I have many critism personally and point at this game as where ME got wrong. The morality system punish role playing, the leveling system is very limiting and offers about no variety of builds within a class, the Collector doesn’t really matter, we are railroaded into working for a terrorist group and we should have spent the middle installenent researching the Reaper not on a side quest. Oh and killing Shepard and destroying the Normandy was only done for shock value, it’s undone immediately and doesn’t affect Shepard im anyway. He died and resurrected and it didn’t change him or her in the slightest. They don’t even introspect about it.
@@oliviawilliams6204 Don't forget the giant baby Terminator boss fight at the end that's created by blending humans up and pumping them into it. People say ME3 ruined the Reapers, but if that's how they're created they were already on thin ice
@@oliviawilliams6204 Accurate. Honestly how this game is forgiven by so many. You go inside a semi-disabled Reaper. A R E A P E R. The series main antagonist. Do you learn anything interesting about their motives? Do you have a repeat of the dialogue with Sovereign on Virmire? Do you have to fend of cosmic horror whispers and question your perceptions? No. You just shoot waves of Husks and Scions. For 20 minutes. Wow.
@@oliviawilliams6204 ``. He died and resurrected and it didn’t change him or her in the slightest. They don’t even introspect about it.`` It was a huge point in the narrative as to why Shepard was left to dry by the alliance and council.
Every Bioware game to date has made the mistake of having an enormous codex full of interesting lorem plus frequent, long loading screens. Yet for some reason, FOR SOME REASON, they have NEVER allowed you to peruse your codex while you're waiting for the game to load. It's unforgivable.
@@UsernameGeri To be fair it was a colossal improvement form the first game, which was like Morrowind in how they handled quest direction and giving that info to the player.
actually not ENTIRELY true. In Dragon age inquisition you get (random) codex pages you have unlocked on the loading screens thought, yes, mass effect should have had this (and give you time to read them [by letting the loading screen only end when you press a button)
if you save Sidonis, he ends up getting garrus father and Sister off of Palaven when the Reapers attack. It's a very nice touch to put Garrus morals back in place and to have it pay off positively in the end as opposed to not letting him do what he wants end up bad.
@@Scottie_S It's cut content actually. But it would have been a really nice touch as ME is known for actions having consequences. Because in ME2, killing Sidonis is a no brainer. But finding out Sidonis could have saved them in ME3 if he was alive would have been a real gut punch for Garrus since he let his revenge control him. Don't know why they didn't implement it in the actual game.
If Sidonis survive the encounter, he will sorrounded himself to the authorities but they will free him later due to the lack of charges against him The Citadel doesn't has authority over Omega and basically anyone that commit crimes there don't go to prison We learn about this hearing the news in the game
Rael's final message to Tali did NOT make her feel better. Her "thanks" was sarcastic; she hated the fact that his last message to her was an order, rather than some expression of familial affection or something. Shepard says as much to Shala'ran when they get back.
You know what is messed up about the story of ME2? During the entire argument between Mordin, Maelon, and Shepard on what to do about the Genophage, no one even thought to get any input from *the Krogan*
Perfectly in character since both think their decisions are right based on their beliefs, not based on what the Krogans want as an species, though one can say Maleon is doing what Krogans want but don’t say
@@onepiece666 This is true. The flaws in both their beliefs are pretty evident as well. Mordin is still acting like the Krogan Rebellions are still happening, which is a bit weird. He is also relying entirely on numbers and completely ignoring the cultural impact the Genophage had on the Krogan. This is totally fair as it was not part of his field. Maelon is turning a blind eye to what the Blood Pack want to use the cure for as long as he got results. His volunteers also did not have complete informed consent so it is still totally messed up. Meanwhile, the final decision is given to Shepard, a person who absolutely does not have all the information needed to make a properly informed decision. God, what I wouldn't give to have Wrex in that conversation. Shame it couldn't happen because it was possible that he would have been dead by that point in the series.
Grunt was still figuring out who he even was. He didn't have any context yet about his people. Remember, his memories only start to make him feel anything later in the game. At first he sees mental images and flashes of info about Krogan history, but he feels nothing as he sees them. At the time of Mordin's loyalty my soon Grunt simply may not have any opinion yet.
Just want to point out that The Arrival DLC is intended to be a post game DLC, after the suicide run. That's why you don't see any impact until mass effect 3, and is also why Shepard is on earth at the beginning of 3 as in The Arrival you can choose to willingly (or otherwise I guess) to head back to earth to defend your actions of destroying the mass relay.
I think dispite all of that intentions, it is really fits with the last mission before the end mission and it would really suit the similar design of the first game. In the first game, you talk with Sovereign while you are talking with Harbinger in the second game. The reason for that is you were detentioned by alliance military at that point and that was not like a punishment instead the alliance was trying to protect shepard from the real punishment. Even he was working with Cerberus, he was after all stopped abductions from the human colonies, thus he was protected from the real punishment.
Point of fact: Shepard did in fact make it off the original Normandy alive. Shepard's death does come about 17 seconds later, but they did make it off the ship alive. Technically speaking.
I always have Kasumi destroy the box. Those memories aren't all she left of him. Plus in the next game she just holes herself in those memories. It's not healthy. Plus to me it dishonored Keji if she stopped being the person he fell in love with.
There's also a bunch of government secrets that could seriously dick the Alliance over, I don't think having VR sex with her dead boyfriend is really worth it
My thought was it was Keiji's last request. Even though it was "Renegade" I also pick to destroy the Geth instead of rewriting because Jack mentions that being brainwashed to nod and smile is horrible fate
@@TheDancerMacabre The thing is, the Heretic Geth were effectively brainwashed into serving the Reapers to begin with. All Shepard does is repair the error in their programming that made them think that aligning with the Reapers was the correct choice.
Mordin overall will never stop being funny, him singing is hands down the best thing, still annoyed at the role he plays in ME3 wish my boy wasn't in the position he was put it.
I think Mordin put it perfectly "Iam not sorry, Shepard. Have to be me, others could make mistake" Plus dont forget bro is around 40 and thier species is pretty fast living. I think he had at most 5-10 years left amd sure as shit not with his level of selfpresavation. I loved him going out in a blaze for correcting his ONE mistake. Better then seeing him mentally decline into a vegtable. Tech around the citadel-lvl can sure as shit keep u longer alive then most want for themselves
I always save Sidonis, but it's more about helping Garrus overcome base need for revenge. Just like with Dr. Saleon, it's about trying to make him a better person.
I kinda agree and disagree with you on this as I think both choices are dependent on the players morals I like sidonis die as I think it's the best outcome but everyone thinks different
@@Riddlywiddly They are both fine options. And that's what I like about the game. It's really just a personal choice for you on which you find better. No right or wrong. Just what feels appropriate at the time based on your character.
Mordin giving you medical advice about how to safely romance Tali is one of the reason i love the dude. He knows everything about your crew, and helps in the best ways he can. Just a generally quirky dude who wants to do good in the world
Would like to point out that the Cerberus backstory here is a massive retcon from ME1. In ME1 it’s implied heavily that they were an Alliance Blackops group gone rogue
Everything about Cerberus is being retconned every game lol. First we apparently wiped them out in ME1 if you did those side quests, then in ME2 they have all the resources to not only rebuild the Normandy, but also had enough to not clone someone, but straight up bring them back from the dead after falling through the atmosphere of a planet. Then in ME3 they had an entire army and fleet we never saw before even though that would've been extremely useful against the Collectors
@@MikeP828 As much as i love ME2, that was always big pet peeve for me. Especially if you have Sole Survivor background, there is no way to call out Cerberus for causing the deaths of Shepard's unit. Most people say that Sole Survivor Shepard would never work for Cerberus and normally i would agree with them. But it can work if addressed more which it unfortunately isn't.
In a way, I wish we saw more diversity in collector enemies. Insectoid design was great but I wish there was more dimorphism between close vs far away combatants. Just a shame the general model is never seen on the field. Maybe some non bipedal enemies in that vein. They're 50k year old corrupted aliens, make em weird
Kinda makes sense, since they were genetically altered. With degenerated reproductive system there's no possibility of gene diversity and adaptation which makes them almost clones.
I get your point but i think it's good as is, the collectors are just drones for the Reapers, nothing more, there's no need for diversity in looks for them since they exist for one purpose
I lost Mordin on the last mission the first time I played this. I was very sad cause he was my favorite crew member. Damn RIP you jittery amphibious alien man
I think mordin has the lowest score of all the teammates in the suicide mission, easy way I always make sure he survives is too just send him to escort the crew back as long as you did his loyalty mission he'll survive
35:30 Personally, I think it’s better to destroy the Greybox. Whether the info in it will be safe or not ultimately winds up being irrelevant, given the Reaper invasion. What is relevant is Kasumi’s future. If she keeps the Greybox, she never moves on from Keiji’s death. She spends all her free time plugged into the Greybox, reliving her memories with Keiji over and over. While convincing her to destroy the Greybox seems harsher at time, it gives her the space she needs to move on and keep living her life.
Ah a fellow man of Vanguard culture What's interesting is that, even with all that is in the game to flesh out the crew members there was even more they initially planned, like a crew-mate conflict between mordin and grunt on the genophage, which would have been cool to see
Grunt is basically an adult baby that first saw the world just the moment he was recruted. In fact Grunt was Okeers way of ignoring the genophage. Wouldn't really make much sense for Grunt to care much about it in ME2.
