I've come to see "the rod" very differently than most. A shepherd's rod is used, not to smack the sheep into staying obedient, but to guide them in the right direction. So in my understanding as a father of 3, and having used corporal punishment traditionally and observed the results and having changed to a physically gentler but no-less stern guidance approach. The difference is night and day and doesn't have to devolve into fear and resentment and defiance.
As a farmer that bit about the rod is not correct. Whether you have hogs, sheep, chickens, or cattle a "rod" (whether that be a literal rod, a stick, your hand, etc) is used to direct the livestock into the correct direction by sometimes tapping, pointing, hitting, whichever. You never use a rod to beat an animal barring emergency circumstances, but you certainly do tap or hit the animal on the side that you DON'T want it to go to. In a modern example, you can train a herd of stock to electric fence, which is like an "electric rod". After the first initial electric jolts the herd learns not to touch the electric fence. You can even turn the fence off for a few hours and the herd (of cattle at least) still won't go beyond it. Parenting is the same.
Having a farming background myself the rod is absolutely about both protecting the animals from themselves, each other, and external threats. Force is required in all circumstances, adjusted to appropriate levels. The Bible normally pairs the rod and staff with the intent of one for in group guidance and correction and the other to ward off out group intrusion or mischief.
Similar to that epiphany about "Don't let the sun go down on your anger." That verse does NOT mean that you must resolve the argument before you go to sleep. It simply means to shelve the conflict and end the day in peace and affection. As one pastor lamented, how many countless marriages have been horribly damaged because a husband and wife thought they needed to stay up all night hashing out a major disagreement, only to wound each other more deeply and needlessly in their exhaustion and frustration?
If we only interpret the word 'discipline" as meaning physical punishment, no wonder this is an issue for believers. If it is understood as guidance and corrective nudging to the right path, I'm sure this would be less of an issue and we would have more well-adjusted children. The Word is never wrong, but our limited understanding is always the issue.
We interpret in Context. Have You looked up that word in Hebrew (and then "Koiné" Greek)‽ Remember when he says, "they will not die".. the Rod in the Context of Discipline there -is a physical rod, actually what GOD Says.. Obviously, there would be zero reason to say that words of guidance and correction will not kill Them! Happy to expound on this more. So, it's Not limited to that, but absolutely includes physical striking. What's GOD Say in the Holy Text
A lot of this can also apply to your spouse. The boxing match thing -- it would be nice to solve it now, or to not relent until it's solved, but being able to take your corners and try again in a bit is helpful.
One of the best things that the Bible does is give us principles rather than specifics at times. Anytime it does not get specifics it usually means that there is a large amount of variance in consideration and discernment needed. If it were to be exhausted it would take so many pages and costs so much confusion with thousands of examples. This is where it wants you to have general wisdom and to seek wise leaders and elders. This is good.
There is no sin without understanding. Did you really just refer to a two year old as 'very fallen'? Compared to what? To who? Jesus and Paul made it very clear that unless one understands what sin is and why they are being sinful, then they cannot INTEND to sin. 'Before you dod not know, so there was no sin with you, but now tou know, so your sin remains.' Little children are barely capble of sin, if at all. Amd you're here saying that a two year old is 'very fallen'. Duuuude. What are you on about?
Calvin said he wasn’t accepting invitations from non Catholic/apostolic churches anymore. When I barely challenged him on it he blocked me. 😂 I fostered a child older than him so I get it. He’s young- but did he change his mind about working with prots or is this an old ad and his info not taken down?
This 'Human Psychology' is something We don't need from the world. It's actually plainly Written rght n tht Hly Txt. With the Fruits of The SPIRIT in Us, "Fathers, [Parents] do not provoke Your Children..
European children shouldnt need a lot of physical discipline we're more of a reasoning people, certain nons lean on it way more because their culture and nature makes it more necessary for them and they know it. Even so a functioning european household doesnt need a lot of physical discipline to function, rare and for severe situations works better for most of our children. Different people are different, big news there
I'm loving these shorter, practical wisdom filled clips. Keep em coming!
I've come to see "the rod" very differently than most. A shepherd's rod is used, not to smack the sheep into staying obedient, but to guide them in the right direction.
So in my understanding as a father of 3, and having used corporal punishment traditionally and observed the results and having changed to a physically gentler but no-less stern guidance approach. The difference is night and day and doesn't have to devolve into fear and resentment and defiance.
As a farmer that bit about the rod is not correct.
