier in the game than AM2R and RoS. While not as decrepit or destroyed, the chozo statue where you'd get the spider-ball is underneath tons of rubble, and the spider-ball is hidden away under nearby debris.
I don't know how many other people would have figured out what you talk about, but I'm very grateful that you explain these narrative comparisons. I respect Metroid 2 a little more every time.
My shit's meme shit compared to this Wholesome Channel filled with Wholesome Videos.
i personally think metroid 2 nowadays is a 7/10 but metroid 1 is a 4/10
The beautiful thing about subtext is you don't have to grasp it on a concrete level to feel it.
Steeb Good point
I really really enjoyed Samus Returns , although I haven’t played the original I can’t see how Anyone could say much negative about the remake it made me a fan of the series and also mad at myself for not playing a Metroid game long ago
Thinking about the theme of genocide, in AM2R, most of the bosses, as well as many of the tougher enemies, are machines. So a lot of the time you're not fighting the natural fauna of he planet, but the tools left behind by the Chozo. There's also the final boss fight, that becomes both visually and mechanically injured when you fight it.
Are you calling the Queen Metroid in AM2R a machine?
+Gren Games
No, just that the mechanics of the boss fight changes to reflect her injured state.
oh
@@Erika-gn1tv AM2R has a better queen metroid than samus returns on 3ds
@@eriksatlher1Oh definitely, that super bomb scene was glorious.
I thought it was interesting though at the end where he say that "given how remakes go, one version will emerge as the defacto way to play and the original will fade into obscurity" but that honestly hasn't happened.
People really can't decide which remake is better and I think as an art piece the original still stands on its own as a much more effective mode of storytelling.
Honestly really glad that they all still have their place
I would definitely agree. Samus Returns is still a great game in it's own right even if I do favor AM2R. This is one of those instances where it really depends on preference.
Idk, everyone raves about Zero Mission to the point that I think few people even consider playing the original Metroid. But that may just be because the original is somewhat painful to play.
I see it as Metroid 2 if you play for the story, Samus Returns if you play for the gameplay and AM2R as the inbetween
AM2R all the way
@@riflemanm16a2 "Somewhat"? Well maybe I just have a thin skin because I hated it
AM2R is fantastic, if you get a chance, play it
Just rubbing the salt further into the wound here
No
I'm not a dirty thief
@@sebastianguerrero6617 You can't steal a game that was made to be free from a corporation that didn't make it.
@@greendoritoman2464 you can still get it
@@sebastianguerrero6617 how do you even steal something that's free? It's like trying to steal a gift meant for you
Couldn't help but notice you used the word "dread" twice, Mark. I miss new 2D Metroid games too.
;)
Well, well, would you look at that. If we only knew what was in the works.
you got it now.
Hi
@@GMTK This aged well
I never really noticed the things Metroid 2 does to create an atmosphere and subtle storytelling like you mentioned. The descent down into the core of the planet and closer to the Queen's lair having fewer and fewer enemies suggesting that the Metroids have nearly wiped out all other creatures and asserted dominance is pretty chilling indeed.
This made me appreciate the original game more.
69 likes on the comment.
@@dragonsswarm1987 and I was number 96. :P
And I was 141 which is (6+9)×9+6
😱😱😱😱😱
In my opinion, Samus Returns is more of a reboot than it is a remake, while AM2R is more faithful to the original. There’s nothing wrong with straying from the original in a remake, especially if it’s an old game, I thought I’d just want to point that out.
That's why this game is a reimagining. Remakes that take the bare basic concepts of the original, and make a brand new game that gives it a different feeling to it. Like the Resident Evil remakes or Oddworld New N Tasty
i mean thats pretty much the entire goal of a remake, thats why i like how square enix is changing things up with the ff7 remake.
@@pforgottonsoul Thats why I hate that word "remake". One version is the same game with enhanced visuals, the other is a complete re-imagining of the game.
@@neoasura The problem is that the word "remaster" fits the first definition more, yet in popular thought remaster and remake are synonymous (when they really have no right to be).
@@shinigamimiroku3723 I wish the people that made am2r could have made there own metroid style game like the people that did axiom verge. I'm not sure if we will ever get another true 2d metroid like super Metroid as samus returns was not 2d sprite based like Am2r was..plus this is nintendo we are talking about they hate metroid lol
Seeing the baby metroid cutscene in Samus Returns, totally gave me the same feeling you described from the original though.
I had never played Metroid II before this remake, and although I was aware Samus would take a baby metroid with her (from watching the Super Metroid intro), I had no idea she would find him a few minutes before the end and much less that he would follow her around after that. I was caught by surprise by that cutscene and mechanic.
Meeting the baby metroid, seeing him react to Samus and becoming her companion, those things made me reflect if her mission, the genocide of the metroid race, had been justified.
All the fighting after that, I just assumed it was Samus trying to keep the metroid safe, especially the final boss.
But the reason the original didn't have any more enemies to fight is because it's supposed to be a moment of contemplation. We just commited genocide on an entire species. Yes, they are dangerous, but still, the weight of that fact will be heavy. Having enemies there diminishes that feeling of contemplation.
My big takeaway with all this: I'm glad to have three very different ways to experience this chapter, just as I like having two ways to experience the first Metroid.
Now, before anyone starts in with, "But Zero Mission is objectively better from almost every standpoint!", although this may be true in most cases (I say "most" because I can't find any way to reason that blowing up Mother Brain is a worse final battle than blowing up a big robot Ridley had built to look like him), it loses something when taken in context with Super Metroid.
A good example: When you encounter Kraid in the original NES game, he's about the same size as you. Tough, but still pretty tiny in the grand scheme. Years later, in Super Metroid, the game plays with your expectations from Metroid 1 by tossing a tiny Kraid at you. After not requiring all too much elbow grease to get him out of the way, you traverse on a bit, only to find that the real Kraid is a gargantuan motherfucker. This moment has impact because of what it built on. If you only play Zero Mission, however, and then move on to Super after however you've chosen to experience 2, then Kraid was just always huge and there's no reason to expect otherwise, so the itty bitty Kraidling loses something in the buildup department.
Chozodia in general kinda sucks. The suitless section takes too long on replays and it just becomes awkward to naviguate afterwards, like the fusion areas, where having one ultra linear path and then trying to have secrets and shortcuts makes for a confusing world.
The problem with Zero Mission is that it holds your hand way, way too much. It should have just been open ended. The Chozo statue guides just ruin that feeling of emptiness, loneliness.
@@CooperZ2 I'm not a big fan of the Chozo statue guides either, but I think given the changing game design standards of the time, they were probably a compromise that had to be made. At the very least, I do like how they subtly tied into the underlying theme of Samus' history with the Chozo, as opposed to the Adam AI from Fusion, which, even though I generally enjoyed that game too, was a lot more intrusive to the experience and arguably planted the seed for the worst character in the worst game in the franchise.
@@LordQuadros "Not My Metroid: Other Meh", I suppose you're talking about that one.
I never realized just how much of an homage Super Metroid was to the first two games until I played them years later.
The Mother Brain fight in Super was the same, you’re expecting it to be over and all of a sudden she turns into this giant mech thing. Must’ve been a shock at the time to anyone who played the original.
7:01 except if you play on hard mode, where metroids DON'T drop health or ammo, enemy AI becomes much more aggressive, and taking 4 hits often means game over. After every metroid battle, your biggest hope is to make it back to the save station.
If you mean SR...that's not for Hard Mode. I don't know if Fusion is different, I lack the Amiibo, but on *Hard* you still get drops from Metroids. Hard's only difference is double damage to you.
Christopher John was talking directly about AM2R, because that's what was onscreen at the time. In AM2R You take double damage, the AI is a hell of a lot more aggressive in its patterns, and if you do manage to kill a Metroid and you took heavy damage, that heavy damage doesn't washed away by a quick purple spritz of energy orbs. They drop absolutely nothing upon death on Hard Mode on AM2R. So you're left trying to hobble back to a save station while trying not to die because you took a beating fighting a metroid. Not to mention the enemies have more health to get through on Hard Mode. So if you're fighting a Zeta and you run out of missiles because you were unable to hit its core, you're screwed. You have to run back, recharge and try again, and if you just barely kill it with a couple missiles left, you get no reward. No quick refill, nothing. Only progression. That's what he was saying.
@@Metroid22540 There's also the fusion mode in AM2R 1.4, which is twice as hard as Hard mode. It does the same with pickups, only enemies hit twice as hard, and I think tank a little more damage as well. Prob the toughest Metroid experience out there.
@@theseabast6515 such a shame its locked behind an amiibo.
EDIT: I did not know about am2r fusion mode, so when I saw fusion mode I thought he was talking about SR, I should have read more carefully.
that being said im still salty about SR fusion mode being locked behind an amiibo.
@@ahumanbeingfromtheearth1502 he said AM2R, though. Did he mean SR?