Also the very first scene is amazing, I would even argue The Attack is almost as good as Suicide Mission and The End Run purely from a quality perspective. It obviously doesn't have as much emotions and stakes attached to it so it'll never be as impactful, but I really love the sound design there
Not to forget about the theme when you're introduced to the Normandy SR2 for the first time. This track still gives me chills and wet eyes after all these years.
The Arrival DLC is actually supposed to be completed post-main game. And it’s the reason Shepard is on earth under house arrest at the start of ME3, and it’s referenced several more times throughout the game.
It will be the reason if you complete it, but if you don’t, canon wise Hackett sends a team there which succeeds at blowing up the Mass Relay but they all die in the process. In this case Shepard is on trial for working together with Cerberus, an avid enemy of both the Council and the Alliance.
I've always sided either Soldier or Sentinel in ME2. Soldier using every weapon, minus the SMG, and having an easy mode button (called Adrenaline Rush) makes them a powerhouse with a bullet for everybody. Sentinel is the tankiest class in the game, with tech armor boosting and instantly recharging shields, and having both warp and overload on hand is incredibly useful.
I've played each class at least twice (male/female) and my favorite class is Vanguard, with Soldier and Sentinel at #2 and #3. Infiltrator and Adept at #4 and #5, with Engineer at #6. I agree with you on Adrenaline Rush being one of the most powerful abilities, but for me Charge is just more fun.
Vanguard you are able to 2 shot most enemies if you close up biotic charge on Insanity which gets easier with practice knowing the strength of squadmates and enemy coordination It is hell a satisfying and extremely invigorating i would only recommend playing insanity with Vanguard
I really like how in the video the ardat-yakshi were compared to the succubus, it gives you an idea on how the devs got their inspiration for some of the species in mass effect.
Fun fact the Asari is actually based on an very famous abduction story where an construction had worker forced intercourse with a blue looking women cause of aliens It was made famous because he had been very vocal that it did happen and aliens are real
Harbinger was already hinted to be a reaper in the Horizon Cutscene. You can clearly see him in the hologram behind the collector general lol was obvious with the voice and everything
I'm so glad you felt the exact same way I did about Zaeed. Good ole uncle Zaeed and his drunken war stories. I wish we got a little more of him but at least he's great in ME3 Citadel
If you don't romance anyone in the first two, I'd say that Samantha Traynor and FemShep are a close second. Because it's like a cute lesbian suddenly joins the crew and FemShep is like "oh yea bet" But they're the number one for gay options.
I usually don’t let Garrus take the shot in his loyalty mission. I thought that it wasn’t what Garrus really needed, and that he really needed to be able to forget the past and move on. The best way I thought for that was for him to let go of revenge.
One of my biggest issues with ME2's story is the fact that Sole Survivor Shepard - if the Corporal Toombs mission was done in ME - never mentions the fact they killed his Akuze squadmates due to their experiments with thresher maws. Ever. Despite being a significant event in his life that shaped a part of his personality. Tela Vasir had to actually point that out. The reason, of course, is because we wouldn't have the intended ME2 story (which I love, to be clear) if that fact were brought up, as it would be too unbelievable that Shepard would work with Cerberus then. I still think it's a really cheap way they went about it, though. And Cerberus is DEFINITELY a terrorist organisation. They went rogue and split off from the Alliance, conducted inhumane experiments on humans and aliens, silenced even high-ranking military officials that found out too much, assassinated political figures, kidnapped children, etc. I agree that it isn't black and white and they're mostly helpful in this game, but that doesn't make them any less terrorists, or wash away the fact they did some absolutely horrendous things up to that point.
I think there are ways that Sole Survivor Shepard would work with Cerberus. Shepard doesn't have to trust nor forgive Cerberus for what they have done, but he doesn't have much options since Alliance and Council refuses to help and he needs resources and team to take down Collectors from attacking any other colonies. Still, i wish there was chance for Shepard to call out TIM for the Akuze incident and TIM would say they were separate or rogue scientists or something. I wish we didn't need Vasir to point that out for us.
I like to think Shep regardless of trauma is practical enough to realize sometimes you have to work with people you hate for a greater purpose. Shep had no other realistic options for funding and a squad.
Outside of Cerberus there's not an alternative to fight the Collectors. The Alliance just give you the middle finger and don't trust you. The Council cut ties with you, despite that hey can give you your Spectre status, and don't want to be involved in what they call “human business". The only alternative is Cerberus. Is up to the player to trust in them or not. However I'm agree that the game should have let us been more vocal about the shit they did There's some dialogue options that mentioned the side quests in MA1 but that's it. But you can be very clear about not trusting Cerberus
I never knew about the Dark Energy plot line until this video. That would have made the Reapers harder to hate and really would have thrown the ethics of fighting them into question. It also would have been a great way to segue into the Indoctrination Theory plot line. Huge kudos for the research and organization of a very dense game/series. Incredible job condensing everything without blowing over anything important.
One thing I think that's absent here its the fact that it is a retrospective. When it came out and we were unsure about the next step and what would or wouldn't be expanded on. The ending of Arrival sent a shiver across my body because I wasnt sure when ME would come about. Having prior knowledge and info how everything shakes down makes things less intense.
Even better when you get Legion in there. He sits just like Garrus, but the fact that no one's even keeping an eye on him and it's just like a little kid waiting for his parents to stop talking to their friends is hilarious.
A small detail I always missed during Tali's loyalty mission was her strained relationship with her father. If you don't use a paragon interrupt to hug it out, Tali instead talks about how what she wanted was a father who was there to spend time with her instead of away chasing dreams of reclaiming the homeworld. If you expose the evidence at the trial, Tali can vent to Admiral Ran about how her father's last words were not a goodbye to her but rather instructions for Tali to shutdown the geth and retrieve the data. And on the Normandy, Shepard can defend his actions be saying it was what her father wanted but Tali responds that she is tired of people doing terrible things for her benefit and without her consent. Exposing the evidence will result in her not being loyal for the final mission. If you allow Tali to be exiled, Admiral Ran will angrily confront you two about not showing the data. Tali can respond that it is for the good of the fleet which only makes Ran angrier, with her saying that Tali is just like her father being far too willing to sacrifice everything for the fleet. Tali however takes her exile with pride saying she was exiled for the good of the fleet and not through any fault of her own. Allowing her to be exiled actually results in her being loyal. I adore this mission for highlighting how much Tali wished her father wasn't so absent, too focused on the fleet to care for his own daughter; and yet Tali also is just as willing to sacrifice anything for the fleet, even her own place in it.
I have the opposite opinion. The Daddy issue trope is a lazy & pushing narrative shown way too much in media and shows more about the producers writers perceived trauma than I believe fits Tali. She idolized her father and it would nice to know she realized her father's love in his attempt to do ANYTHING to make sure she had a normal life on their homeworld.
@Imapotato The fact that basically everyone has "daddy issues" in Mass Effect is pretty bad when you think about it. Miranda has the egomaniacal father, Jacob has an actual monster for a father, Thane is an absentee father, and Wrex's father literally tried to kill him. But at least Tali's story is the most fleshed and nuanced of the bunch.
@@NinjaMan47 Yea that is why I hoped one of the great characters would have been spared. In ME2 she showed none of that, but she gets drunk & slams her dad... was disappointing
I always thought the collectors were meant to be a sort of clean up crew after the reaper's arrival, but they had to be activated early because the Reaper Invasion was delayed. Why else would they have a massive ship with enough pods to collect an entire planet, and a reaper assembly area on their homeworld/station/hive?
I get why people love the game, I just think it blinds people to its faults. Shamus Young does an excellent video on how many of the things Mass Effect 1 set up to make writing Mass Effect 2 easier are thrown out the window. Such as being a Spectre giving character agency, hints of the galaxy getting ready for what comes next, Laura’s research, etc. But what damages this game severely is that by and large it adds nothing to the Reaper plot. The Collectors don’t advance the Reaper story at all. We end ME1 and start ME3 in the same position. Honestly ME2 should’ve been about getting the galaxy ready for the Reapers. Maybe even have a Dragon Age style group meeting where we try to plead our case to the other races. Which would determine how easy or hard it would be to fight the Reapers in ME3. It also doesn’t help this game hurts ME3 by answering like idk… Shepard coming from the grave might be a big deal! Like Jesus, no one in ME2 bothers to ask if Shepard is really Shepard since he technically died. No one bats an eye about it and it’s shocking the writers didn’t notice this gaping problem. Oh, and then there’s the problem that the vast majority of squad mates are entirely pointless. Now I love them as characters kind you, but why do we need Thane when we never use his assassin/ ninja abilities on a mission? Or how about Jack? Who seems like a liability than an asset. Mordin is probably the only squad mate who has any plot relevance with the Collectors.
Thank you!!!! It's literally about nothing tbh. The third one is so much better played on legendary, I was shocked how much they added to it and I was not impressed at all with how weak this second game is
I just got through my first Legendary play through of the trilogy and, though I do love 2 as well, you capture my thoughts exactly. Despite those faults I do think it is probably the best individual game of the three, though ME3 is still my favorite. It’s completely structured on what Bioware did best at the time: character and immersive world building, and thus it gets away with having a very thin main plot that, once you know it, is rather mechanical and contrived and does little for the trilogy as a whole. All that said, it still ends well enough, and is again probably the best overall game experience.
