Excellent analysis indeed, and to do so with such good humor wins many extra points in my book (you had me laughing out loud multiple times). Thank you--you've certainly convinced me, and I will echo your sentiments whenever this comes up again (and will give you the credit you're due). I was a huge Billy Squier fan--my first rock concert was Billy at the Brendan Byrne Arena with Def Leppard opening in '82. (My friend Joey decided not to go last minute, so my Dad ended up taking me--I was in junior high school--and my Dad kept commenting about Billy's "dance moves" with a term too politically incorrect today to repeat here, but it was a running joke for years in my household). I've lived in NYC for 27 years, and have met Billy a few times. Super nice guy. It is a shame that he was tarnished in such a manner. I still love his songs. Thank you again for providing such rare insight and value. #liked&subscribed
Still am a fan, all these years later. Saw him w Def Leppard opening too! Dance moves oh no he might like... Dancing? 😅 Saw him in NYC at city winery acoustic w GE Smith. Still has it going on. And still has his moves 💚💚💚
I totally agree with you Jim. Huge Squier fan, and still am to this day. When I saw the "rock me tonight" video, it made me sick that he made it. I figured they made the video with no money! But I've seen videos just as bad, or worse, and it didn't effect me liking his music. I can think of many other bands that failed going into the 90's that were a success before that. Music changed, and if the popular artists didn't change a little bit with the times, then they struggled. When you think about it, there weren't that many that survived!
I was a teen during the 80's. Billy Squire's music video of rock me tonite wasn't unlike any other cheese worthy video at the time. I didn't even know this was a controversy until right now. This is the era of Miami Vice, using glass blocks to create art, pastel and neon clothes for men, Boy George, Andy Worholo (it was his actual name I guess the end o wasn't cool enough to keep), and practically every artist doing coke in the industry (even John Taylor bassist for Duran Duran). There is more to this story. Or this is social media trying to change history. It wasn't the video.
Look at the chiffon Plant used to wear! I never question anyone's masculinity...since when are guys so fussy about what they do and with whom...cmon now!
@@mariacullati2371 Alot of stuff today that people getting bent by, are not new. Kiss? Queen? Early Van Halen? Bowie? These are the same people who listened to these bands.
What is wrong with people? We judge an artist on a video, or what he has on, or his creative energy when he dances? Are you serious? His guitar work is fantastic and his songs so loved. Go Billy! These chumps don't deserve you!
It would never be a problem today... What a great musician shelved for no reason. I mean, Video killed a lot of radio stars unfortunately... his gesturing, flicks and flamboyance as a dude was HOT! Love the defense! 😂 I also love seeing the circular Capitol Records building 👍 Thank you for all of this historical info, never knew 😢
Wow Billy - Really well done! You could have easily moved to television. Yep, you are right about your vid being a real tough video to watch. I remember being really bummed about it. I really didn't want to believe what I was watching and I think I generally tried to push it out of my mind. This terrific video is entertaining, but I still have my questions. Regardless, I'm much older now (aren't we all!) and I'm a Conservative, but I don't care. My wife and I still listen to your music all the time. As a guitar player, I play it all the time. Love your music and agree that you should be in the R&R HOF.
Lived in L.A. at the time. Most of my friends quit listening to him once we saw that gay ass video. And you never heard anything new from him on he radio, ever. The perception that he was gay had an effect. Rob Halford was afraid of the same thing. I think his later music was just as good.
I remember the Rock Me Tonight video premier and thinking it wasn't anything unusual for the times. Billy always did have a bit of a flamboyant edge to him, but women really connected to that back then. Many still do today! As from a guys point of view, his guitar sound always had a thick rock attitude, his songs were always melodic yet rock edged enough and the lyric content was masculine enough to relate to. As for flamboyance, think about Bon Scott and look at how many masculine hetro men still praise him to this day!! Billy is like the Pete Rose of rock. He deserves better!
@@STD43 he did in short shorts, but look, I like ACDC and Bon and Billy! It was the 70s and the 80s! They were different times! The looks, the sounds, and vibes are different for each decade! There are a lot of people trying different things and cross pollination of styles. Look at Freddie Mercury, Bowie, Jagger, Steven Tyler, Motley Crue, Poison, etc! I think we've all had our moments where we look back at ourselves and wonder what we were thinking! I love music from all decades, but not all music! I'm not trying to change your opinion about my opinion, just explaining where mine was formed! We don't have to agree and that's why there is so much music and so many artists to choose from! Peace!
This is absolutely brilliant. As a huge Billy Squier fan, I appreciate the time and thought put into this. “Enough is Enough” was just a terrible album. However, his next three albums were quite good. Unfortunately, poor choices were made regarding what songs to release as singles. How were “G.O.D..” and “Stronger” not hits? And releasing “She Goes Down” over ”Facts of Life “ or ”Hands of Seduction” … not good choices. These were great songs that built on Billy's early hits, but never saw the light of radio play. Would love to see him tour with a full band one more time.
This was great. You are absolutely right; most music videos of the '80s were just as bad! Maybe we should start a petition to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame for Billy. I remember as a teenager being so excited getting MTV and then being embarrassed to watch it most of the time because the videos were asinine.
