I gotta say something really bad ass about Sarah and you, is that you guys video document all your trials and tribulations and post it! It's not a perfect fu*ing world, that's why I love you guys! This was me a few months back in my own driveway working on my new to me old Johnson! This channel is very relatable to me! And now it's in a shop getting fine tuned by an old OMC emplyee/instructor! Dude is bad ass knows his sh*t
Thanks man! I've had quite a few old boats and they always need time, setbacks, and experimentation to dial everything in. Can't wait to get this reliable and start tweaking it for speeeeeeeeeddddd
Get rid of the oil injection. Run premixed gas. Oil injection can fail or you forget to fill oil tank and you will burn up the motor quick fast and in a jiffy. Just run premixed gas. Cheap insurance plan
Rob, you need to have a functioning poppet for the cooling system to properly pressurize and hold the water in the block as long as it needs to cool. A leaking poppet valve is like driving around without a radiator cap. You’re bold for running the motor that hard without a functioning cooling system. I will reiterate, you NEED a water PSI gauge. It tells the story you’re looking to hear.
It will be very low at idle and get even worse when the thermostats open. Manual calls for 12 psi minimum @5500rpm, but you should have more than 10 at all times while on the plane, and if I remember correctly 20 psi is a normal sort of figure that you should see most of the time
I agree, these motors went on all types of boats. The stock lower unit has the water pickups above the "bullet" portion of the lower unit, which is good for most pleasure boats as you won't suck up as much sand and muck. But in a performance boat, especially with a jack plate you probably need the lower unit that has the water pick up below the prop shaft line. Trimmed out and the jack plate up, you are probably pulling the water inlets out of the water at high speed, hence the immediate overheating. It's probably difficult to watch at high speed, but if you can mount a camera at the telltale water outlet you might be able to see if the stream stops at high speed.
@@mrpink6840 nope we have run stock cases up to 2 inches below the bottom for years never an issue i have gone 90 mph in 800' with stock merc gearcase .....the boat has been like that for years he bought it that way ...they have some other issue .
@@crashalexander7232 Had some pretty fast performance boats myself but the centerline of the prop shaft looks higher than 2 below the bottom of the boat… it’ll be interesting to see what the overheating problem turns out to be
It's set too low the gearcase center is like 4" below the bottom of the boat. I do think I need to plug the upper waterpickup holes, that will happen soon.
You guys rock. I have raced boats for 11 years now both inboard and outboard boats mostly tunnels . Before you move jackplate around have your gf video the boat running at speed to see how much boat is in the water or how wet or dry it is those boats have a small pad at rear if I remember correctly and at speed it should ride on that pad. Trim out at speed until you get boat dry. To mush positive trim and boat will rpm and loose speed and or chine slightly . I started watching your vids for fiberglass help as I'm restoring a boat and never done glass work only motor work lol. I will definitely be hitting you guys up for some tips . Cheers from northern California 👍
Awesome idea! Thanks for the tip, I will definitely do that. I'm not sure this hull has a real pad, it's pretty basic. Might get weird at 60+, we will see eventually.
@@ADDvanced it will be fine. It will only get weird during loss of power ect as long as it's under power it will be fine I think you might have the drive up to high on Jack plate causing temp . Lower one inch and go run. Then take it out pick an rpm say 4000 and trim it out until you feel the boat slow down or rpm spike and loss of speed trim back down a touch and you should have a slight prop roost not much but should see a little one and most likely that will be max effort trim location . If you ever need help on motors and or setup let me know. I have a few pics and vids of a sleek craft I had with a jet ran 118mph with a 540 inch blown alky Chevrolet. . Fun boat and looks cool. Traded it for a 19ft cougar tunnel vdrive . Love boats and now want to learn the glass work as I have always paid an arm and a leg for new floors ect.
You need a water pressure gauge! It may be sucking in air, thread the top two intake holes and plug them with set screws OR get a Bob's machine nose cone for that lower unit.
You must connect one of the two hoses coming from the oil tank, the one marked in blue, to the small oil container passing through a T connection with an open end to let excessive pressure out. The other hose goes to the engine block where air is pumped towards the oil tank in order to pressure the tank. Both kids of the big oil tank must be tight enough for air pressure pushes oil towards the small oil container. Open the small container lid and let the engine pump enough air pressure from the big oil tank until the small container is full and oil starts leaking oil out, then just tighten the lid so no more oil is spilling. When oil is low you hear an intermittent beep, when overheating you hear a continuous beep. Manual says that if oil mixing pump gets broken a continuous tone would come on also. Engine must be stopped whenever a continuous beep is heard. Check oil level when intermittent beep comes on.
@@ADDvanced It must overflow after engine pressures the external tank through the hose not marked in blue bringing air pressure from the right side of the engine looking forward. The hose marked wuth a blue stripe must go towards the tank, it passes through a T but you can connect it direct for testing.
The Slinger ( Seal ) normally just gets pushed down over the drive shaft till it comes down to the water pump housing. It does not fit inside the housing. If you look closely at the old housing, you are going to find that what you thought was a seal, is most likely, nylon from the housing that has melted and been pushed up into that cavity
@@ADDvanced YES!!! pull it back out, you will cook the pump housing, it just slides down the shaft and sits on top of the housing to stop water traveling up the shaft
I know this is what mercury states, but gosh is it weird that there is that gap between the impeller housing and the metal cup. Its even weirder how the slinger seal fits so perfectly into that spot.
The beeping is likely from the main oil tank that float valve is notorious for flooding. My sensor is disconnected I just make sure the one on the engine is full and don't forget to top up the main tank from time to. Time
When I was reading the thread about the v6 history the hull truth they talked about that spot next to the popett valve and why it’s there. I think it was the original thermostat location? I can’t remember but it’s just part of the original casting and not used anymore.
I know you posted this 1st video months ago, but from the warbling sound the starter was making while cranking the 1st time out, I believe there was a damaged cylinder or a blown head gasket. And another poster was correct about the rubber "Slinger" washer - it slides down the driveshaft to just above the water pump housing. It keeps water from the pump from spraying up the exhaust tuner.
In a later video I pull the heads but don't see any signs of anything, and threw in fresh HG's. Thanks for the tip on the slinger washer, I'll redo it before I take it out again. Also going to pull powerhead. Again. I'm determined.
@@ADDvanced I saw that video after I commented here. A couple of things to consider; that "wash" place in the lower cylinder was likely water. If it didn't come from the gasket you may have a crack somewhere in between the top & bottoms of the cylinders. I had a 2.4 liter XR4 that I ran with the overheat alarm going and it scored a piston but couldn't be seen until it was removed. If you haven't yet, be sure and do a compression test
@@ADDvanced As you know, you got a great deal! Of course with boats, there is always something else to do! Good luck, the old 2 liter Mercs are stout. It is great that your lady friend/wife enjoys getting involved!
Sweet boat for the money :D Compression test after overheating it, then if it passes oil injection delete and new poppet valve and assembly, likely have to hit up a used place like Tim's Outboard (they the best) with your ser# and part number you removed ready. Then for your pressure guage you simply T off the cooling line and run that to the guage making sure it's not blocked. Then you can play with a plate and props get her really rippin!
I agree with getting a low water pick up-nose cone, water intakes could be too high if you have the manual jack plate too high, try lowering the jack plate & see, otherwise there is a clog somewhere.
Idk it's hanging down pretty far right now, it's not remotely in the right spot for high speed runs. Going to try to film the gearcase during the next run
I had the exact same boat for 15 years down on the Colorado river with the 175 Evinrude it towed back more expensive boats to our dock everybody called at the McDonald’s boat because of the color I miss that boat
I haven't had any issues with my oil injection on my 95 XR6. I wouldn't delete it, that's why it has oil injection, so you don't have to go through the bs of mixing oil and gas. I just check my tanks to make sure it has enough, I use my boat quite a bit and a gallon has lasted me all summer so far...
@@ADDvanced I agree in that respect but I think most people saying delete it have probably blown one up so they're gun shy... LOL! You don't have a body of water you can hold it wide open without getting a ticket so as long as it smokes, I think you're good...😆
@@bassassin2ohseven584 a steel drive gear running on a nylon gear usually doesn’t end up well… the oil injection will fail and you probably won’t catch it in time. If they ran the oil gear off the bottom of the crank it would be ok. Merc ran the oil gear off #2 cylinder on the 2.0,2.4 and 2.5. It gets to hot up there and will warp the nylon gear resulting in failure.
Delete oil injection, get water pressure gauge, if you have a laser thermometer shoot it at the thermostat covers and see what it reads at idle and after a hard run. This will tell you if your gauge is close to accurate.. you be fine with the stock lower at the speeds your gona run, just pay attention to pressure and if need be plug the top few inlet holes..
