How the weighbridge system works and why Vettel was a naughty boy
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 พ.ย. 2018
- Vettel got himself into a bit of trouble during Q2 in the Brazilian Grand Prix when he rushed through the weighbridge procedure and broke the scales.
How does the weighbridge system work? Why are cars randomly called up in the middle of an intense qualifying session? Was Vettel in the wrong?
Let's delve in!
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I feel like if he had a horn he’d have been laying on it like a new yorker when the scrutineers were in front of him
Hey, I'm racin' eah!
damn, I didn't know the electric motor from the hybrid system could be used to restart an F1 car's engine, thats actually sick.
I discovered it playing Assetto Corsa
@@andre_star7776 in Assetto Corsa cars can't actually turn off
At 1:00, didn't they notice the absence of the halo?
Maybe chain bear was rushing to get this animation done
its the new translucent halo
Yes. It's there, but as long as nobody see's it, there is no reason to complain that it "looks horrible".
Charlie will ban chainbear because that car is not safe enough😅
I did, actually!
It's quite amazing that all this high quality content is free for us to watch.
Kinda unbelievable
Having in mind that Vettel did not set a time, there is no need to weight the car.
Maybe this would be a nice update on the rules. They should raffle who would be weighted after setting a lap time, not when comming into or out of the pits, as the driver/car comming may have no time set, as Vettel did.
It is nice to see at least one man with working brain.
Yeah I pretty much agree with this
Even if that was the case some drivers would try to subvert the rules by doing what could be considered a ‘cheeky’ flying lap and hoping not to get called for a weighing. As it is random, some would get away with it.
A better idea may be to weigh all cars prior to Q1. After they exit the pits they are subject to parc ferme regs. To ensure that no-on tries to bend the rules, each garage could have a steward watching the car at all times. Sure the costs will increase slightly but that is a small price to pay compared to the punishments for breaking the rules.
But tlhow then can they give advantages to Hamilton, if they can't manipulate others?
asbood112 That’s a little contradictory. Like you said, cars are under parc fermé rules after they leave their garage for the first time in Q1. So weighing them before the session starts defeats the purpose of stewarding, as teams could still make changes to the car between being weighed and the start of the session (be that an hour or 15 mins gap). As Chain Bear said, the risk of the weighbridge is enough for teams to judge whether or not to a) change strategy and b) run an underweight car. If we wanted to weigh every single car during Qualifying with ease, we’d have to go back to hour long single session Qualifying, and no one wants that. And having a steward for every single garage sounds like a good idea, but that’s 20 stewards over 20 garages, rather than the stewards bunched together on the weighbridge. It sounds good on paper, but having to move 20 “portable” weighbridges wouldn’t make sense because it would occupy much needed space in a relatively narrow garage already. The system right now is the best system we have to keep it fair. Everyone has the same chance of being called in, and if Ferrari wanted to avoid that scenario, they should have sent their cars out on Soft tyres in the first place.
Nice explanation.
Thanks for sharing.
Does anyone know what was it that was loose between his legs yet?
a screw
The pilot's shaft
an extra bit of lead
a screw from his head went loose. That explains why he did this..
poo
How are you not on TV explaining the rules through the F1 weekend. Informative and easy to understand. We'll done!
Always a clear,concise video explaining the details and technicalities. Keep up the good work Chain Bear.
you deserve an award for your brilliant videos honestly, keep up the Great Work you and your Team!
Music stops at 7:40, might wanna check that out
might be youtube automatic copyright-strike, which automatically turns off sound of a part of a video if it detects that it has audio that is protected by comyright-rules.
No I just mucked it up cause I'd been up too long and my brain died a death . Oops
@@chainbear well i thought you were extraodinary quick with posting the video. Good job
@@chainbear Hi, what soft you use for this animation? It's very effective!
Creepypasta time
Awesome vid Chain Bear. Once again an in-depth analysis of a relevant event that most fans don't know the rulings for, including myself. Thank you once again for your contribution to the F1 community, you're a legend!
