Concerning the recurve on the top: Benedetto says that the recurve on the top is purely cosmetic, that the F holes already make the top far more flexible than the recurve could by itself. And that does make sense, with those holes cut in there, it's going to be more flexible just from the missing material. He then goes on to say that the BACK is the place the recurve makes a difference. It matters because without it, the back is too inflexible to help shoot the sound out of the instrument. He taps on the front and feels he vibrations in the back, first at the center and then sliding towards the edge. When you get towards the edge, you can feel that the vibrations drop off. What he says you want to do is to get that recurve area vibrating as much as the center of the back. It's a pretty subtle thing to feel, no question. But he thins the recurve area to where it is vibrating like the center of the back, then he considers it done. Granted, he's building guitars, but I wonder if the same principle applies to mandolins? I'm almost done with my first arch top and I've never finished a mandolin, but I am definitely noticing what he is talking about with the back vibrations. Just something to consider.
I love it when humble person tries to do something the best anybody's ever done it, because they might just pull it off. If an arrogant person says the same, I don't believe a word of it!
I developed incredible debilitating pain in the meaty section of my palm just below my thumb. Pretty much doing the exact kind of work you are doing. I finally went and got carpal tunnel surgery and it gave me my life back.
I'm sorry to hear that. I just found your Channel a week ago. At least your arthritis isn't keeping you from building the world's finest mandolin built by man!
Nice progress on the mandolin. I am planning on building one in the future. Bought a nice spruce soundboard and the Rodger Siminoff Bluegrass Construction Manual with plans. Your videos inspired me to start building. So far I built a kit concert ukulele, a solid mahogany wood tenor ukulele and am finishing a 000 kit where I made a laminated neck based off your videos. Thanks for the instructions and insight on building instruments.
I wonder if a heated water press roller for wood cutting work on making a Madeline but not for cutting but for pressing wood like a metal forger would do
59 seconds in... I have to pause and state here, if this Mandolin turns out to be "crummy", send it to me. I guarantee it WILL be "The Worlds Finest Mandolin ever built by a Human" in my hands. It will be the only Mandolin I have. Just volunteering, I got your back! LOL
Jerry, I’m very glad you are building this mandolin! I will use these videos as a reference for the future! That 3rd point you are carving in the top and back is a little more detailed than most! I’m just glad you are still able and willing to build! You ARE a master luthier! Lots of love from your buddy from Colorado! Thanxz
Watching with baited breath on this one, Jerry, oh what fun! I'm a sixty-one year old multi-instrumentalist, guitar, mandolin, banjo, ukulele, bass, and piano. I've been enjoying learning how to set up my acoustic guitar and mandolin, you've taken a lot of the mystery out of it, especially the amount to take off the bridge to get the 90/1000ths (low E) and the 80/1000ths (high E) at the twelfth fret. I'd been hoking and poking around with it in the dark for decades, now I know the formula. Thank you, Jerry! I'm gaining the confidence, thanks to you, to level and crown and dress my own frets and nut. I bought a file set, from Stew-Mac, and I made a six inch single cut file block, just as you described yours. I'm not sure about replacing the frets yet, but I think I'll be looking for a beater acoustic guitar to practice on. A shout out to, Liam, my step-daughter just gave me an Auto-Harp. It's all there, but it needs to be tuned up. I don't have a tuning key yet, so I need to locate one of those. There are over thirty strings on the darned thing, so I want to avoid a string change if at all possible. I'm wanting to tune in up and give it to my grandchildren. I'm teaching them the Ukulele right now, and the Auto-Harp will be a fun instrument for them to play around with. I think that it is a fairly decent Chinese Auto-Harp made by, IIRC, Byong Pong instruments. Loads of fun!
Jerry, I like your videos, you do good work.i did warranty work for Gibson in Martin guitar companies I also built guitars at that time, Doyle Lawson and Wayne Lewis both on one of my guitars. Janet Davis tried to get me to do some videos on repair work back in the day. You and I thank a lot the same when it come to repairs and building. Keep up with the good work and great videos. John E. Martin Arkansas
Hope you're feeling better Jerry had my own health issues recently (let's just say water works and leave it there ) but feeling chipper now and aiming straight 😅👍🇬🇧🇫🇴
I haven't done this for a few years but the last time I used a finger plane to carve a mandolin top and (especially) back, I rolled up a ball of gaffer tape and pushed it onto the end of the finger plane blade. It sure makes your hands hurt a lot less. Fewer blisters too.