@@ADDvanced psi at idle will be somewhere around 5 psi and 12-20 at wot depending on engine height.. if there is a major blockage in the cooling system it will read high.. temps will run around 130-140
I think I'm just going to plug a few of the upper holes, this gearcase is supposedly good to 75ish. Thermostats are ordered, hopefully they get here soon.
Another great video. The solid alarm sound is when its overheating. I expect the beeping is the oil injection (my black max is a 1978 built b4 that technology) but like others say, disconnect it and run premix to be certain you won’t seize it up. I’d go with a low water pickup for your high speed runs with it trimmed up. Sounds like thermostats are working since the temp dropped so quick when you were running slow, but I’d test them anyway. I chased a water pressure issue for over a month, ended up replacing every gasket between the power head and the bottom plate of the exhaust and the top seal between of the supply tube from the water pump. I’m sure you’ll sort it out soon.
"top seal between supply tube from water pump", not sure which you are talking about? The waterpump plastic tube went up into the tube in the midsection, but there was no seal there. Should there be?
@@ADDvanced hey Rob, there is on mine. It’s the same as the one between the water pump housing and the tube. You probably have one and can’t see it because it’s right under the power head. I’ll try to find a way to get you a picture of my service manual….
I'm running a 96 Mariner 150 magnum efi which is basically the same powerhead as yours minus the efi. Had some overheat alarms as well, never messed with the poppet valves but found my outlet hoses from the thermostats were plugged. Seems that small bugs like to crawl up them and build nests. Wound up deleting the thermostats and now have great water flow. If you have an alarm controller on yours that could also be bad.
Continuous tone overheat, broken tone oil. If you found sand in your poppet, it's possible that the adapter plate is plugged, and causing your overheat condition. Alot of times the only way to fix is to remove powerhead. Also to much timing, or lack of oil can make heat. Check your thermostats in hot water, they should open at 140f°. Your overheat alarm usually goes off at 180+. My engines usually drop in temp, from 140+ at idle to 100-120(depending on water temp) when put on plane, then slowly gain temp up to 140. The only help I can give on poppet, is that my 2.5 litres don't have the extra parts that came with your kit. I own a 18' laser ltv with a 150 Mariner Supermag, running 77mph with a 28p 4 blade prop, and Bob's lwp.
Thanks for the comment! I appreciate the other potential issues, and I have ordered new thermostats. Also going to film the gearcase at speed and see if it's sucking air.
YOU DID NOT GET THE COPPER WATER TUBE IN THE TOP OF THE WATER PUMP HOUSING WHEN YOU RE -INSTALLED THE LOWER UNIT? OR THE PLASTIC SLEEVE IS CRACKED ...? YOU GOT THE POPIT VALVE JAZZED UP ....OLD PC STUCK IN THERE ? THERMOSTATS THEY STICK OPEN AND CLOSED SOMETIMES .. PLUG TOP HOLES IN THE GEARCASE INLETS ....THE BOAT HAS BEEN RUNNING THAT WAY FOR A LONG TIME JUST NEEDS TO BE DONE RIGHT..
Plastic sleeve is new, and went into the midsection tube when reinstalling. The probelm with the poppet is the diaphram I ordered is too thick. Nothing was still in there, I used some hooks to pull out that plastic O ring seat. Will definitely plug the upper holes....
Need to find out what the best prop to pad height is and adjust the jackplate. You're not getting enough water at speed for some reason. Could also cure your porpoising problem. That boat with a 3 blade prop should get well into the 60's if not close to 70 plus.
looks like you have a 4 blade prop which is good for launching out of the hole but not top end . If you want more speed go to a 3 blade prop and up the pitch a little ( maybe by 2 ) . solid beep is overheating . change your thermostats and make sure your hoses are clear and flowing
It depends on what four blade prop it is, some are as fast or faster than 3 blades on some boats similar to this, for example the Trophy plus. Blades alone isnt the whole story. But generally, 3 blades are most often faster, but we dont know what prop he has got, do we? Maybe I missed it.
All the hoses dealing with the cooling system. You said there was sand in the pop it valve which most likely the previous owner ran the motor a ground and sucked up sand into the cooling system . You can always check the thermostats by boiling them in hot water to see if they open at the correct temperature
you might try pulling off your lower unit and putting your impeller in the water pump housing before you put it on the shaft that way you can make sure all of the fins are going the proper direction
@addvance was going to mention, your video on how to change water pump,,, what I didn't see mentioned was when turning shaft to slide housing down,,, direction of rotation is important,,, but that's for viewers, not yourself,,,, also when you found sand,,,, I'd pull the thermostat and check in the housing for sand there too, maybe your water jackets are clogged
Not to solve the overheating and to be used constantly, but take off the thermostat and try then. And now it's a 500 dollars plus how ever much the ticket was boat. On my old daycruiser my motor sits so that the propshaft is maybe 3cm (little over an inch) below the bottoms lovest point. Normal steel prop, ballistic not a cleaver. And thanks for the vids, allways a pleasure.
That's a nice little boat that should easily run 65 when set up properly. My 18' Nitro bassboat with 150 runs 58 carrying three batteries,trolling motor and 1/2 ton of fishing gear.
Too bad about the issues, but you will get there, I am sure. 56 mph isnt bad for the setup as it looks to be at the moment, and for 500 bux you got reason to be overjoyed. Oh, and the boat looks really nice after the polishing.
Yeah, I am still geeked on this thing! I joined a CeeBee group on FB and a guy has a similar boat with an identical XR2 dialed in, and he's hitting 72mph which is LEGIT imho.
@@ADDvanced It certainly is. As I am sure you know, motor setup (height and prop etc) and weight balance is everything on reasonably light weight boats as this. When it "clicks" into place... they are quite fast. Be careful about handling issues such as chine walk, blow outs and "prop ride" though. If you get upwards of 70 mph and above, a real racing spec life jacket is a wise investment, water gets hard at that speed.. As I wrote in an older comment, get a separate water intake and plumb it into the motor, so you can lift it as high as the prop gives grip. Its quite cheap. DIY just a few bucks. Rule of thumb for boats of this size doing 70-80 mph is you get almost 2 mph extra top for every inch you can lift the motor out of the water. Yes, really. It makes that big of a difference. Good luck.
I thought poppet opens up when at high speed to bypass t stats. That's how Evinrude ob motors work. It's in conjunction with the stats. I'd change the stats and see if the overheating stops. Good luck, that is one nice vintage boat and motor, it sounds and looks amazing
Hea Rob you need to ether remover the thermostats or replace them!!! Did I her you right you where turning 5800 rpm if that’s the case you need more prop to get to 60 mph. You most likely have the right pop off parts the new rubber just has not been compressed try putting a light coating of grease on it before assembly. Like one of the other guys said you need to video the lower unit at speed to see if the motor is to high for the stock pickup and a pressure gauge is a great tool😊
Nah, it seems like it's a different part. I've found photos of older poppet kits and they look thinner, so I just need to find one to order. And yeah, I saw 5800rpm (briefly)... definitely going to video the gearcase on my next run, hoping to change the thermostats or remove and run restrictors (quarter with a hole in it?), but the big thing is I want to get my water PRESSURE gauge working before I go out again.
Just curious where the heck did you find a deal like that. I have been looking for over a year now on craigslist and market place and still cant find a deal like that, Please share. Thanks
A few things I noticed. The gasket on the lower unit water pump with the slot missing is causing air issue so it is good you changed it out. The poppet valve is different on different models so they make a one kit for all thing which looks like missing stuff when it is not. ONBOARD OIL TANK.. has to be completely full and your was not. To check the system just unscrew and run the engine. The large oil tank on the boat should fill that small tank pretty fast. When it is full and I mean full, screw the cap on snugly. That tank should never lose being completely full. IF it drops down you have a issue someplace from the boat tank to the small tank hoses. The normal oil issue is a four beep series every two min. The alarm you had was all about heat or should say overheating. The sensors sometimes have faulty wiring that grounds out the system and you get false alarms however, you had a heat issue. The fact that you didn't burn it up is amazing. I have one right now in my shop that had a overheat problem that melted 3 pistons in a short run of about a tenth of a mile. He shut down and the engine was boiling water for about fifteen min. IT never ran again and all the wiring was melted as was the recirc hoses. SO if you get that alarm, slow down and do not do that again... great engines, best of luck.
