It's been a long time since I read all the way through books 1 and 2. They improve as they go and I like the expanded POVs in the later ones, but I do think Leviathan Wakes is a great introduction to the series. Looking forward to talking about books seven and eight. Let me know what you think.
So you're saying the first book is a great introduction to the series? What a bold statement lol. JK keep up the great work. I caught up a month ago and thought Tiamat's Wrath was the best book in the series. So far...
I read the books first, and I really didn’t like season 1 when I first saw it, so I think if you’re going to do both, watching the show first is the better way in. I’ve now both re-watched the series and re-read the books, and come to really appreciate the show, as well as the books. The one thing I can’t forgive season 1 for is what you point out about the change of it being Naomi, rather than Holden, who gives the protomolecule to Fred Johnson, and the unnecessary conflict that stirs up among the crew. In all, I think season 1 of the show really diminishes Naomi, as compared to the books, and I do not like that. Luckily, season 5 gives it all back to her. The show definitely improves season by season, as do the books. Book 8 is my favorite so far, and I’m really hoping that book 9 will become my favorite once it’s out.
@@archmaesterrenny9569 with the Knight and the crew conflict you can see that they wanted a situation to show how difficult space can be and develop the characters without the aid of having Holden’s thoughts about them. It makes sense for TV if it doesn't quite work. The Naomi choices turned a lot of viewers against her which is a shame because they balance each other so well in the books.
So glad you are finally reviewing the books with the show. I watched Season 1 and then I read the books in between Seasons 1 and 2. I have not read the novellas just because at the time they were only available on Kindle or as a download. I’m looking forward to your take on the changes with Naomi and her ex’s story in the last season. The books gave a lot more details about the reason for her shame and regrets and also you miss how manipulative Marco truly is and how he makes his son responsible for mass destruction and thereby repeating history. I should go back and reread them but they were a bit of a slog at times. They were definitely a way to get through a really snowy winter in Wisconsin!
For me the biggest miss in the show is Bobby. In the book she is pure confidence. In the show they make her seem like a fish out of water. Up until season 5 anyway. And to throw a bit of sexism into it. lol . If her character was male they would have required the actor to bulk up to meet the role. For anybody that didn't read the books. She is 6 and a half feet tall, 240 pounds of solid muscle.
The Audibles narrated by Jefferson Mays are the most amazing thing I've ever listened to. You can close your eyes and see the characters. It was the most rich experience I've had with audible books.
I bought the book in 2011, the cover artwork was incredible and it visually flew off the shelf into my hands. I didn't realize it was going to be a series, since the Miller story ended. Enough time had past and there were significant differences that I did not even know that The Expanse Season 1 was Leviathan Wakes (Who the heck is Avasarala? Naomi hides behind her hair.). I got into it once it was picked up by Amazon. Then, all the pieces fell into place. I watched the entire series and read all the books - no spoilers. Not on audio though- good tip. I love it so much. The story, the characters, the books, the show. I am so looking forward to Leviathan Falls and I think I WILL re read my original copy of Leviathan Wakes, because it's been 10 years!
I binged on the series, then binged on the books, then binged on the series again. Fastest I’ve ever read anything. Started around Christmas then finished the books so far by April.
My favorite SciFy is The Expanse! Followed close by Firefly. Please keep doing Expanse rundown's. Your my favorite reviewer. When series over please followup on ANYTHING Expanse. Love it!
Thanks Pete. I used to devour books before my kids were born, but between that and the Internet destroying my attention span, I find it hard to get the time to read nowadays. I'll give the audio books a go. And thanks, would really enjoy a series analysing the differences between the books and the shows in detail. Now back to waiting for Dune and Foundation.
Yeah, these are the audiobooks that converted me to being a listener more than a reader. There so easy to follow on a commute or around the house. If I still had a lawn to mow I would defintely be wearing headphones.
I love the TV series BUT I LOVE THE BOOKS MORE. I started with the series. Do watch the series, but I agree, READ THE BOOKS. It has so much more detail. The short stories are a good read too! I wish there were more.
I totally agree with this discussion about Naomi. She is used as a fall guy to some degree in the TV show and is blamed for things she had nothing to do with in the books. As a book reader I was ready to be forgiving of what Naomi's character went through but now I see how people demonize her when they don't know the book story and its kind of sad (such a base human need somehow to find someone to blame but why is it the only female member of the Roci?) One of the reasons I want the show to continue beyond Book 6 is that Naomi's arc is so freaking bad ass and needs to be told. I do hope they get to it someday.
I'm now caught up and waiting for the next novel in large part because of you and your show reviews/content. I can't say enough about the books which my family is now reading too. I watched most of the TV shows before I listened to the books but it was still so good. Thank you very much for your recommendation, your content is the best!
Watched the complete series through and then rewatched it after seeing your breakdowns. Watching it again was enhanced by your vids helping me better understand the subtleties of the politics and characters. Now for the books! Thanks again for breakdowns and analysis you do on The Expanse and other shows 🙏
AS a fan YES I AM NOW READING THE BOOKS. I have all the books (audio) loaded and currently on Book 2 Caliban's war. I have never in my life thought I'd be so drawn in to a show, I HAD TO READ THE BOOKS.
