this video blew me away. I always knew how timing worked but never this in depth. just wow, thank you so much for your time and this channel. I definitely want to sponsor your channel each month. thanks again.
When I was young it was so hard to get info from anybody. Luckily I met a mentor. So I just wanted to tell you thanks for sharing that hard earned knowledge. All your videos are great, and I'm sure your helping a lot of youngsters.
About a year ago I bought a truck. Its got a SB 350 and an SM465 manual transmission. Even since then, I've been searching far and wide for information that will help me tear it down and rebuild it. In terms of my mechanical knowledge... I'm starting at zero. But, I'm ambitious, so I'm gonna build a 450-500HP 383! Eventually. I've scoured the internet for information, and want to tell you that the effort you make to pass on your knowledge, is totally worthwhile. Thank you so much for taking the time. If I could drop by and work for knowledge, I'd be there every weekend wrenching away!
Saileahgaz Your comment on Myvintageiron passing on his knowledge is exactly how I feel about his no bs straightforward truth is definitely VERY MUCH APPRECIATED And I have to get on the Patreon website and support his efforts as knowledge is power. and it's not easy to get good technical knowledge!I would kill to be able to to work along side with this guy!Nothing like learning how to rebuild engines then getting hands dirty with the best in the business!!
I always look to your videos for any and all of my info on engines, it's super informative and at the same time super easy to understand. Your info on how to understand your camshaft, the importance on degree ing the cam. Etc changed my whole understanding of engine building.
Great description of ignition timing. There are SO MANY people out there that don't have much of a clue about this, hell, you can't hardly buy a timing light anymore. Growing up on a farm in the boondocks (rural SD) with Hot Rod & Popular Hot Rodding magazine subscriptions back in the 50s to the 70s, I had to figure it out. Growing up now, it's in your laptop plugged in to the car. I appreciate both ways. Some of the nowadays people kinda glaze over when I ask them about their valve OR ignition timing. Great Video as usual, Thank You for caring n sharing.
I've known this stuff for years, but it is always good to hear again with the details and specificity that you explained. It is always good to hear it explained with this level of detail. Thanks for doing all that you do. I never get tired of seeing SBC functionality. Thank you!!!
I recently purchased a new timing light with a degree advance capability without really knowing why. I just knew I had to have it. With this video, I now know how to check my 350 in my 71 El Camino timing with the engine revved. THANK YOU!!!!!
New subscriber! I'm 29 and currently working on the first vehicle my parents were able to give me. A '69 Chevy C-10 pickup. It's been sitting for 12+ years with no one touching it. I'm NOT a mechanic by any means (nor is my dad), so TH-cam and google is my main source of information. I've been trying to get it to run correctly for the past couple weeks and am having one hellva time with it. You, sir, have had one of the most in depth, informative video I've seen over these couple weeks (and I've seen A LOT). I appreciate the time and knowledge you took to make this video.
Excellent explanation, i set the timing on my standard holden 308 V8 (gm) about 10-12 BTDC and let the vacuum and centrifugal advance to the rest , it goes great. I FIND YOUR VIDEOS ARE BETTER THAN MY WORKSHOP MANUALS
Thank You Thank You Thank You!!!! I knew nothing about timing or the timing light before this video and now I have a great understanding and feel comfortable enough to set the timing with a timing light. Very informative!!!
I thought you explained it quite well. I have the same timing light myself, I bought it off an older gentleman at a swap meet who wished me luck figuring it out. Best $5 I ever spent . lol
I'm 37. I was born and grew up right during the birth of electronic fuel injection. And I love it. I really do. The thing about all the advances in technology, and this is true of everything, even smartphones, is that as devices get smarter we have to know and do less and less ourselves. I like to say as our phones get smarter we're getting dumber. I knew what timing was but I didn't know the reason why it was what it was until it was explained here. I'm not a mechanic obviously lol. But I've recently started wrenching on an old 79 Chevy pickup. So now it's relevant to me. Didn't have to worry about any of that stuff on my 2012 Camaro. The computer sorts it all out optimally. But knowing about timing, etc. as explained in this video has helped me gain a little more knowledge of how internal combustion engines work. And it'll help in my dealings with my pickup i'm sure.
After weeks of searching videos, I come across this one. By far the best video that I found. You explain It in a way that no one else has been able to. I cant believe I just now came across your channel. I could learn so much from you. Thank you.
Thank you, simply and well explained and then backed up by showing on a working engine. Perfect, helped to cement my knowledge around initial and total timing.
So as a machinist I have to ask, how do you know your timing tab is for sure correct? What can I do to verify and calibrate 0 on my timing tab to to ensure 0 is really 0? Is that also why the #s are on the harmonic balancer? This and your cam video are the best education I've ever gotten on anything. Not just car related, but period. Thank you so much.
It starts on the engine stand by finding true TDC of your #1 piston. I put the balancer on the crank snout, and mark "zero" on the balancer, no matter what it says on the tab or the balancer. I change all indicators to cater to my mark at zero. Stock balancers are usually 2 piece with rubber in between the outer and inner rings, if you will. And the outer ring can move throwing everything completely out of whack. So you have to mark both pieces to tell if there has been movement, because the inner ring mark will never move. High performance dampners like Fluidampner are one piece. Regardless of the factory marks, the marks you made on the stand are the marks you use for the life of that motor. No one answered you, so I did. MSD has timing tape that is very useful in this endeavor. Good luck.
