WARNING! In the description I link to a video that walks through all of the concept art for Veilguard in a much more thorough fashion than I do here. Most of the content is great but unfortunately there's a section towards the end where he makes multiple bigoted comments towards Taash. It's a 40+ minute video and I hadn't seen that part of it prior to making this so I didn't realize that unnecessary tangent was in there. My apologies.
@SlanderedGaming oooh I just got there! I was watching his vid right after your's and got there, and was just like, what is this dude doin? His video is such a good one and I don't inderstand his whole tangent about being Eastern European and conflating transgender identity with a split personality lol This guy 🤦🏼♀️ Your link is appreciated anyway though, and ty for highlighting this for us!
Damn good video, ive never played dragon age games, though followed recent one as interested in pop culture news as I prefer Crpg's though played plenty rpgs, vampire masquerade bloodlines/elder scrolls/fallout etc. From what I saw of veil guard it looked bad, not dark but like a disney movie and the dialogue... this artwork and the description of what the story should have been even interested me as sounds fantastic. Wasted opportunity
@@awesome27677it‘s not like they crafted this just to take it away from us 💀 clearly this was their vision as well but development was a challenge to say the least
@@copper1675 they threw away mountains of what made dragon age true and the only choice that impacted the game was being a solasmancer. That’s a pretty blatant development choice, along with the just permanent supportive nature of dialogue and Room being as interesting as a ham sandwich on wonderbread (without any cheese). Should have just made the protagonist the protag from a previous game.
@@awesome27677 I feel this is more an act of rebellion on their part. They knew fans would put the pieces together and see that the original vision, the true vision, was far less curated and sanitized. Inquisition art book has some amazing ideas that did not saw light, but still 80% of what you see in the book is in the game, for Veilguard i dont think we got even 20% of the original vision. And I think thats why the game is so shallow. Artists, devs, they know this. Instead of keeping the art book clean and shallow, they decided to show us what it was really ment to be. Its a message. For me at least.
The Elves didn’t even have to be The Bad Guys. Surely not every elf would have flocked to follow Fen’Harrel. Or maybe they would but with different motivations. Anyone with the Elger’nan or Ghilen’ain markings should have been controlled by them immediately, with other elves reacting in different ways. There could have been shock and awe, horror, and desperate flocking to Solas.
@ I mean, the entire elven race followed Andraste, a human barbarian following a human God just for a shot to get back at the Imperium. You don’t think the Dalish of all people wouldn’t hesitate to follow & fight for one of their literal, living Gods & helping bring back elven immortality?
@@ProphetTruth95The funniest thing is the fact even the Tevinter Nights book-that have many stories directly connected with Veilguard-mentions the fact Solas has many followers and spies scattered through Thedas and that the Venatori are reduce to a few people meeting in secret, not an army of infinite goons. Bioware idiots don't follow their own continuity.
It's funny, I actually did enjoy the game for what it is. It was fine, but then, after finishing, and reading about project Joplin... I just feel defeated haha. It was like a final stab to the heart. My gosh this game could have been GREAT. On bluesky I asked Mike Laidlaw, creative director for the cancelled original DA4 vision, why he was removed from the team, since that's what articles were reporting. He corrected me and said he CHOSE to leave the development team for DA4 when it became clear the direction would change dramatically from his original vision. All the devs that were passionate about the franchise seem to have preferred to leave rather than stay and watch what would become of the project.
Slandered Gaming, we knew this was going to happen when this game was not created by OG BioWare. The writing was on the wall when this game was developed.
I'm not gonna lie slandered, I cried a bit reading the book, what could have been. Like you, I played da origins on the day it was released. As a little 14 year old. I've literally grown up with it. This new information has broken my heart tbh
Well it's all the stranger that the concept artist, Rhodes, is actually the art director of Veilguard. He had direct control over the look of the game and it still turned out the way it did. It's either he doesn't have the ability to lead a team or someone higher up overrode his art decisions.
IMO it's the latter. EA told Bioware to make DA4 a live service game based on Anthem's code. This is why Veilguard has a more cartoony "Fortnite" type style, to appeal to the new audience EA wanted. When Anthem failed, EA changed their mind, so Bioware had to turn their live service game into a single player RPG. At this point, they wasted years of development working on a failed project, so it's pretty clear to me that they just reused the assets from the live service game.
@@what-am-i-looking-atThis doesn't really explain why you think it was upper management's call and not Rhodes. Bioware made the pivot from live service to single-player focus back in 2021. This is right when the previous art director, Goldman, stepped down. So that gave Rhodes 3 years to develop this properly with a single-player experience in mind. There's simply no excuse for him not to own this.
@@Nubbins-k8i To clarify, when I said "At this point, they wasted years of development working on a failed project, so it's pretty clear to me that they just reused the assets from the live service game." I meant that by then the team was probably over it. As someone whose been on some long running projects, sometimes you just want to get it over with. Starting from scratch again after 7 years is really tough. Creativity is not an endless well. So I agree Rhodes is responsible, but I also think if EA had never pushed live service to begin with, we would have had a visually similar DA game to DA3. I just don't think it's fair to saddle the blame 100% with Rhodes, when he had to manage EA's expectations _and_ his team's bandwidth.
The religious and cultural aspects of this game are so backward to me. The Dalish revered the Evanuris as saviors and protectors, so them coming back as monsters should be world-shattering and create schisms between those that accept reality and those that choose to believe their gods are still working for their good. Then we have the Antaam allying with elven mages even though the Qun considers ALL magic evil and corrupt. I personally think the newer writers were afraid of the moral ambiguity that would come from having the historically oppressed elves as antagonists, so they just went with the big, mean bull men instead.
As far as I know the elves don't see solas as their savior.Almost all of the dalish elves see him as the dreadwolf.the being who imprisoned their gods and think that he is the reason for the downfall of the elven civilization.The city elves won't have a clue about him as well.
Even as a heavy Lavellan/Solas romancer, I am horribly disappointed with how they handled Solas in Veilguard. He went from a nuanced anti-hero to a "mom made me do it" villain, which is so uninteresting. Seeing these concept arts really is a stab in the heart, I could have had such a tragic story of star crossed lovers as generals on opposite sides of a battlefield...instead I got...mommy issues?
Veilguard is Avengers Infinity Wars but just a couple avengers show up as cameos, nothing that happened in the previous movies matter and we follow the Revengers, a new group of heroes on their first adventure.
I saw a video last weekend that went into depth on this. It hurts. The story was superior in every way. HOF and Hawke? Past choices matter? Dreadwolf more involved? Darker, grittier, with more choices? So sad
10:45 "He looks so much better than any Qunari we get in Veilguard. WHY?" Because the developers gave up on the original vision. They just settled and made them a Dragon Age version of Tieflings.
It feels like current Bioware has no interest in DA anymore. They slapped together Veilguard half-heartedly just to give the fans something to play, then moved on to ME. EA should make a DA division inside Bioware, a team that works on DA exclusively. I dont really care about ME, so this pisses me off even more. They clearly cut some content. And they dont even bother to add that with DLC. Makes me mad.
Lets specify they lost interest in DAV not really the series. Its a sequel thats been worked on 10 years, a good amout the devs who made the previous games left. ME5 has room for a new story DAV had to conclude a story
@@CyrusIsnt Yeah, so? Arent these people professionals? Are you excusing their failure by saying they are new to the studio? Because they clearly arent new to the franchise. yet somehow they managed to ruin the game. And they are clearly preparing for some kind of reboot or something. Either way, Im done with them.
@@Oozaru85 Heres my point they were tired spent too much time engery and resources. To the point i doubt profit was even realistic. So you are working on a game you are tired of, or didnt even help draft you are gaining money off it when it drops. Why try? Why strecth it to 12-14 years of work?
@Oozaru85 Now i am not saying you have to like or agree with what they did. Just saying what they did is understandable given the situation. They still messed up this game could have been a 10 if they let it cook more.
As if i needed more reasons not to play Veilguard, this concept art is the game i was expecting to see. I'm with you on the sadness oh what could have been.
This breaks my heart. What I'm seeing in the concept art is exactly the game I was anticipating and waited 10 years for. And it is exactly the game that was promised at the end of trespasser. A real shame
Confirms what I thought: Veilguard was cobbled together from the remnants of three other potentially good versions of the game pushed out of obligation because BioWare wanted to move on as soon as possible after the decade of development hell. No wonder the writing was such trash and why they wanted to focus on the fanfic OCs of the cast: they needed to distract from everything else that went wrong. Ending by blowing up the old setting was basically them desperate to make a soft reboot so they don't have to build on all the things people actually cared about. The hidden ending was them throwing in a hook so some other people might have the chance to resurrect the franchise at some later date.
