You're right. This is definitely a "Let's see that in writing with Hasbro/WoTc signing the dotted line" scenario. Also, I still haven't seen where the OGL 1.0a was definitively made irrevocable, but then I'm not a lawyer, either. I saw that the SRD and Creative Commons were integrated and the OGL 1.0a is being left in place(for now) but weasel words and all that.
Loved your advice for getting D&D 5E kitties off of 5E and I agree with all of it. As a D&D 5E kitty myself, I've actually got to thank WoTC for the OGL debacle, as I've looked at other games. One of those games that I've looked at recently is Five Torches Deep, and it's a game that bridges the gap between 5E and the OSR. It's mostly backwards compatible with 5E and older D&D games. I'm in love with 5TD, and will try to ease my players over to that game instead. Characters only go to level 9, they're not god-killing entities, but instead well-abled mercenaries.
Refusing to leave D&D is a thing that has been around for decades. I remember when I started in 1981...it was ten years before I was willing to try another game. Only then did I realize what I was missing! So glad you are finding a wealth of new games.
@@erc1971erc1971 I'm a little surprised it took that long. We had an advantage back in the olden times. We played in game stores, so we were routinely exposed to new games whether we wanted to or not.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 I was in middle and high school back then, so I just played with my small group of friends. When I turned 18 and joined the military I got exposed to many other games, and I am glad I did.
Addendum: I've taken the time to look over 5TD. These are some first class rules. I can see why WotC hates 3rd party publishers, so much. It must be terribly frustrating to have thousands of people on the payroll struggling to create content that's not even half as good as the stuff individuals and small companies are cranking out a hundred times faster.
I would love to see them put out the rest of the editions as creative commons, since surely that is within their ability? That would be a huge step forward that I think would bring them a large deal of good faith.
I suppose that would be nice, but it really would just be another empty gesture. They're just giving you something you already have. All the older editions already exist as retroclones precisely because rules cannot be copywrited.
There would be a certain schadenfreude to seeing Cynthia Williams floating to the ground on her golden parachute, but it wouldn't really change a thing.
Regarding D&DBeyond's TOS: It already says your homebrew you've created belongs to them. And you're absolutely right that 6th edition being an over-monetized-hellscape, it's coming.
They need to add Irrevocable to the OGL 1.0a! My favorite games: 1-Cypher, 2-Teenagers From Outer Space, 3-Gamma World 4E(not based on D&D 4E), 4-All Flesh Must be Eaten, 5-Battlelords of the 23rd Century, 6-Pathfinder 1E, 7-5E, 8-Palladium system, 9-AD&D, 10-Shadow of the Demon Lord and 11-Star Frontiers Gamma World 4E(pink book) is my favorite version of Gamma World! I love Twilight 2000, it is a fun game! (you were part of the last major push of the war, and the armies wore themselves out
I haven't played a lot of Palladium. I've read the Palladium Fantasy RPG and watched a game of rifts. Both look like solid rule sets. I did play a short Teenaged Mutant Ninja Turtles campaign in college. That was a damned blast!
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 I honestly don’t have a lot of play experience, but it was the system I owned the most of. And I was dumb and got rid of it so I’m now rebuilding my collection. Luckily many of the books haven’t changed in over 20 years…
Well said. Though I will say one thing I think is significant--and that's how they put the full 5.1SRD under a very open creative commons license. That can never be pulled back--it's three hairs away from being public domain. If if they want to get my full good will, they should do SRDs for everything going all the way back to Chainmail. Do we need them---not at all. Based on yours and a few other recommendations, I've got Castles and Crusades on order. I've still got all my old D&D books and modules and Dragon magazines from back in the 1980s. (I may have started a little later than you. but I rolled my first dice in 82 at a boy scout summer camp, setting in motion a life-long passion.) I've recently pulled them out of storage and have started running again after many many years where life just didn't allow me to run and play. But as you get older, you realize you might as well do the things that really bring you joy.
@@GeminiLibra73 Another idea is stop being the forever DM---Let someone else run for a little while with a whole different game system. Talk with your players adn see what other genres they might be interested in? Someone might by GURPS someone might by Star Wars, or a science fiction world more like BSG. I agree with branching out. Or you could go cold war and play something along the lines of Mission Impossible, James Bond, Man from Uncle type of game. There's a lot of great movies and shows about this genre.
@@andrewlustfield6079 Thanks for watching! I'm not really impressed about WotC putting their 5E SRD on creative commons. It's not like they're giving us anything we don't already have. WotC will never get my, "full good will." They never had it, and they never will. I've climbed high enough up the corporate ladder to know that NO billion dollar multinational corporation deserves anything even approaching "good will," much less, "trust." As for giving up my DM chair... I shared the load for many years. Truth be told, after a while, I just got tired of playing. I'm not a forever DM because I have to be, now. I'm a forever DM because I choose to be.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 Fair enough. Just so you know, just because they have my good will, (meaning I do want D&D to succeed) that doesn't mean I give them my wallet. I stopped buying D&D when 3rd ed came out. I wasn't impressed with the direction and feel the game was going. At my table, I try to develop a live action feel, (LOTR, Game of Thrones, Thirteenth Warrior). To me, third ed felt like it was moving in the direction of video games and anime, with lots of cool, nifty moves that could never happen outside a cartoon. If that's your jam, by all means play that. I like something more grounded, which is why I'm excited about getting my shipment of Castles and Crusades. You and a few others on youtube sold me on that one, so I'm looking forward to giving it a try.
Time will tell. But they could have given us what we ACTUALLY asked for: OGL 1.0b, exactly like 1.0a with the word irrevocable added. They VERY deliberately didn't do that, so yeah. I think it's inevitable that they'll come for it again.
I love RPG's. Played D&D, Gurps, Rolemaster, Cyberpunk, Pallaidium's Rifts, Shadow run, Vampire the masquerade, Metascape, Twilight 2000, Firefly, Alternity, TMNT, etc.. and I've had a blast playing them all.