Curious how much total timing is safe for sbc 355, 10:1 comp, stock Vortec heads, cast rods and hyper pistons, ring gap .025, Vortec V3 supercharger with 650 cfm blowthrough carb with 6# boost at 6000 rpm, 93 gas with octane boost to 96. Currently have homemade stop limiting distributor advance to 20 degrees to be safe. Octane boost turns plugs orange, so it’s hard to read them. Thanks for all the good sbc videos. My next build will be LS, so watching the LS videos with interest.
Thank you for the in-depth explanation on timing. I was trying to explain timing and advance timing to a co-worker and he just couldn't get it. I've been wrenching for over 45 years and understand it but, as you know, to explain it to a non-mechanically intelligent man isn't the easiest thing to do. It seams that every time you say something you have to stop cuz you keep falling into that rabbit-hole of inexperience. I had him watch this and now I think he understands timing (maybe) lol Now I have to try to explain how the vacuum advance distributor works to him (Thanks a lot) lol - later
Great information perfect for my build issues I'm dealing with today. Can I duplicate the Total Timing using an old timing light which does not allow advanced timing settings ? Thank you in advance
Absolutely, hands down best video on timing I’ve seen. So well described in detail . If you don’t understand timing now you should just move on to knitting 🧶 lol
This an awesome channel with great content. I’ve been learning a lot from you and I appreciate it. This is the best explanation with the best analogy. I was wondering if you or any of your viewers has a good recommendation for non-detergent motor oil. Thanks and subscribed!
how much momentum in the crank assembly does the rotation have on the timing? does the rpm of the rotation assembly have an effect on advancing the timing. Never mind I watched the whole video and you answered the questions
Well said kind Sir: I would like to add some distributor info. I found light grease to be OK on distributor weights & springs But not OK at all on the shaft or better said the inside of the top shaft. Light oil, singer sewing machine type, or 3 in 1 oil works. Then if the Rotor is loose, a small amount of lightweight body putty from your finger to the top inside of the metal shaft- then put the rotor on Quickly and let sit till it sets up. It has stayed snug for 6 six years and did pry out. good Luck, Nick Wiese
OK, old 2-stroke motorcycle tuner here. Build many 2-strokes. Almost all have you set timing at 1 ~ 1.8 mm before TDC. Depends on serious race motor with high idle, maybe 2 ~ 2.5 mm before TDC. Once I left the automotive world and started dinking with 2-stroke go fast bikes, it all became more clear. Does not matter if it's degrees or piston position in a measurable scale, it's all the same ... Just curious, what is the actual piston travel in inches or mm for a 350 SBC at initial timing ?? My guess is it's about 1 mm or so ...
I'M GLAD I TOOK TIME TO WATCH THIS,I HAVE BEEN SETTING THE DIST IN AT 0 TDC AND NOW I'M LEARNING IT SHOULD BE ANYWHERE FROM 6 TO 12 DEGREES BEFORE TDC.THIS SHOULD BE A GAME CHANGER FOR ME. NEXT QUESTION IS WITH A HIGH PERFORMANCE MOTOR 383 STROKER MOTOR HOW MUCH ADVANCE SHOULD I SET IT AT ?
oh yea. do you know the total timing on the 383 stroker? I'm curious to know. because I would like to have a idea where to start. without inching up from zero. I would really like some dyno time to really get the timing mapped out. also do you have any experience with nitrous oxide? I built my engine with the intent of running a 200+/- shot. but probably just 100-150 shot if at all. and how much timing to take out. with n.o.s. I have mls head gaskets forged everything. head studs, main studs 4 bolt main. and a comp cams n.o.s. cam. any advice on tuning
Great Video Thank you. Quick question: I have a 85 Chevy 305 that was recently rebuilt and I essentially got for free. I'm going to be using it in a drag racing application (street class). It has stock 305 heads with a Edelbrock Performer EPS and a 650 Holley carb. HEI distributor with vacuum advance. It seems to run super rich, it will choke you out and i'm getting these slight little pops at idle that sound like hiccups. We tried a different carb, same symptoms. If the timing is set too far advanced could that cause these symptoms? What kind of timing would be a good starting point for an engine like this? Thanks in "advance"
So do you check the total timing with the vacuum line on to the vacuum advance ? I have a 352 CI and it does not have harmonic balancer, how critical is that, or why it does not have one, this is on my 1966 for F 100 pickup truck, thanks in advance Leo
On my new jeep 4.7 stroker running a MSD dist with Vac advance and MSD control box,Ford 2150 carb and no other computer I had to advance the timing to about 20 BTDC initial just to get it to start.Than during the cam break in the headers were turning red so I stepped it up to about 45 total timing at 3000 RPM.The glowing stopped and I finished the break in.The motor starts good and runs great at this timing but I have only 13 in vacuum (not enough for brake booster).Is this due to the timing? I live at 7500 ft altitude also. Am I going to hurt anything at this high timing?Water temp is below 200 and I can always put in a vacuum pump.Cam specs are 213/220 @50 .484in/.507 ex113LSA. Heads are ported also.Running ethanol free gas with Lucas octane boost. Thank you for the very informative video's.Its hard to find help with old school builds and you explain things great.
I watched one of your other vids,may have been on an ls engine,but you set the crank 10° before you dropped the distributor? difference between ls and say a "78" 350?
I have been watching some guys spraying their rocker arms and lifters with B-12 cleaner without taking the head off to get rid of lifter knocking.. If that is done, when the B-12, is there problem when it runs down into the engine does it damage the engine or does it run straight to the oil pan?
