Sometimes it's easier to help someone else than yourself - I see a few things you do that I also struggle with lol. I main adc, would be down to chat on ways to improve or duo sometime.
I bet it's super useful since they the bot lane has to work together, and if you wanna chat or critique/give some pointers feel free i don't mind. I'd love to know the point of view from an adc is especially in tricky spots like this.
@@RentsLeague So I only peaked like plat 2 and am in silver rn after trying a new role and taking a 6 month break, so maybe don't take what I'm saying as gospel and I'm missing a bit of context because of the cuts, and I'm gonna make a few assumptions cause I don't know your thought process, but: [0:46] 5:14 in game: Looks like you're trying to pull the wave for your adc, so it won't crash into tower. I think you just got a bit too greedy here and didn't respect the fact that they can kill you here. A safer more consistent play is to just let it crash. Especially if your adc is already there in lane, you're not saving him any minions by pulling. Maybe if you were playing a different support with either some tank stats or healing this is a better option, but as Zyra you can't really do this here. [1:04] 7:50 in game, not enough context to comment [1:15] 9:45 in game, using flash around objectives is good, but maybe needs to be a bit more mindful of how you're using it. So technically: Your team got the dragon, you don't need to fight here. Technically the correct play in low elo solo queue, is to abandon your team here, save your flash and just leave once you see you got the drag. I think most people know this, myself included, but then we go "well they couldn't contest drag, they must be trolling by trying to fight here" and we engage a bad, or more accurately coinflip fight. A more consistent way to win games is to literally abandon your team here. I'll assume this is for fun, because I still have more to add on this fight. I see that you're in bronze, have only been playing since S12, so I'll assume you're still learning what some of the roster does, especially non support less popular champions. You probably just weren't sure if Elise used repel, but generally it's a good idea to save your spells, especially cc spells, until the enemy uses their movement abilities. Additionally you flash into your team, but lux and Elise both primarily do AOE damage, so you're making it easier for them to get more dps off. As Zyra you're really squishy, so I think playing like an adc is helpful - you should care about your life the most, don't play to save your team or adc, don't be afraid to take the kills either, you scale really well with gold. The flash was not only bad positioning, but you also ignored the lux who just sat there and got free damage on to your team. The ult was decent, but could have been delayed until after Elise used repel. TL;DR Dragon fight - save your flash, especially when playing against like talon and other assassins when playing a squishy support [1:34] 11:44 in game, that lux is kinda crazy wtf she doin I do notice that you have gotten at least T1 of your support item and still have stealth ward, remember to get sweepers at least once it finishes, you can get it before depending on the match ups, if denying vision is more important than getting vision. [1:55] 12:05 in game, cool double kill, I think we can push the wave in and recall here [2:02] 12:48 in game, wow a whole minute has passed? surely we don't take that long to push the wave. All jokes aside here, you and your adc are being greedy for plates, just leave him. It's easy to say "Look at your map here" but I think just going for plates here is greedy when you're low mana/health and just got a double kill for your lane. This is a tough situation though, because talon should be helping contest rift/grubs but he's choosing to be greedy and kill you instead of get obj for his team, but that's only something you can get away with in a higher elo when people are playing more standard. But also consider, you get those kills, immediately recall and walk top to help with grubs. If your adc complains on where you are, as you get better with roaming they won't even miss you, you can also type and tell him you're leaving, and if he's decent he'll play safe. Even if he doesn't play safe and gives a kill to talon, you're likely hood of winning goes up if you consistently don't greed for plates and go help secure top side grubs. [2:38] 14:20 in game: This is a good go at getting vision you just played this mechanically bad. Remember save your CC for after they use movement abilities. You get caught in a bad spot because your CC is on cooldown while Elise is chasing you [2:43] tbh this is just bad pathing, you know talon is dead, so you can go through river to get to tower safely, or just take the new path straight to tower, not the path with the bush. Maybe you thought you could kill her here, which you were close, but also missed your first round of abilities, so you should be playing to stall and stay out of range until those come off Cooldown. Your team ends up with the kill, but now your flash is on CD for this next play [3:05] 17:34 in game, I hate this champion, Camille is so broken, please remove her riot. If the Camille is really good, they will use their ult to dodge, either your CC, which is on CD after she jumps the wall, or your ult. So, especially since you have YI here, you should save your