I have an idea for your fine detail sanding. Get yourself a cheap rechargeable electric tooth brush, pull the bristles out of the brush heads and put velcro on the toothbrush head. You can us a small pice of plastic to make the sanding hear a bit bigger or different shapes. I use this on my models when I do body work and use 220grit sand paper and it sand it smooth and flat. Just like using a min DA sander.
Gibson started a revolution using the latest in precision machine tools to make parts that go into musical instruments. This was Orvil's main contribution to the industry.
@@zapa1pnt Pretty sure that Orville Gibson had little to do with the Gibson Company's use of precision tooling. He was a one off builder, the Gibson Company took his designs and changed them to make them realistic for production.
I was watching a pane beater shaping his curves by using his fingers while looking away so that his eye did not confuse his hand. Is this part of your technique Jerry? Love your work and feel for you with the arthritis
You've inspired me to try and build another one. Guess I'll invest in a CNC machine to help out. I'm nowhere near good enough to tackle one by hand. I'm thinking European spruce and tasmanian blackwood.
Worked it down from an almost Eflat to a nice warm Dflat. I guess Stradovari (35:18) would approve. What patience... Nice to see in detail all the steps that go into hand-making such instruments. Can't wait to see (and hear!) the finished instrument.
Just started watching this series with your above title at pt 1. Some of your added 'flair' would come out very different if done by the early Paracho de Verduzco, Michoacan, Mexico, which is widely regarded as the guitar capital of Mexico. If you get a chance: Study the bevels on the 'extra' points of the early B.C.Rich Seagull. Of course those old Mexicans didn't use anything more than scraps of steel & a keen ability to hone a sharp edge on their makeshift knives. Perhaps your 2nd best can attain such fluidity!
That wood doesn't even look real! Just wow! Watching this makes me want to try to make something similar. Using mulberry and carve the back using only one grain layer. Too bad I don't have time for it right now.
Wonderful work as always. Is this an older video re-visited ? If so, I am sorry I missed it the first time around. Maybe you could stain it with walnut syrup ;-)
Is that Cody Shuller singing in some of the music you're playing in your videos? He also builds a wonderful mandolin case! He and his family go to my church.
Love the video(s) and I'm excited to follow along with your progress. I have a quick question regarding terminology/semantics. At one point in the video, you used a measurement of 250/1000ths. Why not use 1/4 inch instead?
I had to stop watching at the 13 min mark. I cut myself horribly doing that exact type of cut because of trying to use my hand as a work holding device. At the time, I had about 30 yrs of experience not including my apprenticeships, and something like that was never going to happen to me since I could do it all in my sleep. Once slip and I was unable to work for many months and lost the project itself, tons of money, waiting list customers, etc. etc. Best of luck to you- please stay safe.
Knowing that the boards have a low and high sound; maybe they should be positioned so the low side is on the bass side and the high on the treble side. It may make a deference in the tone and volume of the instrument.
Have you seen or tried the wecheer/fordom carving setups? ie they have the longer cord to hold the various bits in the attachment pieces. I have found that gives me a lot better control than holding the dremel for carving.
🤣🤣There's a weekend project, for you. A hand carved toilet seat! Something to show off, to your friends. Don't skimp, on the sand paper....for Any reason. 🤣🤣🤣
It would be just as bad if not worse than flamed maple, I'm sure. Every place where there is figure, the grain changes directions. The only way to really plane something like that is cross grain, where you are perpendicular to the grain direction, and sometimes even at a diagonal angle. it's beautiful stuff, but just awful to work on.
What's your top thickness at the outside? You said something about roughing it out to .250 or a bit more. At what point are you working it down to 3/16, or .187 inches , assuming you do that?
Machines would have to go quite a ways yet to be programmed with something of the tips and tricks that a person could put into an instrument. Even they don't get absolutely identical specimens of wood. They will make okay instruments, but not the finest ones.
@@zapa1pnt That's a distinct shortcoming where the only thing done is to carve the wood to a fixed pattern. Something far more elaborate would be needed to, as Jerry puts it, "Sneak up on it." This sounds like fodder for some post doctoral thesis of music and materials science and CAD and programming. Or we could ask Mark Rober to do it, lol. And even yet the scope of subjectivity would be so great. A person might be able to choose between adjusted designs depending on what their ideal instrument is. We might even find the formula for, say, a great Stradivarius imitation, though it would never ever reproduce the original.
