The 2 strokes with carburetors especially after sitting for a while the gas component in the mixture would evaporate from the fuel bowls and the oil component would not evaporate and when starting you get a very high oil to gas ratio and hence the big cloud of smoke. I had 1995 Johnson ocean runners and wow those things could outdo a James Bond smoke screen.
Dude I love born again boating. This is a good question. I am a nut. I have been taking a 16ft 1967 starcraft over 40 miles offshore of NJ. I've ran Honda Merc 2 stroke and now a 4 stroke. My motor now is a 2020 40hp Merc. I love this motor. I never have any worry that is going to fail. Now my dad swore by the old OMC SeaDrive. We had one on a v20 steplift and a pair on a 250 sportsman. We never really had any out of the ordinary issues and he had the pair from 88 till 01. And they were still working when he got rid of the boat
A tohatsu you can let stand out on you,r boat in 12 years, use it all summer and never stop until someone steal the boat and drive it drunk on a rock as my previous 25 , no i have a 9,8 , on a 10 feet driving 10 nautical miles to some islands all spring summer.
Unbelievable amazing discussion! Kudos to you guys and everyone who helped make this happen. You can’t describe a whole pie by one slice. Consumers have preconceived notions and individual frames of reference when it comes to descriptions and opinions. I have come to adopt a mantra in all things…..know what something is and what it isn’t. Advertising is meant to sell a product under the guise of educating the consumer! Again….great job and wonderful depth of knowledge. Very impressed.
You nailed it with the abuse and neglect. With the Ficht it was both of these and ignorance. I have a 2004 225 Ficht with over 130 psi on all cylinders, perfectly maintained by me. Always run ethanol free fuel, XD50 oil, new plugs “ indexed “ every year. To date has over 1000 hours. Proper maintenance is the Number 1 key.
well let me chime in.. I ran a 01 225 Ficht for years.. I sent the emm to DFI technologies and had it redone. With proper yearly maintenance such as what you said above. Another thing is to back wash the cooling system through the service port on the back of the motor with the garden hose. When maintaining the Ficht like that and at the time period the performance that motor gave was incredible.
I can comment on the Etecs having had dozens of them and running them commercially. They were extremely reliable and long lived. Sure they ate the occasional injector or EMM but we’re talking about several years and thousands of hours between failures. I ran them for 4 or 5 years before replacing with new engines. We put around 7,500 hours on an outboard in 5 years. As for dealer nightmares I never had any. My dealer always had them fixed in a day or two at most. Granted taking an engine or boat to the dealer was a pain in the ass so I eventually bought the BRP diagnostic software, and it was pretty cheap. With a cheap laptop and the software replacing an injector was a very quick and easy job. EMM failures were almost always the charging system. The secret to long life with these things is to run the XD 100 oil on the XD 50 setting. BRP tells you to do this if your using it commercially. When I sold these engines they still ran like a raped ape even with 7500 hours. Calendar time was the killer of them after 5 years they started to have small electrical issues such as bad sensors and other minor issues. As a commercial operation even an hour or two of downtime to get and replace a sensor was unacceptable so I never ran one past 5 years. I have no idea how long they were good for but compared to the other outboards I’ve tried these things were exponentially more reliable. In my experience most of the other 2 stokes wouldn’t last more then about 1 or 2 years or about 2500 hours without a powerhead failure. When we had to go to 4 strokes we spent an incredible amount of time doing maintenance. Only maintenance on an etec was a set of spark plugs a couple times a year. The 4 stroke Suzukis and Yamahas require oil changes every couple weeks, timing belt jobs, ect. With a fleet of a dozen or more boats running 12 or more hours a day 7 days a week just keeping up with maintenance is a major pain in the ass and can only be done at night when the boats are not in service. Seems like every damn night your not going home after working 12 or more hours but doing maintenance. I absolutely loved the Etecs from a commercial operators point of view. They just didn’t need any maintenance and just made us money. I can absolutely understand how the maintenance of a 4 stroke isn’t an issue for a recreational boat or even a commercial singe boat operation. Not a big deal to change the oil on one or two engines once every couple weeks.
Interesting topic for certain. My 2006 Etec 40HP has run without fault. Always used high test gas XD50 oil and their gas additive. Can troll 8 hrs in a day without a hiccup with a 1/2 to 3/4 hr run out and again back in. Now 2023 and start of a new season without even taking a screwdriver out. My kicker is a 76 4 HP rude and has a carb rebuild and parts still easy to find.
Just a suggestion, some commentary on how you guys started, were you around boats as a kid, worst job, best job, etc. Would be interesting especially considering how young you all seem.
Best engine I have ever had (up until now) is a '06 Mercury Optimax 200xs ss sm. I ran the snot out of that engine (98,8mph on an Allison SS2000 boat) for 9 years without a single fault. Also it looked good, incredible fuel economy, good sound without the exhaust block off plate - fantastic. Bought it new.
Not saying etecs are the greatest but ive have less trouble with the etec then my yamaha. Im suprised at the 16:50 etecs reliability because i thought they were trash but mine has well over a 1000hrs with zero issues. I have done all the maintenance tho.
Proud owner of a 94 Mercury Xri 175. The motor is just too easy to rebuild myself. The boat racing community loves the Mercury 2.5l v6 for a good reason.
I run a 2003 Johnson 115 on my classic Boston Whaler. I bought it new and have run it with very few issues. I disabled the VRO oil injection a few years ago and the motor just runs great. I don't run anything but recreational fuel and it's a beast of a motor.
