Liszt teached in Paris as a teenager until his early twenties, and while he had a relationsship with Marie d'Agoult, that lasted until the early 1840s. Back then, he taught anybody who could afford. But after he stopped his touring in 1847, he always taught his students for free. Czerny taught Liszt for free.
Liszt is my favorite of the two composers, as his work is a lot more diverse than Chopin (well, he also lived for a lot longer), but I definitely prefer Chopin's teaching philosophy over Liszt's. It'd kill me to have an audience when I just want to learn.
Remember they had different students. If your goal is to be a concert pianist. An audience is something you have to conquer any way some time down the road. I can kind of see why he did it, sort of introducing it in a more casual way, than say an actual concert hall full of people.
@@willsteele793 Liszt’s diversity had nothing to do with life span. Anyone familiar with his work knows he was not only diverse from the start (as the Transcendental Etudes attest), but his works encompass life, far more broad in concept and brilliant than Chopin’s secluded microcosm of a world. Granted, Chopin certainly composed many brilliant gems, but also a very large body of mundane works that bear one listen only.
@@richdisilvio4591 Well, while it is true that Liszt was diverse in his early years, because he ked a long life he got to become even more diverse in his last decade or so where he explored ideas that would be associated with 20th century impressionism and atonality. What Chopin would have been doing had he lived into his 70s is hard to say.
A few things to point out here: - first, and most important: Liszt only switched to giving masterclasses in his old age! It wasn't something he did in the 1830s or 40s, during his younger years in Paris he gave lessons one-on-one, just like Chopin. Your video doesn't consider Liszt's one-on-one lessons, you exclusively talk about his late-life masterclasses. Those are two very different things. Apples and oranges. Liszt taught amateurs like Chopin did when he was in Paris, giving his one-on-one lessons. On the other hand, he taught mostly up-and-coming concert pianists in his masterclasses - as is customary today. Of course, he absolutely did teach technique in his one-on-one lessons in his younger years in Paris - there he was teaching amateurs, it would have been absurd not to teach them technique. However, it would have likewise been absurd to teach technique in his masterclasses - when he was teaching professionals or near-professionals. - there is no indication that Liszt tended to single out beautiful, young noblewomen as pupils. - there is no indication that Liszt was romantically or otherwise involved with any of them, except for Caroline de St- Cricq, when Liszt was 17 and she was 16 - by the way, her father didn't want her to be with a lowly pianist, so he married her off to a nobleman in the Pyrenees, this caused Liszt to be so depressed that he completely disappeared from the limelight: a newpaper famously published his obituary(!), presuming that he was dead - one couldn't make this up, seriously. - I'm not sure what repertoire Liszt used in his one-on-one lessons - presumably he followed his teacher's (Czerny's) lead, so: Bach, Scarlatti, Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven, Czerny, Hummel and probably incorporated some romantic contemporaries, like Chopin and Schumann. In his masterclasses he taught the whole spectrum of keyboard music, from Bach up to hot-off-the-press pieces. Sometimes he included pieces that weren't even published yet. The one piece I know he was sick of hearing in his classes was his own Polonaise No.2 in E-Major. (For the same reason you cite for the Chopin Scherzo.) - The "dirty linen" quotation doesn't say "leave it at home" rather "wash it at home" - meaning polish your technique at home. That way it makes sense.
@@jacobsimonson9040 For this comment I haven't done any :) I have studied music history at uni and wrote my thesis on Liszt (his Lieder to be precise), I've also read half-a-dozen Liszt biographies, dozens of scholarly articles about Liszt in music history journals, a decent number of letters from his correspondence and a few memoirs from his students. (There is even a voice recording on youtube from Frederic Lamond, a Scottish student of Liszt where he is talking about Liszt!) I've done some research (not much, I'm not a musicologist, it's just a hobby) - but I can't say any of it was for this comment. :)
Unfortunately Allysia has made quite a number of mistakes in this video, such as missing the crucial point that she’s referring to Liszt in later years when he had Master Classes with semi-professional pianists, so an audience was a novel and ingenious concept. And yes, they had to be well-trained to even be in these classes, which were all Free. And "pretty" women is another falsehood, as Princess Carolyne, whom he intended to marry, was NO physical beauty, but had a beautiful mind. Liszt is too often portrayed as shallow, yet his artistic and spiritual beliefs were extremely profound, even if he couldn't restrain himself from women. Moreover, Liszt loathed the metronome, which destroys feeling and makes works sound more robotic, and stressed not only fluidity but also immersing one’s self into the music, to envision what you are playing to better bring it to life, hence the Polish Cavalry anecdote. Check out FRANZ LISZT: ENIGMATIC GENIUS on TH-cam
GREAT video... and never forget... when the great Rachmaninoff was told "my dear Rachmaninoff, you are the greatest pianist I have ever heard" Rachmaninoff would respond "That's because you've never heard Anton Rubinstein..." when folks use to come up to Anton Rubinstein and say "Anton Rubinstein... surely you are the greatest pianist in history" Anton Rubinstein would say "that's because you've never heard the GREAT Franz Liszt!"
Don't sell Liszt short... many of his GREAT works also have GREAT sensitive sections... LIKE the GREAT B minor Sonata... "Years of Pilgrimage" or the Consolations... and others... BUT the big part of your conversation... SPOT ON...! very informative... and QUICK moving and entertaining... PERFECT!!!! LOVED it!!!!!
Your channel is amazing! This exactly what I’m looking for ❤. I want to understand classical music better and have a better understanding of the composers .😊
Nice! Thank you. I have a bust on my piano of Franz Lizst. I'm guessing of when he was younger. It was my Dad's, who played piano, too. I loved the Lizst's pieces best!
Lovely presentation! One point about Chopin’s rubato is that he practiced *French rubato*-as did Mozart: keeping the LH steady while the RH gives and takes freely.