ult for after she ults. Your ult radius is 500 units, and Camille's is 425, so if she ults and doesn't want to get hit, she has to leave her ult, which will help either you or yi, whoever she decides to use it on. Something else to note: Technically Talon and Caitlyn being mid is suboptimal. Someone should be pushing that bot lane. It took me a long time to get over this mindset of "Talon should be bot, why is he here, why isn't my team punishing his mispositioning after he killed me". The way you punish his mis positioning, is by not dying, and not taking risks. Until you see Talon on the map, he could be anywhere. This could have been Talon you saw in the jg, not Camille. This is another thing I struggle with: When I'm fed, my goal should be to not die, and take up as much of the enemies time as I can. This isn't the only time we should have this goal, and this fight with Camille is a good example. Your Mordekeiser is doing the right thing by pushing bot, Talon should be matching him, or someone should, but they're not. If your and your team just play safe, clear waves, maybe even give up rift: You will be in an even, or potentially better position. Your team is getting more xp on the map because you're covering all 3 lanes, while their team is not. This is how you punish talon for being mid, it's by not doing anything and letting your mord get bot tower. This is a hard concept to grasp, and perform consistently that I'm currently working on as one of my main goals right now. We're only 3 minutes into the video and there's so much to talk about so I'm gonna stop here, but if you want to chat more I'll leave my discord: @devilishtruthstare
Part 2: I didn't put a lot of editing into these comments, so feel free to ask for clarification, or challenge anything and I can go more into detail on my thought process [3:34] 20:10 in game. Nice flash E attempt, you missed, no other CC, the play is dead here at least you got his flash in return. Should make an upcoming objective fight safer/easier. the safer/more consistent play is to save your flash, I think you can get the same outcome without using it. [4:20] 22:01 in game; Your varus is trolling, why is he dying with ult up, you should have taken more kills earlier in the game. There's not enough context, but for some reason your team is facechecking a bush when you your CC ability is on Cooldown, ping them back and ping your ability. They're griefing here, the only thing you can do is not grief with them. Legit, go push top or something in this situation. Oh I just realized your YI is dead, yeah you're trolling even being near dragon here. Get vision top side, ping to invade red, push out mid, doing anything is better than being here right now. You gotta let your team die here and get map pressure, XP, and gold for yourself. You can't force your team to get off dragon, but you can not waste your time with them [4:58] it looks like you are legitimately unsure of how Talon wall jump works - It has a less than one second cool down on the ability, but each wall has it's own cool down that is longer. He can't jump over the same wall (portion of wall in some cases) in a short time period. Similar to Yasuo E with minions. [5:03] you could be aiming your skill shots better, you seem to be throwing them where the enemies were, not where they're going. Other than that, you did the best you could here, you didn't die with the team, and you can't control their actions. [5:24] 25:09 in game. Using abilities on the wave as support is a little grief. If you have a reasoning behind it I could accept it - you're close to an item so you want the gold, they have an inhib so you are needed to clear it fast, your team is not nearby to immediately clear it. But here it just looks like you weren't thinking and tried to take the wave. I could go into more detail, but it's hard to organize my thoughts on this right now. Yeah you die before your E comes off cooldown from hitting the wave. [6:17] 26:12 in game "Apparently they know where the heck we are by the way, even over the wall" You still have not gotten sweepers. Ok you call it radar, but yeah get that earlier, it should be default first or second back to get it. [6:24] 26:51 in game, I think your just out of position here. I get trying to catch bot with adc, but technically you need to let talon push the wave and you group with your team mid to fight drag. Talon can either take inhib leaving 17+ kills out of the fight, or he can rotate. There's a lot more to talk about if this happens, but at a baseline you need to make him make the decision. Instead you walk towards him, not making think about it, he just goes in and kills you. Removing you from the fight, and it uses Yone's ult. [6:34] 27:02 in game tbh, You are 100% dead to the bleed, but you can live longer if you walk out of his auto range and dodge the second part of Q. Varus managed to root him, so he can't chase. I think if you walk out of his auto range you have more time to get your abilities off before you die, which might let varus kill him in return. Yone's there so it doesn't really matter, you die either way, and your team gets the kill either way, but remembering this can help you in future similar scenarios. If you go mid, instead of bot, Camille can't just take inhib there. Sure it let's talon do it instead, but he wants to push the wave and then catch someone in the jg, and you choosing to go there gave him exactly what he wanted.