I have a set of 041 heads on my 71 Camaro 355. Long story but they only have 7k miles on them from OEM - screw in studs and guide plates. The car is running great but I am wondering about the ex valve seats and unleaded fuel - should I do something? Will the ex valves sink into the heads? How long might they last? Also do you have the flow numbers for them?
Hello John, I just subscribed to your video channel. I find your videos very educational and informative. I do have a question, I have a 390 engine in a 65 T-Bird that is smoking at all speeds. It was suggested that all I would need is a bearing and ring kit, I've never heard of such a thing. So would it be beneficial to me to invest in such a kit?
Really enjoy the channel I have learned alot of things just watching. Having a issue with my 350 85 gmc c2500 after setting total timing it sound like the bottom end. But the rattle goes away if I just set timing back to initial timing
You mentioned BBC needing more ignition timing. I have a 454 with a stock bottom end, mild cam, intake, and performer heads. The carb is a 750cfm. The distributor is vacuum advance. What would my initial and total timing numbers look like?
don't worry about initial it ends up where it ends up set total on that engine I would start with 35 total and work my way up 2 degrees at a time when it starts to ping back it down a couple and you are there it does depend on what heads and compression ratio you have so not all BBC will be the same that's why you gotta play with it to see what it likes some heads have quicker burn time than others depending on chamber size and piston top combination
I'd love to see do a video on how octane allows for timing advance and the correlation between flame travel and flash point with the higher octane and how it creates a lean burn condition. Poeple seem to be confused about the higher the octane the lower the flash point (colder) which in some cases creates heat because there's not enough fuel. I don't seem to have enough patients to explain effectively those things and why you can run more timing the higher the octane. Love you vids and so do my boys. Keep up to good work brother!
This may sound elementary but, I have my engine all together new cam all that. Install the distributor. Where do I set my rotor(timing) at ? Spec for idle is 8 btdc so for cam break-in do I set it about 8 btdc or straight up 0 degrees. Just clarifying...
Im struggling timing my truck. It calls for 32 degrees at 2500 rpm of total advance timing. Now its a performance motor. Should i be using any of the ports on the carb such as ported or manifold? Or should I just plug it and get the timing to 32 at 2500 rpm without any ports?
I have a quick question I understand timing but I've Been Told keep it on keep it off the vacuum advance hose when doing initial timing I understand the weights in the distributor then what is the purpose of the vacuum advance
the Vac advance if for just off idle to keep the engine from stumbling when you first touch the throttle set the timing with it un hooked and blocked off
So the mechanics of setting the total timming!? Does one advance the timming at idle then check the new advance or is the distributer being rotated to add the timming by hand at the same time the throttle is being held at 3000 rpm or so where ever the timing is all in? Thanks for this video it was very helpful for the concept but it seems like there's not a great video on you tube that describes how to add the timming physically. Thanks again any advice would be helpful on how this is done
The distributor advances it's self as timing increases just below the rotor there are weights that spin as RPM increases the weights cause the timing to advance the distributor has the ability to cause the rotor to advance with RPM, so no you are not moving the distributor you set initial timing at idle and the timing will automatically advance with rpm it is built into the distributor
You explain things real well, and that was an easy to understand and comprehensive explanation of timing and how to set base and total timing. You should explain the scale on that very nice damper, that most people don't have, how to use that instead of advance feature light that most people don't have (including myself😂) and how to make your own 30° mark on a stock damper, to use the timing cover scale and set your total timing. The circumference of my damper ÷ 360 = 1/16". 30 of those makes 1 7/8". So it was easy to accurately make that mark on my damper. Now using the scale on my timing cover, I can easily and accurately set my total timing to 33°, or whatever, using my idiot light😂
For the sake of time and confusion please watch the following video " Rough running 390 ford". It shows the problem I am having. I have done the following; coil, distributor cap, plug wires, TDC check, rebuilt the the FE1406 carburetor. It still won't start and stay running. can you please help.
I own a 84 camaro. It has a manual transmission, non ecm controlled carburated 350. I put the xenon strobe light and i dial it to 8 degrees and it does nothing?
So am working on a 1995 suburban 454 no high performance or anything the air cleaner says 4* adv is this what I want as my idle timing ? Is this my total timing ? Thanks
What would you say would be the best timing for a 350 sbc with open chamber 76cc heads with 8.5 compression. It's a race engine and have to be basically stock? Since they are such a large chamber head and low compression and is revving high every lap would you consider going over your suggested 35 degree max?
Question, I'm planning on replacing my intake manifold gaskets on a 79 Chevy k20. Have slight coolant leak on passenger side of intake. I'm afraid of messing up my timing when I pull distributor out. Right now engine runs like a top, fires right up every time. I want to keep it running that way once I'm done and have everything back together. I heard of guys marking distributor and marking intake manifold to keep timing right on, is this method a good idea or would retiming the motor be best option?
i was wondering about your thoughts on wether to use full maifold vacuum or timed port vacuum going to your vacuum advance canistor. i have heard about a 50 /50 preference on these options. i personally have always used the timed port on my holley for the vacuum advance because they do not pull any vacuum at idle. i have seen a number of guys on hear saying you will gain alot of performance if i was to change to full manifold vacuum.what do you think ? any help would be appreciated. Don
What indicators do you use to know that you have not only good enough timing for the engine to run, but the best possible timing for power and efficiency?
The camera doesn't want to pick up the strobe of the timing light because of the frame rate set by the camera is not in sync with the strobe. If the camera is set at 60 hz (60 frames per second) and the strobe light illuminates between frames, the camera won't be able to pick it up.