I think thats part of the point ultimately. You trying to convince people of the reaper threat and them not believing. I do agree that more should've been done with it though, that would've been cool. And the idea of people not believing Shepard was actually themself would have been awesome, but i think for ME 1 companions they would have had faith that despite the grim circumstamce, Shepard wouldve lived
To me, Mass Effect 2 is "Daddy Issues and Plot Hole" the game. The idea that the human reaper is the "Core" of the Reaper whole is not what I got out of that, even the dialog you get from EDI: "It appears a Reaper's shape is based upon the species used to create it." This is in direct conflict with what has been shown up to that point as well as the clarification (retcon) given in the Leviathan DLC of ME3. Its an interesting bit of head canon, but that is not how it was described in the game. It also does not explain why the Collectors are doing this work prior to the official harvest for that cycle. EDI says something about the Reapers not being able to get Protheans to distill down to miracle grow juice (i.e. they couldn't actually harvest them) but at the same time we are told the collectors are genetically altered to serve the Reapers. So the Reapers can genetically alter the Protheans but can't melt them down into glue? Are the Reapers so desperate for new units that they have to preform a pre-harvest using the Collectors before the real Harvest? ME2's main plot line introduces a lot of questions, but answers none of them. This leads us to think it will be answered in ME3 just like a lot of the B-plot story lines, but they never actually do, or worse they are out right refuted. Also, I gotta disagree with your planetary exploration opinion. ME1's planetary exploration nearly made me quit the game it was so tedious and boring. It could have been fun, but the same 2 prefab interiors and heightmaps that were turned up to 11 felt like last minute padding because the main plot didn't have enough run time. I find all attempts at "planetary exploration" from ME1-3, DLCs included, are all the weakest parts and feel like crap I have to wade through to get to the good stuff. Aside from those two disagreements you and I agree on most everything else.
I think by the time up til they did the leviathan dlc they didn't have a fully nailed down origin of the reapers. So what that could've been was harbinger's experiment of doing something that in reality was a failed experiment. The true reapers were created in the leviathans image since they were the ones who created the catalyst, the Main AI of the reapers.
ME2 basically answers one question (why are the Collectors harvesting humans?) and that one answer only raises more questions. 1. Why are they doing this NOW? 2. How is this going to free the Reapers from their Dark Space prison? 3. How is human goo processed into sci-fi metal? 4. Why is the Reaper human-shaped? 5. Why didn't the Collector ship aid Sovereign at the end of ME1? 6. How are the Collectors planning on attacking Earth in order to finish the Reaper? And then there's Arrival. Goddamn motherfuckin' Arrival. This... thing completely invalidates the story of ME1. In ME1, the Reapers were TRAPPED in Dark Space. Their only way out was the Citadel Relay. Everything in ME1 confirms that fact. But now, APPARENTLY, the Reapers can just fly into the Milky Way. And it only takes them a couple of months, 2 years maximum. So... Sovereign plotting and scheming for decades if not centuries... was completely pointless. They could've flown in, used the Alpha Relay, go straight to the Citadel, disable the Relay Network and boom - they win! With the galaxy being none the wiser. So the story of the Reapers is as follows: ME1 - they waste time with Sovereign ME2 - they waste time with the Collectors ME3 - they waste time by not going straight to the Citadel Like, damn. The entire story completely collapsed on itself after ME1.
@@ThePreciseClimber Some things are like that as when they made the first game they just began making the lore so technically the Collectors didn't exist. In my opinion they started having the Collectors harvest humans as the Reapers realized how valuable the humans are because of Shepard who is a Human. Also I still don't get how the human goo is used to make a reaper. Also EDI says whatever species is harvested the Reaper looks like that species which does not make sense as all the capital ship Reapers look like the Leviathans. Also, one could imagine that there's a Mass Relay out in Dark Space where the Reapers hibernate and once they awake approximately every 50k years they use that relay to port to the Citadel Relay. However you also remember the Protheans scientists disabled the Citadel Relay from working. Also Sovereign was trying to figure out why the Citadel Relay stopped working when he sent the signal to power it on to let his Reaper friends through even though he is a Reaper he couldn't just appear and take on the whole galaxy. He had to do it in an incognito way as to not alert the entire galaxy of the Reaper threat, so he was taking his time, by the time of Mass Effect 1, we don't know how long Sovereign had been trying to get the Citadel Relay back online. Could have been decades or centuries.
Mani just did Thanes loyalty mission today and at one point i was literally a pixel away from losing my target, to know that that actually would have resulted on the mission being completely failed gives such weight to having completed it, mass effect 2 is truly a great game
I saved sidonus or whatever his name is because: 1. I’m always choosing paragon options 2. He does eventually turn himself in. You can hear it on the galactic news thingies
There is actually a paragon option with Kasumi where you offer to destroy the greybox for her. **spoiler** if she keeps that box it gets stolen. She also never moves on and heals from her lovers death. Some paragon actions are bad lol
If we're going to ignore the "surprise twist" at the end, what if the Collectors had the captured colonists and transformed them into human Collectors to be used as shock troops for the Reapers, like they did to the Protheans, if the Collector armor is any indication.
Dude I just wanna say you're quickly becoming one of my favorite youtubers, Appreciate ya and can't wait to watch this mass effect is one of my favorite game series flaws and all
I agree 100% - I played the original trilogy as they were released and played through MELE about 3 times so far. MELE has brought a new generation of ME fans more than a decade after the release of ME1 - a sign of a true masterpiece.
True, and personally, I like the story, I don't see how it's the weakest. Mass Effect games always had a few missions about the main story so idk why this TH-camr specifically picked on ME2 for this. I like the reapers in 3 but they were never important enough to me that I would mind not seeing them for a while game. I think people should complain more about how little of the Virmire survivor we saw. I know we're with Cerberus, but Bioware could've done way more with them than 2 scenes.
@@channel45853 Yeah. And since in this game they have such a small screentime, the reunion in the third game doesn't really feel that much satisfying because there is a huge gap between the first and third game in their character development. Also, I have a bit of a problem with how they are introduced in the third game as well (that stupid distrustfulness from Ashley I swear). Fortunately as the ME3 progresses the aspect of their character gets a lot better, but it's just a pity that they could've been one of the more important characters (furthermore playing into the "make your own story" element of the game), but end up as one of the side characters you don't care as much about. I feel like Virmire survivor should've been an easy slam dunk from BioWare, but they were too lazy to write them I guess.
I love watching videos like even if I've played these games thousands of times, I always learn something new!. I never considered bringing Legion to Tali's missions! Also one of my favorite things about this game is getting to know the companions! Recruiting them was great but when I found out I had to do quests for them, I got super excited!
Zaeed was one of my favorites because of how much he was like a friend of mine, who would always keep an eye on the neighborhood and school, sadly he would later die to side-effects of agent orange before I graduated from high-school. Then Zaeed was the only one to die in my play though, that really hurt me, haven't touched it since 💔 😭
I feel like the Genophage worked a lot better in the first game, where it wasn't clear that it was intended only to reduce Krogan numbers to a manageable level. It made it a lot more morally grey. The second game gives you an easy out for arguing in it's favour.
Gingy, I'm glad I found your channel. Not only did you breakdown fallout and dark souls in a way where I could understand the story better, you've made me believe that video games were art again. I can't wait until you breakdown Mass Effect 3 which will be a glorious culmination just like you did with Dark Souls. You are a very bright man and give good introspective. Honestly I feel like you are a pseudo friend to me even though I will never meet you.
I'm not too sure why but the email in ME3 where you see Kal Reagar is killed saving a Turian Patrol almost brings a tear to my eye. Because you can't save everyone, and he was always gonna be one of those people ready to lay down his life for anyone, and it's one of those that makes the message in ME3 hit. Playing through ME2 now can't wait to get back to ME3.
Mass Effect 2 was the second game I pre-ordered what a amazing game Mass Effect was one of the first games I ever played on the Xbox 360 it is a shame that Mass Effect 2 did so many things great and so many things wrong for one getting the upgrade system and streamlining it as well as the available skills and abilities was extremely disappointing to say the least... but the story characters theme environment everything was top-notch BioWare at their finest
I agree that ME2 weapon and ability progression were over-streamlined. ME3 was the perfect balance for me between ME1 and ME2 in that regard - a bit more weapon customization and abilities. Where ME2 shined was the Prologue (what an epic start!), companions, loyalty missions, DLC's, and main missions, including the epic finale. The only thing I wish that was a bit different was the role the Collectors play in the trilogy - the Collectors only appear in ME2. It would have been better if we see just a glimpse of the mysterious Collectors (or just hear about them through the Galaxy news or something) and instead of just building a human reaper, the Collectors were building a reaper (or even more than 1 reaper) to activate the Citadel mass relay that Sovereign could not. So if it wasn't for the suicide mission, the reapers would have arrived years earlier than they did in ME3. Also, it would have been great to see more Collectors in ME3 (they didn't all die out at the Collector base) - like there is a hidden Prothean colony in stasis that is being used by the reapers to make more Collectors. And Javik's loyalty mission is to free that colony!
To add to your review, yes, Mass Effect 2 was on 2 disks. And originally you were supposed to get all dossiers at the start. There's even Diolog still in game from aliens going into the plague zone to recruit Mordin.