I think you like chopin more just from your eye movements 😁. I love the passion that you show in your vids, as it rubs off on me! Thanks for all the great videos 😎👍
I think Lizst’s approach works very well for the advanced students he taught. Most of the great masterclasses you see will have an awful lot more of this style, concepts, images, and metaphor, and the already accomplished student is free to interpret that and bring it into their music. I also think technique and its development is a completely different journey for every student who undertakes it, where each new discovery completely transforms their playjng rather than there being one grand secret. I do also think that to teach exercises and solutions to technical issues is vital for students who arent at that advanced level. Its more a matter of building the biggest repertoire of exercises and solutions possible, fit for any situation you can find yourself in, and the advanced student should be able to draw on exercises they know but also be inventive in their own solutions to a technical issue. The importance of knowing what truly, REALLY loose and tension free technique FEELS like I think is one of the more significant things, but everyones different
From all of your descriptions of their teaching styles, personalities and music, Chopin would seem to be the quintessential introvert and Liszt the quintessential extrovert.
Thank you, Alicia - wow, terrific. I'm always struck by how unoriginal we musicians can be, copying the precise phrasing of our teachers and favorite superstars. Even the superstars can't help but copy each other, playing the identical tempi, pauses, ornaments... thanks for this vital history lesson.
I think they are both perfect examples of the two main types of teaching that generally work. I like Chopins take on technique since my view is very similar. I look at technique as freedom and taste, the better technique you have the wider range of sounds and therefore expression you can use which is freedom. When you make the choice to express a piece in the most careful and best way you can imagine then you are choosing technique befitting of that interpretation aka good taste. I really love this video.
Hi Allysia, Great video as always ! Just a small note : At 5:29, you wrote "Schuman" with one "n" while the composer has two "n" at the end. Nothing dramatic, just saying.
Someone translated his personal letters and letters that were published in newspapers of the time reviewing other composers works. A wonderful book called portrait of an artist. Probably some of the letters were written by his main squeeze.
What a lovely video! It's fun to get geeky about this stuff :) I want to recommend a book with writings from Chopin's pupils. Pianist and Teacher: As Seen by his Pupils.
According to Alan walkers biography of Liszt, he never charged any for a lesson, ever. Czerny taught Liszt for free and Liszt wanted to return the same favor to the world.
Most people here think you lean towards Chopin than Liszt... but watching your videos, your methods seem to align more with Liszt. Either way, both composers were extraordinary talents, and for me it's hard to say which of the two I prefer - I like them both for very different reasons. However, the bizarre thing is that I can't play Chopin for the life of me, but I can play Liszt.
Hey, Jason: That's the weirdest thing I've ever heard really!!! You have to be talking about less difficult works by Liszt; certainly not the Transcendental Etudes, say for instance, " Passage " ( spelling ). Chopin's writing is said to, lie easily under the fingers, while you certainly can't say that about the " Mazeppa " for example by Liszt. ' one needs really flexible fingers to get through that one. I'm supposing you can handle the " Don Juan Fantasy " better than anything considered to be just as difficult by Chopin. Please, name that piece for me. His Etude op. 25 in thirds might come to mind. Just a discussion, only.
well i mean, if they were your teacher, you'd already have to pay oh, and you'd have to wait for time travel to come out and be able to speak what language they did (but maybe you already do, idk) and you would have to explain that you are from a least a hundred years in the future and try not to get put in an asylum for the insane
I don't think money really matters to them. It's talent of the students and presence of the piano they are seeking. Money is only acting upto certain extent as a filter.
Awesome video! I truly enjoyed it. I would say I'm in both sides as a teacher. About my relationships with my students: I am as reserved as Chopin although with some of my students I become a friend and the teaching style goes a little bit Liszt. Also, I have students that are my friends from the beginning, so definitely the teaching style is different with them. About interpretation: This is a hard one. I agree with Chopin about interpretation. Living in a time with access to technology, I encourage my students to listen to different pianists and take what they like about that to their own interpretation. The problem is that some deviate from the original purpose and become critics and so they spend hours criticizing Lang Lang, or Pollini or whatever and not practicing at all. About practice time. I'm absolutely with Chopin on this one. I tell my students to think about goals instead of practice time. However, fory personal practice sessions, I am more on the List side, but I like it! Technique: I teach technique directly on the pieces. I don't like giving my students endless amounts of Hanon. I think that's all for now. Once again, I enjoyed this video so much! Awesome channel!
Debussy met Liszt and was Deeply influenced by him. Liszt's Les Jeuxd'eaux à la Villa d'Este (The fountains of the Villa d'esme) was one of many that inspired Debussy's impressionistic works, of which Liszt truly invented.
Very nice video, love it. There's a book called Aspects of Chopin, by Alfred Cortot, and he makes a transcription of a Chopin's manuscript. Basically it says that the students must start with the E major scale, instead of the C major, because it's more natural for the hand position.
I´m totally on the Chopin side! He seems to have been very insightful and modern in approach. It would be very interesting to know details about his method. Maybe a pre-Neuhaus?
I would say that both methods of teaching have their strengths and weaknesses. Additionally, one's preference also depends on how much they'd like to publicly perform. That being said, I think Chopin's one-on-one sessions are really good for people who are a little more introverted (like myself), but I'd also attend Liszt's sessions because they'd force me to play under pressure. Also, Liszt did more free sessions than not, which is kind of hard to compete with. I can't guess which style Alyssia prefers, aaaaaand that's okay.
I always loved Chopin’s music early on in life .... But once being exposed to Liszt I just wouldn’t want to do without one or the other .... I just gotta have both 🤗🙏🏽👍🏽
I agree more with Chopin's style, and suspect you probably might as well. :) Although the aspects of Liszt's teaching I like are the master class idea, and that his students could chum around with him.
Great video, as always. One constructive criticism: The Word 'Klavier' (with K) is german, not french. Thus, it is pronounced "klu-veer". Greetings from Germany.