When speaking of the Chozo statue, ACTUALLY in Samus Returns you get to see the moment it gets destroyed
Are you talking about the Arachnus boss fight? That's a different Chozo statue.
@@syweb2 i think is from the first apparition of Diggernaut, he drestroy the statue and take the orb, but is not the ice beam if i remember
@@edusilva1305 late, but iirc it's the Power Bombs?
@@Luchux177 that is correct.
As someone who has only played Samus Returns it was pretty interesting to get more of a perspective on the original game.
I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing that AM2R and Samus Returns are both different from Metroid 2. I'm not entirely sure how either game could have captured the feel of the dark, claustrophobic lonliness that the original had because part of it really was because of the Game Boy's limitations. You really can't have a screen with less space anymore or a completely black background. The developers used the Game Boy's limitations to their advantage, and without those limitations, neither remake could ever capture the same tone even if they tried.
I like to think of these remakes as not trying to replace the original, but moreso trying to give a different point of view. A lot of film remakes do this pretty well. Maybe there's enough room for three Metroid 2s. I'm happy that these exist, and I'm happy that there's still reason to play the original.
Yeah! I really dig how each of the games has something to offer. Metroid 2 has the subtle, off-putting atmosphere and silent storytelling (all of the destroyed lab was deeply unsettling); AM2R paints an alternate but arguably the most cohesive world (seeing and travelling within the interconnected Chozo infrastructure throughout your journey was awe-inspiring, and the fast travel system was brilliantly and seamlessly implemented, where SR just plops stations in haphazardly) and expertly references/foreshadows Fusion; SR has its great, challenging metroid encounters and the Chozo memories, which simply couldn't be achieved in the other two games. The high difficulty curve was also refreshing, since checkpoints were so plentiful that it could be afforded without sacrificing fun.
Seeing as the only lasting plot of the game is "Samus arrives on SR388, Samus kills metroids, Samus leaves with baby metroid" with no other qualifiers, I think all three games have legitimacy. Aside from a discrepancy in the motivations of the Chozo and the 11th memory potential plot point, the best of each title can be applied without detracting from the other two. It's almost like three different tellings of the legend of Samus on her mission to wipe out the metroids, with the truth being somewhere between them but ultimately only known to her (if you feel like being fanciful, anyways).
Thank you. I'm so tired of all the M2 vs AM2R vs SR divisiveness.
I think it really would have hindered the remakes if they had tried to capture the same tone as M2. To be honest, I haven't played the original or AM2R, but in SR, I felt like I was going deeper and deeper into some vast unexplored cave system that no sentient life had touched for many years. From what Mark said, M2 went for something very different, and I don't think either take is bad. They're just different and it's a mystery of what the player, personally, prefers.
"You really can't have a screen with less space anymore or a completely black background." Why not? Yes, screens have higher resolution now, but the perspective can just be closer in with larger sprites/models. And why on earth couldn't a background be completely black? Negative space is an eternally valuable element of art.
I recently saw a film made only two years ago in a 4:3 aspect ratio, and the restricted frame contributed a claustrophobic feeling that suited the psychological story. I watched it on my big 16:9 television, and I hardly noticed that it didn't occupy the full screen; yet it did certainly affect me. I'm saying: Don't place unnecessary restrictions on art.
This is literally the best comment in this comment section.
Samus Returns, I think, takes a different tack to showing the Metorids consuming other life - One that I could see being argued as less effective emotionally, but one that I think also communicates how much they upset this ecosystem's food web - Every room where a metroid is is devoid of life... Until you defeat the metroid present, at which point when the enemies would reload into it due to going more than a couple of screens away they're now teaming with life.
On the horror aspect - I agree that Samus Returns is less effective, weirdly with the exception of how it builds up the mining robot which, while not SA-X levels of tension, is quite, quite, delicious with a forboding "What the hell did I just do?" when you wake it up with the grapple beam, having to outrun its mining operation in the mid game, and then fighting it as a boss fight - one that, for me, is up there with the Nightmare bossfight in Fusion, I'd be hard pressed to pick which of those two fights I like more. (The broken Chozo statue is moved, incidentally - There's a broken chozo statue that the Mining robot has totalled, you get the item from it I think after escaping it's mining operation that completely restructures part of the map.)
Oh damn, I didn't think about the broken Chozo statue in relation to the Diggernaut! Nice catch.
There are two broken Chozo statues in SM. One in the first half, hald buried and with no item. I totally agree with you in the Metroid being pretators and I really apprecciate how SM makes you feel like being on an abandoned planet where there was something very well hidden going on. The more you decent, the more technological ot gets.
You make a very moving case for the mining robot fight. It seems like Nintendo still *can* make engaging events with a rich, valent atmosphere in their games, but only when inserting some new arrival into a game and not by developing the ones we actually love and want to see.
I would bet my bottom dollar that in an alternative timeline where the mining robot was in the very first Metroid 2, AM2R would have developed upon it to great appraisal while SR would've given it a cursory nod and only done a good job through another, un-needed addition.
Gizensha Fox There was also this annoying part where the Metroids would escape through these strange walls. Which I think was very effective to get the player on the same level as Samus, who was probably thinking that she just wants to kill these guys already...
These relatively easy and annoying parts also made the sudden encounter of the stronger Metroids scarier I think...
(I still don't know if I really like that they did that...)
What people need to realize about Samus Returns, is that it can't just be a remake, it needs to adapt itself to modern Metroid lore, which is why a lot of the horror aspects were taken out. When Return of Samus originally released on the Gameboy, Metroids were a natural part of SR388's ecosystem, but now the story has changed so that they're an invasive species created by the Chozo to combat the X-Parasite, which makes the themes and tone of the original somewhat obsolete.
7:38 Interesting word choice now that Metroid Dread was announced
Skip to 11:00 for something that sounds like the robots in the Metroid dread trailer.
@@SubtlyStupid Woah, thats crazy?!?!
Was looking to see if this was said yet
I'm pretty sure Metroid Dread developers where watching videos like this and from video game animation studio when making the game.
@@steampunkastronaut7081 Dread was ment to come out on the DS, so no
This genuinely made me want to play the original Metroid II.
So, did you?
@@DeadweightLKS I don't have a copy, and if I were to emulate it, I'd have to do it on PC since touchscreen buttons are literal hell, and I just haven't talked to my computer nerd friends about which gameboy emulator is best.
Plus I'm playing Super Metroid right now on my new switch lite, on top of dabbling in stuff on the N64 emulator, so like... I'll get to it when I get to it.
@@aerynboyer Good luck man! Hope you enjoy Super! :)
@@DeadweightLKS I have been, actually. Though Phantoon is currently kicking my ass.
@@aerynboyer don't know if you ever got past Phantoon, but don't use super missiles against it, it goes crazy with attacks that are difficult to avoid
I don't think you were really giving Samus Returns' backgrounds a fair shake, Mark! Area 1 shows a Prime-like Chozo ruin, sure, but the progression of backgrounds certainly tells a story.
Area 2: An older and crumbling, larger ruin, partially flooded with water, implying a settlement abandoned during retreat to the surface.
Area 3: The upper sections show a depleted brown-rock mine with neglected machinery, and the lower sections are filled with tree roots, showing how nutrients get to SR388's flourishing underground ecosystem.
Area 4: Quartz-crystal mine, with magnificent glowing formations. When Area 3 was mined clean, they found a deeper, fuller vein.
Area 5: Completely overtaken by the native flora, which helps illustrate the resilience of nature on the planet. The Chozo ruins are almost unrecognizable under the thick coating of barnacles and moss, and the backgrounds are a lush tangle of flowering vines.
Area 6: The backgrounds are barren caves, with massive rib cages visible. The first Omega room here has the telltale Aliens-like organic formations in the background, implying abandoned Metroid nests and the previous damage they wrought.
Area 7: With its harsh metal walls and robotic sentries, this was clearly the Chozo lab where the Metroids were first created! The crux of the entire journey, highlighted when you eliminate the rest of the remaining Metroids save the Queen.
Area 8: The Queen's nest, flush with green organic formations, full of new Metroids, the final frantic rush as Samus realizes just how deep inside the planet she is, as the threat multiplies around her.
@Ywe 88 Nah.
@@zerosuitfan91 the graphics and character models are generally subpar and give the impression of a budget title tbh. Sprite art often succeeds in being better looking.
@@ultraspinalki11 That's just, like, your opinion man. Also, it's on a handheld console with the power of an anemic N64.
@@The5lacker other obvious signs of this being a budget title is the fact that the remake is missing nearly half of the original game's enemies, which is why the remake reuses the same enemies over and over in different colors.
@@The5lacker Power Anemic N64? Did you see any game on N64 come close a Resident Evil Revelations?
This was truly fantastic, both in the editing and the analysis. Great job!
you need to learn to listen very very fast
Odin J Indeed
AM2R was definitely a horror game. I hadn’t been as tense waiting for the next boss fight playing a game before or since.