1:46:09 fun fact, theres "unused" dialogue that shows garrus reacting to legion, basically a "hm, normally id decline but ill take it, cant be picky" like kal reegar. I say "unused" because its in the game, but you have to get legion later on
Thanks Gingy! Absolutely loving your Retrospectives! Keep up the good work, and thanks for giving us some amazing content to watch! Looking forward to ME3 and MEA
Been waiting for this! I love Mass Effect 2. Looking forward to hearing your opinion. I watched your entire Soulsborne series after I completed their respective game. Just watched your Sekiro one yesterday shortly after I finished Sekiro for the first time.
Regarding the recruitment of squadmates, you were originally meant to be able to recruit them in any order. This was abandoned late in development, due to the Xbox needing 2 disks in order to fit all of mass effect 2. So they had to divide the recruitment into 2 phases for disk 1 and 2. Second disk squadmates have dialogue for recruiting squadmates on the first disk
I saved the renegade playthru for FemShep, but even as a renegade, chose to play as “the A**hole with a heart of gold.” I.E. focused on safeguarding humanity, but made room in her schedule for the other races where it would benefit mankind/serve her own personal desires. Went all the way to controlling the Reapers bcuz she saw it as the only way of ensuring human dominance while still leaving room for the other races to have their own place (she’d gone all the way with Garrus by this point, and was effectively a half-sister with Tali and Liara). This is why the original ME trilogy will always stand above whatever comes next in the continuity for me. No other series will manage to equal the inter-personal bonds between the main characters while simultaneously having the stakes set so unfathomably high.
Honestly, I think the Reapers needed to be pushed into the 3rd game. If they want us to care about the galaxy burning around us under a swarm of space squid, we need to see it not on fire. ME1 was too busy setting up the trilogy's premise and universe and was therefore focused on that. ME2 lets us see more of the galaxy, meet more new people, and learn new details of the already known races.
If you do project ascension after the end of the main plotline (as i always do tbh) you get to see harbinger in its real reaper form, not significant but pretty cool
I feel like Mass Effect 2 was the peak if the series but also started the downfall. The thermal clips, hamstrung plot points that were dropped later, the focus on a new enemy among other things. Loved the lore, loved the details and of course the characters
Stumbled upon your channel yesterday and binged four videos back to back, now you drop a review of my all time favorite game. Great day! Edit: spelling
A Mass Effect 2 with the Normandy Squadmate interactions that ME3 had (the ones where garrus could move from his guns and tell war stories) is easily an S tier game right there
My only problem with the game is that when you’re planning the series back to back, 2 just feels like side mission the game. None of the missions feels connected to each other and I don’t feel the pay off of any of it until the last mission and playing through 3. There’s only like 5 or 6 actually main mission in a game that has like 30 or 40 something and half of those are really short. I don’t dislike like the game at all, I think it’s really well crafted, it was the first of the trilogy that I played. But it’s my least favorite of the 3 now cause it steers from the main plot so much for much of its run time I feel.
If you aren’t romantically involved with anyone, or are saving yourself for a ME1 party member, the Mordin convo still happens. He thinks you’ve been coming onto him and lets you down gently.
i think one of my favorite things about the shadow broker info on characters was the fact that legion played a quarrian dating simulator for 72 hrs, and has not seceded once it. Also that he bought a game that sole purpose was charity to quarrians. It to me shows that the geth are sympathetic to the quarrians and do actually want to come to an understanding of there creators, or at least legion does. also apparently legion was banned from a game for taunting his opponents, I take this to mean that he teabaged other players. also in the same game they tried to ban him for using a vi but the claims where disputed and those didn't go through, but he didn't try to dispute the taunting one and took the 4 day ban (or it was 4 months I forget).
There definitely is a good reason to keep Morinth alive and kill of Samara. A Renegade Shepard that literally took money from Pitne For and his drugs as Samara states she will hunt us down after her oath if we do anything Injust. Yea I could 100% see why a renegade Shepard would have this thought process and have Samara killed off dealing with that loose end.
The gameplay of ME1 is dated and the story of ME3 for me just felt lazy but ME2 is the sweet spot that I'll always enjoy. I hope another scifi series attempts to do what this game nailed in tone and self contained stories.
Great video, I think the only problem I have with the game is just the animation system, a lot of animations are reused and it really shows. I understand creating so many animations would be time consuming but I think they should have created unique animations for different races, could have helped make it more immersive. Game is definitely a masterpiece for its time, its my #2 GOAT behind Horizon Zero Dawn, Its just so replayable and the characters are easily some of the most memorable ever created, its almost the perfect game.
Absolutely! The repetitive animations really kill replayability for me. My first playthrough I didn't really notice. Now I see every animation each time it's recycled. The chest stretch, the "look away, look back", the finger point, the headshake and walk away, etc.. The single most impacting parts of ME2 and 3 were the handcrafted non-recycled animations.
I like that this game is very character focused. Not only do you have to spend time with your squad and gain their loyalty, you also get to grow closer to them as a result. I have just as much fun talking to characters like Mordin, Legion, and Garrus as well as playing the actual game it’s just great.
Rewriting the Heretics in ME2 is supposed to make combat in ME3 a little more tougher when you fight Geth. There's allegedly more Geth to fight but I haven't noticed the difference tbh
it makes fighting geth in mass effect 3 harder, but if you can make the geth into allies or make peace between geth and quarians, you get more war assets
ME2 is one of my top 5 favorite games of all time. I loved the darker tone, improved combat, and great characters. You don’t see games like this anymore.
A funfact: if you complete The Arrival DLC after beating the game the hologram you talk to in the end is Harbinger in his reaper self, not using the collector body.
9:55 Vanguard Charge is even cooler when you realize _you are warping like a starship in FTL_ - or a bullet. 12:20 Darth FemShep. That's new. 1:00:00 Which is absurd, because humans are among the _least_ genetically diverse species on Earth. 1:05:30 NOOOOOOO
I actually genuinely liked Miranda as a character, mostly because of her issues. She's such an ass, its great. Also the red eyes and scars from this game were a huge fave. Angy Shepard.
![PASULOL รามเกียรติ์ ตอนที่ 4 นนทกพบรัก [Ramakien Ep.4: Nonthok in love]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tMUQgmZzf_A/mqdefault.jpg)
The only criticism I have for this masterpiece: we're recruiting Legion way too late. Just not enough time.
I have many critism personally and point at this game as where ME got wrong. The morality system punish role playing, the leveling system is very limiting and offers about no variety of builds within a class, the Collector doesn’t really matter, we are railroaded into working for a terrorist group and we should have spent the middle installenent researching the Reaper not on a side quest. Oh and killing Shepard and destroying the Normandy was only done for shock value, it’s undone immediately and doesn’t affect Shepard im anyway. He died and resurrected and it didn’t change him or her in the slightest. They don’t even introspect about it.
@@oliviawilliams6204 Don't forget the giant baby Terminator boss fight at the end that's created by blending humans up and pumping them into it. People say ME3 ruined the Reapers, but if that's how they're created they were already on thin ice
Legion is my all time favorite character
@@oliviawilliams6204 Accurate.
Honestly how this game is forgiven by so many. You go inside a semi-disabled Reaper. A R E A P E R. The series main antagonist. Do you learn anything interesting about their motives? Do you have a repeat of the dialogue with Sovereign on Virmire? Do you have to fend of cosmic horror whispers and question your perceptions?
No. You just shoot waves of Husks and Scions. For 20 minutes.
Wow.
@@oliviawilliams6204 ``. He died and resurrected and it didn’t change him or her in the slightest. They don’t even introspect about it.``
It was a huge point in the narrative as to why Shepard was left to dry by the alliance and council.
Every Bioware game to date has made the mistake of having an enormous codex full of interesting lorem plus frequent, long loading screens. Yet for some reason, FOR SOME REASON, they have NEVER allowed you to peruse your codex while you're waiting for the game to load.
It's unforgivable.
Or open your journal in the galaxy map. Instead they just cluttered it with shitty sticky note flags.
@@UsernameGeri To be fair it was a colossal improvement form the first game, which was like Morrowind in how they handled quest direction and giving that info to the player.
actually not ENTIRELY true. In Dragon age inquisition you get (random) codex pages you have unlocked on the loading screens
thought, yes, mass effect should have had this (and give you time to read them [by letting the loading screen only end when you press a button)
Just check them out on the Elevator
They may have been afraid it could've been seen as a violation of Namco's loading screen patent.
if you save Sidonis, he ends up getting garrus father and Sister off of Palaven when the Reapers attack. It's a very nice touch to put Garrus morals back in place and to have it pay off positively in the end as opposed to not letting him do what he wants end up bad.
Adam, is that learned in ME3 or Is that canon in the comic book? I had no idea about that!
@@Scottie_S It's cut content actually. But it would have been a really nice touch as ME is known for actions having consequences. Because in ME2, killing Sidonis is a no brainer. But finding out Sidonis could have saved them in ME3 if he was alive would have been a real gut punch for Garrus since he let his revenge control him. Don't know why they didn't implement it in the actual game.
@@thatoneviewer1553 I don't know why they didn't either. I think we would have eaten that stuff up!
If Sidonis survive the encounter, he will sorrounded himself to the authorities but they will free him later due to the lack of charges against him
The Citadel doesn't has authority over Omega and basically anyone that commit crimes there don't go to prison
We learn about this hearing the news in the game
That why the 3rd is still my favorite, because the game is all payoff.
Rael's final message to Tali did NOT make her feel better. Her "thanks" was sarcastic; she hated the fact that his last message to her was an order, rather than some expression of familial affection or something. Shepard says as much to Shala'ran when they get back.
