Orange piccolo is perfect Narratively. Think about it. Namekians didn’t search for the dragonballs. Each elder had one. A warrior had to prove themselves worthy then he gets the dragonball. When he ends up with all seven. He can make a wish to unlock the fullness of their potential. That is perfect namekian lore.
I feel like you’re right when Orange Piccolo would be perfect narratively speaking. I really just wish that if they were going to give Piccolo this form, they should have had Piccolo go to Elder Kai and get his potential unlocked during the Tournament of Power. Not only would Piccolo be more powerful in the tournament, but he could also train up his potential and eventually awaken Orange Piccolo. I know it’s kinda cliché, but I feel it’s better than Piccolo wishing for power as it just seems so out of place. Because at least with Piccolo getting his potential unlocked by Elder Kai, you can make the case that Piccolo was being strategic in getting stronger quickly and seeing how much it benefited his student Gohan. Then maybe Piccolo could think it might be a good route for him to gain more power, and then he would be more powerful, not an Orange Piccolo. Although the first step to getting there is difficult. And since Piccolo is one of the most strategic characters in all of Dragon Ball, he would do something that is necessary even if it means obtaining power in a cheap way to protect the Earth. So while I may not like Piccolo wishing for power, I’m not too upset about it as it does align with Piccolo’s character, being realistic, and not to mention Kami and Nail’s part inside him as well.
Then there is also the fact that even if Dende is the planet's Dragon Clan Namekian, Shenron is still Piccolo's dragon on Kami's side. He's basically just giving himself power.
I hate that Gohan misconception. He never was ssjb kk level pre TOP. Gohan told Goku to come at him with all he’s got, Goku goes ssjb kk and then Gohan promptly gets one shotted.
@@TSO_SageSSB doesn’t just make goku stronger it gives him 100% ki control so he likely wasn’t going full power against gohan and just used kaioken to end it real fast
Literally growing up with him and being inspired. I wish people talked about things like that when it comes to people's works. Influence shows how we build upon one another
Piccolo didn't ask for Orange, if he had gotten exactly what he asked for and nothing else, He would only have gotten Power Awakened. Orange was a gift from Shenron, he even states he gave piccolo "All he had, plus a bit extra" Orange is a gift straight from Shenron, and to receive a gift of that level you'd have to be considered worthy of it. Orange feels to me like a narrative reward for Piccolo as both a thank you to kami for creating the dragon, and an acknowledgement from Shenron that he has truly changed, as last time Piccolo summoned Shenron, it was as King Piccolo and we all know how THAT went.
People always talk about "Solar Flare + Destructo Disk" but Oozaru Vegeta in a nerfed state with a damaged eye and verbal reason to believe Krillin & Gohan left the battlefield with his back turned to them dodged a Destructo Disk aimed at his tail like it was nothing all because he was still conscious of him existing. And he can't even sense Ki at that time.
Cabba and Universe 6 saiyans were made to rewrite previous mistakes in the DBZ cannon. Cabba was only made because they needed Vegeta to teach "a Son" to turn super Saiyan. Goku trained his son. Goku did it. But Vegeta never had a moment like that, because Future Trunks did it himself and Present trunks (and Goten) are Gag characters. (See Gotenks teen just not existing yet) And Caulifla and Kale were only made because previously Women Super Saiyan weren't cannon in DBZ. Bring them from another universe and that problem is solved
Freiza’s overused. He should’ve stayed dead in z. There are many more characters in dragon ball that deserve more screen time. I think the idea of cooler being cannon is a good idea, but it could be hard finding an origin that makes sense.
Simple answer: Kefla isn’t as strong in the manga as she is in the anime so Gohan beating two mostly inexperienced prodigies fused, with him being a prodigy that has experience, makes sense
Piccolo actually asks the dragon to unlock his potential, which is the slighty lighter green form, orange was the something extra that the dragon gave him.
I can’t use twitter so I’ll leave my take here. Instead of a power level, it makes much more sense to view power scaling in dragon ball as different levels entirely. Namek ssj level, first form freeza level, etc. it makes the idea of characters being able to keep up much more believable. Also my favorite part of the buu saga was gohan in high school. The saiyaman arc was peak.
@@daxmoney5011yeah but bro mentioned Kakarot out of all games. The game is fun but it fell off HEAVY for a ton of fans. Due to them cutting out fights, repetitive battles, and a grindy system. That was until the dlcs happened, the ones I'm referring to are Trunks, Bardock, 23rd Martial Arts Touramemt, and the End of Z dlc. The Golden Frizea and Beerus dlc were basically just add-ons while the others felt like a stand alone game. People rag on about Xenoverse yet it still has the most sales out of everyone and still has an active community just like FighterZ, modded or not.
What do yall mean fall off no game is ever going to retain all the players at launch these games been out for 3 plus yrs. Take was saying there not going to be a time where dbz will not draw attention.