Hey after you change the thermostats and figure out your popet valve issue, if it still over heats you need to take off the heads and check for excess sand or calcium build up. If you are going to keep going for top speed, man i wish you would ditch the oil injection and go premix. You may want to check the plugs and see if any of them look lean. Since you dont have a test wheel. You can do it on the water. You drive the boat until the max RPM and pull the kill switch. It can be a little scetchy if your not paying attention. Go straight and make sure your not about to cross wakes. Love the videos
Good idea on checking the plugs, I use that same technique on my old snowmobiles (scope the phazer long track build!). Oil injection will go away eventually, but I want to stop it from overheating before i start messing with other variables.
Can't disrespect the water cops too much. Junior called me today because he was in the middle of the lake and the Sea Ray wouldn't go forward or reverse. I couldn't help so he called the Oakland County police who patrol his lake on busy weekends and holidays. They towed him in no charge and just a little chastising. Turns out he whacked the prop and conveniently didn't include that detail in our conversation . Fortunately, the hub spun saving the outdrive. A year ago this weekend, we took the Sea Ray out for its maiden voyage after the rebuild. The engine stalled and wouldn't restart due to an electrical issue. Guess who towed us in then too. 😉 Keep posting! As others have said, I like your posts because you aren't afraid to show your fails as well as successes.
Tax Collectors w Badges. They enforce the rules/laws set by the bourgeoisie to oppress and control the proletariat. Keep your laws off my hull! Cheers!
ye oil injection and that..causes problems it seams. Thats why my 1978 1750 black max never failed i gues exept for a few ignition coils and the ignition trigger under the wlywheel one time.
At this point I'm guessing I'll just leave it wrapped up til next year. Going out west in less than a month, and when I get back it will be autumn. Winter is coming.
The fins on the impeller have to be all curved the same way, if they are not it affects the water flow. Check that..2nd check thermostat. Regards to oil, check lines to the motor they get old and deteriorate inside, so might have crap in pump.
They are, I rotated the fins and pushed htem in the correct direction by spinning the driveshaft while lowering the housing. New thermostats have been ordered.... which lines are you thinking I should check, the big one on the bottom of the engine mounted reservoir?
@@ADDvanced the lines from tank to motor, if they are really soft. This is a tough deal, I worked at a mercury racing dealer for quite a few years..I hate chasing. You don't want to just start throwing parts at it.. sometimes the lines from the heads can get sand in them too. Can always try running it without thermostat on muffs see how strong the telltale stream is..
Only poppet diaphragm I see listed for the XR2 is 64877 (orig) or 648771 (alternate newer #). Overheat alarm is constant beep (i.e. beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep); oil problem is intermediate beep (i.e. beep, beep, beep...). If your temp gauge is indicating overheat and your alarm is triggering a constant beeeeeeeeep, then highly likely you are overheating. Thermostats, impeller/water pump, poppet, water pickup can all affect that. you replaced the impeller so probably that is good.
I’m chasing an overheating issue on the same engine. The only thing I haven’t done is pull the powerhead and check the gasket at the midsection. I did find that I had bad reeds and replaced those and not tested again, but I doubt that will fix it. I’ve been trying to find the source of the issue for 3 years now.
I’d sent the gear case to Bibs n have a low water pick up installed like i did on my 2.5 280 puts more water through the motor better cooling and u can run the motor higher n get more speed without suffering heat damage from lack of water plus if ur impeller fails if I r moving forward water gets forced through the motor n it still won’t run hot
Hi just pick up a matching pair 1979 boat motor and trailer boat a checkmate predictor with a 115 tower of power 2 stroke does 44mph with a 19 pitch prop.
Oh far out Merc Mondays are the cats meow! Since I'm currently a 120 Johnson Looper owner, how is the availability on older Merc parts? I know companies still remanufacture powerheads for my Johnson I wonder if they do for older Mercs?
I dont have any idea whatsoever, but surely its better? Considering the overwhelming popularity of these engines as a race motor. But, as I said, no idea really, but that would seem to be what logic would dictate?
@@ADDvanced maybe it’s inop off idle?? Quick test could be to empty that tank of oil and run some pre mixed gasoline and see if the problem persists exactly as was before.
I think the oil float sensors go bad on these things, perhaps test the circuit, can’t tell by looking at them, stuck thermostats, pull them out and clean them gently perhaps with a chemical depending on the contamination, ditch the 4 blade prop for better rpm’s too
Also 'Link and sync' on mercs is a must. Get rid of oil injection too, never trust older systems as they can easily blow a motor🤑 50:1 premix with good oil never fails🙂
Based on all I have seen you change on the motor I would predict that your temp issue is related to the oil. Because motor is old and had been sitting you can get some oil/sludge/tar like restrictions formed in the system. Low oil flow will lead to higher temps. This is proven as you slow down the temp drops so water pump is working. I would run with premixed fuel to see if you get a temp alarm. If you don’t them issue is oil pump related, if you do them keep investigating.
@@ADDvanced prop shaft will still spin (click, click, click) in forward. Through me for a loop because I've done Mercruiser for 10 years. Those you HAVE to put in forward. I tilt the engine in neutral. Put it in reverse. Do my stuff. Take the plugs out and spin engine by hand to get powerhead splines to line up. Button up. Back into neutral. Drop it to vertical. Helps to use ratchet strap to hold lower in place while bolts go back in.
One last thing on heat issue. The engine I have here overheated because the old owner failed to pay attention. It was not anything on the engine. He put it on a jack plate because well, everyone else has one lol. Then proceeded to mount the thing with the engine way to high like 5 inches too high so when running at speed the water pickup holes in the lower unit were out of the water hence burned up the engine quickly. When I mounted the new engine he bought from me (xr4) mid 90's. I lowered it to normal and no more issues. SO... that too can be your issue guys if everything else checks out. Again heat is constant beep, oil is four beeps every two min.
You need to get low water pickups. That's why ur overheating. The stock pickups on the lower unit are not suckin up enough water when ur up on plane. When ur going slow not on plane, the stock pickups are fully submerged. They have lower water pickups that u Weld on the lower unit nose Cone. It has 2 hoses that run to factory water pickup location and 2 new plate that replaces ur factory multi hole water pick up plates. Then you can run a chopper surface running prop. That's how you will see faster top speed runs. The 4 blade you got now is for fast acceleration (holeshot) drop to a 3 blade you will pick up more top speed
negative he aint anywhere near high enough to worry about that there is another issue in the cooling system somewhere t-stats most likely or the water pump install was bad. you can run that motor up to 2 inches below the bottom no issues i have done it for years.
@@GoldenCroc TROPHY RUNS GOOD BUT THERE ARE MANY 3 BLADES THAT RUN WAY BETTER... RULE IS 4 BLADES ADD DRAG VS 3 OR EVEN 2 BLADES....SO ON SOME SETUPS THE TROPHY WILL RUN BETTER BUT GENERALLY SPEAKING MOST OF THE TIME A 3 BLADE WILL MPH THE 4 BLADE ALL ELSE THE SAME.
@@crashalexander7232 Drag is a factor, yes, but there is also grip and many other factors to consider. But yes I mostly agree, on average a 3 blade prop will be faster than a 4, but I just mentioned since he worded it like all three blades are faster in all setups than a 4 blade ones, which isnt always true. This could well be one of those boats that run better with a specialized four blade. V hull optimization on the limit is still somewhat of an black art. Also as I am sure you are aware, the real fast big boys (200mph +) run FIVE or sometimes even more blade props. Only testing, and a lot of it, will tell which is best for this boat. Cheers.
It could be water pickup at high speed. My bravo does that, 454 in a carrera viper, wot trimed up shoots a rooster but temp climbs fast. I have heard stories of low water pickups . I fix mine by not shooting a rooster lol
You should cut the tabs on the thermostats or get rid of them I would start off by cutting the tabs to increase the flow of water if that doesn't work you might have to pull the thermostats out those markers run a little hot You gotta try to give them as much waters you can. Also I normally block out and get rid of the pop it valve That's just additional stuff that gets clogged in the system. Also I would look into Hydraulic trim tabs That would give you a lot more control of your boat with the purposing
@@thewrenchgarage7986 the metal pickup tube in the mid section? Like pull that down more? The plastic pickup tube? I think you're right, really trying to not pull the powerhead if I can help it.
@@ADDvanced I believe it's a copper. If you pull it it will come off I would pull it out grease it and make sure you don't push it all the way up just enough for the midsection too line up. It's only inserted into a rubber grommet.
I’d get rid of the oil injection or unplug it. Also be mindful that the cap on the motor tank can and will developer a hair line crack and can n does cause a alarm n won’t let the motor get proper oil
Do you happen to have a RPM gauge? This will help ppl help you to figure if you are topped in speed and if your actual prop is correctly matched to your motor.
To your information rpm at max speed should be arround 5500 rpm for a lot of motors, don't know about yours but if you run higher RPM you can overheat as well.