You know what is messed up about the story of ME2? During the entire argument between Mordin, Maelon, and Shepard on what to do about the Genophage, no one even thought to get any input from *the Krogan*
To be fair, there is a cut confrontation dialogue (Like Miranda and Jack have) with Mordin and Grunt about that.
Perfectly in character since both think their decisions are right based on their beliefs, not based on what the Krogans want as an species, though one can say Maleon is doing what Krogans want but don’t say
I think it's safe to say we know where they stand.
@@onepiece666 This is true. The flaws in both their beliefs are pretty evident as well.
Mordin is still acting like the Krogan Rebellions are still happening, which is a bit weird. He is also relying entirely on numbers and completely ignoring the cultural impact the Genophage had on the Krogan. This is totally fair as it was not part of his field.
Maelon is turning a blind eye to what the Blood Pack want to use the cure for as long as he got results. His volunteers also did not have complete informed consent so it is still totally messed up.
Meanwhile, the final decision is given to Shepard, a person who absolutely does not have all the information needed to make a properly informed decision.
God, what I wouldn't give to have Wrex in that conversation. Shame it couldn't happen because it was possible that he would have been dead by that point in the series.
Grunt was still figuring out who he even was. He didn't have any context yet about his people. Remember, his memories only start to make him feel anything later in the game. At first he sees mental images and flashes of info about Krogan history, but he feels nothing as he sees them. At the time of Mordin's loyalty my soon Grunt simply may not have any opinion yet.
Just want to point out that The Arrival DLC is intended to be a post game DLC, after the suicide run. That's why you don't see any impact until mass effect 3, and is also why Shepard is on earth at the beginning of 3 as in The Arrival you can choose to willingly (or otherwise I guess) to head back to earth to defend your actions of destroying the mass relay.
I think dispite all of that intentions, it is really fits with the last mission before the end mission and it would really suit the similar design of the first game. In the first game, you talk with Sovereign while you are talking with Harbinger in the second game. The reason for that is you were detentioned by alliance military at that point and that was not like a punishment instead the alliance was trying to protect shepard from the real punishment. Even he was working with Cerberus, he was after all stopped abductions from the human colonies, thus he was protected from the real punishment.
agreed. there has been a fair few misses in these videos
Point of fact: Shepard did in fact make it off the original Normandy alive. Shepard's death does come about 17 seconds later, but they did make it off the ship alive. Technically speaking.
Yeah, and floating around in space while your ship gets blown to space dust around you is probably the most fucked up scene in the game.
@@LegendaryDarkKnight602 And then they suffocate, flop through space, and perish. It was pretty gruesome.
@@katie5998 I like the movie Space Jam.
@@JaymeSplendid cool
nerd
I always have Kasumi destroy the box. Those memories aren't all she left of him. Plus in the next game she just holes herself in those memories. It's not healthy. Plus to me it dishonored Keji if she stopped being the person he fell in love with.
There's also a bunch of government secrets that could seriously dick the Alliance over, I don't think having VR sex with her dead boyfriend is really worth it
Doesn’t she say in ME3 that she didn’t really destroy the greybox? Or am I misremembering?
@@MikeP828 she says she destroyed the greybox but found a way to keep the alliance information.
My thought was it was Keiji's last request. Even though it was "Renegade"
I also pick to destroy the Geth instead of rewriting because Jack mentions that being brainwashed to nod and smile is horrible fate
@@TheDancerMacabre The thing is, the Heretic Geth were effectively brainwashed into serving the Reapers to begin with. All Shepard does is repair the error in their programming that made them think that aligning with the Reapers was the correct choice.
Mordin giving safe sex advice will never not be funny
Mordin overall will never stop being funny, him singing is hands down the best thing, still annoyed at the role he plays in ME3 wish my boy wasn't in the position he was put it.
@@milksterproductions Yeah, and the only way to save him is to do some shenanigans.
Also have Wrex dead.
In watching this video, his breakdown of Mordin made me realize: he's your alt goth friend
@@TheFlurryofFlames how did you realize that?😊
That's briliant😂😊😊
I think Mordin put it perfectly "Iam not sorry, Shepard. Have to be me, others could make mistake"
Plus dont forget bro is around 40 and thier species is pretty fast living. I think he had at most 5-10 years left amd sure as shit not with his level of selfpresavation. I loved him going out in a blaze for correcting his ONE mistake.
Better then seeing him mentally decline into a vegtable. Tech around the citadel-lvl can sure as shit keep u longer alive then most want for themselves
Mass Effect is literally all about getting together your Team for a heist. When you perceive it from that angle, it all clicks.
I always save Sidonis, but it's more about helping Garrus overcome base need for revenge. Just like with Dr. Saleon, it's about trying to make him a better person.
well I killed both of them
Big agree. Giving Garrus what he wants in that moment only allows him to fully become the kind of person he wanted to stop in the first place.
I kinda agree and disagree with you on this as I think both choices are dependent on the players morals I like sidonis die as I think it's the best outcome but everyone thinks different
@@Riddlywiddly They are both fine options. And that's what I like about the game. It's really just a personal choice for you on which you find better. No right or wrong. Just what feels appropriate at the time based on your character.
Na man Dr saleon always dies no matter what. He can’t be redeemed
Mordin giving you medical advice about how to safely romance Tali is one of the reason i love the dude. He knows everything about your crew, and helps in the best ways he can.
Just a generally quirky dude who wants to do good in the world
While also being Mengele
@@JoshSweetvale mengele was never remorseful.
Would like to point out that the Cerberus backstory here is a massive retcon from ME1. In ME1 it’s implied heavily that they were an Alliance Blackops group gone rogue
Everything about Cerberus is being retconned every game lol. First we apparently wiped them out in ME1 if you did those side quests, then in ME2 they have all the resources to not only rebuild the Normandy, but also had enough to not clone someone, but straight up bring them back from the dead after falling through the atmosphere of a planet. Then in ME3 they had an entire army and fleet we never saw before even though that would've been extremely useful against the Collectors
Didn't they SORTA handwave that with something like "oh it was THAT splinter faction of Cerberus that was a rogue black ops group."
@@ironwolf56 I believe so lmao
@@ironwolf56 yeah I think so. The Cerberus you hunt down for Kahoku were a different cell than the Lazarus cell, if I recall correctly.
@@MikeP828 As much as i love ME2, that was always big pet peeve for me. Especially if you have Sole Survivor background, there is no way to call out Cerberus for causing the deaths of Shepard's unit. Most people say that Sole Survivor Shepard would never work for Cerberus and normally i would agree with them. But it can work if addressed more which it unfortunately isn't.
In a way, I wish we saw more diversity in collector enemies. Insectoid design was great but I wish there was more dimorphism between close vs far away combatants. Just a shame the general model is never seen on the field.
Maybe some non bipedal enemies in that vein. They're 50k year old corrupted aliens, make em weird
Kinda makes sense, since they were genetically altered. With degenerated reproductive system there's no possibility of gene diversity and adaptation which makes them almost clones.
Same, I was hoping they would at least use the models from Mass Effect 3 in the remaster, but no :(
Pretorian was weird enough
I get your point but i think it's good as is, the collectors are just drones for the Reapers, nothing more, there's no need for diversity in looks for them since they exist for one purpose
When you look at the Collector General next to a Collector, you'd wonder what the Prothean General looked like next to a Prothean.
I lost Mordin on the last mission the first time I played this. I was very sad cause he was my favorite crew member. Damn RIP you jittery amphibious alien man
I lost Tali, she got shot in the face, and in ME3 I forgot and was like where's my friend
@@jbear3478 F in the chat for Tali
Me who lost Tali,Samara,Mordin and Kasumi: "They have forgone their lives for a better future."
I think mordin has the lowest score of all the teammates in the suicide mission, easy way I always make sure he survives is too just send him to escort the crew back as long as you did his loyalty mission he'll survive
35:30 Personally, I think it’s better to destroy the Greybox. Whether the info in it will be safe or not ultimately winds up being irrelevant, given the Reaper invasion. What is relevant is Kasumi’s future. If she keeps the Greybox, she never moves on from Keiji’s death. She spends all her free time plugged into the Greybox, reliving her memories with Keiji over and over. While convincing her to destroy the Greybox seems harsher at time, it gives her the space she needs to move on and keep living her life.
Ah a fellow man of Vanguard culture
What's interesting is that, even with all that is in the game to flesh out the crew members there was even more they initially planned, like a crew-mate conflict between mordin and grunt on the genophage, which would have been cool to see
Grunt is basically an adult baby that first saw the world just the moment he was recruted. In fact Grunt was Okeers way of ignoring the genophage. Wouldn't really make much sense for Grunt to care much about it in ME2.
@@janekbrat6951 yeah I could see why they cut it though would of loved more in character interactions
Jacob: If you're comfortable having an "ASSASSIN" watch your back.
He compared assassins to mercenaries but he himself is a gun for hire.
@@LegendaryDarkKnight602Jacob is Kanye West.
Let’s not forget that suicide mission from the mass effect 2 soundtrack is one of the greatest musical scores composed in all of human history
"Suicide mission" and "The end run" pure chills
Fucking yes
Also the very first scene is amazing, I would even argue The Attack is almost as good as Suicide Mission and The End Run purely from a quality perspective. It obviously doesn't have as much emotions and stakes attached to it so it'll never be as impactful, but I really love the sound design there
I liked the Collector's battle theme on Horizon.
Not to forget about the theme when you're introduced to the Normandy SR2 for the first time. This track still gives me chills and wet eyes after all these years.