@@SeekingTheLoveThatGodMeans7648 I think, the best robotics could do is make something which Looks like an instrument, just like our shirts Look like shirts but never fit right.
yuck , a 40 grit fiber disk on the grinder won't have any dents and you can carve right down to sandpaper ready surface works to carve the inside too. I have a circular rasp but now I see i won't be using it much
I don't know how this industry goes...but if the sound is there, shouldn't you get about $8,000 to 12,000 for new instrument hand built? Or am I way off?
Isn't this really a matter of taking the plates down to the minimum...just enough to be structurally sound, and nothing more? It's like building a glider or performance sail boat.
You are a lovely man. Your skill is second to none. This could have been a delightful video, but that back-alley catter-walling aural assault peppered throughout made it absolutely intolerable... sorry to be so honest! ...Barry
I sure hope you are feeling better…you were in my prayers 🙏
Realy nice work. Look forward for next part. Be careful of your fingers.
Best regards from Sweden.
Thomas from BMS webb Tv.
🤗
Concerning the recurve on the top: Benedetto says that the recurve on the top is purely cosmetic, that the F holes already make the top far more flexible than the recurve could by itself. And that does make sense, with those holes cut in there, it's going to be more flexible just from the missing material. He then goes on to say that the BACK is the place the recurve makes a difference. It matters because without it, the back is too inflexible to help shoot the sound out of the instrument. He taps on the front and feels he vibrations in the back, first at the center and then sliding towards the edge. When you get towards the edge, you can feel that the vibrations drop off. What he says you want to do is to get that recurve area vibrating as much as the center of the back. It's a pretty subtle thing to feel, no question. But he thins the recurve area to where it is vibrating like the center of the back, then he considers it done.
Granted, he's building guitars, but I wonder if the same principle applies to mandolins? I'm almost done with my first arch top and I've never finished a mandolin, but I am definitely noticing what he is talking about with the back vibrations. Just something to consider.
I love it when humble person tries to do something the best anybody's ever done it, because they might just pull it off. If an arrogant person says the same, I don't believe a word of it!
It’s OK if it’s not the world’s best, I still enjoy the process and will be watching all the way.
You should get a yoga mat for a router mat. It’ll help keep those from moving around while routing.
I developed incredible debilitating pain in the meaty section of my palm just below my thumb. Pretty much doing the exact kind of work you are doing.
I finally went and got carpal tunnel surgery and it gave me my life back.
Nice to hear you got relief.
Jerry's problem is he's got that there sorryass arthritis. It aint goin' away, until he does.
According to the hand specialist I don't have carpal tunnel I have advanced arthritis
I'm sorry to hear that. I just found your Channel a week ago. At least your arthritis isn't keeping you from building the world's finest mandolin built by man!
Sorry to hear about the need for carpel tunnel syndrome. Crochet does that to us crafters, too.
The detail that you are starting to tease us with looks amazing. I think you may well be going to meet your goal........I really hope you do😊
Thanks Jerry. I am throughly enjoying the ride along.
She'll be such a beautiful mandolin when you've finished true craftsmanship.
The extra point you're doing is well thought out and very tasteful.
Always a joy to sit and watch Mr. Rosa do his art.
Nice progress on the mandolin. I am planning on building one in the future. Bought a nice spruce soundboard and the Rodger Siminoff Bluegrass Construction Manual with plans. Your videos inspired me to start building. So far I built a kit concert ukulele, a solid mahogany wood tenor ukulele and am finishing a 000 kit where I made a laminated neck based off your videos. Thanks for the instructions and insight on building instruments.
May you stay strong and live long as a blessing of joy in the Lord Jesus Christ
BLESS YOU...
I wonder if a heated water press roller for wood cutting work on making a Madeline but not for cutting but for pressing wood like a metal forger would do
59 seconds in... I have to pause and state here, if this Mandolin turns out to be "crummy", send it to me. I guarantee it WILL be "The Worlds Finest Mandolin ever built by a Human" in my hands. It will be the only Mandolin I have. Just volunteering, I got your back! LOL
Thank you for the gospel music. Your skills are incredible. Your faith is better. Keep it up.
