This made Disney look like an absolute joke...

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ธ.ค. 2023
  • #disney #starwars #adamdriver #kyloren #sequeltrilogy
    In a recent interview, Adam Driver opened up regarding the last minute changes made to his character arc in The Rise of Skywalker and talks about the missed potential of Kylo Ren.
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  • @Ron__Solo
    @Ron__Solo 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +11670

    All they had to do was actually plan out a trilogy. But instead they worked on them individually as they went on. Absolutely baffling

    • @TheScathed
      @TheScathed 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +285

      Disney be like: It worked for early Marvel. Why not here?

    • @webguy943
      @webguy943 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +89

      Incompitency

    • @Tink2k
      @Tink2k 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

      They weren't in their own bubbles making the movies. They did discuss them. And there were other factors influencing the final movie - like Carrie's death. Did it require a whole new script? Only they know what the challenges were. Personally, I like what we got - especially the Force Dyad

    • @LoyaltotheNightsky
      @LoyaltotheNightsky 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +93

      That's basically how the original trilogy was done as well. Hence the Luke and Leia incest weirdness, who Vader was supposed to be vs what he actually ended up as, etc. I'm not sure the perfectly crafted plan thing people go on about is really the big issue. Sometimes that actually works out better. There are a variety of factors that went wrong here.

    • @brandonandujar2289
      @brandonandujar2289 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +57

      @@Tink2k mental

  • @Turtle3000
    @Turtle3000 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +6299

    What hurts the most about the sequels is the potential that was so daftly wasted.

    • @Dolphiny_Link
      @Dolphiny_Link 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +54

      100% agreed

    • @FazeParticles
      @FazeParticles 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      but why was it wasted?

    • @deeznuts9886
      @deeznuts9886 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

      Can we swap the word daftly with abhorrently?

    • @Turtle3000
      @Turtle3000 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +64

      @@FazeParticles I mean you watched those movies, right?

    • @olafgurke4699
      @olafgurke4699 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +53

      @@FazeParticles Why was it wasted, indeed. Isn't that the billion dollar question? Why were Disney Lucasfilm given the equivalent of a Bugatti and decided to absolutely floor it into the wall of a graveyard?

  • @joepeaden1661
    @joepeaden1661 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1244

    The kiss in the last scene was legitimately the most "what the fuck" moment I have ever experienced.

    • @zoyadulzura7490
      @zoyadulzura7490 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +39

      I have not see the movie, but this made me laugh.

    • @javierlopez9789
      @javierlopez9789 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +57

      I remember people in my theater booing the moment thay happened.

    • @dhunter1133
      @dhunter1133 26 วันที่ผ่านมา +44

      Given that he mind-graped her in the first movie, for her to have ANY affection for him - much less fall in love with him - is downright embarrassing.

    • @milkychanthefawn
      @milkychanthefawn 26 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

      @@dhunter1133mind grape is not a thing

    • @poppukonfilm
      @poppukonfilm 25 วันที่ผ่านมา +5

      Forced so hard like whyyy

  • @danpage6907
    @danpage6907 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +447

    Most amazing take away from this video: there was "a plan" for the sequel trilogy.

    • @pauldraper1736
      @pauldraper1736 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +28

      then somehow palpatine returned

    • @x_.suzaku._x
      @x_.suzaku._x 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      TFA is decent, but Rian Johnson killed everything

    • @mattr.1887
      @mattr.1887 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      😂😂

    • @JAnx01
      @JAnx01 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      @@x_.suzaku._x No, it's hot garbage.

    • @Cujo5
      @Cujo5 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      @@x_.suzaku._xTFA was the beginning of the mess.

  • @nathantudor5763
    @nathantudor5763 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +7930

    The original arc for kylo would have made Luke’s decision to kill him make so much more sense as well, if Luke knew no matter what anyone did he would irredeemably fall to the dark side the only real course of action would have been to kill him.
    Not perfect, but still better than what we ended up with.

    • @Carlo_ReNews
      @Carlo_ReNews 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +61

      But already does make sense the way it is Luke saw a vision of people suffering through him (Him killing Han…) and wanted to do something about it. Just like in empire where he had a vision and rushed to the fast solution

    • @nathantudor5763
      @nathantudor5763 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +416

      @@Carlo_ReNews yet he decided to redeem his father who had already committed numerous atrocities? Doesn’t make sense that he decided to outright kill his nephew unless he knew he’d be irredeemable.

    • @Carlo_ReNews
      @Carlo_ReNews 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +48

      @@nathantudor5763 He thought about killing him which is in his character. Luke has always been someone who is at first tempted by the easy way, the way of the dark side. I mean even in your example he first tried to kill Vader before realizing that this is wrong. It is the same exact case with Ben

    • @nathantudor5763
      @nathantudor5763 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +106

      @@Carlo_ReNews whilst true, after attempting to kill Vader (which I will remind you he was told he needed to “defeat” by yoda before he would be a Jedi) he didn’t bugger off to some unknown out of the way planet to sulk about it and leave everyone else to deal with the fallout of his actions. That I think is more the issue here than the fact that he acted first on impulse.

    • @Carlo_ReNews
      @Carlo_ReNews 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

      @@nathantudor5763 Okay now we come to an other trade of Luke. I agree him leaving everybody else is a little weird but it comes from the fact that he thinks he caused this and that he is a danger to others because he is a Jedi. Luke would do anything to protect his friend and in this instance he thought him leaving causing the Jedi to die out would be the best option. And it makes sense when we look at how many times the Jedi have messed up and how many times the dark side had rissen again.

  • @abanana6431
    @abanana6431 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +9280

    I think Ben should've been redeemed, while Rey drifts to the dark side. Then in the end it's (Jedi) Finn and Kylo against Sith (or maybe Dark Jedi) Rey, whose power is explosive but unrefined, leading to her destruction. That would've been sick.

    • @Dripularstein
      @Dripularstein 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +755

      Ahhh, sith rey would've been a good way.

    • @FSousA7X
      @FSousA7X 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1188

      Oh Finn, the character they forgot was even in the trilogy😂

    • @BlobThoughtsMTG
      @BlobThoughtsMTG 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +696

      Can't have a female villain. All women are queens 💅

    • @enzoamore8971
      @enzoamore8971 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +103

      I'd rather it be the other way around, but would still keep Finn as the main character.

    • @onlygoodgamesofficial
      @onlygoodgamesofficial 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      All garbage

  • @0That_Guy0
    @0That_Guy0 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +41

    They basically had a golden goose.
    They didn’t want to take the time and prepare the entire plotline. Instead they grabbed the goose and squeezed three scrambled eggs out of it.

  • @chrisbrown6952
    @chrisbrown6952 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +202

    I think I would have liked to have heard more of what Adam Driver actually said and not what you said he said

    • @Criner05
      @Criner05 5 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

      That's what I thought this video was gonna be.

    • @ArcherJ1
      @ArcherJ1 18 วันที่ผ่านมา +3

      A lot of SW content creators do this stuff on purpose to omit details and hop on the sequel bandwagon hate for views. I’ve seen it done the worst with the Adam driver interview specifically cutting away good things he said about ep8. I’m not a huge sequel fan either but it’s really annoying when people pull this kind of stunt.