@@tchaivorakfauresohnsieg9532 It's not a about grammar, it's about pronunciation. And it was just meant constructively. Or do you think, everyone should pronounce everything as they think it should be pronounced? If that was the case, we couldn't communicate anymore.
While it is true the word « Klavier » is German, there is also a French word « Clavier » , a Danish word « Klaver » and the Dutch word « Klavier » . That’s because the word has its roots in the Latin. There are multiple pronunciations because the word exists in multiple languages, but still has the same origin. Greetings from Canada
I'm surprised so many people think you prefer Chopin's method. Having watched lots of your videos and also, by the way you explained both methods, it gave me the impression you prefer Liszt's. Now I'm really curious hahaha. Great video Allysia as always. I think I prefer Liszt's method, btw, even if I love Chopin's music. Maybe that's why I think you do too 😋
I spend a lot of time doing the left hand in Chopin and in Liszt. I did not play any Etudes unless they have musical merit and good quality writing. Bach is the exception. Because all his has technical elements . I also play colours not just notes!
I feel like Liszt's style is more that of mine, but I have some elements of Chopin. Having a level of subtly and bombast, I would definitely prefer Liszt as a teacher, as I love performance. And I think that you also align with Liszt
As for me, I actually have no preference between the two. I can hear Liszt one day, and be on a virtual kick for at least a month or so, forgetting everyone else. Not just Chopin, but Brahms ( my favorite composer ). Mendelsohn and Schumann: The same goes for him. And of course, Chopin. Rachmaninoff too. Add Schubert's sonatas, and I'm gone again. Then, it's Bach and another month gets shot in the, well, you know what I mean. These guys wrote so much and so many beautiful works; so many gorgeous melodies you can't get enough of them in one day or week. Liszt However, wrote the strangest and haunting, even saddest middle song like development tone poems, if you will, in his creations. The " Dante Sonata " for example. Even his 2nd Concerto. The Massive Sonata also. Chopin wrote similar melodies as well. But there's something about Liszt that would nearly bring me to tears: not unlike transforming me to the time in which they actually lived. Seeing them in their attire, and the women they looked over: the gowns and hats, rustling dresses, furtive glances, flirting.
Apparently Liszt went to a Paganini concert and was inspired by the virtuosity and technical perfection which became him and his style. I take it he expected that virtuosity from his students. You are deffo Chopin
That's not entirely true, yes, he was greatly influenced by Paganini's virtuosity, but Liszt was influenced by Schubert, Beethoven, Chopin, etc. and was so much more. Check out FRANZ LISZT: ENIGMATIC GENIUS on TH-cam
Merci for this. I think piano teachers today seem to have Liszt's of historic teachers and are quick to put them on the Chopin block. Yes, it was pretty punny, but you took the Beethoven.
Very few teachers prefer just Chopin style or Liszt style. For example, I put a very big amount of time in the lessons to very physical issues, such as fingerings, movement of the arm and so on. Trying to help the student to achieve their pieces. Those make so big difference in sound. But at the same time I don't believe in technical exercises. I don't focus those things because of technique. When playing beautiful music, there's no effor just in technique. Technique is unique with every pianist and when one finds a comfortable way to do things, that's the main point, not the specific technique style. Technique is to help people, not as an intrinsic value. :)
The differences run far deeper than you describe. As composers, there is no contest: there is more genius in one measure of a Chopin Ballade than in anything Liszt managed to spew out. Liszt was truly acknowledged as the greatest pianist of his time and Chopin agreed. But Chopin detested Liszt's music, as you would/should expect. There are other differences as well. Good video on their teaching.
As a piano teacher, I consider Chopin's approach as the basic technic, the most fundamental, to play romantic music, as well as Bach and Mozart ones for the previous styles. When the hands and the mind are well formed by that three fundamental ways to play the keyboard, then we can develop another kind of of virtuosity with Beethoven and Liszt way of playing, and further with Bartók and Prokoviev, to name the most paradigmatic composers from the technical point of view. I teach in Chopin's way, very precise on technical movements, fingering, related to the expressive content of each musical phrase, pattern, note... I do believe a student needs to be precisely guided into technical and musical matters. Liszt seems to me more a kind of a guru, able to help very good pianists to understand the emotional and poetical basis of a piece to bring it out while playing, but not a real teacher. His "technical studies" are very interesting to understand his very germanic systematic approach of the technic, they are useful for advanced students, as well as Brahms studies.
@@therealrealludwigvanbeethoven Because Chopin is better than Liszt, in a different way, but still a little better. However we all know sir, that you are the true legend who inspired them
@@Tguchi26 Thank you, my friend. However, I strongly disagree with the assertion that Chopin is 'better' than Liszt. Although Chopin was undoubtedly a gifted composer, Liszt's maturity & innovation later in his life led him to preconceive music of the 20th century, and in doing so, he automatically is more innovative than his Polish/French contemporary. In regards to lyricism and subjective 'beauty' in music, I believe that Liszt is easily on par or above Chopin. This is subjective, however, I would encourage you to take a look at Liszt's Annees to begin with. To conclude, I believe Chopin & Liszt are rivals or the latter is better, through musical innovation, astonishing lyricism, and overall compositional rigor.
I´m quite surprised that Liszt didn´t care much about tecnique, everybody knows he was czerny´s student and czerny learned from Beethoven. I started my piano playing with a beloved teacher who passed away and he really wasn´t too much into technique either, eventhough he was my teacher from the Conservatory, he studied in Moscow and I learned to play more with independent fingers tecnique, what liszt´s followers call spider fingers, now I have a new teacher who is literally in love with Liszt and Arrau. Arrau followed the line of Liszt through Martin Krauze. And for what I noticed Liszt´s disciples are very complimentary with Liszt´s tecnique. And my current lessons involve a lot more tecnique. Chopin named Liszt´s music as "vulgar" and in a way you gave the right answer in your video. Chopin considered the piano and piano tecnique for what they were "instruments", "tools" "means to an end" while many consider Liszt as the father of the school of piano virtuosity, for christ´s sake he invented the "piano recital". So Chopin might tought that Liszt´s music was putting music at the service of the instrument, totally preposterous for Chopin´s mind. Anyway you shade a lot of light about Liszt´s ways to see music, I´ll have to learn a lot more about this great master. No matter what, I agree with Chopin, Liszt´s music is wonderful, a little too much for my taste. Now after learning spider fingers tecnique and Liszt´s tecnique, I´ve got to concede, Liszt´s tecnique involving natural movements of the hands, arms and body as a whole, are superb, superior of everything I knew, eventhough he wasn´t too much into it, as you say, to me is a total mistery. Thanks pianoTv wonderful video. What´s your favorite tecnique?