You should manually measure the oil and fuel you have used. Just re fill the tanks and take note of how much you have used. Could be running lean or not enough oil
Get rid of the oil injection. Go premixed. Get an aluminum 3 blade 21p or 23p and see which one gives you a better top speed if that is what you want. I have a merc 5.0 in a 20ft maxum and I have 15p for pulling tubes also have a 17p id rather get on plane faster than top speed. I still hit low 40s with the 15p
Looks like it was chine walking a lot, triming up will make it worse. I think with one person the weight distribution is off. In the last video when Sarah was in the boat it was much more stable. My LaveyCraft does the same thing when above 60 and trimmed out, it's not as drastic as this boat but you can tell it's chine walking.
And the prop is? Trim out...and pitch-up. Your light and if your running a Trophy, a 25p is worth a try. Don't worry, you are not alone, my First-Mate is also my cruise control...
The housing for the poppet valve is broken like you said. It bypasses water over 2k rpm for extra cooling. It should be a direct path from the port with the spring and diaphragm to the empty port an inch or so towards the back of the engine. It'll stay cool under 2k as the engine relies only on the thermostats which is what you were seeing
@@ADDvanced Got it. Weird how they had that provision for that long but was a blind hole. Just rebuilt a 1990 2.0 and they use that entire bracket to dump the water to the exhaust.
Awesome video! Did you ever get the correct poppet valve part? Or was what you used okay and you've been rolling with it? I need to rebuild my poppet. Thanks for any info
Solid tone overheat. Broken tone is oiling. If its not oiling enough it Will overheat. I've built more engines from oiling issues...loose the oiling system
Also correct factory procedure to bleed air from oiling system is while engine is running at an idle on water hose...remove the cap on engine oil tank till it fills from the oil tank in boat. Pressure from engine will force oil to engine tank. It takes few minutes but you will see the oil level rises. Put cap back on. If it doesnt rise the one way pressure valve on air hose is bad on engine or the tank in boat has air leak and not building pressure. The oil pump on side of engine is only a metering pump that injects correct amount of oil based on RPM into the fuel stream. Its not true oil injection. Just automatic oiler. Its junk removal will save you a meltdown...certified professional advice from mercury mechanic
@@jamiehankins3204 Regarding weather he is overheating or not, just looking at his tell tail, I had a 225 BM and it would piss way harder than what I'm seeing. If his temp gauge is pegging why is there no steady temp alarm? Wonder what the alarm setpoint is. 190 maybe?
There is mud built up in the small passage’s that comes back to the water jacket in fact open up the water jacket and look for mud forget the gasket it’s not a problem tighten up a little more some where in the cooling system there is blockage I’ve seen where a mud wasp 🐝 started to build a nest in the per tube lol 😂 what😲I hope you understand what I’m trying to say else can I help you with also find your temperature sender and Change it you can not unplug a sending sensors and get a response from the motor you don’t know if the sensor ground it self and that is what kick off your temp sensor if you haven’t had the thermostat out please do that first get a new thermostat and gasket just in case good luck
I am getting NO WATER out the exhaust at all, which is causing the overheating. I've changed waterpump, housing, poppets, thermostats, and pulled the heads and exhaust plate. Still no water coming out the exhaust.... ?!?!
@@ADDvanced I dug through my parts bin and found an old poppet valve that is still assembled. I’d be more than happy to put together a little video and hopefully shed some light on what’s going on.
Im guessing you are running a 21 pitch prop? I had an 84 16 1/2’ baja speedster with a 150 black max and 2 props... 21 pitch would run 55mph by gps and then I had a 23 pitch that would make the boat hit 62mph, again all by gps, never trust the speedo.
I don't have a speedo, so everything is GPS lol. I think the prop has a scribbled 22p and "J2" or "Jr" and that's all that's on it. Not sure what brand it is....
I gotta say something really bad ass about Sarah and you, is that you guys video document all your trials and tribulations and post it! It's not a perfect fu*ing world, that's why I love you guys! This was me a few months back in my own driveway working on my new to me old Johnson! This channel is very relatable to me! And now it's in a shop getting fine tuned by an old OMC emplyee/instructor! Dude is bad ass knows his sh*t
Thanks man! I've had quite a few old boats and they always need time, setbacks, and experimentation to dial everything in. Can't wait to get this reliable and start tweaking it for speeeeeeeeeddddd
@@ADDvanced absolutely! If anyone is in a hurry to get an old boat running just right the 1st time out they should probably get a different hobby
Get rid of the oil injection. Run premixed gas. Oil injection can fail or you forget to fill oil tank and you will burn up the motor quick fast and in a jiffy. Just run premixed gas. Cheap insurance plan
Agreed, they tend to fail in those engines, i broke the oil pump sharft in one already. Cost me a power head
💯
Amen brother that would be the frist thing
Wrong
Truth
Rob, you need to have a functioning poppet for the cooling system to properly pressurize and hold the water in the block as long as it needs to cool. A leaking poppet valve is like driving around without a radiator cap. You’re bold for running the motor that hard without a functioning cooling system.
I will reiterate, you NEED a water PSI gauge. It tells the story you’re looking to hear.
Oh I have one.... I just don't think it works. Should it read ANY psi at idle? I guess chasing that down would help trouble shoot immensely....
It will be very low at idle and get even worse when the thermostats open. Manual calls for 12 psi minimum @5500rpm, but you should have more than 10 at all times while on the plane, and if I remember correctly 20 psi is a normal sort of figure that you should see most of the time
@@waynecammidge8851 Okay I will have to track down why that gauge is not working... .seems like the first step towards figuring this out.
12 psi at idle, 15psi on plane
@@ADDvanced should between 1.5-5 psi at idle and 15 psi at WOT.
I’d bet that jack plates set too high for the stock gear case without low water pickup
I agree, these motors went on all types of boats. The stock lower unit has the water pickups above the "bullet" portion of the lower unit, which is good for most pleasure boats as you won't suck up as much sand and muck. But in a performance boat, especially with a jack plate you probably need the lower unit that has the water pick up below the prop shaft line. Trimmed out and the jack plate up, you are probably pulling the water inlets out of the water at high speed, hence the immediate overheating. It's probably difficult to watch at high speed, but if you can mount a camera at the telltale water outlet you might be able to see if the stream stops at high speed.
@@mrpink6840 nope we have run stock cases up to 2 inches below the bottom for years never an issue i have gone 90 mph in 800' with stock merc gearcase .....the boat has been like that for years he bought it that way ...they have some other issue .
@@crashalexander7232 Had some pretty fast performance boats myself but the centerline of the prop shaft looks higher than 2 below the bottom of the boat… it’ll be interesting to see what the overheating problem turns out to be
It's set too low the gearcase center is like 4" below the bottom of the boat. I do think I need to plug the upper waterpickup holes, that will happen soon.
@@endurolife3485 Center of prop shaft is about 4" below bottom of hull.
Check the stator for extra timing spark plug ignition in the 6 cilindres.
You guys rock. I have raced boats for 11 years now both inboard and outboard boats mostly tunnels . Before you move jackplate around have your gf video the boat running at speed to see how much boat is in the water or how wet or dry it is those boats have a small pad at rear if I remember correctly and at speed it should ride on that pad. Trim out at speed until you get boat dry. To mush positive trim and boat will rpm and loose speed and or chine slightly . I started watching your vids for fiberglass help as I'm restoring a boat and never done glass work only motor work lol. I will definitely be hitting you guys up for some tips . Cheers from northern California 👍
Awesome idea! Thanks for the tip, I will definitely do that. I'm not sure this hull has a real pad, it's pretty basic. Might get weird at 60+, we will see eventually.
@@ADDvanced it will be fine. It will only get weird during loss of power ect as long as it's under power it will be fine I think you might have the drive up to high on Jack plate causing temp . Lower one inch and go run. Then take it out pick an rpm say 4000 and trim it out until you feel the boat slow down or rpm spike and loss of speed trim back down a touch and you should have a slight prop roost not much but should see a little one and most likely that will be max effort trim location . If you ever need help on motors and or setup let me know. I have a few pics and vids of a sleek craft I had with a jet ran 118mph with a 540 inch blown alky Chevrolet. . Fun boat and looks cool. Traded it for a 19ft cougar tunnel vdrive . Love boats and now want to learn the glass work as I have always paid an arm and a leg for new floors ect.
You need a water pressure gauge! It may be sucking in air, thread the top two intake holes and plug them with set screws OR get a Bob's machine nose cone for that lower unit.
You beat-me to it.
Or a dedicated low water intake, if you need even more heights than a nose cone.
you can plug top 4 holes in the 8 hole case
bobs cone not needed till 85 mph stock case is fine just needs dialed in.