    • @darrenmays2036
      @darrenmays2036 12 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I’ve also seen what the actors have actually said and none of them think those movies were good

  • @clockwork3991
    @clockwork3991 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2645

    After seeing The Force awakens I always assumed that was where it was going. His character seemed so desperate to dive deeper and deeper into the dark side. I actually found it interesting that he was tempted by the light side, and would then take drastic actions like killing Han to push himself and resist the light. I wish they would have stuck with it.

    • @sammco6704
      @sammco6704 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +192

      The thing is, even in force awakens you can tell he is forcing himself down the dark, even when his tendencies don't necisarily reflect that. I think a redemption Ben could have worked if they played with the dicotomy of what he wants versus what his impulses are. What I wish happened is over the course of the trilogy, Rey's impulses push her down the dark while she wants to remain in the light and Ben's impulses push him down the light while he wants to remain in the dark. Eventually, both give in to their impulses and it becomes Sith Rey versus Redeemed Kylo, with Finn caught in the middle attempting to save his friend. I think that would have been sick and would have naturally reflected the arcs both of the characters seemed to be going down from Force Awakens.

    • @elan8213
      @elan8213 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +14

      It’s such a terrible arc to begin with - the creators forced the shift against everything from the original trilogy.

    • @calebriver
      @calebriver 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

      as an 11 year old who grew up on star wars when force awakens came out, i was hoping we would get that story. i was in the middle of liking and disliking it but as the trilogy continued i liked them less and less cause they really didnt know what to do with the characters

    • @wileymoore3914
      @wileymoore3914 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Same

    • @Fxrrxt2x
      @Fxrrxt2x 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      ​@@sammco6704 That would've been amazing. I had hoped they would do something like that at the time.

  • @BiggusWeeabus
    @BiggusWeeabus 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +497

    Kylo being basically Anti-Vader would have made SO MUCH MORE SENSE

    • @maaingan
      @maaingan 5 หลายเดือนก่อน +47

      Right??? Why was he never taught that Darth Vader actually died *defying the Emperor* as Anakin Skywalker… a Jedi?!? He was trained to be a Jedi by the son of Anakin, and it never came up?!? His hero was a fuckin Jedi, why does he spend 90% of the trilogy trying to emulate the embodiment of the ultimate redemption arc if he’s supposed to be evil?? He should have been tempted by the dark side exactly like his uncle and grandfather were, but ultimately give in to his compassion. Rey should have been the one that comes off as relatable, being a poor nobody with nothing- who is then corrupted by her newfound ability to claim anything she wants as hers using her strength to take from others and cause despair because of her origins as a wounded, lonely, dejected urchin. Both characters would have been not only watchable, but endearing and timeless

    • @user-tg1tz8pu3s
      @user-tg1tz8pu3s หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      he would have been a much better villain

    • @MrChoklad
      @MrChoklad หลายเดือนก่อน +9

      @@maaingan that would've been a thrilling direction, made with love and respect for the original story, something disney clearly doesn't have.

  • @superpacocaalado7215
    @superpacocaalado7215 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +34

    If you have a villain kill Han Solo, do it to the bitter end.
    That scene meant that there was no coming back from the dark side for him, he killed his father, the same way there would be no coming back for Vader if he killed Luke.

    • @thewhyzer
      @thewhyzer 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Vader killed Obi Wan, who might as well have been his father.

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@thewhyzer The joke is that Vader didn't, in fact, kill Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan became a Force ghost before Vader's strike reached him.
      Vader himself was perplexed at this outcome when he inspected Obi-Wan's cloak afterward.

    • @thewhyzer
      @thewhyzer 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@LecherousLizard I thought Vader killed him and the corpse disappeared immediately afterwards.

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@thewhyzer Watch that scene again.
      When Obi-Wan notices Luke safe on the side, he smirks, assumes a position as if he was meditating. Vader swings at him, but Obi-Wan poofs out of existence before Vader has a chance to strike him and his lightsaber only hits the cloak, then perplexed Vader moves the cloak with his boot wondering "What the fuck just happened?"
      I mean, we see in later movies of the Original Trilogy that lightsabers don't completely vaporize things while leaving clothes OK and considering all the edits Lucas did over the years, this one seems like quite a serious oversight, don't you think?

    • @thewhyzer
      @thewhyzer 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@LecherousLizard I'm not saying the light saber vaporized him, I'm saying he killed Obi Wan, and Obi Wan's body vanished. I bet Vader's body vanished too after he died from Palpatine's lightning and/or the fall.

  •  7 หลายเดือนก่อน +633

    I actually think his struggle between light and dark side was the best aspect of the trilogy. Gave him so much character.

    • @benmorgan9748
      @benmorgan9748 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

      That's like 50% of Star Wars' characters though. Pretty boring imo

    • @colin857
      @colin857 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

      Someone else made a good point too that it also made Luke's Character worse...if what he saw ended up being true, then it justify his feeling to kill him...instead he just made Kylo who he becamd

    • @Tink2k
      @Tink2k 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Visions are tricky things. Kylo did kill Han. Maybe Luke saw other things in the vision that either we didn't see onscreen or Rey's influence (after her mind was opened to the Force) changed Kylo / Ben's future@@colin857

    • @codythefriendlyskunkboy1780
      @codythefriendlyskunkboy1780 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      @@benmorgan9748 At least he was actually a character tho. Rey is some random nobody and Finn..idk he was the main character for like most of Force Awakens then became a side character (haven't watched those movies in years)

    • @mtpstv94
      @mtpstv94 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      What character. All the characters were a joke. Irredeemable to what they did to Star Wars in every way.

  • @willyum3920
    @willyum3920 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1685

    I always feel sorry for the cast of this trilogy. Imagine the excitement of being in the new star wars, John Boyega's description was so heartwarming..... and then we got the final product. Sith Rey would be cool, redemption Ben would be cool if they showed why he deserved it in some way unlike in the films, good ben turning fully to the darkside over 3 films would have been awesome. Anything but Rian Johnston trying to make a name for himself by making insane plot, cannon and character decisions ruining the thing we love. Urggg you've got me going again. But to the point, yes I'd love this Ben to Kylo storyline

    • @hydratanksamari
      @hydratanksamari 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +77

      I do feel bad for them, the new faces of a modern legend, ruined to suite the egos of a few, hired by clueless twits who jut wanted to make back the money they paid to Lucas for his IP

    • @alexinfinite7142
      @alexinfinite7142 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Yup. I'm with you

    • @knightatyourservice7512
      @knightatyourservice7512 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +36

      I personally think the problem was more on Lucasfilm and Disney rather than Rian Johnson. Like not making a concrete plan to stick with and having the director with different perspectives on how Star Wars should be and interpretations of the same story wasn't good planning. And I'm saying it as someone who liked TFA, loved TLJ and felt let down by TROS. Not to mention, Rian was the only writer for this movie. Like of course the story might be rough around the edges at the very least.