I'm gonna be as knowledgeable as this fella when I reach his age in prolly 30 years I'm hoping! It's weird how half the older dudes or napa fellas I ask how to do something when I'm building an engine, they either tell me something I know is a bad idea or won't work or I listen to them and it fucks something up lol. If 3 TH-cam fellas explain it good and they are all saying basically the same thing then I roll with it.
I have known this, but what I am not sure of is how far up the rpm range the timing keeps advancing the curve. It looks like in your video the curve stops advancing around 3k rpm. Does it advance beyond that? And do modern electronic ignition engines advance the curve clear up to say 6k rpm?
The timing really does not advance above about 3000 rpm's on most engines it has been discovered that advancing the timing above this RPM shows no real benefit
what should the total timing be on a 1979 351W on 87 regular gas? it has the fallowing, motor craft 2150 2bbl on a 1969 iron 2bbl intake all stock except NO smog junk, has aftermarket fox body chines sort tube headers 2.5 true duel exhaust from heders to tail pipe with h pipe and c4 transmission. all so what rpm should it all be in by ? the destributor is set up using the 10l slot or 10 distributor degrees in the centrifugal advance slot. right now i am runing it with the base timing at 2 degrees btc + 19 degrees vaccum advance on full manifold vacuum or 21 btc at idle. douse this sound right or should i change it?
The Vaccume advance should not be changing timing at idle you should be a 6 degrees at idle and your VA should have no vacuum signal until you hit the throttle your hose is hooked up to the wrong port it needs to be above the throttle plate
I've set base timing before at 0 degrees like the emissions sticker under the hood says it should be set at on this engine, (LB9 and LO3 engines have different ignition timings as I recall) doesn't the electronic spark advance on the distributor automatically compensate for ignition advance? It seems to run fine all the way through to 5000 RPM which the engine is capped for anyway, and only will run funky if the engine is pushed while it's still warming up, with a lot of valve float and rich mixture of course. I know the EST has to be disconnected in order to set base timing because the electronic module will continuously push spark advance even at idle, thus giving an inaccurate base timing if it's not disconnected first. I just wanna make sure I have the right degree of advance for running on 87 octane and a motor that's not developing huge amounts of compression even with hundreds of thousands of miles on it.
If you have an OBD 2 computer controlling timing it's true you set it at 0 and the advance curve is mapped into the ECU the engine in the video has no computer and timing must be set manually
Oh this is OBD 1 since it's an '87-'95 SBC, but it does have an HEI electronic distributor as stock, that not only controls spark advance, but injector pulse as well. If the 4 pin connector isn't plugged in, the injectors will not fire at all. Hopefully I won't have to swap out the distributor when switching over to a TPI intake, and it'll control injector pulse as normal even with 8 injectors to monitor.
Yep, although OBD 1 is very rudimentary, by the time OBD 2 came out engines already have switched over to coil packs, or coil on plug design, allowing the computer to make finer adjustments to ignition timing according to each cylinder's needs.
When you advanced timing on light to 30, is that just to demo that at higher rpm you hit the zero timing mark? Just want to make sure you didn’t have to manually advance the distributor itself. Thx.
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this video blew me away. I always knew how timing worked but never this in depth. just wow, thank you so much for your time and this channel. I definitely want to sponsor your channel each month. thanks again.
Thank You
+Useful Entertainment
When I was young it was so hard to get info from anybody. Luckily I met a mentor. So I just wanted to tell you thanks for sharing that hard earned knowledge. All your videos are great, and I'm sure your helping a lot of youngsters.
Love your aircraft explanation. I would have never thought to explain it that way.
All this knowledge for free!!!! Man I wish I had TH-cam back in the late 80s and early 90s haha. Great video brother thanks so much for your time!
About a year ago I bought a truck. Its got a SB 350 and an SM465 manual transmission. Even since then, I've been searching far and wide for information that will help me tear it down and rebuild it. In terms of my mechanical knowledge... I'm starting at zero. But, I'm ambitious, so I'm gonna build a 450-500HP 383! Eventually. I've scoured the internet for information, and want to tell you that the effort you make to pass on your knowledge, is totally worthwhile. Thank you so much for taking the time. If I could drop by and work for knowledge, I'd be there every weekend wrenching away!
Thanks
Saileahgaz Your comment on Myvintageiron passing on his knowledge is exactly how I feel about his no bs straightforward truth is definitely VERY MUCH APPRECIATED And I have to get on the Patreon website and support his efforts as knowledge is power. and it's not easy to get good technical knowledge!I would kill to be able to to work along side with this guy!Nothing like learning how to rebuild engines then getting hands dirty with the best in the business!!
I always look to your videos for any and all of my info on engines, it's super informative and at the same time super easy to understand. Your info on how to understand your camshaft, the importance on degree ing the cam. Etc changed my whole understanding of engine building.
Glad to help!
I'm a rookie and this was a great video breaking down the basics!!!! Much appreciated.
Great description of ignition timing. There are SO MANY people out there that don't have much of a clue about this, hell, you can't hardly buy a timing light anymore. Growing up on a farm in the boondocks (rural SD) with Hot Rod & Popular Hot Rodding magazine subscriptions back in the 50s to the 70s, I had to figure it out. Growing up now, it's in your laptop plugged in to the car. I appreciate both ways. Some of the nowadays people kinda glaze over when I ask them about their valve OR ignition timing. Great Video as usual, Thank You for caring n sharing.