Thank you!
@@TheNosScarFace Why are you thanking them?
@@steampunkastronaut7081 for telling the truth.
Really nice and everything the jumpscare surprise, but it makes more artificial the story (the metroids) and some changes. Thankful it's a fangame so this stuff really does not affect the whole thing officially
When I hear about your points about how AM2R has more Chozo established structure than Samus Returns, how it has more of a story to tell. Though I would have to say Samus Returns being more barren is pretty much well explained through the Chozo Memories. Showing that the Chozos really can’t continue development into the planet compare to what AM2R had imagined.
Yeah this guy is definitely biased against SR and was not fair at all in his judgment.
I love all 3 versions of the game, it's impossible to me to recommend one over the other when they're so different but, at least this video, made it sound like SR is a blasphemy. SR did a lot of good things and most of them were either not mentioned or mentioned and then mentioned why it's somehow bad.
The broken Chozo Statue is in _Samus Returns_ somewhere. I don't remember where, but it is.
Supertron I think you actually watch it get broken by the Mining Robot.
I believe it's before your first encounter with the giant mining robot. I let my brother borrow the game so I can't double check.
Where you get the Spider-Ball
Yeah the mining golem thing seems to have shattered it and sucked up the space jump in Metroid 3DS, if I recall correctly.
It sucks up the Power Bombs, which is actually quite similar to Zero Mission how you get teased with getting those but someone else makes off with them.
Based on interviews with Yoshio Sakamoto on the original Metroid, Gunpei Yokoi thought that designers weren't allowed to know about the limitations of the hardware because they would limit themselves when designing a game. Based on that I question whether the designers of Metroid 2 actually aimed for the kind of atmosphere by using the limitations of the Gameboy like you claim.
That means that they did as much as they could then to convey the atmosphere regardless of technical limitations. It's only really a stretch to say even the size of Samus vs how far you can see on a game boy was intended to cause an emotional reaction.
To say that the programmers weren't aware of the limitation of the computers they were programming for is questionable at best. To be Blunt it's insane to think that they didn't know.
Designers are not programmers.
Edit: To expand on that point, the original designers made a lot of movement stuff for the original Metroid that had to be cut when Sakamoto joined the project because it took up too much memory they didn't know about what the Famicom could handle and how much RAM it would take. The Ice beam was apparently implemented because it was a way to create platforms without upping memory requirements (since enemy hitboxes were already present in RAM).
Designers were programmers in that era.
I'm sorry, but no. Miyamoto didn't program Super Mario Bros. Back then, Nintendo (partially?) outsourced programming, F-Zero was one of the first games made fully in-house.
I think it's also notable that samus returns uses the baby Metroid for back tracking, there's a lot of pickups blocked by the crystals in the remake, on one hand it feels weird to make this important plot beat into another lock and key but on the other it lends greater connection because the baby helps the player tie up loose ends and let's them get more attached to it as they go on a final sweep of the planet.
There's actually only 4 collectibles that require the baby Metroid. There are a bunch that have the crystals in some spots, but those serve as a shortcut to the item rather than actually requiring the Metroid.
Larva. Not baby.
It is not a baby. It’s a biological weapon.
Samus calls it a larva in every real Metroid. Stop it. Get some help.
@@zephyr8072 It's not that serious 💀. Get some help.
@@danielthrash One misogynist’s attempt to humiliate and destroy one of the oldest female gaming icons is pretty serious to me.
@@zephyr8072 better to call it Hatchling since larva are the forms used in zero mission. Referring to it as hatchling when talking about it keeps it pretty streamlined no?
So it has a similar problem covered in Extra Credits' video about being "in service to the brand".
Edit: How I interpret this video: Metroid 2 is what happened from Samus' experience in the moment, claustrophobic, dark, dingy, scary, and upsetting where she does not know what to expect behind every corner, Samus Returns is the exaggerated story that the Space military tells people, because they don't want civilians thinking they are cold, heartless, genocidal maniacs who would experiment on anything and everything for the sake of making dangerous bioweapons.
and AM2R, if it were canon, would likely be Samus reminiscing on the event as she thinks about what she's done over the course of her missions.
Tbh I think Samus Returns makes more sense as the "canon" story. It doesn't try to make you uncomfortable about genocide because that's not how Samus feels; to her, the Metroids are just monsters, and she's just doing her job. imo they did kind of butcher the ending of that game by treating the Baby like a power up but the actual cutscene showing her spare its life is very emotionally powerful.
@@BenjaminAnderson21 I disagree; Samus is a Bounty Hunter, not a Soldier. She has a conscience that she isn't prevented from being able to follow due to laws. After all, if it were "just a job to her", as you said, she wouldn't have spared the baby metroid's life. In other words, Samus Returns is only really canon when it comes to what the Galactic Federation is portraying her as. the original is what actually happened.
@@kennyholmes5196 It's factually incorrect that the original was what "actually happened." I'm not arguing that Samus Returns is the canonical interperatation of the story or anything, becuase that's not something that needs to be argued: it's a simple fact. What I'm arguing is that it makes more sense.
I understand that Samus isn't a soldier who just follows orders and I also understand that she has her own moral convictions, but she is still a cold-hearted killer in many cases. She's *certainly* not one to care about the fact that she's committing genocide against a species that would have been harmless if left alone; her own perception is that she's doing the right thing for the greater good (although that obviously turns out to be wrong!) The reason she spared the baby and didn't spare the other metroids is most likely due to the fact that she didn't see it as a threat because of its imprintation on her.
@@BenjaminAnderson21 The Metroids aren't "harmless if left alone", they were bioengineered by the Chozos to be the ultimate weapon, later explained as the only creatures capableof fighting the X Parasites. So they're by no means harmless or part of the ecosystem, they were living creatures made to be weapons. And from her pov, she's fighting a weapon that had already been used by the space pirates on Zebes (the planet where she grew up, no less!) to devastating effects. She's probably not thinking about genocide or the darker side of things, she's freeing the universe of a threat.
Disappointed you talked about how AM2R interpreted its environments from the gb versions but just reduced Samus's Return's versions to "crumbling ruins". I was looking forward to comparisons between them and how some areas were interpreted in a similar fashion but others looked very different.
I found AM2R more utilitarian in their interpretation, the chozo where technological, but they didn't had a modern industrial take on their machinery. It was always kinda like the greeks having both science and art mixed. I mean even in the Diggernaut design it's ornamented with several marks one wouldn't put in modern machinery because it has no use. I will have liked to hear a comparison between how the hive looked. Since AM2R shifts drastically the look when approaching the Queen's lair. While Nintendo makes it more Gigeresque, having the Metroids alter their environment to suit them. There are bugs in AM2R hive but there isn't any life near the waterfalls which can be kind of surreal. Considering there were even live platforms near the laboratory.
Yeah, that confused me a bit. I'm seeing plenty of lava-filled areas, backgrounds that look like large water reservoirs (even if we don't go in too much of one here), the shift to a tech-heavy base in the later areas, but...nope it's all just ruins because he says so. Like huh?
Samus Returns is bright and tacky. The backgrounds are there to complement the 3D function. Otherwise they are just brightly lit and have none of the atmosphere of dark tunnels and decaying stone. Everything's lit up like the planet is totally alive.
The backgrounds in Samus Returns are breathtaking. It feels like one of the only 2D games where the background comes right up to the screen right where you're walking. I really first noticed it in the dam(?) area where you're climbing the thing and notice the grooves in the concrete structure are uniform all the way into the distance.
Bright, yeah, and perhaps lacking in atmosphere and atmospheric variety, but "tacky"? No way, SR is pretty beautiful, and the backgrounds are full of evocative details and animations, some that stand out, some that you will miss the first time you enter a room, but altogether a pleasure to soak in.
I will give credit to Samus Returns in that the cutscene where Samus first encounters the baby Metroid is handled perfectly. Samus' thoughts are conveyed perfectly in complete silence and it's easy to understand without any kind of complicated explanation. You could also see the combat encounters towards the end of the game as a representation towards Samus' desire to protect the Baby Metroid. Though I feel like this could've been conveyed better if the enemies weren't present but the final boss was still there giving you time to silently bond which leads into a desire to protect when faced with unforeseen adversity.
Slight Edit: Upon beating the game the second time I feel that the presence of enemies in the final area actually didn't affect my ability to form an relationship with the Metroid at all. Nor did it distract.me from.thinking back on the adventure and a major part of that is that the enemies in that area are ridiculously weak early game enemies that don't take any effort at all (even on higher difficulties). Since they don't require any effort from the player to overcome, the player is able to let their mind wander while their body is occupied with slight stimuli. It's an experience similar to thinking while you're knitting or ironing your clothes or something. Since it's more of the same you are able to focus on what's difference and that would be the presence of your companion the baby Metroid. With the [Spoiler] fight sealing the deal on your relationship with the Metroid. It was very well executed
Marche800 "I just fought my nemesis, a dangerous space pirate that wants to steal the last metroid in the galaxy. I'll leave it in Ceres Station and depart inmediatly, thus leaving it vulnerable to yet another attack!" Samus in a nutshell.