Mr. Shearer you are far more compelling than I imagined you could be. I'll have to go walk in the rain for several days and rethink my position of the video...
Why did the song rise on the charts even after the video was released? Because not everyone had MTV, and many didn't see the video and only knew of the song from radio.
Never heard about the music video or the controversy with it, but it doesn't change my mind about his music. The Stroke will always be in my top 50 favorite songs. It's a classic.
I never get comments like this. Billy was a HUGE rock star and was literally everywhere! Check out his album sales! It's just that his career fell off a cliff. Blue-collar fan base + gay (perception at least) = nose dive. I've been playing guitar for 45 years and still can't get enough of it. Billy Squier is still in regular rotation of songs to cover.
YES!!!! I've been saying this for years. "Rock Me Tonite" was also a #1 on the cred-obsessed ROCK radio chart in the summer of '84. MTV still had the video in rotation months after it had dropped OFF the Billboard Hot 100. Revisionists be damned!
MTV also played all kinds of gender-bending stuff that a segment of their viewers also loved (Culture Club, George Michael, Duran Duran, remember?). Mick Jagger & David Bowie have secured their existence in our hearts. Their careers were set in stone, and are not going to be fazed one iota by wiggling their tushies like you want attention "up there". But you never saw Keith Richards or David Gilmour or Tom Petty or even Bruce Springsteen dance like they're "bi-curious". And certainly not non-stop for 4 minutes in pastel colors. His primary audience was the working-class rockers that don't get into "that sort of thing". And why did they continue to play his song, when the video came out? Like it's going to end like a car into a brick wall? Nothing else he released could come anywhere near the top 40. Top 40 programmers avoided adding new stuff, once the backlash started taking effect. Also, the remainder of his songs that managed to chart on the low end of the Hot 100 all came out while "hair/glam metal was riding high on the charts, and well before grunge came out and swept it all off of the charts. And for the argument that he had run out of quality music to be worthy of hits, I advise you to listen to "Don't Say You Love Me" (from 1989), which charted at a mediocre #58. That song could easily stand with some of the best of his catalog, with a killer guitar riff. In the golden age of metal (late 80s/very early 90s), this should've been a solid hit, if not a BIG hit. But they wanted nothing to do with Billy, and I can only surmise it stems from this video, and the backlash against him it created.
@@screwyootube1 There was no “backlash”. He continued to chart at AOR. If his street cred was soooo compromised, rock radio wouldn’t have continued to support him, which they did. The whole thing is revisionist history. Just like this “We Built This City” is the “worst song ever” narrative. Both make for cute stories, but they’re not based in any reality.
I don’t hold any of it against him or against his music. I still rock out to it when he’s on the radio. But make no mistake. This video is 100% Billy Squier. In fact other people involved tried to tell him, tried to change it and manly it up. Billy insisted on what we see and I think it’s actually pretty obvious in how into it he was. The director wanted to remove his own name from the project because he thought it was so bad, but like I said Billy insisted. This video was the ultimate poor decision. But again I absolutely do not hold it against him. Everyone was doing cringy shit at the time. This just happened to be the most cringy of them all. Someone had to do it
@@buttercupkong Totally agree, King Of Cringe. But that's a whole other level of cringe. It's a good tune but the words are problematic. The real story about the song and the girl as told by Benny is interesting.
Pulling the video off of MTV - - made the situation - wayyy worse.. IF- they had only replaced that awful video - with a great - live concert version - in it's place for R.M.T. immediately in the same week..People would've respected it more.. and recoup lost fans
The Billy video is much worse than the Jagger/Bowie video because their video was them just being silly and having a laugh. You can tell they're goofing around. It's not meant to be taken seriously. Billy is dead serious in his video. There's no campy fun about it. No sense of humor. Much worse.
Pillar of Truth #4 is *Truth.* But here's the thing: I was around back then. I don't remember anyone saying, "That 'Rock Me Tonight' video is just terrible- I'm never listening to Billy Squier again!" In fact, honest-to-God I never even saw the "Rock Me Tonight" video at all until TH-cam.
Don't Say You Love Me would've been another hit, as least as big as Everybody Wants You, if not for Rock Me Tonite. And one big difference in Squier's moves caught on video prior to - and after - the offending video, is he usually had a guitar strapped on at the same time. All these other clips shown here tying to say he's always been "flamboyant"... He's no different from someone like David Lee Roth. Girls want to do 'em (yet they still), while guys want to be 'em. But Rock me Tonite was a 4-minute long barrage of effeminate-dancing around, not even holding a musical instrument to show SOME evidence to the contrary, of masculinity. My God, there are SO many ridiculous excuses this host puts forward that are easily disputed/disproved. Bottom line, this video is just there to argue, even though the host's merits are lame, at best, if not just straight bullshit.
I'm not really a rock person but wasn't the flamboyance what made him popular in the first place. The stroke got my attention because it seemed super controversial kind of like the pusher by steppenwolf inna gadda da vida. It stood out. Steppenwolf ran out of gas too and I never understood that. I think people just get bored with the sound. I really think it had little to do with the gay video. It's like Steve Martin and his crazy comedy he could only do it so long. They try to alter their genre and it's never the big novelty the first thing was. The breakthrough. Like I say it seems the centrist musicians have an advantage like Elton John Michael the Beatles because they pull in little kids and sometimes the elevator people. His last song lacked the cat scratch fever effect but I don't think the gay thing killed him.