It is always a joy to watch the hands work of a true craftsman and artist. I have been enjoying your videos for a long time. Thank You Jerry.
Good to see you still working, with your brain as well as your hands. Adam
So glad. I saw there was an RSW video, watched immediately. It's taking shape. Looking good!!!
Glad to see you crafting the mandolin Jerry, even though your hands are hurting. I'm a bass player and immensely enjoy your work
The original note sounded like a D (confirmed on my keyboard) and now it sounds closer to D flat after the scraping, IMO.
Despite my best efforts, every time I watch one of your videos I learn stuff. Thanks for putting the videos out here.
Jerry, I’m very glad you are building this mandolin! I will use these videos as a reference for the future! That 3rd point you are carving in the top and back is a little more detailed than most! I’m just glad you are still able and willing to build! You ARE a master luthier! Lots of love from your buddy from Colorado! Thanxz
The mandolin is actually farther along than this video. Let’s all check in for Jerry’s live stream Friday morning at 8:00 central.
Watching with baited breath on this one, Jerry, oh what fun! I'm a sixty-one year old multi-instrumentalist, guitar, mandolin, banjo, ukulele, bass, and piano. I've been enjoying learning how to set up my acoustic guitar and mandolin, you've taken a lot of the mystery out of it, especially the amount to take off the bridge to get the 90/1000ths (low E) and the 80/1000ths (high E) at the twelfth fret. I'd been hoking and poking around with it in the dark for decades, now I know the formula. Thank you, Jerry! I'm gaining the confidence, thanks to you, to level and crown and dress my own frets and nut. I bought a file set, from Stew-Mac, and I made a six inch single cut file block, just as you described yours. I'm not sure about replacing the frets yet, but I think I'll be looking for a beater acoustic guitar to practice on.
A shout out to, Liam, my step-daughter just gave me an Auto-Harp. It's all there, but it needs to be tuned up. I don't have a tuning key yet, so I need to locate one of those. There are over thirty strings on the darned thing, so I want to avoid a string change if at all possible. I'm wanting to tune in up and give it to my grandchildren. I'm teaching them the Ukulele right now, and the Auto-Harp will be a fun instrument for them to play around with. I think that it is a fairly decent Chinese Auto-Harp made by, IIRC, Byong Pong instruments. Loads of fun!
Unker's Salve helps the hands. I put a thick layer on at night and sleep in gloves. The hands usually work again by morning.
Jerry, I like your videos, you do good work.i did warranty work for Gibson in Martin guitar companies I also built guitars at that time, Doyle Lawson and Wayne Lewis both on one of my guitars. Janet Davis tried to get me to do some videos on repair work back in the day. You and I thank a lot the same when it come to repairs and building. Keep up with the good work and great videos. John E. Martin Arkansas
That wood is beautiful, Jerry!
Recently found your channel. I'm thoroughly enjoying it. Thank you for the time you put in it.
Ok I’m hooked again, Such craftsmanship. Thanks Jerry!
Hope you're feeling better Jerry had my own health issues recently (let's just say water works and leave it there ) but feeling chipper now and aiming straight 😅👍🇬🇧🇫🇴
You should have just left it at health issues.
I haven't done this for a few years but the last time I used a finger plane to carve a mandolin top and (especially) back, I rolled up a ball of gaffer tape and pushed it onto the end of the finger plane blade. It sure makes your hands hurt a lot less. Fewer blisters too.
You do amazing work!!!
UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
get a guard on that grinder! :) Had to say it.... I use those wheels to build guitars, and they BITE HARD!
Beautiful work my friend. Inspiring.
I stayed because of the great Bluegrass music. Allison Krauss. It's all good.
Rhett and his same old song. “Patience and tenacity” Good example for all of us.
Looking forward to watching this.. I watched your last build and it turned out amazing.. I suspect this one is going to be even better.
I have an idea for your fine detail sanding. Get yourself a cheap rechargeable electric tooth brush, pull the bristles out of the brush heads and put velcro on the toothbrush head. You can us a small pice of plastic to make the sanding hear a bit bigger or different shapes. I use this on my models when I do body work and use 220grit sand paper and it sand it smooth and flat. Just like using a min DA sander.
Hello from Canada great videos thanks
I was hoping the next installment of this adventure would come out today! :)
The note you sounded at around 18 minutes of this vid is a perfect D
That is some pretty wood.