    • @willyum3920
      @willyum3920 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

      ​@@knightatyourservice7512 its difficult to respond to that because you said that you enjoyed TFA and TROS. We could discuss what it means to be an objectively good vs subjectively enjoyable or compelling film maybe. I'm on the well worn path of opinion that TFA was basically ANH. It set up some characters I liked, was beautifully shot and had a cliff hanger ending which all would have been good enough if they'd followed it up in the next film. That's where I totally agree with you about Lucasfilm and Disney because if they'd had an overarching plan for the story of this character needs to end up here and this one there, it could have all worked....
      HOWEVER; [insert absolute diatribe which you've heard/read a million times before about the inconsistencies in the ongoing plot and the misunderstanding of and disrespect of the characters we loved growing up, the ridiculous plot holes or the "somehow...." various things have happened, the ludicrous macGuffins that don't make logical sense, plot convenient lore retcons, the characters they dropped or didn't go anywhere or had no reason to exist like the Knights of Ren etc etc etc....]
      I personally think TROS was insulting to the fans love of Star Wars overall as Darth Edge Lord Rian Johnston actively undermined almost everything that had come before on purpose. TLJ was a result of that and Disney's/Lucasfilm's lack of planning as you say, a desperate attempt to undo what RJ did and ultimately just insulting to our intelligence.

    • @Soundwave142
      @Soundwave142 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

      Yeah me too. I do feel bad for John Boyega especially despite his enthusiasm, honest effort and acting skills, he was brought on so that Disney can check off their diversity checklist and then shoved into the background after the first film. Adam Driver did put out his best effort as well and I find him more interesting than Rey. Regarding "Sith Rey," I do not remember what video it was, but the guy said that these "Mary Sue" characters that have it all because they "deserve it" or "superior from the get go," are more akin to villains than heroes.

  • @stormshot119
    @stormshot119 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1219

    Kylo Ren was legitimately the only character to have some sort of character development in the sequels. Rey was already the *perfect* character and everyone else was sidelined or flanderized

    • @bombomos
      @bombomos 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +99

      Rey was already the most boring character

    • @notjohncena6492
      @notjohncena6492 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +25

      Then there are actual "fans" who think any of the sequels are top 5 star war movies

    • @BaldianOfIbelin
      @BaldianOfIbelin 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +91

      They bastardized Finn by ruining his sacrifice and making him the butt of the joke in episode 8 that's what made me give up on the sequels

    • @Sivrn-Val
      @Sivrn-Val 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +25

      ​@@notjohncena6492We don't talk about those creatures.

    • @xrstevenson
      @xrstevenson 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +26

      And that's why they say he carried the trilogy. He didn't really, they just fucked up everybody else, Finn carried TFA so hard until Rey picked up the lightsaber, you can totally see the tone shifted from that point onward

  • @alfonzredeker6601
    @alfonzredeker6601 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    I think the dumbest decision they made for him was to have him die at the end. I think it would have been cool to have Ben ultimately reject joining Rey and the Jedi, instead having him go off and wander the galaxy trying to atone for his sins and using his powers to root out the corruption that flourished under the first order. Even if Adam didn't return as Ben, they could have made interesting and compelling stories for his character after the events

  • @nateeverett1646
    @nateeverett1646 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +60

    I always wanted Ben to go to the light side and Ray to go to the dark and Ben bring her back, at the cost of his own life, mirroring Luke and Anakin.
    When episode 7 came out, I also really wanted it to have been Han that ignited Kylo’s lightsaber, sacrificing himself so his son wouldn’t cross that line and go full dark side. Snoke would congratulate him for killing Han and we’d watch Kylo lie and struggle with the fact he DIDN’T kill his dad, and that sacrifice would redeem him, like a reverse of Darth Vader and Luke.
    Could have been so much better.

  • @ThomatoSauce
    @ThomatoSauce 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +152

    ANYTHING would’ve been better than what we ended up getting.

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      Including The Force Awakens itself.

    • @chaosgyro
      @chaosgyro 24 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I don't know...the prequels exist

    • @WillyYalad-ep7gv
      @WillyYalad-ep7gv 20 วันที่ผ่านมา

      ​@@chaosgyroDude, don't you dare to compare the prequels (that yeah, have their flaws, but aren't a dogshit) with the absolutly disaster, disrespecfuly and abominable, sequels

    • @chaosgyro
      @chaosgyro 20 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @WillyYalad-ep7gv The sequels can be watched as a sci-fi action-comedy series that isn't...too bad. Just watch the pretty colors and smile at the attempted levity. The prequels aren't even watchable movies. Also, Vader was destroyed far worse by George Lucas than a hundred Rian Johnsons could manage to do to Luke.

    • @WillyYalad-ep7gv
      @WillyYalad-ep7gv 20 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@chaosgyro Dude, you can't be serious, the only thing that makes the prequels uncomfortable is the romance between Padmé and Anakin, the boring stuff from the first prequel of the movies and Jar Jar. The prequels left the franchise at such a high level that this allowed the first Disney Star Wars sequel to be a bomb in the good sense of the word. I can respect you like the sequels the way you do, or that you like it without a particular reason, but dude, you can't just take to the ground the good things and what the prequels meant and mean today

  • @Zilla1954
    @Zilla1954 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +176

    I always got the feeling this is where Kylo's character was written to go because it felt like there was this gap of a true villain that Kylo was meant to fill by the third movie. I really thought that Kylo was going to go full Vader (or worse) by the third film, and I guess I was right according to the original intent, but wrong about what actually ended up happening.

  • @megnetic21
    @megnetic21 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +172

    I think the redemption was the best idea but should have been executed better/Rey falling to the dark side which ends up making him realize his own mistakes and he has to form an uneasy alliance with Finn and Poe to bring her back. That dynamic would have set up great SW style banter potential between Poe, Finn and Ben as well.

    • @miles7224
      @miles7224 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      I think keeping Ben as evil would've also worked really well. We often see Jedi be tempted by the dark side, but very rarely do we see a Sith tempted by the light (at least in main canon).
      All we'd need then is for Rey to keep the Palpatine name and stick to the messaging throughout the film that your ancestry doesn't matter.

    • @jaminallen3119
      @jaminallen3119 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Ooh yeah I could see that being really good! You should've given them the plot outline. Would've been far better 👌

    • @trueandika
      @trueandika 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Redemption was a terrible idea. Laughable. And it was executed according so.

    • @Commander23c
      @Commander23c 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Leave the quips out of it, please. We need more Star Wars like Andor…

    • @serteshsardrakal2272
      @serteshsardrakal2272 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I think I heard a similar script somewhere before? I think it was a game called kotor with a guy called revan.

  • @Rightround0846
    @Rightround0846 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    Adam playing an absolute sadistic evil character sounds so awesome. They wasted Adam as an actor it's sad..

  • @Pingthescribe
    @Pingthescribe 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +101

    Based on what he's said, I do see they were trying to go that way in hindsight. Episode 9 was clearly rushed and should have taken more time, I always felt like I was watching a draft rather than a final copy.

    • @alduintheanti-dragonborn
      @alduintheanti-dragonborn 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      Disney wanted their holiday season release.

    • @Pingthescribe
      @Pingthescribe 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

      @@alduintheanti-dragonborn Another thing that someone pointed out to me is that each movie was an apology for the last instead of doing it's own thing. People didn't like the prequels? Let's make TFA like Ep IV! It's too same-y? Let's shake things up! People don't like that? Let's play it safe!
      They were too concerned with being people pleasers and seemed to think they could avoid SW fan's famously unrealistic standards.

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@Pingthescribe TFA was literally a cheap ANH knock-off with Disney crossing their fingers hoping nobody will notice.
      At least prequels did their own thing, even if they sure could've ended up being more polished, but TFA not only wasn't anyhow inventive, it was downright insulting to watch.