Other than some of the character compilations (Drummer) the biggest difference for me between the show & books is Naomi. She's practically a different person on the show vs the books. And so is Naomi & Holden's relatioship. She was pretty integral to his maturity as a person in the books. The show made her seem like she didn't know who she was. That annoyed me. I enjoy the show for the incredible visuals & basic ambiance they give to the ships & space stations & asteroids that people are now occupying. You know in an instant what someone's social class is just by looking at their ship & gear. Unfortunately they just couldn't portray how physiologically different Belters were to Inners & that difference was pretty important to the entire Marco plot & to Holden & Naomi's relationship. It was mentioned in passing in the first episodes of the first season but you get many more references to Belter physiology/appearance in the books. I think the writing on the show did a good job tying ALL the books together into a cohesive unit. They also did a good job truncating some of the events that happen that are supposed to build tension I guess in he books? But there were times, especially during Cibola Burn that I wanted to throw the book against the wall in frustration. I mean c'mon. The school bus full of kids that is on fire with no brakes that is heading for the canyon where the bridge is out does not also need a nuke with a timer & a super nova...the show writers had the good sense to dial some of that back. Since the books were written in a first person POV style, you are inside character's heads hearing their thoughts. Inner dialogs just can't be translated to screen very effectively so unfortunately you almost always lose insight into characters & character development from book to screenplay. I didn't understand Melba's sudden change of heart in season 3 & that was what motivated me to want to read the novels. I figured I was also missing other subtleties regarding the ring gates too. My favorite part of Cibola Burn was The Investigator POV. My favorite part about season 4 was Murtree/Amos. It's kinda weird how the show took minor characters like Drummer, Ashford & Murtree & made them amazing!!!
yeah, they did two actors with "belter bods", the GF of Miller's partner, and the prisoner that is tortured... its be an Avatar expense to do it right.
"Unfortunately they just couldn't portray how physiologically different Belters were to Inners..." I watched seasons 1-3 before ever reading the books, by the time season 4 came around on Amazon I had read all the books, and decided I would re-watch the series one more time after the book read. I had watched them a few times already, but after reading the source material wanted yet another viewing... I noticed that the first season they do make it a point to state how belters physiology is changing. In the series, I am sure due to the expense and also finding appropriate actors to portray elongated belters, they just couldn't go full on physically different from earthers. They essentially are saying that belters have started to shift to being completely different but weren't fully there yet. And after reading the books this stands out more, and they kind of address such in season 1 during the scene with Miller and his Ex in the bar, and with a few characters that look the part, but after reading the books that does stick out and makes one wish they stuck with that more like in season 1. But I get budgets matter and thst just couldn't be feasibly done... I guess.
I noticed a lot of comments by show only watchers that did NOT catch the whole Belters being different from Inners thing. The books mention it frequently. I commend the show writers for avoiding large info dumps & literally spoon feeding the audience the plot but there were certain things that were very subtle & confused show watchers who hadn't read the books. As I mentioned, after watching the first 3 seasons on SyFy I knew there were things I wasn't catching that the books would probably explain better. ( Melba's change of heart, what exactly happened to Holden, what did he feel when going through the ring)Since at that point the show was cancelled I just went ahead & read all 8 books & however many novellas were out not knowing the show was coming back. It's been interesting seeing what & where they changed things.
I I haven't read this or watched the show but I watch all your reviews and you always big this one up, so I'm going to give it a whirl and start from the beginning! Gratitude 🥰
Thanks for the insight. I've watched the show 5 times all the way through and just started reading LW. I was a little hung up on the differences at first but I think your POV will help me enjoy it even more.
Outside of the things that were impossible to add (Hair and clothing free flowing on the float, belter physiology), I think the two things I miss most from the books are the gimbaled crash couches, and the power of the Epstein drive. Ships in the show fly insanely close to each other. In the books, flying so close to another ship with your Epstein on would likely result in a lot of molten slag.
The screen adaptation covered hair issues by showing women w/ tight, tied-up hair, especially Belters. The capable CGI SPFX team had free-floating hair in low/no gravity scenes. The wardrobe team did a great job as well. 'Earthers' walked around wearing loose fitting clothes, especially UN Sect'y General Chrisjen Avasarala. She wore extravagant jewelry, flowing robes, and occasionally capes on Earth. But when in space, she had a snug, white space outfit, no jewelry. I DO take issue, however, w/ one problem in Luna scenes. The Moon has 1/6th of Earth's gravity. Even if assuming everyone strolls around in 'gravity boots' (the feet I noticed were in regular shoes), when the Expanse team attends a diplomatic reception hosted by the UN Sect'y, they, and other attendees frequently sat in very comfortable, 'plump', well cushioned sofas. Even in 'grav-boots', unless wearing 'gravity underwear', it was quite incongruent seeing people sitting in sofas in 1/6 G.
My experience with this series is the same: started with the T.V. show, but wound up reading the books. I feel both go hand in hand as far as telling the overall story. The show is one of the best adaptations from one medium to another, but the books are absolutely fantastic, telling a great story within a world well built.
Yup, tv show first, and started the books this year, with Leviathan in January. I’m a bit of a slow reader with work and kids stopping a weekly deep dive, but currently halfway through Cibola Burn and loving it. Hoping to finish Nemesis Games when S6 drops in December, so that I can read Babylon’s Ashes and the last three books after the S6 finale in early 2022
Fantastic perspective, foundation, and context of both the series and comparable books. Excellent analytics,🧐Pete. I always find your exposition adds detail and plot-points that I may have overlooked🤔. Thanks!