The Arrival DLC is actually supposed to be completed post-main game. And it’s the reason Shepard is on earth under house arrest at the start of ME3, and it’s referenced several more times throughout the game.
It's ME2's Epilogue
It will be the reason if you complete it, but if you don’t, canon wise Hackett sends a team there which succeeds at blowing up the Mass Relay but they all die in the process. In this case Shepard is on trial for working together with Cerberus, an avid enemy of both the Council and the Alliance.
@@jerkopatrik well shit. Learn something new every day.
I've always sided either Soldier or Sentinel in ME2. Soldier using every weapon, minus the SMG, and having an easy mode button (called Adrenaline Rush) makes them a powerhouse with a bullet for everybody. Sentinel is the tankiest class in the game, with tech armor boosting and instantly recharging shields, and having both warp and overload on hand is incredibly useful.
I've played each class at least twice (male/female) and my favorite class is Vanguard, with Soldier and Sentinel at #2 and #3. Infiltrator and Adept at #4 and #5, with Engineer at #6. I agree with you on Adrenaline Rush being one of the most powerful abilities, but for me Charge is just more fun.
Vanguard you are able to 2 shot most enemies if you close up biotic charge on Insanity
which gets easier with practice knowing the strength of squadmates and enemy coordination
It is hell a satisfying and extremely invigorating i would only recommend playing insanity with Vanguard
@@Handlelesswithme Vanguard is insanely fun to play, feels even more fun in ME2 than ME3, maybe because mobility is more limited in ME2.
My favorite in this game was Infiltrator, in ME3 it was Adept. Adept with fully upgraded Dark Channel was kind of OP.
I really like how in the video the ardat-yakshi were compared to the succubus, it gives you an idea on how the devs got their inspiration for some of the species in mass effect.
Fun fact the Asari is actually based on an very famous abduction story where an construction had worker forced intercourse with a blue looking women cause of aliens
It was made famous because he had been very vocal that it did happen and aliens are real
Harbinger was already hinted to be a reaper in the Horizon Cutscene. You can clearly see him in the hologram behind the collector general lol was obvious with the voice and everything
When I was a kid, the collectors boarding the ship was the most terrifying thing I had ever played
I'm so glad you felt the exact same way I did about Zaeed. Good ole uncle Zaeed and his drunken war stories. I wish we got a little more of him but at least he's great in ME3 Citadel
A two hour analysis from Gingy? What an absolute treat!
Garrus and Femshep are unironically the most wholesome and believable romantic couple in a video game.
I always picked Garrus when I've played this game. He's just so awesome lol
Male shep and Tali are tied.
If you don't romance anyone in the first two, I'd say that Samantha Traynor and FemShep are a close second. Because it's like a cute lesbian suddenly joins the crew and FemShep is like "oh yea bet"
But they're the number one for gay options.
Yep femshep garrus is the only true romance
Disgusting
I usually don’t let Garrus take the shot in his loyalty mission. I thought that it wasn’t what Garrus really needed, and that he really needed to be able to forget the past and move on. The best way I thought for that was for him to let go of revenge.
One of my biggest issues with ME2's story is the fact that Sole Survivor Shepard - if the Corporal Toombs mission was done in ME - never mentions the fact they killed his Akuze squadmates due to their experiments with thresher maws. Ever. Despite being a significant event in his life that shaped a part of his personality. Tela Vasir had to actually point that out. The reason, of course, is because we wouldn't have the intended ME2 story (which I love, to be clear) if that fact were brought up, as it would be too unbelievable that Shepard would work with Cerberus then. I still think it's a really cheap way they went about it, though.
And Cerberus is DEFINITELY a terrorist organisation. They went rogue and split off from the Alliance, conducted inhumane experiments on humans and aliens, silenced even high-ranking military officials that found out too much, assassinated political figures, kidnapped children, etc. I agree that it isn't black and white and they're mostly helpful in this game, but that doesn't make them any less terrorists, or wash away the fact they did some absolutely horrendous things up to that point.
I think there are ways that Sole Survivor Shepard would work with Cerberus. Shepard doesn't have to trust nor forgive Cerberus for what they have done, but he doesn't have much options since Alliance and Council refuses to help and he needs resources and team to take down Collectors from attacking any other colonies. Still, i wish there was chance for Shepard to call out TIM for the Akuze incident and TIM would say they were separate or rogue scientists or something. I wish we didn't need Vasir to point that out for us.
Nope. Operation: paperclip 'em.......
I like to think Shep regardless of trauma is practical enough to realize sometimes you have to work with people you hate for a greater purpose. Shep had no other realistic options for funding and a squad.
Outside of Cerberus there's not an alternative to fight the Collectors. The Alliance just give you the middle finger and don't trust you. The Council cut ties with you, despite that hey can give you your Spectre status, and don't want to be involved in what they call “human business".
The only alternative is Cerberus. Is up to the player to trust in them or not. However I'm agree that the game should have let us been more vocal about the shit they did
There's some dialogue options that mentioned the side quests in MA1 but that's it. But you can be very clear about not trusting Cerberus
I would think they would at least have an option to point it out to the Illusive man
I never knew about the Dark Energy plot line until this video. That would have made the Reapers harder to hate and really would have thrown the ethics of fighting them into question. It also would have been a great way to segue into the Indoctrination Theory plot line. Huge kudos for the research and organization of a very dense game/series. Incredible job condensing everything without blowing over anything important.
Mass effect 2 was so impactful to me I now constantly try to get my friends to play the series
One thing I think that's absent here its the fact that it is a retrospective. When it came out and we were unsure about the next step and what would or wouldn't be expanded on. The ending of Arrival sent a shiver across my body because I wasnt sure when ME would come about. Having prior knowledge and info how everything shakes down makes things less intense.
I love these types of videos, and I know they must take a WHILE to create. Props to you Gingy!
i love the way garrus just sits in the background during tali’s trial 😂
Even better when you get Legion in there. He sits just like Garrus, but the fact that no one's even keeping an eye on him and it's just like a little kid waiting for his parents to stop talking to their friends is hilarious.
“I’ve had enough of your disengenuous assertions!” is one of my favorite videogame moments of all time.
I love your game analysis. Never disappointed. I always learn something new from games that I play 1000 times. Keep the good work
A small detail I always missed during Tali's loyalty mission was her strained relationship with her father. If you don't use a paragon interrupt to hug it out, Tali instead talks about how what she wanted was a father who was there to spend time with her instead of away chasing dreams of reclaiming the homeworld.
If you expose the evidence at the trial, Tali can vent to Admiral Ran about how her father's last words were not a goodbye to her but rather instructions for Tali to shutdown the geth and retrieve the data. And on the Normandy, Shepard can defend his actions be saying it was what her father wanted but Tali responds that she is tired of people doing terrible things for her benefit and without her consent. Exposing the evidence will result in her not being loyal for the final mission.
If you allow Tali to be exiled, Admiral Ran will angrily confront you two about not showing the data. Tali can respond that it is for the good of the fleet which only makes Ran angrier, with her saying that Tali is just like her father being far too willing to sacrifice everything for the fleet. Tali however takes her exile with pride saying she was exiled for the good of the fleet and not through any fault of her own. Allowing her to be exiled actually results in her being loyal.
I adore this mission for highlighting how much Tali wished her father wasn't so absent, too focused on the fleet to care for his own daughter; and yet Tali also is just as willing to sacrifice anything for the fleet, even her own place in it.
I have the opposite opinion. The Daddy issue trope is a lazy & pushing narrative shown way too much in media and shows more about the producers writers perceived trauma than I believe fits Tali. She idolized her father and it would nice to know she realized her father's love in his attempt to do ANYTHING to make sure she had a normal life on their homeworld.
@Imapotato The fact that basically everyone has "daddy issues" in Mass Effect is pretty bad when you think about it.
Miranda has the egomaniacal father, Jacob has an actual monster for a father, Thane is an absentee father, and Wrex's father literally tried to kill him. But at least Tali's story is the most fleshed and nuanced of the bunch.
@@NinjaMan47 Yea that is why I hoped one of the great characters would have been spared. In ME2 she showed none of that, but she gets drunk & slams her dad... was disappointing
I always thought the collectors were meant to be a sort of clean up crew after the reaper's arrival, but they had to be activated early because the Reaper Invasion was delayed. Why else would they have a massive ship with enough pods to collect an entire planet, and a reaper assembly area on their homeworld/station/hive?
I get why people love the game, I just think it blinds people to its faults. Shamus Young does an excellent video on how many of the things Mass Effect 1 set up to make writing Mass Effect 2 easier are thrown out the window. Such as being a Spectre giving character agency, hints of the galaxy getting ready for what comes next, Laura’s research, etc.
But what damages this game severely is that by and large it adds nothing to the Reaper plot. The Collectors don’t advance the Reaper story at all. We end ME1 and start ME3 in the same position. Honestly ME2 should’ve been about getting the galaxy ready for the Reapers. Maybe even have a Dragon Age style group meeting where we try to plead our case to the other races. Which would determine how easy or hard it would be to fight the Reapers in ME3.
It also doesn’t help this game hurts ME3 by answering like idk… Shepard coming from the grave might be a big deal! Like Jesus, no one in ME2 bothers to ask if Shepard is really Shepard since he technically died. No one bats an eye about it and it’s shocking the writers didn’t notice this gaping problem.