    • @zoyadulzura7490
      @zoyadulzura7490 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@LecherousLizard The similarities to ANH bugged me, but after seeing TFA, I was still hopeful for what would come after. Then TLJ came, and I still can't bring myself to watch TRoS. TLJ dashed all my hopes for the trilogy. It felt like someone stamping all over Star Wars. I feel bad for many of the people involved (including the actors, who have caught needless blame), who were bringing their A-game but still had to essentially follow the orders of those in control.

  • @starwarsjoey228
    @starwarsjoey228 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +187

    sith rey would be so cool, imagine if rey went proper evil palpatine mode.
    maybe palpatine would be like hehe kill me, not fully expecting her to kill him, but she just straight up rushes him with so much raw power he isn't expecting it, then she goes evil, and has to fight her old friends

    • @kecksbelit3300
      @kecksbelit3300 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

      that would suck rly hard to be honest. Rey would still be a mary sue and now the most powerful beeing dies even easier. The only reason he wanted her to kill him was so he could transfer his essence into her anyway.

    • @starwarsjoey228
      @starwarsjoey228 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@kecksbelit3300 yeah but the dark side makes u unlock Ur powers and really quickly, like savage, so it would be ok for teynto be Mary sue if we used dark side.
      Plus I do feel bad for palpatine, maybe if it was snoke instead. Tbf palpatine ried even easier in rotj

    • @andrewmalinowski6673
      @andrewmalinowski6673 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

      It seemed more like resurrecting Palpatine was a rushed decision, especially since all they had to go with was; "Palpatine's back somehow" and didn't even try to explain it. Almost all the concept art I've seen with Sith Rey seemed better than what we got in Episode IX, but her brief "turn" towards the Dark Side seemed more like a means to appeal to fans and only made it worse than the opening of VIII with the weird bombing run

    • @kecksbelit3300
      @kecksbelit3300 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@starwarsjoey228 it's not cause he used the dark side it's cause he got talsins magic

    • @starwarsjoey228
      @starwarsjoey228 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@kecksbelit3300 I think both, look at nightfall ani

  • @DrakeBarrow
    @DrakeBarrow 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

    That was my original take when I saw TFA. It felt like a good angle to go with - the idea that he didn't WANT to be saved. Let people try to talk him down, try to bring him back, and every time he swats their offer aside. Would it have sucked that Han & Leia's only kid became a monster? Yes, it would've. But at least the story would've been interesting and more original.
    (Actually, that sums up a lot of arguments about the Sequel Trilogy. Almost any direction would've been better than no direction, and that's what we got.)

    • @3Rayfire
      @3Rayfire 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      In the EU they had three kids, and only one fell to the Dark Side.

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      My original take when I saw TFA was that I wanted to get a refund.
      The worst part about that is that I pirated the movie. That's how awful it was. 10 minutes in I expected it to go nowhere and, oh, boy, if I wasn't proven right. And later I learned the next two movies managed to be even worse, ha!

  • @cloudmangalm03
    @cloudmangalm03 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

    In retrospect, the sequels feel a lot like a whole fanfic circling around Rei.

  • @cracklasco
    @cracklasco 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

    It would’ve been more tragic story wise. The love of his parents and family wouldn’t have been enough to save him. Would’ve been great to se them break that trope of a family member or friend becoming good again over the love of their friends and family.

  • @Warkingist
    @Warkingist 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +12

    Honestly the problem with the whole sequel trilogy was they had no direct path they wanted to follow it was all over the place with no real direction and they just went with whatever they thought would be good without actually reading it out loud to themselves to see how bad it actually was.

    • @zoyadulzura7490
      @zoyadulzura7490 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      That's what happens when money is the ultimate goal vs. fulfilling a vision, like George Lucas had done with the (flawed but loveable) prequels.

  • @alpaga4820
    @alpaga4820 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    I don't think it's ever a good idea to go into a trilogy without knowing clearly where the story is going, and it's an even stupider idea to do whatever the fuck they did here.

  • @Tw1s7
    @Tw1s7 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

    I think the redemption arc worked only because Rey's character was so frustrating to experience, but if done right, I could see how the original vision could be better, but from what we had, Kylo Ren's story was the best out of all of the Sequels.

  • @ProjSHiNKiROU
    @ProjSHiNKiROU 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +46

    I would rather see Kylo Ren redeemed than falling into the deep end. However, I would rather have Duel of the Fates for Episode 9 and my ideal Episode 9 would be both versions merged together (Final battle on Coruscant and rewritten Rey vs. Kylo Ren arc).

    • @andrewmalinowski6673
      @andrewmalinowski6673 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      At least that sound better than what we got, but almost half of Episodes VIII and IX go from semi-canon to "WTF just happened?" or "how is that even logical in-universe?" as if the screenwriters didn't even know the basics of the franchise

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I'd rather have for the protagonist to have an actual personality and show some semblance of growth, instead of having a revelation she's perfect at everything she do.

  • @DrakeBrunette
    @DrakeBrunette 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    I had several different theories for Kylo... Redemption Arc, Reverse Vader and (my personal favorite) Morally Grey Double Agent who only did what he did to get close to Snoke in order to assassinate him...
    Either way, I think any of them can work. They just needed a general outline to start with and then stick to it with a team of writers who all know and love Star Wars. Perhaps having George Lucas as a semi regular consultant.
    Same thing with Reys lineage. Is she descended from a Skywalker, Solo, Kenobi, Palpatine, Yoda (lol), New Character? Just have a plan about it!!!!

    • @x_.suzaku._x
      @x_.suzaku._x 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I'm tired about redemption arcs, there is a lot in the Star Wars lore

  • @AlwayzFresh
    @AlwayzFresh 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    This is the least of the things making Disney look like a joke, plus all of this was well known before today by anyone paying attention. Anyone who understands storytelling knows the two directors where directing against each other. They literally made a bi-polar franchise.

    • @cuddlecakes7153
      @cuddlecakes7153 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      "bi polar franchise" lmao

    • @tacidian7573
      @tacidian7573 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      From now on till doomsday, I'll refer to the sequel trilogy as the bi-polar trilogy.

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      The worst Rian Johnson was, was being the final nail in the coffin. A symptom, not a problem.
      If you _actually_ paid attention, you'd realize from the very first minutes of TFA (personally it took me 10 minutes) that the sequel trilogy would be a disappointment and you should only take bets how bad of a disappointment it'd be.

    • @citizenvulpes4562
      @citizenvulpes4562 5 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@tacidian7573 please don't, I don't want my mental illness to be associated with this mess, thank you.

    • @tacidian7573
      @tacidian7573 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@citizenvulpes4562 👍🏻👍🏻

  • @CameronM1138
    @CameronM1138 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Redeeming Ben was actually one of the few things I still like about Rise of Skywalker. The way it was handled was pretty bad, but I'm still glad they went in that direction.

  • @hunterkiller1440
    @hunterkiller1440 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

    It'd be more interesting if Luke was the one who wants to redeem Kylo Ren while Rey believes he is irredeemable.

    • @Kryto_Gaming
      @Kryto_Gaming หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Interesting, that would have fit with Luke's established character too. When they were doing the flashbacks in the 2nd movie, I thought Luke would have had the opposite issue with Kylo, that he was going to keep believing in him just like he did with Vader, but that backfired on him and got his new temple killed. That would have made WAY more sense then Luke randomly having doubts about a still innocent friend and literal family member after seeing the mass genocider that was Vader redeemed.