We really got a Pixar parody of what the original dragon age 4 was supposed to be didn’t we? So much of this looks like this game if the main issues like tone, watered down world, and abandonment of old storylines and themes are all clearly here in the original concept.
I think the reason we see a Tevinter Magister and a Qunari together is that DA4 was likely going to be a Mass Effect 3 scenario where, in order to stop a world-ending threat, you had to forge alliances between factions which had been fighting throughout the entire series, which would have been incredible.
Jesus Christ, that stranded Fade part sounds absolutely magnificent. It also could have been such an awesome way for them to bring back Hawke and hopefully do more justice to his/her. God this concept art is also crushing my heart.
So upset to know that something incredible could have been produced compared to what we got. Veilguard had its good moments, especially the ending. But it hurts so bad knowing the potential this world and story had to make a gripping fourth installment. The characters, cultures, histories, and choices the players made deserved to be fleshed out and executed well. So much material to work with and we got … this. A patchwork quilt compared to the beautiful tapestry that it could’ve been. I’m so bummed because the good stuff is all right there, laid out for people to see now. So many questions we’ll never have answered makes me genuinely upset. Really enjoyed seeing you play through thru DAV, Slandered. While it’s not the game it could’ve been, it has been great to go on this journey with you and see your experiences throughout the narrative! You’re a joy to watch and I’ll always appreciate your honest, nuanced, and fair commentary. Can’t wait to see what the future holds for you. I’m gonna go back to mourning what we could’ve had for awhile though, lol 😭 😢 *Edits for grammar
@@SlanderedGaming Im curious why you say pushing him out. When Bioware stated there was always a place for Gaider, and Gaider claimed he left due to being tired of development hell and wanted to work on non-dragonage stuff and being inspired with something else.
I wonder if this change in the art direction was the reason Matt Goldman left Bioware so suddenly about 3 years back? He was the Dragon age art director if I recall. He got promoted to creative director I think after Mike Laidlaw left and quit Bioware not long after that. It was very sudden and it seems he left under a bit of a cloud but the reason for his departure was never explained.....
I’m not sure how far I am through Veilguard at this moment. But even as I play, it’s clear to me where content has been stripped away. Companion quests that end unceremoniously. Rivain consisting of nothing but an empty beach and an arena you can burn through in fifteen minutes. Dock Town, which is supposedly full of intrigue and freedom fighters, but only offers maybe two or three short fetch quests between main plot quests. Throughout my three runs, I can’t help but keep searching for the rest of the game. The statements given by some of the writers who have resigned keeps ringing through my mind: That leading up to their resignation, they could feel the quiet resentment for their work. Whatever creative environment Bioware fosters now, it’s not one that’s conducive to building experiences audiences can care about beyond getting our money’s worth.
@@CyrusIsnt I am not sure if you are joking or not so sorry if I am being "ehm akshually" but Southern Thedas calls the Divine in Tevinter (who is both a mage and a male) the Black Divine.
This is the biggest issue for me. That the blueprint was ALWAYS so promising after DAO. But there was consistently changes being made to every iteration of the game and imo, diluted and lost a bit of the fabric of what made Dragon Age what it is. It's cool that people stil find enjoyment in the series but this game is the biggest "what if" for me. Looking at all this concept art is really heartbreaking and why I actually disagree with people saying that it was unfair/unreasonable to expect a David Gaider style game. The diminished portrayal of the characters, factions, and literal ABSENCE of story from previous games is the biggest slap in the face to the fans. All of this could have been remedied with competent, respectful writers who honoured the work before them. Instead they literally lit the previous work on fire.
Wow, DATV devs literally spit on the faces of their predecessors & their work. I mean if they really want to make their own game, their own vision, then make a new IP. They're already standing on the shoulders of giants. Don't do Dragon Age & their predecessors dirty like that. Its disrespectful.
Can we start a Kickstarter campaign for Dreadwolf?? Its the game we actually wanted and the concept art really showed an almost entirely fleshed out storyline
Everything about this game history looks cringe. They converted it so that it was going to be a multiplayer looter, then they stripped that out and converted it to a single player game . They also fired a bunch of the older employees and then they had to pull people from ME4 to help and that showed in the final product. I also don't think there will be another DA game, this one was too big of a commercial failure.
Imo, all that stuff was thrown to the side because there were so many rounds of layoffs/leavings and with each successive round of staff departures, the more removed the team got to the original storyline. Then everyone that came in afterwards wanted to 'put their stamp' on the game and in the end, we get a frankenstein of a dragon age game that doesn't resemble the originally planned game and has no real continuity with previous games and the lore at large.
I'm so sad we didn't get this Taash. And they could have had Imshael discuss gender with Taash and that would have been a much more interesting lore-relevant way of introducing the topic.
Holy hell Taash. Thats so much better, why did they do that? That made me a bit mad as an artist lol. But I wonder what happened. It's not really uncommon for concept art to be shafted in actual production. Games have limits and it's hard to do your cool idea of a 100 arm Hecatoncheires character if the tech, time, and money isn't there. Guess Issabel is a clear example of that. But it seems like production shifted halfway through or maybe it was the leadership? I don't know but it seems like the "dark" part of dark fantasy scared someone and they didn't want to touch those themes too much. I would be interested in seeing what when wrong here.
Its hard to imagine that what is shown here is pushing game limits since it seems to align with what was done in Inquisition and even Origins. Its been done before and can be done again with more resources and more time.
@@degreeskelvin3025 I mean what the company thought wasn't acceptable for the vibe they are going. If they wanted a more teen style game and didn't want any social blowback for touching sensitive subjects, then they won't. Not saying that thinking is even in line with Dragon Age as a series or how people would accept something like DAO, but it's a different company than when Origins came out. I can see a corporate guy thinking like that to max profit or a new team coming in and not liking what Dragon Age was so they want to make their own thing and the whole game seems safe. Could be a number of things really.
@dagonofthedepths yeah probably even all that put together. In the end we just didn't get what we could have cause those working on it didnt really want that. It is what it is.
You do an excellent job of detailing how the concept art we're seeing here was directly created to convey key moments that the team deemed important for the fourth installment of the series. These artworks do not exist in a vacuum, they are not simply environmental ideas or character design concepts, they are capturing consequential story scenes and through your analysis of the art we can see how the story itself was in some ways already written. Moving from piece to piece was really stimulating my imagination in ways that nothing from the fourth entry has ever done before. Appreciate the thoughtful analysis you put into this one.
In retrospect it's pretty apparent that Joplin was the sequel we were supposed to have and Veilguard is 80% Morrison with the live service removed. But personally the artbook healed some wounds for me. We didn't get the game we deserved, but at least it exists in some form.
DAV effectively destroys everything that came before it, arrogantly declaring all of the established lore moot since THIS games' version of things is far, far superior, according to new Bioware. You might be looking forward to more of this nonsense, but as far as I'm concerned, DA is DEAD! "We won't disrespect the choices made in previous games," stated John Epler. No. They'll just render all of them useless by completely destroying EVERYTHING! Have fun with this new DA. I'm finished with it.
we can't have good things anymore. Dragon Age was my adolescence. I loved Solas in Inquisition, and just like with Origins, we don't get the continuity we deserve.
I genuinely wonder if EA already had an idea for a cutesy fantasy multi-player game, then just decided to cannibalize Dragon Age 's lore and make it single-player so that they have plausible deniability.
this video resonated with me so hard and i agree with everything youve said. as someone who shelled out for the deluxe version of the artbook before release, another thing that hurt was after seeing how there isnt really any companion conflict in veilguard, theres a storyboard section on joplin (the internal name for this iteration of the game) where imshael as your companion was actually a double agent for solas the entire time. would have been not only an amazing inner party conflict, but an amazing tie in after imshael recognized felassan in the masked empire novel but seemingly didnt react to solas in inquisition (and with this information, probably because imshael wants solas to win and did not want to jeopardize his chances lol).