They tried it once, they will try again. Although I stopped playing D&D years ago for another system I agree totally that we are in this together. I love our community and hobby so much.
Alright. Subbed. I love the bit you try and convince players to GM from time to time. It really would make it easier for everyone all around to improve their love for the hobby.
@Grumpy Old Grognard Oh no. I completely agree. I think I enjoy it more than being a player, though I do kinda wish I could play as a PC in a high level campaign.
seeing this whole WotC OGL debacle from overseas here in Germany, i am realizing again and again, how fortunate we Europeans where ( and are ) with D&D never getting more than 40% control of the ttrpg market. D&D ( red box ) was my first ttrpg, back in the early 80's but quickly got challenged by DSA ( The Dark Eye ). Midgard ( another German one ) and MERS. Now i am in a group, my firends and i built 28 years ago ( still going strong with 40+ sunday playing sessions / year ). We are 7 guys, with 4 of us rotating in the game master seat, each one with different systems. So we switch after each campaign. For example, after tomorrows ending of our D&D 5e campaign ( funny enough a 3pp one - Odyssey of the Dragon Lords ) i will take up the reigns with a Splittermond campaign( its in the line of The Dark Eye, but with more high fantasy stuff and a unique initiative system, but unfortunately no English version yet ) We are switching to Call of Cuthulu then and after that i guess our Pathfinder will introduce us to 2e. So my advice to all the regular groups out there: switching GM's and with it systems, will get you so much more content. Over the years, i played as a Psyker, Juggler, a little girl with nerdy glasses, a stuffed vulture, a Techno-Mage, a Paladin of a God of Death, an Orc archer with magic in abundance, a bio-engineered angel, a bear-human hybrid healer, a mad sientist, an usuran shapeshifter-mage, an elementalist cleric, a cyberweapon-smith, once even a fragence of death and decay ( jup, that was a smelly one )and the list goes on and on.... my point? don't limit yourself, when there is an abundance of different systems, settings and ways to play... D&D for me is mostly a combat simulator, but for roleplaying there are much better systems out there, you only have to look out for them. greetings from Germany P.S. Call of Cuthulu should have been the system in "Stranger Things" with its horror setting, not D&D, but i guess WotC paid handsomely
Yeah, I too went and bought POD of Second Edition books, and shot a tweet to WotC before doing so, telling them I was doing it as goodwill for their actions and that I wasn't closing my eyes to their past actions. Sixth edition means nothing to me. I've been done with buying 5e since, I think Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes. I walked over to my book case today, as I described to my 5E players the small, black form that wrapped around one of their faces, I pulled my Monster Manual II (1E) off the shelf and began describing the issues they were having with a Executioner's Hood, on the fly, converting it from 1E to 5E from the hip. We have too much to work with from the past to be beholden to this present company.
46 years GMing for me. I have always played a lot of games. I have forgotten how many over the years. Right now I am currently running or playing games using Traveller (both Mongoose and Classic), Hero System, Savage Worlds, Barbarians of Lemuria, PF2, Harnmaster, 1e AD&D, 1e Oriental Adventures and Cyperpunk Red. If I go back a year or two add Kult, StarMaster and 5e DnD. Variety is the spice of life.
Enjoyable and valuable video. "The problem is Modern rules that aren't good." My experience playing and DMing 5e is that invariably "I end up playing a boring game". You mentioned reasons why it's boring from the DM's point of view, but it is as bad or worse from the player's perspective. Why, because it takes so long between taking my turn to roll dice. There is very little reason to even pay attention while it isn't my turn as I have few "reaction" opportunities and teamwork between PCs is not really supported by the game. And I rarely feel pressed because the baddies die in one or two rounds, PCs don't die, there is little reason to not kill everything and leveling up occurs when the DMs feels like it, so our decisions seem meaningless. Play something else. Sounds like good advice to me.
You've done a great job summarizing some of 5E's problems. Thers's a lot more, of course, but that would be a whole video in itself, and one I really don't think needs to be made.
"Fled the field"? I think rather a Tactical Withdrawal, back under a rock and into the shadows, for now. But good to celebrate a small win none the less.
😊👍 I agree. We only won on major battle. But thier is more battles and most likely not soon. Wizards of the coast will wait for when they think everyone forgot or when they have to begin the next attack.
Great video. I'm going to buy the Starter Set and some other books from Troll Lord Games for the Castles and Crusades ruleset, whatever I can afford - I looked at the free PDF for the entire Player's Handbook and it won me over. I won't be able to afford it for a month or so (shipping costs to Australia are pretty horrendous nowadays), but it will be my new system of choice. I don't have OSRIC yet (but have a lot of the original 1st and 2nd Edition AD&D books), OSE, Swords & Wizardry (great system, have played it a lot recently), and Labyrinth Lord Advanced. I also have most of Pathfinder 1st Edition and about the first year of releases for Pathfinder 2nd Edition. I've put all of my 5E Books into storage (including a lot of Kickstarter books). Won't be using them for the foreseeable future. Cheers!
That's great! So... Trade secret... Most of your old 1E and 2E materials are compatible with C&C with almost no conversion. All you need to do is convert the critters to ascending AC (easy enough to do on the fly), and you'll find a 1E or 2E module/encounter shockingly well balanced for C&C.
I'm certain that's true. Cynthia Williams is trying to prove to investors that D&D is a "lifestyle brand." A movie flop right now would shake investor confidence. If she wasn't a complete idiot she would have given the entire farm to the Critical Role crew and hitched her cart to them. Instead, she pissed them off. How do these idiots get paid so much?
This isn't the Gates of Morannon, this isn't even Pellenor Fields this is the Battle of the Last Alliance with Hasbro as Sauron and we all know what happened after that.