My 99 johnson outboard 2 stroke 4 cylinder is incredibly reliable. I bought it in 2010 and it hadn't been ran in about 6 years at the time. It started up immediately but needed carbs rebuilt because of sitting all those years with fuel in it. But since then, its been basically perfect. In the last 14 years ive only had to change change lower unit oil seals once and a spark plug wire once. Never even needed the spark plugs changed though I did change them once last year but only because it seemed crazy they never needed it. It ran the same. 25 years and its still perfect
I enjoyed watching the video. Thanks for putting it together. I personally have been around Suzuki’s for many years. I have never had problems with them. I just purchased a DF350, I have read good and bad things. However, you can find that with all motors.
We ran two Yamaha 350s on a push Boat push in a couple hundred tons of sand cranes and excavators a lot of times in the ponds in the current. You have those things redline for 1015 minutes at a time steady push and 4500 RPMs all day.
My mechanic here in Australia won't touch any Evinrude. I use a Yamaha 130 V4 2 stroke. 130psi on all four cylinders and has been reliable. It has never failed to get me home and damn does it pull hard. My only gripe are warm restarts with heatsoak. That's 2 strokes for you though - having to re-prime the engine.
i used to have a 2002 20 hp 2 stroke merc that we bought new, we had it for like 17 years and onkly did a impeller and plugs once , never let me stranded.... had a 2005 200hp ox66 nothing but reliability, currently have a 2006 50hp 2 stroke yamaha and a 2018 90 yamaha
Couldnt be happier with the Etec 250 Gen1 2005 unit i had. over 1200 trouble free hours. Currently on a pair of 2001 200 HPDI's at 770hrs and running like a dream! Filters, filters filters!
I have a carbureted 1999 Johnson 150 on my boat. It’s a great motor. I love the thing. It’s super reliable for a 2 stroke. It’s a shame OMC did the Ficht injection and went out of business.
I got a 53 johnson 3 horse that never misses a beat has a crack in the lower unit cant fill the lower unit cause the plugs are froze in carb leaks gas if it doesnt sit up perfectly straight but it fires first pull every time and gets me out and back pushing a 16 foot bass tracker
Well Came across this post 1 year late but I have the 1st batch 371st 4 Carby 90hp BA Honda that I got in 96 used it mainly for trolling until 2005 Zero problems whatsoever. I was unable to go fishing for 19 years and all I did new Oil filter, Oil , Spark Plugs Gear Oil and it purrs just like it did in 2005.
I would have considered them more on the reliable side, though now they are getting up there in age and those plastic carbs can give you trouble, but I ran a 250 for 3 years 2-3 times a week back in 2013-2016 and had no issues, except for the fuel consumption :/
We also had the first gen Yamaha 40hp 4stroke on a center console rib that was so reliable, serviced once a year and used nearly every weekend with no issues for 5 years for junior sail training and family trips. We blew the bottom of the boat out and had to reglass the bottom and put in additional stringers to stiffen it due to prolonged abuse but no engine issues
My grandpa baught new in 87’ a Yamaha pro v 150j passed down to my uncle and passed down to me 15 yrs ago, the motor has been flawless until last year had to finally change the power pack! $300 on eBay I changed it myself . Runs like new !
I have a 2007 yamaha f40/30 jet drive that is carburared. In 2008 they went fuel injected. Its been an excellent engine. Nothing but normal maintenance. 3cyl
Curious to hear your thoughts on the tower of power engines. I have one on a classic Glastron and it’s nearly 50 years old now. There’s usually one thing every year that needs attention but it’s still going very strong for me. That being said I am a lake boater.
I’m a firm believer that reliability has a lot to do with taking care of it. I ran multiple 2 stroke Evinrude/Johnson motors from 35-70hp on ducks boats and would run them year round. Below 0 temps to summers in the 90’s. I would change lower oil before each season so twice a year. Plugs each year, impellers once a year. Those motors are still running with new owners. I’m running a Honda 75 and a Mercury 90 now and they also run as long as you care for them.
Got a 2011 Optimax 150 in brazil on a 21ft boat, 400h in one and a half year for whale watching, service by authorized mechanic and few issues with temperature, many issue with getting part and service (run already 200h without thermostat at 44-54°C because of supply and service difficulties), but always came back from 10miles off shore trip. But would prefer the silence at idle and the reliability of the dual 4 stroks powered boat.
Picking on the carbureted 4 strokes, I'm still running a 99' Honda that has been the epitome of reliability. No idea how many hours because I've been through 4 hour meters and it ran a few years without one, the 4th hour meter currently reads over 600 hours. Almost all salt use, year round. It does get cared for properly, not looking forward to replacing it but realize I'm on borrowed time at this point.
@@richardferrell4362 re read. The motor likely has a couple thousand hours, the 4th hour meter reads 600 (closer to 800 now I think). I don't remember what the other 3 read when they died, and it went several years without one.
subscribed. Keep an eye on the engine you choose and maintain because the number of cup holders on the boat mean nothing when dead in the water. I am still partial to simple old two stokes but at altitude, they gasp.
I just bought a Suzuki df40 for a 15' runabout we are restoring. Always had Mercury's, the boat we are restoring had a Johnson Super Sea horse 2 stroke. I chose the Suzuki because from my research these motors are very reliable. We will see.
Any opinions on those 1989-2006 Mercury 6-15 HP 2 Stroke outboards? I got a 1995 9.9 2 Smoker, I will say that it's a bulletproof engine, run's phenomenal, 1150 Hours of use and almost 30 years later, and still fires first pull, mix it at 50:1, and she'll last forever with proper maintenance. Still wish they made those little gas hogs. Coming from someone who has owned one, these are bulletproof gas hogs.
Lets hit on what you guys know/think about the 250hp Suzuki's, they are crazy popular in central west gulf coast and the smaller older mechanical version has been around a very long time.
