Author's note: at 13:30 we've got an 'oops'. On-screen it shows Helium-3, but with one proton and 2 neutrons on the image, that would be hydrogen-3 or Tritium, He-3 would be two protons and a neutron. I'm gonna blame that one on being busy getting ready for the ISDC, though the slide is from an older episode so that's more of 'failed to catch the error again' :)
REALLY HATE your use of A.I. “art” in your header it’s absolutely 2000% garbage on fire. Can you NOT use real human artwork instead? ARTISTS AGAINST A.I.
@@donhillsmanii5906 this is a channel about futurism and the future of humanity... I think the AI art fits perfectly and makes perfect sense next to the human art
@@donhillsmanii5906 The slides are just eye candy anyway, aside from a few important charts or graphs. If you are not ADD-riddled like me, you can always just do something else while listening to Isaac.
When I read "author's note", in my mind I was reading it with voice, but because it was in your voice my brain interpreted it as Arthur's note even though I read author's note
Great example is the Expanse. Huge agricultural domes powered by orbital mirrors, and underground living facilities. In that universe, its the safest place to birth and raise children off-earth, though still not better than earth!
Taken to it's logical conclusion, orbitals would be overall safer and healthier than any moon or planet, including earth. Just need a ton of orbital industry to get it going (note I didn't say tech, because most of the tech we'd absolutely need we already have, just not the engineering yet)
Amusing story, my best friend decided he wanted to try his hand at making mead so swung by to get some honey (my wife keeps bees) , 'Ganymead' was one of the names we kicked around for the label.
Cool. This reminds me of an old short story "Christmas on Ganymede". In that story Ganymede had an indigenous population that funnily enough was described as "they can speak English but when they do that you wish that the couldn't". Yes the story was meant as comedy. I just checked on Wikipedia. Apparently written by Isaac Asimov. The article says written 1940 and published 1942.
For us old timer nukes, that 0.08 Sieverts figure for radiation on the surface of Ganymede is equivalent to 8 Rem per day. While not lethal short term, that's a pretty strong dose. For comparison, after working in nuclear for decades I've only had a total recorded cumulative dose of maybe half that. I could get my lifetime occupational dose on the surface of Ganymede in half a day probably. It won't kill you but do that enough times and you likely have cancer in your future. Heavily shielded or underground habs would be a must for colonization.
That figure got a smile from me! It reminded me of when I used to teach radiological protection, and would bombard my students with the units and ask for convertions. 😂
I have sort of a soft spot for Ganymede. Ever since an obscure scifi story from the early 80s mentioned Ganymede as being colonized by my ethnic group. I was so happy! We made it! We have a world to ourselves! Someone recognized us as worthy of that! It's an irradiated rock 2.4 times smaller than the Earth, but I'm not asking for much! Just enough space to build our dome cities or arcologies and grow our numbers! Come to Ganymede and stay awhile! The restaurant and bakeries are awesome!😋
What is the obscure sci fi story from the 80s where Ganymede is colonized by an ethnic group? I must be trying all the wrong searches because I can’t find it… but my search did remind me to read Ken MacLeod’s series.
Bro, I read it as "I would go out with Callisto, because her father works for ratiation belt". I'm like... is he making his own nuclear powerplant, or is he popping WW3.
I kinda wonder what sort of damage Terra-forming our moon might have on planet Earth. I would think the differences of Sunlight due to the atmosphere of the moon might come into play in some way. A lot of biology is wired for moonlight. What happens if we toyed with that?
That is true of a number of very good channels, in science and various other genres. Might I recommend, in no particular order: The Click Jammidodger DUST Rebecca Watson Beau of the Fifth Column Storied Randy Rainbow The Launch Pad Old Gods of Appalachia Anton Petrov The Professional Left
Interestingly in Babylon 5 the earthgov was trying to liberate a shadow vessel from the surface of Ganymede and of course when the thing went crazy it destroyed the surface domes. Thank goodness Sheridan already there waiting for it
Hey Isaac Arthur, because of your space interests and covering all kinds of space related topics, I'd recommend to you checking out both Talk pages that are respectively associated to the Fermi Paradox and the space colonization Wikipedia pages, and in the latter case the very bottom part.
Gregory Benford wrote ''Against Infinity'' about humanity's attempts to colonize Ganymede. However an ancient alien (robotic) entity, the Aleph, tries to counter this...
One question though. What would be the incentive for choosing Ganymede over Callisto? Whatever advantages Ganymede has, e.g., abundance of water ice, even subsurface ocean, are present also on Callisto. However, Callisto has several advantages, such as lower ambient radiation, stable geology (Ganymede may have plate tectonics ) and being not as deep inside Jupiter's gravity well as Ganymede. As for mining Jupiter or IO, such works will be done by robots anyway. A little outpost would do. Makes no sense to build a vast colony in a hostile environment just for that. If the goal is to biologically colonize the Jovian system, I don't see much reason for choosing Ganymede over Callisto.
I recently read that some ETs grom another system landd on Gamymede and when the Space Force learned of it they wemt there to welcome these new arrivals. I haven't received any confirmation but I hope it's true.