That is the plan! Still want to figure out what's going on with that poppet tho. does not fit right at all.
You must connect one of the two hoses coming from the oil tank, the one marked in blue, to the small oil container passing through a T connection with an open end to let excessive pressure out. The other hose goes to the engine block where air is pumped towards the oil tank in order to pressure the tank. Both kids of the big oil tank must be tight enough for air pressure pushes oil towards the small oil container.
Open the small container lid and let the engine pump enough air pressure from the big oil tank until the small container is full and oil starts leaking oil out, then just tighten the lid so no more oil is spilling.
When oil is low you hear an intermittent beep, when overheating you hear a continuous beep.
Manual says that if oil mixing pump gets broken a continuous tone would come on also. Engine must be stopped whenever a continuous beep is heard. Check oil level when intermittent beep comes on.
I unscrewed the reservoir oin the engine and ran it and it stayed full but did not start overflowing...
@@ADDvanced It must overflow after engine pressures the external tank through the hose not marked in blue bringing air pressure from the right side of the engine looking forward. The hose marked wuth a blue stripe must go towards the tank, it passes through a T but you can connect it direct for testing.
Sounds Great!!! I had an oil problem with twin 150’s, screen covered with paraffin in onboard oil tank.
How did you clean it?
@@ADDvanced Mineral spirits and air pressure, let tube soak then blow it out with air
The Slinger ( Seal ) normally just gets pushed down over the drive shaft till it comes down to the water pump housing. It does not fit inside the housing. If you look closely at the old housing, you are going to find that what you thought was a seal, is most likely, nylon from the housing that has melted and been pushed up into that cavity
Oops. Should I pull it and move it back up top? There was no evidence of one being above the housing when I pulled it out.
@@ADDvanced YES!!! pull it back out, you will cook the pump housing, it just slides down the shaft and sits on top of the housing to stop water traveling up the shaft
@@ADDvanced yes the seal should be on top, old one was wrong or got mashed
Yes, needs to be changed
I know this is what mercury states, but gosh is it weird that there is that gap between the impeller housing and the metal cup. Its even weirder how the slinger seal fits so perfectly into that spot.
The beeping is likely from the main oil tank that float valve is notorious for flooding. My sensor is disconnected I just make sure the one on the engine is full and don't forget to top up the main tank from time to. Time
When I was reading the thread about the v6 history the hull truth they talked about that spot next to the popett valve and why it’s there. I think it was the original thermostat location? I can’t remember but it’s just part of the original casting and not used anymore.
Okay, thanks!
I know you posted this 1st video months ago, but from the warbling sound the starter was making while cranking the 1st time out, I believe there was a damaged cylinder or a blown head gasket. And another poster was correct about the rubber "Slinger" washer - it slides down the driveshaft to just above the water pump housing. It keeps water from the pump from spraying up the exhaust tuner.
In a later video I pull the heads but don't see any signs of anything, and threw in fresh HG's. Thanks for the tip on the slinger washer, I'll redo it before I take it out again. Also going to pull powerhead. Again. I'm determined.
@@ADDvanced
I saw that video after I commented here. A couple of things to consider; that "wash" place in the lower cylinder was likely water. If it didn't come from the gasket you may have a crack somewhere in between the top & bottoms of the cylinders. I had a 2.4 liter XR4 that I ran with the overheat alarm going and it scored a piston but couldn't be seen until it was removed. If you haven't yet, be sure and do a compression test
@@HankW257 I'll add it to the list!
@@ADDvanced As you know, you got a great deal! Of course with boats, there is always something else to do! Good luck, the old 2 liter Mercs are stout. It is great that your lady friend/wife enjoys getting involved!
Sweet boat for the money :D Compression test after overheating it, then if it passes oil injection delete and new poppet valve and assembly, likely have to hit up a used place like Tim's Outboard (they the best) with your ser# and part number you removed ready. Then for your pressure guage you simply T off the cooling line and run that to the guage making sure it's not blocked. Then you can play with a plate and props get her really rippin!
I agree with getting a low water pick up-nose cone, water intakes could be too high if you have the manual jack plate too high, try lowering the jack plate & see, otherwise there is a clog somewhere.
Idk it's hanging down pretty far right now, it's not remotely in the right spot for high speed runs. Going to try to film the gearcase during the next run
I had the exact same boat for 15 years down on the Colorado river with the 175 Evinrude it towed back more expensive boats to our dock everybody called at the McDonald’s boat because of the color I miss that boat
I’m lovin it
our 1988 70HP would emit a continuous tone when over heating, and a high pitched beeping when low on oil
I haven't had any issues with my oil injection on my 95 XR6. I wouldn't delete it, that's why it has oil injection, so you don't have to go through the bs of mixing oil and gas. I just check my tanks to make sure it has enough, I use my boat quite a bit and a gallon has lasted me all summer so far...
I think the catastrophic nature of what happens when the system fails is leading to all the comments saying delete it.
@@ADDvanced I agree in that respect but I think most people saying delete it have probably blown one up so they're gun shy... LOL! You don't have a body of water you can hold it wide open without getting a ticket so as long as it smokes, I think you're good...😆
@@bassassin2ohseven584 a steel drive gear running on a nylon gear usually doesn’t end up well… the oil injection will fail and you probably won’t catch it in time. If they ran the oil gear off the bottom of the crank it would be ok. Merc ran the oil gear off #2 cylinder on the 2.0,2.4 and 2.5. It gets to hot up there and will warp the nylon gear resulting in failure.
Delete oil injection, get water pressure gauge, if you have a laser thermometer shoot it at the thermostat covers and see what it reads at idle and after a hard run. This will tell you if your gauge is close to accurate.. you be fine with the stock lower at the speeds your gona run, just pay attention to pressure and if need be plug the top few inlet holes..
Texas sized 10-4, appreciate the tips!
@@ADDvanced psi at idle will be somewhere around 5 psi and 12-20 at wot depending on engine height.. if there is a major blockage in the cooling system it will read high.. temps will run around 130-140
I suggest get a low water pickup lower unit, also check the thermostats
I think I'm just going to plug a few of the upper holes, this gearcase is supposedly good to 75ish. Thermostats are ordered, hopefully they get here soon.
Another great video. The solid alarm sound is when its overheating. I expect the beeping is the oil injection (my black max is a 1978 built b4 that technology) but like others say, disconnect it and run premix to be certain you won’t seize it up.
I’d go with a low water pickup for your high speed runs with it trimmed up. Sounds like thermostats are working since the temp dropped so quick when you were running slow, but I’d test them anyway.
I chased a water pressure issue for over a month, ended up replacing every gasket between the power head and the bottom plate of the exhaust and the top seal between of the supply tube from the water pump.
I’m sure you’ll sort it out soon.
"top seal between supply tube from water pump", not sure which you are talking about? The waterpump plastic tube went up into the tube in the midsection, but there was no seal there. Should there be?
@@ADDvanced hey Rob, there is on mine. It’s the same as the one between the water pump housing and the tube. You probably have one and can’t see it because it’s right under the power head. I’ll try to find a way to get you a picture of my service manual….
I'm running a 96 Mariner 150 magnum efi which is basically the same powerhead as yours minus the efi. Had some overheat alarms as well, never messed with the poppet valves but found my outlet hoses from the thermostats were plugged. Seems that small bugs like to crawl up them and build nests. Wound up deleting the thermostats and now have great water flow. If you have an alarm controller on yours that could also be bad.
You have a 2.5L power head… they run hotter than the early 2.0l
As it is Summer there at present, try running the Boat without thermostats to see if that helps the issue
Didn't help
Continuous tone overheat, broken tone oil.
If you found sand in your poppet, it's possible that the adapter plate is plugged, and causing your overheat condition. Alot of times the only way to fix is to remove powerhead.
Also to much timing, or lack of oil can make heat.
Check your thermostats in hot water, they should open at 140f°. Your overheat alarm usually goes off at 180+. My engines usually drop in temp, from 140+ at idle to 100-120(depending on water temp) when put on plane, then slowly gain temp up to 140.
The only help I can give on poppet, is that my 2.5 litres don't have the extra parts that came with your kit.
I own a 18' laser ltv with a 150 Mariner Supermag, running 77mph with a 28p 4 blade prop, and Bob's lwp.
Thanks for the comment! I appreciate the other potential issues, and I have ordered new thermostats. Also going to film the gearcase at speed and see if it's sucking air.