You're amazing for explaining this right away!! Thank you sooooo much
As always you clips are informative and well structured. Thanks
Brilliant video again Chain Bear - Thank you!!
You do a great job explaining in all of your videos. Kudos!
Spot on video as always. F1 isn't the easiest sport to understand. The rules are broad and complex, especially the technical aspects, which means many fans don't understand fully understand some incidents. This leads to frequent accusations of bias or inconsistency - which isn't to say that the FIA is immune to these, just not as much as some people think. This puts more onus on commentators to accurately communicate these rules and their interpretation, which often varies. What I'm basically trying to say is, for being a reliable and effective communicator, thanks Chain Bear.
is a video on the blue flag rule coming up with regards to the verstappen ocon incident?
no ocon was unlapping himself
Ocon, according to the rules, could have passed Verstappen if he had the pace. Whether he should have in that situation is where the controversy lies.
you only get a blue flag, when a faster car is going to lap you. in that case ocon was faster than verstappen. so no blue flags
Guardian of the Blind review the video : ocon got flashing blue flag , one on the left (pit exit) and one on 2 turn
A backmarker can unlap themself if they are faster, I.E. softer tyres, fresher tyres, better chassis. If you got blue flagged everytime you were about to get lapped, you literally wouldn't be able to unlap yourself
thank you chain bear, I didnt know that the car is supposed to be pushed onto the weightbridge and not driven on by the driver....
it was pushed onto the bridge, but the car started rolling down the hill. the stewards were standing well away from the car waiting what's going to happen.
Thank you. As soon as I saw the incident, I was really waiting for your explanation as I have no clue what's the waybridge and what's used for
Another clearly and logically explained video on the gobbldygook laws of F1. Thanks, CB.
Excellent analysis and very well stated!
i am seeing this video once again after seeing it on Autosport channel again man! just to help you. i like your vids that much. great job.
The amount of patients it took to wait to watch it on your Chanel
could you do an explanation about how the whole F1 team works? like their jobs and relationships with the drivers and other team members
Well done video!!! Thank you!
Thanks for this awesome explanation!!
Fascinating, love your channel, subscribed
In all fairness, he broke the rules. Almost struck a track official (albeit at 3 mph). He’s lucky all he got was a fine and a reprimand.
K1dPhresh1 - I agree... they need to make the punishment the same as it is for being underweight, starting from the pit lane or if it were particularly egregious, disqualification from the race.
orion khan that would definitely make anyone think twice about it. I get it, he wanted to get on the Supersofts and get a lap in before the rain, but rules are rules. Especially when it comes to safety.
@@user-zv8qg1co4z the video explained this. He could be driving a lap with a car that's like 50 kg's too light
The fine was too low same when teams get fined. A few thousands is nothing to the drivers at the top or top teams
@@owlaracing1106 I mean 100-200 bucks for speeding isn't much to most people with a full time job, but we don't want to pay it. Same with F1 Drivers and fines. The fine he got is low (I agree it's kinda low) but money is money. No one wants to pay fines.
Watching this again after seeing the autosport one, your video's deserve the views :)
Excellent video. Bravo.
I clicked even though I had already seen it on autosport. Keep up the good content!
Great vid as always bear
Gutted I had to watch this on Autosport before, but your channel gets the like!
Very eloquent explanation as ever👌🏻
6:51 I know what you did there...😂
Spot on
?
DUpanda ShAN “Bear” in mind👌🏻 (excuse my silly sense of humor)
Brilliantly explained.
Extremely good video. Love ur content.
and why did he music abruptly stop ?
whew, I didn’t watch the quali, so I thought that Vettel was caught in having a lighter car instead of what happened 😅
wow... this was good...
can you explain how hamilton did not get a penalty during the qualies.
but
vettel got a penalty for blocking sainz in austrian grand prix qualies
He didn't get a penalty because he didn't impede a flying lap if you are on about the Williams incident. Both cars were on an out lap, Hamilton saw a car approaching fast and assumed it was someone on a flying lap he hadn't been told about, and tried to get off the racing line. Unfortunately, the exact moment he did that the Williams went the same way. Had it been a flying lap, he would have got a penalty for it.