I have a 01 evinrude ficht 135 on a separate boat (have 5+ boats in my circle) 10000% agreed. Most unreliable engine and no one will touch it😂 nailed it Now i have a yamaha 70 on my skiff one of those bulletproof yamaha designs. The 25/50/70/90 2 stroke yamahas were legendary. You guys are killing it with these podcasts. You bring up that shops wont touch 2 strokes down there. They still work on them here some shops but dealerships wont touch anything older than 5 years.
150 johnson 2 stroke . I put gas in it turn key and it flies ..winter pull. Runi out gas while its flushing w/ fresh water .fog it . See you next season 22 years now ..very reliable , fast too
Just found you guys great discussion. Question for you, I have a 2016 Boston Whaler 210 Montauk with a 2016 Evinrude E-TEC 200HP HO. I am in South West Florida and just can't get any service in my area on the E-TEC. My E-TEC needs about a $4k of work, including a new fuel pump/reservoir. So, I've been thinking about repowering. A Suzuki 200 seems like an interesting option. What are your thoughts? Should I try and get the E-TEC repaired? or repower?
Thank you! Personally, if it's in the budget, I'd figure out how to sell the E-TEC and do the repower. I don't think I would dump 4K in the E-TEC, hoping to get it running properly. Though you will lose some power going from the E-TEC to the 200 Suzuki, so that should play a factor in the decision, I guess it would depend on if you can actually find someone that knows what they are doing with the E-TEC and what is the real number to get it running reliably again. Because that's a problem all together, and not being able to find someone to work on it :(
What is the most reliable engine? Or does this weigh heavily on the owner, maintenance, and upkeep? I guess a good topic would be what is the most reliable boat for a terrible boat owner!
Good video guys. Just wanted to say that Evinrude did not go out of business, they are still making parts and servicing old engines. In fact they are still making outboards under the Rotax name. The new motors share allot with the G2 which is a fantastic outboard that I wish you guys would have touched on. 👍🏻
My 89 40hp Yamaha elf oil injected 2 stroke runs top. Of course I disconnected oil injection and mix oil directly in the fuel myself. Have for the past 15yrs. Also have a 5.0 thunderbolt Merceuiser alpha 1 gen 2 that's held up since 1998 then again I know how to change fluids, Water pumps regular maintenance. by the way i take either motor wherever I want to go.
Im running a original 1954 Johnson qd 15 10 hp . Just a tuneup was done as far as ive noticed runs good for 70 . It by today's standards is like a toy you can rebuild witha flathead screwdriver and a few wrenches . Anything ive had to work on takes a few minutes
I went through the whole etech fuel injector thing. I fumbled and stumbled my way through it, and learned how. Got the software learned how to generate the necessary data file for each injector replaced and serviced all 6 injectors successfully. Again there was some trial-and-error involved for sure, once I understood it it's really quite simple.
The best deal is the motor you can have the best dealer relationship with. I have a 5 month hard water season. I don't want to wait on any parts after the melt. Having a symbiotic relationship with the dealer reduces open water downtime. Purchasing boat, parts and services gets you some leverage and a desire in the dealer to have a long successful relationship.
Here’s a question, if you were in the used market for a motor even to just update a boat for resale. What would be your cut off as far as age, hours, brand, pricing even? Are the newer OptiMaxx is even worth buying with parts and availability getting slimmer?
i just unloaded 2 05 yamaha f150s...had to pull the power head twice on the one motor and once on the other to fix leaky oil seal... ran hard as hell but it was always something really little with those motors got about 2k hours on them before sold
These guys break down why they have their opinions a little better. I do like Andy. But he tends to under describe issues . When he does his over under. Why even bring up the electronics unless something isn't offered. Just give damn base price in why u like the boat. He spends half time listing same parts he choses on every boat😊
My 2016 Yamaha 150 has that problem right now. Need a new head because of it. The problem has not been fixed! Also the F150 still have major exhaust corrosion problems
The f150 had a balancer problem they have new ones out (like 6 generations) the f225 oil pan and exhaust had the problems they have a kit for them( pretty hard to get now) also the t stat housings have bad corrosion problems if I remember correctly you have to put the t stat in at 9 and 3
Got too many projects right now brother, but this is a year ago so hopefully your Pro Line is running like a top by now :) lol the only way to really get one on one in touch with us is through the Skool Community: www.skool.com/boatersprogram/about
OMC The Original Parent Company of Evinrude and Johnson Outboard Motors. I have had Different H.P. of these 2 Brands and No Problems. I Currently run a 90 Evinrude XP 200 2 Stroke on a 91 STRATOS 201 Pro with No Problems. Great running Outboard ❤ 👍💯🇺🇸🇺🇸
It’s like the auto industry. Never buy a vehicle with a first few years new engine or transmission design. Once they hit the market the problems surface. Then the engineers solve the problems.
When you got to the part of the discussion about reliability, how did you not mention the Hondas? In the early 2000s, when all the other manufacturers were struggling with their fuel injection systems on their four-strokes, Honda got it right. Those 130s were unstoppable. I had one for over 20 years. It started first try every time.
I just picked up a 2004 hpdi 300 with 600 hrs to replace my 1986 Suzuki dt200😳 That motor was the definition of run it hot or not at all. It still runs, but the clutch dog was shot so it was time to replace it. Love the videos though! I’ve always worked on cars, but there were a lot of unknowns to boats that I learned from you. Thank you!