I don't know, i think Ridley wasn't really necessary in this game. He wasn't in the original game in the first place.
Dimi-Kun I felt like his fight was cool and does help clear up certain inconsistencies between Prime and Super Metroid. For example Ridley is seen using cybernetic enhancements but in the post credit scene you can see that he abandoned them likely due to the damage they suffered while fighting Samus Explaining why he's totally organic by the beginning of super Metroid. Plus we don't know how much time passed between Metroid 2 and Super Metroid. It's possible Samus was under the impression that she managed to shake off Ridley's pursuit or that he'd stopped following her after being defeated on SR388. Either way I think his boss did help establish a genuine relationship with the Baby Metroid although I do think it could've been handled differently.
The baby rushing in to save Samus' life against Ridley is the reason I'm okay with the inclusion of the boss fight. That, and it loosely connects to Meta Ridley, which is nice.
Marche800 I didn't know about that post-credit scene. Thought the only one was that one showing the X-Parasite. My bad.
Nevertheless, there's still something really fishy about that. How would've Ridley known that Samus was in SR388 in the first place? That's a little bit too convenient.
Thinking about it, well, i guess it doesn't matter. Either with or without Ridley, it's still ok; taking the original game as canon, we have this deep ending where Samus has her time to think about what just happened in SR388 while going back to her ship with the baby. Taking the remake as canon, we have this fight were the baby saves Samus for the first time. I guess both of them suit the relationship of Samus and the baby.
I would think considering how utterly paranoid the Space Pirates get making logs about Samus in the Prime games that they'd at LEAST be good at tracking her down by now, if nothing else.
You hit the nail on the head. Metroid II is a unique game and one of my favorites. I remember playing it for the first time at my grandma's house over a weekend. I had just broke my arm so all I could do with my cast was play Gameboy.
I never could express it as well as you did, but the remakes do miss the point of Metroid II. I did thoroughly enjoy AM2R and thought Samus Returns was alright.
I miss the age of dark, lonely, and colorless Metroid
Just finished AM2R today. Thoroughly enjoyable experience.
Metroid 2 was one of the first games I ever played. I remember hours and hours of getting lost and challenged and never being able to progress but still always coming back to it. I got Samus Returns on release day hoping to get a chance to finally beat the game I loved as a kid but could never finish but bounced off of it really quickly. Thanks for helping me understand what I felt was missing from it
same brony lol
There is a thing about how Samus Return handle the baby that I found quit good. During the game, you encounter various crystal that block power-up, you can't destroy them by any mean so you pass the rest of the game wondering how to break those crystals.
When you finally got baby Metroid, just like the original game, the baby can eat those crystal. The game show off by putting crystal right after the baby is with you. So now, you finally know what to do and you come back where the power-up were blocked.
While I won't say it's necessarily great to block items behind wall you can't break until you got near the end of the game. In story, it does build up the relation that Samus have with the baby Metroid and why she care about it (without Samus opening her mouth just to say why she like THE BABY now). Which make the final boss, and the rest of the Metroid storyline for that matter. Make much more sense as to why Samus care so much about the baby Metroid imo.
Of course, this doesn't excuse Other M depiction of Samus "THE BABY" Aran much better. But points there for Super and Fusion.
(Also, christ, how much I writted "baby" in this post?)
Oh shit never noticed that detail before!
I don't mind that the items were blocked off. Seeing the metroid destroy the crystals was a nice woah moment and the few upgrades that are blocked only matter for 100%, since the ones you can get before the metroid are more than enough to turn samus into god.
I was worried WHY they suddenly made those crystals block power-ups when that's supposed to be the end of the game, but I figured there was one last true challenge after trying to get to the ship.
Turns out that was right, and going for all those items makes perfect sense why Samus and the Metroid get so attached in it.
> (Also, christ, how much I writted "baby" in this post?)
I miss when we called it the Hatchling. Other M ruined everything. :(
Thomas Davis - The funny thing about your comment is that Other M's attempt to turn Samus into a "waifu" is specifically one of the biggest issues with the game.
But sure, a game that's completely linear, doesn't let you explore at all, doesn't let you collect new weapons and abilities, constantly interrupts you with long, unskippable cutscenes, lets you cheese nearly every combat encounter by just spinning the d-pad in circles, and overall would be almost completely unrecognizable as a Metroid game if you changed the characters, is a great Metroid game.
"Unecessary additional boss fight"
It finally spells out for people not paying attention that prime is canon and makes supers opening make more sense. If anything its one of the best additions in returns
People are too harsh on returns tbh
Still feels kind of shoehorned in and messes with what little of Metroid 2's tone remains. I'm just tired of them forcing Ridley fights at the end of remakes, and they've only done it twice!
@@syweb2 Well Ridley finally died cannonically on Other M, the X parasite gobbled up everything that was left on Fusion and now Samus absorbed that in the form of the Screw Attack. Don't expect Ridley to come back on Dread, but let's see what happens with it on Prime 4
@@eldoctoroso I predict that some bullshit will bring Ridley back.
@@eldoctoroso Didn't he go kablooie in a phazon dust cloud in Prime 3 too?
Stellar analysis!! The editing was on point too. The part where you had the map and a Gameboy screen hovering over it made me smile ear to ear!
I think the new final boss fight had a couple of story purposes. For one thing, the devs might have wanted to show Samus grow a bit attached to the baby Metroid, with them bonding a bit during the fight. I don't remember any time Samus showed an attachment to the baby Metroid in earlier 2D games. The second aspect is showing Ridley's transition from a cyborg body in the Prime series to his fully organic body at the start of Super Metroid. I also think it's nice to see a story nod to Prime in a 2D entry. The third aspect is reinforcing Samus' characterization prior to Other M with the way she goes after Ridley without any hesitation
WiiMan, you really need to stop insisting opinions are facts.
Talking about the feeling of horror, I think, for me, the one that did it the best was Fusion. Freaking SA-X is really well done, as so the moments were she appears.
The only enemy that can truly challenge Samus is herself; SA-X, or Dark Samus. Ridley is a nuisance, hardly a threat when she's beaten him down so many times.
Emmanuel Gonzalez Caseira fusion is just the best metroidgame
Fast-forward to E3 2021 and the E.M.M.I.'s relentless pursuit of Samus who; unlike Samus' first foray onto SR388 to wipe out the Metroids you're stuck right at the bottom; the LAST place where you want to be when there's murderous bots crawling around relentlessly chasing you that you can't make even a dent in them with your weaponry
@@Antiformed Mother brain nearly killed her bro and so did the omega metroid in fusion
Your dissection of Metroid 2's themes and mechanics reminded me why I feel in love with this series in the first place, which is something that many other Metroid games failed to achieve.
Thank you, I really needed that.
I will like to add that both the remakes interpretations of the Queen Metroid were pitiful to the original vision.
In the original Metroid 2, she fought more like a scared parent, backed into a corner trying to protect it's young. In fact, you could actually escape the original Queen Metroid fight. Both games removed this escape route, and in AM2R, the queen aggressively charged you with intent to kill.
The queen was only fighting to defend her young from you. At that point, in Metroid II: Return of Samus, the Queen was showing way more compassion than you, the player.
in am2r its shown that the queen's scream of rage, beacuse, at the end of the day, you are murdering her children, are the cause of the earthquakes that open new areas up, also it would be weird that a species that's known for being aggresive wouldnt act as aggresive as possible against a murderer intruder
Hmm, that's a really interesting point... It enhances the point that you are the villain here, disrupting the ecosystem of the planet just to, supposedly, protect the galaxy from the evilness of Space Pirates and any others that want to use the Metroids. But they're not the problem. The rest of galaxy is.
@@lepatrick4596 yeah, that's also a good point. The parental instinct is there, mixed with the intrinsic viciousness characteristic of the Metroids.
Hence in Super Metroid Samus becomes a parent herself. Sort of. What I love about the Metroid series is that it started off simple, yet evolved into a story about the ambiguity of morality.
As for Remakes - I loved both of them. Being involved in the subtle Storytelling I still felt the Queen's parental pain. Maybe it was all in my head, but still, the feeling was there nonetheless. I've regarded her aggression as a line of defense.
I would say that AM2R's depiction of the Queen still fits with the interpretation of a scared parent. After all you've spent the entire game murdering her children and have now entered her lair. Why wouldn't she be bearing down on you with the intent to kill you? It's like if you entered the den of a Grizzly bear and killed all the cubs. That momma Grizzly is gonna rip you a new one.
I actually really like Samus Return's ending. It gives you that late-game power trip as you tear through enemies that used to be a problem for you. Plus the fight with Ridley is fun and a nice callback to Prime with him still having his wounds.
