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Mono Vs OSC Resolution and Details Which is Better?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ธ.ค. 2023
- Here are two difference I have notice while shooting with both OSC and Mono cameras. Hope you find some fun facts in here as I love to throw in tidbits of info that other channels neglect. And feel free to give me your own comments on these observations.
I pray that God will restore your health, that you will have a safe recovery, and that He will make you feel better. Keep believing and having faith that He shall heal you….Also, another great video, As a newbie I am learning a lot from you.
Thanks you. He has in many was already.
Excellent video Ben ! I think the 533 mm is a really good first mono because there's no vignetting even with 1.25 inch filters. I hope your health continues to improve and wish you all the best in what must be an horrendous time. The fact you have still made content is truly remarkable .
You are very right about those 1.25 filters. and they are very affordable too.
I wonder if the 533 would be much easier to use vs the 4/3rds 294MM. I have the sibling 2600MC and the files are so easy to use.@@TheNarrowbandChannel
It’s great to see another video and hope your health is getting better. I appreciate all the insights on mono. In the beginning, I started with OSC because I thought my local climate (Pacific Northwest) wouldn’t offer enough time to complete images in a reasonable amount of time. I made the jump after the first two months and the difference is eye-opening, especially with the control it offers for specific wavelengths of light.
You are very right. Many miss this. Plus shooting on a full moon with certain filters means you really get more imaging time.
Thanks for putting up this video which explains a lot for us that for now are sticking to OSC. 😍
So far this autumn/winter here where I live (Norway) I have had only *one* clear night where clouds did not ruin the session. And that night was with a nearly full moon, but the dual-band (L-Extreme) gave some nice results anyway.
I would like to see a comparison with the *same* integration time for a OSC and Mono version (533 is a good candidate).
I will eventually "go mono", but for now I am to impatient to put in all the time for capturing *and* post-processing 😊
I was thinking on this all week and you gave me the information. You are very brave and I admire your work. Diana
Great to watch your latest video. Enjoy the coming festive season with family and friends, precious memories.
Thanks so much
Thanks for another great informative video. The law of diminishing returns is that hidden gremlin in the system… little inaccuracies creeping in here and there … slight focus differences as filters are swapped over, residual amp glow sneaking in with more exposures etc … as we try to squeeze out every last bit of data.
Well said!
Nicely put together Ben. Ive a foot in both camps with the 2600MM and 533MC. I'd also totally recommend the 533MM as a beginner Mono, super little camera. Hope you're recovery is going well pal 👍🙏
Thanks for sharing!
Well, I did and added mono to my rig. I already had the ASI533 MC P and a 533MM P popped up in my price range so I bit the bullet. Cheers mate and hope you’re feeling better!!!
Ben, I have been keeping you in my thoughts and I was just thinking of you earlier this weekend, so this video was a welcome sight! I have also been considering a move to mono, and this will be of great help as I plot my next move! Thank you and best wishes, Matt
You will find the mono world is very vast.
Broadband targets is where the OSC shines, especially if you are in non light polluted skies. Mono does allow you to shoot even during full moon (at least Ha and SII, OIII as long as the moon is some distance from your target). And it is good to see you again, I know that the community here is pulling for you, so glad to see you on the mend. CS!
Thanks.
Hi Ben, First, glad to see your health is improving. It takes time. Wishing you a speedy full recovery.
Second, thank you for all the videos, you explain complex things in ways us laypeople can understand. I have learned quite alot.
Third, would you do a video on pros and cons of various pixel sizes with different scope focal lengths? Things like resolution, guiding requirements and accuracy, clipping, light gathering ability, etc. The most popular might not be the best for someone’s individual setup. I know this is a complex subject with many moving parts, but you are a good teacher and could do it well.
That sounds like a good video but there are actual web tools that let you do it. Have you ever used astronomy.tools I now I use them often when making buying decisions.
Great seeing you Ben.
Stay strong sir.
Thank you.
Thank you Ben, sending hugs and prayers to all of you
Thank you.
Mighty. Thank you. I am not an astro guy, but I love your content.
Wow, thank you!
Very interesting and well presented information. Even though this is a bit outside the focus of my photography, I enjoy gleaning the knowledge you share. Once I begin playing with very basic astrophotography, then I will let you know whether you're a "bad" influence or not! lol Glad to see you're up to making content and hope all is improving day by day. Thank you, as always, for the wealth of knowledge you share with us all.