When you say run it hot you mean wot? Can't run and cruise at 4k rpm for long period of time cause that would be a shit load of fuel for twin 300 for my boat. Cause I usually run 25- 50miles round trip for me
@@antonioprado8068 no I just mean old motor=worn components, and in order to get decent compression and be able to keep the motor starting easily on my fishing trips I’d have to start it every 30 minutes or so and let it run. A lot of guys with these old Suzukis (myself included) would have to get in the lake and run them wot for 15 min so they could get a clean start for the beginning of a tournament😂 They’re known to turn over, fire once, then not start without a good bump of starter fluid
@Jake Wachholz ohh I thought you were talking about the hpdi. I'm now looking at replacing my twin 98 yammie150 for twin 300. How's your experience so far with the hpdi. What did you pay, hours and how did you initially inpect it before buying it to make sure you were getting a good reliable 1
@@antonioprado8068 I paid $1600 for it with 600 hours. I checked compression, pulled all the spark plugs and checked the cylinder walls for anything resembling a sticky ring, checked the lower unit with a pressure test, checked the trim rod seals, tested the oil tank pump on the reservoir, pulled some fuel out of the vst and then just checked the hardware on the power head to see if the motor seemed like it was taken care of. It’s in decent shape. the power head might need a rebuild in a couple hundred hours, but that’s two seasons for me, and for $1600 I’m not complaining!
@Jake Wachholz holy fuck. 1600!!! I wish!!! Even if you spend 4k on a new powered that means it'll be 5600 for a pretty much new engine. I wish, everyone wants 4-6k for each hpdi 300. I need 2 so it would cost 8-12k and with more than 600hrs may I add. I'm in miami. I don't know if your in s.florida and how you found the add. Unless it was through a friend or recommendation
Oh hell ty for telling me about the E tec engine. I was considering getting one when I replace my Mercury. I can't work on an E tec. I'm going to stay with Mercury maybe a Optimax after 01.
I had a boat with twin 90 Fichts on it, ran it for 2 years 0 issues, i currently have a 300hp G2, im only 8 months and 30 hours into my ownership of it so far, its had one issue with the magnets coming off the flywheel, stuck em back on with some JB weld seems to be going ok since. compared to a 250 honda 4 stroke it runs like a madman The reason for the serial numbers on the injectors, is they all flow slightly differently at different RPMS, this is checked in the factory and you need to give this data to the ECU when fitting to ensure correct fuel quantity's are injected. The software for a G1 can be brought for about $50 i think. for the G2 its more expensive. Contrary to what these guys say, you can see on a modern outboard what sort of abuse it has taken. You can get the service records for it to check its been looked after, and you can get a print out from the ECU which will tell you things like time at all the RPMS, max RPM recorded, records of over heats or issues, etc. This will give you a pretty good idea of the way its been run
I agree modern outboards are all reliable. The Yamaha 150 I agree with then for me next would be Suzuki 200 I have been running my Suzuki 200 for years now with zero issues and any thing over 200hp go with mercury.
The 2 strokes with carburetors especially after sitting for a while the gas component in the mixture would evaporate from the fuel bowls and the oil component would not evaporate and when starting you get a very high oil to gas ratio and hence the big cloud of smoke. I had 1995 Johnson ocean runners and wow those things could outdo a James Bond smoke screen.
Dude I love born again boating. This is a good question. I am a nut. I have been taking a 16ft 1967 starcraft over 40 miles offshore of NJ. I've ran Honda Merc 2 stroke and now a 4 stroke. My motor now is a 2020 40hp Merc. I love this motor. I never have any worry that is going to fail. Now my dad swore by the old OMC SeaDrive. We had one on a v20 steplift and a pair on a 250 sportsman. We never really had any out of the ordinary issues and he had the pair from 88 till 01. And they were still working when he got rid of the boat
I've had them all over the decades and Tohatsu 4-stroke has been my most reliable, trouble free outboard -- considerably less expensive, too.
A tohatsu you can let stand out on you,r boat in 12 years, use it all summer and never stop until someone steal the boat and drive it drunk on a rock as my previous 25 , no i have a 9,8 , on a 10 feet driving 10 nautical miles to some islands all spring summer.
And they come with a longer warranty than all of them. Plus the build they mercs 30hp and down. Love Tohatsu outboards.
Suzuki also
There lower units are tiny I had a 40 and I had lower unit issue without hitting anything
Unbelievable amazing discussion! Kudos to you guys and everyone who helped make this happen. You can’t describe a whole pie by one slice. Consumers have preconceived notions and individual frames of reference when it comes to descriptions and opinions. I have come to adopt a mantra in all things…..know what something is and what it isn’t. Advertising is meant to sell a product under the guise of educating the consumer! Again….great job and wonderful depth of knowledge. Very impressed.
You nailed it with the abuse and neglect. With the Ficht it was both of these and ignorance. I have a 2004 225 Ficht with over 130 psi on all cylinders, perfectly maintained by me. Always run ethanol free fuel, XD50 oil, new plugs “ indexed “ every year. To date has over 1000 hours. Proper maintenance is the Number 1 key.
well let me chime in.. I ran a 01 225 Ficht for years.. I sent the emm to DFI technologies and had it redone. With proper yearly maintenance such as what you said above. Another thing is to back wash the cooling system through the service port on the back of the motor with the garden hose. When maintaining the Ficht like that and at the time period the performance that motor gave was incredible.
Really depended on how they were run. Habitually cruising at just the right throttle/load deposits soot on the cylinder walls and tear them up.
F150 Yamaha had soft balancers shredding and clogging oil passages and and popping engines.