Finally, someone gets just what was good about Metorid II. Still one of my favorites.
I’ve actually recently heard what I honestly think is a very good point in defense of Samus Return’s ending. The point is simply that they retconned it. Think about it. In the original Metroid 2, the reason so few enemies existed in the endgame area is because the game wanted to sell the idea that the Metroid were this dangerous alien species that completely killed off any other species it encountered. But years and years later we got a game explaining the Metroid were actually created to combat the X parasites. Now let’s be honest, what are the chances that in Metroid 2 the writers all ready had this idea in mind for a game that wouldn’t come until years and years later? So when Samus Returns was made, they wrote the story with that in mind. Because in the lore, the Chozo intentionally made the Metroid with the careful intent that they WOULDNT destroy the ecosystem of other species because they were eating the X parasites therefore it made sense more monsters would be down there because the Metroid would be leaving them alone
Except the Metroids _don't_ leave them alone. We see this in the beginning of Samus Returns, with a Metroid eating a hornoad, we see it in Zero Mission with the Metroids eating a Space Pirate, and we see it in other games (like Super) where Metroids feed on whatever they come across.
@@syweb2 Even if the Metroids do occasionally eat other species, the fact that they're primarily eating the X parasite could mean that since they're eating those, they might not be eating enough of the others to completely run all of them extinct
@@syweb2 the ending of the game does hints that the Xs arent exactly extinct
@@carso1500 We know this by simple virtue of Fusion happening. I wasn't arguing that the X were extinct.
@@thatweirdgamer9214 They don't "primarily" feed on X, though, they only do it when they encounter them. Metroids are opportunistic predators that feed on whatever, whenever they feel like it - they just happen to be engineered to be able to feed on X, and were directed to do so while being controlled by the Chozo.
I love the quality of the video, plus the verbal description of the older metroid game's makes me value the memory of playing them. So i thank you for reminding me of that found memory.
In regards to your comment about the presence of enemies near the queen's lair in the three games:
It is possible that Samus Returns was going for a "the ecosystem is in balance" type thing. Since SR is made with the benefit of knowing ahead of time what wiping out the Metroid will do, it might make more sense to frame them as part of SR388's complicated and slightly artificial ecosystem rather than frame them as purely parasitic predators.
Erik Gallegos
The problem is the Metriods are supposed to be capable of wiping out an entire ecosystem. This is why they are a dangerous bio weapon.
Just because they can do it doesn't mean they will do it.
Edbot 321
Yes, but wouldn't it common sense to get as far away from the Metroids as possible? Even if the Metroids didn't wipe out all the life near their lair, the life itself would have GTFOed. This type of behavior can also be found in real-world examples.
That's kinda what happens. Rooms with Metroids in them have absolutely no enemies, and when the room is clear of Metroids enemies start appearing.
that doesn't change the fact that metroids are still predators in the ecosystem, and prey doesn't just go live inside the nest of a predator.
Very interesting retrospective. It inspired me to go back and play through the original GB version and I was not disappointed. Thank You Mark!
Your production value just keeps getting better and better, Mark. Excellent work as always!
I am constantly taken aback by the quality of presentation of your videos Mark. The editing and visual presentation is exemplary!
To be fair:
7:20 You can still get almost killed by each metroid fight in Samus Returns, and the health you get back from them is not enough to survive many hits if you didn't manage your health well, which makes the return to/search of the save station more tense since you can die in a few hits.
8:44 While it's true the screen doesn't feel crunched anymore, enemies in Samus Returns attack on sight when they appear on screen, which makes it a little aprehensive, since any enemy can attack you at any moment. This is somewhat canceled by the counter move you've got, but at the same time you have to master it since it's not a "press to win" kind of action.
12:46 Definitely not at the end, but there are some that have been destroyed, although not by metroids but by the Diggernaut. It's an odd change, really. I've seen some games that try to give you a mysterious boss character ever since... Nightmare from Fusion? Maybe they wanted something similar.
14:47 Because Samus Returns was not only intended as a Metroid II remake, but as the triumphal return of a beloved Nintendo character well known for her badassery and bravado. After the Japanese developers tried to make her more appealing to their own demographic by turning Samus into fap material in Other M, and destroying what image we all had of her as a powerful hunter, this game needed to rebuild that status by going to the other (maybe extreme) opposite side of that spectrum.
While, indeed, the first few hours feel disempowering, just like most other Metroid games, by the end of your journey you feel incredibly overpowered, which is good, because you're motherfuckin' Samus Aran, and that's what these eastern developers probably wanted you to feel.
15:12 Not entirely unnecesary. Again, by the end of your journey you feel overpowered, and the Queen metroid is not that much of a challenge. That final boss fight is memorable in a way that it's surprising, unexpected, and much more difficult, at least in my opinion. It gives you a true challenge and now you can try all the flashy moves you got. When you end you feel much more accomplished and you see why Samus is seen as such a badass by fans.
Overall, while Metroid II is, to an extent, a horror game, Samus Returns feels different because it needed to feel different. Not only does it provides a much more "metroidy" experience, it also serves as an apology letter for what shortcomings happened with the franchise a few years back, which is honestly very welcomed.
At this moment it's kind of difficult to make a scary Metroid anymore, since if we take power out of the main character we also diminish the reason why it's beloved in the first place. Still, I kind of wish they coul have come with something to, indeed, increase the dread, ala Alien Isolation maybe.
I think that a remake of Metroid Fusion would still succeed in giving us the experience we want while also being a horror game. You're always working to become stronger, and you see that as you progress, but the SA-X is a good reminder that you are not strong enough yet, and that you will die like nothing if you get in its way.
Justin Alicea I hope that if we do get a Fusion remake it’ll be Mercury Steam developing it. They wanted to do Fusion but Nintendo was like, “nah, how about Metroid 2?”
"And Metroids drop a lot of goodies upon death."
That is... Unless you play on hard.
It was tough. But i did it.
The editing was fantastic, thanks for the video.
Wow, this was very interesting. I haven't seen most of these points discussed about Samus Returns. Well done as always, Mark!
The flashy cutscenes that play when you melee counter something showed that Samus was becoming more skilled as the game goes on. You go from just shooting more missiles at alphas, to jumping onto gammas, then to holding your own against zetas while still shooting at it, and finally the ninja flip on to the omegas.
I also feel like you gave Samus Retuns’ background and soundtrack less credit than they deserve. The background showed more species like the red and purple crocomire thing it area 2, tiny diggernaut robots still at work in area 3 and another one in area 6 I think(don’t remember what it looked like, only remember staring at if for a couple minutes in awe). I found that if you payed attention, you could sometimes see alpha metroids flying around and zetas camouflaged in the background. Oh yeah, you also visit the very lab the metroids were created in. Kinda an important detail.
As for the soundtrack, you can still hear some of the beeps and boops from the chozo temple in the original in area 3’s theme. Also, AM2R remixed a few super metroid tracks and you didn’t say anything about that.
And on the topic of AM2R, Mark mentions that AM2R is more interested in telling a story about the chozo. For one, this is a fan game and any new lore this game introduces should be taken with a grain of salt at most and also, SAMUS RETURNS DID THIS TOO! There is a freaking gallery that tells the entire story of SR388’s chozo and drops a massive bomb shell once you 100% the game(granted I don’t think mark has seen it yet due to the pitifully low percentage counters seen on the map screen). There is just a very obvious lack of respect for Samus Returns throughout the video.
The one thing I'd call simply humorous BS on is the...final fight at the end. There's not a single 2D game where the normal Beam weapons hurt bosses, then suddenly in one mid-fight scene she's...shooting her *UNCHARGED* Beam at the boss and it actually hurts it when I was only using Super Missiles.
Seeing that the Beam actually WORKS and can fire it way more rapidly, I just plain unleashed the beam on that poor sunnava gun and to my shock, your Beam actually DOES work on that single boss.
UltimaKeyMaster I kinda just started shooting at him. I thought “It worked on Omegas, why not Ridley.” I mostly used charge beam and supers tho.
UltimaKeyMaster You expected that only Super Missiles would works and you would be left helpless once out of ammo ? Even though the game make sure you can still kill the different Metroid types with Ice beam as a last resort option ?
Wait, Ridley takes damage from Missiles? I thought he could _only_ be harmed with the beam.
Also, Ridley takes damage from normal beam attacks in the beginning of Super, so maybe it's a callback?
Another New Player Ridley can’t be damaged with normal missiles. Only supers
Having never played Metroid 2, I really enjoyed Samus Returns. I had the benefit of letting it be its own beast and not holding it to any standard. But I think the video nails it at the end, that the remakes are about form, not experience. Mercury Steam wasnt intent on recreating Metroid 2's experience, but rather updating the mechanics and creating a new experience.
Thanks for this video! I think it's one of your best. The deep analysis was worth wait :)
Finished watching the video. AMAZING and INSIGHTFUL commentary!!! Thank you so much for making this video.