Whether you have hogs, sheep, chickens, or cattle a "rod" (whether that be a literal rod, a stick, your hand, etc) is used to direct the livestock into the correct direction by sometimes tapping, pointing, hitting, whichever.
You never use a rod to beat an animal barring emergency circumstances, but you certainly do tap or hit the animal on the side that you DON'T want it to go to.
In a modern example, you can train a herd of stock to electric fence, which is like an "electric rod". After the first initial electric jolts the herd learns not to touch the electric fence. You can even turn the fence off for a few hours and the herd (of cattle at least) still won't go beyond it. Parenting is the same.
@the32712 thanks. Yes. My point was just as you say yourself. "You never use the rod to beat the animal...", exceptions aside.
Having a farming background myself the rod is absolutely about both protecting the animals from themselves, each other, and external threats. Force is required in all circumstances, adjusted to appropriate levels. The Bible normally pairs the rod and staff with the intent of one for in group guidance and correction and the other to ward off out group intrusion or mischief.
It’s both
"Your rod and your staff...." Your comment isn't true. A rod is used to whack and hit.....can't deny that....
Incredibly grateful for these wise & practical men of our Lord!!!
Similar to that epiphany about "Don't let the sun go down on your anger." That verse does NOT mean that you must resolve the argument before you go to sleep. It simply means to shelve the conflict and end the day in peace and affection. As one pastor lamented, how many countless marriages have been horribly damaged because a husband and wife thought they needed to stay up all night hashing out a major disagreement, only to wound each other more deeply and needlessly in their exhaustion and frustration?
thank you brothers for this clip, extremely helpful and relevant me and my wife
Oh my goodness God bless you guys! I needed this for my son!! But please pray for me as my husband is unsaved so there is that added level for me.
Thank you so much for this wonderful godly wisdom!!!
If we only interpret the word 'discipline" as meaning physical punishment, no wonder this is an issue for believers. If it is understood as guidance and corrective nudging to the right path, I'm sure this would be less of an issue and we would have more well-adjusted children.
The Word is never wrong, but our limited understanding is always the issue.
We interpret in Context. Have You looked up that word in Hebrew (and then "Koiné" Greek)‽ Remember when he says, "they will not die".. the Rod in the Context of Discipline there -is a physical rod, actually what GOD Says.. Obviously, there would be zero reason to say that words of guidance and correction will not kill Them! Happy to expound on this more. So, it's Not limited to that, but absolutely includes physical striking. What's GOD Say in the Holy Text
A lot of this can also apply to your spouse. The boxing match thing -- it would be nice to solve it now, or to not relent until it's solved, but being able to take your corners and try again in a bit is helpful.
One of the best things that the Bible does is give us principles rather than specifics at times. Anytime it does not get specifics it usually means that there is a large amount of variance in consideration and discernment needed. If it were to be exhausted it would take so many pages and costs so much confusion with thousands of examples. This is where it wants you to have general wisdom and to seek wise leaders and elders. This is good.
This is very helpful
This is helpful. Is this from a larger podcast video on parenting? Thank you all.
Thank you for sharing this conversation!
Guy on the left actually said "Terturitan" 20 seconds in instead of Tertullian lmao
There is no sin without understanding.
Did you really just refer to a two year old as 'very fallen'?
Compared to what?
To who?
Jesus and Paul made it very clear that unless one understands what sin is and why they are being sinful, then they cannot INTEND to sin.
'Before you dod not know, so there was no sin with you, but now tou know, so your sin remains.'
Little children are barely capble of sin, if at all.
Amd you're here saying that a two year old is 'very fallen'.
Duuuude.
What are you on about?
Amen
Calvin said he wasn’t accepting invitations from non Catholic/apostolic churches anymore. When I barely challenged him on it he blocked me. 😂 I fostered a child older than him so I get it. He’s young- but did he change his mind about working with prots or is this an old ad and his info not taken down?
Nikki, do better.
This 'Human Psychology' is something We don't need from the world. It's actually plainly Written rght n tht Hly Txt. With the Fruits of The SPIRIT in Us, "Fathers, [Parents] do not provoke Your Children..
European children shouldnt need a lot of physical discipline we're more of a reasoning people, certain nons lean on it way more because their culture and nature makes it more necessary for them and they know it. Even so a functioning european household doesnt need a lot of physical discipline to function, rare and for severe situations works better for most of our children. Different people are different, big news there
What are you talking about? lol! I live in the UK… these European kids need discipline mate 😅😅😅