I shouldn't have looked it, but i have been a bioware fan since 1999, i could not resist... it broke my heart 💔 corporate greed ruined this game, i am sure we will have another entry, but i am afraid it will be without Solas and with the bad quality of writing we gotta in Veilguard... 😢
Matt Rhoades is one of the few old school BW devs left, and his work has always been on point. Art in general is one of the few things they consistently do well, especially environmental art. Even in Andromeda and Anthem, these things were great. Their environments always feel good to exist in. Character art... often lacks. This isn't the first time the concept art for characters was superior to the final product, in fact I feel like that's always been the case. Their characters always get watered down to the lowest common denominators in the end.
Its the classic AAA failure that is... "We need to appeal to a wider, more modern audience." "What about appealing to Dragon Age fans?" "... You're fired."
Wider audience yes, but saying "modern audience" doesn't make any sense. We *are* the modern audience. Anybody who consumes games in 2024 is the modern audience.
I feel bad for the writers and artists. They created this incredible story and then were told by EA that they had to make a live service multiplayer game with microtransactions (based on Anthem's code). So they had to make lots of changes to the story to accomodate the new format (also why the writing is more suited to 12+ than M like previous games). :/ EA's decision was so controversial that the original director and some writers quit. When Anthem failed, THEN the team was allowed to go back to an RPG game...but by then they lost a ton of development time. :/ I feel really bad for the writers and artists being blamed for a mid game when it was greedy executives to put everything in disarray.
I think I’m finally over Dragon Age? Like, Veilguard just kinda ruined the whole franchise for me. That’s, of course, my subjective option, but I really did not like DA:TV. I can’t even bring myself to do another playthrough. There are a lot of games that look so much more promising, like Avowed and Exodus. I’m also excited to see what Larian will cook up next, because as far as I am concerned, they’re the top players of the industry right now.
Your Veilguard review was balanced and touched on a number of areas honestly. I am glad you took some additional time to review some other areas, such as concept art and story lines left out. Your thoughts on this are well articulated and appreciated. I and many others are asking the same questions. Not purchasing or playing until it hits the dust bin.
I really believe the people that work on this game are really not Dragon Age Fans these people are using the gaming industry to push their agenda that’s why I have major concerns for M.E.5.
Gaider is just a great writer stray gods was so good i should have known with him working on it but i was still surprised at all the ways yiur choices affect the game
Act 2, actually. Solas was meant to chase the dagger with us up until showdown for 2 acts, and then he could squish you in Act 3 in your dreams if you didn't find a way to protect your mind from him.
Yeah basically it skips all the Act 1 content and gets straight to Act 2. What's interesting about that is a major complaint about Veilguard is the poor start that doesn't develop Varric or Rook.
For the love of .. that is exactly what I wanted. I wanted this game to lean even more to DA 2 structure. I wanted it to have few define acts across years. It would make much more sense to build relationships and dot the timeline.
10 thumbs up! I love your passion, you should have 100k+ subscribers. Love your channel, it is must view. Imagine what DA4 could have been if it was done similar to BG3? It had all the pieces to be truly epic. Instead, we got a cartoon game for children. And if Bioware survives, where does it go from here? It threw away all the amazing lore and the climax it was building to. It's crushing.
After seeing that they had all the tools in hand to make a great follow up to Inquisition, I have no sympathy for them for how Veilguard's reception has been.
I wish some other game development studio would make DA4 again and right... But that would be probably another 5 - 10 years of waiting and also its not going to happen. T_T This is the end...
If you haven't played Stray Gods, it is very, very good. 10 out of 10, would recommend. And double if you're a theater kid. I'm not, but I still like the music and I like the concept. Hoping for a sequel.
@@SlanderedGaming If you like music at all, the game is basically social roleplaying where you sing different songs to persuade people and change outcomes. Each song has three different styles depending on if you want to be "Friendly" "Aggressive" or "Manipulative." Each verse of the song, you can change the personality style based on what you're trying to say, and all the songs have many verses. Combining different personality styles gets you entirely different songs, or you can just stick to one style. There is one set event mid game that you cannot change, and that's a little frustrating. But there's multiple potential outcomes. So if you're okay with visual novels, it's a lot of fun and has some killer tunes that you make/discover for yourself.
I'm hoping a lot of this was due to development hell and now that bioware isn't messing around with multi-player and live service, we'll get back to things like this
I hear what you are saying but EA weren't the ones who basically pushed David Gaider out. That's 100% on Bioware and his departure is a MASSIVE reason for the failings of Veilguard. My review 100% called out issues with EA as well.
As a Cass/Divine romancer in DAI, the lack of the role the Divine in DATV was my top disappointment. I will say I felt the same about the DAI art book when I got it, especially with the variations of enemies that they had concepts for but never put in the game. The Venatori rode on giant scorpions in one concept! That would have been amazing, especially in the desert regions of DAI. My biggest gripe with the series still is the lack of enemy variations. DAV had a bit more than DAI, but eventually became the same hordes over and over again. The final boss fights were great though and far better than Corphyeus.
I cant believe that the development team thought what they put out was superior option to what we saw in the art book, some of the pictures and descriptions literally made me tear up, I would have given anything to get that game instead of this. But then again, they also thought the abhorent gross design they gave Taash was better than the one in the artbook so Im not surprised, tho its clear Taash is a completely different character here. Soul crushing is the right way to put it. The artbook is DA at its best, Veilguard is the tiktok version.
I very much agree with you! That vid you recommend though which goes through all the concept art is amazing, eccept for the last part where the creator dips a bit too much into biggot teritorry adressing Taash. If that part would not be there then that vid would be amazing.
I'm really disappointed in DA: The Veilguard, but trying to play devil's advocate we need to be honest concept art never actually represents what we get on screen once games ship, especially when a project is in development for 10 years. Some games tend to stick closer to it and for the most part are the ones with "artsy/weird" look, an example could be Disco Elysium or to use a more AAA example Dishonored (the 1st mostly). All that said, the reason most folks prefer this concept art is because, as every concept art, it was done in pre-production which means the original team of Inquisition was still around, honestly no idea what actually happened in production (from RPG to GAAS and then to action adventur), I never had the pleasure to work on a Bioware title, but if I had to guess the game was originally supposed to be another "proper" Dragon Age and this was the concerpt art for that game, when it was forced to be a GAAS everything had to change, the target audience is different and performances need to be perfect because on top of them you';; also have possible networking issues. There is where the new style popped up a cleaner (too much) and easier to optimize look, done by people who are used to produce such type of art.
Man I really love your reviews. You be speaking truth. Agree with all your points and I appreciate you giving your perspective as someone who actually knows and cares about the story. I didn't play much DA but you make me wanna pick up Origins again.
What kills me is THEY HAD all of this already in front of them and they did not use it! Why? Who made that decision? Did they not have the money to actually deliver the game we was in the The Art Book? Was that Joplin that we could of had? It looks like they did not want to knock down the ant hill after all. They always told us they were going to turn everything over on its head, VEILGUARD was supposed to BE THAT. They kept it as status quo.. they played it safe, they went back on what we planned and it was NOT for the better. I want the game that's in the Art Book!
Watched another video that did a breakdown of this. Its pretty frustrating and sad what we couldn't have. From what I understand. The number of sales for Veilguard were poor enough that we might not see any more Dragon Age for a long time which makes this all the more painful.. I hope we get to hear the behind the scene accounts for the development to understand how we got the game we got. Something tells me it might be like suicide squad kill the justice league or Mass Effect 4....
Honestly, my biggest problem with Taash's design is the sour face they constantly pull. Literally like a petulant child who didn't get the new toy they so badly wanted. The armors and all that are alright I think, as they kinda fit the Qunari turned pirate theme.
Yes! I felt so frustrated that they scraped like 2/3 of original Joplin game that had a lot of right vibe and potential, and the remaining 1/3 - the dreams, encounters with Solas - were the most superb things about otherwise pretty mid (if discounting offensive treatment of DA lore and previous choices and morally grey characters and factions) game Veilguard turned out.