The point that most videos were pretty bad in 80's is true. Remember artists were on tour, yet were also expected to get a MTV video out for every release. Squier relied on the Director, and was touring when the final version was released. It was bad, but did not end his career.
I read the MTV book that came out in 2011. Great read! Whole chapter dedicated to the making of this video. Really sad what happened to Squire after it debuted. I guess ultimately he could have nixed the vid but MTV had the rights to debut video for very long time so guess he just caved. Recommend the book for anyone who grew up with MTV.
we all loved him, We loved this song,, We also thought this video made Billy look feminine with his moves in the song.... Dunno if that hurt his career but just stating our facts,,,,, Especially when our definition of rock and roll was sex drugs and rock n roll, with the sex being with woman. He seemed just to feminine in his dance moves with this song.
satin sheets became the only thing fans knew about him."same problem Peter frampton had,identify crisis.the"we really don't know anything about this guy!"problem.
It's not that Squier danced around in his apartment feelin' good about a song on the radio, it's that he pranced like a little girl, and his "fey" hand movements just killed everything. Michael Jackson danced w/himself in the 80's, but he looked super bad-ass doing it - Squier looks like Richard Simmons on speed, just absolutely horrible looking nancy-prancy running around.
That dancing though... If you call it that. Reminds me of Elainee on the Seinfeld "little kicks". I was in my prime in the early eighties and believe it... When we saw that video nobody wanted to be caught dead rocking Squire tonight
You are 100% correct. I was 21 in 1984 and well in tune with music media. There was no backlash at all against the video. Other bands (Ratt, Crue) were wearing makeup and lingerie to no ill effect.
I was teenage boy when MTV launched. was already a Squier fan. the video is/was embarrassing. it didn't hurt my love for him or his music. music vids were problematic for a few performers. Paul Simon was pissed at the You can call me Al video. it was the Chevy Chase show and it was Chevy's antics and the video that were more popular than the song.
I do not know, but I watched Mtv daily during the 80's. What changed were the types of music, the addition of vh-1, playing fewer music videos during peak viewing times to make room for game shows and reality tv. Hair metal took over and there was a kickback against the corporate rock sound. I inderstand the appeal of dance movies like "Flasfdance", "Fame" and "Footloose" having am impact on music video as well. In this case video did kill the radio star. Squier had other video play on Mtv but inevidably the vjay's would reference "Rock Me Tonight." I don't know if it killed his music career, but - and I am a gay guy saying this - "Rock Me Tonight" is homoerotic. I don't know thst it was unintentional so much as a miscalculation in pandering to a demographic. In no way, in 1984, was a heterosexual man going to undulate around his bedroom floor like Madonna and get away without being suspect in those homophobic days. It was his peak. Once a performer comes down from it, especially in infamy, promoters don't invest in the same way ever again.
1. BIlly Squier himself claims "Rock me Tonight" ended his career. You can't get a better expert witness on the music industry and how it worked at that time. 2. The video only aired two weeks. Billy's career after that point failed dramatically in most areas. All evidence points to that time frame as the point things took a dramatic turn for the worse. 3. The "Enough is Enough" was a weak album theory is not a strong defense. Interpreting music is subjective. It's simply your opinion. If I was willing to concede that point to you, it still would not be enough to establish that album as being the downfall to BIllys career. 4. Your four pillars of justice are simply circumstantial. Not one of your pillars help to establish your ever changing defense theory. Which is, (the best I can make out)... Something killed BIlly's career, but it wasn't the "Rock me Tonight" video. Here is the defense I would have ran with: 1. Billy could have went overseas and worked in counties where the video did not air. Many musicians will work elsewhere if the United States is no longer a lucrative endeavor. BIlly neglected to do that. Which indicates that Billy's bad business choices are more indicative of his career failing as opposed to one fluke video. 2. BIlly could have said No to the video. BIlly ultimately had the final say as whether or not the video would air. He ran with it. Which again supports the theory of bad business decisions over one single video to end it all.
Squier blamed the video because he didn't want to admit that he had passed his creative peak. I love Love is the Hero and like Lady With a Tenor Sax and Don't Say You Love Me and She Goes Down, but I can still see that they were never going to equal the earlier stuff. Your first #2 is also circumstantial.
@@Scott_From_Maine I think you hit the nail on the head! It's pretty simple: if his post "Rock Me Tonight" songs were as good, people would have responded - the dumb video notwithstanding.
I partly agree. In Europe, "The stroke" was heavily marketed in mags & media, & played in clubs. "Sounds" & "Kerrang!" picked up on it & capitol went even further with "Emotions in motion". I immediately liked "All night long" off "Signs of Life" when it came out, and can't recollect ever having seen that video on MTV at the time. But none of the following releases were marketed as heavily as the ones before '84, so I truly believe the record company was at least as much to blame as the artist himself.
@@drgrlitz also billy fell into the early 80s catergory people tend to look at the 80s as a whole . there was huge difference in music from 82 to 89. a lot of bands that were huge in early 80s were done by 85-86. hair metal pop and rap took over. look at reo speedwagon foreigner styx journey all huge in early 80s by 1987 they were considered old news
The video did not end Squire. Ask any female, we don't judge guys by how they dance cause most can't. Satin sheets, most women like. The video clearly was not aimed at men.