I've known this stuff for years, but it is always good to hear again with the details and specificity that you explained. It is always good to hear it explained with this level of detail. Thanks for doing all that you do. I never get tired of seeing SBC functionality. Thank you!!!
Anytime I need information about my engine build I come straight to you. Thanks for all you do for us novice mechanics.
I recently purchased a new timing light with a degree advance capability without really knowing why. I just knew I had to have it. With this video, I now know how to check my 350 in my 71 El Camino timing with the engine revved. THANK YOU!!!!!
You bet glad it helped
New subscriber! I'm 29 and currently working on the first vehicle my parents were able to give me. A '69 Chevy C-10 pickup. It's been sitting for 12+ years with no one touching it. I'm NOT a mechanic by any means (nor is my dad), so TH-cam and google is my main source of information. I've been trying to get it to run correctly for the past couple weeks and am having one hellva time with it. You, sir, have had one of the most in depth, informative video I've seen over these couple weeks (and I've seen A LOT). I appreciate the time and knowledge you took to make this video.
THX
Excellent explanation, i set the timing on my standard holden 308 V8 (gm) about 10-12 BTDC and let the vacuum and centrifugal advance to the rest , it goes great. I FIND YOUR VIDEOS ARE BETTER THAN MY WORKSHOP MANUALS
i have a problem understanding how the spark can fire before piston has reached the top with out it spark knocking
You have explained ignition timing better than anyone I have ever heard it from. Now, I finally get it. Thank you!
You Bet
Thank You Thank You Thank You!!!! I knew nothing about timing or the timing light before this video and now I have a great understanding and feel comfortable enough to set the timing with a timing light. Very informative!!!
I thought you explained it quite well. I have the same timing light myself, I bought it off an older gentleman at a swap meet who wished me luck figuring it out. Best $5 I ever spent . lol
Found your video on the Corvette Forum, great explanation of total timing and visuals. I'll recommend it to others, thanks.
THX
Was your vacuum advance hooked up when checking for total timing?
Yes
Your videos are awesome, no one explains things like you do. You make it understandable. keep'm coming!
I've watched a lot of your videos MVI but this one I missed...FANTASTIC Info !
*YOU ROCK !*
You sir did a fantastic job of explaining this. The airplane comparison made so much sense to me.
I'm 37. I was born and grew up right during the birth of electronic fuel injection. And I love it. I really do. The thing about all the advances in technology, and this is true of everything, even smartphones, is that as devices get smarter we have to know and do less and less ourselves. I like to say as our phones get smarter we're getting dumber. I knew what timing was but I didn't know the reason why it was what it was until it was explained here. I'm not a mechanic obviously lol. But I've recently started wrenching on an old 79 Chevy pickup. So now it's relevant to me. Didn't have to worry about any of that stuff on my 2012 Camaro. The computer sorts it all out optimally. But knowing about timing, etc. as explained in this video has helped me gain a little more knowledge of how internal combustion engines work. And it'll help in my dealings with my pickup i'm sure.
After weeks of searching videos, I come across this one. By far the best video that I found. You explain It in a way that no one else has been able to. I cant believe I just now came across your channel. I could learn so much from you. Thank you.
Thanks a lot! Watched and learned. Will apply to this to my SBC 350 soon. Greetings from Holland!
Thank you, simply and well explained and then backed up by showing on a working engine. Perfect, helped to cement my knowledge around initial and total timing.
So as a machinist I have to ask, how do you know your timing tab is for sure correct? What can I do to verify and calibrate 0 on my timing tab to to ensure 0 is really 0? Is that also why the #s are on the harmonic balancer?
This and your cam video are the best education I've ever gotten on anything. Not just car related, but period. Thank you so much.
It starts on the engine stand by finding true TDC of your #1 piston. I put the balancer on the crank snout, and mark "zero" on the balancer, no matter what it says on the tab or the balancer. I change all indicators to cater to my mark at zero. Stock balancers are usually 2 piece with rubber in between the outer and inner rings, if you will. And the outer ring can move throwing everything completely out of whack. So you have to mark both pieces to tell if there has been movement, because the inner ring mark will never move. High performance dampners like Fluidampner are one piece. Regardless of the factory marks, the marks you made on the stand are the marks you use for the life of that motor. No one answered you, so I did. MSD has timing tape that is very useful in this endeavor. Good luck.
You said that this is basic. It isn't. It's a great explanation for something very advanced. Thank you!
makes perfect sense now, thanks
(side note: DON'T DO DRUGS, I used to know this information )
By far the most informative timing video I’ve watched, I actually understand this whole process...excellent job buddy!
Awesome, thank you!
Curious how much total timing is safe for sbc 355, 10:1 comp, stock Vortec heads, cast rods and hyper pistons, ring gap .025, Vortec V3 supercharger with 650 cfm blowthrough carb with 6# boost at 6000 rpm, 93 gas with octane boost to 96. Currently have homemade stop limiting distributor advance to 20 degrees to be safe. Octane boost turns plugs orange, so it’s hard to read them. Thanks for all the good sbc videos. My next build will be LS, so watching the LS videos with interest.