I prefer Chopin's teaching, I think piano have to be teached one on one, and with technique included of course. And I think you prefer Chopin's ;) Nice video!
Thank you for the great information. But why do you often show the whites of your eyes? It looks so scary that it reminds me of a horror movie like Shining.
Pianists are obligated to Chopin because he writes music that has consequence (of a specific and singular voice) and substance that is described by melodic and harmonic ingenuity sufficient enough to justify it. More importantly, it can actually be played satisfactorily by advanced pianists, to thereby win the popular lobby. Liszt is everyway much more challenging, but not because, as is often believed, because of the technique required, but because of the vision required to navigate the music. Only the most gifted pianists sponsor the kind of technical competency necessary to realize or loose Liszt's music from the demands of the technique that 'trap' it. Both Liszt and Chopin were too musically obligated to ever intended that their music 'sound' technically challenging (dazzling is a different matter), but of the two, Chopin's music suffers technical vulgarity with greater dignity. Liszt is far more fragile, which is why there are so many bad performances of it challenging his legacy. If you've played the Anees De Pelerinage, you know that the easy parts are hard, and the hard parts are, even for most who dare to perform them in public, impossible to traverse without imparting a sense of your own...personal physical struggle with it, which interferes with both the intent and the music, you haven't the gifts necessary to entertain it. If you are caused to become aware of the struggle, either the performance has failed, or your musical orientation is unsophisticated. Anyone can play Chopin. Witness his presence in the catalogue and on TH-cam. Liszt is a different matter. The best of it, while being admittedly technically astounding, fails as music, but it's not Liszt's fault...and yet...it is. Here is a rare performance that actually succeeds in channeling the spirit Liszt intended and requires in order not to fail. It is both technically and musically transcendent, because the silences, which are the hard part of the Lisztian architecture, are rapturous: you are caused to listen 'into' them...until the abyss looks back (in the Nietzschean sense). Enjoy! th-cam.com/video/kH6bFu7la5g/w-d-xo.html
If more that cavalier interest you should read Prof. Alan Walker, who spent twenty years in pure research on Franz Liszt. One note of interest is the seven years, traveling though Europe and Russia giving over 1000 concerts for people who otherwise would never get to hear music played from the Masters, Beethoven, Bach, etc. Liszt also is credited with the word 'recital'...transcription and paraphrase. There are also many lectures you can Google by Alan Walker, very enlightening!
My guess is Chopin since you uploaded 10 or so videos about Chopin (which I love btw, he's totally my favorite composer).
6:07
*LING LING WANTS TO KNOW YOUR LOCATION*
Totally totally underrated af
DAMN I WANTED TO COMMENT THIS
Lol
Liszt teached in Paris as a teenager until his early twenties, and while he had a relationsship with Marie d'Agoult, that lasted until the early 1840s. Back then, he taught anybody who could afford. But after he stopped his touring in 1847, he always taught his students for free. Czerny taught Liszt for free.
These guys really put their personalities into their music
Liszt is my favorite of the two composers, as his work is a lot more diverse than Chopin (well, he also lived for a lot longer), but I definitely prefer Chopin's teaching philosophy over Liszt's. It'd kill me to have an audience when I just want to learn.
Remember they had different students. If your goal is to be a concert pianist. An audience is something you have to conquer any way some time down the road. I can kind of see why he did it, sort of introducing it in a more casual way, than say an actual concert hall full of people.
I would wonder then... what is your favourite Liszt piece?
I think Chopin had a more consistently brilliant list of compositions. Yes, Liszt’s work is more diverse but that’s a function of his life span.
@@willsteele793 Liszt’s diversity had nothing to do with life span. Anyone familiar with his work knows he was not only diverse from the start (as the Transcendental Etudes attest), but his works encompass life, far more broad in concept and brilliant than Chopin’s secluded microcosm of a world. Granted, Chopin certainly composed many brilliant gems, but also a very large body of mundane works that bear one listen only.
@@richdisilvio4591 Well, while it is true that Liszt was diverse in his early years, because he ked a long life he got to become even more diverse in his last decade or so where he explored ideas that would be associated with 20th century impressionism and atonality. What Chopin would have been doing had he lived into his 70s is hard to say.
A few things to point out here:
- first, and most important: Liszt only switched to giving masterclasses in his old age! It wasn't something he did in the 1830s or 40s, during his younger years in Paris he gave lessons one-on-one, just like Chopin. Your video doesn't consider Liszt's one-on-one lessons, you exclusively talk about his late-life masterclasses. Those are two very different things. Apples and oranges. Liszt taught amateurs like Chopin did when he was in Paris, giving his one-on-one lessons. On the other hand, he taught mostly up-and-coming concert pianists in his masterclasses - as is customary today. Of course, he absolutely did teach technique in his one-on-one lessons in his younger years in Paris - there he was teaching amateurs, it would have been absurd not to teach them technique. However, it would have likewise been absurd to teach technique in his masterclasses - when he was teaching professionals or near-professionals.
- there is no indication that Liszt tended to single out beautiful, young noblewomen as pupils.