I can comment on the Etecs having had dozens of them and running them commercially. They were extremely reliable and long lived. Sure they ate the occasional injector or EMM but we’re talking about several years and thousands of hours between failures. I ran them for 4 or 5 years before replacing with new engines. We put around 7,500 hours on an outboard in 5 years. As for dealer nightmares I never had any. My dealer always had them fixed in a day or two at most. Granted taking an engine or boat to the dealer was a pain in the ass so I eventually bought the BRP diagnostic software, and it was pretty cheap. With a cheap laptop and the software replacing an injector was a very quick and easy job. EMM failures were almost always the charging system. The secret to long life with these things is to run the XD 100 oil on the XD 50 setting. BRP tells you to do this if your using it commercially. When I sold these engines they still ran like a raped ape even with 7500 hours. Calendar time was the killer of them after 5 years they started to have small electrical issues such as bad sensors and other minor issues. As a commercial operation even an hour or two of downtime to get and replace a sensor was unacceptable so I never ran one past 5 years. I have no idea how long they were good for but compared to the other outboards I’ve tried these things were exponentially more reliable. In my experience most of the other 2 stokes wouldn’t last more then about 1 or 2 years or about 2500 hours without a powerhead failure. When we had to go to 4 strokes we spent an incredible amount of time doing maintenance. Only maintenance on an etec was a set of spark plugs a couple times a year. The 4 stroke Suzukis and Yamahas require oil changes every couple weeks, timing belt jobs, ect. With a fleet of a dozen or more boats running 12 or more hours a day 7 days a week just keeping up with maintenance is a major pain in the ass and can only be done at night when the boats are not in service. Seems like every damn night your not going home after working 12 or more hours but doing maintenance. I absolutely loved the Etecs from a commercial operators point of view. They just didn’t need any maintenance and just made us money. I can absolutely understand how the maintenance of a 4 stroke isn’t an issue for a recreational boat or even a commercial singe boat operation. Not a big deal to change the oil on one or two engines once every couple weeks.
Interesting topic for certain. My 2006 Etec 40HP has run without fault. Always used high test gas XD50 oil and their gas additive. Can troll 8 hrs in a day without a hiccup with a 1/2 to 3/4 hr run out and again back in. Now 2023 and start of a new season without even taking a screwdriver out. My kicker is a 76 4 HP rude and has a carb rebuild and parts still easy to find.
Just a suggestion, some commentary on how you guys started, were you around boats as a kid, worst job, best job, etc. Would be interesting especially considering how young you all seem.
Best engine I have ever had (up until now) is a '06 Mercury Optimax 200xs ss sm. I ran the snot out of that engine (98,8mph on an Allison SS2000 boat) for 9 years without a single fault. Also it looked good, incredible fuel economy, good sound without the exhaust block off plate - fantastic. Bought it new.
Not saying etecs are the greatest but ive have less trouble with the etec then my yamaha. Im suprised at the 16:50 etecs reliability because i thought they were trash but mine has well over a 1000hrs with zero issues. I have done all the maintenance tho.
Proud owner of a 94 Mercury Xri 175. The motor is just too easy to rebuild myself. The boat racing community loves the Mercury 2.5l v6 for a good reason.
Exactly. These guys really have no clue lol.
I’ve got a 2005 Yamaha TLR 115 2 stroke on my first boat. Glad to hear y’all say some good things about it.
Love that engine!
I run a 2003 Johnson 115 on my classic Boston Whaler. I bought it new and have run it with very few issues. I disabled the VRO oil injection a few years ago and the motor just runs great. I don't run anything but recreational fuel and it's a beast of a motor.
I have a 1995 Johnson 90 hp fast strike I got rid of my oil injection also it still runs great 👍
My 99 johnson outboard 2 stroke 4 cylinder is incredibly reliable. I bought it in 2010 and it hadn't been ran in about 6 years at the time. It started up immediately but needed carbs rebuilt because of sitting all those years with fuel in it. But since then, its been basically perfect. In the last 14 years ive only had to change change lower unit oil seals once and a spark plug wire once. Never even needed the spark plugs changed though I did change them once last year but only because it seemed crazy they never needed it. It ran the same. 25 years and its still perfect
I enjoyed watching the video. Thanks for putting it together. I personally have been around Suzuki’s for many years. I have never had problems with them. I just purchased a DF350, I have read good and bad things. However, you can find that with all motors.
We ran two Yamaha 350s on a push Boat push in a couple hundred tons of sand cranes and excavators a lot of times in the ponds in the current. You have those things redline for 1015 minutes at a time steady push and 4500 RPMs all day.
My mechanic here in Australia won't touch any Evinrude. I use a Yamaha 130 V4 2 stroke. 130psi on all four cylinders and has been reliable. It has never failed to get me home and damn does it pull hard. My only gripe are warm restarts with heatsoak. That's 2 strokes for you though - having to re-prime the engine.
i used to have a 2002 20 hp 2 stroke merc that we bought new, we had it for like 17 years and onkly did a impeller and plugs once , never let me stranded.... had a 2005 200hp ox66 nothing but reliability, currently have a 2006 50hp 2 stroke yamaha and a 2018 90 yamaha
Couldnt be happier with the Etec 250 Gen1 2005 unit i had. over 1200 trouble free hours. Currently on a pair of 2001 200 HPDI's at 770hrs and running like a dream! Filters, filters filters!
Good talk. He's absolutely correct about no mech working on Etecs. I can't find a service shop that works on etecs within 2 hours of where I live.
I’ve got a good one. He has all the software and cables, plus experience.
My G2 is in good hands with him.
Suzuki df150s. Only issue I've ever had was the data cable to the Guage. And trim tilt motors. Around 1000 hours
I have a carbureted 1999 Johnson 150 on my boat. It’s a great motor. I love the thing. It’s super reliable for a 2 stroke. It’s a shame OMC did the Ficht injection and went out of business.
Love the channel guys , thanks for sharing your knowledge...
How about 2000 mercury 225 EFI? How reliable are they got a boat with 600 hrs.
Oh ya, you gotta discuss synthetic oils for use in outboards too !! good bad ugly ??
I got a 53 johnson 3 horse that never misses a beat has a crack in the lower unit cant fill the lower unit cause the plugs are froze in carb leaks gas if it doesnt sit up perfectly straight but it fires first pull every time and gets me out and back pushing a 16 foot bass tracker
Well Came across this post 1 year late but I have the 1st batch 371st 4 Carby 90hp BA Honda that I got in 96 used it mainly for trolling until 2005 Zero problems whatsoever. I was unable to go fishing for 19 years and all I did new Oil filter, Oil , Spark Plugs Gear Oil and it purrs just like it did in 2005.