Thank you for the in-depth explanation on timing. I was trying to explain timing and advance timing to a co-worker and he just couldn't get it. I've been wrenching for over 45 years and understand it but, as you know, to explain it to a non-mechanically intelligent man isn't the easiest thing to do. It seams that every time you say something you have to stop cuz you keep falling into that rabbit-hole of inexperience. I had him watch this and now I think he understands timing (maybe) lol Now I have to try to explain how the vacuum advance distributor works to him (Thanks a lot) lol - later
Great information perfect for my build issues I'm dealing with today. Can I duplicate the Total Timing using an old timing light which does not allow advanced timing settings ? Thank you in advance
Absolutely, hands down best video on timing I’ve seen. So well described in detail . If you don’t understand timing now you should just move on to knitting 🧶 lol
Awesome, thank you!
Thanks a bunch!! I have been out of the loop and did not pay attention to timing light technology. Technology is cool!!
I learned so much so quick. Quickest 27 minutes of my life
That last part with the strobe was so great! I really hoped it would work!
I understood the basics of timing. Now I understand timing. Thank you.
Your welcome
This an awesome channel with great content. I’ve been learning a lot from you and I appreciate it. This is the best explanation with the best analogy.
I was wondering if you or any of your viewers has a good recommendation for non-detergent motor oil. Thanks and subscribed!
Outstanding explaination! A spark in any given cylinder at 3000 rpm is every 25 seconds! wow!!!!
how much momentum in the crank assembly does the rotation have on the timing? does the rpm of the rotation assembly have an effect on advancing the timing. Never mind I watched the whole video and you answered the questions
Outstanding...never stop these tutorials....thank you!!!
Thanks you
Well said kind Sir: I would like to add some distributor info. I found light grease to be OK on distributor weights & springs But not OK at all on the shaft or better said the inside of the top shaft. Light oil, singer sewing machine type, or 3 in 1 oil works. Then if the Rotor is loose, a small amount of lightweight body putty from your finger to the top inside of the metal shaft- then put the rotor on Quickly and let sit till it sets up. It has stayed snug for 6 six years and did pry out. good Luck, Nick Wiese
OK, old 2-stroke motorcycle tuner here. Build many 2-strokes. Almost all have you set timing at 1 ~ 1.8 mm before TDC. Depends on serious race motor with high idle, maybe 2 ~ 2.5 mm before TDC. Once I left the automotive world and started dinking with 2-stroke go fast bikes, it all became more clear. Does not matter if it's degrees or piston position in a measurable scale, it's all the same ... Just curious, what is the actual piston travel in inches or mm for a 350 SBC at initial timing ?? My guess is it's about 1 mm or so ...
I'M GLAD I TOOK TIME TO WATCH THIS,I HAVE BEEN SETTING THE DIST IN AT 0 TDC AND NOW I'M LEARNING IT SHOULD BE ANYWHERE FROM 6 TO 12 DEGREES BEFORE TDC.THIS SHOULD BE A GAME CHANGER FOR ME. NEXT QUESTION IS WITH A HIGH PERFORMANCE MOTOR 383 STROKER MOTOR HOW MUCH ADVANCE SHOULD I SET IT AT ?
A sincere thank you, professor.
Excellent session. You're a good teacher. Your analogies are great!
I appreciate that!
You son of a gun, if I knew this 30 years ago I could have won more races. THANKS...
oh yea. do you know the total timing on the 383 stroker? I'm curious to know. because I would like to have a idea where to start. without inching up from zero. I would really like some dyno time to really get the timing mapped out. also do you have any experience with nitrous oxide? I built my engine with the intent of running a 200+/- shot. but probably just 100-150 shot if at all. and how much timing to take out. with n.o.s. I have mls head gaskets forged everything. head studs, main studs
4 bolt main. and a comp cams n.o.s. cam. any advice on tuning
NA start at 30 degrees for every 50 shot pull 3 to 4 degrees
Great Video Thank you. Quick question: I have a 85 Chevy 305 that was recently rebuilt and I essentially got for free. I'm going to be using it in a drag racing application (street class). It has stock 305 heads with a Edelbrock Performer EPS and a 650 Holley carb. HEI distributor with vacuum advance. It seems to run super rich, it will choke you out and i'm getting these slight little pops at idle that sound like hiccups. We tried a different carb, same symptoms. If the timing is set too far advanced could that cause these symptoms? What kind of timing would be a good starting point for an engine like this? Thanks in "advance"
So do you check the total timing with the vacuum line on to the vacuum advance ? I have a 352 CI and it does not have harmonic balancer, how critical is that, or why it does not have one, this is on my 1966 for F 100 pickup truck, thanks in advance Leo
great video as always. a video on reading spark plugs would be awesome. like for timing, detonation, heat range etc. Thanks!
On my new jeep 4.7 stroker running a MSD dist with Vac advance and MSD control box,Ford 2150 carb and no other computer I had to advance the timing to about 20 BTDC initial just to get it to start.Than during the cam break in the headers were turning red so I stepped it up to about 45 total timing at 3000 RPM.The glowing stopped and I finished the break in.The motor starts good and runs great at this timing but I have only 13 in vacuum (not enough for brake booster).Is this due to the timing? I live at 7500 ft altitude also. Am I going to hurt anything at this high timing?Water temp is below 200 and I can always put in a vacuum pump.Cam specs are 213/220 @50 .484in/.507 ex113LSA. Heads are ported also.Running ethanol free gas with Lucas octane boost. Thank you for the very informative video's.Its hard to find help with old school builds and you explain things great.
I watched one of your other vids,may have been on an ls engine,but you set the crank 10° before you dropped the distributor? difference between ls and say a "78" 350?
Need.help..if my harmonic balancer does.noy return.gets stuck.paused..did I installed it wrong..or something else? Maybe carburetor issue.dk..great video.