I watched the show and then started listening to the Audiobooks. I'm on 'Perspolis Rising' right now and I love listening to the narrator (other than the Chrisjen Avasarala mispronunciation that drove me a little crazy at first). I like having the main ideas in my head already from the show and then getting all of the details from the books.
Yeah, I had listened to the books where he says Avasarala's name so much that it got stuck that way in my head. Had to unlearn it after my first few Expanse videos.
I could listen to you all day talking about The Expanse. I watched the show first and enjoyed it immensely, So decided to listen to the books on Audible, 100% agree Jefferson Mays is brilliants. Yeah the books give a lot more detail then the show. but i think the acting is so good, you really fall in love with them and who they play. I also agree about the novellas, They give so much more information and i too would encourage folks to read them.
Great video. I recently reread the series as well. Definitely details I missed the first time around. The thing I like about the show is how it allowed the creators to revisit and expand on certain characters and ideas they may have underplayed initially. Djogo as an example comes to mind. Looking forward to your next video.
I read the first book whenever it first came out, and really liked it. For whatever reason, I stopped paying attention and thus never got around to the second book when it was released. By chance, I randomly started watching The Expanse--not knowing what it was--on SyFy and was like, 'wait a minutes, why do I know this story?', which of course lead to me connecting the dots. In any case, because the show is so amazing, I ended up going back and reading the rest of the books, although I admit it took a long time to finally get around to doing that. Having already seen the series, I couldn't imagine how it could be improved in any way, but let me tell you, the books are amazing!
I doubt I'll be able to finish the whole series of books before book 9 comes out... I just finished Leviathan Wakes last week, and I don't have a ton of spare time. That said, this video strengthened my resolve to read the books because I absolutely love the Expanse TV series... thanks for all of the amazing videos, please keep up the great work!
The show got me into the books. I only started Last year and I caught up to Season 5 while I was reading book 5. I loved seeing how they did certain things from the book in the show! I am on book 6 now (I slowed down a bit) and I am excited to finish the show then finish the story with the books.
Your presentation is very good, as usual. Excellent observations and analysis. Inspired by your recent season one recap, I re-watched it, and went on to re-watch seasons two and three, as well. Any writer or student of narrative understood the development of the many important characters and the plot had to proceed in the video more slowly and more simply than in the books, or be so much more subtle a portrayal that it would go over the head of most of the potential viewers. The piecemeal stitching together of the elements of the narrative was a result. Nevertheless, I feel they all did a decent job with the video narrative, and it works better, as you observed, on a second and third viewing. The same goes for the second and third seasons. Even with the deficiencies, limitations and constraints of the video medium in our capitalist, commercial, creative environment, taking the first three seasons together as a single integrated narrative makes the narrative much more coherent and compelling. When I watched all three seasons together, skipping parts I felt were filler (e.g., I no longer need exposition, I know where the story's vectors are going, and I don't need the intros or the credits) and not being hobbled by weekly breaks or a ~40 minute run-length, I found the story-telling considerably improved, notwithstanding that it lacked the power of a written text.
Agree. I love the show (and if they truly don’t finish telling the full version of the show, I’m left wondering what the point of ever starting it in the first place even was…,) and it is actually very well done and pretty faithful to the core story… but the books are incredible and ultimately better.
Started reading the books in late 2019. Just finished Cibola Burn tonight. Caliban's War took me a long time to get through, but the other three I read in a month or two each. For the most part, I have to admit, I like the show better. The show feels more cohesive. Like it's one long story rather than multiple shorter ones. It benefits greatly from the fact that so many of the books were already finished by the time it started, so they could start setting things up much earlier. There's a lot of foreshadowing in the show that just isn't in the books.
I'm at the Book 5 right now, and my opinion about books and how they are represented in TV show is pretty much the same. Also Jefferson Mays is such a great voice actor -- he has vast range and his character voices are gorgeous. Audiobooks wouldn't be as half as good without him.
I first heard about how great The Expanse was, a rollicking hard science fiction series (just what I was looking for), about the time the TV series was first announced. When I learned Leviathan Wakes was the first book, I bought it on iBooks, the first novel I read on my phone. I followed to the next book and the one after and then learned of the novellas and started buying and reading those. Skeptical, I didn't check out the TV series until the beginning of the second season and I had just finished the fourth book. The casting was amazing. Some people different than I imagined, Holden was quite a bit different, but Naomi was good (she should have been the tallest member of the crew) and Amos is played VERY well. Miller and Avasarala were absolutely PERFECT! Yeah, there was an awful lot of whipped up conflict in the TV series but I figured that was to keep up the drama expected from a TV show and to draw out character info. They also brought forward several characters and situations that didn't appear until the second or third books but I assumed they didn't know how long they would have to tell their story. The TV series is the best adaptation from books that I've ever seen, but I still prefer the books. The TV show just has so much trouble expressing certain feelings or concerns or for that matter details. But it's fun to see our characters in action. I've read the entire book series three times now and I'll start it over again when the last (*sob*) book is released. I love what they've done with Drummer, pulling her out to express certain ideas and even replace entire characters (who then have been brought forward to do WHAT?!). Her character has been so entirely enriched. And I appreciate the redeeming of Captain Ashford who was a total jerk in the books. I tell people they don't really NEED to read the novellas, but they really do provide useful backstory, much of which is hinted at in the TV series.