Gibson started a revolution using the latest in precision machine tools to make parts that go into musical instruments. This was Orvil's main contribution to the industry.
Yes, "to the industry", but not the instrument or the art.
@@zapa1pnt Allowing many more people to afford to buy them when the hand made ones became to expensive.To the art of playing for sure.
@@davestambaugh7282 Yes, what you say here is true, but I stand by my comment.
@@zapa1pnt Pretty sure that Orville Gibson had little to do with the Gibson Company's use of precision tooling. He was a one off builder, the Gibson Company took his designs and changed them to make them realistic for production.
I love the additional point/ curve
cant wait til the next video 🙂 Part 3
I was watching a pane beater shaping his curves by using his fingers while looking away so that his eye did not confuse his hand. Is this part of your technique Jerry? Love your work and feel for you with the arthritis
Thanks for doing this series. I don’t play string instruments but it’s interesting to see what goes into them.
Very nice! I love the carving!
Thanks Jerry!
You've inspired me to try and build another one. Guess I'll invest in a CNC machine to help out. I'm nowhere near good enough to tackle one by hand. I'm thinking European spruce and tasmanian blackwood.
I have taken a spoon, cut the handle off, and sharpened it into a wood scraper
As usual Jerry I get my luthier fix and bluegrass fix at same time. Love your videos. We are on Vancouver Island.
Worked it down from an almost Eflat to a nice warm Dflat. I guess Stradovari (35:18) would approve. What patience... Nice to see in detail all the steps that go into hand-making such instruments. Can't wait to see (and hear!) the finished instrument.
keep the work area cleaner so when carving and you get the chip out and you will get a chip out, you can find the piece and glue it back on.
I can already tell that this is going to be a beautiful mandolin!
That tool you used outside is called a mandolin shaper. ;-)
She's a beaut already!
Just started watching this series with your above title at pt 1. Some of your added 'flair' would come out very different if done by the early Paracho de Verduzco, Michoacan, Mexico, which is widely regarded as the guitar capital of Mexico. If you get a chance: Study the bevels on the 'extra' points of the early B.C.Rich Seagull. Of course those old Mexicans didn't use anything more than scraps of steel & a keen ability to hone a sharp edge on their makeshift knives. Perhaps your 2nd best can attain such fluidity!
Fabulous. 👍👍
thank you
That wood doesn't even look real! Just wow! Watching this makes me want to try to make something similar. Using mulberry and carve the back using only one grain layer. Too bad I don't have time for it right now.
Wonderful work as always. Is this an older video re-visited ? If so, I am sorry I missed it the first time around. Maybe you could stain it with walnut syrup ;-)
LOL! Frankly, though, I’d rather use my syrup to stain a nice stack of flapjacks!
No, this video is not a repeat of anything.
@@zapa1pnt Thank you
@@georgefrench1907 I agree
Lovely!!!!
I've seen a lot of guys use the same metal pencil you do and I've always wondered what this?
A master instrument maker of the highest class.
Is that Cody Shuller singing in some of the music you're playing in your videos? He also builds a wonderful mandolin case! He and his family go to my church.
I don’t have the permission to get one of these Beautiful Mandolin Family instruments yet I will be working toward this soon !!!
You will have to find someone will to sell theirs.
Jerry is no longer building on commission.
Love the video(s) and I'm excited to follow along with your progress. I have a quick question regarding terminology/semantics. At one point in the video, you used a measurement of 250/1000ths. Why not use 1/4 inch instead?
i like the camera shadow..right where you are working. thank you for sharing
No one makes you watch this is not Hollywood I'm more interested in doing the work than I am in making a video
I had to stop watching at the 13 min mark. I cut myself horribly doing that exact type of cut because of trying to use my hand as a work holding device. At the time, I had about 30 yrs of experience not including my apprenticeships, and something like that was never going to happen to me since I could do it all in my sleep.
Once slip and I was unable to work for many months and lost the project itself, tons of money, waiting list customers, etc. etc.
Best of luck to you- please stay safe.
Hello from Piqua Ohio
Knowing that the boards have a low and high sound; maybe they should be
positioned so the low side is on the bass side and the high on the
treble side. It may make a deference in the tone and volume of the
instrument.