I have been watching some guys spraying their rocker arms and lifters with B-12 cleaner without taking the head off to get rid of lifter knocking.. If that is done, when the B-12, is there problem when it runs down into the engine does it damage the engine or does it run straight to the oil pan?
Very glad there's good instruction even after much time has passed, you know for me slow people,thanks dude !
question having issues ge/ing 389 motor to fire over cold. 30• dwell. engine cranks well. but difficult firing over. squirting gas in carb helps
I have a set of 041 heads on my 71 Camaro 355. Long story but they only have 7k miles on them from OEM - screw in studs and guide plates. The car is running great but I am wondering about the ex valve seats and unleaded fuel - should I do something? Will the ex valves sink into the heads? How long might they last? Also do you have the flow numbers for them?
Hello John, I just subscribed to your video channel. I find your videos very educational and informative. I do have a question, I have a 390 engine in a 65 T-Bird that is smoking at all speeds. It was suggested that all I would need is a bearing and ring kit, I've never heard of such a thing. So would it be beneficial to me to invest in such a kit?
I really does depend on the condition of the cylinders I wouldn't recommend buying any parts until the engine is torn down and inspected
Really enjoy the channel I have learned alot of things just watching. Having a issue with my 350 85 gmc c2500 after setting total timing it sound like the bottom end. But the rattle goes away if I just set timing back to initial timing
You mentioned BBC needing more ignition timing. I have a 454 with a stock bottom end, mild cam, intake, and performer heads. The carb is a 750cfm. The distributor is vacuum advance. What would my initial and total timing numbers look like?
don't worry about initial it ends up where it ends up set total on that engine I would start with 35 total and work my way up 2 degrees at a time when it starts to ping back it down a couple and you are there it does depend on what heads and compression ratio you have so not all BBC will be the same that's why you gotta play with it to see what it likes some heads have quicker burn time than others depending on chamber size and piston top combination
Good explanation for the novice.
Glad it was helpful!
I'd love to see do a video on how octane allows for timing advance and the correlation between flame travel and flash point with the higher octane and how it creates a lean burn condition. Poeple seem to be confused about the higher the octane the lower the flash point (colder) which in some cases creates heat because there's not enough fuel. I don't seem to have enough patients to explain effectively those things and why you can run more timing the higher the octane. Love you vids and so do my boys. Keep up to good work brother!
Oh forgot throw in compression. Thanks!
And since we're old school why not throw in the dual point distributors!
This may sound elementary but, I have my engine all together new cam all that. Install the distributor. Where do I set my rotor(timing) at ? Spec for idle is 8 btdc so for cam break-in do I set it about 8 btdc or straight up 0 degrees. Just clarifying...
Great video for us beginners, thank you very much, I needed something like this to get a better understanding
Im struggling timing my truck. It calls for 32 degrees at 2500 rpm of total advance timing. Now its a performance motor. Should i be using any of the ports on the carb such as ported or manifold? Or should I just plug it and get the timing to 32 at 2500 rpm without any ports?
What timing light brand do you use?
i like the way you explain things. yours choice of words make it all flow together nicely
I have a quick question I understand timing but I've Been Told keep it on keep it off the vacuum advance hose when doing initial timing I understand the weights in the distributor then what is the purpose of the vacuum advance
the Vac advance if for just off idle to keep the engine from stumbling when you first touch the throttle set the timing with it un hooked and blocked off
So the mechanics of setting the total timming!? Does one advance the timming at idle then check the new advance or is the distributer being rotated to add the timming by hand at the same time the throttle is being held at 3000 rpm or so where ever the timing is all in? Thanks for this video it was very helpful for the concept but it seems like there's not a great video on you tube that describes how to add the timming physically. Thanks again any advice would be helpful on how this is done
The distributor advances it's self as timing increases just below the rotor there are weights that spin as RPM increases the weights cause the timing to advance the distributor has the ability to cause the rotor to advance with RPM, so no you are not moving the distributor you set initial timing at idle and the timing will automatically advance with rpm it is built into the distributor
You explain things real well, and that was an easy to understand and comprehensive explanation of timing and how to set base and total timing. You should explain the scale on that very nice damper, that most people don't have, how to use that instead of advance feature light that most people don't have (including myself😂) and how to make your own 30° mark on a stock damper, to use the timing cover scale and set your total timing. The circumference of my damper ÷ 360 = 1/16". 30 of those makes 1 7/8". So it was easy to accurately make that mark on my damper. Now using the scale on my timing cover, I can easily and accurately set my total timing to 33°, or whatever, using my idiot light😂
Can you do a video on distributor on 3.8 rear wheel having a hard time setting it thanks for your knowledge
thank you for this video i been struggling to figure out my timing on my 283..... your the best
Great video, when setting total timing, that is with vacuum advance connected, correct ?
Yes
Thanks for putting this one out so quickly!! Awesome video as always!
your welcome
For the sake of time and confusion please watch the following video " Rough running 390 ford". It shows the problem I am having. I have done the following; coil, distributor
cap, plug wires, TDC check, rebuilt the the FE1406 carburetor. It still
won't start and stay running. can you please help.
I got a 400m Ford running 12.5/1 compression 560 lift cam what determins we're to set advanced timing how do I figure that out
I own a 84 camaro. It has a manual transmission, non ecm controlled carburated 350. I put the xenon strobe light and i dial it to 8 degrees and it does nothing?
Great video..very educational..Thanks for uploading.