I am the grumpy old grognard. 'Bout all there is to that. As to the Algorithm? I doubt even a Google engineer could answer that one. ALL HAIL THE ALGORITHM! (Probably best not to piss it off...)
Best part of the whole thing was one of their investors coming out on Twitter and verbally burying the people running the company, I've never seen that before in my life and it was absolutely hilarious. I also pointed out as much as I could to others that they definitely are going to try this again, their new OGL will still happen and it'll be for 6th edition and their Virtual Tabletop scam. Then they can quietly drop support for 5th edition and hope treating it like a legacy product will choke out all the third-parties still wanting to publish under the OGL 1.0a. It's the only move they have and it more or less hinges on people dropping their guard between then and now of which many probably will.
Like many, the OGL debacle has made me look harder at the flaws of 5ED&D. ... I have a feeling your gonna think this is the wrong direction, but I'm falling in love with Pathfinder 2E! (both from a player and GM perspective.) ... I also want to try Savage Worlds too, thanks to my GM.
Our group plays a large variety of games. What we don’t play is D&D 5E, or any other edition WotC has put out. Had one player once who was trying to get us to try it. Told him if he wants to play 5E, find another group cause I had no interest in it.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 I’m in pretty much the same boat lol. We got the 3e books on the release dates, along with the little conversion booklet for making the change from ad&d 2e. We played a bit, didnt like it, went back to 2e and have continued to play it since. Tried 5e with my nephew and some of his friends and didnt like it either. None of WotC’s editions feel like d&d to me. Its another game with the d&d title. While I got my start with ad&d 2e (1990) I have played BECMI a bit, and I enjoy that too
Completely agree and I've been saying that too. Don't trust them and continue fighting. They want that cash cow money. The movie and one dnd. They have to know not to betray us. They must be tanked to get the point across. They are just pivoting tactics.
I would not be surprised if they come at us twice as hard once this stupid movie is out and they set up the licensing and Terms of Service for 6E. They may not care about our custom. This might just be an attempt to stop the bleeding. Once stock prices start dropping shit gets serious for these people because they get hired and fired by investors. Long term, though? They may be planning to turn D&D into a video game. They may be thinking of the TTRPG genre as a lost cause.
'People are the worst monsters' LOL, NPC's can be a right pain in the ass to a party. Great listing of RPG games,, I've played most of them and love em. I've just ordered the SW west End Games 30th An. reprint as I was a dick and sold years ago them.
WEG SW is a great game. I have kept veteran gamers on the edges of their seats for years using this system, and yet it's so simple I am using it to introduce my son and his friends to TTRPGs.
I have fond memories of that old FASA Star Trek game. I have always viewed Star Trek as one of the hardest genre's to run. I have a friend who can run that game masterfully...and ironically he can't run anything else worth a darn. On the flip side, that (*&%^(^%$ Wild Die from the WEG d6 system made me hate that game. I rolled a one on that thing every other time I rolled, way above the 1 in 6 chance, I called it the "volatility" die. The only way to make that game fun for me was to have to confirm a 1 (by rolling another 1) or it was just another regular die.
Over the last few weeks I realised I have become too complacent with my groups gaming habits. I learned on a variety of systems in the mid 80’s early 90’s. I agree about completing the campaign and I will be dropping out of system oneshots in when players can’t make it or as a break in play. West End Games is all kind of mirky for copyright. Tracking down old boxes of ghostbusters rpg, or Marvel heroes is good for an evening oneshot because they are short rule books, quick character turn around and popular franchises. Though if you are running a Marvel Heroes game 60’s, 70’s, Early 80’s for inspiration (Spider-Man and his Amazing Friends). Also in my list of old ttrpgs was Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Aliens (though if I remember the combat system was clunky as all hell, which was a shame because the rest of it was a lot of fun. Not checked out the new version I have heard good things about it being good for evening one shots)
Fun Fact: The D6 Adventures system is open source, so no murkiness there. The only murkiness is the Star Wars license, which isn't really murk at all. It's crystal clear that you can't publish or make money on it. But the rules still can't be copywrited.
Said it before, I'll say it again: It doesn't matter. They'll leave the 1.0a "untouched"? Meaning they won't ADD 'irrevocable' to it. All of 5E is on the SRD? Meaning you can have it because they're focusing on 6E. Choose which you use? Meaning 5E doesn't, matter, because: 6E will be digital, have a vtt ogl or EULA, the film won't be boycotted, the heat will die down in a year and people will forget. They stopped twisting the knife, even took their hand off the hilt, *but the dagger is still in your back.* You can not trust them.
I agree. I'll be shocked if he 6E OGL doesn't require content creators to "voluntarily agree" to abandon 1.01a, and I wouldn't be even remotely surprised if they add a similar condition to the 6E VTT TOS. Even if they don't, you can bet they're going to try this again.
All of this really stinks to me. Hasbro just fired 1000 people, and one of their biggest investors basically said they are garbage. Lol. It seems to me that hasbro had a very bad year, and since wotc carries the company, they decided to make up their lost revenue by using d&d. Obviously, there was major backlash, and they finally capitulated. However, I don't think this is over. I'm 100% certain that there is going to be something else that comes out and negates everything they have done that is good. Don't let your guard down. Money is all they care about.
Great vid. I'm a Moldvay (81 red box basic & expert, then 1e advanced) grognard. Currently, I'm playing with a similar group of players. We're playing Advanced Labyrinth Lord. It seems a good match for the those that had my experience. Have you tried it?
No. I have read the Labyrinth Lord rules, and it is a solid OD&D retroclone, but I haven't had a chance to give it any table time. Yet. I still use OSRIC for retro play. If it makes any difference I started in 78, so I was hooked into AD&D already when Moldvay was published. I have run games in Moldvay, and I love the system. I love Mystara, too. But I'm a Greyhawk man in my core.