I just hope when we do, that a giant orbital space battle between earth and mars ravages the local lunar community for months leading to a massive refugee crisis to the edge of the solar system.
Oh my god! And then what would happen? Would some strange alien substance then infect an entire asteroid colony? Would that asteroid then fly itself into Venus? Would that asteroid then fly to the edge of the solar system and create a giant ring structure?
Most technologically sophisticated people today would be vastly disappointed in humanity if by 2156, autonomous robots were not way superior to humans now in doing any tasks in space, and autonomous robots could be made in much more varied form factors and with different intrinsic capabilities. For that matter, there are many today who believe that a crash program could achieve such robots by 2056, a hundred years earlier. I just can't be sold on how biology is an advantage in space.
Issac you should run for president of the United States. It's not just an idea, this is a calling. You above all else I would trust with power, and the future.
You pronounce the "R" in some words and others it's just not pronounced. Like, world Wo'old, un own, field fe'ild, terraform teariform. Teariform seems like how you would describe what is being done to Earth right now. For some reason, I still hate the King who forced everyone to speak with a lispe. It's interesting to hear the two ways of speaking come from the same person in close association to each other. I grew up hating the story of that king from the time I first heard it. I was told to ignore the lispe, but it's just a reminder of that twama. It's a person being comfortable with oppression in my mind, and I need to get rid of that bias I developed as a kid. It's not healthy, to a point it's hard to hear speak to this day.
I wonder why Callisto wouldn't be picked instead, as a "crown jewel" of Jupiter. Also rich in water and various resources, far enough from Jupiter that radiation is even lower (even taking Ganymede's magnetic field into account), and its outer orbit might be a bit easier for ship transit purposes. While also making a good base to exploit the rest of Jupiter from.
Honestly, since getting a decent idea on how much more efficient habitats are versus planetary colonization, I have lost a lot of interest in the specifics of colonizing specific planets or moons. Other than geology research and the like I don't think we would ever bother colonizing instead of building habitat stations of whatever configuration we decide is most practical.
@@puresowns215 I tend to feel the same way… maybe each of these moons will have max 10,000 people living on them at any one time to get the extraction systems set up and then back to space they go to live in comfort and assemble more habitats. And thinking about how those 10,000 people would live while they work isn’t that interesting to me… I tend to go straight to ‘why can’t they just manage the robots from a comfortable habitat in orbit instead of going down to the surface?’ … Maybe they wouldn’t be extraction colonies but temporary tourist/geologist/historian outposts erected while the moon is still standing.
Do that and I demand that the name is kept. So it will be something like "Ganymede station". At least for the first one if there is enough material for several O'Neil cylinders.
@@michaelpettersson4919 Ganymede should provide enough material for several hundred thousand O’Neil cylinders… but likely the material from Ganymede would be combined with material taken from other moons and even gas giants of the Sol system to make the maximum amount of optimally configured O’Neil Cylinders… doubtless thousands would have names derived from Ganymede in some way.
Agreed, but timeframe matters. The machinery and mining needed to recycle something this size into a few million (or billion) habitats is probably on the order of eons. There’s going to be a colony on the surface in there somewhere.
I might be wrong because I read it very long time ago, but I think in the Mars Trilogy there was mentioned a similar concept of a habitat, but it was an underground one, and it had one side dug out to let light in through mirrors.
Heinlein's Farmer in the Sky and Benford's Against Infinity are my favorite novels set on Ganymede. I haven't read Poul Anderson's Snows of Ganymede but I'd like to.
Would be interesting to discuss colonizing Callisto for comparison, as it has slightly lower size and gravity but is less irradiated thanks to being completely outside of Jupiter's radiation belt, while Ganymede is not, and as mentioned here has lower escape velocity.
The definition of "colonised" seem to be... The term seem to vary with the person using it. Our host Isaac Arthur here do not seem to have any compulsion against colonising the Sun...
Very good book, first I read by Clarke too, though I'd already seen 2001, had to backtrack to read the toher sequels after. Funny coincidence, I was doing a panel with Larry Niven sunday morning an 3001 came up, though more on the space elevator discussion
This is a true story. Way back in high school one day we all gathered together on campus near a tree and decided to make Maddie, our strange classmate, that we were far in the future and living on Ganymede having sparked fusion on Jupiter and migrated humanity out there. We were celebrating our 50 year class reunion, that's how we all came to be together in a perfect replica of our old high school back on Earth. Maddie fell for it and was disoriented the whole rest of the day being completely unable to remember his class schedule. Sometimes Maddie ingested certain molecules that he, and anyone, probably shouldn't. Bear in mind that the aforementioned 50 year class reunion will be next year and we knew very little about Ganymede since the Voyager spacecraft had not yet arrived at the Jupiter system, and would not for several more years. Yes, I'm pretty old by now but avoided ingesting dangerous molecules for the most part and still have a functional brain. Mostly.