Thanks, that's the best explanation that I've found
So am working on a 1995 suburban 454 no high performance or anything the air cleaner says 4* adv is this what I want as my idle timing ? Is this my total timing ? Thanks
That is at idle
Thanks this was much needed, very good illustrations!
What would you say would be the best timing for a 350 sbc with open chamber 76cc heads with 8.5 compression. It's a race engine and have to be basically stock? Since they are such a large chamber head and low compression and is revving high every lap would you consider going over your suggested 35 degree max?
35 or 36 is best you can play around with it but you will most likely find going higher won't help performance
Question, I'm planning on replacing my intake manifold gaskets on a 79 Chevy k20. Have slight coolant leak on passenger side of intake. I'm afraid of messing up my timing when I pull distributor out. Right now engine runs like a top, fires right up every time. I want to keep it running that way once I'm done and have everything back together. I heard of guys marking distributor and marking intake manifold to keep timing right on, is this method a good idea or would retiming the motor be best option?
i was wondering about your thoughts on wether to use full maifold vacuum or timed port vacuum going to your vacuum advance canistor. i have heard about a 50 /50 preference on these options. i personally have always used the timed port on my holley for the vacuum advance because they do not pull any vacuum at idle. i have seen a number of guys on hear saying you will gain alot of performance if i was to change to full manifold vacuum.what do you think ? any help would be appreciated. Don
try it both ways and see what works best
What indicators do you use to know that you have not only good enough timing for the engine to run, but the best possible timing for power and efficiency?
Cam degree
After watch a bunch of video on youtube finally i understand igition timing on this video really thanks alot sir :)
You Bet
The camera doesn't want to pick up the strobe of the timing light because of the frame rate set by the camera is not in sync with the strobe. If the camera is set at 60 hz (60 frames per second) and the strobe light illuminates between frames, the camera won't be able to pick it up.
Amazing video. Hands down best and easiest explanation I've seen. What would you recommend total timing wise on a 1976 Corvette with the L48 5.7L 350?
32
wow. impressed Sir, thanks for your efforts. nicely explained.
I'm gonna be as knowledgeable as this fella when I reach his age in prolly 30 years I'm hoping! It's weird how half the older dudes or napa fellas I ask how to do something when I'm building an engine, they either tell me something I know is a bad idea or won't work or I listen to them and it fucks something up lol. If 3 TH-cam fellas explain it good and they are all saying basically the same thing then I roll with it.
Does the curve stop advancing at 3000rpm??
I have known this, but what I am not sure of is how far up the rpm range the timing keeps advancing the curve. It looks like in your video the curve stops advancing around 3k rpm. Does it advance beyond that? And do modern electronic ignition engines advance the curve clear up to say 6k rpm?
The timing really does not advance above about 3000 rpm's on most engines it has been discovered that advancing the timing above this RPM shows no real benefit
Great video. Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Got a question what is a good timing set for a sbc 383 stroker with a compression ratio 10 :4 : 1
You are absolutely incredible.
Thank you Sir.
I bet you say that to all the boys
what should the total timing be on a 1979 351W on 87 regular gas? it has the fallowing, motor craft 2150 2bbl on a 1969 iron 2bbl intake all stock except NO smog junk, has aftermarket fox body chines sort tube headers 2.5 true duel exhaust from heders to tail pipe with h pipe and c4 transmission. all so what rpm should it all be in by ? the destributor is set up using the 10l slot or 10 distributor degrees in the centrifugal advance slot. right now i am runing it with the base timing at 2 degrees btc + 19 degrees vaccum advance on full manifold vacuum or 21 btc at idle. douse this sound right or should i change it?
The Vaccume advance should not be changing timing at idle you should be a 6 degrees at idle and your VA should have no vacuum signal until you hit the throttle your hose is hooked up to the wrong port it needs to be above the throttle plate
I've set base timing before at 0 degrees like the emissions sticker under the hood says it should be set at on this engine, (LB9 and LO3 engines have different ignition timings as I recall) doesn't the electronic spark advance on the distributor automatically compensate for ignition advance? It seems to run fine all the way through to 5000 RPM which the engine is capped for anyway, and only will run funky if the engine is pushed while it's still warming up, with a lot of valve float and rich mixture of course. I know the EST has to be disconnected in order to set base timing because the electronic module will continuously push spark advance even at idle, thus giving an inaccurate base timing if it's not disconnected first. I just wanna make sure I have the right degree of advance for running on 87 octane and a motor that's not developing huge amounts of compression even with hundreds of thousands of miles on it.
If you have an OBD 2 computer controlling timing it's true you set it at 0 and the advance curve is mapped into the ECU the engine in the video has no computer and timing must be set manually
Oh this is OBD 1 since it's an '87-'95 SBC, but it does have an HEI electronic distributor as stock, that not only controls spark advance, but injector pulse as well. If the 4 pin connector isn't plugged in, the injectors will not fire at all. Hopefully I won't have to swap out the distributor when switching over to a TPI intake, and it'll control injector pulse as normal even with 8 injectors to monitor.
OBD 1 controls timing also
Yep, although OBD 1 is very rudimentary, by the time OBD 2 came out engines already have switched over to coil packs, or coil on plug design, allowing the computer to make finer adjustments to ignition timing according to each cylinder's needs.
When you advanced timing on light to 30, is that just to demo that at higher rpm you hit the zero timing mark? Just want to make sure you didn’t have to manually advance the distributor itself. Thx.
no the distributor advances the timing on its own
what kind of timing light do you recommend?