Hi Ben, was wondering where you’ve been! Glad to see you back. I emailed you a while ago as I had a problem with my scope that I thought you might be able to help me solve. But I’m glad you’re back and looking well. Feel good and I wish you and your family a very merry Christmas and a happy new year as well.
Luis Mercado
Thanks. The end of this chemo thing is coming eventually.
Thanks Ben. Another excellent video, the most crystal clear explanation of Mono v OSC I have seen. Keep up the great work.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Shit man…. Sorry to see this. I’ve only just seen some of your old videos recently and had asked about the Svbony guide scope 3d file you uploaded…. Don’t worry about the past man, focus on you and your kids. Astro, and YT are just add-ons to your life experience. They’re minimal. I hope that in a few f days I catch up to real time and learn you’ve kicked cancer’s ass.
Great video. Nics facts and tidbits to keep in mind. Clear skies.
Glad it was helpful!
Hi Ben, I can tell you have put back on a little weight and seem to have more energy. It's nice to see you making the videos you leave doing. You will still be in my prayers. Clear Skies!
Hey, thanks! and yes I am almost back to old weight.
Ben, Question about the number of subs that is optimal. I think you said something like after 65 subs you will see diminishing gains in detail. I know it’s nuanced and target dependent, but how should we think about our exposure time in regards to the number of frames. I’m still in OSC world but hope to make the mono jump this year. Thanks so much for all your content and healing energy for you this holiday season!
You can get a good image at 30 frames. At 60 you start to see less and less gains. After 60 it's almost a waist of time unless you are working on something ludicrously faint.
Peter Zelinka did a video 6 days ago "4 ways to improve your astrophotography images", in which (amongotherthings) he goes more deeply into imaging time. Worth checking out. You make it much less confusing.
His videos are nice and complete but to long. I am subbed but it's been a while since I actually watched one.
👊 Glad you’re back, hope your health is getting much better.
It's getting there.
Great video. I saw you little struggling with breath. Please, don't mind us. We all miss you, but we can wait for you to relax and get better. I have never wished anybody to get better as much as I wish for you. Take care.😊
😊 thank you
Wow, amazing info! Now I'm sure I will get the asi2600mm. Thank you and God bless you!
That is a solid camera.
its good to see youre doing well man!
Thank you
While I'm posting, I have a question unrelated to this video.
A While back you did a video about ASiair+. You mentioned using a micro SD card to write subs to. Exactly how is this done? In "Image management"
Screen, it doesn't appear as USB, and mmc do.
You might have a card issue then of some kind. It shows right up when I stick in a micro sd.
Okay, no hidden secrets. I'll try another, thanks.
Great to see you are looking better, hope the health is continually improving. One question if say you take 2 hours of mono then would not 6 hours of OSC work just as well?
If you're comparing a BW image to the color then yes.
I live in Montana and excellent astro-nights are rather rare, so shooting mono is counterproductive. One shot color allows me to complete an image in a single night. The quality is super and the processing is simple.
You can complete an image with mono in A single night too. :)
Excellent video! I would love to see a comparison of a OSC and Mono versions of the same camera, but keeping the total stacked integration time constant. This would show how even though Mono has higher resolution, integration would be 1/3 as you would need the constant integration time for each color. Ex. Comparison of 3 hours of of time with OSC vs 1 hour of each color using Mono. How much of a difference would it be. Would be an interesting experiment.
Other channels have done half backed comparisons like that.
Thanks!
Thank you!
Hi, can you please do a tutorial on how to combine data from narrowband OSC & broadband OSC if both is shot using the same optics?
I would but I do not have to sensors to match up. for that.
Nice explanation Ben and great to see you again. In my endeavours I acquired the Asi585MC with Starvis2 as my first camera. I topped it up with a seperate cooler from Rouz Astro. That gives me a 9 MP cooled camera at a ridiculous price. The sensitivity is 1.5 times the 485, in near infrared, that’s without cooling. I hope the cooling boosts that number. Any thoughts or advice on this ? Ps. I’ll run the camera on the Evolux 82ed or Altair wave 115 edtx, both with reducers, hence I go the Osc route as you mentioned to start with.
Cooling always improves image quality. But the most important thing is getting the temperature the same all through the imaging session.