Hi Jerry, it looks to be progressing nicely! Hey, I missed it, what is wrong with your right hand? I sure hope it's not carpal tunnel. Take care.
Have you seen or tried the wecheer/fordom carving setups? ie they have the longer cord to hold the various bits in the attachment pieces. I have found that gives me a lot better control than holding the dremel for carving.
😊I’ve been reading the comments and I’m gonna buy a dog and name him Ydontya seems to be very popular 😂
Very nice Mando...though isn't a a router a machine? I don't quite get the distinction between hand and machine made when the machine is a hand tool.
👏👏👏the best
Hi Jerry just catching up on this series...nice work, I was wondering if an archtop guitar top and back are created in the same methods?
Does the finger plane have a flat or curved bottom? Just curious as I would like to build a mandolin. Thanks!
You can buy them either way but I always use the curved bottom
Beautiful voices and I cant find them online.
vary nice
This must be the nicest toilet seat i have ever seen, just kidding, nice work !
🤣🤣There's a weekend project, for you.
A hand carved toilet seat! Something to show off, to your friends.
Don't skimp, on the sand paper....for Any reason. 🤣🤣🤣
How does that quilted maple machine ? Tear out ????
It would be just as bad if not worse than flamed maple, I'm sure. Every place where there is figure, the grain changes directions. The only way to really plane something like that is cross grain, where you are perpendicular to the grain direction, and sometimes even at a diagonal angle. it's beautiful stuff, but just awful to work on.
Have you ever used thicker broken glass as a scraper 😁????
until the next one...
What's your top thickness at the outside? You said something about roughing it out to .250 or a bit more. At what point are you working it down to 3/16, or .187 inches , assuming you do that?
Have you ever built a left handed mandolin Jerry?
Machines would have to go quite a ways yet to be programmed with something of the tips and tricks that a person could put into an instrument. Even they don't get absolutely identical specimens of wood. They will make okay instruments, but not the finest ones.
They, Certainly, can't tap the raw material and evaluate the tone.
@@zapa1pnt That's a distinct shortcoming where the only thing done is to carve the wood to a fixed pattern. Something far more elaborate would be needed to, as Jerry puts it, "Sneak up on it."
This sounds like fodder for some post doctoral thesis of music and materials science and CAD and programming. Or we could ask Mark Rober to do it, lol. And even yet the scope of subjectivity would be so great. A person might be able to choose between adjusted designs depending on what their ideal instrument is. We might even find the formula for, say, a great Stradivarius imitation, though it would never ever reproduce the original.
@@SeekingTheLoveThatGodMeans7648 I think, the best robotics could do is make something which Looks like an instrument, just like our shirts Look like shirts but never fit right.
Why don’t you clamp too down when you use the router?
If it is clamped down, he can't keep turning it, as he works.
The same thing holds true for his carving and sanding, on
his carpet covered bench top.
Sometimes I do most times I don't
So you like to leave a 1/4 inch?
Yeah, but I don’t think that’s one of Jerry’s secret Lloyd Loar measurements.😀
yuck , a 40 grit fiber disk on the grinder won't have any dents and you can carve right down to sandpaper ready surface works to carve the inside too. I have a circular rasp but now I see i won't be using it much
I have used both and I prefer the rasp
Lloyd Loar would like to have a word....
Great Work ,! . Love the Opening Tune . What is that. . 🙏
Why didn't you move your work out of the camera shadow? Little distracting....but still great video.
Jerry tries hard, to make sure we can see what he is doing
but, sometimes, when we can see, he can't.
It's not Hollywood and I'm more interested in doing the work then making videos
I need a cd of this music. I’m an old fart, downloads don’t interest me.
I don't know how this industry goes...but if the sound is there, shouldn't you get about $8,000 to 12,000 for new instrument hand built?
Or am I way off?
Isn't this really a matter of taking the plates down to the minimum...just enough to be structurally sound, and nothing more?
It's like building a glider or performance sail boat.
Why don't you use a router pad instead of chasing your work around ?
"Fancy can't sound good" = "I can't afford it so I'm gonna crap all over it". Don't sweat the bottom feeders.
If you use power tools is it really being built by hand?
Yes
You are a lovely man. Your skill is second to none. This could have been a delightful video, but that back-alley catter-walling aural assault peppered throughout made it absolutely intolerable... sorry to be so honest! ...Barry