Man I know you don’t stand jerks and assholes but this game designers have gone too far with they shitty ideologies that no one cares about … I want the Dragon Age not the silly crying baby DA … I want a game
One of this games biggest problem is easily it’s wasted potential. Imagine what you did at the ritual determined which gods were released, and your previous choices determined some of their tactics and successes, including Solas. Perhaps Andruil goes after the Dalish and City elves, and solas fights a propaganda war for their support, or Briala being behind the throne slows her reach somewhat in the cities. Falon’din gains support from the mortalitassi, or dirthamen the mages depending on how the Mage/Templar war ended, and who the new divine is. June maybe uses new eluvians to gain an edge, or Ghillanain manipulates the wardens, darkspawn and wild creatures she made to make an army of monsters? What if the worst made choice led to half the pantheon being released, or just Elgar’nan but make him so much more horrifying than any of the others? They had origins bought back in the least interesting way as well. What if you started as an elf in Solas’s forces or even an ancient elf like Abelas? A mage in the Tevinter elite, like the noble in origins but reversed, where you could become archon or reform the magisters yourself? A Dwarf like the ones in the Descent DLC? A Qunari deployed to Tevinter as a warrior spy? This game easily had more possibilities than any other dragon age game, and we barely got any of it. And even ignoring that, there’s so much. Vivienne being elected divine should send shockwaves as far as Tevinter, so should Leliana dissolving the circles. The Architect being alive, discovering the truth of the Tevinter gods and blight. What about Urthemiels soul in Kieran? And especially the Orlessian throne and civil war. It’s heavily implied certain choices would lead to civil war starting again, especially with the three way truce. That should have been a big deal!
The concepts are so beautiful and epic! I hate hearing all the wasted ideas and potential they ignored, but all that and then axeing Calpernia as a companion will always cut me bad. It really hurts to see how much they cut the story down. It would have been amazing to see.
I just feel the game treats you like a little kid in a safe space while blowing enemies up in red fog clouds. It’s really strange what they were trying to pull off.
The people who greenlit the version of the Veilguard we got effectively spelled the end of Bioware because people now know they'll treat Mass Effect with the same level of care.
@@SlanderedGaming, I hope you're right, but I think this studio will need to change things up a lot to make that happen. The last three games all moved away from branching stories and role-playing to varying degrees. They need to realize that this is what made the studio valuable to begin with.
I had to quit the video. My anger at a studio bastardizing a franchise this badly is overwhelming. Dragon Age was amazing. I cannot stand what they turned a lot of this into. Bad writing decisions and generic plot devices-this is not the Dragon Age I loved, it's a crippled figment and I am not going to support it with my money. I genuinely do not understand how you can mess up this badly as a team when everything is handed to you. Maybe it was EA interference, I don't know.
Slandered, I recently discovered your channel, and you're already probably one of my favorites to follow. I really like how passionate you are about the series and like you, I started DAO the day it was released. Your reviews and going over the lore has been a fun way to reconnect with the series (after Trespasser and the DAV development hell, I admittedly stepped away for a long time). Thank you for your honest reviews and I look forward to more. :)
while i sympathize with the devs who have been on socials clarifying that concept art is brainstorming and often includes things that could never have feasibly been implemented (especially with too man branching world states combined with development with rocky as veilguard's), i think the art book demonstrates where the current story was reduced from earlier plot concepts WITHOUT the elements that supported them in the original concept. kal-sharok is a great example (got downsized from a faction to just the setting for harding's quest), but another is the lords of fortune. the faction in-game feel out of place (little pc reactivity, their hub isn't even integrated into the map, half their codexes and plots are just about the antaam/qunari) but the original plot was incredibly focused on ships and sea travel across thedas! a pirate faction would have made much more sense in that context. but as things got cut down, they clearly merged what they had for isabela and the pirates and the qunari down into one somewhat lackluster faction. sure, probably a lot of the art book would never have been implementable in even an ideal development. but the finished product was clearly a race to the finish line trying to figure out how much of joplin could make it into the game. and it's very telling that in the original plot concept, interrupting solas's ritual was the MIDDLE of the game, not the beginning...
let me preface this by saying i've sunk 90+ hours into a completionist playthrough and i did have fun with the game. the crux of this issue i have is the shallowness of the narrative. there is no nuance: all your friends are 100% correct always, and you are 100% correct always, and everybody else is just there to cheer you on. the inquisitor is a just a faceless empty shirt, colorless and boring, morrigan has been turned into a sweet mother figure and varric is just absent. game has been criticised for being woke, but i'm gonna say, game is not woke "enough". everyone is just offering vapid talking points, where they are ontificating on what the right thing to do or say is. and even though they situations can sometimes be rather dark or serious, the "right thing to do" is always 100% the right thing to do. or when it's not, it's like "whatever man", not a serious decision with compromise and sacrifice. dragon age is supposed to put you in serious moral quandaries about what is right and wrong and how much you can justify your means by your ends. this game offerred none of that. the exclusion of any discussion for the racial and class oppression the elves faced is a symptom of this disney-fication. solas is not a revoloutionary who had to make harsh decision, he's just "in love". the romantic nuance would have been fine, but it is sad that this is the only aspect explored in the game
I agree concept art is amazing and so was the arc of elves and even sentinels siding with Solas. this game missed the involvement of more players, Solas agents, other elves and sentinels, spies from all sides, other agents of Inquisition, etc.. it felt a bit empty on npcs and player involved in stopping him. and can we talk about how amazing Arlathan Forest looks in that first concept art? it looks thick and dark and ominous, more like it was described in book and short story.
WARNING!
In the description I link to a video that walks through all of the concept art for Veilguard in a much more thorough fashion than I do here. Most of the content is great but unfortunately there's a section towards the end where he makes multiple bigoted comments towards Taash. It's a 40+ minute video and I hadn't seen that part of it prior to making this so I didn't realize that unnecessary tangent was in there. My apologies.
@SlanderedGaming oooh I just got there! I was watching his vid right after your's and got there, and was just like, what is this dude doin? His video is such a good one and I don't inderstand his whole tangent about being Eastern European and conflating transgender identity with a split personality lol This guy 🤦🏼♀️ Your link is appreciated anyway though, and ty for highlighting this for us!
Damn good video, ive never played dragon age games, though followed recent one as interested in pop culture news as I prefer Crpg's though played plenty rpgs, vampire masquerade bloodlines/elder scrolls/fallout etc. From what I saw of veil guard it looked bad, not dark but like a disney movie and the dialogue... this artwork and the description of what the story should have been even interested me as sounds fantastic. Wasted opportunity
Just listened to some of it and yeah, guy’s a massive prick.
Sorry, man, you are exaggerating.
I watched the video and there is no bigotry in it, and I watched until the very end.
Thank you a lot for the heads up on that Slandered, i really appreciate it :)
I love how the artists decided to show all of this to Us fans... like saying.. Hey this is what we wanted for you guys... sorry you didnt got it...
That's exactly what it feels like.
@@SlanderedGaming They really did the fanbase dirty. this is the biggest slap in the face.
@@awesome27677it‘s not like they crafted this just to take it away from us 💀 clearly this was their vision as well but development was a challenge to say the least
@@copper1675 they threw away mountains of what made dragon age true and the only choice that impacted the game was being a solasmancer. That’s a pretty blatant development choice, along with the just permanent supportive nature of dialogue and Room being as interesting as a ham sandwich on wonderbread (without any cheese). Should have just made the protagonist the protag from a previous game.
@@awesome27677 I feel this is more an act of rebellion on their part.
They knew fans would put the pieces together and see that the original vision, the true vision, was far less curated and sanitized.
Inquisition art book has some amazing ideas that did not saw light, but still 80% of what you see in the book is in the game, for Veilguard i dont think we got even 20% of the original vision. And I think thats why the game is so shallow.
Artists, devs, they know this. Instead of keeping the art book clean and shallow, they decided to show us what it was really ment to be. Its a message. For me at least.
in an alternate timeline DA: Dread Wolf was a criticaly aclaimed masterpiece :/
@@alex-uw4mm absolutely!
The finale that we wanted 😢 and will never had lets pour one out
Yea😢
I fully believe Dreadwolf would've been a very, very well received game. Perhaps even a masterpiece.
Turns out the Elven revolution will not be televised...
The Elves couldn’t revolt/be villains because “White Man Bad.” It’s why the Venetori SOMEHOW are not only still around but an organized army
The Elves didn’t even have to be The Bad Guys. Surely not every elf would have flocked to follow Fen’Harrel. Or maybe they would but with different motivations.
Anyone with the Elger’nan or Ghilen’ain markings should have been controlled by them immediately, with other elves reacting in different ways. There could have been shock and awe, horror, and desperate flocking to Solas.
@ I mean, the entire elven race followed Andraste, a human barbarian following a human God just for a shot to get back at the Imperium. You don’t think the Dalish of all people wouldn’t hesitate to follow & fight for one of their literal, living Gods & helping bring back elven immortality?