Callisto would be better. Specialized RTG craft could assist in diverting other carefully selected small moons around Jupiter to add to the mass of Calisto, as there's lots to choose from. Mass drivers on other moons could send select materials to Callisto. More mass, more ability to hold an atmosphere, protect from radiation and protect from micro meteorites, and make it easier for human and other organism health.
Ganymede is the true test for whether or not humanity can reach for the stars. If we can make it there, then we can make it on a lot of different worlds.
Jupiters moons, Callisto and all the ones further out, are going to be a massive empire one day. I can see Ganymede, Europa and Io being used for resources and production….i just think they’ll be more automated due to all the radiation. I mean, up until there are underground Silo style compounds reaching down into the sun surface oceans…… Man, someone make a KSP style colony game with real physics and all the known Jovian moons with a accurate radiation belt already lol Thank you so much for another Jupiter system colony episode!!!!!
Also I think they’d mainly be mined for volatiles. I could be way off but I think the smaller moons are where the rocks and minerals are at. Though of course, it could be worthwhile to mine the seafloor of Europa…
How about a space colony settled by Carnivore diet enthusiasts, who eschew hydroponic crops for anything but animal feed, and build artificial ranches for their flocks and herds?
If you put a conducting coil around Ganymede even at the poles for smaller equipment requirements Jupiter will induce enormous amounts of power in it. The other moons could be used as well and the power transmitted as laser light about the jovian system.
Will solar panels get enough sunlight to supply electricity for the colonist? Agriculture will have to be conducted underground because of the cold temperatures.
Hey, an Idea for power storage... So, we know how to produce liquid nitrogen since... A long time now. And since the 90s we have warm super conductors. And Tesla, the man himself, not the company, has long gave up a really effective turbine. So liquid Nitrogen in a well insulated container. The inside layer being a superconductor at liquid nitrogen temp. Have the nitrogen *leak* to a tesla turbine, basically another layer in the same box... It spins, the container as a whole spins, have a coil around it. You now have a very efficient generator. Bonus. Making liquid nitrogen also separates out anything else in the air. Including CO2.
Moot point, even if the radiation question were to be answered, you're still stuck in low G. That's bound to have all kinds of bad effects for long term exposure. Until a proper fix is found, telepresence and perhaps an outpost akin to the space station's time frame would be the only feasible Ganymedian effort. Not even the sight would be worth the recuperation that one would have to go through or the meds they'd need for long term habitation on Ganymede. Ultimately, it's about "effort". Is it worth the effort to colonize a moon like that when a space station would be far more appropriate (and easier as human resources go)? I think not. Humans will have to stick to same or close to same gravity as Earth does, because that's how we evolved. And THE biggest reason for that is not just because of the health issues, but also because of what humans are... which is a really vile race that still (in this long) hasn't understood that fighting each other is utterly meaningless and that money, wealth, power... wanting them, are just symptoms of a deranged mind that needs to be placed under medication. Some people tend to want to see the best in humanity, i just see what happens now, with several wars that are happening because some human shaped refuses are wanting for power, while the rest of the human race is struggling under troglodytes with ambitions of grandeur who think that it's "ok" to pollute our planet's sky (without asking anyone, really) with space trash just so they can squeeze MORE money out of people who are clueless to the effects of their actions. Yeah, no. I'd rather ban any space flight in the first place if this eventually leads to settling and therefore, creating, yet another issue. Humanity as a whole needs to cook longer before it can even consider something like this, because we think too fast and feel too slow. And honestly, this feels like it would be a mistake.
I think we should stick to somehere more hospitable to human life,.. Gaza maybe, or North Korea, Antarctica,Atacama,Sahara,Gobi. Perhaps an active volcanic vent in Iceland!
It's funny to think that we have no idea at this point whether lava tubes will be the choicest high-end real estate, or the equivalent of trailer parks.
@@arcadiaberger9204The main factor is their proximity to the ice. But who knows, they might have ice in them…. They _have_ been shadowed for billions of years after all…
So as it happens, the length of a Martian sol and a Ganymedean "day" are almost identical: 24 hours, 39.6 minutes versus 24 hours, 31.8 minutes. Perhaps the first permanent colonists on Ganymede will be from Mars, not Earth.
How beefy do the domes need to be to survive meteorites and asteroidites since there is no atmosphere to burn up them up? What is the current strike frequency on moons around Jupiter?
Won't light pressure drive the orbiting mirrors away from a useful locations. Especially, goven they've been proposed as means of propulsion i. e. Solar sails.
I discussed that in the Staties and lagites episode, what ends up happening in short form though is you adjust them to a non-keplerian orbit, and for lagrange points, you usually just put the shade a bit closer to the Sun than L1, and the mirror even closer.
Isaac, I’d love to hear your thoughts on atomic printing. Especially if that leads into the ability to deconstruct existing materials down to fundamental particles and rebuild them with different atomic weights. This would essentially simplify many of the challenges in this episode as you’d be able to print medicines and volatile materials as necessary. Even if it was painfully slow, you could print more printers to speed the manufacturing process up.
Maybe you can do all 4 in this series. For example, Io would be fun but has a heavy potential for resources that could be utilized despite the extreme volcanism, which could be more tamed and used as power, like how cryovolcanoes could be used for power.