YOU DID NOT GET THE COPPER WATER TUBE IN THE TOP OF THE WATER PUMP HOUSING WHEN YOU RE -INSTALLED THE LOWER UNIT? OR THE PLASTIC SLEEVE IS CRACKED ...? YOU GOT THE POPIT VALVE JAZZED UP ....OLD PC STUCK IN THERE ? THERMOSTATS THEY STICK OPEN AND CLOSED SOMETIMES .. PLUG TOP HOLES IN THE GEARCASE INLETS ....THE BOAT HAS BEEN RUNNING THAT WAY FOR A LONG TIME JUST NEEDS TO BE DONE RIGHT..
Plastic sleeve is new, and went into the midsection tube when reinstalling. The probelm with the poppet is the diaphram I ordered is too thick. Nothing was still in there, I used some hooks to pull out that plastic O ring seat. Will definitely plug the upper holes....
Need to find out what the best prop to pad height is and adjust the jackplate. You're not getting enough water at speed for some reason. Could also cure your porpoising problem. That boat with a 3 blade prop should get well into the 60's if not close to 70 plus.
looks like you have a 4 blade prop which is good for launching out of the hole but not top end . If you want more speed go to a 3 blade prop and up the pitch a little ( maybe by 2 ) . solid beep is overheating . change your thermostats and make sure your hoses are clear and flowing
I'll start playing with props once I get all the bugs worked out. What hoses do you want me to check?
It depends on what four blade prop it is, some are as fast or faster than 3 blades on some boats similar to this, for example the Trophy plus. Blades alone isnt the whole story. But generally, 3 blades are most often faster, but we dont know what prop he has got, do we? Maybe I missed it.
All the hoses dealing with the cooling system. You said there was sand in the pop it valve which most likely the previous owner ran the motor a ground and sucked up sand into the cooling system . You can always check the thermostats by boiling them in hot water to see if they open at the correct temperature
Cool content! Keep it coming please. You guys will figure it out.
Thanks for the support!
you might try pulling off your lower unit and putting your impeller in the water pump housing before you put it on the shaft that way you can make sure all of the fins are going the proper direction
They're all going the right way, I used my thumb to push them in one at a time while spinnign the driveshaft.
@addvance was going to mention, your video on how to change water pump,,, what I didn't see mentioned was when turning shaft to slide housing down,,, direction of rotation is important,,, but that's for viewers, not yourself,,,, also when you found sand,,,, I'd pull the thermostat and check in the housing for sand there too, maybe your water jackets are clogged
Not to solve the overheating and to be used constantly, but take off the thermostat and try then. And now it's a 500 dollars plus how ever much the ticket was boat. On my old daycruiser my motor sits so that the propshaft is maybe 3cm (little over an inch) below the bottoms lovest point. Normal steel prop, ballistic not a cleaver. And thanks for the vids, allways a pleasure.
Yeah mine is 3-4" below. Too low. Good idea with thermostat, I think I'd need to run restrictors tho.
Did you change the thermostats?
That's a nice little boat that should easily run 65 when set up properly. My 18' Nitro bassboat with 150 runs 58 carrying three batteries,trolling motor and 1/2 ton of fishing gear.
Yup it will go way faster. Just needs to get air under it and fly it like an airplane wing. Nitros are fast boats. Run on top of the water. Not in it.
can't wait
Maybe a gopro on the back of the boat from the side pointed at the water discharge? Then you can see if it's still putting out water at high rpm.
Yes for the tell tale and the drive height.
Great idea
Too bad about the issues, but you will get there, I am sure. 56 mph isnt bad for the setup as it looks to be at the moment, and for 500 bux you got reason to be overjoyed. Oh, and the boat looks really nice after the polishing.
Yeah, I am still geeked on this thing! I joined a CeeBee group on FB and a guy has a similar boat with an identical XR2 dialed in, and he's hitting 72mph which is LEGIT imho.
@@ADDvanced It certainly is. As I am sure you know, motor setup (height and prop etc) and weight balance is everything on reasonably light weight boats as this. When it "clicks" into place... they are quite fast.
Be careful about handling issues such as chine walk, blow outs and "prop ride" though. If you get upwards of 70 mph and above, a real racing spec life jacket is a wise investment, water gets hard at that speed..
As I wrote in an older comment, get a separate water intake and plumb it into the motor, so you can lift it as high as the prop gives grip. Its quite cheap. DIY just a few bucks. Rule of thumb for boats of this size doing 70-80 mph is you get almost 2 mph extra top for every inch you can lift the motor out of the water. Yes, really. It makes that big of a difference.
Good luck.
Did the water ever start squirting out of the side of the engine? I was told that was the most important thing, no water "pissing out" turn it off.
I dosent come out till the thermostat opens
On my 1976 Merc. 150 water came out immediately.
Yes, I covered that in the first video on this boat (Merc Monday EP2), check it out if you haven't seen it.
I thought poppet opens up when at high speed to bypass t stats. That's how Evinrude ob motors work. It's in conjunction with the stats. I'd change the stats and see if the overheating stops.
Good luck, that is one nice vintage boat and motor, it sounds and looks amazing
Thanks! I have ordered some thermostats and we'll see what happens. I have a feeling it's something else tho.
Hea Rob you need to ether remover the thermostats or replace them!!!
Did I her you right you where turning 5800 rpm if that’s the case you need more prop to get to 60 mph. You most likely have the right pop off parts the new rubber just has not been compressed try putting a light coating of grease on it before assembly.
Like one of the other guys said you need to video the lower unit at speed to see if the motor is to high for the stock pickup and a pressure gauge is a great tool😊
Nah, it seems like it's a different part. I've found photos of older poppet kits and they look thinner, so I just need to find one to order. And yeah, I saw 5800rpm (briefly)... definitely going to video the gearcase on my next run, hoping to change the thermostats or remove and run restrictors (quarter with a hole in it?), but the big thing is I want to get my water PRESSURE gauge working before I go out again.
Just curious where the heck did you find a deal like that. I have been looking for over a year now on craigslist and market place and still cant find a deal like that, Please share. Thanks
Watch episode 2 it goes over the boat and the deal in more detail
@@ADDvanced got it thanks
A few things I noticed. The gasket on the lower unit water pump with the slot missing is causing air issue so it is good you changed it out. The poppet valve is different on different models so they make a one kit for all thing which looks like missing stuff when it is not.
ONBOARD OIL TANK.. has to be completely full and your was not. To check the system just unscrew and run the engine. The large oil tank on the boat should fill that small tank pretty fast. When it is full and I mean full, screw the cap on snugly. That tank should never lose being completely full. IF it drops down you have a issue someplace from the boat tank to the small tank hoses. The normal oil issue is a four beep series every two min. The alarm you had was all about heat or should say overheating. The sensors sometimes have faulty wiring that grounds out the system and you get false alarms however, you had a heat issue. The fact that you didn't burn it up is amazing. I have one right now in my shop that had a overheat problem that melted 3 pistons in a short run of about a tenth of a mile. He shut down and the engine was boiling water for about fifteen min. IT never ran again and all the wiring was melted as was the recirc hoses. SO if you get that alarm, slow down and do not do that again... great engines, best of luck.
I'm pretty sure there's some chunks of impeller somewhere in this engine restricting flow. I'll find it eventually.
Hey after you change the thermostats and figure out your popet valve issue, if it still over heats you need to take off the heads and check for excess sand or calcium build up. If you are going to keep going for top speed, man i wish you would ditch the oil injection and go premix. You may want to check the plugs and see if any of them look lean. Since you dont have a test wheel. You can do it on the water. You drive the boat until the max RPM and pull the kill switch. It can be a little scetchy if your not paying attention. Go straight and make sure your not about to cross wakes.
Love the videos
Good idea on checking the plugs, I use that same technique on my old snowmobiles (scope the phazer long track build!). Oil injection will go away eventually, but I want to stop it from overheating before i start messing with other variables.
Can't disrespect the water cops too much. Junior called me today because he was in the middle of the lake and the Sea Ray wouldn't go forward or reverse. I couldn't help so he called the Oakland County police who patrol his lake on busy weekends and holidays. They towed him in no charge and just a little chastising. Turns out he whacked the prop and conveniently didn't include that detail in our conversation . Fortunately, the hub spun saving the outdrive.
A year ago this weekend, we took the Sea Ray out for its maiden voyage after the rebuild. The engine stalled and wouldn't restart due to an electrical issue. Guess who towed us in then too. 😉
Keep posting! As others have said, I like your posts because you aren't afraid to show your fails as well as successes.
Tax Collectors w Badges. They enforce the rules/laws set by the bourgeoisie to oppress and control the proletariat. Keep your laws off my hull! Cheers!
You will be ready for the LOTO Shootout 2023! Keep the motorboatin' coming!!
wub wub wub wub wub wub
Your engine still has the idle stabilizer system. Most people delete it.