I gotta say i did not expect such a detailed and critical reply, which I think you for putting this much effort into, cause I'm just learning down here but it's much appreciated. I will say these were from my promo games a while back when I was still quite a bit rusty, but you were most certainly right on most of these points.
It's n Because assassin's are the role in the lore that should be the people that are the mostly skilled people that trained their ENTIRE life to get to those skills but in game a rengar one shots you in 0.5s with ONE button
Man I laughed to death watching it but I know that it's not easy to play against fed assassins. I am a Zyra main. Master's League in Chinese server. There are definitely ways you can improve in your gameplay and I would love to help you if we were friends or neighbors or something. Haha
Glad to hear a zyra main stopped by. Thank you, and help is much appreciated if you had any tips for me feel free to drop em down here if you wanted too
Sick edits man tough game to play as Zyra
I appreciate that so much man, Thank you for dropping by:))
@ anytime man anytime
10 games and %20 wr is wild
It is Absolutly wild. :0
Sometimes it's easier to help someone else than yourself - I see a few things you do that I also struggle with lol. I main adc, would be down to chat on ways to improve or duo sometime.
I bet it's super useful since they the bot lane has to work together, and if you wanna chat or critique/give some pointers feel free i don't mind. I'd love to know the point of view from an adc is especially in tricky spots like this.
@@RentsLeague So I only peaked like plat 2 and am in silver rn after trying a new role and taking a 6 month break, so maybe don't take what I'm saying as gospel and I'm missing a bit of context because of the cuts, and I'm gonna make a few assumptions cause I don't know your thought process, but:
[0:46] 5:14 in game: Looks like you're trying to pull the wave for your adc, so it won't crash into tower. I think you just got a bit too greedy here and didn't respect the fact that they can kill you here. A safer more consistent play is to just let it crash. Especially if your adc is already there in lane, you're not saving him any minions by pulling. Maybe if you were playing a different support with either some tank stats or healing this is a better option, but as Zyra you can't really do this here.
[1:04] 7:50 in game, not enough context to comment
[1:15] 9:45 in game, using flash around objectives is good, but maybe needs to be a bit more mindful of how you're using it.
So technically: Your team got the dragon, you don't need to fight here. Technically the correct play in low elo solo queue, is to abandon your team here, save your flash and just leave once you see you got the drag. I think most people know this, myself included, but then we go "well they couldn't contest drag, they must be trolling by trying to fight here" and we engage a bad, or more accurately coinflip fight. A more consistent way to win games is to literally abandon your team here. I'll assume this is for fun, because I still have more to add on this fight.
I see that you're in bronze, have only been playing since S12, so I'll assume you're still learning what some of the roster does, especially non support less popular champions.
You probably just weren't sure if Elise used repel, but generally it's a good idea to save your spells, especially cc spells, until the enemy uses their movement abilities.
Additionally you flash into your team, but lux and Elise both primarily do AOE damage, so you're making it easier for them to get more dps off.
As Zyra you're really squishy, so I think playing like an adc is helpful - you should care about your life the most, don't play to save your team or adc, don't be afraid to take the kills either, you scale really well with gold. The flash was not only bad positioning, but you also ignored the lux who just sat there and got free damage on to your team.