NWN is my all-time favorite Video Game. I was never much of a modder, but I knew enough to build my own Greyhawk campaign from scratch. I was a HOF DM back in when Neverwinter Connections was open. th-cam.com/video/hORIfqRtZfY/w-d-xo.html
That's great! Modding is my therapy. Prolific community. I also learned, started running a few pulp cthulhu campaigns (r2o, dcord) during the pandemic, and they're still going.
I don't see how that really makes any difference. Putting the 5E SRD on creative commons wasn't an act of magnanimity. It was just a cheap attempt to look magnanimous. WotC doesn't own the rules to any of the versions of D&D. They never did.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 of course they don't own the rules, but now anyone can use any of the material in that over 400 pages of SRD5.1 without fear of legal or financial repercussions however they like so long as they include the attribution listed in the first page. If WotC does this then all of D&D from OD&D to 4th edition is up for grabs in the same way, all of the games we've come to love are able to continue on unencumbered, and the authors we love are free to make whatever they like from whatever inspires them. We won't need WotC anymore, and they won't be able to do anything to us. At least that's my take. I'd be interested to hear your take on it.
Weird. I was expecting a video on hacking Hasbro/WotC executives home and work computers and using their cameras and mics to record blackmail material. The video is good but I really went in with the wrong expectations. Also, hating each other is fine. Just as long as that hate gets directed at WotC as needed. The enemy (WotC) of my enemy (5e theater kids) is still my enemy (WotC). So hate away just remember we occasionally may need to join our hatred and aim at WotC
Nah, man. Hate begets hate. Life is too short for that shit. You may be big enough to overlook animus to rise to a common cause, but are you so certain the people you hate on will do the same? Disagreement is fine. Hate? No, man. Hate can only destroy.
The real trust was lost back in the day older WOTC management abandoned the D20 trademark and 3.0/3.5 ruleset - this is just more that same pattern of behaviour and so many in the TTRPG hobby called them out on it :P Hasbro/WOTC want to get off the hook still for milking other audiences their 'branded IP pay walled VTT' alleged experience will cater too. They will be back to their shenanigans again because similar crap happened before.
WotC never threatened my trust, because they never had it. As a rule, trusting corporations is a bad idea. What Wizards put in jeopardy was my willingness to do business with them at all.
I really don't understand why or how people have a problem with different dice in a hobby that's about imagination and creativity. This closed minded rigidity seems anathema to the fundamental core of what TRPGs are all about.
Star-Wars/Star-Treck: IDK why, but I don't care for the idea of TTRPGs based on other exsisting franchises like Star-Wars. Maybe it's because Disney ruiend my love of Star-Wars in general? But I think it's really for the same reason it feels wrong to insert a pop-culture character into a TTRPG game of an unrelated setting; (as much fun as it is to build said characters.) Not to say I woudn't play a Space Opera. Just needs to be an orrigional setting. ... CallOfCathulu: I'm not personally into grimdark, but I trust it does it well? ... Pathfinder 2E: As somone who started on D&D5E, I totally agree that PF2E is all arround better version of it. ... Ostric: Never heard of it tbh. It's a retroclone? Maybe as a 1-shot. ... I could play a western or post-apacoliptic, but it's not my favorite genera. ... Travler: All I know about Travler is that it's Sci-Fi, and that Puffin Forest made fun of the character cration prosess, but I'ld be willing to try it. ... Castles and Crucades: Again, maybe... as a 1-shot.
It's certainly true that not all games based on movie/TV franchises are good, but STar Trek, Star Wars, and a homebrew Doctor Who game based on the Traveller rule set were some of my favorite campaigns. Have you ever actually run or played any games set in existing franchises? I'm curious, which ones?
That's not what I'm saying... For now. I'm just saying, "spread your wings a little." Don't give Wizards such a lock on the market. If the ONLY RPG you play is D&D, try something different once in a while. You might be surprised how much fun you have.
You're right. This is definitely a "Let's see that in writing with Hasbro/WoTc signing the dotted line" scenario. Also, I still haven't seen where the OGL 1.0a was definitively made irrevocable, but then I'm not a lawyer, either. I saw that the SRD and Creative Commons were integrated and the OGL 1.0a is being left in place(for now) but weasel words and all that.
They are very deliberately NOT making 1.0 irrevocable. They'll be back.
Loved your advice for getting D&D 5E kitties off of 5E and I agree with all of it.
As a D&D 5E kitty myself, I've actually got to thank WoTC for the OGL debacle, as I've looked at other games.
One of those games that I've looked at recently is Five Torches Deep, and it's a game that bridges the gap between 5E and the OSR. It's mostly backwards compatible with 5E and older D&D games. I'm in love with 5TD, and will try to ease my players over to that game instead. Characters only go to level 9, they're not god-killing entities, but instead well-abled mercenaries.
Refusing to leave D&D is a thing that has been around for decades. I remember when I started in 1981...it was ten years before I was willing to try another game. Only then did I realize what I was missing! So glad you are finding a wealth of new games.
I will definitely take a look at 5TD! Thanks for the recommendation!
@@erc1971erc1971 I'm a little surprised it took that long. We had an advantage back in the olden times. We played in game stores, so we were routinely exposed to new games whether we wanted to or not.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 I was in middle and high school back then, so I just played with my small group of friends. When I turned 18 and joined the military I got exposed to many other games, and I am glad I did.
Addendum: I've taken the time to look over 5TD. These are some first class rules.
I can see why WotC hates 3rd party publishers, so much. It must be terribly frustrating to have thousands of people on the payroll struggling to create content that's not even half as good as the stuff individuals and small companies are cranking out a hundred times faster.
I would love to see them put out the rest of the editions as creative commons, since surely that is within their ability? That would be a huge step forward that I think would bring them a large deal of good faith.
I suppose that would be nice, but it really would just be another empty gesture. They're just giving you something you already have. All the older editions already exist as retroclones precisely because rules cannot be copywrited.
