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Denon X4700H vs Denon X4500H
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ต.ค. 2020
- Buy the Denon X4700H: bit.ly/DenonX4700H
Buy the Denon X4500H: bit.ly/DenonX4500H
Buy the Denon X3600H: bit.ly/DenonX3600H
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CORRECTION: @technodad made me aware that the X4700H does not have DTS-X Pro.
@Benjamin Israel instablaster =)
Yes!
Finally, the video I was waiting for! 👍🏻 Thanx a lot man!
Hope it helps in some way
@@joentell I hope I can find the AVR x4500h here in Mexico, seems to be better for my needs
Awesome video. Feel the same about denon receivers
Great video. Quick question, not clear on this but with the x4700 (or both), could you use your Parrasound to power the main 5 channels (Front L/C/R and 2 surrounds) and let the x4700 power the rears and heights if you wanted to utilize 11.2? TY
Joe - Thanks for the review. Really Helpful! Did you find any real impact to sound quality between 4500 and 4700? I noticed Amir at Audio Science Review (ultimately) was happy with the 4700 but I also know that sound quality can vary by model to model, even with comparable specs. I'm curious due to the change in chipset that you mentioned and wonder if there is a soundboard or other internal change as well.
i have the denon x 4700 it works very well for me i have no problems with this receiver
What's the limit on external map channels if you're doing a mix of internal and external amps with the X4700H and X4500H? (thinking of 7 channel external, and 4 channel internal for the height channels).
Thanks for doing this video joe, I'm thinking about getting the x3600H and skipping the x3700H series all together since the 8k switching doesn't actually do 4k120hz since that's what I want it for.
I would jump on it at its current price. Who knows how long they'll be in stock for. And feel free to use my affiliate link too.🤣😉
Just bought a 4500, gonna wait a couple years till the 2.1 kinks are smoothed out
Pro tip: When you're using the app to run MultEQ, it randomly runs slow as hell. The fix is to change the receiver to HEOS/Media Player first before connecting to the receiver with the app. I'm not sure why, but this makes it download each position's results much faster and I haven't had a run fail during calibration since I've started doing this. I don't know if it's because it dedicates more resources to the network hardware when the AVR is set to streaming or what, but this has worked consistently for me.
That is a pro tip. I'll have to check that out.
The great thing about the new HDMI 2.1 AVRs isn't 8K, in my opinion, it's support for 4K at over 60 Hz (up to 120 with HDR which also needs extra bandwidth), and VRR (variable refresh rate).
Good content
With the sunglasses I was expecting Fresh Hater Jay instead of Joe😅🤣. You should definitely be able to load Audyssey profile between similar models, although I am sure Denon has an explanation as to why they do not support that feature. I guess the internal components that were changed could change the sound even if your room and speakers hadn't changed.
@MyTwoCats Joe has lost the support of the cat lovers. I am sure be will be devastated. So you bought a Denon 8500 and THEN determined it was trash? That doesn't seem to be an intelligent decision. My guess is you don't own any AV gear. None. That crazy dude Andy Summer supporting your comment only makes your opinion worth even less.
@@andysummers485 Man I knew the US election would bring out all the crazy people. I just didn't expect to find them on AV Reviews.
Enjoy your videos. I have the Elac UB5 bookshelf speaker (85db sens and 4ohms). What amplifier would you recommend to get the most out of these speakers? Something around $1,000 or less.
Thank you. I've used those with all kinds of amps they do like power if you plan on playing them loud. My recommendation depends on if you're doing a home theater or 2-channel
2 channel, I do not play them loud. Around 70 to 80 db.
@@joentell 2 channel, I do not play them loud. Around 70 to 80 db.
I like some of the Yamaha AS series. I use the A-S501.
I currently have the avr-x4500H, i'm going to wait for the 4800 or 4900. Especially with the HDMI2.1 issues.
There's nothing wrong with the X4500H for me.
Is it too early to upgrade to 8K from 4k since we do not have lot of 8k content and TVs in wide range of users choice ? Would you please provide me your honest opinion since I'm a regular viewer of your channel? I'm confused to buy SR6014 or SR7015 at this time..
I would refer you to @technodad and @stopthefomo
@@joentell ok thank you..