Ganymede is my favorite [place] in our solar system. I had a fundraiser to raise the 87 million trillion dollars to terraform it. We are only 87 million trillion dollars from reaching our goal. That's why this is my favorite non-megastructure related episode. Thank you very much.
If you'd like to build some interstellar highway networks from Lunar to Ganymede to save time for next Jupiter meeting, why not? But before you launch Ganymede settlements establishment, preparing to meet your new galactic neighbors at their bases and spaceports on the Ganymede. Good luck bro, Sol system development projects will bringing surprises in this century.
When you have serious industry and population in space already and can cheaply and reliably build artificial habitats that are perfectly tailored to one's environmental preferences, actual planets become backwaters; terraforming is like cavemen using modern construction techniques to make better caves instead of modern cities.
How are people going to survive the radiation from Jupiter, or the partial gravity on its moons? Get real, Arthur! A very entertaining fantasy, but that's it.
Author's note: at 13:30 we've got an 'oops'. On-screen it shows Helium-3, but with one proton and 2 neutrons on the image, that would be hydrogen-3 or Tritium, He-3 would be two protons and a neutron. I'm gonna blame that one on being busy getting ready for the ISDC, though the slide is from an older episode so that's more of 'failed to catch the error again' :)
REALLY HATE your use of A.I. “art” in your header it’s absolutely 2000% garbage on fire.
Can you NOT use real human artwork instead?
ARTISTS AGAINST A.I.
@@donhillsmanii5906 this is a channel about futurism and the future of humanity... I think the AI art fits perfectly and makes perfect sense next to the human art
@@donhillsmanii5906 The slides are just eye candy anyway, aside from a few important charts or graphs. If you are not ADD-riddled like me, you can always just do something else while listening to Isaac.
When I read "author's note", in my mind I was reading it with voice, but because it was in your voice my brain interpreted it as Arthur's note even though I read author's note
@@fubaralakbar6800 the worst is I KNOW it's stock footage. and the SAME stock footage over and over, but I just sit and watch and listen to Isaac lol.
Great example is the Expanse. Huge agricultural domes powered by orbital mirrors, and underground living facilities. In that universe, its the safest place to birth and raise children off-earth, though still not better than earth!
Taken to it's logical conclusion, orbitals would be overall safer and healthier than any moon or planet, including earth.
Just need a ton of orbital industry to get it going (note I didn't say tech, because most of the tech we'd absolutely need we already have, just not the engineering yet)
@@RiversJ I agree, as in particular the gravity of Earth is something one cannot as easily simulate on Ganymede as on a rotating habitat.
Just look out for the Caliban!
@@SuperibyPRotating habitat with the floor at an angle, mounted on the surface.
@@RiversJ What weird definition of 'technology' includes purely theoretical constructs?
Drinking Ganymead on Ganymede
I prefer Brawndo thanks.
Lol, I read this as "drinking grannies mead on Ganymede"
Amusing story, my best friend decided he wanted to try his hand at making mead so swung by to get some honey (my wife keeps bees) , 'Ganymead' was one of the names we kicked around for the label.
Oh yes! The thirst mutilator! It's got what plants crave, because it's got electrolytes!
I'm good, gonna have me a nice tall glass of Enceladade.
Cool. This reminds me of an old short story "Christmas on Ganymede". In that story Ganymede had an indigenous population that funnily enough was described as "they can speak English but when they do that you wish that the couldn't". Yes the story was meant as comedy.
I just checked on Wikipedia. Apparently written by Isaac Asimov. The article says written 1940 and published 1942.
yep, there's a nice audio version of it by Jim Roberts too
I was thinking totally sounds like an Asmov story.
For us old timer nukes, that 0.08 Sieverts figure for radiation on the surface of Ganymede is equivalent to 8 Rem per day. While not lethal short term, that's a pretty strong dose. For comparison, after working in nuclear for decades I've only had a total recorded cumulative dose of maybe half that. I could get my lifetime occupational dose on the surface of Ganymede in half a day probably. It won't kill you but do that enough times and you likely have cancer in your future. Heavily shielded or underground habs would be a must for colonization.
NASA's limit is 600 mSv per lifetime, or 7.5 days on the surface of Ganymede. So, yes, you are exactly correct.
That figure got a smile from me! It reminded me of when I used to teach radiological protection, and would bombard my students with the units and ask for convertions. 😂
I have sort of a soft spot for Ganymede. Ever since an obscure scifi story from the early 80s mentioned Ganymede as being colonized by my ethnic group. I was so happy! We made it! We have a world to ourselves! Someone recognized us as worthy of that! It's an irradiated rock 2.4 times smaller than the Earth, but I'm not asking for much! Just enough space to build our dome cities or arcologies and grow our numbers!
Come to Ganymede and stay awhile! The restaurant and bakeries are awesome!😋
What is the obscure sci fi story from the 80s where Ganymede is colonized by an ethnic group?
I must be trying all the wrong searches because I can’t find it… but my search did remind me to read Ken MacLeod’s series.