Now I want someone fucking fired for this whole fiasco. The blood must flow.
There would be a certain schadenfreude to seeing Cynthia Williams floating to the ground on her golden parachute, but it wouldn't really change a thing.
Regarding D&DBeyond's TOS: It already says your homebrew you've created belongs to them. And you're absolutely right that 6th edition being an over-monetized-hellscape, it's coming.
They need to add Irrevocable to the OGL 1.0a!
My favorite games: 1-Cypher, 2-Teenagers From Outer Space, 3-Gamma World 4E(not based on D&D 4E), 4-All Flesh Must be Eaten, 5-Battlelords of the 23rd Century, 6-Pathfinder 1E, 7-5E, 8-Palladium system, 9-AD&D, 10-Shadow of the Demon Lord and 11-Star Frontiers
Gamma World 4E(pink book) is my favorite version of Gamma World!
I love Twilight 2000, it is a fun game! (you were part of the last major push of the war, and the armies wore themselves out
What no love for Palladium Books? 😉
Great work as always Grumpy!
I haven't played a lot of Palladium. I've read the Palladium Fantasy RPG and watched a game of rifts. Both look like solid rule sets.
I did play a short Teenaged Mutant Ninja Turtles campaign in college. That was a damned blast!
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 I honestly don’t have a lot of play experience, but it was the system I owned the most of. And I was dumb and got rid of it so I’m now rebuilding my collection. Luckily many of the books haven’t changed in over 20 years…
Well said. Though I will say one thing I think is significant--and that's how they put the full 5.1SRD under a very open creative commons license. That can never be pulled back--it's three hairs away from being public domain. If if they want to get my full good will, they should do SRDs for everything going all the way back to Chainmail. Do we need them---not at all. Based on yours and a few other recommendations, I've got Castles and Crusades on order. I've still got all my old D&D books and modules and Dragon magazines from back in the 1980s. (I may have started a little later than you. but I rolled my first dice in 82 at a boy scout summer camp, setting in motion a life-long passion.) I've recently pulled them out of storage and have started running again after many many years where life just didn't allow me to run and play. But as you get older, you realize you might as well do the things that really bring you joy.
Well said. I think Gen-X has a real voice in this conversation.
@@GeminiLibra73 Another idea is stop being the forever DM---Let someone else run for a little while with a whole different game system. Talk with your players adn see what other genres they might be interested in? Someone might by GURPS someone might by Star Wars, or a science fiction world more like BSG. I agree with branching out. Or you could go cold war and play something along the lines of Mission Impossible, James Bond, Man from Uncle type of game. There's a lot of great movies and shows about this genre.
@@andrewlustfield6079 Thanks for watching!
I'm not really impressed about WotC putting their 5E SRD on creative commons. It's not like they're giving us anything we don't already have.
WotC will never get my, "full good will." They never had it, and they never will. I've climbed high enough up the corporate ladder to know that NO billion dollar multinational corporation deserves anything even approaching "good will," much less, "trust."
As for giving up my DM chair... I shared the load for many years. Truth be told, after a while, I just got tired of playing. I'm not a forever DM because I have to be, now. I'm a forever DM because I choose to be.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 Fair enough. Just so you know, just because they have my good will, (meaning I do want D&D to succeed) that doesn't mean I give them my wallet. I stopped buying D&D when 3rd ed came out. I wasn't impressed with the direction and feel the game was going. At my table, I try to develop a live action feel, (LOTR, Game of Thrones, Thirteenth Warrior). To me, third ed felt like it was moving in the direction of video games and anime, with lots of cool, nifty moves that could never happen outside a cartoon. If that's your jam, by all means play that. I like something more grounded, which is why I'm excited about getting my shipment of Castles and Crusades. You and a few others on youtube sold me on that one, so I'm looking forward to giving it a try.
If WotC declared Chapter 13 bankruptcy tomorrow, D&D would be just fine.
Until both Cynthia Williams and Chris Cao are fired, we will never be able to trust WotC and Hasbro...
🤨
No billion-dollar, multinational corporation should EVER have your trust. Ever.
YES. This war is. not. over. Thanks for sharing!
Excellent video. You're 100% right that they are coming back for the OGLv1.0a at some point.
Time will tell. But they could have given us what we ACTUALLY asked for: OGL 1.0b, exactly like 1.0a with the word irrevocable added. They VERY deliberately didn't do that, so yeah. I think it's inevitable that they'll come for it again.
I love RPG's. Played D&D, Gurps, Rolemaster, Cyberpunk, Pallaidium's Rifts, Shadow run, Vampire the masquerade, Metascape, Twilight 2000, Firefly, Alternity, TMNT, etc.. and I've had a blast playing them all.
They tried it once, they will try again.
Although I stopped playing D&D years ago for another system I agree totally that we are in this together. I love our community and hobby so much.
Thanks for the shout out Grumpy. I'll send you physical copy of Cowpunchers Reloaded if you want.
Ummm... HELL YEAH! I have your email from the Rules Cylopedia. I'll send you my address.
Don't forget to sign it!
Alright. Subbed. I love the bit you try and convince players to GM from time to time. It really would make it easier for everyone all around to improve their love for the hobby.
It's not a lie. Being a DM is a lot more work, but it's also a lot more fun.
@Grumpy Old Grognard Oh no. I completely agree. I think I enjoy it more than being a player, though I do kinda wish I could play as a PC in a high level campaign.
seeing this whole WotC OGL debacle from overseas here in Germany, i am realizing again and again, how fortunate we Europeans where ( and are ) with D&D never getting more than 40% control of the ttrpg market.
D&D ( red box ) was my first ttrpg, back in the early 80's but quickly got challenged by DSA ( The Dark Eye ). Midgard ( another German one ) and MERS.
Now i am in a group, my firends and i built 28 years ago ( still going strong with 40+ sunday playing sessions / year ).