It’s not about the 8K that anyone cares about as even 2 years later 8K isn’t a thing and probably will never be a thing. It’s about 4K 120hz and VRR.
Great video!
Thanks. And thanks for the correction about DTS-X Pro. I pinned the comment. No wonder I didn't try it out...it's not available on this model. 🤣
The Daily HiFi gangster 😎
Is it really bright in the room your in? Why the sun glasses 🕶?
I think my eyes were really bloodshot because I used a contract solution that my eyes did not like. It looked really bad as if I got into some kind of fight.
I agree with the "heos" issues. There is also issues with the "remote app" . Both have issues were it just doesn't work sometimes. Then at times it won't work at all and you are forced to do a factory reset to get them to work. It's really disappointing that Denon being such a large corporation, they can't get their apps to work efficiently.
No need factory reset from your Avr, instead try to remove and forget bluetooth connection on your devices and avr, and re pairing it again, if still not stable turn it off and wait couple minutes and re try again, it work for me.
God knows I love denon PMA / POA 😃
I purchased a denon 4700. No reason to care about the 8k, not a gamer. I at first wasn't happy with the sound for music especially. But now that I've used the editor app turning off midrange compensation and limiting corrections to below 500Hz I love it. This is my first Denon. Have owned sony es, sony, pioneer, harman kardon, yamaha. For movies I'd say there 4700 is the best I've had. For music in 5 channel I'd say sony es is better, but surround denon is best. Auro 3d is sweet, love that center spread has returned, nice for 2ch music and tv
You seem to be enjoying your purchase!
I used the editor app today! And I agree. It sounds MUCH better. More precise.
Will you recommend this over the Arcam AVR30 AV Receiver ?
I haven't tried that AVR personally, but I like the specs considering it has Dirac with bass control and Auro3D.
Heos is one of the main reasons I sold my Marantz sr7012. That and noisy pre-outs. Bought an Anthem MRX1120 and haven't been happier.
Denon/ marantz Pre amp mode looks awesome and that is a really nice addition, considering it is tenatively giving business to another electronic manufacturer to achieve better sound, rather than asking you to upgrade AVR lines.
I have the 4400 and I still don’t see a reason to upgrade!
I currently have the Onkyo TX-NR646 for my 5.1 setup. JBL (ES100) as the FRONT speakers along with REARS (ES20) and SUB (ES250) from JBL. I feel this AVR is underpowered for my JBL ES100 so I wanted to get the AVC-X4700H being more powerful in terms of power amplification, features and future -proof.
ALL GURUS' out here, I am a newbie so please advice me whether I should get this new 4700H for both music and movies ??
The power difference itself is pretty negligible but the big advantage this Denon has is preamp outputs; you can hook it up to an external amplifier to get a considerable power increase.
If you don't need the other features of the 4700H then you can save some cash by getting something like an X3600H.
@@KCC46 thanks a lot for this feed .. Well., I thought DENON 4700H would have a greater class of amplification stated (125W @ 8ohm) vs my (100W @ 8ohm) .. off Course., I am considering this “PRE-AMP” feature which is a great option for powering my units .. Sound quality, DAC, etc is what I am thinking too as I heard DENON is more responsive to Music as compared to ONKYO ..
Hope this 4700H doesn’t disappoint me 😕
@@nasimhaider281 Yeah, the 25 extra watts represents about a decibel relative to the max power of the Onkyo. The Onkyo doesn't do 9 channels of course so no contest there.
I'm actually running an Onkyo NR656 myself and have an X4500H arriving soon, which I'll be pairing with an external amp. It will be interesting to hear the differences, if really any.
@@KCC46 👍🏻 great .! We are on the same boat then .. 😊 let me know about your listening experience after adding External amp to your 4500 .. btw ., what amp are you looking into .?
@@nasimhaider281 I snagged a great local deal on an Outlaw 5000. My listening area is fairly small and I'm currently only running 5.1, but might go Atmos in the future, so I'll be amping all of my speakers and just using the 4500 as a preamp for the near future.
When you reply on suppliers for internal components when problems arise, the company that sold you the product catches the backlash. Like Joe said the companies with the most brand recognition benefit when products shine and they take the biggest hit when they don't even if it was a component supplied by a third party that caused the poor performance. Denon/Marantz hasn't run from the HDMI issue and they have always taken care of their customers. I am sure this will be no different.