  • @thatzachguy76
    @thatzachguy76 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +31

    Kylo was always played too emotional and unhinged like an edgy teen not getting their way. I was never worried when he showed up on screen nor was I intimidated by anything you did, cut to his "opposite" Vader and every time he shows up you feel fear because you know he is in control and ruthless.

    • @jamiekay4210
      @jamiekay4210 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      That scene where he threw a tantrum and slashed those computers up in TFA made me roll my eyes. Not even Anakin, with all his brooding and sulking throughout the Prequels, acted out like a petulant child the way Kylo did. Anakin had his verbal jousts with the other Jedi sure, but he never pulled out his lightsaber and started hacking up things in the Jedi Temple like a brat when he was denied the rank of Master.
      The two characters are night and day, but not in the way Disney intended. One was well written with a complex emotional backstory that would inform his eventual transformation into Darth Vader, and the other was a Vader wannabe who acted like he was written by an angsty teen writing a SW fanfic.

    • @thatzachguy76
      @thatzachguy76 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      @@jamiekay4210 which unfortunately he seems to have been written by just such a person lol Disney writers are either edgy wannabes or pacifist "everyones opinion has weight and importance no matter what" types, theres really no inbetween and it shows in their writing and "story boarding" if you can call it that lol

  • @WheyanQuix
    @WheyanQuix 28 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I had never heard of Kyle Ren being set to be an anti-Vader. I mean obviously the reflection is there in plain sight, but like taking it a step further to not just a Vader-ish start but taking the evil as his own and eliminating his own master to take over the empire. Completing the “rule of two” between the Sith. That would have been EPIC to see especially if they really dove into his hunger for power and made himself part mechanical to give him more of the physical strength/intimidating presence that Vader had!

  • @shibumi8
    @shibumi8 16 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    I’m sad he didn’t get chance to act out what was originally planned. Sounds like he was stoked to give it his all.

  • @jokester3076
    @jokester3076 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +17

    Ben Solo’s redemption was the one thing they did right in the rise of skywalker

    • @javierlopez9789
      @javierlopez9789 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      And then they ruined it by killing him

  • @lucashampton6269
    @lucashampton6269 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    Here's how I would have handled Rise of Skywalker.
    We open with Luke waking up. He's not on Ach-To. His cloak is missing. The room he's in hums with the Force. Two Aang-Tii monks approach and explain that they were consulting their artifacts when a vision of the future came to them. The vision was unclear save for one thing: Luke needed to see the vision too.
    He sees it, they teach him to teleport with the Force, and he goes on his mission.
    We learn that Rey is not a Palpatine, but is actually a Solo. She was abducted very young to be used as a host for Darth Talon (who here has been using essence transfer to prolong her life from her time in the Old Republic. She was able to find force sensitives too strong to possess but also could be made into apprentices) so she can lead a resurgent "lost tribe" of Sith to domination.
    The rescue attempt was botched to hell and back and Rey was spirited away by the lost tribe. In the pursuit, Han tried to disable the ship but he wasnt thinking clearly because it was his daughter on the line. He instead causes the ship to crash on Jakku and explode soon after. This would be the catalyst for Han and Leia separating. Rey obviously lived in an escape pod with one of the Sith. But, the Sith is badly hurt and is picked off by raiders. Rey is found by Unkar and so on.
    Ben is internally conflicted over killing his father and having let his hated Uncle get the better of him without even being there. The brief Force contact he had with his mother, his mind meld with Rey, he was feeling all sorts of messed up.
    Ben learns of the lost Sith and their plan when encounter each other in searching for Sith artifacts from the Banite order. He decides to go all in with the lost Sith to protect his newly rediscovered sister. Becoming Darth Caedus to position himself to best keep her safe.
    Luke arrives to team up with Rey as they lead the newly formed Galactic Alliance (formed in the ashes of the New Republic destruction on Hosnian Prime) forces against the lost Sith and the First Order. Luke and Rey dispatch a few Sith then duel Ben together. When he's sure the Sith and First Order are done for, Ben relents and lets himself be killed.
    Luke and Rey start work on a new Jedi Order with new ideas, not just a rerun of the old one. It ends with Anakin's force ghost sitting next to Luke as they overlook a new Jedi temple in construction. They're joined by Obi-Wan and Yoda and a final shot of them watching a group of Jedi in training below. Among them, Leia trades blows in sparring with a barabel Jedi.

    • @JoeTheCrusader
      @JoeTheCrusader 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      This would have been an awesome movie!

    • @bobafett4265
      @bobafett4265 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      This sounds fantastic and way better than "current" Dosney could make on a good day.

  • @liamwilson7549
    @liamwilson7549 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Anyone attacking him for killing Han Solo needs to stop. The man is just an actor, he isn’t the one who makes the script.

  • @77Pictures
    @77Pictures 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Despite the mess of the sequels, I do think if Kylo has not been redeemed it would have been even worse. The idea that after all Anakin went through, his lineage would just go bad with no real reason behind it, is pretty depressing.

  • @waterierStone
    @waterierStone 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +35

    I think the biggest problem was when they made snoke a nothing villain. I think it would have made more sense if he was a robot being controlled by some cultists who were trying to resurrect palpatine. Maybe they needed some a palpatine's dna to finish the cloning process, and that's why they needed rey to go to exogul. There's so many things wrong with 8 & 9 that I think it's pointless in trying to single them out.

    • @Soundwave142
      @Soundwave142 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Yeah, it was like a bag of hot air. They could have made him Palpatine that did not fully form until the last film.

    • @Azure_Fire
      @Azure_Fire 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      If I was writing it, I would have made him a former apprentice of Darth Plagius who was ousted by Palpatine. He's all scarred from the battle to two would have had to become Plagius's true apprentice.

    • @rafikshaheed4271
      @rafikshaheed4271 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      Star Wars Ep VIII messed everything up by killing Snoke. If he survived, he could have had a significant presence in the last film, and part of Palpatine's will (maybe a Sith cultist, who sought out to complete Palpatine's life work while trying to transfer Sidious's consciousness into his body, thereby sacrificing his life so that the Dark Lord could live).

    • @TheRealDarkSide830
      @TheRealDarkSide830 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      I actually think the concept of Snoke being a decoy was interesting, just poorly executed.

  • @michaelandreipalon359
    @michaelandreipalon359 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    More justification to need an official animated project based on Duel of the Fates. It won't be perfect, but if it means doing the post-Crisis treatment for the Star Wars Alt-universe... and besides, animation and voice acting need more love than oversaturated live action.

  • @KyleJones1
    @KyleJones1 25 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Love that the most replayed part of the video is at the end, when you actually get to here two seconds from the interview.

  • @ShadowAkatora
    @ShadowAkatora หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    "Some things were changed when Rian Johnson was brought onboard"
    That's the f*cking understatement of the century.

  • @Wasattsi
    @Wasattsi 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Mmmmmmmmm. Nah, Kylo Ren’s arc was one of the only things I liked about the Sequels. Keeping him evil probably would’ve lessened how much I like him.

  • @RayOfTruth
    @RayOfTruth 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Redeemed Ben Solo was one of the best things in TROS, it was a good change.

  • @tylerelli6565
    @tylerelli6565 22 ชั่วโมงที่ผ่านมา

    RIP Carrie Fisher, her passing away was symbolic of the Star Wars franchise.