I usually re-watch the whole show before the next season starts. I'll still do that, but will probably re-read all the books too if I can make it through. The audiobooks are excellent too. Jefferson Mays does such a fantastic job with the accents without sounding hammy. There may be the occasional dodgy pronunciation, but all the characters are distinct, and his performance is consistent throughout. Better get on that :)
I too watched the show before reading the books. I think that's the way to do it because then you are not upset by the show not being as good as the book.
There's a part of me that understands the logic of doing it that way, but I almost always read the books first. If I find something to read through a show I've never been able to stop once I catch up with they are.
What strikes me the most about the first book was Miller’s thought process and point of view of a suicidal person with an extreme obsession. This echoes with the homicidal and sudden violence from Amos in the later book. The writers really put a lot of effort in the personal perspective.
I'd watched all five seasons of TV show twice through before reading any of the books, and then I read books 1 to 6 back-to-back. I felt the books retrospectively enhanced my enjoyment & understanding of the TV show despite the many differences. My dilemma now I've caught up is do I read on to get ahead of the TV show (I really want to), or do I save the rest until after I've seen the next series? Will I enjoy the next season more if I read the remaining books in advance? Will I enjoy the book less if I don't??
I first watched 3 seasons of the show, then switched to the books up to book 8, and then back to the show. Reading books didn't take from the show and watching the show didn't take from the books.
Most of the time books are often “better” than the movie/TV show adaptation. However, The Expanse is a great adaptation of the books. The visuals and the realistic depiction of space travel and the science of living outside of Earth is phenomenal. 👌🏽
I can't make a 12 minute video to explain why, but I've read all the books, twice, and I read them first (or as many as we're released when the show began) and I like the show better than the books.
So I hear. Currently reading Cibola Burn which I’m loving as it does feel like a Western. But there’s no earthbound politics, OPA pirates or Marco in book 4, so I’m sure all that excitement will be in Nemesis Games along with the falling rocks
I read all the books and when the TV show came out the characters of Naomi and Holden didn't quite fit with what I'd imagined. Having said that I did warm to them after a while. The other character who appears later is Bobbie, I expected her to be a lot more "physical" and taught on the TV and while she's still quite an imposing woman my expectations were perhaps a bit too much. But again after a while I accepted what she was in the show. Absolutely love it all and it's going to be a real shame when both the books and the series come to an end. By far the most realistic Sci-Fi scientifically with both a great and complex storyline and character set. (SPOILER ALERT IF YOU'RE NOT UP TO DATE) Was hugely disappointed with the Alex character ending in the show but understand the reasons why.
Will this video series contain spoilers for the whole book or television series? I am most of the way through the books, but I am trying to preserve their experiential integrity. (I did not even start this video in fear of spoilers, so I apologize if you give a run-down in it somewhere).
As someone who just started being a fan of this series at the beginning of the year when i first watched the show, and now starting to have read the books about 2 months ago, I can tell you one thing I hate in the show now, and that's Mars. It's such a huge disconnect between Mars in the show and Mars in the book. They REALLY tried to make Mars unlikable in the show, and it does show. They are WAY more strict in the show, and do some just straight up morally black things comparred to the books where they are morally grey leaning on white, where they do some questionable things, but you can tell they are only doing them because they believe it's the best outcome. (Book 3 shows us a little more of the 'grey' side of Mars, but I won't get into that on this comment since this video is only about book 1)
It's been a long time since I read all the way through books 1 and 2. They improve as they go and I like the expanded POVs in the later ones, but I do think Leviathan Wakes is a great introduction to the series. Looking forward to talking about books seven and eight. Let me know what you think.
So you're saying the first book is a great introduction to the series? What a bold statement lol. JK keep up the great work. I caught up a month ago and thought Tiamat's Wrath was the best book in the series. So far...
I read the books first, and I really didn’t like season 1 when I first saw it, so I think if you’re going to do both, watching the show first is the better way in. I’ve now both re-watched the series and re-read the books, and come to really appreciate the show, as well as the books. The one thing I can’t forgive season 1 for is what you point out about the change of it being Naomi, rather than Holden, who gives the protomolecule to Fred Johnson, and the unnecessary conflict that stirs up among the crew. In all, I think season 1 of the show really diminishes Naomi, as compared to the books, and I do not like that. Luckily, season 5 gives it all back to her. The show definitely improves season by season, as do the books. Book 8 is my favorite so far, and I’m really hoping that book 9 will become my favorite once it’s out.
@@archmaesterrenny9569 with the Knight and the crew conflict you can see that they wanted a situation to show how difficult space can be and develop the characters without the aid of having Holden’s thoughts about them. It makes sense for TV if it doesn't quite work. The Naomi choices turned a lot of viewers against her which is a shame because they balance each other so well in the books.
