Hedgehogs are the only unit that give me pause about this game. I'm really hype to watch more matches but hedgehogs seem insane from what I've seen. It seems like it's good about almost everything and anything that can beat it, it can avoid. It just seems a bit too strong at all aspects of the game. I think it uniquely screws over the celestials too. It's hard to set up a bunch of bases around the map when you have pretty much the fastest units in the game with high DPS and an AA mode. **all said with the caveat that we need to see the impact of T3 units
HH in frigate had like 2 too many thing going for it: insane burst damage insane sustain damage (the reload time is better than most Attack speeds) insanely fast insane range after a cheap and fast upgrade. specially anti air (15), as it can siege celestial farther than the max range of celestial (13, saber, only ground) and, if the veterancy skill still exists: too much hp (370/5ar at lvl3 is frankly too much).
@@giuseppebonatici7169 Agreed. I think of it as akin to the hellion. If you're fast, you're generally flimsier and shorter range to make up the discrepancy. Giving it high damage, decent sustain, speed, range, and the ability to AA seems wild for an early-mid game unit.
It was more about broken promote. Without it hedgehogs aren't nearly as oppressive. It's very likely that vanguards would never win against celestials if there was no promote. It'd look pretty similar, but with reversed roles: cel with full map control opening vectors and doing whatever they want.
I have to agree with Don~Ilya here that the promote ability was the core issue not the hedgehogs. The hedgehog only received one change from Elephant Beta to Frigate which was a unit model size reduction by 0.2 (borderline meaningless). But in elephant they were never used because they were rather weak. Promote moved their HP from 230>299 and their damage from 10>13 per rocket (40>52 per burst attack). This stat increase really made them the spotlight of the game for VG.
Fiends/guants were the most broken unit in the game and now they are fine. Hornets and Harbingers are other good examples. Hedgehogs will be fixed but it is mainly due to promote like the other guys said. They just need to be adjusted to fit in with fast promotions.
I do not "cheese" I just participate in strategies that would be considered aggressive from my opponent, but I never cheese. Even Flash would agree that I am an honorable macro player, and simply choose to use strategies that increase my odds of winning by using tools available to me on the enemies side of the map 😆
Hey thanks dude! last 3-4 days I've been eye-ing up some aoe4 games to cast, its just been a bit hectic IRL, i was a bit burned out with aoe4 and then also stormgate releasing in 3 days, planning to cast an aoe4 game this weekend actually, its been too long! I think instead of daily casts for aoe4, this time i'll come back with 1 cast every 2 days - more sustainable that way! thanks for checking on me, means alot!
My opinion in this match: Trudel have to cut incoming units middle of the map. When you defent, you must get enemy fear its own side. Or is this situation too strong for Scout anyways?
Cutting off units would be a strong move for him your 100% correct, as well as counter attacking more than just that one time. I think he mainly just made the wrong unit comp for the strategy I was going for. He needed Vector/Argent/Kri instead of Saber and Scythe.
Scythe in particular seemed like a very odd choice here. I can sort of see wanting sabers to break out of a contain (though a dubious choice about hedgehogs when you have nothing to protect them) but what were the scythes supposed to do?
omg as a sc2 play you can tell this terran has no idea what he is doing. building placement is so bad, splits are bad, unit retention not important to him. Also no ground siege unit for terran?
Hey Mate! Enjoying your videos, but I'm super irritatted by the thumbnails. You make it click-baity. You don't need to. Not every match and unit needs to be BROKEN or BUSTED or INSANE or whatever. We SC2 veterans look for great plays, not exploits between patches. I think you gotta choose your audience, and stick with it. Cheers!
Excited to play in a few weeks!
💪
Hedgehogs are the only unit that give me pause about this game. I'm really hype to watch more matches but hedgehogs seem insane from what I've seen. It seems like it's good about almost everything and anything that can beat it, it can avoid. It just seems a bit too strong at all aspects of the game.
I think it uniquely screws over the celestials too. It's hard to set up a bunch of bases around the map when you have pretty much the fastest units in the game with high DPS and an AA mode.