- there is no indication that Liszt was romantically or otherwise involved with any of them, except for Caroline de St- Cricq, when Liszt was 17 and she was 16 - by the way, her father didn't want her to be with a lowly pianist, so he married her off to a nobleman in the Pyrenees, this caused Liszt to be so depressed that he completely disappeared from the limelight: a newpaper famously published his obituary(!), presuming that he was dead - one couldn't make this up, seriously.
- I'm not sure what repertoire Liszt used in his one-on-one lessons - presumably he followed his teacher's (Czerny's) lead, so: Bach, Scarlatti, Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven, Czerny, Hummel and probably incorporated some romantic contemporaries, like Chopin and Schumann. In his masterclasses he taught the whole spectrum of keyboard music, from Bach up to hot-off-the-press pieces. Sometimes he included pieces that weren't even published yet. The one piece I know he was sick of hearing in his classes was his own Polonaise No.2 in E-Major. (For the same reason you cite for the Chopin Scherzo.)
- The "dirty linen" quotation doesn't say "leave it at home" rather "wash it at home" - meaning polish your technique at home. That way it makes sense.
Gergely Kiss how much research did you do to write this comment
@@jacobsimonson9040 For this comment I haven't done any :) I have studied music history at uni and wrote my thesis on Liszt (his Lieder to be precise), I've also read half-a-dozen Liszt biographies, dozens of scholarly articles about Liszt in music history journals, a decent number of letters from his correspondence and a few memoirs from his students. (There is even a voice recording on youtube from Frederic Lamond, a Scottish student of Liszt where he is talking about Liszt!) I've done some research (not much, I'm not a musicologist, it's just a hobby) - but I can't say any of it was for this comment. :)
Gergely Kiss fair enough
I have a suspicion that you are very familiar with Alan Walker.
@@gergelykiss liszt was a hippie of his time, he was active with more than a few women and had several illegitimate children with them.
Unfortunately Allysia has made quite a number of mistakes in this video, such as missing the crucial point that she’s referring to Liszt in later years when he had Master Classes with semi-professional pianists, so an audience was a novel and ingenious concept. And yes, they had to be well-trained to even be in these classes, which were all Free. And "pretty" women is another falsehood, as Princess Carolyne, whom he intended to marry, was NO physical beauty, but had a beautiful mind. Liszt is too often portrayed as shallow, yet his artistic and spiritual beliefs were extremely profound, even if he couldn't restrain himself from women.
Moreover, Liszt loathed the metronome, which destroys feeling and makes works sound more robotic, and stressed not only fluidity but also immersing one’s self into the music, to envision what you are playing to better bring it to life, hence the Polish Cavalry anecdote. Check out FRANZ LISZT: ENIGMATIC GENIUS on TH-cam
Very interesting video . You are a marvellous communicator and I love all your videos .
GREAT video... and never forget... when the great Rachmaninoff was told "my dear Rachmaninoff, you are the greatest pianist I have ever heard" Rachmaninoff would respond "That's because you've never heard Anton Rubinstein..." when folks use to come up to Anton Rubinstein and say "Anton Rubinstein... surely you are the greatest pianist in history" Anton Rubinstein would say "that's because you've never heard the GREAT Franz Liszt!"
Don't sell Liszt short... many of his GREAT works also have GREAT sensitive sections... LIKE the GREAT B minor Sonata... "Years of Pilgrimage" or the Consolations... and others... BUT the big part of your conversation... SPOT ON...! very informative... and QUICK moving and entertaining... PERFECT!!!! LOVED it!!!!!
I like Chopin's teaching a little more, and I believe Alyssia is also on Chopin's side :P Very interesting video!
Me too, I vote Chopin. She is on Chopin’s side lol.
I thought Mozart doesn't like Chopin
Prawin Rai Mozart never met Chopin
But Chopin did like Mozart
It is the profile picture.
Your channel is amazing! This exactly what I’m looking for ❤. I want to understand classical music better and have a better understanding of the composers .😊
Nice! Thank you. I have a bust on my piano of Franz Lizst. I'm guessing of when he was younger. It was my Dad's, who played piano, too. I loved the Lizst's pieces best!
I like a combination of both of the teachers.
Delightful in every way, great video and so well done and researched.
Lovely presentation! One point about Chopin’s rubato is that he practiced *French rubato*-as did Mozart: keeping the LH steady while the RH gives and takes freely.
Thank you so much for teaching us so much .Subscribed and like instantly .Means so much
I think you like chopin more just from your eye movements 😁. I love the passion that you show in your vids, as it rubs off on me! Thanks for all the great videos 😎👍
I think Lizst’s approach works very well for the advanced students he taught. Most of the great masterclasses you see will have an awful lot more of this style, concepts, images, and metaphor, and the already accomplished student is free to interpret that and bring it into their music. I also think technique and its development is a completely different journey for every student who undertakes it, where each new discovery completely transforms their playjng rather than there being one grand secret. I do also think that to teach exercises and solutions to technical issues is vital for students who arent at that advanced level. Its more a matter of building the biggest repertoire of exercises and solutions possible, fit for any situation you can find yourself in, and the advanced student should be able to draw on exercises they know but also be inventive in their own solutions to a technical issue. The importance of knowing what truly, REALLY loose and tension free technique FEELS like I think is one of the more significant things, but everyones different
From all of your descriptions of their teaching styles, personalities and music, Chopin would seem to be the quintessential introvert and Liszt the quintessential extrovert.
Thank you, Alicia - wow, terrific. I'm always struck by how
unoriginal we musicians can be, copying the precise phrasing
of our teachers and favorite superstars. Even the superstars can't
help but copy each other, playing the identical tempi, pauses, ornaments... thanks for this vital history lesson.
Chopin: introvert.
Liszt: extrovert
Yes just like Beethoven(Chopin) and Mozart(Liszt)
I think they are both perfect examples of the two main types of teaching that generally work. I like Chopins take on technique since my view is very similar. I look at technique as freedom and taste, the better technique you have the wider range of sounds and therefore expression you can use which is freedom. When you make the choice to express a piece in the most careful and best way you can imagine then you are choosing technique befitting of that interpretation aka good taste. I really love this video.