It affects the timing at idle.
ye oil injection and that..causes problems it seams. Thats why my 1978 1750 black max never failed i gues exept for a few ignition coils and the ignition trigger under the wlywheel one time.
What happened to the SST build? Love that boat!
At this point I'm guessing I'll just leave it wrapped up til next year. Going out west in less than a month, and when I get back it will be autumn. Winter is coming.
Haven't finished the series yet but I'm thinking there's a headgasket issue blowing combustion pressure into the water jacket
Could you not reproduce the alarm chime while hooked up in the driveway to a hose and run the motor?
Maybe if I get a huge trash can or something.... I think I need to do that....
@@ADDvanced Yeah thats how we used to do it. Run it in a 55 gallon trash can full of water exactly!
The fins on the impeller have to be all curved the same way, if they are not it affects the water flow. Check that..2nd check thermostat. Regards to oil, check lines to the motor they get old and deteriorate inside, so might have crap in pump.
They are, I rotated the fins and pushed htem in the correct direction by spinning the driveshaft while lowering the housing. New thermostats have been ordered.... which lines are you thinking I should check, the big one on the bottom of the engine mounted reservoir?
@@ADDvanced the lines from tank to motor, if they are really soft. This is a tough deal, I worked at a mercury racing dealer for quite a few years..I hate chasing. You don't want to just start throwing parts at it.. sometimes the lines from the heads can get sand in them too. Can always try running it without thermostat on muffs see how strong the telltale stream is..
Only poppet diaphragm I see listed for the XR2 is 64877 (orig) or 648771 (alternate newer #). Overheat alarm is constant beep (i.e. beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep); oil problem is intermediate beep (i.e. beep, beep, beep...). If your temp gauge is indicating overheat and your alarm is triggering a constant beeeeeeeeep, then highly likely you are overheating. Thermostats, impeller/water pump, poppet, water pickup can all affect that. you replaced the impeller so probably that is good.
Correct! 64877!!
I’m chasing an overheating issue on the same engine. The only thing I haven’t done is pull the powerhead and check the gasket at the midsection. I did find that I had bad reeds and replaced those and not tested again, but I doubt that will fix it. I’ve been trying to find the source of the issue for 3 years now.
Salt crystals cause of not running the engine in saltfree water before storege can be the issue.
This is a midwest boat not saltwater
I’d sent the gear case to Bibs n have a low water pick up installed like i did on my 2.5 280 puts more water through the motor better cooling and u can run the motor higher n get more speed without suffering heat damage from lack of water plus if ur impeller fails if I r moving forward water gets forced through the motor n it still won’t run hot
Hi just pick up a matching pair 1979 boat motor and trailer boat a checkmate predictor with a 115 tower of power 2 stroke does 44mph with a 19 pitch prop.
Decent but I bet it can hit 50....
Years ago my buddy had a very similar boat as that, same colors but a Pioneer with a 200hp. we called it the cheese log. 😂
Dangerously cheesy
Also water pressure is the most important Guage on an outboard.
It would be nice if mine worked....
@@ADDvanced lol get it workin 💪 🤣. Honestly it's like one of the only guages u need. . I would definitely say it's the most important
Oh far out Merc Mondays are the cats meow! Since I'm currently a 120 Johnson Looper owner, how is the availability on older Merc parts? I know companies still remanufacture powerheads for my Johnson I wonder if they do for older Mercs?
I dont have any idea whatsoever, but surely its better? Considering the overwhelming popularity of these engines as a race motor. But, as I said, no idea really, but that would seem to be what logic would dictate?
I think it's fine so far. There are even companies making completely bespoke billet blocks for the high perf guys.
Did you trim up the motor for the speed run?
Yup. Reason I am not getting a huge rooster tail is the motor is hanging too low.
@@ADDvanced That makes sense Good luck with it.
Oil injection system?
Tank still full?
Is it injecting correctly or at all?
You may answer your own question
Yes, yes, I think so it's smokey when it starts up.
@@ADDvanced maybe it’s inop off idle??
Quick test could be to empty that tank of oil and run some pre mixed gasoline and see if the problem persists exactly as was before.
You need to READ the water pressure at WOT
Gauge no workie. Good idea tho. Should probably fix that.
GOOD Job..... I'm really enjoying your videos !
Thanks! Cheers man!
I think the oil float sensors go bad on these things, perhaps test the circuit, can’t tell by looking at them, stuck thermostats, pull them out and clean them gently perhaps with a chemical depending on the contamination, ditch the 4 blade prop for better rpm’s too
Great ideas, thank you!
I had same going on I had a piece of rubber stuck in thermostat
Bobs nose cone/ low water pickup?
Also 'Link and sync' on mercs is a must. Get rid of oil injection too, never trust older systems as they can easily blow a motor🤑 50:1 premix with good oil never fails🙂
Based on all I have seen you change on the motor I would predict that your temp issue is related to the oil. Because motor is old and had been sitting you can get some oil/sludge/tar like restrictions formed in the system. Low oil flow will lead to higher temps. This is proven as you slow down the temp drops so water pump is working. I would run with premixed fuel to see if you get a temp alarm. If you don’t them issue is oil pump related, if you do them keep investigating.
Does it have a water pressure gauge? That could be the issue
Yes it does! Does not work. :|
I’m no professional but I’m going to guess that’s your problem. Loss of water pressure on those high speed runs
Greetings from land of Mercury Marine (older the better) I'm weird. I index everything in reverse. I like having the gearbox locked in place.
Wouldn't it be the same thing?
@@ADDvanced prop shaft will still spin (click, click, click) in forward. Through me for a loop because I've done Mercruiser for 10 years. Those you HAVE to put in forward. I tilt the engine in neutral. Put it in reverse. Do my stuff. Take the plugs out and spin engine by hand to get powerhead splines to line up. Button up. Back into neutral. Drop it to vertical. Helps to use ratchet strap to hold lower in place while bolts go back in.
Cracks me up "2-stroke profiling"
One last thing on heat issue. The engine I have here overheated because the old owner failed to pay attention. It was not anything on the engine. He put it on a jack plate because well, everyone else has one lol. Then proceeded to mount the thing with the engine way to high like 5 inches too high so when running at speed the water pickup holes in the lower unit were out of the water hence burned up the engine quickly. When I mounted the new engine he bought from me (xr4) mid 90's. I lowered it to normal and no more issues. SO... that too can be your issue guys if everything else checks out. Again heat is constant beep, oil is four beeps every two min.
I got back there and the whole lower unit is buried, all the holes are under water. It's actually mounted real deep.
You need to get low water pickups. That's why ur overheating. The stock pickups on the lower unit are not suckin up enough water when ur up on plane. When ur going slow not on plane, the stock pickups are fully submerged. They have lower water pickups that u Weld on the lower unit nose Cone. It has 2 hoses that run to factory water pickup location and 2 new plate that replaces ur factory multi hole water pick up plates. Then you can run a chopper surface running prop. That's how you will see faster top speed runs. The 4 blade you got now is for fast acceleration (holeshot) drop to a 3 blade you will pick up more top speed
negative he aint anywhere near high enough to worry about that there is another issue in the cooling system somewhere t-stats most likely or the water pump install was bad.
you can run that motor up to 2 inches below the bottom no issues i have done it for years.
Just a note: There are four blades that are just as fast as 3 blades on boats like this, one example being the Trophy plus.
@@GoldenCroc TROPHY RUNS GOOD BUT THERE ARE MANY 3 BLADES THAT RUN WAY BETTER... RULE IS 4 BLADES ADD DRAG VS 3 OR EVEN 2 BLADES....SO ON SOME SETUPS THE TROPHY WILL RUN BETTER BUT GENERALLY SPEAKING MOST OF THE TIME A 3 BLADE WILL MPH THE 4 BLADE ALL ELSE THE SAME.
@@crashalexander7232 Drag is a factor, yes, but there is also grip and many other factors to consider. But yes I mostly agree, on average a 3 blade prop will be faster than a 4, but I just mentioned since he worded it like all three blades are faster in all setups than a 4 blade ones, which isnt always true.
This could well be one of those boats that run better with a specialized four blade. V hull optimization on the limit is still somewhat of an black art. Also as I am sure you are aware, the real fast big boys (200mph +) run FIVE or sometimes even more blade props. Only testing, and a lot of it, will tell which is best for this boat. Cheers.
@@GoldenCroc 200 MPH OFF SHORE RUN 5 -6 BLADE CNC PROPS YES ....THOSE PROPS SURFACE SO ONLY 3 BLADES IN THE WATER AT A TIME....LOL
Check the stator!
when you display speed in mph, is that in land miles or knots?