@@ProphetTruth95The funniest thing is the fact even the Tevinter Nights book-that have many stories directly connected with Veilguard-mentions the fact Solas has many followers and spies scattered through Thedas and that the Venatori are reduce to a few people meeting in secret, not an army of infinite goons.
Bioware idiots don't follow their own continuity.
It's funny, I actually did enjoy the game for what it is. It was fine, but then, after finishing, and reading about project Joplin... I just feel defeated haha. It was like a final stab to the heart.
My gosh this game could have been GREAT. On bluesky I asked Mike Laidlaw, creative director for the cancelled original DA4 vision, why he was removed from the team, since that's what articles were reporting.
He corrected me and said he CHOSE to leave the development team for DA4 when it became clear the direction would change dramatically from his original vision.
All the devs that were passionate about the franchise seem to have preferred to leave rather than stay and watch what would become of the project.
Slandered Gaming, we knew this was going to happen when this game was not created by OG BioWare. The writing was on the wall when this game was developed.
Yeah it's just wild to see it laid out so clearly like this.
I'm not gonna lie slandered, I cried a bit reading the book, what could have been. Like you, I played da origins on the day it was released. As a little 14 year old. I've literally grown up with it. This new information has broken my heart tbh
Its a gut punch for sure. As a fan. We will always imagine what could have been. It sucks we got what we got.
Well it's all the stranger that the concept artist, Rhodes, is actually the art director of Veilguard. He had direct control over the look of the game and it still turned out the way it did. It's either he doesn't have the ability to lead a team or someone higher up overrode his art decisions.
IMO it's the latter. EA told Bioware to make DA4 a live service game based on Anthem's code. This is why Veilguard has a more cartoony "Fortnite" type style, to appeal to the new audience EA wanted. When Anthem failed, EA changed their mind, so Bioware had to turn their live service game into a single player RPG.
At this point, they wasted years of development working on a failed project, so it's pretty clear to me that they just reused the assets from the live service game.
@@what-am-i-looking-atThis doesn't really explain why you think it was upper management's call and not
Rhodes. Bioware made the pivot from live service to single-player focus back in 2021. This is right when the previous art director, Goldman, stepped down. So that gave Rhodes 3 years to develop this properly with a single-player experience in mind. There's simply no excuse for him not to own this.
@@Nubbins-k8i To clarify, when I said "At this point, they wasted years of development working on a failed project, so it's pretty clear to me that they just reused the assets from the live service game."
I meant that by then the team was probably over it. As someone whose been on some long running projects, sometimes you just want to get it over with. Starting from scratch again after 7 years is really tough. Creativity is not an endless well.
So I agree Rhodes is responsible, but I also think if EA had never pushed live service to begin with, we would have had a visually similar DA game to DA3. I just don't think it's fair to saddle the blame 100% with Rhodes, when he had to manage EA's expectations _and_ his team's bandwidth.
6:25 not only that he is LITERALLY their God. Someone they've been waiting for for aeons to come and deliver them !!
It's like Jesus came back, made clear that he is the guy and Christians go "Meh."
EXACTLY.
The religious and cultural aspects of this game are so backward to me. The Dalish revered the Evanuris as saviors and protectors, so them coming back as monsters should be world-shattering and create schisms between those that accept reality and those that choose to believe their gods are still working for their good. Then we have the Antaam allying with elven mages even though the Qun considers ALL magic evil and corrupt. I personally think the newer writers were afraid of the moral ambiguity that would come from having the historically oppressed elves as antagonists, so they just went with the big, mean bull men instead.
As far as I know the elves don't see solas as their savior.Almost all of the dalish elves see him as the dreadwolf.the being who imprisoned their gods and think that he is the reason for the downfall of the elven civilization.The city elves won't have a clue about him as well.
@@bharathezhilan2477
Still t wo other Gods for them to worship though.
Even as a heavy Lavellan/Solas romancer, I am horribly disappointed with how they handled Solas in Veilguard. He went from a nuanced anti-hero to a "mom made me do it" villain, which is so uninteresting. Seeing these concept arts really is a stab in the heart, I could have had such a tragic story of star crossed lovers as generals on opposite sides of a battlefield...instead I got...mommy issues?
Exactly...
Veilguard is Avengers Infinity Wars but just a couple avengers show up as cameos, nothing that happened in the previous movies matter and we follow the Revengers, a new group of heroes on their first adventure.
Lol sounds hella accurate
I saw a video last weekend that went into depth on this. It hurts. The story was superior in every way. HOF and Hawke? Past choices matter? Dreadwolf more involved? Darker, grittier, with more choices? So sad
Link pls
10:45 "He looks so much better than any Qunari we get in Veilguard. WHY?"
Because the developers gave up on the original vision. They just settled and made them a Dragon Age version of Tieflings.
Yeah it felt like the Devs saw how popular Karlach was and then designed the Qunari based off that... without the good writing.
It feels like current Bioware has no interest in DA anymore. They slapped together Veilguard half-heartedly just to give the fans something to play, then moved on to ME. EA should make a DA division inside Bioware, a team that works on DA exclusively. I dont really care about ME, so this pisses me off even more. They clearly cut some content. And they dont even bother to add that with DLC. Makes me mad.
Lets specify they lost interest in DAV not really the series. Its a sequel thats been worked on 10 years, a good amout the devs who made the previous games left.
ME5 has room for a new story
DAV had to conclude a story
@@CyrusIsnt Yeah, so? Arent these people professionals? Are you excusing their failure by saying they are new to the studio? Because they clearly arent new to the franchise. yet somehow they managed to ruin the game. And they are clearly preparing for some kind of reboot or something. Either way, Im done with them.
@@Oozaru85 Heres my point they were tired spent too much time engery and resources. To the point i doubt profit was even realistic. So you are working on a game you are tired of, or didnt even help draft you are gaining money off it when it drops. Why try? Why strecth it to 12-14 years of work?
@Oozaru85 Now i am not saying you have to like or agree with what they did.
Just saying what they did is understandable given the situation.
They still messed up this game could have been a 10 if they let it cook more.
I don't think we can be sure if they have no interest in DA because the game had such a clearly irregular dev cycle.
You are slowly becoming one of my favorite content creators on here man keep it up
Thank you!
He is the best, bar none!
As if i needed more reasons not to play Veilguard, this concept art is the game i was expecting to see. I'm with you on the sadness oh what could have been.
This breaks my heart. What I'm seeing in the concept art is exactly the game I was anticipating and waited 10 years for. And it is exactly the game that was promised at the end of trespasser. A real shame
Confirms what I thought: Veilguard was cobbled together from the remnants of three other potentially good versions of the game pushed out of obligation because BioWare wanted to move on as soon as possible after the decade of development hell. No wonder the writing was such trash and why they wanted to focus on the fanfic OCs of the cast: they needed to distract from everything else that went wrong.
Ending by blowing up the old setting was basically them desperate to make a soft reboot so they don't have to build on all the things people actually cared about. The hidden ending was them throwing in a hook so some other people might have the chance to resurrect the franchise at some later date.
I'm fine with them rebooting it but if you are going to do that then still give us the Dragon Age game most of the fans wanted to see.
We really got a Pixar parody of what the original dragon age 4 was supposed to be didn’t we?
So much of this looks like this game if the main issues like tone, watered down world, and abandonment of old storylines and themes are all clearly here in the original concept.
I think the reason we see a Tevinter Magister and a Qunari together is that DA4 was likely going to be a Mass Effect 3 scenario where, in order to stop a world-ending threat, you had to forge alliances between factions which had been fighting throughout the entire series, which would have been incredible.
They've done that in every game, nothing new
Jesus Christ, that stranded Fade part sounds absolutely magnificent. It also could have been such an awesome way for them to bring back Hawke and hopefully do more justice to his/her.
God this concept art is also crushing my heart.
So upset to know that something incredible could have been produced compared to what we got. Veilguard had its good moments, especially the ending. But it hurts so bad knowing the potential this world and story had to make a gripping fourth installment. The characters, cultures, histories, and choices the players made deserved to be fleshed out and executed well. So much material to work with and we got … this. A patchwork quilt compared to the beautiful tapestry that it could’ve been.
I’m so bummed because the good stuff is all right there, laid out for people to see now. So many questions we’ll never have answered makes me genuinely upset.