  • @nexus1g
    @nexus1g หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I'd heard that there was talk about Kylo and Rey swapping roles throughout the trilogy, and that would have been amazing. Especially with the idea of the dyad--sort of like the Son and Daughter in Mortis.

  • @chewy99.
    @chewy99. 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    No I’m very glad they didn’t do that. Ben should be redeemed.

  • @SWTobito0702
    @SWTobito0702 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    I honestly feel so vindicated in my feelings of both TLJ and TROS, hearing this.
    One of the biggest aspects of TLJ that I genuinely love to this day is its decision to make Kylo usurp Snoke and take the role of Supreme Leader.
    I had such high hopes that Kylo's arc would be like a fun house mirroring of Luke's. Instead of struggling with the dark side and choosing the light, Kylo struggles with the pull of the light and delves into darkness. And I was so beyond disappointed when TROS gave him another generic light side redemption.
    Now, knowing that Kylo remaining evil was the original plan and his redemption was just thrown in when they came around to TROS, makes me feel quite legitimized in my feelings.

    • @LecherousLizard
      @LecherousLizard 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      What are your feelings about TFA then?
      Because, personally, after watching TFA I was absolutely done with the Sequel Trilogy... and from the looks of it, it'd appear I was 110% right in my assessment.

  • @K.HenriqueUshinohama
    @K.HenriqueUshinohama 15 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I liked the way he came back from the dark side after the battle and the chat with his father.

  • @madmarcus1709
    @madmarcus1709 20 วันที่ผ่านมา +2

    Adam Driver was such a wasted actor for these movies. He’s not a bad actor, his talent was just wasted. As were so many of the other actors and actresses. Although, I really wish actors and actresses would realize when a movie is bad and admit it. Rather than siding with Disney and saying the fans are wrong to hate a film. Because that is a giant middle finger to fans and basically says to us “You can’t hate it. If you do, you’re a bad person.”

  • @DarthMomo
    @DarthMomo 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I think i like a redeemed ben solo who lives

  • @Tink2k
    @Tink2k 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I am sad for the circumstances that led to a reevaluation and rewrite of the final film. Leia's presence in the original script was likely too difficult to easily revise when she died.
    But having said that, I love the movie we got - and definitely more than what I have heard about the original.
    Is redemption a theme in Star Wars? Absolutely. Is it over done or repetitive? Not really. The connection to Rey and her struggles mirroring his was fantastic. That he came to the light and she learned to fight the darkness were both done well. Ben didn't need to become the ultimate villain. That would have been a bad end to the Skywalker legacy.

  • @Nocturniss
    @Nocturniss 23 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Every time I feel like Disney lets me down, they always find a way to drag the bar lower...🤦‍♂

  • @GatCat
    @GatCat หลายเดือนก่อน

    I watched these movies and do not remember any plot line or major events. I honestly can’t recall what happened.

  • @litjellyfish
    @litjellyfish 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +23

    For me it’s clear that ep 9 was a mess.
    Where do we have Kylo at the end of Ep8. He reached out to Rey maybe the only one he felt connected to that understood him a bit. And also maybe he even had som romantic feelings for here. He was both friendzoned. Friend denied and professionally denied form her.
    He fails in his fight with Luke. He gets pinched about the killing of his father.
    He is the most powerful man in the galaxy. And all gates him. Both the enemy and his own people. He is to most lonely and scared person in the galaxy.
    What would such a man / dictator do. Of course try to increase his power over the galaxy. And over himself mentally / force. And of course try to kill off anyone who hurt him.
    And all this. Thrown away. People complain that snoke was thrown away. For me he was not. Smoke was killed so Kylo could emerge. But then they really wasted him.

    • @bobafett4265
      @bobafett4265 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      You're not wrong there, it could've been a great moment to actually do something greater with Kylo but they pissed that away like Disney did with the Sequel Trilogy as a whole, it had potential starting out, but when episode 8 hit, there was no way they were going to fix it from there.

    • @litjellyfish
      @litjellyfish 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@bobafett4265 I actually is ok with parts of EP8. Ok it was a mess but not all bad. Pure personally I edited it down over 30 minutes. Removed over silly non fitting jokes. Improved the pacing (the whole casino thing went totally out) Rose do not exist in this version. Leia do not fly etc.
      But Luke still drinks Blue milk. Nothing wrong with blue Milk. (Many complain it’s just look gross and should evoke gross feeling - maybe. But narrative wise it’s actually there to show what life Luke lives there. He also drinks it more gross to provoke Rey. Like ok I’ll show you stuff but I really don’t care or trust you or only what you can tolerate. Basically a screening test.

    • @elcarlxd4486
      @elcarlxd4486 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      ​@@litjellyfishi hated the whole casino side story except phasma's death

    • @litjellyfish
      @litjellyfish 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@elcarlxd4486 yup me too that is why I removed it. And it affected so little in general so for me it proves it had nothing really to do in the movie. If a narrative section of over 15 minutes is so easy to take out without affecting other parts then for me it should be taken out

  • @MikesterMF
    @MikesterMF 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I think a better ending would have been mixed. Not necessarily a redemption arc for Kylo, but kind of a mellowing out for both him and Rey. Them both taking on characteristics of the dark side and the light side. And, controversially, having Luke as the main antagonist. His arc was always somewhat muddled and edging on giving into the dark side. Have him take something of a dark turn towards solely eraticating the dark side, a "jedi purist" if you will. While Rey and Kylo find a true balance between the dark side and the light. Rather it being a tale of good vs evil, have it be a tale of old vs new. Luke (and palpatine/snoke) represent a bygone era, clinging to the past dichotomy. Kylo and Rey represent growth and change.
    But no. Instead we got the same old slop.

  • @ilovetweek000
    @ilovetweek000 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    If they truly wanted to redeem Ben, it would've been better if Rey ended up embracing her lineage as Palpatine's granddaughter and having to fight Ben, that would've been different at least.

  • @taristazin2073
    @taristazin2073 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Anything Disney touches, it destroys. I'm 52 years old and this is not the Disney I grew up with. So very sad.

  • @AtiShard16
    @AtiShard16 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    I like Ben getting redeemed. That was one of the only good things about TROS

    • @tacidian7573
      @tacidian7573 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I don't remember much of the sequels, only that my best friend and I sat in the theater absolutely baffled and disappointed. After The Last Jedi, I had no high hopes going into The Rise of Skywalker, but somehow the story that was presented to me was even worse than the "leaked plot" that had circled around on the Internet months before.

  • @marcosoliveira8731
    @marcosoliveira8731 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Disney Killed Star Wars franchise.

  • @huntergourley9135
    @huntergourley9135 25 วันที่ผ่านมา

    The thing ive noticed about the movies release dates is that from episode 1-6 each have a 3 year gap but episodes 7-9 along with solo and rouge one are released year after year heres the release years ->( episode 4 1977,episode 5 1980,episode 6 1983,episode 1 1999,episode 2 2002 episode 3 2005 episode 7 2015,rouge one 2016,episode 8 2017,solo movie 2018,and episode 9 2019)

  • @Phoenixesper1
    @Phoenixesper1 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    I think it would have been better if Finn had actually been the last skywalker. That Finn was a failed force sensitive created from lukes DNA from his severed hand, (which happens in the comics), he was dumped in the storm troopers and only when he encounters rey do his powers emerge the surprising light saber battle out of nowhere! Ben Is irredeemable is vader without any light, a vicious powerhouse of darkness, Rey fights her inclanations but as her powers emerge she ultimately falls and surplants Palpatine to his delight, while Finn is made aware of his powers and trained by none other then anakins force ghost who teaches him to weild both the light and dark in balance and becomes the last of the skywalkers who takes down Ben, and the end of the trilogy sets up for Rey Palpatine and Finn Skywalker to carry on into a true new generation and the yuzonvaungn war!