Right on Tristan. Good hearing from you again. Lots of shout outs for you at The Hi-Fi Summit.
@@joentell Thanks my friend. Really appreciate you.
@@andysummers485 you are a troubled person. I will pray for you.
Anyway to get more sound out of the surround speakers with x4500h?
Turn up the levels?
External amp?
Instead of running this in preamp mode..if that is the use you are going to do.....why would one not just buy the Marantz 7706 pre/pro?
No DIRAC on the Marantz. Also, I happen to have a power amp. If I didn't, I think I would be ok using the built-in power amps. I don't have a large room.
@@joentell
The Denon X4700H doesnt have Dirac either
The fact that you have power amps would make me think you would go straight for the pre/pro and skips the AVR's
I have run separates for 15 years or so. When I replaced the pre/pro I didnt even really look at AVR's..I just looked at dedicated pre/pro options based on what I had already
Yes, but the X4700 and the T778 both have pre-outs. I like options. My power amp is only 5 channels so it helps to have both options at the moment.
Did you ever find out if the old 4-core on the x4500 was actually more powerful than the new 2-core on the x4700h?
Never did. I wonder if it was a cost savings thing.
@@joentell yeah, I’m also thinking they put in the cheaper PCM 5102A DAC in the May 2021 x-2700, x3700, x6700 with the fixed HDMI 2.1 boards vs the pre-May Denons that had the AK4458 DAC. I was willing to pay the extra $400 for the new 2021 price of $1500 for the x3700 (which would’ve bought me the x4700h earlier this year) but not if the sound quality is worse. No one is testing the new vs old so I don’t know if I should return it until it’s confirmed that the quality is just as good. Because of the Holiday return period being extended to January, I still have time for someone to test these two versions. You would think audiophiles would be all over this. But no one is taking this seriously enough to test.
@@germanjimenez2087 that is exactly my primary concern in buying right now, I have been scouring the internet for information on the new dacs in the x4700h, I am considering a refurb from accesories4less, just to source a pre- may 21 model. Have you confirmed you have a non AKM dac in your unit. Ive heard they are under the top board so require a minor uninstall to find out for sure.
There are 4 Sharc processors with single core in X4500 and 2 dual core Sharcs at x4700. Probably easier to layout to circuit board and faster processing due smaller distances. So it's win to x4700
You did not mention the fact Denon released a firmware update which rendered the HEOS, network useless. On the 4500
Is that right? Has it been resolved yet?
Audio Science Review has benchmarks on the X4700H and X3600H.
The DAC performance in the X4700H with amp off makes a big difference in DAC. SINAD of 75 DB vs 96 DB amp off. That's a difference between a horrible DAC and a very good performing DAC (by AVR standard).
Thanks for that. I'll have to take a look. I did mention that if pushed to higher levels, it might be audible, but not in my particular use case. At what point is the difference in SINAD audible? If you know, I'm curious. Thanks.
@@joentell Good question, I don't have enough DACs to test. I can tell you is my SMSL M100 (first version) has a SINAD of 102 db and playing 16 bit FLAC music it sounds notably better than onboard audio of my laptop or cell phone which if I had to guess are probably ~90 db. Particularly the bass is a big improvement in the better DAC.
The AD18 you had was a DAC of 80 db. iiWi reviewed the SMSL Sanskrit 10th MKII (114 db) and said it was a significant improvement over the original Sanskrit 10th (80 db by USB, 102 by TOSLINK).
Do you still have the Yamaha A-S501? I'd be curious how the Denon pre-outs sound connected to that amp while playing Dolby True HD, vs taking that same track via TOSLINK in stereo PCM to an external DAC connected to the Yamaha. I'm not sure if you'd hear a notable difference in DAC if you are playing lossy Netflix AC3.
@@TwoMoSmoka420 anything -65db and lower is inaudible.
Do you still have your old x4500h ??
Yes. I need to sell it
@@joentell how much??
@@jjguillen65 oh man. I don't know. Email me or dm me on social media
Can you use banana plugs on the back of the 4700
Yes 100%
yes you can
Conclusion : ask yourself if you need these new features - 2 presets ,preamp mode, HDMI 2.1.