Really enjoyed seeing you play through thru DAV, Slandered. While it’s not the game it could’ve been, it has been great to go on this journey with you and see your experiences throughout the narrative! You’re a joy to watch and I’ll always appreciate your honest, nuanced, and fair commentary. Can’t wait to see what the future holds for you.
I’m gonna go back to mourning what we could’ve had for awhile though, lol 😭 😢
*Edits for grammar
You aren’t lying brotha. The image of Cassandra as Devine hurts!
And now you just showed an image of the best looking qunari I’ve seen since the Arishok
@@Justanotherguy83 I love DA 2. Where we actually had good antagonists instead of cartoon villains like Loghain, Howe, Archdemon or DAI Corypheus
@@Justanotherguy83 definitely. Arishok is the best looking Qunari in the entire series
When you in develpment hell 😢
That you created
EA created the issues not Bioware@@barbos1507
Yeah EA definitely made things bad instead of allowing Bioware follow the path they had laid out@@barbos1507
True the development issues absolutely play into this but frankly pushing David Gaider out of the studio played a MASSIVE role as well.
@@SlanderedGaming Im curious why you say pushing him out. When Bioware stated there was always a place for Gaider, and Gaider claimed he left due to being tired of development hell and wanted to work on non-dragonage stuff and being inspired with something else.
I wonder if this change in the art direction was the reason Matt Goldman left Bioware so suddenly about 3 years back? He was the Dragon age art director if I recall. He got promoted to creative director I think after Mike Laidlaw left and quit Bioware not long after that. It was very sudden and it seems he left under a bit of a cloud but the reason for his departure was never explained.....
I’m not sure how far I am through Veilguard at this moment. But even as I play, it’s clear to me where content has been stripped away. Companion quests that end unceremoniously. Rivain consisting of nothing but an empty beach and an arena you can burn through in fifteen minutes. Dock Town, which is supposedly full of intrigue and freedom fighters, but only offers maybe two or three short fetch quests between main plot quests. Throughout my three runs, I can’t help but keep searching for the rest of the game.
The statements given by some of the writers who have resigned keeps ringing through my mind: That leading up to their resignation, they could feel the quiet resentment for their work. Whatever creative environment Bioware fosters now, it’s not one that’s conducive to building experiences audiences can care about beyond getting our money’s worth.
I’m also curious how you bring Dorian back but not talk about the black Devine
@@d00mgames95 vivinne is black... she can be the divine
@@CyrusIsnt I am not sure if you are joking or not so sorry if I am being "ehm akshually" but Southern Thedas calls the Divine in Tevinter (who is both a mage and a male) the Black Divine.
@@nikolasgrots334 oh you ment that their divine the dude you dont see in game
I agree. We see so little of Tevinter culture in the game.
@@CyrusIsnt yes lol
This is the biggest issue for me. That the blueprint was ALWAYS so promising after DAO. But there was consistently changes being made to every iteration of the game and imo, diluted and lost a bit of the fabric of what made Dragon Age what it is. It's cool that people stil find enjoyment in the series but this game is the biggest "what if" for me. Looking at all this concept art is really heartbreaking and why I actually disagree with people saying that it was unfair/unreasonable to expect a David Gaider style game. The diminished portrayal of the characters, factions, and literal ABSENCE of story from previous games is the biggest slap in the face to the fans. All of this could have been remedied with competent, respectful writers who honoured the work before them. Instead they literally lit the previous work on fire.
Wow, DATV devs literally spit on the faces of their predecessors & their work. I mean if they really want to make their own game, their own vision, then make a new IP. They're already standing on the shoulders of giants.
Don't do Dragon Age & their predecessors dirty like that. Its disrespectful.
Can we start a Kickstarter campaign for Dreadwolf?? Its the game we actually wanted and the concept art really showed an almost entirely fleshed out storyline
Same thought, I would reaaaaally love to have it.
Everything about this game history looks cringe. They converted it so that it was going to be a multiplayer looter, then they stripped that out and converted it to a single player game . They also fired a bunch of the older employees and then they had to pull people from ME4 to help and that showed in the final product. I also don't think there will be another DA game, this one was too big of a commercial failure.
Yup it's all deeply unfortunate.
Imo, all that stuff was thrown to the side because there were so many rounds of layoffs/leavings and with each successive round of staff departures, the more removed the team got to the original storyline. Then everyone that came in afterwards wanted to 'put their stamp' on the game and in the end, we get a frankenstein of a dragon age game that doesn't resemble the originally planned game and has no real continuity with previous games and the lore at large.
i bought the art book, read it in 10 minutes, cried, and returned it. what a big fuck you to dragon age fans this game we got was
I'm so sad we didn't get this Taash. And they could have had Imshael discuss gender with Taash and that would have been a much more interesting lore-relevant way of introducing the topic.
Imshael was such a missed opportunity. Also Calpernia..
Yup both of those changes would've really helped their character.
Thedas don't have mental institutions, so there is no way to introduce her properly, and no, I'm not pulling a barve.
Man. What a gut-punch. Especially 2-page spread at 21:05.
Holy hell Taash. Thats so much better, why did they do that? That made me a bit mad as an artist lol.
But I wonder what happened. It's not really uncommon for concept art to be shafted in actual production. Games have limits and it's hard to do your cool idea of a 100 arm Hecatoncheires character if the tech, time, and money isn't there. Guess Issabel is a clear example of that. But it seems like production shifted halfway through or maybe it was the leadership? I don't know but it seems like the "dark" part of dark fantasy scared someone and they didn't want to touch those themes too much.
I would be interested in seeing what when wrong here.
Its hard to imagine that what is shown here is pushing game limits since it seems to align with what was done in Inquisition and even Origins. Its been done before and can be done again with more resources and more time.
@@degreeskelvin3025 I mean what the company thought wasn't acceptable for the vibe they are going. If they wanted a more teen style game and didn't want any social blowback for touching sensitive subjects, then they won't. Not saying that thinking is even in line with Dragon Age as a series or how people would accept something like DAO, but it's a different company than when Origins came out. I can see a corporate guy thinking like that to max profit or a new team coming in and not liking what Dragon Age was so they want to make their own thing and the whole game seems safe. Could be a number of things really.
@dagonofthedepths yeah probably even all that put together. In the end we just didn't get what we could have cause those working on it didnt really want that. It is what it is.
You do an excellent job of detailing how the concept art we're seeing here was directly created to convey key moments that the team deemed important for the fourth installment of the series. These artworks do not exist in a vacuum, they are not simply environmental ideas or character design concepts, they are capturing consequential story scenes and through your analysis of the art we can see how the story itself was in some ways already written. Moving from piece to piece was really stimulating my imagination in ways that nothing from the fourth entry has ever done before. Appreciate the thoughtful analysis you put into this one.
In retrospect it's pretty apparent that Joplin was the sequel we were supposed to have and Veilguard is 80% Morrison with the live service removed. But personally the artbook healed some wounds for me. We didn't get the game we deserved, but at least it exists in some form.
It doesn't heal anything for me. LOL
DAV effectively destroys everything that came before it, arrogantly declaring all of the established lore moot since THIS games' version of things is far, far superior, according to new Bioware. You might be looking forward to more of this nonsense, but as far as I'm concerned, DA is DEAD! "We won't disrespect the choices made in previous games," stated John Epler. No. They'll just render all of them useless by completely destroying EVERYTHING! Have fun with this new DA. I'm finished with it.
Shout out to you for giving credit to that dude, he did an awesome job. And, just like you, he's coming from a place of appreciation for the series.
we can't have good things anymore.
Dragon Age was my adolescence.
I loved Solas in Inquisition, and just like with Origins, we don't get the continuity we deserve.
This... just hurts
But if Solas has all the elves behind him how can we get lol quirky Bellara? Thats what people really want in Dragon Age.
he doesn't have all the Elves, a majority but not all follows Solas.
No no only you want her none here want her
@@karandullet380 It's called sarcasm friend.
What was wrong with Bellara even .. what you wanted Sera back ? I think Sera was much more annoying.
@@cracmar03 Bellara's autism or w/e she had was just as bad as manic Sera. At least I could send Sera packing.
Wish I could change dimensions to one where this game actually existed. Not even Sandal appeared
Glad the algorithm brought me to your channel man great video.