@@dougsxoom616 what about Raikkonen's lap, blocked by Hamilton? And is it or not dangerous driving?
@@dariogaeta94, that one is a little less clear cut. My personal opinion is that he was sloppy with getting out of the way but he did not cause a hindrance. So no penalty.
He moved off the racing line, granted a little later than ideal, and right up against the put exit line. He left more than enough space on the right hand side for Raikkonen to get through. Raikkonen moved left just after him and went the long way round. Don't know why, but Kimi has a history of trying to grab every bit of a tow he can. How do we know Kimi wasn't hindered and why his move behind Lewis may have been intentional? His DRS remained open and he kept his foot in the throttle. If the car in front is genuinely in the way, you'd expect him to lift off or touch the brakes, but there was no sign of that.
So yes, Lewis wasn't as switched on perhaps as you'd expect, but did he block Kimi's flying lap? Well evidence suggests Kimi was not impeded and his driving was intentional.
I would guess that is the conclusion the Stewards came too as well, and Kimi has also said he wasn't blocked by Lewis, so, yeah, there's that too.
And don't forget when Hamilton whas driving thrue pit entry but then in last sec he drive over two wite Line and gras. Why didnt get a penalty?
@@andreasnyh5740 or that time Vettel moved twice to block Hamilton into the braking zone in Russia and didn't get a penalty for it. Or that time when Vettel passed Vergne in Brazil under yellow flags and didn't get a penalty for it which gifted him his third title, instead of it being Alonso's third title. Or there's that time in Bahrain when Ferrari didn't get a penalty for releasing Raikkonen with a loose wheel. Or there's that time Vettel deliberately crashed his car into someone else and didn't get banned from the World Championship or even disqualified from that race for dangerous driving.
We could do this all day, and for every Hamilton or Mercedes conspiracy you want to drag up, I can pull a Ferrari one up in response, just to prove it goes both ways.
Thanks for explaining!!! Now i know what had happened
How does the weight limit work if they damage the car? Say I destroy my front wing, and this makes me underweight? Is this a problem?
Doubt that matters since that would be an obvious disadvantage and can't be abused.
Thanks man🤗
Any plans to make a video about the Ocon/Verstappen incident? It would be a good chance to go over the rules regarding backmarkers unlapping themselves, and how far past you must be ahead of other drivers in order to give them room.
1:43 is an interesting picture because there is a haas team member working on the red bull car
On the right front wheel (left front from camera perspective) the brakes seem to be smoking so it seems he was just helping out by blowing air in the brake duct.
Reminds of another video of Vettel asking his team to help out a tooro rosso I belive with brakes on fire
It adds another bit of strategy. They knew the risk or if they didn't now they do but I think that its too fun when things like this do happen to get rid of.
This channel is a necessity for f1 fans
Love the video but I have one question. Typically, how many cars are called to the weighbridge during quali??
There were 10 total in Brazil. That's about average I think.
Shaun Stephens thanks for the reply! For all my years following F1, I never even knew this was a thing!
Love the hard work you put into the videos! Still waiting for an answer to the question! If Chain Bear remembers :)
Thank you soooo much for explaining that. I didn’t know why vettel had such a hefty fine but now I understand why.
You should rotate the back tyre by 180°, to give the tyre manufacturer better chance to shine! 0:58 and other places...
Awesome 👌🏻
When is the merch coming?!?!
How does the author of these videos create the animations? What software is used? I'd like to try something similar.
Love the title
A good change could be to inform the team of the impending stop on the weighbridge - as the car leaves the pit, that way they have time to factor it into the strategy
No, like he said in the video, it prevents people from collecting rubber.
But in the mean time hamilton almost launches sirotkin in the air but gets away with it
Nice one FIA
Anyone know why they didn't even investigate it?