The ult was decent, but could have been delayed until after Elise used repel.
TL;DR Dragon fight - save your flash, especially when playing against like talon and other assassins when playing a squishy support
[1:34] 11:44 in game, that lux is kinda crazy wtf she doin
I do notice that you have gotten at least T1 of your support item and still have stealth ward, remember to get sweepers at least once it finishes, you can get it before depending on the match ups, if denying vision is more important than getting vision.
[1:55] 12:05 in game, cool double kill, I think we can push the wave in and recall here
[2:02] 12:48 in game, wow a whole minute has passed? surely we don't take that long to push the wave.
All jokes aside here, you and your adc are being greedy for plates, just leave him. It's easy to say "Look at your map here" but I think just going for plates here is greedy when you're low mana/health and just got a double kill for your lane. This is a tough situation though, because talon should be helping contest rift/grubs but he's choosing to be greedy and kill you instead of get obj for his team, but that's only something you can get away with in a higher elo when people are playing more standard.
But also consider, you get those kills, immediately recall and walk top to help with grubs. If your adc complains on where you are, as you get better with roaming they won't even miss you, you can also type and tell him you're leaving, and if he's decent he'll play safe. Even if he doesn't play safe and gives a kill to talon, you're likely hood of winning goes up if you consistently don't greed for plates and go help secure top side grubs.
[2:38] 14:20 in game: This is a good go at getting vision you just played this mechanically bad. Remember save your CC for after they use movement abilities. You get caught in a bad spot because your CC is on cooldown while Elise is chasing you
[2:43] tbh this is just bad pathing, you know talon is dead, so you can go through river to get to tower safely, or just take the new path straight to tower, not the path with the bush. Maybe you thought you could kill her here, which you were close, but also missed your first round of abilities, so you should be playing to stall and stay out of range until those come off Cooldown. Your team ends up with the kill, but now your flash is on CD for this next play
[3:05] 17:34 in game, I hate this champion, Camille is so broken, please remove her riot.
If the Camille is really good, they will use their ult to dodge, either your CC, which is on CD after she jumps the wall, or your ult. So, especially since you have YI here, you should save your ult for after she ults. Your ult radius is 500 units, and Camille's is 425, so if she ults and doesn't want to get hit, she has to leave her ult, which will help either you or yi, whoever she decides to use it on.
Something else to note: Technically Talon and Caitlyn being mid is suboptimal. Someone should be pushing that bot lane. It took me a long time to get over this mindset of "Talon should be bot, why is he here, why isn't my team punishing his mispositioning after he killed me". The way you punish his mis positioning, is by not dying, and not taking risks. Until you see Talon on the map, he could be anywhere. This could have been Talon you saw in the jg, not Camille.
This is another thing I struggle with: When I'm fed, my goal should be to not die, and take up as much of the enemies time as I can. This isn't the only time we should have this goal, and this fight with Camille is a good example. Your Mordekeiser is doing the right thing by pushing bot, Talon should be matching him, or someone should, but they're not. If your and your team just play safe, clear waves, maybe even give up rift: You will be in an even, or potentially better position. Your team is getting more xp on the map because you're covering all 3 lanes, while their team is not. This is how you punish talon for being mid, it's by not doing anything and letting your mord get bot tower. This is a hard concept to grasp, and perform consistently that I'm currently working on as one of my main goals right now.
We're only 3 minutes into the video and there's so much to talk about so I'm gonna stop here, but if you want to chat more I'll leave my discord: @devilishtruthstare
Part 2: I didn't put a lot of editing into these comments, so feel free to ask for clarification, or challenge anything and I can go more into detail on my thought process
[3:34] 20:10 in game. Nice flash E attempt, you missed, no other CC, the play is dead here at least you got his flash in return. Should make an upcoming objective fight safer/easier. the safer/more consistent play is to save your flash, I think you can get the same outcome without using it.