So glad you are finally reviewing the books with the show. I watched Season 1 and then I read the books in between Seasons 1 and 2. I have not read the novellas just because at the time they were only available on Kindle or as a download. I’m looking forward to your take on the changes with Naomi and her ex’s story in the last season. The books gave a lot more details about the reason for her shame and regrets and also you miss how manipulative Marco truly is and how he makes his son responsible for mass destruction and thereby repeating history. I should go back and reread them but they were a bit of a slog at times. They were definitely a way to get through a really snowy winter in Wisconsin!
For me the biggest miss in the show is Bobby. In the book she is pure confidence. In the show they make her seem like a fish out of water. Up until season 5 anyway. And to throw a bit of sexism into it. lol . If her character was male they would have required the actor to bulk up to meet the role. For anybody that didn't read the books. She is 6 and a half feet tall, 240 pounds of solid muscle.
The Audibles narrated by Jefferson Mays are the most amazing thing I've ever listened to. You can close your eyes and see the characters. It was the most rich experience I've had with audible books.
Totally. I avoided any audio novellas that Mays didn't narrate.
God I love seeing new Expanse content on TH-cam, especially from Pete Peppers
I bought the book in 2011, the cover artwork was incredible and it visually flew off the shelf into my hands. I didn't realize it was going to be a series, since the Miller story ended. Enough time had past and there were significant differences that I did not even know that The Expanse Season 1 was Leviathan Wakes (Who the heck is Avasarala? Naomi hides behind her hair.). I got into it once it was picked up by Amazon. Then, all the pieces fell into place. I watched the entire series and read all the books - no spoilers. Not on audio though- good tip. I love it so much. The story, the characters, the books, the show. I am so looking forward to Leviathan Falls and I think I WILL re read my original copy of Leviathan Wakes, because it's been 10 years!
I binged on the series, then binged on the books, then binged on the series again. Fastest I’ve ever read anything. Started around Christmas then finished the books so far by April.
@@letsgocamping88 Same!
My favorite SciFy is The Expanse! Followed close by Firefly. Please keep doing Expanse rundown's. Your my favorite reviewer. When series over please followup on ANYTHING Expanse. Love it!
Thanks Pete.
I used to devour books before my kids were born, but between that and the Internet destroying my attention span, I find it hard to get the time to read nowadays. I'll give the audio books a go.
And thanks, would really enjoy a series analysing the differences between the books and the shows in detail.
Now back to waiting for Dune and Foundation.
Yeah, these are the audiobooks that converted me to being a listener more than a reader. There so easy to follow on a commute or around the house. If I still had a lawn to mow I would defintely be wearing headphones.
Awesome reads...all the books. So looking forward to this next book. It will take us where only The Expanse can.
Yes, videos on each of the books as you re-read, please!!
I love the TV series BUT I LOVE THE BOOKS MORE. I started with the series. Do watch the series, but I agree, READ THE BOOKS. It has so much more detail.
The short stories are a good read too! I wish there were more.
The novellas are amazing
I totally agree with this discussion about Naomi. She is used as a fall guy to some degree in the TV show and is blamed for things she had nothing to do with in the books. As a book reader I was ready to be forgiving of what Naomi's character went through but now I see how people demonize her when they don't know the book story and its kind of sad (such a base human need somehow to find someone to blame but why is it the only female member of the Roci?) One of the reasons I want the show to continue beyond Book 6 is that Naomi's arc is so freaking bad ass and needs to be told. I do hope they get to it someday.
I'm now caught up and waiting for the next novel in large part because of you and your show reviews/content. I can't say enough about the books which my family is now reading too. I watched most of the TV shows before I listened to the books but it was still so good. Thank you very much for your recommendation, your content is the best!
Watched the complete series through and then rewatched it after seeing your breakdowns. Watching it again was enhanced by your vids helping me better understand the subtleties of the politics and characters. Now for the books! Thanks again for breakdowns and analysis you do on The Expanse and other shows 🙏
AS a fan YES I AM NOW READING THE BOOKS. I have all the books (audio) loaded and currently on Book 2 Caliban's war. I have never in my life thought I'd be so drawn in to a show, I HAD TO READ THE BOOKS.
Other than some of the character compilations (Drummer) the biggest difference for me between the show & books is Naomi. She's practically a different person on the show vs the books. And so is Naomi & Holden's relatioship. She was pretty integral to his maturity as a person in the books. The show made her seem like she didn't know who she was. That annoyed me.
I enjoy the show for the incredible visuals & basic ambiance they give to the ships & space stations & asteroids that people are now occupying. You know in an instant what someone's social class is just by looking at their ship & gear. Unfortunately they just couldn't portray how physiologically different Belters were to Inners & that difference was pretty important to the entire Marco plot & to Holden & Naomi's relationship. It was mentioned in passing in the first episodes of the first season but you get many more references to Belter physiology/appearance in the books.
I think the writing on the show did a good job tying ALL the books together into a cohesive unit. They also did a good job truncating some of the events that happen that are supposed to build tension I guess in he books? But there were times, especially during Cibola Burn that I wanted to throw the book against the wall in frustration. I mean c'mon. The school bus full of kids that is on fire with no brakes that is heading for the canyon where the bridge is out does not also need a nuke with a timer & a super nova...the show writers had the good sense to dial some of that back.