Mph.
Check to see if thermostat is open all the way
Will pull and check them tonight, thanks for the tip!
Should have a tstat on each bank, as for oil injection to many horror stories to take a chance
Understood, just want it to stop overheating first.
It could be water pickup at high speed. My bravo does that, 454 in a carrera viper, wot trimed up shoots a rooster but temp climbs fast. I have heard stories of low water pickups . I fix mine by not shooting a rooster lol
No “squirting” happens when you move the throttle with the engine off. There is no accelerator pump, you are just moving the throttle plates
...uh... yeah.. I knew that, I was just checking to see if anyone else knew that. It was a test. lol. Thanks for the info.
You should cut the tabs on the thermostats or get rid of them I would start off by cutting the tabs to increase the flow of water if that doesn't work you might have to pull the thermostats out those markers run a little hot You gotta try to give them as much waters you can. Also I normally block out and get rid of the pop it valve That's just additional stuff that gets clogged in the system. Also I would look into Hydraulic trim tabs That would give you a lot more control of your boat with the purposing
I'm getting no water out of the exhaust. New water pump, poppet assembly/diaphram, thermostats, pulled the heads, exhaust plate, no visible blockages.
@@ADDvanced I had a similar issue with mine it's probably the grommet for the water pickup tube.
@@ADDvanced you might have to pull that power head off and replace the grommet also try to pull the pickup tube out it might be pushed all the way up
@@thewrenchgarage7986 the metal pickup tube in the mid section? Like pull that down more? The plastic pickup tube? I think you're right, really trying to not pull the powerhead if I can help it.
@@ADDvanced I believe it's a copper. If you pull it it will come off I would pull it out grease it and make sure you don't push it all the way up just enough for the midsection too line up. It's only inserted into a rubber grommet.
Think I am in love with Sarah. Lol!
I’d get rid of the oil injection or unplug it. Also be mindful that the cap on the motor tank can and will developer a hair line crack and can n does cause a alarm n won’t let the motor get proper oil
Do you happen to have a RPM gauge? This will help ppl help you to figure if you are topped in speed and if your actual prop is correctly matched to your motor.
To your information rpm at max speed should be arround 5500 rpm for a lot of motors, don't know about yours but if you run higher RPM you can overheat as well.
This overheats as soon as it's on plane.
You should manually measure the oil and fuel you have used. Just re fill the tanks and take note of how much you have used. Could be running lean or not enough oil
Add water psi gauge, delete oil injection and check prop to pad height
fixed gauge, still over heating, no water coming out the exhaust... wtf.... it's like it's 100% blocked. I don't get it.
Get rid of the oil injection. Go premixed. Get an aluminum 3 blade 21p or 23p and see which one gives you a better top speed if that is what you want. I have a merc 5.0 in a 20ft maxum and I have 15p for pulling tubes also have a 17p id rather get on plane faster than top speed. I still hit low 40s with the 15p
Check dangar marine for tip on using ratchet strap for install (or removal)…very easy 1 person operation
"Danger?" ...or Dangar?
@@choimdachoim9491 (autocorrect)…dangar
Trim that motor up a tad bit more when running you should gain a little more speed
Looks like it was chine walking a lot, triming up will make it worse. I think with one person the weight distribution is off. In the last video when Sarah was in the boat it was much more stable. My LaveyCraft does the same thing when above 60 and trimmed out, it's not as drastic as this boat but you can tell it's chine walking.
It was trimmed out.... I think I need to raise the OB because the gearcase still hangs too low.
And the prop is? Trim out...and pitch-up. Your light and if your running a Trophy, a 25p is worth a try.
Don't worry, you are not alone, my First-Mate is also my cruise control...
No markings on the prop unfortunately...
The housing for the poppet valve is broken like you said. It bypasses water over 2k rpm for extra cooling. It should be a direct path from the port with the spring and diaphragm to the empty port an inch or so towards the back of the engine. It'll stay cool under 2k as the engine relies only on the thermostats which is what you were seeing
That’s a blind hole, it’s not a 2.5.
No, it looks cut. Factory paint is on the edge. None of the XR2s have that second part.
@@ADDvanced Got it. Weird how they had that provision for that long but was a blind hole. Just rebuilt a 1990 2.0 and they use that entire bracket to dump the water to the exhaust.
@@dbsranchr Wasn't just the 2.5's. Early 90's 2.0's used that passage. Didn't realize they made that change until later on though
Awesome video! Did you ever get the correct poppet valve part? Or was what you used okay and you've been rolling with it? I need to rebuild my poppet. Thanks for any info
Solid tone overheat. Broken tone is oiling.
If its not oiling enough it Will overheat.
I've built more engines from oiling issues...loose the oiling system
Also correct factory procedure to bleed air from oiling system is while engine is running at an idle on water hose...remove the cap on engine oil tank till it fills from the oil tank in boat. Pressure from engine will force oil to engine tank. It takes few minutes but you will see the oil level rises. Put cap back on. If it doesnt rise the one way pressure valve on air hose is bad on engine or the tank in boat has air leak and not building pressure. The oil pump on side of engine is only a metering pump that injects correct amount of oil based on RPM into the fuel stream. Its not true oil injection. Just automatic oiler. Its junk removal will save you a meltdown...certified professional advice from mercury mechanic
@@jamiehankins3204 Regarding weather he is overheating or not, just looking at his tell tail, I had a 225 BM and it would piss way harder than what I'm seeing. If his temp gauge is pegging why is there no steady temp alarm? Wonder what the alarm setpoint is. 190 maybe?
@@pgnandt I heard the steady tone one time.....
@@ADDvanced Cool. Good to know it's working then. When your temp gauge goes hot. I wonder what the actual temp is and if it's a concern.
The entire lake is a no wake zone?
Yup. At 6pm. On sundays. It was 6:09 when they pulled me over. I hate cops.
That rubber doesn't go there it goes over the shaft on top of the housing take it off and put it right and that blown gasket is a problem
You guys need to get a service manual so you can make sure its going together rite.
I have one but it's not specific to the XR2, so I've been using google fu.
Send it! Fuckin’ SEND IT!
There is mud built up in the small passage’s that comes back to the water jacket in fact open up the water jacket and look for mud forget the gasket it’s not a problem tighten up a little more some where in the cooling system there is blockage I’ve seen where a mud wasp 🐝 started to build a nest in the per tube lol 😂 what😲I hope you understand what I’m trying to say else can I help you with also find your temperature sender and Change it you can not unplug a sending sensors and get a response from the motor you don’t know if the sensor ground it self and that is what kick off your temp sensor if you haven’t had the thermostat out please do that first get a new thermostat and gasket just in case good luck
I am getting NO WATER out the exhaust at all, which is causing the overheating. I've changed waterpump, housing, poppets, thermostats, and pulled the heads and exhaust plate. Still no water coming out the exhaust.... ?!?!
I like the instructional and how to.
Happy to help!
bad thermostat, usually a brown wire will lead you to the thermostat housing
They're new
Timing? Mabye
POSSIBLE SIDE ISSUE
“Snapped off” looking poppet cover is stock. No worries there.
Ok, have any idea of the diaphram being way too thick? It doesn't seem like the right part at all...
@@ADDvanced let me go through your video again to make sure you have all of the required pieces.
@@ADDvanced yeah, that poppet diaphragm does look thick. Let me do some poppet kit part number research.
@@ADDvanced I dug through my parts bin and found an old poppet valve that is still assembled. I’d be more than happy to put together a little video and hopefully shed some light on what’s going on.
Imagining that thing with a Mercury Marine 150L ProXS FourStroke! Hauln Arse! If only it werent $13k
Lol and the weight difference!
Ewww
@@lafountainmountain3244 Not a two stroke.
@@hankschrader149 Heavier, faster more efficient.
@@steveo7767 SLOWER
Continuous means solid sound
Undercowl says "continuous beeping" which is confusing AF. Beeping by definition means not continuous... so.... ??? lol
By the way, your in the same boat (ar, ar,) as me ( Low water pick-up).
NOPE NOT NEEDED
Im guessing you are running a 21 pitch prop? I had an 84 16 1/2’ baja speedster with a 150 black max and 2 props... 21 pitch would run 55mph by gps and then I had a 23 pitch that would make the boat hit 62mph, again all by gps, never trust the speedo.
I don't have a speedo, so everything is GPS lol. I think the prop has a scribbled 22p and "J2" or "Jr" and that's all that's on it. Not sure what brand it is....
Get a mercury manual . $10 for a pdf manual you can print and put on your phone to search digitally.
Have one. 🤙
You buy parts based on serial number of engine
Got a150 champion 94
One piece alert 24:16 WOWZA! ;-)