[4:20] 22:01 in game; Your varus is trolling, why is he dying with ult up, you should have taken more kills earlier in the game. There's not enough context, but for some reason your team is facechecking a bush when you your CC ability is on Cooldown, ping them back and ping your ability. They're griefing here, the only thing you can do is not grief with them. Legit, go push top or something in this situation.
Oh I just realized your YI is dead, yeah you're trolling even being near dragon here. Get vision top side, ping to invade red, push out mid, doing anything is better than being here right now. You gotta let your team die here and get map pressure, XP, and gold for yourself. You can't force your team to get off dragon, but you can not waste your time with them
[4:58] it looks like you are legitimately unsure of how Talon wall jump works - It has a less than one second cool down on the ability, but each wall has it's own cool down that is longer. He can't jump over the same wall (portion of wall in some cases) in a short time period. Similar to Yasuo E with minions.
[5:03] you could be aiming your skill shots better, you seem to be throwing them where the enemies were, not where they're going. Other than that, you did the best you could here, you didn't die with the team, and you can't control their actions.
[5:24] 25:09 in game. Using abilities on the wave as support is a little grief. If you have a reasoning behind it I could accept it - you're close to an item so you want the gold, they have an inhib so you are needed to clear it fast, your team is not nearby to immediately clear it. But here it just looks like you weren't thinking and tried to take the wave. I could go into more detail, but it's hard to organize my thoughts on this right now.
Yeah you die before your E comes off cooldown from hitting the wave.
[6:17] 26:12 in game "Apparently they know where the heck we are by the way, even over the wall" You still have not gotten sweepers.
Ok you call it radar, but yeah get that earlier, it should be default first or second back to get it.
[6:24] 26:51 in game, I think your just out of position here. I get trying to catch bot with adc, but technically you need to let talon push the wave and you group with your team mid to fight drag. Talon can either take inhib leaving 17+ kills out of the fight, or he can rotate. There's a lot more to talk about if this happens, but at a baseline you need to make him make the decision. Instead you walk towards him, not making think about it, he just goes in and kills you. Removing you from the fight, and it uses Yone's ult.
[6:34] 27:02 in game tbh, You are 100% dead to the bleed, but you can live longer if you walk out of his auto range and dodge the second part of Q. Varus managed to root him, so he can't chase. I think if you walk out of his auto range you have more time to get your abilities off before you die, which might let varus kill him in return.
Yone's there so it doesn't really matter, you die either way, and your team gets the kill either way, but remembering this can help you in future similar scenarios.
If you go mid, instead of bot, Camille can't just take inhib there. Sure it let's talon do it instead, but he wants to push the wave and then catch someone in the jg, and you choosing to go there gave him exactly what he wanted.
I gotta say i did not expect such a detailed and critical reply, which I think you for putting this much effort into, cause I'm just learning down here but it's much appreciated. I will say these were from my promo games a while back when I was still quite a bit rusty, but you were most certainly right on most of these points.
tip buy zhonias hourglass against assassins, it makes it hard to kill youi
Ay thank you for the tip, I'll get one quicker next time...
It's n
Because assassin's are the role in the lore that should be the people that are the mostly skilled people that trained their ENTIRE life to get to those skills but in game a rengar one shots you in 0.5s with ONE button
Once they get on a roll it's just too easy... but I should have armoured up a bit to help.
Man I laughed to death watching it but I know that it's not easy to play against fed assassins. I am a Zyra main. Master's League in Chinese server. There are definitely ways you can improve in your gameplay and I would love to help you if we were friends or neighbors or something. Haha
which chinese server do you play on
@mrzimcrnnce2599 Ionian Chinese server
Glad to hear a zyra main stopped by. Thank you, and help is much appreciated if you had any tips for me feel free to drop em down here if you wanted too
@@alexgordon850你住在中国吗？
@@mrzimcrnnce2599 是的
I hate the assasin can do what he wants meta
They aren't making it easy to win, but who know mabey the next meta will for for us.