Since the books were written in a first person POV style, you are inside character's heads hearing their thoughts. Inner dialogs just can't be translated to screen very effectively so unfortunately you almost always lose insight into characters & character development from book to screenplay. I didn't understand Melba's sudden change of heart in season 3 & that was what motivated me to want to read the novels. I figured I was also missing other subtleties regarding the ring gates too. My favorite part of Cibola Burn was The Investigator POV. My favorite part about season 4 was Murtree/Amos. It's kinda weird how the show took minor characters like Drummer, Ashford & Murtree & made them amazing!!!
yeah, they did two actors with "belter bods", the GF of Miller's partner, and the prisoner that is tortured... its be an Avatar expense to do it right.
"Unfortunately they just couldn't portray how physiologically different Belters were to Inners..."
I watched seasons 1-3 before ever reading the books, by the time season 4 came around on Amazon I had read all the books, and decided I would re-watch the series one more time after the book read. I had watched them a few times already, but after reading the source material wanted yet another viewing...
I noticed that the first season they do make it a point to state how belters physiology is changing. In the series, I am sure due to the expense and also finding appropriate actors to portray elongated belters, they just couldn't go full on physically different from earthers. They essentially are saying that belters have started to shift to being completely different but weren't fully there yet.
And after reading the books this stands out more, and they kind of address such in season 1 during the scene with Miller and his Ex in the bar, and with a few characters that look the part, but after reading the books that does stick out and makes one wish they stuck with that more like in season 1. But I get budgets matter and thst just couldn't be feasibly done... I guess.
I noticed a lot of comments by show only watchers that did NOT catch the whole Belters being different from Inners thing. The books mention it frequently. I commend the show writers for avoiding large info dumps & literally spoon feeding the audience the plot but there were certain things that were very subtle & confused show watchers who hadn't read the books. As I mentioned, after watching the first 3 seasons on SyFy I knew there were things I wasn't catching that the books would probably explain better. ( Melba's change of heart, what exactly happened to Holden, what did he feel when going through the ring)Since at that point the show was cancelled I just went ahead & read all 8 books & however many novellas were out not knowing the show was coming back. It's been interesting seeing what & where they changed things.
@@yensid4294 i must say , i did like the Klaes Ashford changes.
I I haven't read this or watched the show but I watch all your reviews and you always big this one up, so I'm going to give it a whirl and start from the beginning! Gratitude 🥰
Enjoy!
Thanks for the encouragement to read. As a former media specialist, I always wanted my students to read the books first.
Hell yeah bro! I read it for the first time this summer (inspired by you) and enjoyed it so much. Can't wait to read the rest!!
Finishing book 2 right now. Enjoy the ride!
@@PetePeppers1 nice! I completely agree with everything you said in this btw, spot on!
Thanks for the insight. I've watched the show 5 times all the way through and just started reading LW. I was a little hung up on the differences at first but I think your POV will help me enjoy it even more.
Outside of the things that were impossible to add (Hair and clothing free flowing on the float, belter physiology), I think the two things I miss most from the books are the gimbaled crash couches, and the power of the Epstein drive. Ships in the show fly insanely close to each other. In the books, flying so close to another ship with your Epstein on would likely result in a lot of molten slag.
They SORT of mention it when they use the drive plume to torch the protomolecule hybrids
The screen adaptation covered hair issues by showing women w/ tight, tied-up hair, especially Belters. The capable CGI SPFX team had free-floating hair in low/no gravity scenes. The wardrobe team did a great job as well. 'Earthers' walked around wearing loose fitting clothes, especially UN Sect'y General Chrisjen Avasarala. She wore extravagant jewelry, flowing robes, and occasionally capes on Earth. But when in space, she had a snug, white space outfit, no jewelry.
I DO take issue, however, w/ one problem in Luna scenes. The Moon has 1/6th of Earth's gravity. Even if assuming everyone strolls around in 'gravity boots' (the feet I noticed were in regular shoes), when the Expanse team attends a diplomatic reception hosted by the UN Sect'y, they, and other attendees frequently sat in very comfortable, 'plump', well cushioned sofas. Even in 'grav-boots', unless wearing 'gravity underwear', it was quite incongruent seeing people sitting in sofas in 1/6 G.
My experience with this series is the same: started with the T.V. show, but wound up reading the books. I feel both go hand in hand as far as telling the overall story. The show is one of the best adaptations from one medium to another, but the books are absolutely fantastic, telling a great story within a world well built.
Yup, tv show first, and started the books this year, with Leviathan in January. I’m a bit of a slow reader with work and kids stopping a weekly deep dive, but currently halfway through Cibola Burn and loving it. Hoping to finish Nemesis Games when S6 drops in December, so that I can read Babylon’s Ashes and the last three books after the S6 finale in early 2022
Loved all the exobiology stuff in Cibola Burn that the show couldn't really incorporate. Enjoy the journey!
Fantastic perspective, foundation, and context of both the series and comparable books. Excellent analytics,🧐Pete. I always find your exposition adds detail and plot-points that I may have overlooked🤔. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it
i agree totally! i went through the audio books and the physical books together. absolutely loved the series!!! can't wait for the last book :)
I watched the show and then started listening to the Audiobooks. I'm on 'Perspolis Rising' right now and I love listening to the narrator (other than the Chrisjen Avasarala mispronunciation that drove me a little crazy at first). I like having the main ideas in my head already from the show and then getting all of the details from the books.