I genuinely wonder if EA already had an idea for a cutesy fantasy multi-player game, then just decided to cannibalize Dragon Age 's lore and make it single-player so that they have plausible deniability.
If so they have been practising on DA since Inquisition. I do remember criticism to Inquisition for palette and colorful looks that are 'Disney shit'.
This game def needs a behind the scenes doc on just what the hell really happened during the dev cycle
this video resonated with me so hard and i agree with everything youve said. as someone who shelled out for the deluxe version of the artbook before release, another thing that hurt was after seeing how there isnt really any companion conflict in veilguard, theres a storyboard section on joplin (the internal name for this iteration of the game) where imshael as your companion was actually a double agent for solas the entire time.
would have been not only an amazing inner party conflict, but an amazing tie in after imshael recognized felassan in the masked empire novel but seemingly didnt react to solas in inquisition (and with this information, probably because imshael wants solas to win and did not want to jeopardize his chances lol).
I shouldn't have looked it, but i have been a bioware fan since 1999, i could not resist... it broke my heart 💔 corporate greed ruined this game, i am sure we will have another entry, but i am afraid it will be without Solas and with the bad quality of writing we gotta in Veilguard... 😢
Matt Rhoades is one of the few old school BW devs left, and his work has always been on point. Art in general is one of the few things they consistently do well, especially environmental art. Even in Andromeda and Anthem, these things were great. Their environments always feel good to exist in. Character art... often lacks. This isn't the first time the concept art for characters was superior to the final product, in fact I feel like that's always been the case. Their characters always get watered down to the lowest common denominators in the end.
Its the classic AAA failure that is...
"We need to appeal to a wider, more modern audience."
"What about appealing to Dragon Age fans?"
"... You're fired."
Wider audience yes, but saying "modern audience" doesn't make any sense.
We *are* the modern audience. Anybody who consumes games in 2024 is the modern audience.
I feel bad for the writers and artists. They created this incredible story and then were told by EA that they had to make a live service multiplayer game with microtransactions (based on Anthem's code). So they had to make lots of changes to the story to accomodate the new format (also why the writing is more suited to 12+ than M like previous games). :/ EA's decision was so controversial that the original director and some writers quit.
When Anthem failed, THEN the team was allowed to go back to an RPG game...but by then they lost a ton of development time. :/ I feel really bad for the writers and artists being blamed for a mid game when it was greedy executives to put everything in disarray.
geez i didn’t know the dragon age world got down like that.
Great video Slandered!
I think I’m finally over Dragon Age? Like, Veilguard just kinda ruined the whole franchise for me. That’s, of course, my subjective option, but I really did not like DA:TV. I can’t even bring myself to do another playthrough. There are a lot of games that look so much more promising, like Avowed and Exodus. I’m also excited to see what Larian will cook up next, because as far as I am concerned, they’re the top players of the industry right now.
Your Veilguard review was balanced and touched on a number of areas honestly. I am glad you took some additional time to review some other areas, such as concept art and story lines left out. Your thoughts on this are well articulated and appreciated. I and many others are asking the same questions. Not purchasing or playing until it hits the dust bin.
Taash could have been a baddie, but the blue hairs dude had this need to put nb nonsense.
She looked sexy in early arts that is not even in this art book, shame.
I really believe the people that work on this game are really not Dragon Age Fans these people are using the gaming industry to push their agenda that’s why I have major concerns for M.E.5.
I'm telling you, I've never felt so betrayed from a series like dragon age 😔
Gaider is just a great writer stray gods was so good i should have known with him working on it but i was still surprised at all the ways yiur choices affect the game
So veilguard starts what would have been the end of act 1
Act 2, actually. Solas was meant to chase the dagger with us up until showdown for 2 acts, and then he could squish you in Act 3 in your dreams if you didn't find a way to protect your mind from him.
Yeah basically it skips all the Act 1 content and gets straight to Act 2. What's interesting about that is a major complaint about Veilguard is the poor start that doesn't develop Varric or Rook.
@@SlanderedGaming yeah a lot of talk and no show, more like rook talking to their self 😂😂
For the love of .. that is exactly what I wanted. I wanted this game to lean even more to DA 2 structure. I wanted it to have few define acts across years. It would make much more sense to build relationships and dot the timeline.
Which explains why the end is so good while the rest is so weird. @@SlanderedGaming
10 thumbs up! I love your passion, you should have 100k+ subscribers. Love your channel, it is must view. Imagine what DA4 could have been if it was done similar to BG3? It had all the pieces to be truly epic. Instead, we got a cartoon game for children. And if Bioware survives, where does it go from here? It threw away all the amazing lore and the climax it was building to. It's crushing.
Thank you! My hope is that Bioware learns from the experience and that ME5 turns out to be a better game.
In my Florida Evans voice: Damn, damn, damn, DAMN!
After seeing that they had all the tools in hand to make a great follow up to Inquisition, I have no sympathy for them for how Veilguard's reception has been.
I wish some other game development studio would make DA4 again and right... But that would be probably another 5 - 10 years of waiting and also its not going to happen. T_T
This is the end...
It's sad but sometimes it's better to let go. I don't think we will have more Dragon Age.
If you haven't played Stray Gods, it is very, very good. 10 out of 10, would recommend. And double if you're a theater kid. I'm not, but I still like the music and I like the concept. Hoping for a sequel.
Really?! Wow okay I'll have to give it a whirl.
@@SlanderedGaming If you like music at all, the game is basically social roleplaying where you sing different songs to persuade people and change outcomes. Each song has three different styles depending on if you want to be "Friendly" "Aggressive" or "Manipulative." Each verse of the song, you can change the personality style based on what you're trying to say, and all the songs have many verses. Combining different personality styles gets you entirely different songs, or you can just stick to one style.
There is one set event mid game that you cannot change, and that's a little frustrating. But there's multiple potential outcomes.
So if you're okay with visual novels, it's a lot of fun and has some killer tunes that you make/discover for yourself.
I'm hoping a lot of this was due to development hell and now that bioware isn't messing around with multi-player and live service, we'll get back to things like this
yea that 40-minute video did what they manage to piece together what it could have been with Project... Joquin I think? its just... *sighs*
It's wild to see there was basically a whole game waiting to be made.
instead of targeting the developers I wish the more feral of fans, detractors , gamers, would go after the real culprit , EA
I hear what you are saying but EA weren't the ones who basically pushed David Gaider out. That's 100% on Bioware and his departure is a MASSIVE reason for the failings of Veilguard. My review 100% called out issues with EA as well.
OK MODDERS: GET THE BOOK, WRITE THE STORY, GIVE US THE GAME WE WANTED!
As a Cass/Divine romancer in DAI, the lack of the role the Divine in DATV was my top disappointment. I will say I felt the same about the DAI art book when I got it, especially with the variations of enemies that they had concepts for but never put in the game. The Venatori rode on giant scorpions in one concept! That would have been amazing, especially in the desert regions of DAI. My biggest gripe with the series still is the lack of enemy variations. DAV had a bit more than DAI, but eventually became the same hordes over and over again. The final boss fights were great though and far better than Corphyeus.
Just watched the full concept art video. Glad I skipped this game. It is kinda meta that the elves get screwed over yet again, this time by Bioware!
It makes me so mad we didn't get writing the way it should be.
Always a great day when you release a video bro.
I cant believe that the development team thought what they put out was superior option to what we saw in the art book, some of the pictures and descriptions literally made me tear up, I would have given anything to get that game instead of this.
But then again, they also thought the abhorent gross design they gave Taash was better than the one in the artbook so Im not surprised, tho its clear Taash is a completely different character here.
Soul crushing is the right way to put it. The artbook is DA at its best, Veilguard is the tiktok version.
I very much agree with you!
That vid you recommend though which goes through all the concept art is amazing, eccept for the last part where the creator dips a bit too much into biggot teritorry adressing Taash. If that part would not be there then that vid would be amazing.
This^
'Should seek medical help'
'Split personality'
Yikes thanks for the callout.
I'm really disappointed in DA: The Veilguard, but trying to play devil's advocate we need to be honest concept art never actually represents what we get on screen once games ship, especially when a project is in development for 10 years.
Some games tend to stick closer to it and for the most part are the ones with "artsy/weird" look, an example could be Disco Elysium or to use a more AAA example Dishonored (the 1st mostly).