  • @Dragonrider1227
    @Dragonrider1227 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    I had a feeling that was the original intention of the arch. Should’ve kept it. Likely to pander to his sudden huge fandom. They should’ve just let J.J direct the whole trilogy. It still would’ve had issues but it probably would’ve get more coherent at least

  • @xSharpW
    @xSharpW 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Ben deserved his redemption...Finn deserved to be a Jedi, and Rey could've been an interesting twist character who should've started turning to the dark side after her whole thing with the mirrors in episode 8...we only got like, 1/3 of those things and it wasn't done super well unfortunately but YK it's over now. We lost.

  • @w00master
    @w00master 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    The truth is that Star Wars has been sh*t since the prequels. The main issue is that they cannot break from the Skywalker saga which at this point has nothing new to say.

  • @defiantmopar
    @defiantmopar 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I honestly doubt that JJ had any sort of plan for story or character development. He never does

  • @windshadetarn1679
    @windshadetarn1679 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

    The first movie of the sequels made me strong supporter of counter vader Kylo. Everyone was like "he will be redeemed. It's Disney" and I was praying for this to be:
    Vader: looks irredeemable but was redeemed
    Kylo: Looks redeemable but stands his ground and stays at the dark side out of his own free will
    It makes such a great idea and I was praying for it to happen....and now I learned that I was right and I was FRICKING ROBBED!
    Can we get JJ cut? second and third movie made by JJ to make fully irredeemable Kylo happen? And maybe to keep Hux rellevant and Knights of Ren more entertaining? Ryan ruined everything I wanted BADLY. Ahhh....bummer

    • @nicolaridolfi6510
      @nicolaridolfi6510 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      I think that Ryan sealed Kylo as an irredeemable villain with the throne room scene. It's more JJ who changed his mind in the last movie. Anyway about Hux and the Knights of Ren being weaker or absent in TLJ, I can absolutely agree.

    • @camembertcheese7092
      @camembertcheese7092 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      @@nicolaridolfi6510I agree, also in the following scenes on krait he is clearly being set up as the main bad guy. Indirectly responsible for Luke’s death. The scene where Rey shuts the door on him at the end is the door being closed on hope of a good side in him. Then JJ reverse uno’s it in the next movie, most likely under pressure from Disney and KK

  • @14bface
    @14bface 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    Disney has made themselves look like a joke for awhile now.

  • @MrStrikecentral
    @MrStrikecentral 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Do you really think that this would have made the movie any better? I'm still ashamed I paid good money to see it in theaters. I knew it was going to be a trainwreck when I stepped in, but I still had to see it for myself. This would have changed nothing. Garbage writing is garbage writing.

  • @vike7711
    @vike7711 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Like has been already said-there was no plan for a trilogy,it just produced one mess after another,filled with dumb plotholes and mystery boxes.The “Somehow Palpatine returned” being the absolute zenith of bullshit…..What could’ve been is the worst part-the chance to see the main three characters back on screen together again gone for good.

  • @CloneScavengerVulpin8389
    @CloneScavengerVulpin8389 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    I want to see more of adam driver.

  • @pyrosiumofficial
    @pyrosiumofficial 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    It's funny because, as far as I'm aware, Kylo Ren was carrying this trilogy on his back. And imo, his redemption was perfect. THOUGH, his death was a major cop out.

  • @stephaniemertz2881
    @stephaniemertz2881 21 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I just would have appreciated Disney not taking a massive dump on the star wars franchise altogether. 🤷‍♀️

  • @LordHypnos4
    @LordHypnos4 24 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Spend 5 billion on an IP, have no plan, end up with a joke of a trilogy and a series of shows in shambles, Disney 101

  • @james6932
    @james6932 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Ben wanting to be Vader but ultimately Rey falling to the dark side and taking Palpatine's place would've been mega epic and would've at least let the Sith survive for another generation.

  • @RADukura
    @RADukura หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    - Took Anakin’s story
    - Twist it and slap a female protagonist
    - “Somehow, Palpatine returned”
    - Profit from woke and stans

  • @bradavon
    @bradavon 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I would like to have heard Adam Driver speak and not someone mute him and speak over it, personally.

  • @darthj_der7447
    @darthj_der7447 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I would've liked to hear Adam Driver talk about it

  • @AustinNGrayson
    @AustinNGrayson 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +19

    Honestly one of the only issues I have with Star Wars as a whole is how these mass murdering psychopaths keep being “redeemed.” Yeah when you are a mass murderer, a mass murderer of children at that, there’s no redemption for you.

    • @granatmof
      @granatmof 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      I'll have to remember this the next time I become I mass murderer /j
      I get what you're saying. It's also sort of old Hollywood rules that the bad guy doesn't get a happy ending.
      For Anakin, Shmi should have been rescued between movies and given a home on Naboo. Padme and Anakin visit Shmi and a secondary attack by Dooku results in Shmi's death, which Anakin blames on Dooku. So when Anakin kills Dooku out of revenge that's the direction of his fall, not slaughtering a village including women and children. For an added bonus, Palpatine is the secret benefactor behind Shmi's rescue, which Anakin finds out about. He explains to Anakin he kept it secret to protect her from his enemies, when in reality is was a secret meant for Anakin to discover to trust him more with a loved one in the future. With Qui-gon gone, Palpatine is looking to replace him as a father figure, because Obi-Wan is a brother figure. Lucas was so hyper focused on trying to set up the Sequels, he missed the archetypes right in front of him.

    • @funnelvortex7722
      @funnelvortex7722 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      The problem is that Star Wars is mythology, mythology regularly features heroes falling to evil and then finding redemption even after going on a rampage of evil acts (for example, Hercules' heroism happened because he was endebted to the Gods since he murdered his family). Of course in any other fictional universe or in our world we'd want Anakin to suffer for what he did, and even in-universe if he survived ROTJ he would likely have been tried and executed by the New Republic for war crimes, but the point of Anakin's redemption was moreso a spiritual one where his soul was redeemed rather than the idea he should be 100% forgiven or let off the hook for what he did. Part of the reason he accepted and welcomed his death in ROTJ is because he knew he didn't deserve to live.
      Fans are probably gonna rip me a new asshole and I really like this story and character myself *BUT* the whole "mass murderer turns into a good guy and is forgiven by everyone" thing in Star Wars really started with Revan.

    • @AustinNGrayson
      @AustinNGrayson 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@funnelvortex7722 it’s a complaint I have with Star Wars specifically because it tries to separate itself from dramatic storytelling while simultaneously trying to embrace it. And it works most of the time but not when it comes to these ludicrous “redemption” arcs.

    • @ihavegymnastics
      @ihavegymnastics 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Jesus loves all.

    • @liorobgar
      @liorobgar 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      Redemption isn’t about being excused for your past actions, it’s about choosing to turn away from your evil path. Nobody deserves redemption because the idea of redemption having to be deserved undermines the point of it. Redemption’s always an option, even if you still have to be held accountable for the terrible things you’ve done.