We are 7 guys, with 4 of us rotating in the game master seat, each one with different systems.
So we switch after each campaign.
For example, after tomorrows ending of our D&D 5e campaign ( funny enough a 3pp one - Odyssey of the Dragon Lords ) i will take up the reigns with a Splittermond campaign( its in the line of The Dark Eye, but with more high fantasy stuff and a unique initiative system, but unfortunately no English version yet )
We are switching to Call of Cuthulu then and after that i guess our Pathfinder will introduce us to 2e.
So my advice to all the regular groups out there: switching GM's and with it systems, will get you so much more content.
Over the years, i played as a Psyker, Juggler, a little girl with nerdy glasses, a stuffed vulture, a Techno-Mage, a Paladin of a God of Death, an Orc archer with magic in abundance, a bio-engineered angel, a bear-human hybrid healer, a mad sientist, an usuran shapeshifter-mage, an elementalist cleric, a cyberweapon-smith, once even a fragence of death and decay ( jup, that was a smelly one )and the list goes on and on....
my point? don't limit yourself, when there is an abundance of different systems, settings and ways to play... D&D for me is mostly a combat simulator, but for roleplaying there are much better systems out there, you only have to look out for them.
greetings from Germany
P.S. Call of Cuthulu should have been the system in "Stranger Things" with its horror setting, not D&D, but i guess WotC paid handsomely
Very well stated. OSE is a very good starting point for old-school D&D, crunch realism Harn Master.
There were a far more great games that didn't get c a mention than did. OSE is a brilliant OSR game!
I've been playing the FF Star Wars game for some months, and you hit the nail on the head with what I don't like about GMing the system.
Unfortunately, many modern games have the same problem.
Yeah, I too went and bought POD of Second Edition books, and shot a tweet to WotC before doing so, telling them I was doing it as goodwill for their actions and that I wasn't closing my eyes to their past actions.
Sixth edition means nothing to me. I've been done with buying 5e since, I think Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes. I walked over to my book case today, as I described to my 5E players the small, black form that wrapped around one of their faces, I pulled my Monster Manual II (1E) off the shelf and began describing the issues they were having with a Executioner's Hood, on the fly, converting it from 1E to 5E from the hip. We have too much to work with from the past to be beholden to this present company.
46 years GMing for me. I have always played a lot of games. I have forgotten how many over the years. Right now I am currently running or playing games using Traveller (both Mongoose and Classic), Hero System, Savage Worlds, Barbarians of Lemuria, PF2, Harnmaster, 1e AD&D, 1e Oriental Adventures and Cyperpunk Red. If I go back a year or two add Kult, StarMaster and 5e DnD. Variety is the spice of life.
Enjoyable and valuable video. "The problem is Modern rules that aren't good." My experience playing and DMing 5e is that invariably "I end up playing a boring game". You mentioned reasons why it's boring from the DM's point of view, but it is as bad or worse from the player's perspective. Why, because it takes so long between taking my turn to roll dice. There is very little reason to even pay attention while it isn't my turn as I have few "reaction" opportunities and teamwork between PCs is not really supported by the game. And I rarely feel pressed because the baddies die in one or two rounds, PCs don't die, there is little reason to not kill everything and leveling up occurs when the DMs feels like it, so our decisions seem meaningless. Play something else. Sounds like good advice to me.
You've done a great job summarizing some of 5E's problems. Thers's a lot more, of course, but that would be a whole video in itself, and one I really don't think needs to be made.
I trust WoTC like I trust gas station sushi.
I consider that statement exceedingly unfair to Gas Stations.
"Fled the field"? I think rather a Tactical Withdrawal, back under a rock and into the shadows, for now. But good to celebrate a small win none the less.
😊👍
I agree.
We only won on major battle.
But thier is more battles and most likely not soon.
Wizards of the coast will wait for when they think everyone forgot or when they have to begin the next attack.
Great video.
I'm going to buy the Starter Set and some other books from Troll Lord Games for the Castles and Crusades ruleset, whatever I can afford - I looked at the free PDF for the entire Player's Handbook and it won me over. I won't be able to afford it for a month or so (shipping costs to Australia are pretty horrendous nowadays), but it will be my new system of choice.
I don't have OSRIC yet (but have a lot of the original 1st and 2nd Edition AD&D books), OSE, Swords & Wizardry (great system, have played it a lot recently), and Labyrinth Lord Advanced.
I also have most of Pathfinder 1st Edition and about the first year of releases for Pathfinder 2nd Edition.
I've put all of my 5E Books into storage (including a lot of Kickstarter books). Won't be using them for the foreseeable future.
Cheers!
That's great!
So... Trade secret...
Most of your old 1E and 2E materials are compatible with C&C with almost no conversion. All you need to do is convert the critters to ascending AC (easy enough to do on the fly), and you'll find a 1E or 2E module/encounter shockingly well balanced for C&C.
If you have a use for books as .pdf files there's an interesting Humble Bundle going on at the moment too.
I think somebody in the mega corp hierarchy started to panic about the movie tanking.
Here's the thing, it was always going to tank, because it's cringe.
@@Richforce1 Probably. D&D movies sucked even when the game was in top form. D&D ain't exactly at the top of its game these days.
I'm certain that's true. Cynthia Williams is trying to prove to investors that D&D is a "lifestyle brand." A movie flop right now would shake investor confidence. If she wasn't a complete idiot she would have given the entire farm to the Critical Role crew and hitched her cart to them. Instead, she pissed them off.
How do these idiots get paid so much?
This is a great video, thank you!
Thank YOU for taking the time to watch it!
This isn't the Gates of Morannon, this isn't even Pellenor Fields this is the Battle of the Last Alliance with Hasbro as Sauron and we all know what happened after that.
Good analogy!
I wouldn't count on WotC waiting a thousand years to return, though.
No idea who you are or why YT recommended you to me, but keep doing your thing my dude.