@@corbynite2004shot in the dark but maybe “The Ganymede Takeover” by Phillip K. Dick and Ray Nelson??
@@corbynite2004shot in the dark but maybe “The Ganymede Takeover” by Phillip K. Dick and Ray Nelson ??
Cool. And I got absolutely no idea what ethnicity that is.
Belters?
Love your colonizing episodes. Love your world builder approach. I love a good story. I never get tired of listening one.
Thanks!
I'd go with Callisto just because it's farther from the radiation belt.
The crust is also a lot more mineral rich, with a higher fraction of rocky material than Ganymede
Love Callisto, it's my favorite moon, so much so I named a cat after it! ❤
Bro, I read it as "I would go out with Callisto, because her father works for ratiation belt".
I'm like... is he making his own nuclear powerplant, or is he popping WW3.
@@janchovanec8624 Nah. Callisto's not my type. I wanna go out with Venus, she's a lot hotter!😀
Callisto is where it’s at for me.
Ganymede seems like a good place to set up some agricultural domes. I'm sure nothing bad could happen.
From Ganymede to Titan, yes sir I've been around 🎵
When i think about the galilean moons, i think about ship building yards for some reason.
I kinda wonder what sort of damage Terra-forming our moon might have on planet Earth. I would think the differences of Sunlight due to the atmosphere of the moon might come into play in some way. A lot of biology is wired for moonlight. What happens if we toyed with that?
WOAH! careful there bucko. The great engine of progress steams forever forward! SCIENCE IS AWESOME... HUZZAH!!!
So long as we avoid awakening the shadow vessel
Man, Callisto is beautiful.
Because of what that comet chasing probe found with the airogell wings, the moons will have organic material to use.
This channel is still inexplicably under subscribed.
That is true of a number of very good channels, in science and various other genres.
Might I recommend, in no particular order:
The Click
Jammidodger
DUST
Rebecca Watson
Beau of the Fifth Column
Storied
Randy Rainbow
The Launch Pad
Old Gods of Appalachia
Anton Petrov
The Professional Left
His speech impediment will hold him back
@@Raine247 It hardly seems to.
@@Raine247it didn’t six years ago, and it’s significantly better now. Now new people just think he has an odd accent.
Interestingly in Babylon 5 the earthgov was trying to liberate a shadow vessel from the surface of Ganymede and of course when the thing went crazy it destroyed the surface domes. Thank goodness Sheridan already there waiting for it
Your videos are the highlight of my week.
Hey Isaac Arthur, because of your space interests and covering all kinds of space related topics, I'd recommend to you checking out both Talk pages that are respectively associated to the Fermi Paradox and the space colonization Wikipedia pages, and in the latter case the very bottom part.
Gregory Benford wrote ''Against Infinity'' about humanity's attempts to colonize Ganymede. However an ancient alien (robotic) entity, the Aleph, tries to counter this...
ThankQ Issac Another Imagination Teasing Episode 😋
My favorite Moon ❤
One question though. What would be the incentive for choosing Ganymede over Callisto?
Whatever advantages Ganymede has, e.g., abundance of water ice, even subsurface ocean, are present also on Callisto.
However, Callisto has several advantages, such as lower ambient radiation, stable geology (Ganymede may have plate tectonics ) and being not as deep inside Jupiter's gravity well as Ganymede.
As for mining Jupiter or IO, such works will be done by robots anyway. A little outpost would do. Makes no sense to build a vast colony in a hostile environment just for that.
If the goal is to biologically colonize the Jovian system, I don't see much reason for choosing Ganymede over Callisto.
I recently read that some ETs grom another system landd on Gamymede and when the Space Force learned of it they wemt there to welcome these new arrivals. I haven't received any confirmation but I hope it's true.
With hardly any atmosphere, it should be easy enough to beam captured sunlight from a ganymede orbit to the surface.
Moons of exo planet gas giants sounds the key phrase, as solves tidal locked main planets at red dwarf stars
I think robots will be used to find all resources needed before the crew arriving.
I just hope when we do, that a giant orbital space battle between earth and mars ravages the local lunar community for months leading to a massive refugee crisis to the edge of the solar system.
Oh my god! And then what would happen? Would some strange alien substance then infect an entire asteroid colony? Would that asteroid then fly itself into Venus? Would that asteroid then fly to the edge of the solar system and create a giant ring structure?
I hope that doesn’t happen.
Could you do a video on starship and what possibilities it's going to open? :)
Most technologically sophisticated people today would be vastly disappointed in humanity if by 2156, autonomous robots were not way superior to humans now in doing any tasks in space, and autonomous robots could be made in much more varied form factors and with different intrinsic capabilities. For that matter, there are many today who believe that a crash program could achieve such robots by 2056, a hundred years earlier. I just can't be sold on how biology is an advantage in space.
Let me know when you finish the orbital ring around Jupiter.
I suspect a source of export from Ganymede would be nitrogen to Mars and the asteroid belt.
Nice Kubrick horizontal at 6'40'' Arthur- and you're not backed by the establishment?