Yeah, I had listened to the books where he says Avasarala's name so much that it got stuck that way in my head. Had to unlearn it after my first few Expanse videos.
Nice work as usual Pete, just finished Leviathan audiobook, Miller!!!!
“It’s a legitimate salvage!”
I could listen to you all day talking about The Expanse. I watched the show first and enjoyed it immensely, So decided to listen to the books on Audible, 100% agree Jefferson Mays is brilliants.
Yeah the books give a lot more detail then the show. but i think the acting is so good, you really fall in love with them and who they play. I also agree about the novellas, They give so much more information and i too would encourage folks to read them.
Great video. I recently reread the series as well. Definitely details I missed the first time around. The thing I like about the show is how it allowed the creators to revisit and expand on certain characters and ideas they may have underplayed initially. Djogo as an example comes to mind. Looking forward to your next video.
I read the first book whenever it first came out, and really liked it. For whatever reason, I stopped paying attention and thus never got around to the second book when it was released. By chance, I randomly started watching The Expanse--not knowing what it was--on SyFy and was like, 'wait a minutes, why do I know this story?', which of course lead to me connecting the dots. In any case, because the show is so amazing, I ended up going back and reading the rest of the books, although I admit it took a long time to finally get around to doing that.
Having already seen the series, I couldn't imagine how it could be improved in any way, but let me tell you, the books are amazing!
I doubt I'll be able to finish the whole series of books before book 9 comes out... I just finished Leviathan Wakes last week, and I don't have a ton of spare time. That said, this video strengthened my resolve to read the books because I absolutely love the Expanse TV series... thanks for all of the amazing videos, please keep up the great work!
No hurry really. You'll definitely want to be able to read the final trilogy after season 6 airs though.
The show got me into the books. I only started Last year and I caught up to Season 5 while I was reading book 5. I loved seeing how they did certain things from the book in the show! I am on book 6 now (I slowed down a bit) and I am excited to finish the show then finish the story with the books.
Your presentation is very good, as usual. Excellent observations and analysis.
Inspired by your recent season one recap, I re-watched it, and went on to re-watch seasons two and three, as well.
Any writer or student of narrative understood the development of the many important characters and the plot had to proceed in the video more slowly and more simply than in the books, or be so much more subtle a portrayal that it would go over the head of most of the potential viewers. The piecemeal stitching together of the elements of the narrative was a result. Nevertheless, I feel they all did a decent job with the video narrative, and it works better, as you observed, on a second and third viewing. The same goes for the second and third seasons.
Even with the deficiencies, limitations and constraints of the video medium in our capitalist, commercial, creative environment, taking the first three seasons together as a single integrated narrative makes the narrative much more coherent and compelling. When I watched all three seasons together, skipping parts I felt were filler (e.g., I no longer need exposition, I know where the story's vectors are going, and I don't need the intros or the credits) and not being hobbled by weekly breaks or a ~40 minute run-length, I found the story-telling considerably improved, notwithstanding that it lacked the power of a written text.
Please continue with Expanse series! Thats my best scify novel
Agree. I love the show (and if they truly don’t finish telling the full version of the show, I’m left wondering what the point of ever starting it in the first place even was…,) and it is actually very well done and pretty faithful to the core story… but the books are incredible and ultimately better.
Also rereading the books too, first time rereading since watching the show.
Good times, and a good time to do it.
Started reading the books in late 2019. Just finished Cibola Burn tonight. Caliban's War took me a long time to get through, but the other three I read in a month or two each.
For the most part, I have to admit, I like the show better. The show feels more cohesive. Like it's one long story rather than multiple shorter ones. It benefits greatly from the fact that so many of the books were already finished by the time it started, so they could start setting things up much earlier. There's a lot of foreshadowing in the show that just isn't in the books.
Just finished Tiamats wrath can’t wait for leviathan falls
I'm at the Book 5 right now, and my opinion about books and how they are represented in TV show is pretty much the same.
Also Jefferson Mays is such a great voice actor -- he has vast range and his character voices are gorgeous. Audiobooks wouldn't be as half as good without him.
Jefferson Mays got me hooked on audiobooks. He's great.
Just finished the 4th book. Amos is one of my favorite characters of all time. I'm so far behind!!!!
Dropped the books, struggled through the 3rd book and the 4th book just dropped me into the mire.
I first heard about how great The Expanse was, a rollicking hard science fiction series (just what I was looking for), about the time the TV series was first announced. When I learned Leviathan Wakes was the first book, I bought it on iBooks, the first novel I read on my phone. I followed to the next book and the one after and then learned of the novellas and started buying and reading those.
Skeptical, I didn't check out the TV series until the beginning of the second season and I had just finished the fourth book.
The casting was amazing. Some people different than I imagined, Holden was quite a bit different, but Naomi was good (she should have been the tallest member of the crew) and Amos is played VERY well. Miller and Avasarala were absolutely PERFECT!
Yeah, there was an awful lot of whipped up conflict in the TV series but I figured that was to keep up the drama expected from a TV show and to draw out character info. They also brought forward several characters and situations that didn't appear until the second or third books but I assumed they didn't know how long they would have to tell their story.
The TV series is the best adaptation from books that I've ever seen, but I still prefer the books. The TV show just has so much trouble expressing certain feelings or concerns or for that matter details. But it's fun to see our characters in action.