I'm biased towards Liszt cause I started playing piano after Lisztening to his pieces as a kid : P
Hi Allysia,
Great video as always !
Just a small note : At 5:29, you wrote "Schuman" with one "n" while the composer has two "n" at the end.
Nothing dramatic, just saying.
Another grammarphile
I love this kind of videos!
I love them both .... but Chopin seems to me to be more sensitive & romantic to me ❤️🤗🙏🏽
Someone translated his personal letters and letters that were published in newspapers of the time reviewing other composers works. A wonderful book called portrait of an artist. Probably some of the letters were written by his main squeeze.
What a lovely video! It's fun to get geeky about this stuff :) I want to recommend a book with writings from Chopin's pupils. Pianist and Teacher: As Seen by his Pupils.
According to Alan walkers biography of Liszt, he never charged any for a lesson, ever. Czerny taught Liszt for free and Liszt wanted to return the same favor to the world.
I believe he did in his teenage years as that was basically his only job after his father died.
Most people here think you lean towards Chopin than Liszt... but watching your videos, your methods seem to align more with Liszt.
Either way, both composers were extraordinary talents, and for me it's hard to say which of the two I prefer - I like them both for very different reasons. However, the bizarre thing is that I can't play Chopin for the life of me, but I can play Liszt.
Hey, Jason: That's the weirdest thing I've ever heard really!!! You have to be talking about less difficult works by Liszt; certainly not the Transcendental Etudes, say for instance, " Passage " ( spelling ). Chopin's writing is said to, lie easily under the fingers, while you certainly can't say that about the " Mazeppa " for example by Liszt. ' one needs really flexible fingers to get through that one. I'm supposing you can handle the " Don Juan Fantasy " better than anything considered to be just as difficult by Chopin. Please, name that piece for me. His Etude op. 25 in thirds might come to mind. Just a discussion, only.
Oh tank you Allysia! I was so looking forward to this video😀
I would pay money for one of these to be my teacher.
well i mean, if they were your teacher, you'd already have to pay
oh, and you'd have to wait for time travel to come out and be able to speak what language they did (but maybe you already do, idk) and you would have to explain that you are from a least a hundred years in the future and try not to get put in an asylum for the insane
And then u manage to play future pieces they will
I don't think money really matters to them. It's talent of the students and presence of the piano they are seeking. Money is only acting upto certain extent as a filter.
Awesome video! I truly enjoyed it. I would say I'm in both sides as a teacher.
About my relationships with my students:
I am as reserved as Chopin although with some of my students I become a friend and the teaching style goes a little bit Liszt. Also, I have students that are my friends from the beginning, so definitely the teaching style is different with them.
About interpretation:
This is a hard one. I agree with Chopin about interpretation. Living in a time with access to technology, I encourage my students to listen to different pianists and take what they like about that to their own interpretation. The problem is that some deviate from the original purpose and become critics and so they spend hours criticizing Lang Lang, or Pollini or whatever and not practicing at all.
About practice time. I'm absolutely with Chopin on this one. I tell my students to think about goals instead of practice time. However, fory personal practice sessions, I am more on the List side, but I like it!
Technique: I teach technique directly on the pieces. I don't like giving my students endless amounts of Hanon.
I think that's all for now.
Once again, I enjoyed this video so much! Awesome channel!
It would be interesting to know how much of an influence Chopin had on Debussy. It sounds like Chopin's approach anticipated Debussy's tone pallette.
Debussy met Liszt and was Deeply influenced by him. Liszt's Les Jeuxd'eaux à la Villa d'Este (The fountains of the Villa d'esme) was one of many that inspired Debussy's impressionistic works, of which Liszt truly invented.
@@amygoodwin9170 that is very interesting! Thank you for the helpful information!
Very nice video, love it. There's a book called Aspects of Chopin, by Alfred Cortot, and he makes a transcription of a Chopin's manuscript. Basically it says that the students must start with the E major scale, instead of the C major, because it's more natural for the hand position.
David Velasquez E Major scale? I thought it would be B Major..
i totally agree with that; i’m not great at scales and i have always found e major to be way easier than c major.
A good selection of beethoven sonata movements and chopin etudes must be a part of any advanced student's body of work.
I´m totally on the Chopin side! He seems to have been very insightful and modern in approach. It would be very interesting to know details about his method. Maybe a pre-Neuhaus?
I would say that both methods of teaching have their strengths and weaknesses. Additionally, one's preference also depends on how much they'd like to publicly perform.
That being said, I think Chopin's one-on-one sessions are really good for people who are a little more introverted (like myself), but I'd also attend Liszt's sessions because they'd force me to play under pressure. Also, Liszt did more free sessions than not, which is kind of hard to compete with.
I can't guess which style Alyssia prefers, aaaaaand that's okay.
Enjoyed this !!
Very good video! Very enjoyable!
Love both composers but i have to choose Liszt on this one
Thanks, love your content!
That was very instructional. Thank you!
How about you Allysia? Whay kind of teacher are you?
Thanks, lovely to learn
I mean when you consider how many of their students became actual concert pianists, who is the better teacher - who has the better method?
I always loved Chopin’s music early on in life .... But once being exposed to Liszt I just wouldn’t want to do without one or the other .... I just gotta have both 🤗🙏🏽👍🏽
Your hair is beautiful
I prefer Chopin's teaching more, he is obviously my favourite composer
Liszt: group master-classes, students performing in front of people.
Me: *Ah, yes, the Suzuki way...*
I agree more with Chopin's style, and suspect you probably might as well. :) Although the aspects of Liszt's teaching I like are the master class idea, and that his students could chum around with him.
Do a piano series on pianists please.
Wonderful ! xxxxxxx
Great video, as always.