I think the inclusion of the NEW final boss fight in SR may make you feel it was tacked on, but stranely enough I think it fit really well all things considered. It solidified metroid prime games as canon, and helped bridge the gap between metroid 2 and super metroid. Also: I like how the music changes from hopeful to foreboding as you make your way back to the ship. That darkness that SR lacked comes back into fruition upon returning to the surface.
Personally, I find Ridley's inclusion in SR to just be fanservice. He doesn't contribute anything, actually creates a plot hole, and actively makes Samus look like a dumbass. Let's address those last two
Said plot hole stems from a line Samus says in Metroid Fusion, forgive me for paraphrasing, but it essentially goes "I owe the hatchling my life twice over". Not thrice, *twice*. What does this final fight have in one of the cutscenes? The Metroid saving Samus from almost dying, which would be the first in the timeline it has done so, but the third overall.
As for how it makes our protagonist look stupid, Samus *just* fought Ridley and *assumes* he's actually dead. She delivers the Metroid to the scientists on Cerris and leaves, just thinking it'll be safe, when we all know how tenacious Ridley is, cuz he wouldn't just die like that. Not to mention, how did he heal and shed his cybernetics *that* quickly? Wouldn't he need a good amount of time to recover from that sort of beating?
The Prime games have always been canon dude, that Sakamoto interview was mistranslated.
nobody ever questioned that the prime games were canon, their status as being so didn't need solidifying
It also helped the player feel the attachment Samus develops to it, in how it actually contributes to the battle whereas it was originally just eating roadblocks.
Plus, it was a fun and satisfying fight, which it needed with how unsatisfying the Queen Metroid felt. It even subverted the boss mechanics up to that point, with the way they're only damaged by missiles being erased via making missiles useless and making you use your beam proper.
If the ending wasn't full of enemies, if the environment didn't turn dark and gloomy after exiting the cave, and if Ridley's intro was more of a surprise it could have been a good moment.
Great Job! As someone who's been playing Metroid II since it's release, I'm happy to hear this analysis from someone who actually appreciates the game for what it is, instead of throwing it under the bus like most critics.
I totaly agree about the ending, damn you realy layed my thoughts open in there!
I cannot underestimate how much I appreciate you and all the content you make
I think you're selling Samus Returns a bit short. Contrary to what you're claiming in the video Samus Returns is very interested in telling the story of the Chozo - it's just hidden behind the Chozo memories that open up the more you collect items instead of being something you can figure out from the environments (or by reading the scan visor lore dump). I'm not arguing it's a better way to tell background story, I'm just saying there is just as much or even more Chozo lore in Samus Returns than there was in AM2R. The memories even make sense of the poison gates!
Once I figured out what was going on in the last memories I got incredibly excited about the story potential it has for future Metroid games, which is a feeling I haven't felt in a long, long time. That, and the fact that Samus Returns is the first main line Metroid game to acknowledge the Prime series even exists makes it worth straying from Metroid II's ending in my books. Yes, I would''ve liked the solemn climb through the Metroid nest instead of a laboratory full of killer robots, but I'm really happy with what we got.
My opinion is that Samus Returns is foreshadowing a future battle between Samus and a militant, xenophobic Chozo Warrior who will be very much UNLIKE her adoptive grandparents Old Bird and Grey Voice. The battle might even be staged like a ritualized duel between opposing Chozo Warriors, with one stage in powersuits and another in nothing but their Zero Suits.
@@gigaslave Or, if the Chozo really have been wiped out, someone who studied the Chozo ruins getting a similar "annihilate the outsider" sort of xenophobia.
Combine that with Prime 3's 100% ending indicating that Dark Samus still has a few Phazon pods to come back with the same way she did at the start of that game, and there might be an interesting dual threat to look forward to in a future Metroid game.
I'd also like to see something set after Fusion, using Samus's Metroid powers in some way (because, thanks to the Federation, she is part energy vampire jellyfish now), because that just sounds like an incredibly fun game mechanic to work with.
@@elijahpadilla5083 The design idea I had for a post-Fusion progression for Samus's suit is to have it undergo a metamorphosis similar to SR-388 Metroids, giving her some of the powers associated with each form as it grows and adding rigid carapace for natural armor. (Alpha improves her control of her spacejumps and walljumps, Gamma gives her improved protection against electricity, Zeta beefs up her Power Grip abilities and gives her purchase on slippery walls, Omega hardens her "claws" and strengthens her melee attack/counter, and Queen//Royal restores her Hyper Mode functionality)
@@gigaslave That honestly sounds really interesting. A Fusion Suit that evolves through a Metroid's life cycle, maybe in a more exploration-heavy title that lets you challenge bosses in a more flexible order. That way, you can choose to take your Gamma electricity resistance into a fight with a boss whose primary method of attack is lightning, and save your Zeta "claw" upgrade for a more melee-centric boss fight (or to backhand projectiles back at a boss that puts you through a bullet hell). However, given how Omegas are pictured as having incredible jump height in both Samus Returns and the final fight in Fusion, I'm of the opinion that they'd be the jump upgrade, with Alphas providing a base-level defensive upgrade, to allow exploration in areas under lava or acid.
Also, the ice weakness could be exploited by our hypothetical antagonist, especially if they're a Federation defector who knows that Samus is now infused with Metroid genetics.
@@elijahpadilla5083 My concept had her getting rudimentary carapace as soon as Alpha stage and the carapace grows and becomes stronger as her suit continues metamorphosis in general. It also gives her an organic armor look with her classic colours, only as she hits Omega and Queen stage her armor will also be studded with "Metroid nuclei" that serve as capacitors for her Hyper Mode.
That final final boss was nice.
*spoilers*
Every boss required ice beams and missiles but that last one made use of your standard beam and missiles (were you able to use missiles?), it strengthened the bond with the metroid a bit, it was more fun imo than other bosses because it forced constant movement and you had to master aiming and moving simultaneously. The final Metroid-formed boss forced you into a cramped room with annoying patterns, but the only cramped thing with Ridley was Ridley himself getting too close (but after you realize that you have control of his movement you can use that to your advantage). It also showed how Ridley wanted to take it (and then again in supermetroid), but this wasn't that important since super metroid demonstrated that. It may have been pointless to the story, but I thought it was important for gameplay. That's my two cents.
its an amazingly designed boss even if its not faithful
it also makes samus's choice of returning to zebes even more personal than just "shit i gotta stop them from using the metroid as a weapon!" instead she thinks (GODDAMN IT WHY DID I LEAVE YOU ALONE?!?! THIS NEVER WOULD HAVE HAPPENED IF I WAS THERE TO PROTECT YOU!!!) yeah :P
Missiles don't work, but Super Missiles do, learned that the tough way...
Utterly fantastic video. Great work on it!
Really enjoyed this video Mark, thanks a lot. Was hoping you'd say "see you next mission" though.
People that has played the original Metroid II
(and loved it, we're a strange bunch) certainly gave AM2R a chance.
I'd urge the other gamers to do the same after finishing Samus Returns
(if they haven't already): Pure Metroid love, in one hell of an accomplished
form way beyond the regular Metroid hack.
For this, Milton Guasti and the team he assembled deserve a huge "thank you".
Loads of respect Mark; great video.
AMR2 is pure pixel art
so well written, so interesting every single time ! Amazing work !
I really liked your review and analysis of all three games! Thank you! Very well done sir!
That video was one of your best ones, Mark. Really got me thinking.
Sometimes, when I'm designing a game, I put in front of my brain that the only thing the game need is to be fun and I shouldn't worry about the rest because I'm a one-man-team. But this kind of perception and analysis on a game make me look deeper in the stuff I'm trying to create. I'm really thankful for that.
It's important to never lose track of what's important.
I watch GDC talks weekly and see other channels like this.
The thing is that I lost track of this kind of stuff when I started making because of stress, little time and no team. Sometimes with a team is even worse.
Thanks! I'll definitely look into!
7PLAYS Im working as a design intern in uk, leme kno if u want chat about design or testing/feedback on ur projects. Chin up, mate.
D T Thank you for the support! Right now I'm working on personal and with no actual ambition projects, but I'll let you know if I start something big and need some serious advice/chat.
Right now you can check the demo of a project I'm working on (portuguese only right now, but the version in my computer already has english language option available):
se77e.itch.io/the-alpha-chosen
And my latest jam game that I'm actually kinda proud and maybe I'll go back into it in the future (curiously enough, this game I didn't care as much about "fun"):
umbrateam.itch.io/umbra-exitus
Any feedback is valuable :D
I'm a layman, but it seems to me that a game must be, above else... entertaining (maybe that's the word I'm looking for?) Like, for instance, a movie that makes you laugh is as entertaining as a movie that makes you cry, it just captures your attention in a different way. Like Zelda BoTW and Super Mario Odyssey are very entertaining (to my taste) but they convey different sensations, emotions, thoughts...