All that said, the reason most folks prefer this concept art is because, as every concept art, it was done in pre-production which means the original team of Inquisition was still around, honestly no idea what actually happened in production (from RPG to GAAS and then to action adventur), I never had the pleasure to work on a Bioware title, but if I had to guess the game was originally supposed to be another "proper" Dragon Age and this was the concerpt art for that game, when it was forced to be a GAAS everything had to change, the target audience is different and performances need to be perfect because on top of them you';; also have possible networking issues.
There is where the new style popped up a cleaner (too much) and easier to optimize look, done by people who are used to produce such type of art.
I share your hurt.
Also, Larian just did a Larian.
with 12 more subclasses ? =D
Man I really love your reviews. You be speaking truth. Agree with all your points and I appreciate you giving your perspective as someone who actually knows and cares about the story. I didn't play much DA but you make me wanna pick up Origins again.
What kills me is THEY HAD all of this already in front of them and they did not use it! Why? Who made that decision? Did they not have the money to actually deliver the game we was in the The Art Book? Was that Joplin that we could of had? It looks like they did not want to knock down the ant hill after all. They always told us they were going to turn everything over on its head, VEILGUARD was supposed to BE THAT. They kept it as status quo.. they played it safe, they went back on what we planned and it was NOT for the better. I want the game that's in the Art Book!
Watched another video that did a breakdown of this. Its pretty frustrating and sad what we couldn't have. From what I understand. The number of sales for Veilguard were poor enough that we might not see any more Dragon Age for a long time which makes this all the more painful..
I hope we get to hear the behind the scene accounts for the development to understand how we got the game we got. Something tells me it might be like suicide squad kill the justice league or Mass Effect 4....
You can tell this bummed you out because you didn't even hold the 'f' in "fantastic day"
The more time passes, the worse it gets
I know the right thought would just be to be happy because I had the chance to play Dragon Age Origins mainly but I can't keep myself from being angry
Honestly, my biggest problem with Taash's design is the sour face they constantly pull. Literally like a petulant child who didn't get the new toy they so badly wanted. The armors and all that are alright I think, as they kinda fit the Qunari turned pirate theme.
"they" Lol, it's only one individual, a singular ugly and rude female with mental issues, that's that.
Yes! I felt so frustrated that they scraped like 2/3 of original Joplin game that had a lot of right vibe and potential, and the remaining 1/3 - the dreams, encounters with Solas - were the most superb things about otherwise pretty mid (if discounting offensive treatment of DA lore and previous choices and morally grey characters and factions) game Veilguard turned out.
Yeah it's frustrating to see.
Man I know you don’t stand jerks and assholes but this game designers have gone too far with they shitty ideologies that no one cares about … I want the Dragon Age not the silly crying baby DA … I want a game
the qunari look so much cooler in their art lol
One of this games biggest problem is easily it’s wasted potential. Imagine what you did at the ritual determined which gods were released, and your previous choices determined some of their tactics and successes, including Solas. Perhaps Andruil goes after the Dalish and City elves, and solas fights a propaganda war for their support, or Briala being behind the throne slows her reach somewhat in the cities. Falon’din gains support from the mortalitassi, or dirthamen the mages depending on how the Mage/Templar war ended, and who the new divine is. June maybe uses new eluvians to gain an edge, or Ghillanain manipulates the wardens, darkspawn and wild creatures she made to make an army of monsters? What if the worst made choice led to half the pantheon being released, or just Elgar’nan but make him so much more horrifying than any of the others?
They had origins bought back in the least interesting way as well. What if you started as an elf in Solas’s forces or even an ancient elf like Abelas? A mage in the Tevinter elite, like the noble in origins but reversed, where you could become archon or reform the magisters yourself? A Dwarf like the ones in the Descent DLC? A Qunari deployed to Tevinter as a warrior spy? This game easily had more possibilities than any other dragon age game, and we barely got any of it.
And even ignoring that, there’s so much. Vivienne being elected divine should send shockwaves as far as Tevinter, so should Leliana dissolving the circles. The Architect being alive, discovering the truth of the Tevinter gods and blight. What about Urthemiels soul in Kieran? And especially the Orlessian throne and civil war. It’s heavily implied certain choices would lead to civil war starting again, especially with the three way truce. That should have been a big deal!
The concepts are so beautiful and epic! I hate hearing all the wasted ideas and potential they ignored, but all that and then axeing Calpernia as a companion will always cut me bad. It really hurts to see how much they cut the story down. It would have been amazing to see.
I just feel the game treats you like a little kid in a safe space while blowing enemies up in red fog clouds. It’s really strange what they were trying to pull off.
Doesn’t anyone else find it rather disturbing that they went with a very child friendly art style in a game that has so many references to sex?
The people who greenlit the version of the Veilguard we got effectively spelled the end of Bioware because people now know they'll treat Mass Effect with the same level of care.
I don't agree. Still holding out hope that ME5 will be fantastic and that we'll get another DA game.
@@SlanderedGaming, I hope you're right, but I think this studio will need to change things up a lot to make that happen. The last three games all moved away from branching stories and role-playing to varying degrees. They need to realize that this is what made the studio valuable to begin with.
THANK YOU.
I'm done with Bioware now. My sights are on the Exodus game were some of the old bioware devs went. That games universe is shaping up nicely.
I had to quit the video. My anger at a studio bastardizing a franchise this badly is overwhelming. Dragon Age was amazing. I cannot stand what they turned a lot of this into. Bad writing decisions and generic plot devices-this is not the Dragon Age I loved, it's a crippled figment and I am not going to support it with my money. I genuinely do not understand how you can mess up this badly as a team when everything is handed to you. Maybe it was EA interference, I don't know.
Slandered, I recently discovered your channel, and you're already probably one of my favorites to follow. I really like how passionate you are about the series and like you, I started DAO the day it was released. Your reviews and going over the lore has been a fun way to reconnect with the series (after Trespasser and the DAV development hell, I admittedly stepped away for a long time). Thank you for your honest reviews and I look forward to more. :)
Thanks glad you are enjoying it!
while i sympathize with the devs who have been on socials clarifying that concept art is brainstorming and often includes things that could never have feasibly been implemented (especially with too man branching world states combined with development with rocky as veilguard's), i think the art book demonstrates where the current story was reduced from earlier plot concepts WITHOUT the elements that supported them in the original concept. kal-sharok is a great example (got downsized from a faction to just the setting for harding's quest), but another is the lords of fortune. the faction in-game feel out of place (little pc reactivity, their hub isn't even integrated into the map, half their codexes and plots are just about the antaam/qunari) but the original plot was incredibly focused on ships and sea travel across thedas! a pirate faction would have made much more sense in that context. but as things got cut down, they clearly merged what they had for isabela and the pirates and the qunari down into one somewhat lackluster faction.
sure, probably a lot of the art book would never have been implementable in even an ideal development. but the finished product was clearly a race to the finish line trying to figure out how much of joplin could make it into the game. and it's very telling that in the original plot concept, interrupting solas's ritual was the MIDDLE of the game, not the beginning...
let me preface this by saying i've sunk 90+ hours into a completionist playthrough and i did have fun with the game. the crux of this issue i have is the shallowness of the narrative. there is no nuance: all your friends are 100% correct always, and you are 100% correct always, and everybody else is just there to cheer you on. the inquisitor is a just a faceless empty shirt, colorless and boring, morrigan has been turned into a sweet mother figure and varric is just absent. game has been criticised for being woke, but i'm gonna say, game is not woke "enough". everyone is just offering vapid talking points, where they are ontificating on what the right thing to do or say is. and even though they situations can sometimes be rather dark or serious, the "right thing to do" is always 100% the right thing to do. or when it's not, it's like "whatever man", not a serious decision with compromise and sacrifice. dragon age is supposed to put you in serious moral quandaries about what is right and wrong and how much you can justify your means by your ends. this game offerred none of that. the exclusion of any discussion for the racial and class oppression the elves faced is a symptom of this disney-fication. solas is not a revoloutionary who had to make harsh decision, he's just "in love". the romantic nuance would have been fine, but it is sad that this is the only aspect explored in the game
I agree concept art is amazing and so was the arc of elves and even sentinels siding with Solas. this game missed the involvement of more players, Solas agents, other elves and sentinels, spies from all sides, other agents of Inquisition, etc.. it felt a bit empty on npcs and player involved in stopping him. and can we talk about how amazing Arlathan Forest looks in that first concept art? it looks thick and dark and ominous, more like it was described in book and short story.