One constructive criticism: The Word 'Klavier' (with K) is german, not french. Thus, it is pronounced "klu-veer".
Greetings from Germany.
Make peace with yourself dude its alright
Its not grammar lesson going on
@@tchaivorakfauresohnsieg9532
It's not a about grammar, it's about pronunciation.
And it was just meant constructively.
Or do you think, everyone should pronounce everything as they think it should be pronounced? If that was the case, we couldn't communicate anymore.
@@laertesdd thts the case actually, everyone pronounce everything as they think unless they aren't aware of the language from which the word is from
While it is true the word « Klavier » is German, there is also a French word « Clavier » , a Danish word « Klaver » and the Dutch word « Klavier » . That’s because the word has its roots in the Latin. There are multiple pronunciations because the word exists in multiple languages, but still has the same origin.
Greetings from Canada
I'm surprised so many people think you prefer Chopin's method. Having watched lots of your videos and also, by the way you explained both methods, it gave me the impression you prefer Liszt's. Now I'm really curious hahaha. Great video Allysia as always. I think I prefer Liszt's method, btw, even if I love Chopin's music. Maybe that's why I think you do too 😋
Do a video on Emil gilels and svitoslav Richter
If I had a choice I would prefer Chopin as a teacher. I don’t think I would have stood a chance with Liszt lol.
A M Salim just imagine having Liszt as a teacher lol...
Liszt was actually very good to his students. He was extraordinarily generous and even had students live with him.
thanks for this comprehensive video :)
This is the earliest I have been
you're definetely on the chopin side, you smile so much more when you talk about him XD
E
4.
E
Y
🍉🍏🍏🍏
Liszt also refused to teach his Hungarian Rhapsody no 2 for the same reason he didn't teach the b minor scherzo
You mean Bb minor scherzo, right?
I prefer Chopin! The gentle and kind ;). Thanks for your lovely video!
She is a swell young lady! Most capable!
Who's your favorite ???? 👀👀👀👀
Chopin!!!
Liszt
I spend a lot of time doing the left hand in Chopin and in Liszt. I did not play any Etudes unless they have musical merit and good quality writing. Bach is the exception. Because all his has technical elements
. I also play colours not just notes!
High quality video comparison.
I like Chopin's approach to fingering and technique more but I also very much like Liszt's focus on performance and master classes.
My teacher teaching Chpopin commented that he is treated as a introvert but the way he died says otherwise.
Chopin for sure!! And thanks for your amazing videos
I feel like Liszt's style is more that of mine, but I have some elements of Chopin. Having a level of subtly and bombast, I would definitely prefer Liszt as a teacher, as I love performance. And I think that you also align with Liszt
As for me, I actually have no preference between the two. I can hear Liszt one day, and be on a virtual kick for at least a month or so, forgetting everyone else. Not just Chopin, but Brahms ( my favorite composer ). Mendelsohn and Schumann: The same goes for him. And of course, Chopin. Rachmaninoff too. Add Schubert's sonatas, and I'm gone again. Then, it's Bach and another month gets shot in the, well, you know what I mean. These guys wrote so much and so many beautiful works; so many gorgeous melodies you can't get enough of them in one day or week. Liszt However, wrote the strangest and haunting, even saddest middle song like development tone poems, if you will, in his creations. The " Dante Sonata " for example. Even his 2nd Concerto. The Massive Sonata also. Chopin wrote similar melodies as well. But there's something about Liszt that would nearly bring me to tears: not unlike transforming me to the time in which they actually lived. Seeing them in their attire, and the women they looked over: the gowns and hats, rustling dresses, furtive glances, flirting.
poderia por favor colocar legenda em portugues?
Apparently Liszt went to a Paganini concert and was inspired by the virtuosity and technical perfection which became him and his style. I take it he expected that virtuosity from his students. You are deffo Chopin
That's not entirely true, yes, he was greatly influenced by Paganini's virtuosity, but Liszt was influenced by Schubert, Beethoven, Chopin, etc. and was so much more. Check out FRANZ LISZT: ENIGMATIC GENIUS on TH-cam
Merci for this. I think piano teachers today seem to have Liszt's of historic teachers and are quick to put them on the Chopin block.
Yes, it was pretty punny, but you took the Beethoven.
What is the name of the painting at 6:37?
Very few teachers prefer just Chopin style or Liszt style. For example, I put a very big amount of time in the lessons to very physical issues, such as fingerings, movement of the arm and so on. Trying to help the student to achieve their pieces. Those make so big difference in sound. But at the same time I don't believe in technical exercises. I don't focus those things because of technique. When playing beautiful music, there's no effor just in technique. Technique is unique with every pianist and when one finds a comfortable way to do things, that's the main point, not the specific technique style. Technique is to help people, not as an intrinsic value. :)
The differences run far deeper than you describe. As composers, there is no contest: there is more genius in one measure of a Chopin Ballade than in anything Liszt managed to spew out. Liszt was truly acknowledged as the greatest pianist of his time and Chopin agreed. But Chopin detested Liszt's music, as you would/should expect. There are other differences as well.
Good video on their teaching.
As a piano teacher, I consider Chopin's approach as the basic technic, the most fundamental, to play romantic music, as well as Bach and Mozart ones for the previous styles. When the hands and the mind are well formed by that three fundamental ways to play the keyboard, then we can develop another kind of of virtuosity with Beethoven and Liszt way of playing, and further with Bartók and Prokoviev, to name the most paradigmatic composers from the technical point of view.
I teach in Chopin's way, very precise on technical movements, fingering, related to the expressive content of each musical phrase, pattern, note... I do believe a student needs to be precisely guided into technical and musical matters. Liszt seems to me more a kind of a guru, able to help very good pianists to understand the emotional and poetical basis of a piece to bring it out while playing, but not a real teacher.
His "technical studies" are very interesting to understand his very germanic systematic approach of the technic, they are useful for advanced students, as well as Brahms studies.