What about the Ocean runner 1990s
I would have considered them more on the reliable side, though now they are getting up there in age and those plastic carbs can give you trouble, but I ran a 250 for 3 years 2-3 times a week back in 2013-2016 and had no issues, except for the fuel consumption :/
My dad had early L6 250 verado and had so many issues. Warranty supercharger due to issues, steering fluid leaking out of casting etc
We also had the first gen Yamaha 40hp 4stroke on a center console rib that was so reliable, serviced once a year and used nearly every weekend with no issues for 5 years for junior sail training and family trips. We blew the bottom of the boat out and had to reglass the bottom and put in additional stringers to stiffen it due to prolonged abuse but no engine issues
Also old Yamaha 15hp 2stoke are very reliable
My grandpa baught new in 87’ a Yamaha pro v 150j passed down to my uncle and passed down to me 15 yrs ago, the motor has been flawless until last year had to finally change the power pack! $300 on eBay I changed it myself . Runs like new !
Me running off shore with a 99 ocean pro 175 😂
Probably one of the most bulletproof engines ever made. Drink fuel but never die.
1995 XR 200 Mercury still running today and zero issues.
Same with my 98 Mercury 225
No mention of a black max ??
I have a 2007 yamaha f40/30 jet drive that is carburared. In 2008 they went fuel injected. Its been an excellent engine. Nothing but normal maintenance. 3cyl
Curious to hear your thoughts on the tower of power engines. I have one on a classic Glastron and it’s nearly 50 years old now. There’s usually one thing every year that needs attention but it’s still going very strong for me. That being said I am a lake boater.
I dont know much about them lol much older than me :) but if it's getting you out there without much money, I'd say keep it going :)
I’m a firm believer that reliability has a lot to do with taking care of it. I ran multiple 2 stroke Evinrude/Johnson motors from 35-70hp on ducks boats and would run them year round. Below 0 temps to summers in the 90’s. I would change lower oil before each season so twice a year. Plugs each year, impellers once a year. Those motors are still running with new owners. I’m running a Honda 75 and a Mercury 90 now and they also run as long as you care for them.
Maintenance is the total key for sure!
I’m an outboard only guy my vro 115 has been a great engine for me. You guys kick ass, just discovered this channel
Thank you!
L6 is a Verado?
Yes sir :)
Got a 2011 Optimax 150 in brazil on a 21ft boat, 400h in one and a half year for whale watching, service by authorized mechanic and few issues with temperature, many issue with getting part and service (run already 200h without thermostat at 44-54°C because of supply and service difficulties), but always came back from 10miles off shore trip. But would prefer the silence at idle and the reliability of the dual 4 stroks powered boat.
Picking on the carbureted 4 strokes, I'm still running a 99' Honda that has been the epitome of reliability. No idea how many hours because I've been through 4 hour meters and it ran a few years without one, the 4th hour meter currently reads over 600 hours. Almost all salt use, year round. It does get cared for properly, not looking forward to replacing it but realize I'm on borrowed time at this point.
600 hours on a 25 yr old motor ain't shit. You take it out twice a month for an hour?
@@richardferrell4362 re read. The motor likely has a couple thousand hours, the 4th hour meter reads 600 (closer to 800 now I think). I don't remember what the other 3 read when they died, and it went several years without one.
subscribed. Keep an eye on the engine you choose and maintain because the number of cup holders on the boat mean nothing when dead in the water. I am still partial to simple old two stokes but at altitude, they gasp.
There is a big difference between the first gen ETECs and the ETEC G2
I just bought a Suzuki df40 for a 15' runabout we are restoring. Always had Mercury's, the boat we are restoring had a Johnson Super Sea horse 2 stroke. I chose the Suzuki because from my research these motors are very reliable. We will see.
Any opinions on those 1989-2006 Mercury 6-15 HP 2 Stroke outboards? I got a 1995 9.9 2 Smoker, I will say that it's a bulletproof engine, run's phenomenal, 1150 Hours of use and almost 30 years later, and still fires first pull, mix it at 50:1, and she'll last forever with proper maintenance. Still wish they made those little gas hogs. Coming from someone who has owned one, these are bulletproof gas hogs.
Lets hit on what you guys know/think about the 250hp Suzuki's, they are crazy popular in central west gulf coast and the smaller older mechanical version has been around a very long time.
You guys are an absolute wealth of knowledge. keep it up thank you.👍🇨🇦
The evinrude e-tec infomercials always cracked me up.
Lol Right! I knew they were going under as soon as I head them blasting that 10 year warranty and no service for 5 years! LOL WHAT!
I had twin 135 HP, 2003 OPTI Max engines for 19 years with zero issues. Very reliable, over 1500 hours.
2000 150 Opti, as me it still runs like new.
Great podcast guys! just wondering why no mention of TOHATSU outboards TLDI and 4 strokes unreliability/reliability etc etc?
Don't see a lot of Tohatsu's around here :/
If you don't need fancy just a work horse 1980's evinrudes are tough and super easy to fix.
my friend has twin 350 s on his 33 grady he had trouble with the fly wheel yamaha was great to back it up they push that boat good
1996 Evinrude 15hp, starts 1st pull every time.
I have a 01 evinrude ficht 135 on a separate boat (have 5+ boats in my circle) 10000% agreed. Most unreliable engine and no one will touch it😂 nailed it
Now i have a yamaha 70 on my skiff one of those bulletproof yamaha designs. The 25/50/70/90 2 stroke yamahas were legendary.