@@smt2542 Because the incident didn't happen on Sirotkin's hot lap, but his out lap.
@@bobbob5255 Totally agree with that, but that's the FIA for you. We can only be grateful that nobody got seriously injured.
It wasn’t his hot lap Sirotkin decided he wanted to passed everyone and get a head start by going full speed around a blind corner, while everyone else on their out lap was driving normally. No on could have predicted him doing that
Silly @FauneRs, don’t you know that *Hamilton* is exempt from the rules? He *_never_* gets called for even the most blatant and egregious rules violations because *_reasons._*
I think between training/warming laps they can and should inspect all cars during session. To be fair, I would volunteer for weighting my team's car. As all they should be doing.
Is there a reason they dont just embed piezo sensors in a select part of the pit lane to weigh? A lot harder to break
I may be very late, but did nobody notice the Haas guy with the heat gun on the Red Bull at 1:37?
Any chance of giving us your view on drs regarding the max-occon incident. Should drs be available to backmarkers to unlap themselves? Thanks
I probably won't go into this. Though maybe in future I'll do a mini-sode after controversial incidents to give my (not particularly valuable) opinion! We'll see!
Tbh DRS should be available for backmarkers are it makes it easier for them to unlap or claw back time lost being lapped
What about the fuel weight? Ending of the qualifying the cars have less weight due to less fuel and at beginning they have more weight. How do they calculate that?
The minimum weight is still the minimum weight. At no point can your car with driver weigh less, so you have to make sure the car is heavy enough with an empty tank
Would a team gain an advantage in wet conditions (when the car is grip limited not power limited) by increasing the weight of the car? More weight = more grip so as long as the weight does not cause the car to tip into power limited, surely it would allow a faster lap time?
not exactly, a higher downforce setup would help, but just adding weight to make the car heavier would make them way harder to control
more weight means that the car is harder to stop and turn, even if it has a bit more grip
Wish you would have brought up DRic's idea and if you thought it would be good.
What’s the point of the weight restriction? Do they want to keep the cars below a certain top speed for safety reasons?
I reckon they should make it that you can only be weighed if you set a lap time.
That must hurt for Vettel.
In case anyone wondered, the system consists of a sensor in the entry to pit lane connected to a computer running an algorithm with a $RAND function in it. It doesn’t know which car it is or which lap it’s on and *because* of that relative _simplicity,_ it’s an effective countermeasure to teams trying to cheat the system. Adding the ability for it to know which car it is and which lap it’s on would not only add massive complexity to something that already works, but require someone to then program some kind of *_”weight”_* towards who should be called in and at what times (as in being more likely to pip someone who’s set a lap vs. someone who has yet to do so), which defeats the purpose of it as a deterrent since anyone can be called at anytime...
Absolute bollocks. The timing box must be able to identify the car and you know if it's on an outlap or not by whether or not it's crossed the line at least once. This "massive complexity" you're talking about is changing "if (rand() < some_value)" to "if (rand() < some_value && this_cars_laps != 0)". Seems like an incredibly difficult change.
@@danielnewby2255 , yeah, and then watch the people bitch and moan because their favourite driver had his last run ruined because the random calculator picked on him because he had set a fast lap and it must be an FIA fix to gift the other guy pole position, or some shit like that. Why change it from "purely random" to "random, but with a hint of driver selection"?
Over the years of watching F1 I have seen every team at some point get caught out by the weigh bridge. I remember seeing Button have a quali session ruined by it because he couldn't get out to do a flying lap. What I haven't seen before is the bullshit people are coming up with just because it was Vettel or Ferrari who got caught out this time.
@@dougsxoom616 There's no hint of driver selection there friend. I don't know why it's hard to understand "don't flag cars that aren't on a flying lap." You're not setting your QT on an out lap.