**all said with the caveat that we need to see the impact of T3 units
HH in frigate had like 2 too many thing going for it:
insane burst damage
insane sustain damage (the reload time is better than most Attack speeds)
insanely fast
insane range after a cheap and fast upgrade. specially anti air (15), as it can siege celestial farther than the max range of celestial (13, saber, only ground)
and, if the veterancy skill still exists: too much hp (370/5ar at lvl3 is frankly too much).
@@giuseppebonatici7169 Agreed. I think of it as akin to the hellion. If you're fast, you're generally flimsier and shorter range to make up the discrepancy. Giving it high damage, decent sustain, speed, range, and the ability to AA seems wild for an early-mid game unit.
It was more about broken promote. Without it hedgehogs aren't nearly as oppressive. It's very likely that vanguards would never win against celestials if there was no promote. It'd look pretty similar, but with reversed roles: cel with full map control opening vectors and doing whatever they want.
I have to agree with Don~Ilya here that the promote ability was the core issue not the hedgehogs. The hedgehog only received one change from Elephant Beta to Frigate which was a unit model size reduction by 0.2 (borderline meaningless). But in elephant they were never used because they were rather weak. Promote moved their HP from 230>299 and their damage from 10>13 per rocket (40>52 per burst attack). This stat increase really made them the spotlight of the game for VG.
Fiends/guants were the most broken unit in the game and now they are fine. Hornets and Harbingers are other good examples. Hedgehogs will be fixed but it is mainly due to promote like the other guys said. They just need to be adjusted to fit in with fast promotions.
They need to increase the damage of sabers by 300%
Sabers do a lot more damage vs armored targets. Unfortunately that doesn't include hedgehogs.
I feel like animancers would have done well against the sentry turrets and deployed hedgehogs.
I do not "cheese" I just participate in strategies that would be considered aggressive from my opponent, but I never cheese. Even Flash would agree that I am an honorable macro player, and simply choose to use strategies that increase my odds of winning by using tools available to me on the enemies side of the map 😆
Was persevering on the scythes a bad idea?
Yeah I think so, I think scythes just weren't good during the frigate playtest. I can imagine it being buffed but we'll have to see
Buddy I got worried about you. I haven’t seen you post aoe4 in a while so came to check on you. Hope you are good. Come back soon!
Hey thanks dude! last 3-4 days I've been eye-ing up some aoe4 games to cast, its just been a bit hectic IRL, i was a bit burned out with aoe4 and then also stormgate releasing in 3 days, planning to cast an aoe4 game this weekend actually, its been too long! I think instead of daily casts for aoe4, this time i'll come back with 1 cast every 2 days - more sustainable that way! thanks for checking on me, means alot!
My opinion in this match: Trudel have to cut incoming units middle of the map. When you defent, you must get enemy fear its own side. Or is this situation too strong for Scout anyways?
Cutting off units would be a strong move for him your 100% correct, as well as counter attacking more than just that one time. I think he mainly just made the wrong unit comp for the strategy I was going for. He needed Vector/Argent/Kri instead of Saber and Scythe.
Scythe in particular seemed like a very odd choice here. I can sort of see wanting sabers to break out of a contain (though a dubious choice about hedgehogs when you have nothing to protect them) but what were the scythes supposed to do?
🥞
🫶
😈😈😈
✌
NGL this looks like such an irritating match. Tickle fights both ways except one side gets fast repairs
omg as a sc2 play you can tell this terran has no idea what he is doing. building placement is so bad, splits are bad, unit retention not important to him. Also no ground siege unit for terran?
Please change the model of the rocket cars, they look terrible
Hey Mate!
Enjoying your videos, but I'm super irritatted by the thumbnails.
You make it click-baity. You don't need to. Not every match and unit needs to be BROKEN or BUSTED or INSANE or whatever.
We SC2 veterans look for great plays, not exploits between patches.
I think you gotta choose your audience, and stick with it. Cheers!