Yep I noticed the flamboyant (gayish) moves by Billy Squire long before Rock me tonight on previous videos, so the RMT video wasn't really a surprise but rather just a bit over the top
MAN , I'm glad you aren't my defense lawyer ! I'm not at all convinced . It was a killer ! I remember the video , ( That dancing ) ... LOL ! Ya got some sugar in your tank BILLY .
Just sayin' other artist transitioned into the 90s just fine. The video was bad but it seems pretty crazy that it could end his career. I guess the only people who know are the fans that did stop coming to his concerts and buying his albums.
My guess is that Kenny Ortega saw earlier videos of Squier and noticed the "flamboyance", so he may have believed Squier was gay and needed a "coming out" video. Notice too how the band is presented, especially the bass player. Ortega was trying to make them all look gay. So the moral of the story is, if you don't want to look like you are gay, don't hire a gay director, because that is exactly what a gay director will make you look like.
A time for all... And all in time To slip beyond the borderline Of who we are and where we long to be... When every night you hear the sound Of wakin' up and breakin' down You find a chance and heave it all away So the explanation is in the bridge of the song, above. About going beyond yourself, and crossing a borderline, another Madonna connection, it just wasn't going to sit right in middle America for the sons of homophobic fathers. That's why the backlash. Squier would have done better to leave the original vodeo up.
Jim Shearer failed to mention the numbers of tickets sold for Squier's concerts immediately before and after the Rock Me Tonight video. Now I don't know if this is true or not, but I've heard it mentioned that those numbers cratered. If it is true that there was an immediate drop in ticket sales, then it argues against his opinion.
the answer toboillar four, the question about David Bowie and and Mick Jagger surviving their gay looking video and Billy Squire not: We already knew David Bowie and Mick were gay, it was a surprise to us that Billy was. and that's it. I will give you, musically, Billy had hit his prime, but I am just answering #4
@@bb-gc2tx right. But he looked gay compared to how he sounded. My wife said, David Lee Roth danced as “gay” as Billie Squire. But Billy Squire’ music video made him l”look gay” to his millions of fans. That image stopped him cold, sadly.
It's not the clothes, or the sheets, or the writhing on the floor that's the worst part for me -- it's the really God awful dancing. The man's dancing was just awkward. Unintentionally comical.
I grew out of hearing him once I hit high school. His songs sound very much alike.....another argument. He was over thirty and the majority of fans as I saw it were jr. High girls, not working class rock fans. I'm sure that the Pyromania crowd wasn't there to see Billy, but instead the chicks who came for Billy.
“Never mistake a loud opinion for a fact”. TRUTH. Great analysis
Super relevant statement, today. Induct Billy Squire, seriously, R&R Hall of Fame.
Thank you, the truth will set you free. Billy Squire OWNED the eighties, listen to yhat music now , its still fantastic.
Indeed, and Billy Squier's entire music catalog is superb Rock and Roll. I listen to his incredible music daily ❣️🎧😎
Excellent analysis indeed, and to do so with such good humor wins many extra points in my book (you had me laughing out loud multiple times). Thank you--you've certainly convinced me, and I will echo your sentiments whenever this comes up again (and will give you the credit you're due).
I was a huge Billy Squier fan--my first rock concert was Billy at the Brendan Byrne Arena with Def Leppard opening in '82. (My friend Joey decided not to go last minute, so my Dad ended up taking me--I was in junior high school--and my Dad kept commenting about Billy's "dance moves" with a term too politically incorrect today to repeat here, but it was a running joke for years in my household).
I've lived in NYC for 27 years, and have met Billy a few times. Super nice guy. It is a shame that he was tarnished in such a manner. I still love his songs.
Thank you again for providing such rare insight and value. #liked&subscribed
Still am a fan, all these years later. Saw him w Def Leppard opening too! Dance moves oh no he might like... Dancing? 😅 Saw him in NYC at city winery acoustic w GE Smith. Still has it going on. And still has his moves 💚💚💚
Billy Squier is king ❤ ❤.
POOR BILLY. I feel even worse for him now. Despite the downswing he absolutely deserves to be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame!!!
I totally agree with you Jim. Huge Squier fan, and still am to this day. When I saw the "rock me tonight" video, it made me sick that he made it. I figured they made the video with no money! But I've seen videos just as bad, or worse, and it didn't effect me liking his music. I can think of many other bands that failed going into the 90's that were a success before that. Music changed, and if the popular artists didn't change a little bit with the times, then they struggled. When you think about it, there weren't that many that survived!
Yes, Billy Squier is my all time favorite musician❣️ His ENTIRE music catalog is superb Rock and Roll✨😎🎧
I was a teen during the 80's. Billy Squire's music video of rock me tonite wasn't unlike any other cheese worthy video at the time. I didn't even know this was a controversy until right now. This is the era of Miami Vice, using glass blocks to create art, pastel and neon clothes for men, Boy George, Andy Worholo (it was his actual name I guess the end o wasn't cool enough to keep), and practically every artist doing coke in the industry (even John Taylor bassist for Duran Duran). There is more to this story. Or this is social media trying to change history. It wasn't the video.