Isn’t this where doctor who was/is from?the home of the time lords…
Gallifrey, not Ganymede.
Ever read Ringmakers of Saturn?
Didn't Heinlein do it first?
Farmer in the Sky.
watched
Bring honey 🍯,,,to make mead !! Vikings honey wine 🍷
Jupiter radiation
Issac you should run for president of the United States. It's not just an idea, this is a calling. You above all else I would trust with power, and the future.
First!
First reply!
@@nomadicsynth First reply to the first reply to the first comment!
@@corbynite2004 First reply to the first reply to the first reply to the first comment
@@froggyhell5705 second with no exclamation mark
Here, at some unremarkable point in spacetime.
You pronounce the "R" in some words and others it's just not pronounced.
Like, world Wo'old, un own, field fe'ild, terraform teariform.
Teariform seems like how you would describe what is being done to Earth right now.
For some reason, I still hate the King who forced everyone to speak with a lispe.
It's interesting to hear the two ways of speaking come from the same person in close association to each other.
I grew up hating the story of that king from the time I first heard it.
I was told to ignore the lispe, but it's just a reminder of that twama.
It's a person being comfortable with oppression in my mind, and I need to get rid of that bias I developed as a kid.
It's not healthy, to a point it's hard to hear speak to this day.
Where da fuq is oorth.?.?.
"All these worlds are yours. Except Europa. Attempt no landings there."
Alright; Ganymede it is.
I've always wondered why They said that. They must have known that perverse humans would immediately be drawn to Europa out of curiosity.
Nice reference.
I'm afraid I can't do that caejones2792.
“Oh, and also avoid Io. Unless you want to die from a volcano.”
Pleased to ganymeet you!
Hahaha! Come for the Arthur, stay for the puns.
This comment wins🎉🎉🎉
And Uranus too.
That's terrible I wish I thought of it first ❤
Come to the airlock for a moment please.
I wonder why Callisto wouldn't be picked instead, as a "crown jewel" of Jupiter. Also rich in water and various resources, far enough from Jupiter that radiation is even lower (even taking Ganymede's magnetic field into account), and its outer orbit might be a bit easier for ship transit purposes. While also making a good base to exploit the rest of Jupiter from.
It probably would be picked first in reality.
Callisto is my pick, favorite moon for sure! 😊
Best way to colonize Ganymede is to crunch it up and turn it into O’Neil cylinders. Yum.
Honestly, since getting a decent idea on how much more efficient habitats are versus planetary colonization, I have lost a lot of interest in the specifics of colonizing specific planets or moons. Other than geology research and the like I don't think we would ever bother colonizing instead of building habitat stations of whatever configuration we decide is most practical.
@@puresowns215 I tend to feel the same way… maybe each of these moons will have max 10,000 people living on them at any one time to get the extraction systems set up and then back to space they go to live in comfort and assemble more habitats. And thinking about how those 10,000 people would live while they work isn’t that interesting to me… I tend to go straight to ‘why can’t they just manage the robots from a comfortable habitat in orbit instead of going down to the surface?’ … Maybe they wouldn’t be extraction colonies but temporary tourist/geologist/historian outposts erected while the moon is still standing.
Do that and I demand that the name is kept. So it will be something like "Ganymede station". At least for the first one if there is enough material for several O'Neil cylinders.
@@michaelpettersson4919 Ganymede should provide enough material for several hundred thousand O’Neil cylinders… but likely the material from Ganymede would be combined with material taken from other moons and even gas giants of the Sol system to make the maximum amount of optimally configured O’Neil Cylinders… doubtless thousands would have names derived from Ganymede in some way.
Agreed, but timeframe matters. The machinery and mining needed to recycle something this size into a few million (or billion) habitats is probably on the order of eons. There’s going to be a colony on the surface in there somewhere.
I love the use of mirrors to avoid lethal radiation. They could be used for Mars exploration and beyond.
I might be wrong because I read it very long time ago, but I think in the Mars Trilogy there was mentioned a similar concept of a habitat, but it was an underground one, and it had one side dug out to let light in through mirrors.
Heinlein's Farmer in the Sky and Benford's Against Infinity are my favorite novels set on Ganymede. I haven't read Poul Anderson's Snows of Ganymede but I'd like to.
i think low gravity is very unhealthy for us - we need cylinders. it would make a good mining source but not long term living.
We dont know tge gravity threshold needed but suspect ur right
@@SeanSoraghan true but zero g severely reduces bone density and causes other problems. so 14%g is probably not enough long term.
We don't know yet if low gravity would result in the same adverse health effects as microgravity or not.
Would be interesting to discuss colonizing Callisto for comparison, as it has slightly lower size and gravity but is less irradiated thanks to being completely outside of Jupiter's radiation belt, while Ganymede is not, and as mentioned here has lower escape velocity.
Farmer in the sky... But on Callisto, where the surface dose is lower, there's plenty of easily accessible ore bodies in the craters, etc.
In the novel 3001...Ganymede was colonized. Great book.