I've read the entire book series three times now and I'll start it over again when the last (*sob*) book is released.
I love what they've done with Drummer, pulling her out to express certain ideas and even replace entire characters (who then have been brought forward to do WHAT?!). Her character has been so entirely enriched. And I appreciate the redeeming of Captain Ashford who was a total jerk in the books.
I tell people they don't really NEED to read the novellas, but they really do provide useful backstory, much of which is hinted at in the TV series.
I have to buy the books. Years ago I commuted daily so could read a lot. These days I drive and listen to podcast’s
I usually re-watch the whole show before the next season starts. I'll still do that, but will probably re-read all the books too if I can make it through. The audiobooks are excellent too. Jefferson Mays does such a fantastic job with the accents without sounding hammy. There may be the occasional dodgy pronunciation, but all the characters are distinct, and his performance is consistent throughout. Better get on that :)
Indeed. The telly series is ok, the books are brilliant.
I need to read the books.
Can't imagine you'd be disappointed
I too watched the show before reading the books. I think that's the way to do it because then you are not upset by the show not being as good as the book.
There's a part of me that understands the logic of doing it that way, but I almost always read the books first. If I find something to read through a show I've never been able to stop once I catch up with they are.
What strikes me the most about the first book was Miller’s thought process and point of view of a suicidal person with an extreme obsession. This echoes with the homicidal and sudden violence from Amos in the later book. The writers really put a lot of effort in the personal perspective.
this is one of the series where I really actually like the audiobook more than reading them.
Yeah, it feels like something is missing without Jefferson Mays.
I'd watched all five seasons of TV show twice through before reading any of the books, and then I read books 1 to 6 back-to-back. I felt the books retrospectively enhanced my enjoyment & understanding of the TV show despite the many differences. My dilemma now I've caught up is do I read on to get ahead of the TV show (I really want to), or do I save the rest until after I've seen the next series? Will I enjoy the next season more if I read the remaining books in advance? Will I enjoy the book less if I don't??
Fun fact, differences between the movie and the books, I’m pretty sure it’s Amos that delivers that line from the book you quote in the beginning. LOL
I watced the 1st season 5 times just to absorb all the nuanced world buil...contet reveal for my simple ind! BRILLIANT SERIES INDEED.
Do you have any videos that go over everything we know in the books so far?
I first watched 3 seasons of the show, then switched to the books up to book 8, and then back to the show.
Reading books didn't take from the show and watching the show didn't take from the books.
Most of the time books are often “better” than the movie/TV show adaptation. However, The Expanse is a great adaptation of the books. The visuals and the realistic depiction of space travel and the science of living outside of Earth is phenomenal. 👌🏽
I can't make a 12 minute video to explain why, but I've read all the books, twice, and I read them first (or as many as we're released when the show began) and I like the show better than the books.
Also In my opinion the Eros chase scene is way, WAY better in the book. It's so intense it was even making me anxious while i was reading it.
Oh man now I need to reread the whole thing 😂😂😂
Nemesis Games is fucking amazing
So I hear. Currently reading Cibola Burn which I’m loving as it does feel like a Western. But there’s no earthbound politics, OPA pirates or Marco in book 4, so I’m sure all that excitement will be in Nemesis Games along with the falling rocks
Was great to finally get POV chapters from the rest of the Roci crew.
I read all the books and when the TV show came out the characters of Naomi and Holden didn't quite fit with what I'd imagined. Having said that I did warm to them after a while. The other character who appears later is Bobbie, I expected her to be a lot more "physical" and taught on the TV and while she's still quite an imposing woman my expectations were perhaps a bit too much. But again after a while I accepted what she was in the show. Absolutely love it all and it's going to be a real shame when both the books and the series come to an end. By far the most realistic Sci-Fi scientifically with both a great and complex storyline and character set. (SPOILER ALERT IF YOU'RE NOT UP TO DATE) Was hugely disappointed with the Alex character ending in the show but understand the reasons why.
The books were good but there were a ton of different characters, and sometimes I felt like I should have been taking notes to keep them all straight.
Question? Is their a Companion book? Like other syfy shows have had?
Just finished tiamats wrath . I dont know what to do now
I love Amos
I prefer audio as I'm not a fast reader at all.
Will this video series contain spoilers for the whole book or television series? I am most of the way through the books, but I am trying to preserve their experiential integrity. (I did not even start this video in fear of spoilers, so I apologize if you give a run-down in it somewhere).
Watched the show before reading the books. I'm on Calibans War.
As someone who just started being a fan of this series at the beginning of the year when i first watched the show, and now starting to have read the books about 2 months ago, I can tell you one thing I hate in the show now, and that's Mars. It's such a huge disconnect between Mars in the show and Mars in the book. They REALLY tried to make Mars unlikable in the show, and it does show. They are WAY more strict in the show, and do some just straight up morally black things comparred to the books where they are morally grey leaning on white, where they do some questionable things, but you can tell they are only doing them because they believe it's the best outcome. (Book 3 shows us a little more of the 'grey' side of Mars, but I won't get into that on this comment since this video is only about book 1)
But, should I read the books?
Only if you like fun
Jefferson Mays is the gravy on my potatoes.
Too bad they had to get rid of Alex
19th