Look at the chiffon Plant used to wear! I never question anyone's masculinity...since when are guys so fussy about what they do and with whom...cmon now!
@@mariacullati2371 Alot of stuff today that people getting bent by, are not new. Kiss? Queen? Early Van Halen? Bowie? These are the same people who listened to these bands.
@@barbaraj.6309 None of whom made embarrassingly-effeminate videos of 4 minutes of non-stop prancing in girly colors.
@@screwyootube1 did you not see dancing in the streets??
Exactly alot of strange videos back then
What is wrong with people? We judge an artist on a video, or what he has on, or his creative energy when he dances? Are you serious? His guitar work is fantastic and his songs so loved. Go Billy! These chumps don't deserve you!
It would never be a problem today... What a great musician shelved for no reason. I mean, Video killed a lot of radio stars unfortunately... his gesturing, flicks and flamboyance as a dude was HOT!
Love the defense! 😂
I also love seeing the circular Capitol Records building 👍
Thank you for all of this historical info, never knew 😢
Wow Billy - Really well done! You could have easily moved to television.
Yep, you are right about your vid being a real tough video to watch. I remember being really bummed about it. I really didn't want to believe what I was watching and I think I generally tried to push it out of my mind. This terrific video is entertaining, but I still have my questions. Regardless, I'm much older now (aren't we all!) and I'm a Conservative, but I don't care. My wife and I still listen to your music all the time. As a guitar player, I play it all the time.
Love your music and agree that you should be in the R&R HOF.
Love Rock Me Tonight! A great song.
Lived in L.A. at the time. Most of my friends quit listening to him once we saw that gay ass video. And you never heard anything new from him on he radio, ever. The perception that he was gay had an effect. Rob Halford was afraid of the same thing. I think his later music was just as good.
You had me laughing so hard. I liked the video and after hearing your arguments in defense, I agree with you!
When Flashdance meets Richard Simmons! 👍
Your comment had me laughing hard for a few minutes!
That was a very good case you made there. Liked and Subscribed!
I remember the Rock Me Tonight video premier and thinking it wasn't anything unusual for the times. Billy always did have a bit of a flamboyant edge to him, but women really connected to that back then. Many still do today! As from a guys point of view, his guitar sound always had a thick rock attitude, his songs were always melodic yet rock edged enough and the lyric content was masculine enough to relate to. As for flamboyance, think about Bon Scott and look at how many masculine hetro men still praise him to this day!! Billy is like the Pete Rose of rock. He deserves better!
Hey now Bon never pranced around like a sissy in pastel shirts.
@@STD43 he did in short shorts, but look, I like ACDC and Bon and Billy! It was the 70s and the 80s! They were different times! The looks, the sounds, and vibes are different for each decade! There are a lot of people trying different things and cross pollination of styles. Look at Freddie Mercury, Bowie, Jagger, Steven Tyler, Motley Crue, Poison, etc! I think we've all had our moments where we look back at ourselves and wonder what we were thinking! I love music from all decades, but not all music! I'm not trying to change your opinion about my opinion, just explaining where mine was formed!
We don't have to agree and that's why there is so much music and so many artists to choose from!
Peace!
This is absolutely brilliant. As a huge Billy Squier fan, I appreciate the time and thought put into this. “Enough is Enough” was just a terrible album. However, his next three albums were quite good. Unfortunately, poor choices were made regarding what songs to release as singles. How were “G.O.D..” and “Stronger” not hits? And releasing “She Goes Down” over ”Facts of Life “ or ”Hands of Seduction” … not good choices. These were great songs that built on Billy's early hits, but never saw the light of radio play. Would love to see him tour with a full band one more time.
Very convincing. I have often repeated the Billy Squier story because it's a fun story, but I am happy go be corrected
This was great. You are absolutely right; most music videos of the '80s were just as bad! Maybe we should start a petition to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame for Billy. I remember as a teenager being so excited getting MTV and then being embarrassed to watch it most of the time because the videos were asinine.
He was hot stuff in the early 80's ..lol.. I always wondered what happened to him
The "Rock Me Tonight" video is indefensible. Full stop.
Mr. Shearer you are far more compelling than I imagined you could be. I'll have to go walk in the rain for several days and rethink my position of the video...
You don’t get it dude!
That video ruined him!
Why did the song rise on the charts even after the video was released? Because not everyone had MTV, and many didn't see the video and only knew of the song from radio.
Like me 😂
Flail your arms, Billy!! I'm flailing, Kenny! I'm flailing!!!
Never heard about the music video or the controversy with it, but it doesn't change my mind about his music. The Stroke will always be in my top 50 favorite songs. It's a classic.
Squier like Morrison and Cobain had is own sound way underrated artist
I never get comments like this. Billy was a HUGE rock star and was literally everywhere! Check out his album sales!
It's just that his career fell off a cliff. Blue-collar fan base + gay (perception at least) = nose dive.
I've been playing guitar for 45 years and still can't get enough of it. Billy Squier is still in regular rotation of songs to cover.
haha!! WOW! These are great! Really good idea for a video series! I hope you do more of them!! ^_^
YES!!!! I've been saying this for years. "Rock Me Tonite" was also a #1 on the cred-obsessed ROCK radio chart in the summer of '84. MTV still had the video in rotation months after it had dropped OFF the Billboard Hot 100. Revisionists be damned!