Oh, and then there’s the problem that the vast majority of squad mates are entirely pointless. Now I love them as characters kind you, but why do we need Thane when we never use his assassin/ ninja abilities on a mission? Or how about Jack? Who seems like a liability than an asset. Mordin is probably the only squad mate who has any plot relevance with the Collectors.
Thank you!!!! It's literally about nothing tbh. The third one is so much better played on legendary, I was shocked how much they added to it and I was not impressed at all with how weak this second game is
PS I think original shep is gone. This is a new soul with his/her memories
I just got through my first Legendary play through of the trilogy and, though I do love 2 as well, you capture my thoughts exactly. Despite those faults I do think it is probably the best individual game of the three, though ME3 is still my favorite. It’s completely structured on what Bioware did best at the time: character and immersive world building, and thus it gets away with having a very thin main plot that, once you know it, is rather mechanical and contrived and does little for the trilogy as a whole. All that said, it still ends well enough, and is again probably the best overall game experience.
I think thats part of the point ultimately. You trying to convince people of the reaper threat and them not believing. I do agree that more should've been done with it though, that would've been cool.
And the idea of people not believing Shepard was actually themself would have been awesome, but i think for ME 1 companions they would have had faith that despite the grim circumstamce, Shepard wouldve lived
To me, Mass Effect 2 is "Daddy Issues and Plot Hole" the game.
The idea that the human reaper is the "Core" of the Reaper whole is not what I got out of that, even the dialog you get from EDI: "It appears a Reaper's shape is based upon the species used to create it."
This is in direct conflict with what has been shown up to that point as well as the clarification (retcon) given in the Leviathan DLC of ME3. Its an interesting bit of head canon, but that is not how it was described in the game.
It also does not explain why the Collectors are doing this work prior to the official harvest for that cycle.
EDI says something about the Reapers not being able to get Protheans to distill down to miracle grow juice (i.e. they couldn't actually harvest them) but at the same time we are told the collectors are genetically altered to serve the Reapers. So the Reapers can genetically alter the Protheans but can't melt them down into glue? Are the Reapers so desperate for new units that they have to preform a pre-harvest using the Collectors before the real Harvest?
ME2's main plot line introduces a lot of questions, but answers none of them. This leads us to think it will be answered in ME3 just like a lot of the B-plot story lines, but they never actually do, or worse they are out right refuted.
Also, I gotta disagree with your planetary exploration opinion. ME1's planetary exploration nearly made me quit the game it was so tedious and boring. It could have been fun, but the same 2 prefab interiors and heightmaps that were turned up to 11 felt like last minute padding because the main plot didn't have enough run time. I find all attempts at "planetary exploration" from ME1-3, DLCs included, are all the weakest parts and feel like crap I have to wade through to get to the good stuff.
Aside from those two disagreements you and I agree on most everything else.
I think by the time up til they did the leviathan dlc they didn't have a fully nailed down origin of the reapers. So what that could've been was harbinger's experiment of doing something that in reality was a failed experiment. The true reapers were created in the leviathans image since they were the ones who created the catalyst, the Main AI of the reapers.
ME2 basically answers one question (why are the Collectors harvesting humans?) and that one answer only raises more questions.
1. Why are they doing this NOW?
2. How is this going to free the Reapers from their Dark Space prison?
3. How is human goo processed into sci-fi metal?
4. Why is the Reaper human-shaped?
5. Why didn't the Collector ship aid Sovereign at the end of ME1?
6. How are the Collectors planning on attacking Earth in order to finish the Reaper?
And then there's Arrival. Goddamn motherfuckin' Arrival. This... thing completely invalidates the story of ME1.
In ME1, the Reapers were TRAPPED in Dark Space. Their only way out was the Citadel Relay. Everything in ME1 confirms that fact. But now, APPARENTLY, the Reapers can just fly into the Milky Way. And it only takes them a couple of months, 2 years maximum. So... Sovereign plotting and scheming for decades if not centuries... was completely pointless. They could've flown in, used the Alpha Relay, go straight to the Citadel, disable the Relay Network and boom - they win! With the galaxy being none the wiser.
So the story of the Reapers is as follows:
ME1 - they waste time with Sovereign
ME2 - they waste time with the Collectors
ME3 - they waste time by not going straight to the Citadel
Like, damn. The entire story completely collapsed on itself after ME1.
@@ThePreciseClimber Some things are like that as when they made the first game they just began making the lore so technically the Collectors didn't exist. In my opinion they started having the Collectors harvest humans as the Reapers realized how valuable the humans are because of Shepard who is a Human. Also I still don't get how the human goo is used to make a reaper. Also EDI says whatever species is harvested the Reaper looks like that species which does not make sense as all the capital ship Reapers look like the Leviathans. Also, one could imagine that there's a Mass Relay out in Dark Space where the Reapers hibernate and once they awake approximately every 50k years they use that relay to port to the Citadel Relay. However you also remember the Protheans scientists disabled the Citadel Relay from working. Also Sovereign was trying to figure out why the Citadel Relay stopped working when he sent the signal to power it on to let his Reaper friends through even though he is a Reaper he couldn't just appear and take on the whole galaxy. He had to do it in an incognito way as to not alert the entire galaxy of the Reaper threat, so he was taking his time, by the time of Mass Effect 1, we don't know how long Sovereign had been trying to get the Citadel Relay back online. Could have been decades or centuries.
Mani just did Thanes loyalty mission today and at one point i was literally a pixel away from losing my target, to know that that actually would have resulted on the mission being completely failed gives such weight to having completed it, mass effect 2 is truly a great game
I saved sidonus or whatever his name is because:
1. I’m always choosing paragon options
2. He does eventually turn himself in. You can hear it on the galactic news thingies
There is actually a paragon option with Kasumi where you offer to destroy the greybox for her. **spoiler** if she keeps that box it gets stolen. She also never moves on and heals from her lovers death. Some paragon actions are bad lol
If we're going to ignore the "surprise twist" at the end, what if the Collectors had the captured colonists and transformed them into human Collectors to be used as shock troops for the Reapers, like they did to the Protheans, if the Collector armor is any indication.
Dude I just wanna say you're quickly becoming one of my favorite youtubers, Appreciate ya and can't wait to watch this mass effect is one of my favorite game series flaws and all
Garrus left the space police to become space Batman
Was just rewatching the first one last night!! Thank you Gingy❤️❤️
This is my favourite game ever an absolute masterpiece from start to finish.
I agree 100% - I played the original trilogy as they were released and played through MELE about 3 times so far. MELE has brought a new generation of ME fans more than a decade after the release of ME1 - a sign of a true masterpiece.
True, and personally, I like the story, I don't see how it's the weakest. Mass Effect games always had a few missions about the main story so idk why this TH-camr specifically picked on ME2 for this. I like the reapers in 3 but they were never important enough to me that I would mind not seeing them for a while game. I think people should complain more about how little of the Virmire survivor we saw. I know we're with Cerberus, but Bioware could've done way more with them than 2 scenes.
@@channel45853 Yeah. And since in this game they have such a small screentime, the reunion in the third game doesn't really feel that much satisfying because there is a huge gap between the first and third game in their character development. Also, I have a bit of a problem with how they are introduced in the third game as well (that stupid distrustfulness from Ashley I swear). Fortunately as the ME3 progresses the aspect of their character gets a lot better, but it's just a pity that they could've been one of the more important characters (furthermore playing into the "make your own story" element of the game), but end up as one of the side characters you don't care as much about. I feel like Virmire survivor should've been an easy slam dunk from BioWare, but they were too lazy to write them I guess.
Lair of the Shadow Broker easily has the best romance writing in the entire trilogy and it's not even close.
Liara the Shadow Broker.
I love watching videos like even if I've played these games thousands of times, I always learn something new!. I never considered bringing Legion to Tali's missions! Also one of my favorite things about this game is getting to know the companions! Recruiting them was great but when I found out I had to do quests for them, I got super excited!
Zaeed was one of my favorites because of how much he was like a friend of mine, who would always keep an eye on the neighborhood and school, sadly he would later die to side-effects of agent orange before I graduated from high-school. Then Zaeed was the only one to die in my play though, that really hurt me, haven't touched it since 💔 😭
I feel like the Genophage worked a lot better in the first game, where it wasn't clear that it was intended only to reduce Krogan numbers to a manageable level. It made it a lot more morally grey. The second game gives you an easy out for arguing in it's favour.
Mass effect 123 is my favourite game series ever. Actually teared up at the Xmas party photo at the end of 3 😭
Gingy, I'm glad I found your channel. Not only did you breakdown fallout and dark souls in a way where I could understand the story better, you've made me believe that video games were art again. I can't wait until you breakdown Mass Effect 3 which will be a glorious culmination just like you did with Dark Souls. You are a very bright man and give good introspective. Honestly I feel like you are a pseudo friend to me even though I will never meet you.
I'm not too sure why but the email in ME3 where you see Kal Reagar is killed saving a Turian Patrol almost brings a tear to my eye. Because you can't save everyone, and he was always gonna be one of those people ready to lay down his life for anyone, and it's one of those that makes the message in ME3 hit. Playing through ME2 now can't wait to get back to ME3.