PianoTv nice video☺ can you do a piano tutorial of ruins of Athens (simplified) Beethoven thanks you 😝
I think you're on the Chopin side btw
You’re definitely on the Chopin side :)
Azgal0r im on liszts
Batman Bin Suparman why?
@@Tguchi26 Why not?
@@therealrealludwigvanbeethoven Because Chopin is better than Liszt, in a different way, but still a little better. However we all know sir, that you are the true legend who inspired them
@@Tguchi26 Thank you, my friend. However, I strongly disagree with the assertion that Chopin is 'better' than Liszt. Although Chopin was undoubtedly a gifted composer, Liszt's maturity & innovation later in his life led him to preconceive music of the 20th century, and in doing so, he automatically is more innovative than his Polish/French contemporary. In regards to lyricism and subjective 'beauty' in music, I believe that Liszt is easily on par or above Chopin. This is subjective, however, I would encourage you to take a look at Liszt's Annees to begin with. To conclude, I believe Chopin & Liszt are rivals or the latter is better, through musical innovation, astonishing lyricism, and overall compositional rigor.
Scherzo*
Winner: Shoppin' Liszt
Shoppin List
I like Chopin's teching!
8:42 That's "cavalry," not "calvary."
There are good and bad sides of both teaching philosophies. :3
8:37 Hardcore!
😎😎😎
I´m quite surprised that Liszt didn´t care much about tecnique, everybody knows he was czerny´s student and czerny learned from Beethoven. I started my piano playing with a beloved teacher who passed away and he really wasn´t too much into technique either, eventhough he was my teacher from the Conservatory, he studied in Moscow and I learned to play more with independent fingers tecnique, what liszt´s followers call spider fingers, now I have a new teacher who is literally in love with Liszt and Arrau. Arrau followed the line of Liszt through Martin Krauze. And for what I noticed Liszt´s disciples are very complimentary with Liszt´s tecnique. And my current lessons involve a lot more tecnique. Chopin named Liszt´s music as "vulgar" and in a way you gave the right answer in your video. Chopin considered the piano and piano tecnique for what they were "instruments", "tools" "means to an end" while many consider Liszt as the father of the school of piano virtuosity, for christ´s sake he invented the "piano recital". So Chopin might tought that Liszt´s music was putting music at the service of the instrument, totally preposterous for Chopin´s mind. Anyway you shade a lot of light about Liszt´s ways to see music, I´ll have to learn a lot more about this great master. No matter what, I agree with Chopin, Liszt´s music is wonderful, a little too much for my taste. Now after learning spider fingers tecnique and Liszt´s tecnique, I´ve got to concede, Liszt´s tecnique involving natural movements of the hands, arms and body as a whole, are superb, superior of everything I knew, eventhough he wasn´t too much into it, as you say, to me is a total mistery. Thanks pianoTv wonderful video. What´s your favorite tecnique?
I prefer Chopin's teaching, I think piano have to be teached one on one, and with technique included of course.
And I think you prefer Chopin's ;)
Nice video!
6:59
If i wanted to become concert pianist then liszt, but for composing chopin. Both are just amazing!
I'd rather go to Liszt for both. He was better at composing than Chopin.
Thank you for the great information.
But why do you often show the whites of your eyes?
It looks so scary that it reminds me of a horror movie like Shining.
if you say so
Pianists are obligated to Chopin because he writes music that has consequence (of a specific and singular voice) and substance that is described by melodic and harmonic ingenuity sufficient enough to justify it. More importantly, it can actually be played satisfactorily by advanced pianists, to thereby win the popular lobby.
Liszt is everyway much more challenging, but not because, as is often believed, because of the technique required, but because of the vision required to navigate the music. Only the most gifted pianists sponsor the kind of technical competency necessary to realize or loose Liszt's music from the demands of the technique that 'trap' it.
Both Liszt and Chopin were too musically obligated to ever intended that their music 'sound' technically challenging (dazzling is a different matter), but of the two, Chopin's music suffers technical vulgarity with greater dignity. Liszt is far more fragile, which is why there are so many bad performances of it challenging his legacy.
If you've played the Anees De Pelerinage, you know that the easy parts are hard, and the hard parts are, even for most who dare to perform them in public, impossible to traverse without imparting a sense of your own...personal physical struggle with it, which interferes with both the intent and the music, you haven't the gifts necessary to entertain it.
If you are caused to become aware of the struggle, either the performance has failed, or your musical orientation is unsophisticated. Anyone can play Chopin. Witness his presence in the catalogue and on TH-cam. Liszt is a different matter. The best of it, while being admittedly technically astounding, fails as music, but it's not Liszt's fault...and yet...it is.
Here is a rare performance that actually succeeds in channeling the spirit Liszt intended and requires in order not to fail. It is both technically and musically transcendent, because the silences, which are the hard part of the Lisztian architecture, are rapturous: you are caused to listen 'into' them...until the abyss looks back (in the Nietzschean sense). Enjoy! th-cam.com/video/kH6bFu7la5g/w-d-xo.html
Not sure I'd want to learn with either of them;
They'd show up and say "let's start with something easy" and would all go downhill from there.
Some times I like to jam like Liszt ... but on the deeper side Chopin is like Quiet Storm Smooth Mellow Jams 🤗🙏🏽🤗
Who’s better.. none… different expression of Infinity… !!!!!! Don’t try to be expert..,, you can’t define Infinity…!!!! Just Listen …!!! Don’t …
If more that cavalier interest you should read Prof. Alan Walker, who spent twenty years in pure research on Franz Liszt. One note of interest is the seven years, traveling though Europe and Russia giving over 1000 concerts for people who otherwise would never get to hear music played from the Masters, Beethoven, Bach, etc. Liszt also is credited with the word 'recital'...transcription and paraphrase. There are also many lectures you can Google by Alan Walker, very enlightening!
on a side note,
wow you're so pretty
...and on a completely unrelated topic, you have a striking resemblance to Keira Knightley :)