The Elder Nope. I lived thru it.
MTV also played all kinds of gender-bending stuff that a segment of their viewers also loved (Culture Club, George Michael, Duran Duran, remember?). Mick Jagger & David Bowie have secured their existence in our hearts. Their careers were set in stone, and are not going to be fazed one iota by wiggling their tushies like you want attention "up there". But you never saw Keith Richards or David Gilmour or Tom Petty or even Bruce Springsteen dance like they're "bi-curious". And certainly not non-stop for 4 minutes in pastel colors. His primary audience was the working-class rockers that don't get into "that sort of thing". And why did they continue to play his song, when the video came out? Like it's going to end like a car into a brick wall? Nothing else he released could come anywhere near the top 40. Top 40 programmers avoided adding new stuff, once the backlash started taking effect.
Also, the remainder of his songs that managed to chart on the low end of the Hot 100 all came out while "hair/glam metal was riding high on the charts, and well before grunge came out and swept it all off of the charts. And for the argument that he had run out of quality music to be worthy of hits, I advise you to listen to "Don't Say You Love Me" (from 1989), which charted at a mediocre #58. That song could easily stand with some of the best of his catalog, with a killer guitar riff. In the golden age of metal (late 80s/very early 90s), this should've been a solid hit, if not a BIG hit. But they wanted nothing to do with Billy, and I can only surmise it stems from this video, and the backlash against him it created.
@@screwyootube1 There was no “backlash”. He continued to chart at AOR. If his street cred was soooo compromised, rock radio wouldn’t have continued to support him, which they did. The whole thing is revisionist history. Just like this “We Built This City” is the “worst song ever” narrative. Both make for cute stories, but they’re not based in any reality.
EMBRACE IT
I will end this by saying this was awesome and spot on.
I don’t hold any of it against him or against his music. I still rock out to it when he’s on the radio. But make no mistake. This video is 100% Billy Squier. In fact other people involved tried to tell him, tried to change it and manly it up. Billy insisted on what we see and I think it’s actually pretty obvious in how into it he was. The director wanted to remove his own name from the project because he thought it was so bad, but like I said Billy insisted. This video was the ultimate poor decision. But again I absolutely do not hold it against him. Everyone was doing cringy shit at the time. This just happened to be the most cringy of them all. Someone had to do it
Take a look at Benny Mardones- "Into the Night" 1980- it's the king of cringe worthy! The comment section is hysterical!
@@buttercupkong Totally agree, King Of Cringe. But that's a whole other level of cringe. It's a good tune but the words are problematic. The real story about the song and the girl as told by Benny is interesting.
Loved your video! I was a "Rock me Tonight" fan since the first time I ear it!
Pulling the video off of MTV - - made the situation - wayyy worse.. IF- they had only replaced that awful video - with a great - live concert version - in it's place for R.M.T. immediately in the same week..People would've respected it more.. and recoup lost fans
The Billy video is much worse than the Jagger/Bowie video because their video was them just being silly and having a laugh. You can tell they're goofing around. It's not meant to be taken seriously. Billy is dead serious in his video. There's no campy fun about it. No sense of humor. Much worse.
Where are the new "in defense of"? Great videos man!
Def flamboyant!!!!!! Just like Paul Stanley. I always thought he was limp wristed.
Pillar of Truth #4 is *Truth.* But here's the thing: I was around back then. I don't remember anyone saying, "That 'Rock Me Tonight' video is just terrible- I'm never listening to Billy Squier again!" In fact, honest-to-God I never even saw the "Rock Me Tonight" video at all until TH-cam.
Preach, brother!
Don't Say You Love Me would've been another hit, as least as big as Everybody Wants You, if not for Rock Me Tonite. And one big difference in Squier's moves caught on video prior to - and after - the offending video, is he usually had a guitar strapped on at the same time. All these other clips shown here tying to say he's always been "flamboyant"... He's no different from someone like David Lee Roth. Girls want to do 'em (yet they still), while guys want to be 'em. But Rock me Tonite was a 4-minute long barrage of effeminate-dancing around, not even holding a musical instrument to show SOME evidence to the contrary, of masculinity.
My God, there are SO many ridiculous excuses this host puts forward that are easily disputed/disproved. Bottom line, this video is just there to argue, even though the host's merits are lame, at best, if not just straight bullshit.
he was a lttle sugary early
Made some very good points.
So fantastic - please make more!
I'm not really a rock person but wasn't the flamboyance what made him popular in the first place. The stroke got my attention because it seemed super controversial kind of like the pusher by steppenwolf inna gadda da vida. It stood out. Steppenwolf ran out of gas too and I never understood that. I think people just get bored with the sound. I really think it had little to do with the gay video. It's like Steve Martin and his crazy comedy he could only do it so long. They try to alter their genre and it's never the big novelty the first thing was. The breakthrough. Like I say it seems the centrist musicians have an advantage like Elton John Michael the Beatles because they pull in little kids and sometimes the elevator people. His last song lacked the cat scratch fever effect but I don't think the gay thing killed him.