The definition of "colonised" seem to be... The term seem to vary with the person using it. Our host Isaac Arthur here do not seem to have any compulsion against colonising the Sun...
@@michaelpettersson4919 Indeed, Indeed. Isaac Arthur is the Mad Hatter of space colonization.
Very good book, first I read by Clarke too, though I'd already seen 2001, had to backtrack to read the toher sequels after. Funny coincidence, I was doing a panel with Larry Niven sunday morning an 3001 came up, though more on the space elevator discussion
NOTIFICATION GANG!!
Push
I support colonising Ganymede.
Any elemental accounting associated with colonization to me seems a little insufficient without a discussion on phosphate.
This is a true story. Way back in high school one day we all gathered together on campus near a tree and decided to make Maddie, our strange classmate, that we were far in the future and living on Ganymede having sparked fusion on Jupiter and migrated humanity out there. We were celebrating our 50 year class reunion, that's how we all came to be together in a perfect replica of our old high school back on Earth. Maddie fell for it and was disoriented the whole rest of the day being completely unable to remember his class schedule. Sometimes Maddie ingested certain molecules that he, and anyone, probably shouldn't.
Bear in mind that the aforementioned 50 year class reunion will be next year and we knew very little about Ganymede since the Voyager spacecraft had not yet arrived at the Jupiter system, and would not for several more years. Yes, I'm pretty old by now but avoided ingesting dangerous molecules for the most part and still have a functional brain. Mostly.
Well… that seems… really fucking mean. In fact, forget the “seems”.
Plays Cowboy BeBop Theme song in background
Excellent video and some nice bonus world-building.
Good work, Isaac.
Callisto would be better. Specialized RTG craft could assist in diverting other carefully selected small moons around Jupiter to add to the mass of Calisto, as there's lots to choose from. Mass drivers on other moons could send select materials to Callisto. More mass, more ability to hold an atmosphere, protect from radiation and protect from micro meteorites, and make it easier for human and other organism health.
Ganymede is the true test for whether or not humanity can reach for the stars. If we can make it there, then we can make it on a lot of different worlds.
Jupiters moons, Callisto and all the ones further out, are going to be a massive empire one day. I can see Ganymede, Europa and Io being used for resources and production….i just think they’ll be more automated due to all the radiation. I mean, up until there are underground Silo style compounds reaching down into the sun surface oceans……
Man, someone make a KSP style colony game with real physics and all the known Jovian moons with a accurate radiation belt already lol
Thank you so much for another Jupiter system colony episode!!!!!
I wanna make that kind of game but I ain’t got the skills. But hey, check again in 10 years and maybe that dream won’t be so distant.
Also I think they’d mainly be mined for volatiles. I could be way off but I think the smaller moons are where the rocks and minerals are at. Though of course, it could be worthwhile to mine the seafloor of Europa…
I have heard that Callisto is the best option for colony in Jupiter's moons
Happy #Arthursday!!!!
How about a space colony settled by Carnivore diet enthusiasts, who eschew hydroponic crops for anything but animal feed, and build artificial ranches for their flocks and herds?
If you put a conducting coil around Ganymede even at the poles for smaller equipment requirements Jupiter will induce enormous amounts of power in it. The other moons could be used as well and the power transmitted as laser light about the jovian system.
We would definitely need some type of artificial gravity. It would probably will just end up being a mining operation for water ice .
Will solar panels get enough sunlight to supply electricity for the colonist? Agriculture will have to be conducted underground because of the cold temperatures.
I doubt it’s all that much warmer underground
@@oberonpanopticon it depends on far down colorists are able to drill down to hit warm areas.
Hey, an Idea for power storage...
So, we know how to produce liquid nitrogen since... A long time now.
And since the 90s we have warm super conductors.
And Tesla, the man himself, not the company, has long gave up a really effective turbine.
So liquid Nitrogen in a well insulated container. The inside layer being a superconductor at liquid nitrogen temp.
Have the nitrogen *leak* to a tesla turbine, basically another layer in the same box...
It spins, the container as a whole spins, have a coil around it.
You now have a very efficient generator.
Bonus. Making liquid nitrogen also separates out anything else in the air. Including CO2.
Moot point, even if the radiation question were to be answered, you're still stuck in low G. That's bound to have all kinds of bad effects for long term exposure. Until a proper fix is found, telepresence and perhaps an outpost akin to the space station's time frame would be the only feasible Ganymedian effort.
Not even the sight would be worth the recuperation that one would have to go through or the meds they'd need for long term habitation on Ganymede. Ultimately, it's about "effort". Is it worth the effort to colonize a moon like that when a space station would be far more appropriate (and easier as human resources go)? I think not. Humans will have to stick to same or close to same gravity as Earth does, because that's how we evolved. And THE biggest reason for that is not just because of the health issues, but also because of what humans are... which is a really vile race that still (in this long) hasn't understood that fighting each other is utterly meaningless and that money, wealth, power... wanting them, are just symptoms of a deranged mind that needs to be placed under medication. Some people tend to want to see the best in humanity, i just see what happens now, with several wars that are happening because some human shaped refuses are wanting for power, while the rest of the human race is struggling under troglodytes with ambitions of grandeur who think that it's "ok" to pollute our planet's sky (without asking anyone, really) with space trash just so they can squeeze MORE money out of people who are clueless to the effects of their actions. Yeah, no. I'd rather ban any space flight in the first place if this eventually leads to settling and therefore, creating, yet another issue. Humanity as a whole needs to cook longer before it can even consider something like this, because we think too fast and feel too slow. And honestly, this feels like it would be a mistake.