I am the grumpy old grognard. 'Bout all there is to that. As to the Algorithm? I doubt even a Google engineer could answer that one.
ALL HAIL THE ALGORITHM!
(Probably best not to piss it off...)
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 hell yeah, brother
17:00
"Never tell me the odds!"
- Han Solo.
Best part of the whole thing was one of their investors coming out on Twitter and verbally burying the people running the company, I've never seen that before in my life and it was absolutely hilarious. I also pointed out as much as I could to others that they definitely are going to try this again, their new OGL will still happen and it'll be for 6th edition and their Virtual Tabletop scam. Then they can quietly drop support for 5th edition and hope treating it like a legacy product will choke out all the third-parties still wanting to publish under the OGL 1.0a. It's the only move they have and it more or less hinges on people dropping their guard between then and now of which many probably will.
There was a rumor last year that a group of investors was trying to sever Hasbro's management influence over WotC. I wonder if they saw this coming?
I wanna be pedantic. We threatened the shareholders pocket, THEY whupped WotC. I see no reason to assume WotC suddenly changed
They didn't. Count on it. They'll lick their wounds and slither back out in no time.
I spent more money on buying 3pp materials this week, and new games, than I had spent in the entire last year.
Me too!
Like many, the OGL debacle has made me look harder at the flaws of 5ED&D.
...
I have a feeling your gonna think this is the wrong direction, but I'm falling in love with Pathfinder 2E!
(both from a player and GM perspective.)
...
I also want to try Savage Worlds too, thanks to my GM.
It doesn't matter one jot what I think about the RPGs that you enjoy. What matters is what think. Play the game YOU love.
I will be abstaining hardcore from anything 6e.
You and me, both. From what they've released so far, they're not doing a damned thing that Neverwinter Nights didn't do better, and cheaper, anyway!!!
Our group plays a large variety of games. What we don’t play is D&D 5E, or any other edition WotC has put out. Had one player once who was trying to get us to try it. Told him if he wants to play 5E, find another group cause I had no interest in it.
I gave 3 and 5 test drives. 3 was a passing fair game, at best. 5 was a hopeless exercise in mediocrity.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 I’m in pretty much the same boat lol. We got the 3e books on the release dates, along with the little conversion booklet for making the change from ad&d 2e. We played a bit, didnt like it, went back to 2e and have continued to play it since. Tried 5e with my nephew and some of his friends and didnt like it either. None of WotC’s editions feel like d&d to me. Its another game with the d&d title. While I got my start with ad&d 2e (1990) I have played BECMI a bit, and I enjoy that too
Completely agree and I've been saying that too. Don't trust them and continue fighting. They want that cash cow money. The movie and one dnd. They have to know not to betray us. They must be tanked to get the point across. They are just pivoting tactics.
I would not be surprised if they come at us twice as hard once this stupid movie is out and they set up the licensing and Terms of Service for 6E. They may not care about our custom. This might just be an attempt to stop the bleeding. Once stock prices start dropping shit gets serious for these people because they get hired and fired by investors. Long term, though? They may be planning to turn D&D into a video game. They may be thinking of the TTRPG genre as a lost cause.
'People are the worst monsters' LOL, NPC's can be a right pain in the ass to a party. Great listing of RPG games,, I've played most of them and love em. I've just ordered the SW west End Games 30th An. reprint as I was a dick and sold years ago them.
WEG SW is a great game. I have kept veteran gamers on the edges of their seats for years using this system, and yet it's so simple I am using it to introduce my son and his friends to TTRPGs.
I have fond memories of that old FASA Star Trek game. I have always viewed Star Trek as one of the hardest genre's to run. I have a friend who can run that game masterfully...and ironically he can't run anything else worth a darn.
On the flip side, that (*&%^(^%$ Wild Die from the WEG d6 system made me hate that game. I rolled a one on that thing every other time I rolled, way above the 1 in 6 chance, I called it the "volatility" die. The only way to make that game fun for me was to have to confirm a 1 (by rolling another 1) or it was just another regular die.
Tough break. The only good thing about having that degree of bad luck is the flood of endorphins you finally get when your bad luck fails you.
Over the last few weeks I realised I have become too complacent with my groups gaming habits. I learned on a variety of systems in the mid 80’s early 90’s.
I agree about completing the campaign and I will be dropping out of system oneshots in when players can’t make it or as a break in play.
West End Games is all kind of mirky for copyright. Tracking down old boxes of ghostbusters rpg, or Marvel heroes is good for an evening oneshot because they are short rule books, quick character turn around and popular franchises. Though if you are running a Marvel Heroes game 60’s, 70’s, Early 80’s for inspiration (Spider-Man and his Amazing Friends). Also in my list of old ttrpgs was Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Aliens (though if I remember the combat system was clunky as all hell, which was a shame because the rest of it was a lot of fun. Not checked out the new version I have heard good things about it being good for evening one shots)
Fun Fact:
The D6 Adventures system is open source, so no murkiness there. The only murkiness is the Star Wars license, which isn't really murk at all. It's crystal clear that you can't publish or make money on it. But the rules still can't be copywrited.
Said it before, I'll say it again: It doesn't matter.
They'll leave the 1.0a "untouched"? Meaning they won't ADD 'irrevocable' to it.
All of 5E is on the SRD? Meaning you can have it because they're focusing on 6E.
Choose which you use? Meaning 5E doesn't, matter, because: 6E will be digital, have a vtt ogl or EULA, the film won't be boycotted, the heat will die down in a year and people will forget.
They stopped twisting the knife, even took their hand off the hilt, *but the dagger is still in your back.* You can not trust them.
I agree. I'll be shocked if he 6E OGL doesn't require content creators to "voluntarily agree" to abandon 1.01a, and I wouldn't be even remotely surprised if they add a similar condition to the 6E VTT TOS.
Even if they don't, you can bet they're going to try this again.