  • @ConnorLonergan
    @ConnorLonergan 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    It definitely looks like Ryan Johnson or The Last Jedi is to be blamed. Not saying there is no fault from that movie or part of the production, just that every time we get more behind-the-scenes info the dumpster fire looks like it is more prominent during Ris of Skywalker

    • @Butter_Warrior99
      @Butter_Warrior99 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      There was literally audio allusions to Rey being a Kenobi. Fuck Ryan Johnson.

    • @ConnorLonergan
      @ConnorLonergan 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@Butter_Warrior99 Citaion, because I watched the movie and never came across that being the case what with the whole "your parents where drinkers selling you for money."

    • @Butter_Warrior99
      @Butter_Warrior99 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@ConnorLonergan Film Theory Rey Obi Wan on TH-cam right now mf. I dare ya.

    • @Butter_Warrior99
      @Butter_Warrior99 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@ConnorLonergan BOOM MF, before Last Jedi ruined it all : th-cam.com/video/-uZv_gXLNew/w-d-xo.htmlsi=xg4LBR2VmpOk57c8

    • @MyToastyToast
      @MyToastyToast 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      While I agree, I think it’s silly to think JJ had any long term plan for the trilogy. If anything I think the sequels would have been more cohesive if they had the balls to continue the direction TLJ was going in, for better or for worse

  • @SouthWestI10
    @SouthWestI10 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Home's resonance is a timeless classic

  • @eryharinanto3574
    @eryharinanto3574 17 วันที่ผ่านมา

    The final scene with the kiss was SO out of place, literally visceral "WTF" moment

  • @Butter_Warrior99
    @Butter_Warrior99 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    Almost like Disney is a culture vulture that forgot what it was.

  • @M-elephant7777
    @M-elephant7777 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I'm not 100% clear on how 'being very evil --> irredeemably evil' is much of a character arc... Like in TFA he kills his dad and helps genocide billions and he's somehow supposed to get worse over the next 2 movies? How? Plus he was a school-shooter shortly before the events of TFA so...? Like what was actually the plan here?
    ...clearly there wasn't one

    • @bobafett4265
      @bobafett4265 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Yep operation no plan what Disney were planning since getting Lucasfilm, seriously if they really did care about what they then just bought, they would've taken some notes on how George Lucas handled his projects, let them take time, they can afford it secondly absolute care should be put into whatever you are making, if you don't it will be costly, instead Dosney decided against those ideas and thus it's now a joke of what it once was.

    • @jediryan9454
      @jediryan9454 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      No one is born evil. It's an interesting take on how someone becomes a killer. A reverse of a hero's tale.

    • @M-elephant7777
      @M-elephant7777 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@jediryan9454 That's not what episode 7 was, we started with him already being a temper tantrum throwing genocidal maniac, there's no build up
      (also a few people have been born evil)

    • @RayOfTruth
      @RayOfTruth 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Granted The Force Awakens script and canon novelization imply Snoke and Hux avoided having Kylo learn of Starkiller Base's true purpose as a superweapon because he wasn't evil enough to go along with it yet.

  • @PurpleBox89
    @PurpleBox89 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    "Outlines are a waste of time. If you give your characters free will, they will grow in ways you never anticipated, and they will take the story places you could not have predicted, raising themes you might or might not have intended to explore."

  • @Aliens_Project
    @Aliens_Project 23 วันที่ผ่านมา

    After the Trailer for Episode 7 i cried Tears of Joy...i could't imagine to see, as a 50-year old Fan, a new Trilogy in my life.
    After Episode 7 & 8 in Theaters and way later Episode 9 on D+ i would go back in Time and tell myself not to Ruin my Memory of this great Franchise.

  • @lordzykron5518
    @lordzykron5518 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    It would have been an amazing redemption for them to swap the roles and make Rey die as the dark turned villan, with Kylo as the redeemed hero.

  • @ReclaimerTyphoon
    @ReclaimerTyphoon 23 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Yes, I would have like for the trilogy to not have been fragmented and passed back and forth like a child with divorced parents.

  • @Perfidious_Hollow
    @Perfidious_Hollow 27 วันที่ผ่านมา

    The second he took his helmet off every ounce of intimidation his character had went right out the window. That was why Vader was such a great villain.

  • @mr_inconspicuous
    @mr_inconspicuous 23 วันที่ผ่านมา

    It feels like scenes like killing Han were completely wasted with their happily ever after ending

  • @Lechuga1815
    @Lechuga1815 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I didn't like the new trilogy, but one of the major themes present in the first 6 movies is that anyone can find redemption. Like Vader, it would be their choice and it would take significant convincing. And Kylo was never as sanctified in the Dark Side quite like Vader so it seems plenty probable. If I made a couple changes with Kylo is I would either go full insane or reel in his unhinged moments and make him more stoic. He just seemed incompetent most of the time especially since he lost to a girl that just got force powers and has never held a lightsaber before their battle in episode 7. Also, Han shouldn't have been the ghost that visits him in episode 9. It would make more sense if he got visited by Anakin since not only is he an actual force ghost, but he would be like "hey, i've been vader and it sucked. Go back to the lightside, trust me, it's worth it."

  • @kate2create738
    @kate2create738 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    It was easy to guess that was the original direction, however certain elements I think just didn’t add up. With Anakin, as much as some have mocked Episode 1-3, it was a development of watching a young boy traumatized by the death of his mother his only family, to doing what it took to save the love of his life from a doomed fate of death, only to be the key to killing her. We understood why he went mad, how little he grasped the discipline of the Jedi to control his emotions, to not understand how his emotions getting out of control clouded his judgment to form an alliance with one of the darkest creatures in the galaxy, tainting his soul that it was thought to be lost. By Episode 4, the audience previously knew little of this background but grasps of it, yet we see the evil Darth Vader carries.
    The issue I had with Kyle is that he didn’t seem dark, but lost. And how that affected Luke’s story really shows how much those responsible for the direction of the Star Wars series under Disney had no respect for the previous work of the whole Star Wars world. It was bound to fail for not respecting the history of the characters and understand how that shapes them, Luke’s story was about a boy turning into a man knowing his legacy was out in the wide galaxy, unknowingly that it was his faith in his father to regain to the good in him is what saved the galaxy from a threatening authoritarian regime. It’s very difficult to understand how Luke was left with some optimism about the future to becoming a pathetic jaded recluse with no interest in the force.
    There’s times when history repeating itself works in certain timelines, but honestly they really butcher it with the recent franchise.

  • @willthompson9073
    @willthompson9073 29 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Whats pretty crazy is they didnt change his "look" hardly at all which is very rare

  • @MrJoshinJosh
    @MrJoshinJosh 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Disney’s been an absolute joke ever since the day that Walt was born.

  • @oscardylan99864
    @oscardylan99864 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    This trilogy is a perfect example of why you need to make a plan and stick to it.

  • @corphish129
    @corphish129 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I always thought this was the original intent. It's nice to have it confirmed.

  • @aoihitori
    @aoihitori 7 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I'll bet that they don't had concrete Storyboard for this, everything was on the fly.

  • @exoticdachoo007
    @exoticdachoo007 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I absolutely despise that Adam's talent was wasted. He's such a good actor, a hidden gem you may say, with his screams being the highlight because he can scream really well. Same with Domhnall who plays Hux, a villain who isn't force sensitive but still puts up a fight would be amazing (I mean we have Grievous, but he's a cyborg not a human).