You guys are killing it with these podcasts. You bring up that shops wont touch 2 strokes down there. They still work on them here some shops but dealerships wont touch anything older than 5 years.
Don't forget the 115 and the 130
150 johnson 2 stroke .
I put gas in it turn key and it flies ..winter pull. Runi out gas while its flushing w/ fresh water .fog it . See you next season 22 years now ..very reliable , fast too
Just found you guys great discussion. Question for you, I have a 2016 Boston Whaler 210 Montauk with a 2016 Evinrude E-TEC 200HP HO. I am in South West Florida and just can't get any service in my area on the E-TEC. My E-TEC needs about a $4k of work, including a new fuel pump/reservoir. So, I've been thinking about repowering. A Suzuki 200 seems like an interesting option. What are your thoughts? Should I try and get the E-TEC repaired? or repower?
Thank you! Personally, if it's in the budget, I'd figure out how to sell the E-TEC and do the repower. I don't think I would dump 4K in the E-TEC, hoping to get it running properly. Though you will lose some power going from the E-TEC to the 200 Suzuki, so that should play a factor in the decision, I guess it would depend on if you can actually find someone that knows what they are doing with the E-TEC and what is the real number to get it running reliably again. Because that's a problem all together, and not being able to find someone to work on it :(
@@TheBoatersPodcast Thank you so much for the reply.
What is the most reliable engine? Or does this weigh heavily on the owner, maintenance, and upkeep? I guess a good topic would be what is the most reliable boat for a terrible boat owner!
Yamaha is the only motor company that makes boats as well, skeeter is owned by Yamaha
Good video guys. Just wanted to say that Evinrude did not go out of business, they are still making parts and servicing old engines. In fact they are still making outboards under the Rotax name. The new motors share allot with the G2 which is a fantastic outboard that I wish you guys would have touched on. 👍🏻
My 89 40hp Yamaha elf oil injected 2 stroke runs top. Of course I disconnected oil injection and mix oil directly in the fuel myself. Have for the past 15yrs. Also have a 5.0 thunderbolt Merceuiser alpha 1 gen 2 that's held up since 1998 then again I know how to change fluids, Water pumps regular maintenance. by the way i take either motor wherever I want to go.
Im running a original 1954 Johnson qd 15 10 hp . Just a tuneup was done as far as ive noticed runs good for 70 . It by today's standards is like a toy you can rebuild witha flathead screwdriver and a few wrenches . Anything ive had to work on takes a few minutes
I went through the whole etech fuel injector thing. I fumbled and stumbled my way through it, and learned how. Got the software learned how to generate the necessary data file for each injector replaced and serviced all 6 injectors successfully. Again there was some trial-and-error involved for sure, once I understood it it's really quite simple.
Nice!
Ox66 2 stroke fuel injection V-MAX 150. 13 years old when I Sold it. Still running today. 24 years later... best motor ever YAMAHA!
I’ve got a 150 optimax, it seems good so far. It’s a 2000. Is that a year they had it more figured out?
That was like on the tail end of them figuring it out ;) but 24 years is great! Keep doing what you are doing!
I run a 24ft hydrasport 97 ocean pro 225 40-50 miles offshore
The best deal is the motor you can have the best dealer relationship with.
I have a 5 month hard water season. I don't want to wait on any parts after the melt. Having a symbiotic relationship with the dealer reduces open water downtime. Purchasing boat, parts and services gets you some leverage and a desire in the dealer to have a long successful relationship.
100% True Thank you!
Anything that cannot be fixed on the water without a specialized tech on board is unreliable.
I'm an old man at "53" but my 96 Intruder 150 is a bullet proof work horse.
I'll run her till she blows or the government says i can't.
I have a 1999 E115 Ficht. It is so complicated to work on. My JH 115 SPL 90 degree, 1997 is an old charm, easy powerful, reliable.
Looking at getting a new 6hp 4 stroke for my new kaboat. Fishing fresh, and brackish water. What would y'all recommend?
I believe Tohatsu builds everyones small outboards.
Here’s a question, if you were in the used market for a motor even to just update a boat for resale. What would be your cut off as far as age, hours, brand, pricing even? Are the newer OptiMaxx is even worth buying with parts and availability getting slimmer?
We talk about this on the next episode :)
th-cam.com/video/7t3V5lETqRE/w-d-xo.html
How reliable are the 05’ Honda 90?
Honda's are generally super reliable, obviously it is dependent on the maintenance and care of the engine though :)
i just unloaded 2 05 yamaha f150s...had to pull the power head twice on the one motor and once on the other to fix leaky oil seal... ran hard as hell but it was always something really little with those motors got about 2k hours on them before sold
I feel like the young guy watches team marine services with Andy lol
These guys break down why they have their opinions a little better. I do like Andy. But he tends to under describe issues . When he does his over under. Why even bring up the electronics unless something isn't offered. Just give damn base price in why u like the boat. He spends half time listing same parts he choses on every boat😊
Did I say thank you? Nope!
Thank you both for this discussion.
Are the Suzuki 4 strokes heavier than Mercs?
Depends on the year but generally yes
What about the f150 with the harmonic balancer issues? Early f225 with exhaust corrosion issues?
I thought they would of brought that up too.
My 2016 Yamaha 150 has that problem right now. Need a new head because of it. The problem has not been fixed! Also the F150 still have major exhaust corrosion problems
The f150 had a balancer problem they have new ones out (like 6 generations) the f225 oil pan and exhaust had the problems they have a kit for them( pretty hard to get now) also the t stat housings have bad corrosion problems if I remember correctly you have to put the t stat in at 9 and 3
i run a late 90's txrr 150 Yammy 2 stroke. Its still rippin it. ultra dependable. not too bad on fuel.