AM2R still does a good job with the music when you enter the Metroid nests at the end of an area. Especially the early nests where you keep going deeper and have less and less health and ammo, the fights keep getting harder, and the rooms keep getting more dangerous, the music takes on a more foreboding tone. I will say that I find AM2R to be the overall better game and remake in the comparison between it and SR so I'm somewhat biased.
Really enjoyed this video mate, good stuff!
as a huge metroidvania genre fan, I really give credit to AM2R's learning curve and reward system and I see as a good example of introducing new skills in metroidvania games. They do a nice set up how the frustration you been penting up trying to reach to the new power upis nicely rewarded by easing your previous situations which also teaches its utility. As for veteran metroid fans, it was fun as we start to sense which power up is coming up next as we overcame the obstacles.
Looking back, videos like this are the reason Samus Returns didn't sell amazingly well. Praising AM2R to high hell and not appreciating Returns (specifically at 5:41) despite it having amazing art direction and some of the finest animation of Samus in the entire franchise.
Each zone DOES tell a story, just like AM2R, but you chose to ignore it for some reason.
On the surface, there are gross, slobbering creatures that attack you on site. The Chozo drones fittingly act more in a cycle. Area 1 is more of a domestic sanctuary, the buildings architecture is subdued and there are more Chozo statues here than any other area. Area 2 is a dam next to an underground lake (coincidentally, like AM2R except more traditionally Chozo and less mechanical). This is also where the lava rooms are frequent further proving that this facility was used for energy purposes.
Area 3 is a MINE for unknown crystals. They are obviously valuable, because this is when the drones are much more aggressive and have harder defenses. whereas Area 4 is deeper in the mine, ergo less explored and most of the crystals are still in tact. The Diggernaut is found here, so that further proves that progression of this excavation stopped here.
Area 5 is mostly untouched, almost like a nature preserve. 90% of the enemies in this area are NOT drones, because the Diggernaut didn't reach this far. Area 6 is a small area, but the background shows skeleton remains of a large beast, likely to anticipate the first Omega Metroid. This is also where the Diggernaut steals the Power Bomb so being this deep in the planet is not something an average lifeform could accomplish.
And now Area 7, literally the most important area in the FRANCHISE. This is the BIRTHPLACE of the Metroid species. The music is a remix of Super Metroid's cutscene melody. You can see that the fans are set to HIGH and there's icicles hanging from all the metal. Notably in the very last room, with the "Hyper" Omega Metroid, you can see a hologram of a planet. This could very well be the planet the one Rogue Chozo (secret ending) escaped to, possibly hinting Metroid DREAD 4 years early!
I will admit, both the original and AM2R handled Area 8 and the ending much better, but this constant shitting on Samus Returns (not really from this video but multiple videos like it, ESPECIALLY in the comments) was so ass-backwards, considering the whole reason AM2R exists is because Nintendo didn't make 2D Metroid. But now that they finally do... the fans don't buy it!?!
@@yourstrulythebxy I am glad that MercurySteam's efforts were clearly noticed for them to revitalize a long lost sequel. Not to mention be FEATURED at #E3, as opposed to Samus Returns which was just shown at the treehouse.
I think it’s more because it came out late in the lifespan, but yeah you’re right. People constantly shit on samus returns just for being 2.5D, it’s really annoying. Like yeah I prefer sprites too, but the game looks REALLY good. Tbh the only criticisms constantly thrown at the game I agree with are that the ending isn’t great and that it could’ve used more enemy variety.
Having just finished playing Samus Returns, I've been looking for videos like this. This was a thoughtful analysis of all three games. I played the original when it first came out and was always disappointed that it wasn't more like the original game. However, I did beat it and it was a proud moment.
I played AM2R the day it came out (thankfully got my copy before they pulled it). I didn't even hear about it until like, a week before its release. Wow. What a fantastic, loving project. I was enamoured by how much love went into it. It was a lot of fun, and familiar as both Metroid 2 and as an update with modern Metroid elements. I appreciated the extra areas and items they put into the game. The Omega fights were terrifying. I had to take a break after all of them.
Samus Returns was a delight. It was officially a Nintendo product, so I was hoping it would be good. Many aspects of the game were fantastic. I could have done without the melee counter, though. Giving me the 360 aiming was amazing. The aeion powers were...interesting. Three of them were needed at various points in the game, but the one I used the most was the radar. It completely removed the exploration aspect of the game, but made getting 100% a lot easier.
If I had to choose one of the two to show to someone as the "definitive" version of the game, it would be AM2R. While the original is dark and isolating, and all of the other good points you brought up, I think AM2R flows better not only as a game, but with the franchise. I'll always have fondness for the original, but if I were introducing someone to the series for the first time, I'd have them play AM2R instead.
With you on having someone new to the series play AM2R. It really does flow better, coming after Zero Mission and leading into Super. I still think Samus Returns would be good to play after said someone is more accustomed to the series. It brings a lot new to the table, and I'm excited to see how Dread expands on it.
Excellent video! Unbiased and informative with a solid review mixed in.
This is an outstanding video. Great work. Subbed!
On thing I really liked about AM2R was the extra attention to the game's background including actually finding the research team and Federation squad in the game instead of them only being info in the manual. I also always liked a good shinespark puzzle or two.
But what really sells it to me was how plain FUN it was. The extra area with an optional boss was a blast to find and fight.
The lore tie-in with Fusion was amazing. Everything on the station was wildlife from SR388 and in AM2R you actually fight a lot of said wildlife (even two of them as bosses) but with slightly different mechanics so as to not be copy past.
Those are some of the things that I found AM2R did incredibly well. It kept the changes to the areas' layout to a minimum, but built off a lot from there, and added in what was missing! It's like we, as kids, try to interpret what the areas we go through in the game actually are, and we make these connections in our minds and think of some cool stories for the places, all within the confines of the game we play. I always find that approach very fun!
Like, imagine the hideouts from Metroid 1. What kind of location was Kraid's hideout? A temple? A power generator gone into disarray? What about Ridley's hideout? Since it's so deep into the lava, maybe it used to be a forge/armory, using the heat to develop new weapons for the Chozo? There are so many approaches to what these areas, in-universe, were meant to be, and it lets out imagination run wild!
I'm so glad you understand Metroid 2. It's mine and my brother-in-law's favorite gameboy game. We grew up with it.
AM2R I think still nails the dark foreboding atmosphere. I notice the Genetics Lab is in black and white at some areas and has perhaps the most chilling music. There's also the area with the 3 Omega Metroids and the dark area with all of those Gamma Metroids. AM2R knew how to include claustrophobic graphics.
Wow, this was great. You really hit it out of the park.
16:33 I like how you worked the word "dread" into your script, since that's been the long-rumored name for the next 2D entry in the series.
I don't find the melee counter sequences in Metroid fights goofy - quite the opposite. Samus Returns feels a lot like Doom 2016 - Samus is the destroyer of Metroids, much like the Marine is the destroyer of demons. The acid seems to seal the Metroids on the planet but it also protects them from Samus. The Metroids will screech out if the Aeon pulse reaches them and some even run from her in self protection. I feel Nintendo captured the violence Samus brings pretty well.
Samus did feel pretty unmerciful in this game. The grapple maneuvers and especially that death blow to the diggernaut.
To be fair, that robot gives Samus and players a LOT of shit, so that death blow was fucking hilarious.
Yeah, seriously, fuck the Diggernaut. Gameplay-wise that thing was a nuisance and atmosphere-wise it was terrifying, so it should feel satisfying when you finally kill it.
How do you figure that those QTE actions were showcasing her violence? They just looked like over the top flamboyant action moves. They were more comical than anything. People mentioning the final shot against the Diggernaut too; Samus just listlessly raises one arm and shoots at it without turning to face it. That doesn't say "showcasing the violence of a bounty hunter exterminating an entire species", it says "old men in suits try really hard to make character look cool, fail badly".
Do you know the whole point that we're talking about is the satire against violence in the original game? Samus does something questionable by exterminating a species that was quitely living on their own, and the narrative + the ending reveals that quite strongly enough.
You may call Samus Returns a Doom 2016 of sorts. But it's not the exact same game compared to the original's goals. That's the whole point of the video, not bringing out what is already known.
It would be okay if this remake would aim for such purpose. But no, instead they would say that Metroid 2 apparent 'limitations' weren't in purpose, and call it bullshittery just because. I'm *not* okay with that bannalistic, superficial perspective, it denies deeper and artistic insight in one being less creative in exchange.
I don't care how Samus Returns has been made for, I care about acknowledgment and honesty for one's sake in relation of clever purposes and goals. Metroid 2 is an atmospheric game. Samus Returns is basically just ... well, another streamlined Metroid action game, I guess.
Awesome video and super interesting, thanks a lot!!!