Thank you for being the first lore channel I’ve heard accurately describe primary and secondary mass relays
Wow, just finished rewatching your video on ME1 last night and now this? Can’t ask for more
Mass Effect 2 was the second game I pre-ordered what a amazing game Mass Effect was one of the first games I ever played on the Xbox 360 it is a shame that Mass Effect 2 did so many things great and so many things wrong for one getting the upgrade system and streamlining it as well as the available skills and abilities was extremely disappointing to say the least... but the story characters theme environment everything was top-notch BioWare at their finest
I agree that ME2 weapon and ability progression were over-streamlined. ME3 was the perfect balance for me between ME1 and ME2 in that regard - a bit more weapon customization and abilities. Where ME2 shined was the Prologue (what an epic start!), companions, loyalty missions, DLC's, and main missions, including the epic finale. The only thing I wish that was a bit different was the role the Collectors play in the trilogy - the Collectors only appear in ME2. It would have been better if we see just a glimpse of the mysterious Collectors (or just hear about them through the Galaxy news or something) and instead of just building a human reaper, the Collectors were building a reaper (or even more than 1 reaper) to activate the Citadel mass relay that Sovereign could not. So if it wasn't for the suicide mission, the reapers would have arrived years earlier than they did in ME3. Also, it would have been great to see more Collectors in ME3 (they didn't all die out at the Collector base) - like there is a hidden Prothean colony in stasis that is being used by the reapers to make more Collectors. And Javik's loyalty mission is to free that colony!
To add to your review, yes, Mass Effect 2 was on 2 disks. And originally you were supposed to get all dossiers at the start. There's even Diolog still in game from aliens going into the plague zone to recruit Mordin.
1:46:09 fun fact, theres "unused" dialogue that shows garrus reacting to legion, basically a "hm, normally id decline but ill take it, cant be picky" like kal reegar. I say "unused" because its in the game, but you have to get legion later on
those mods that allow you to have Legion from the begining are hilarious
Thane is absolute sweetheart in my eyes. I absolutely loved him 😭
Great video,
One thing, renege isn't 'evil' it's 'ends justify the means'- must stop the reapers, you either help or you get out of the way.
Can't believe I spent 2 straight hours watching this, damn the content is so good that time went by without me noticing
I can’t say I agree with you on everything but you present in such a way I’m excited to see you’re take on mass effect 3
Thanks Gingy!
Absolutely loving your Retrospectives!
Keep up the good work, and thanks for giving us some amazing content to watch!
Looking forward to ME3 and MEA
Been waiting for this! I love Mass Effect 2. Looking forward to hearing your opinion. I watched your entire Soulsborne series after I completed their respective game. Just watched your Sekiro one yesterday shortly after I finished Sekiro for the first time.
Regarding the recruitment of squadmates, you were originally meant to be able to recruit them in any order. This was abandoned late in development, due to the Xbox needing 2 disks in order to fit all of mass effect 2. So they had to divide the recruitment into 2 phases for disk 1 and 2. Second disk squadmates have dialogue for recruiting squadmates on the first disk
So many companions and yet I used garrus and wrex/grunt through the entire series lol
I saved the renegade playthru for FemShep, but even as a renegade, chose to play as “the A**hole with a heart of gold.” I.E. focused on safeguarding humanity, but made room in her schedule for the other races where it would benefit mankind/serve her own personal desires. Went all the way to controlling the Reapers bcuz she saw it as the only way of ensuring human dominance while still leaving room for the other races to have their own place (she’d gone all the way with Garrus by this point, and was effectively a half-sister with Tali and Liara).
This is why the original ME trilogy will always stand above whatever comes next in the continuity for me. No other series will manage to equal the inter-personal bonds between the main characters while simultaneously having the stakes set so unfathomably high.
Honestly, I think the Reapers needed to be pushed into the 3rd game. If they want us to care about the galaxy burning around us under a swarm of space squid, we need to see it not on fire. ME1 was too busy setting up the trilogy's premise and universe and was therefore focused on that. ME2 lets us see more of the galaxy, meet more new people, and learn new details of the already known races.
If you do project ascension after the end of the main plotline (as i always do tbh) you get to see harbinger in its real reaper form, not significant but pretty cool
Another top notch video!!! Thanks for these.
I feel like Mass Effect 2 was the peak if the series but also started the downfall. The thermal clips, hamstrung plot points that were dropped later, the focus on a new enemy among other things. Loved the lore, loved the details and of course the characters
Tali has always been my main squeeze! Even if her canonical appearance is a stock photo.
Stumbled upon your channel yesterday and binged four videos back to back, now you drop a review of my all time favorite game. Great day!
Edit: spelling
A Mass Effect 2 with the Normandy Squadmate interactions that ME3 had (the ones where garrus could move from his guns and tell war stories) is easily an S tier game right there
My only problem with the game is that when you’re planning the series back to back, 2 just feels like side mission the game.
None of the missions feels connected to each other and I don’t feel the pay off of any of it until the last mission and playing through 3.
There’s only like 5 or 6 actually main mission in a game that has like 30 or 40 something and half of those are really short. I don’t dislike like the game at all, I think it’s really well crafted, it was the first of the trilogy that I played. But it’s my least favorite of the 3 now cause it steers from the main plot so much for much of its run time I feel.
yeah, in hindsight its basically all just set up for 3 really.
Fun fact: the Vorcha are voiced by Mark Meer who also voices male Shepherd
If you aren’t romantically involved with anyone, or are saving yourself for a ME1 party member, the Mordin convo still happens. He thinks you’ve been coming onto him and lets you down gently.
Good job putting this together, I'm usually not a fan of longer form vids but this was well done.
i think one of my favorite things about the shadow broker info on characters was the fact that legion played a quarrian dating simulator for 72 hrs, and has not seceded once it. Also that he bought a game that sole purpose was charity to quarrians. It to me shows that the geth are sympathetic to the quarrians and do actually want to come to an understanding of there creators, or at least legion does. also apparently legion was banned from a game for taunting his opponents, I take this to mean that he teabaged other players. also in the same game they tried to ban him for using a vi but the claims where disputed and those didn't go through, but he didn't try to dispute the taunting one and took the 4 day ban (or it was 4 months I forget).
10:52 Tackle to the nuts? Outstanding move Shepard, that's why you're the boss
There definitely is a good reason to keep Morinth alive and kill of Samara. A Renegade Shepard that literally took money from Pitne For and his drugs as Samara states she will hunt us down after her oath if we do anything Injust. Yea I could 100% see why a renegade Shepard would have this thought process and have Samara killed off dealing with that loose end.
The gameplay of ME1 is dated and the story of ME3 for me just felt lazy but ME2 is the sweet spot that I'll always enjoy. I hope another scifi series attempts to do what this game nailed in tone and self contained stories.
Fantastic content as always! Keep up the great work! 😊
You deserve so much more credit for explaining these games so we'll. I knew nothing before I watched your videos.
Great video, I think the only problem I have with the game is just the animation system, a lot of animations are reused and it really shows. I understand creating so many animations would be time consuming but I think they should have created unique animations for different races, could have helped make it more immersive. Game is definitely a masterpiece for its time, its my #2 GOAT behind Horizon Zero Dawn, Its just so replayable and the characters are easily some of the most memorable ever created, its almost the perfect game.
Absolutely! The repetitive animations really kill replayability for me. My first playthrough I didn't really notice. Now I see every animation each time it's recycled. The chest stretch, the "look away, look back", the finger point, the headshake and walk away, etc.. The single most impacting parts of ME2 and 3 were the handcrafted non-recycled animations.
I like that this game is very character focused. Not only do you have to spend time with your squad and gain their loyalty, you also get to grow closer to them as a result. I have just as much fun talking to characters like Mordin, Legion, and Garrus as well as playing the actual game it’s just great.
50:13 As it happens Kasumi is incredibly sympathetic to Jack, bring her along for Suze's loyalty mission, and in awe at Miranda.
I never knew about the Legion flotilla interactions, never tried so hard to go out of my way. That’s so awesome that the team thought of that stuff.
Rewriting the Heretics in ME2 is supposed to make combat in ME3 a little more tougher when you fight Geth. There's allegedly more Geth to fight but I haven't noticed the difference tbh
it makes fighting geth in mass effect 3 harder, but if you can make the geth into allies or make peace between geth and quarians, you get more war assets
@@mahmudulhossain7420 it’s actually better to kill the heritics for both the alliance and difficulty
Man.... i love these deep dives!! I cant get enough
Edit: remember fans...its "the Illusive man" not the "Elusive man."
48:47 Aresh actually survives the bomb explosion and saves alot of people in ME3 when he delays the reapers as civilians evacuate. He dies doing that.
Looks like I arrived here really early. Lucky me, been waiting for your next video anxiously.
ME2 is one of my top 5 favorite games of all time. I loved the darker tone, improved combat, and great characters. You don’t see games like this anymore.
Love all your content. The amount of detail you provide is incredible.
he does a good job but he still missed a lot, same with ME1
A funfact: if you complete The Arrival DLC after beating the game the hologram you talk to in the end is Harbinger in his reaper self, not using the collector body.
absolute banger of a video Gingy, Love the content you make, Looking forward to the MS3 video as well 😄
9:55 Vanguard Charge is even cooler when you realize _you are warping like a starship in FTL_ - or a bullet.
12:20 Darth FemShep. That's new.
1:00:00 Which is absurd, because humans are among the _least_ genetically diverse species on Earth.
1:05:30 NOOOOOOO
I miss the crazy sprinting from the first one. Also good to see another helmeted in cutscenes person.
I actually genuinely liked Miranda as a character, mostly because of her issues. She's such an ass, its great.
Also the red eyes and scars from this game were a huge fave. Angy Shepard.