Excellent point about the constant temperature, and the additional cooler cannot be regulated in temperature, it will just cool all it can .. Thank you Ben - good and important knowledge 👌 @@TheNarrowbandChannel
There's actually 3 groups: Mono, OCS, and those that have both options 😁
Is there a brand or a set or filters you would recommend for a mono beginner. I've seen a lot of good reviews on Antlia. Probably don't want to spend Chroma money though. I want to stick with 2". And I would probably just get the LRGB to start with. I'm currently using a AT60ED with a reducer and also have the flattener. So, my FL is 288mm and 360mm. Not sure if that matters.
I use the Baader filters mostly. They are a good quality price option.
curious - what are your thoughts about OSC plus narrowband filters - like L-Extreme (you do not get any SII with that).
The filter would be to lower the background noise (improving your Signal to Noise ratio).
They are not as efficient. And force you to do only HOO work. You can't capture Sii with most of them. and the ones I have seen that allow it are not very good yet.
@@TheNarrowbandChannel so wait for them to get better or go Mono?
OSC will not be better then mono for at least another 20 years. @@allenbaylus3378
Very nicely explained. I wonder if you could review different kinds of filters for a mono camera? Sorta your best bang for your buck. The Chroma filters make my eyes water.
The somewhat cheaper ones would be Astronomik and Baader (German) or Antlia (Japanese). ZWO (Chinese) filters - probably the cheapest ones, but there are some mixed reviews of it. I use Antlia filters, which I paid half the price, since I bought them used. The best thing to do is wait after holiday season and people doing returns and so on and the dealers trying to get rid of it and put out big discounts on used or refurbished equipment. In my experience, if the filter isn't broken or cracked then it's fine.
I use Baader's myself.
I also used Baader in the past for my LRGB but I am wondering if I should explore some other brands.@@TheNarrowbandChannel
Some of the best images I've captured with my 533 MC have been in the 30-60 subs! I'm planning to get the 2600 MM soon, do you recommend 36mm filters or 2" filters?
36mm filters are absolutely fine with the 2600MM, no worries. You should use the 2" as soon as you start using fullframe cameras.
36mm would be my vote.
I recently got back to OSC because clouds 😅
There’s some talk there is a possibility in 2024 all new OM-1X Coming out with an all new sensor, Also, there is talk of a new pen-f II, have to take it with a grain of salt information from 43 rumours, if it turns out to be true, this is good news for us micro 4/3 users.
I so would love an OM1x
Mono is undoubtedly better, however some of us live in western Europe where 90% of the time the skies are overcast. And when the skies are clear, the nights are only 3 hours long. Going mono in these locations means it could take years to gather the data you want.
It’s interesting that God chose OSC for our human eyes. Texas Instrument did DLP projectors that had a spinning color filter wheel so every pixel looked like full color, but was actually time-multiplexed. Frankly, I think mono and OSC should be close to the same. For example, if I am taking blue subframes with a mono, I’m throwing away all green and red photons due to the blue filter. Whereas, if I’m taking OSC subs, each pixel is throwing away photons due to the bayer mask. True, the bayer has 50% green pixels, which is less interesting, I suppose. But what if someone made a different bayer pattern with a higher percentage at Ha/SII and at OIII? Wouldn’t that be awesome. But since that is for a niche market, they would charge a fortune for it. A long time ago, I had an SBIG 2Mp mono camera and filter wheel that cost about $3k. I had RGB filters. With only 2Mp, that made sense. But I couldn’t afford all the narrow band filters. I only had the Ha filter. Right now, I’m using a Fujifilm mirrorless OSC 26Mp camera and have the SVBony Ha/OIII dual-band filter. I’m waiting for their budget SII/OIII filter. And maybe I will also get the ASI2600 camera (basically same sensor as my Fujifilm XT4). I will have to decide on mono vs OSC for that cooled camera. But against most advice and expert knowledge, I am still leaning to OSC. At 26Mp now (with the Fujifilm camera), I get fantastic prints at 13x19” (the largest my Epson photo printer can make). Right now, my preference is to reduce my post-processing time and challenges. And OSC had been simpler than mono was back when I was doing it. Maybe mono processing isn’t as tough as it was 20 years back due to software improvements, but I’m not convinced. Anyway, any comments you have regarding my thoughts are welcome.
Mono gives you 10% better detail over one shot, however the cost for that 10% is 50% higher, your wallet, your choice.
That isn't really true about the detail difference. it's higher than that. And the cost of filters can be offset because you do not need a true apo scope. You can get by with just a ed doublet. or even an achromat.