How do i get i. Touch with you to do work on my old center console 1988 pro line
Got too many projects right now brother, but this is a year ago so hopefully your Pro Line is running like a top by now :) lol the only way to really get one on one in touch with us is through the Skool Community: www.skool.com/boatersprogram/about
Great discussion! Yamaha F115 right up there with F150 reliability !
True that!
My 2000 Yamaha 150 DI 2-stroke was the best outboard I’ve ever had. That thing ran and ran and ran, and then it ran some more.
I have a 40HP ETEC that has been great. If I had to replace it then tohatsu.
We got a 2003 2 stroke Yamaha 150 high pressure direct injection, after full service(by a Pro-Yamaha mechanic)..it sings like a Violin 🎻!!
why not a scott atawater
I really don't know that much about vintage outboards :/
I passed up a deal for boat with a 115 optimax I'm glad I went with the Yamaha 115 2 stroke
how hard is it to switch from mechanical controls to fly bye-wire with a 2019 Suzuki 200 hp
No you just need a fly by wire motor and controlls. They are easier to rig than mechanical control engines.
My 2006 90 mercury EFI has never given me an issue.
On a Podcast note , camera work, The master shot thrown in there is a good move. Better viewing experience.
Love your content! Should consider doing a weekly news review.. keep up with all the marine stuff..
im still using a 6hp evinrude made in 1974. only some hours every year but its amazing enough its still alive even without running that much^^
OMC The Original Parent Company of Evinrude and Johnson Outboard Motors. I have had Different H.P. of these 2 Brands and No Problems. I Currently run a 90 Evinrude XP 200 2 Stroke on a 91 STRATOS 201 Pro with No Problems. Great running Outboard ❤ 👍💯🇺🇸🇺🇸
I have a 1988 Johnson gt 100 2 stroke & still runs strong.
It’s like the auto industry. Never buy a vehicle with a first few years new engine or transmission design. Once they hit the market the problems surface. Then the engineers solve the problems.
When you got to the part of the discussion about reliability, how did you not mention the Hondas? In the early 2000s, when all the other manufacturers were struggling with their fuel injection systems on their four-strokes, Honda got it right. Those 130s were unstoppable. I had one for over 20 years. It started first try every time.
What's your opinion on the Suzuki df200
I think they mentioned something about bolts seizing snapping off causing labor to go up in this video.
I like them!
I enjoy your videos so much !
I just picked up a 2004 hpdi 300 with 600 hrs to replace my 1986 Suzuki dt200😳
That motor was the definition of run it hot or not at all. It still runs, but the clutch dog was shot so it was time to replace it.
Love the videos though! I’ve always worked on cars, but there were a lot of unknowns to boats that I learned from you. Thank you!
When you say run it hot you mean wot? Can't run and cruise at 4k rpm for long period of time cause that would be a shit load of fuel for twin 300 for my boat. Cause I usually run 25- 50miles round trip for me
@@antonioprado8068 no I just mean old motor=worn components, and in order to get decent compression and be able to keep the motor starting easily on my fishing trips I’d have to start it every 30 minutes or so and let it run.
A lot of guys with these old Suzukis (myself included) would have to get in the lake and run them wot for 15 min so they could get a clean start for the beginning of a tournament😂
They’re known to turn over, fire once, then not start without a good bump of starter fluid
@Jake Wachholz ohh I thought you were talking about the hpdi. I'm now looking at replacing my twin 98 yammie150 for twin 300. How's your experience so far with the hpdi. What did you pay, hours and how did you initially inpect it before buying it to make sure you were getting a good reliable 1
@@antonioprado8068 I paid $1600 for it with 600 hours.
I checked compression, pulled all the spark plugs and checked the cylinder walls for anything resembling a sticky ring, checked the lower unit with a pressure test, checked the trim rod seals, tested the oil tank pump on the reservoir, pulled some fuel out of the vst and then just checked the hardware on the power head to see if the motor seemed like it was taken care of.
It’s in decent shape. the power head might need a rebuild in a couple hundred hours, but that’s two seasons for me, and for $1600 I’m not complaining!
@Jake Wachholz holy fuck. 1600!!! I wish!!! Even if you spend 4k on a new powered that means it'll be 5600 for a pretty much new engine. I wish, everyone wants 4-6k for each hpdi 300. I need 2 so it would cost 8-12k and with more than 600hrs may I add. I'm in miami. I don't know if your in s.florida and how you found the add. Unless it was through a friend or recommendation
Oh hell ty for telling me about the E tec engine. I was considering getting one when I replace my Mercury. I can't work on an E tec. I'm going to stay with Mercury maybe a Optimax after 01.
Just installed a brand new Tohatsu 60 on my boat. Can’t wait to get it out.
Nice!
I had a boat with twin 90 Fichts on it, ran it for 2 years 0 issues, i currently have a 300hp G2, im only 8 months and 30 hours into my ownership of it so far, its had one issue with the magnets coming off the flywheel, stuck em back on with some JB weld seems to be going ok since. compared to a 250 honda 4 stroke it runs like a madman
The reason for the serial numbers on the injectors, is they all flow slightly differently at different RPMS, this is checked in the factory and you need to give this data to the ECU when fitting to ensure correct fuel quantity's are injected. The software for a G1 can be brought for about $50 i think. for the G2 its more expensive.
Contrary to what these guys say, you can see on a modern outboard what sort of abuse it has taken. You can get the service records for it to check its been looked after, and you can get a print out from the ECU which will tell you things like time at all the RPMS, max RPM recorded, records of over heats or issues, etc. This will give you a pretty good idea of the way its been run
I agree modern outboards are all reliable. The Yamaha 150 I agree with then for me next would be Suzuki 200 I have been running my Suzuki 200 for years now with zero issues and any thing over 200hp go with mercury.