Your compelling argument makes more sense then the common narrative.
He skips by Hear & Now which put Billy back on radio with multiple songs.
Great video! Love your points and your presentation.
It certainly didn't help.
Still a great song!!!
The video for Van Halen’s Jump was great! What are you smoking?
but those moves though
Great arguments
The point that most videos were pretty bad in 80's is true. Remember artists were on tour, yet were also expected to get a MTV video out for every release. Squier relied on the Director, and was touring when the final version was released. It was bad, but did not end his career.
Yeah, it didn't end his career. Just the hits. LOL!
Jim is hilarious.
I read the MTV book that came out in 2011. Great read! Whole chapter dedicated to the making of this video. Really sad what happened to Squire after it debuted. I guess ultimately he could have nixed the vid but MTV had the rights to debut video for very long time so guess he just caved. Recommend the book for anyone who grew up with MTV.
2 Boston like mentions , very nicely crafted.
we all loved him, We loved this song,, We also thought this video made Billy look feminine with his moves in the song.... Dunno if that hurt his career but just stating our facts,,,,, Especially when our definition of rock and roll was sex drugs and rock n roll, with the sex being with woman. He seemed just to feminine in his dance moves with this song.
@The Elder I still love Billy. saw him 4 times...
satin sheets became the only thing fans knew about him."same problem Peter frampton had,identify crisis.the"we really don't know anything about this guy!"problem.
Yeah Frampton became “the talk box guy”
Yeah.....he released that last album AFTER that 👉👈 video!!
It's not that Squier danced around in his apartment feelin' good about a song on the radio, it's that he pranced like a little girl, and his "fey" hand movements just killed everything.
Michael Jackson danced w/himself in the 80's, but he looked super bad-ass doing it - Squier looks like Richard Simmons on speed, just absolutely horrible looking nancy-prancy running around.
That dancing though... If you call it that.
Reminds me of Elainee on the Seinfeld "little kicks". I was in my prime in the early eighties and believe it... When we saw that video nobody wanted to be caught dead rocking Squire tonight
You are 100% correct. I was 21 in 1984 and well in tune with music media. There was no backlash at all against the video. Other bands (Ratt, Crue) were wearing makeup and lingerie to no ill effect.
They weren't prancing like in this video, non-stop for 4 minutes.
For the Love of God and all that is Holy........it wasn't the video! (Using my Chris Farley yelling voice).
I was teenage boy when MTV launched. was already a Squier fan. the video is/was embarrassing. it didn't hurt my love for him or his music.
music vids were problematic for a few performers. Paul Simon was pissed at the You can call me Al video. it was the Chevy Chase show and
it was Chevy's antics and the video that were more popular than the song.
I'm currently competing in a anti-masturbation contest.
Don't worry, i'm still the M.C. of my Hammer.
OK, back to Video.
I agree
12:50 Ooof 😣
He should have just had a model doing all the dancing
Not sure that Billy would agree with you. Let's keep in mind you don't know what was happening behind the scenes on the business side of things.
Make this a series please!
I do not know, but I watched Mtv daily during the 80's. What changed were the types of music, the addition of vh-1, playing fewer music videos during peak viewing times to make room for game shows and reality tv. Hair metal took over and there was a kickback against the corporate rock sound. I inderstand the appeal of dance movies like "Flasfdance", "Fame" and "Footloose" having am impact on music video as well. In this case video did kill the radio star. Squier had other video play on Mtv but inevidably the vjay's would reference "Rock Me Tonight." I don't know if it killed his music career, but - and I am a gay guy saying this - "Rock Me Tonight" is homoerotic. I don't know thst it was unintentional so much as a miscalculation in pandering to a demographic. In no way, in 1984, was a heterosexual man going to undulate around his bedroom floor like Madonna and get away without being suspect in those homophobic days. It was his peak. Once a performer comes down from it, especially in infamy, promoters don't invest in the same way ever again.
P.S. today I don't think it would really matter, but gays were still being murdered in the 1980's.
1. BIlly Squier himself claims "Rock me Tonight" ended his career. You can't get a better expert witness on the music industry and how it worked at that time.
2. The video only aired two weeks. Billy's career after that point failed dramatically in most areas. All evidence points to that time frame as the point things took a dramatic turn for the worse.
3. The "Enough is Enough" was a weak album theory is not a strong defense. Interpreting music is subjective. It's simply your opinion. If I was willing to concede that point to you, it still would not be enough to establish that album as being the downfall to BIllys career.
4. Your four pillars of justice are simply circumstantial. Not one of your pillars help to establish your ever changing defense theory. Which is, (the best I can make out)... Something killed BIlly's career, but it wasn't the "Rock me Tonight" video.
Here is the defense I would have ran with:
1. Billy could have went overseas and worked in counties where the video did not air. Many musicians will work elsewhere if the United States is no longer a lucrative endeavor. BIlly neglected to do that. Which indicates that Billy's bad business choices are more indicative of his career failing as opposed to one fluke video.
2. BIlly could have said No to the video. BIlly ultimately had the final say as whether or not the video would air. He ran with it. Which again supports the theory of bad business decisions over one single video to end it all.