@@danielnewby2255 and the only way to program it to know if a driver has done a flying lap or not is to input car numbers, car numbers mean drivers are identified and teams are known to the programme, which takes me back to my original - why give people something to complain about trying to fix a system that isn't actually broken? You know why I say it's not broken? Because this wasn't an issue until it happened to a Ferrari. No one has complained about the fact that a dozen other cars got randomly selected during the season, or possibly even more, but because it happens to a Ferrari once at a bit of an inopportune moment, oh hell, let's rewrite the rulebook because its clearly unfair, deeply biased and it of course completely ruined Vettel's chance to be on pole position didn't it.
@@danielnewby2255 Then that sensor needs to be connected to the rest of the system so it can know "this_cars_laps". Chances are, it's not connected to the rest of the systems and just goes... Oh a car! rand()
yes he broke the rules, but what was not mentioned here was that the FIA guy in front of the car made a motion that suggested he could drive forward, even if that is not how it normally happens, i think this was brought into consideration when the stewards made their decision and gave him some reprieve
FIA could just make one rule for Vettel and another for everyone else. That would suit Vettel.
How many more videos are going to be on auto sport?
0:54 "Manoeuvrable"
Wow, never knew that was spelled differently in the UK, as opposed to maneuverable in the US.
All they have to do is crash into the wall in the pit lane, destroying the front wing, and making the car lighter (so you could blame it on the wing). Expensive, but it works. Comment if there is some rule against this, I would be quite interested to know if there was.
Do views on your channel suffer since partnering with Autosport? I always watch them there first, but then rarely watch them again here. Genuinely interested.
Very probably!
Could you take a look on the verstappen vs ocon insedent as well? Many people say it’s 50/50
Eh, I wasn't planning on it. I can see opinions on both sides and it's certainly not one way or the other. I'd say Ocon held significantly more of the blame, mind.
certainly not 100* one way or the other, I mean
You probably right I’m just feel like it is always verstappen in these last few races. There is always two sides of the story. And that’s racing. Anyway,
Tanks for replying
man rally racing has sure changed
Great video as ever! I do have just a tiny little nitpick (oh boy I’m being THAT guy), the graph on the right around 0:34: I believe the F=m*a equation is a linear inverted relation but was drawn non-linear. If I’m incorrect: any explanations as to why would be appreciated!
It's not 'cause we're looking at the dependent variable "a" in terms of variable "m". So the equation is a = F/m so the curve follows a y=1/x curve. Not linear.
Chain Bear F1 Oh my, you are correct and I’ve learned that being THAT guy past my bed time turns me into a babbling fool. Thanks for responding and forgive the foolishness!
Decreasing the weight of the cars would actually make them way safer in crashes right? I really don´t get why f1 cars need to weigh that much. Decelerating a heavier car is much trickier than decelerating lighter ones, so crash barriers wouldn´t need to be that thick, making different racing tracks possible. At least that´s what I thing and of couse I´m not an expert by any means. Wouldn´t it also make overtaking much easier, since acceleration would increase? I think racing in lighter F1 cars could solve some problems, and make f1 more interesting to watch. But what are the downsides of lowering the weight limit? Please tell me, I would love to know some of your guys thoughts!
The way I see it there's no point in weighing a car that didn't set a lap time, what gains can you possibly have from doing about 70% of a lap with an underweight car.
Doesn't matter how much track time you have, if your car is illegal then it's illegal. I remember a while back someone in the nhra top fuel dragsters had an illegal intake under the supercharger a d when his engine exploded he went to cover it with his gloves but they still got in a ton of trouble. He lost the race and destroyed an engine but still got penalized.
maybe because the car would still be underweight when he actually sets the banker lap time?
@Peters6221 top fuel dragsters explode all the time. They're pushing 10,000-12,000 hp. It happens. He got penalized for the illegal intake manifold. Last I checked F1 drivers don't get penalized for having an engine failure.