If there is a discussion about floating platforms in the Venus atmosphere, why can the same concept not be used in Jupiter and Saturn?
I think we should stick to somehere more hospitable to human life,..
Gaza maybe, or North Korea, Antarctica,Atacama,Sahara,Gobi. Perhaps an active volcanic vent in Iceland!
Work our way up, definitely.
Lava-tube Wives will be a big reality TV hit in the future Sol System! ***1/2
It's funny to think that we have no idea at this point whether lava tubes will be the choicest high-end real estate, or the equivalent of trailer parks.
The Real House Wives Of Ganymede
@@arcadiaberger9204The main factor is their proximity to the ice. But who knows, they might have ice in them…. They _have_ been shadowed for billions of years after all…
@@oberonpanopticon Well, we'll have the ice and anything else with industrial value out of them before we begin using them for habitation, won't we?
So as it happens, the length of a Martian sol and a Ganymedean "day" are almost identical: 24 hours, 39.6 minutes versus 24 hours, 31.8 minutes. Perhaps the first permanent colonists on Ganymede will be from Mars, not Earth.
I have simple route's of entertainment, i see Isaac Arthur+ colonising and I click like before the video has started.
Why not pull it around Venus
Have to admit, didn't really feel this vid after listening to Dr. Fatima's latest video.
Good Morning, Isaac.
Heavily stooped in the fiction from "sci-fi," but I'd be interested in a video on apotheosis. Any takes?
How beefy do the domes need to be to survive meteorites and asteroidites since there is no atmosphere to burn up them up? What is the current strike frequency on moons around Jupiter?
Just going to point out, "dirty ice" is half the problem with assuming everything out there is pure.......
Won't light pressure drive the orbiting mirrors away from a useful locations. Especially, goven they've been proposed as means of propulsion i. e. Solar sails.
I discussed that in the Staties and lagites episode, what ends up happening in short form though is you adjust them to a non-keplerian orbit, and for lagrange points, you usually just put the shade a bit closer to the Sun than L1, and the mirror even closer.
The first book I ever read in English was Farmer in the Sky, so Ganymede has always had a special place in my imagination
Isaac, I’d love to hear your thoughts on atomic printing. Especially if that leads into the ability to deconstruct existing materials down to fundamental particles and rebuild them with different atomic weights.
This would essentially simplify many of the challenges in this episode as you’d be able to print medicines and volatile materials as necessary.
Even if it was painfully slow, you could print more printers to speed the manufacturing process up.
Yeah. Sure buddy.
Loved the video. You always do a excellent job
I love your content and it's often played while I work on stuff. Your voice reminds me of an old friend.
If someone is born off earth, genetically engineered and birthed from an artifical womb, would they still be human?
Irrelevant
Maybe you can do all 4 in this series. For example, Io would be fun but has a heavy potential for resources that could be utilized despite the extreme volcanism, which could be more tamed and used as power, like how cryovolcanoes could be used for power.
note to self: must research more on anti-matter.
Callisto is the safer option, much less radiation.
Ganymede is my favorite [place] in our solar system. I had a fundraiser to raise the 87 million trillion dollars to terraform it. We are only 87 million trillion dollars from reaching our goal.
That's why this is my favorite non-megastructure related episode. Thank you very much.
I don't know. Considering how expensive it is to terraform Jupiter's moons, an Io-you may be in order.
Revolutionary Concepts for Human Outer Planet Exploration (HOPE) from 2003 went on and posited a crewed mission somewhere after 2045.
If you'd like to build some interstellar highway networks from Lunar to Ganymede to save time for next Jupiter meeting, why not?
But before you launch Ganymede settlements establishment, preparing to meet your new galactic neighbors at their bases and spaceports on the Ganymede.
Good luck bro, Sol system development projects will bringing surprises in this century.
A video about nuclear pulse propulsion would be cool!
One thing to note about electrical current, amperage has a much greater effect than voltage when it comes to lethality.
Not sure if I'm missing smth, but doesn't this [13:29] show two tritium atoms fusing?
Yes, it does, damn, I wonder how I screwed that up. It should be two protons and aneutron for He3 of course.
Callisto first, same resources, less radiation
Why the negative view on ai?
When you have serious industry and population in space already and can cheaply and reliably build artificial habitats that are perfectly tailored to one's environmental preferences, actual planets become backwaters; terraforming is like cavemen using modern construction techniques to make better caves instead of modern cities.
How are people going to survive the radiation from Jupiter, or the partial gravity on its moons? Get real, Arthur! A very entertaining fantasy, but that's it.