This was one of the first games I ever got when I was about 5 years old. I completely forgot I even played it until I began remembering some of the sections in the game as I watched your video. It's really weird to get a feeling of nostalgia in a game you thought you've never played only to begin remembering certain parts.
Samus Returns also has interesting back grounds. Also the Chozo Memories add lore to Metroid 2
how good can that lore be when the game is willing to shit all over the lore by adding ridley?
It makes no sense for Ridley to be there.
Antiform it makes sense. It explains why and how Ridley knows about the baby. Why he was at the space station in Super Metroid.
Ridley was going to SR 388 to get a metroid to use as experiment, but samus was there first and since you can beat this game in less than 2 hours while speedrunning also gives time to the space pirates track down the planet location since they have intel with the federation. Ridley was not waiting for samus to get back to the ship, he was just late he saw that samus spared one metroid and tried to kidnap. This game also bridges the prime games lore by making ridley regaining his flesh form.
How the hell would ridley know that samus would spare a metroid, thats why he rushes to the planet a soon he gets the location.
WiiManElite Shut the hell up
great video but I'm kinda disappointed you didn't talk more about the backgrounds as I think it's actually one of the things that SR does extremely well. Samus follows the journey the Chozo took when they arrived on the planet: there's the main tunnel they dug, the several buildings they constructed for using the planet's resources, the crystaline wall they dug through under which there's this whole underground nature world. Then towards the end of the game, Samus explores the wrecked research lab followed by the Metroid Hive with the queen before returning to the surface
I agree that they didn't nail the horror elements of the game but it's a different take on the story overall. You can basically look at Samus as a the chosen one to fix the Chozo's mistakes what with the DNA gates and the Aieon abilities seemingly having been designed for her mission. This is Nintendo playing it safe with the story, which is understandable considering where Metroid currently is as a franchise, but I'd still say they put genuine effort into making the game interesting and coherent.
Wow, fantastic video! I had the same reaction to Samus Returns. I'm an AM2R fan but you've given me new perspective on the original.
Another fine addition to my collection!
I can defend the acid thing. The chozo made the metroids, so they could use them to gate stuff off. However, I don't think you will learn that in the game itself.
+RobertStyx not the Prima guide but in game on the save file, depending on your item collection percentage a series of "Chozo Memories" will unlock. It helps clarify what the Chozo did on the planet and even teases the next 2d Metroid which is exciting. It doesnt use much in terms of words though so the guide probably explains it more in detail but with the pictures you could definitely figure it out on your own.
Thomas Davis
Why not just create a machine to kill all metriods? Could be also blocked them off with weapons. Who were they expectimg to kill all of them so many years ago?
Metroids are super effective at killing the x parasite, a much more dangerous enemy to everything in the galaxy. They're pretty much a failsave preventing the parasite from destroying everything. In future games, the X parasite becomes the main villain.
Thomas Davis I'm not lying though? I interpreted the fact that the Metroids were trapped in the goo because that's what was surrounding the Metroids. Also the only metroid to move from different areas was the baby Metroid which shows that they can in fact move from area to area just not through the goo. In fact that guide describes the goo wrongly as its not a stasis solution at all. You can see the native life (the Chute Leech) go in and out of the goo without freezing it. The Chozo did lock the Metroid deep in the planets caverns thats correct. You said so yourself the Chozo Memory shows it happening. I figured it out solely through the pictures minus the stasis part because it simply isnt true (at least for all wildlife its PROBABLY true that the Metroids cant move).
@Thomas Davis. 2 years, no Fusion nor Prime 4 yet
I would say samus returns is more of a reimagination than a remake.
Really good video. Thanks for sharing.
This was a great video and I feel like I learned something vital to Metroid canon I wasn't aware of.
Great in depth review of the 3 versions, but you totally missed a spot in Samus returns, when the giant guardian robot stalks you until he finally breaks the chozo statue and protects the hability to later on try to destroy on a mind boggling battle, this a big highlight for me, cheers
I'm gonna spoil the true final boss here, so don't click Read More if you don't want to know.
I definitely agree that sticking enemies in the final area before the Metroid nest and after the Queen on the way to the surface was a bad call, for the reasons you talk about. (I kinda wonder if this was a playtesting thing, where people complained that it was boring in that last stretch of the game, so they added enemies.) But I really think it's worth mentioning the ways Metroid 2 actually improves on the ending, especially in its connection to later games.
Specifically, it improves on Samus's - and by extention, the player's - relationship with the baby Metroid. This was always an element of the series that I found odd. In Metroid 2, she decides not to kill the Metroid for reasons that are entirely up to interpretation, then drops it off at Ceres, then sees Ridley take it, and that's her entire interaction with it until the end of Super, where we're suddenly supposed to have an emotional connection to it. That never really landed for me, especially when the entirety of Other M was built on it.
Samus Returns does more with the baby Metroid, though. For a start, there's the cutscene where it hatches. You can see through Samus's body language what she's thinking, and the way it adorably comes to rest on her armcannon made me love the little thing.
But more important is the fact that you get to spend more time with it. Metroid 2 is just a quick jaunt to the surface, then end of game. In Samus Returns, however, you get to explore the world with the baby Metroid by your side. Not only is it adorable, especially when you see it floating next to you in elevators and teleporters, but it'll eat away stuff to let you access pickups. Some are pickups that you could've gotten before if you'd backtracked after you got the right ability or just solved a puzzle, but a handful are completely inaccessible until you have the baby Metroid. And after you beat the game, it can even be seen floating around your cockpit on the file selection screen.
And then you go to the surface and encounter the final boss. Spoilers: It's Ridley! Funny how they made some version of him the surprise true final boss in both remakes. Can't wait to fight Ultra Mega Ridley during the Zebes escape sequence in the Super Metroid remake in 2030! Also holy shit, we're as close to 2030 as 2004.
Anyway, this could very easily have just been shoehorned in, but it's an excellent fight, and it further develops the relationship between Samus and the baby Metroid. We see how protective Samus is of the baby Metroid, practically screaming Mrs. Weasley's, "Not my daughter, you bitch!" through her body language. But we also see the baby Metroid save Samus's life by latching onto Ridley as he's about to deliver the final blow, draining some of his energy, and then transferring it into Samus to give her a second wind. Then on that third phase, it'll sometimes latch onto Ridley, forcing him into an attack that you can counter and get in a cinematic move to deal a ton of damage.
The fact that the baby Metroid's life is now bookended by helping Samus fight one of her arch nemeses makes its death in Super all the more tragic. It completely recontextualizes that game, too. Now it's not just about stopping the Space Pirates. It's personal. Saving the baby Metroid is just as important. And in the end, she's only able to accomplish one of those missions.
Kevin Stevens Well written. I sort of felt the Ridley fight was out of place until reading this, undecided but you’ve now swayed me. But I agree 100% that the fact the baby can follow you around etc. and the redone ending scene where Samus doesn’t kill the baby, becomes essential to Super Metroid.
This deserves more likes. I always felt that disconnect in regards to the baby Metroid until Samus Returns came out. It's just so much more satisfying, not only to play, but to experience the story of this particular chapter in Samus' life.
Damn, I just finished Samus Returns and after reading this comment it had made me more emotional than I did.
9:17 I grew up as the ideal demographic for Metroid 2 (6 years old in 1991) and it was absolutely awesome. Best game on the Gameboy and still my favorite Metroid game of the franchise. It worked within the limits of the handheld for some of the greatest isolation vibe of the any game.
Play it on an original gameboy, with the smeared LCD effects of the screen that makes running blindly into a room next to a metroid shell dangerous. Then the effect of needing a light shined at just the right angle on the screen means if you play at night by flashlight under the covers of your bed when you're supposed to be asleep... The more dark and spooky the real world around you, the more dark and spooky the game got. And the safety of your ship is light years away on the surface of the planet while you delve into more dangerous territory in the heart of the planet.
BTW: AM2R is the best remake I've seen. It should be the defacto replacement for the modern gamer. And I rate it tied for Super Metroid as the best of the series, and even better then Super Metroid in terms of story line.
Dustin B I played it during class. Found it discounted in a store during the SNES era.
A really good way to approach comparing these remakes; tons of great points and it’s not just someone dissing the other remake. I was really intrigued from the sense of horror point in the original game. I always remember that being said about Fusion. The ending point was very truthful as well and makes me reconsider how I think about these games. Thank you for having such a thorough and in-depth comparison of these games.
I think Samus Returns' ending could have actually been better even if they kept the boss fight. If they had kept the quite, the total lack of enemies, and the reflective state the game puts you in, for both new players and fans of the original/AM2R, Ridley's appearance would have been a complete shock.
As it stands the last moments just make you feel like you're fighting your way to the end so therefore a final boss is expected.
8:14 THAT is such a cool graphic. Wow.
awesome review and breakdown analysis , u get it , it gives me a good feeling someone gets the games.
Love this review. There's something about the charm the older games have, that aren't present in the newer remakes. I remember a quote something along the lines of "limitations foster creativity."