@@mxer4life25 not quite. When Haas was penalised for the floor on Grosjeans car, FIA knew about it but only took action when Renault filed a complaint. And Magnussen didnt get any penalty for running the same floor because no complaint was filed (Renault had nothing to gain from that)
Ranger - the system used is very simple... a sensor sees a car coming into pit lane and a $RAND function in an algorithm decides whether the car gets a red light or not... it doesn’t know which car it is or what lap it’s on as that would add significant complexity to a necessary and understood process. It’s such an effective countermeasure for teams trying to cheat the system *_because_* it’s such a simple system...
As fast as vettel getting off the weight bridge
Great title lol
Wait, if the top 10 sets fastest times in Super softs, and ir heavily rains when the race starts, they still have to start with ss tyres?
No only if it's dry
There is a TH-cam video on how Vettel break the weighbridge, and it is not like simply drive off it. You can see the weighbridge plates shoot back at the Scrutineers. Damn dangerous.
My boy done lost it
I subscribed
Would tire wear ever confuse anything? Could a team who pushed their weight to the lightest allowed be screwed over by tires losing weight?
What happens If you lose parts during the race?
llHawkll fuel probably helps. In qualifying, the teams send the cars out with as low a fuel quantity as they can to maximize power. I also think that the FIA post race weight is not as high as to account for possible damage.
in the bad old days the rally teams would get a lighter car to the minimum weight by filling the fire extinguisher or rollbar tubes made of exhaust tubing with lead shot..
As much as yes, maybe the weighbridge procedure maybe could be updated... The fact remains that Vettel not only broke the procedure (and the scales), he attempted to hurry the stewards and seemingly tried to force one to act faster by moving the car whilst a steward *was still standing in front of it and had been repeatedly signalled for engine shutoff* . That's just dangerous behaviour and in that context the fine he recieved looks a bit lenient if anything.
havent i seen that video before...? i am confused
Applause!!!
finally someone english speaking who actually says vettel and not vetell
Blame Coulthtard, he used to call him that (probably still does) when commentating. Always irked me that.
Oh, yeah, it's actually fettel but never mind.
Ooh someone from different part of the world with a different accent pronounces it slightly differently than it should....why care....not all languages have the same sounds....I don't get why People keep going on and on about this....
So they say verssta(/e)ppen instead of verstappen
Kivyat instead of kvyat
Ricciardo instead of Riccardo
Vetell instead of vettel
Charles leclerc instead of charles leclere
Does it take from the experience....no it really doesnt..
@@squeakybunny2776 No, it doesn't. It just helps to understand who is ignorant and intends to show no respect, and who doesn't.
@@SimoneSaviolo you realize people from different languages can't make the same sounds right??
Talking about people who can't show respect and have to demand that you pronounce their name correctly geez...
3:30 why not just have a fast less accurate scale on the approach to the weighbridge that gets the rough weight as cars drive over it at regular speed, and then if more precise measurements are needed, direct that car to the weighbridge?
U could actually invent a scale such that it can "sense the weight" of F1 car when it drives through the scale at very low speed so as to not loose time. Again I don't think aerodynamic could cheat on the weight by increasing downforce given at very low speed but u could expect the giants could invent technologies to cheat around the system as best as they can. So the best and secure method is to weigh on accurate scale with engine off.
At least he didn't come up light.
heyyyyyyyyyyyy, the music cut off abruptly in the outro. THAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THE VIDEO. If such issue is not dealt with properly I threaten to only watch chainbear on AutoSport!
jk u rock bro :P do include the song title in description, its really cool
Oi mate i've seen this video on another channel, anyone care to explain?
Notifivation squad letsgoo
Fun fact: the FIA is NOT allowed to inspect a car during qualifying when it has not yet set a time.
Rules should be equal to everybody. In 2019 and earlier even now 2021 there are some drivers who are treated differently ( better). And avoid penalties from their actions. It was in the past and is still existing. Sorry for any misatkes. Eng is not my first language
I don’t think the system works in the 3-part qualifying. It was a different story when you had a one-hour session, or weighing every car after their lap in single-lap qualifying. There have been complaints about this procedure ever since 3-part quali began in 2006, so with over 12 years of moaning, something needs to change, surely?