All of this really stinks to me. Hasbro just fired 1000 people, and one of their biggest investors basically said they are garbage. Lol. It seems to me that hasbro had a very bad year, and since wotc carries the company, they decided to make up their lost revenue by using d&d. Obviously, there was major backlash, and they finally capitulated. However, I don't think this is over. I'm 100% certain that there is going to be something else that comes out and negates everything they have done that is good. Don't let your guard down. Money is all they care about.
🎯🎯🎯
Great vid. I'm a Moldvay (81 red box basic & expert, then 1e advanced) grognard. Currently, I'm playing with a similar group of players. We're playing Advanced Labyrinth Lord. It seems a good match for the those that had my experience. Have you tried it?
No. I have read the Labyrinth Lord rules, and it is a solid OD&D retroclone, but I haven't had a chance to give it any table time. Yet.
I still use OSRIC for retro play. If it makes any difference I started in 78, so I was hooked into AD&D already when Moldvay was published. I have run games in Moldvay, and I love the system. I love Mystara, too. But I'm a Greyhawk man in my core.
I hear you. I mod for NWN, and the oerth pnp mods are still very popular (giants, tharizdun, dwellers).
NWN is my all-time favorite Video Game. I was never much of a modder, but I knew enough to build my own Greyhawk campaign from scratch. I was a HOF DM back in when Neverwinter Connections was open.
th-cam.com/video/hORIfqRtZfY/w-d-xo.html
That's great! Modding is my therapy. Prolific community. I also learned, started running a few pulp cthulhu campaigns (r2o, dcord) during the pandemic, and they're still going.
*I wonder if you have ever checked out "The Mutant Epoch" from Outland arts.*
*[ Text emboldened for easy of reading. ]*
I'll check it out! Thanks!
How about setting netral systems?
All systems are setting neutral.
I'll call this war won when WotC makes SRDs for all previous editions of D&D and puts them all into the Creative Commons.
I don't see how that really makes any difference. Putting the 5E SRD on creative commons wasn't an act of magnanimity. It was just a cheap attempt to look magnanimous. WotC doesn't own the rules to any of the versions of D&D. They never did.
@@grumpyoldgrognard9561 of course they don't own the rules, but now anyone can use any of the material in that over 400 pages of SRD5.1 without fear of legal or financial repercussions however they like so long as they include the attribution listed in the first page. If WotC does this then all of D&D from OD&D to 4th edition is up for grabs in the same way, all of the games we've come to love are able to continue on unencumbered, and the authors we love are free to make whatever they like from whatever inspires them. We won't need WotC anymore, and they won't be able to do anything to us.
At least that's my take. I'd be interested to hear your take on it.
Weird. I was expecting a video on hacking Hasbro/WotC executives home and work computers and using their cameras and mics to record blackmail material. The video is good but I really went in with the wrong expectations. Also, hating each other is fine. Just as long as that hate gets directed at WotC as needed. The enemy (WotC) of my enemy (5e theater kids) is still my enemy (WotC). So hate away just remember we occasionally may need to join our hatred and aim at WotC
Nah, man. Hate begets hate. Life is too short for that shit. You may be big enough to overlook animus to rise to a common cause, but are you so certain the people you hate on will do the same?
Disagreement is fine. Hate? No, man. Hate can only destroy.
The real trust was lost back in the day older WOTC management abandoned the D20 trademark and 3.0/3.5 ruleset - this is just more that same pattern of behaviour and so many in the TTRPG hobby called them out on it :P Hasbro/WOTC want to get off the hook still for milking other audiences their 'branded IP pay walled VTT' alleged experience will cater too. They will be back to their shenanigans again because similar crap happened before.
WotC never threatened my trust, because they never had it. As a rule, trusting corporations is a bad idea. What Wizards put in jeopardy was my willingness to do business with them at all.
No Spawn of Fashan?!
LoL!!!
Nope.
I really don't understand why or how people have a problem with different dice in a hobby that's about imagination and creativity. This closed minded rigidity seems anathema to the fundamental core of what TRPGs are all about.
Because MONEY!
How is that hard?
Star-Wars/Star-Treck: IDK why, but I don't care for the idea of TTRPGs based on other exsisting franchises like Star-Wars.
Maybe it's because Disney ruiend my love of Star-Wars in general?
But I think it's really for the same reason it feels wrong to insert a pop-culture character into a TTRPG game of an unrelated setting; (as much fun as it is to build said characters.)
Not to say I woudn't play a Space Opera. Just needs to be an orrigional setting.
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CallOfCathulu: I'm not personally into grimdark, but I trust it does it well?
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Pathfinder 2E: As somone who started on D&D5E, I totally agree that PF2E is all arround better version of it.
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Ostric: Never heard of it tbh. It's a retroclone? Maybe as a 1-shot.
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I could play a western or post-apacoliptic, but it's not my favorite genera.
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Travler: All I know about Travler is that it's Sci-Fi, and that Puffin Forest made fun of the character cration prosess, but I'ld be willing to try it.
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Castles and Crucades: Again, maybe... as a 1-shot.
It's certainly true that not all games based on movie/TV franchises are good, but STar Trek, Star Wars, and a homebrew Doctor Who game based on the Traveller rule set were some of my favorite campaigns. Have you ever actually run or played any games set in existing franchises? I'm curious, which ones?
Do not buy any more of their products?
That's not what I'm saying... For now. I'm just saying, "spread your wings a little." Don't give Wizards such a lock on the market. If the ONLY RPG you play is D&D, try something different once in a while. You might be surprised how much fun you have.
keep that same energy come election time
Phht. Both parties can kiss my fat ass.
At what point, though, does relentless mediocrity become a kind of achievement, anyway?
🤣I'm not sure, but D&D has gone WAY past it.
I enjoy the new traveller and call of Cthulhu and one I’d recommend Low Fantasy Gaming (bad name) by pickpocket press.
Yes! Great system!