Squier blamed the video because he didn't want to admit that he had passed his creative peak. I love Love is the Hero and like Lady With a Tenor Sax and Don't Say You Love Me and She Goes Down, but I can still see that they were never going to equal the earlier stuff. Your first #2 is also circumstantial.
@@Scott_From_Maine I think you hit the nail on the head! It's pretty simple: if his post "Rock Me Tonight" songs were as good, people would have responded - the dumb video notwithstanding.
I partly agree. In Europe, "The stroke" was heavily marketed in mags & media, & played in clubs. "Sounds" & "Kerrang!" picked up on it & capitol went even further with "Emotions in motion". I immediately liked "All night long" off "Signs of Life" when it came out, and can't recollect ever having seen that video on MTV at the time. But none of the following releases were marketed as heavily as the ones before '84, so I truly believe the record company was at least as much to blame as the artist himself.
@@drgrlitz also billy fell into the early 80s catergory people tend to look at the 80s as a whole . there was huge difference in music from 82 to 89. a lot of bands that were huge in early 80s were done by 85-86. hair metal pop and rap took over. look at reo speedwagon foreigner styx journey all huge in early 80s by 1987 they were considered old news
@@bb-gc2tx: Indeed. By the marketing departments of the record companies.
Heard you talk about this on Feedback. Watched it and showed to to others. Well Played Jim.
Nirvana argument is wrong. Billy's career was long over before 1991. So the most overrated band in history nirvana did not end his career
agreed he was long gone
Great to see somebody else consider them the most overrated band in history.
The video did not end Squire. Ask any female, we don't judge guys by how they dance cause most can't. Satin sheets, most women like. The video clearly was not aimed at men.
Yep I noticed the flamboyant (gayish) moves by Billy Squire long before Rock me tonight on previous videos, so the RMT video wasn't really a surprise but rather just a bit over the top
great vid
Great video!! Well done.
MAN ,
I'm glad you aren't my defense lawyer !
I'm not at all convinced .
It was a killer !
I remember the video ,
( That dancing ) ... LOL !
Ya got some sugar in your tank BILLY .
"There is nothing to defend.., It's A Great Song And A Great Video"...
IT's A GREAT VIDEO!
I agree with you and I defend it as well. save me from the prancing animus. think billy idol, think every prancing rock star of the 80s
He didn't just prance, he minced and sashayed.
All VH and DLR videos were incredible!!!!
In defense of that 1992 suit. Yikes.
I think could've sustained a few more major hits if it weren't for that video...in my defense, check out the video without the music......
This video has way too few views.
I think you made the case well.
Just sayin' other artist transitioned into the 90s just fine. The video was bad but it seems pretty crazy that it could end his career. I guess the only people who know are the fans that did stop coming to his concerts and buying his albums.
My guess is that Kenny Ortega saw earlier videos of Squier and noticed the "flamboyance", so he may have believed Squier was gay and needed a "coming out" video. Notice too how the band is presented, especially the bass player. Ortega was trying to make them all look gay. So the moral of the story is, if you don't want to look like you are gay, don't hire a gay director, because that is exactly what a gay director will make you look like.
Totally agree!
A time for all... And all in time
To slip beyond the borderline
Of who we are and where we long to be...
When every night you hear the sound
Of wakin' up and breakin' down
You find a chance and heave it all away
So the explanation is in the bridge of the song, above. About going beyond yourself, and crossing a borderline, another Madonna connection, it just wasn't going to sit right in middle America for the sons of homophobic fathers. That's why the backlash. Squier would have done better to leave the original vodeo up.
If he was a girl, that video would have been great!!! Ha!
Jennifer Beals perhaps?
You are a genius, its a fact¡¡¡
Jim Shearer failed to mention the numbers of tickets sold for Squier's concerts immediately before and after the Rock Me Tonight video. Now I don't know if this is true or not, but I've heard it mentioned that those numbers cratered. If it is true that there was an immediate drop in ticket sales, then it argues against his opinion.
Billy said this himself. His ticket sales dropped by half. Not sure if that's causation or correlation though. Maybe the album just wasn't as good.
whats even worse is that people bought tickets before the backlash and didnt even bother show up after they allready bought the tickets
the answer toboillar four, the question about David Bowie and and Mick Jagger surviving their gay looking video and Billy Squire not: We already knew David Bowie and Mick were gay, it was a surprise to us that Billy was. and that's it. I will give you, musically, Billy had hit his prime, but I am just answering #4
hes been married for decades
@@bb-gc2tx right. But he looked gay compared to how he sounded. My wife said, David Lee Roth danced as “gay” as Billie Squire. But Billy Squire’ music video made him l”look gay” to his millions of fans. That image stopped him cold, sadly.
Who asked?
It's not the clothes, or the sheets, or the writhing on the floor that's the worst part for me -- it's the really God awful dancing. The man's dancing was just awkward. Unintentionally comical.
Why be so mean against someone you don’t even know?My last comment on this cause I this is my third comment on this.
I grew out of hearing him once I hit high school. His songs sound very much alike.....another argument. He was over thirty and the majority of fans as I saw it were jr. High girls, not working class rock fans. I'm sure that the Pyromania crowd wasn't there to see Billy, but instead the chicks who came for Billy.
I think the "Rock Me Tonite" video could have been acceptable if Billy didn't dance like Elaine on Seinfeld.