Exactly...and maybe not so much about HDMI 2.1 at the moment.
@@joentell 2.1 is for gaming only.
I can get the 3700 or get 4500h for 100 cheaper which would you buy im stuck on fence
Do you need the power or do you like the preamp mode, dual presets, Atmos virtualization, and other features on the newer models?
I pull the trigger on the 4500h looks better and be awhile before I do more than one amp thanks for reply
Not a bad choice!
Why the sunglasses ?
Why, do you really want to see my eyes that badly? 🤣
Did Joe brainwash Fresh Hater Jay for this one? He was very nice ;) The pre-amp mode is awesome for those going with external amplification. But I agree if you're only using internal amps, the previous models are still legit. I'm eyeing the 3500/3600 for a basic living room system.
I felt like overall it wasn't a 100% recommendation for the X4700H, but rather save some money and check out the previous models before they go out of stock.
Since the X4500H sales for 1.199$ and X4700H sales for 1.699$ on Amazon. according to what you're describing. the X4700H is not worth 500$ price difference.
I think I'm going to order the X4500H ( I have NO use for 8K) the whole concept of Samsung trying to shove 8K TV's is a totally pointless concept. at this point,
even HDMI 2.1 is not supported by too many graphic cards. aside from the very top of line Nvidia ,
Sony SS-CS5 review please, now it is on sale under $100
😂
Seriously I just got myself X4500H 3 days ago...for $999
Super exciting changes...YAWN...I'll stick to my X6400H, absolutely nothing worthwile upgrading, specially since 2020 AVR's have broken HDMI 2.1 chips...
Yeah, X6400H is still a beast. I wonder if it's a great idea for them to introduce a product every year or if they should wait till there's significant innovation.
Garbage receiver. I should have never bought this buggy avr. Coming from pioneer i am totally disappointed in the this 4700h.
Denon preset 1&2 against pioneers 6.
This avr can literally warm up my entire room if i leave it on for 3hrs(smh) with how hot this things gets! . Ive owned atleast 8 pioneer avrs in the past 12yrs and none of them didn't even break a sweat when pushed hard. I will definitely go back to pioneer!!
Rinde R show glad i come across this i just about to upgrade my pioneer elite sc79 to this. I just think im gonna wait.
@@shedrickjohnson8473 trust me this particular model is not worth the money(my opinion). Denon was just in a race to become the first company to implement 8k in their Avrs. And in return? All kinds of glitches here and there!!! Its my first denon avr. I only switched from pioneer because pioneer is pretty much non existent at this point. Their avr app is garbage and customer service/tech support is pretty much stone age at this point. I loved everything about pioneer, the build, the way it looks, the amber light ui display, the brushed aluminum look on the sc models e.t.c.
Their recievers are the best looking (in my opinion) so going out of business just made things worse. They were even bought out by onkyo and now onkyo was sold to sound united i think(not sure ).
I still might get another pioneer though, it might be the lx sc901 or the 801. They are the older flagship (2018 model i believe) .but As long as it has all the sound formats of today ( atmos, dtsX and imax enhanced) then i think i should be fine.
Denon avrs run extremely 🔥 hot. And I just don't know why. I can leave the receiver on without any source content playing and reciever already jumps to about 98 degrees!!! I find that crazy!!!. And to make it worse there is no inbuilt fan in them (smh) . Pioneers in the other hand come with internal fans which keeps the reciever COOL as ice at all times even when I pushed it to the max!!! Thats how well built they were.
I only bought the denon because I had some cash to burn and they were the new releases of 2020 so I said why not. Now maybe I would have been better off buying the older models 2017-2019 but I guess I will never know until I try them. But I can tell you right now...I am not liking this 4700h that I currently own. I want to give Yamaha a try but still thinking about it.
@@rindershow212 thanks alot thats a big help for my decision. I own bw 804d speakers my co workers said i come out best going separates.
@@shedrickjohnson8473 yup exactly!! In my opinion any avr will do if you are going the separates route. You don't even need a flagship avr. An entry level avr with all the surround formats will do if doing separates. So in that case the avr will only be used as "processor " .
@@rindershow212 thanks again have a great and safe new year.
Will you recommend this over the Arcam AVR30 AV Receiver ?
Nope, own both. Arcam has way better DAC’s…