@@andrewstokes6859 the commentor wrote that "dbz games are repetitive but will never fall off" Sage was saying that Kakarot never did but the others did
9:26 i think this only applies the TOP like half of the fights were near the edge, so blind them and then just throw them out get the quick w, they couldnt fly... technically
I love the buu saga most because 1, ssj3 come on, 2 the execution was amazing to me, I love how it worked except for video only problem I have with it, the whole Goku realizing that people need him, and the power he's looking for in others is actually the power of friendship or whatever you wanna call it, power of others stuff like that, I love how it's executed, the ending was in my opinion perfect for it
Thanks for that last hot take, idk why people hate on it now, art is usually a work of love and toriyama, really wanted to just show us a fun time, like “look at this little guy” and we were here for it, so many things are standing on the shoulders of DB and DB stands on the shoulders of Journey to the West and so many other things, whyre they looking down on everyone who paved the way?? It’s okay to like things, like you said
I know it’s not much but he got a zenkai boost from reserrection f plus training with piccolo plus he as he fights he gets stronger plus the longer he has potential unleashed it grows so maybe that’s why?
super does having power scaling issues with trunks but as far as gohan and krillin go goku is almost always holding back it’s like the whole suppression thing that most people even fans forget
One of my “meh”moments in DBS was how powerful Frieza gotten in Resurrection F as he went from being weaker than Super Saiyan Goku on namel to being stronger than both SSJB Goku and Vegeta in a few months which in my opinion undermines Goku and Vegeta struggles and training during all this time from Namek-Battle of Gods Saga as Frieza is basically resurrected for some reason nobody on Earth notices the sky turning Dark and I would think the Z-Fighters at least on Earth can sense Frieza power the moment he is revive I don’t exactly remember if Frieza can suppressed energy or not but anyway whole Frieza is training on space is it that nobody can sense his power raising even for a second especially at how powerful Frieza was during Resurrection F I just find that to be ridiculous of the Z fighters. Also the concept of god ki and power levels are all over the place because why is it that when Goku and Vegeta get a very powerful boost to their overall power from base to their god forms once they gotten God ki and everyone else does not have God ki and characters like Gohan, Android 17, Kefla, Trunks etc and it’s not that I don’t like the powers up I just found hey hey got the power up really dumb or just explain and plan out more also wtf is Super Saiyan Rage come on that is honestly the most dumbest form in dragon ball history right next to Super Saiyan 3.
Frieza never trained a day in his life before Namek and he was already almost as strong as a Super Saiyan. It kind of makes sense that Frieza’s race gains an immense amount of power from minimal training
Good point and your right I still just find it crazy that Frieza power level and potential would be that big of a jump even with him not training a single day of his life in only a few months
I can see what u mean and this is why the anime doesn’t portray SSB the best. In the manga Kefla , Gohan, Krillin aren’t even close to SSB level. But they make fights seem closer than what it is. Krillin , 17 , Gohan and Kefla can’t sense God chi and an aspect of Blue is perfect Ki control so Goku can have his power at SSJ level or SSJ3 level in blue. For example against Beserker Kale Goku was in SSJ2 and went blue but he was clearly holding back massively of SSB power because we see him Fatigued fight a stronger SSJ2 Kale and Caulifa with just his God form. The anime doesn’t explain well that most of the time Goku isn’t remotely trying in Blue. Another example Gohan fights a SSBK Goku but against Toppo Gohan can’t even scratch him where as Goku in the exhibition enbrasses Toppo in blue l. But yeah unless it was Frieza , Jiren , Zamasu or Hit. Whenever Goku goes Blue he’s outputting around SSJ3 or a little more power
14:42 Frieza was cooking with his lines in Super. Best written in the arc in my opinion, he always stole the spotlight when he actually TRIED to fight (JUST LIKE HE SHOULD'VE TRUED TO TRAIN A LONG TIME AGO)
Yeah you know you’re onto something there, we’re still talking about dragonball 40 years after it came out, and the franchise never fell off, it’s not like mha which most people who got into it years ago don’t care anymore
My GT hot take is it would be better to Readapt it or just outright make parts of it canon, then to outright write it off as a non canon side story This is entirely based off of the fact that super hasn’t mattered to me, since every arc has still been stuck in the end of Z time skip. GT already opened a template of ideas to open up in a post Z world. Super feels like Z lite cause it takes place that was canonically called a peaceful timeskip, and until that is retconned I don’t care it was considered peaceful 😂, and I’ll point this out Super had a Tuffle appear in the tournament of Power, and I’m all for Baby and an invasion of the Machine Mutants Movie/ arc. Literally someone just take plan to eradicate the super Saiyan. Replace hatchiyak and Dr.lychee with Myu and Baby. retitle it Dragon Ball Super: Exterminate the Super Saiyan God can have Baby take down the fighterZ on earth and have Myu work on 17 and 18, and set up better segways into Super Hellfighter Android 17.
If u really think about it tho super has been quite a peaceful time at least for earth since the last proper threat was golden frieza and the only outlier is cell max if u consider him as one
if youre going to redo gt id change a few things, no super 17, it sucks, its just a bad idea. overusing the dragonballs is a good idea, just make me care about the dragons more, give ssj4 to some thats not vegeta goku or gohan, if youre going to have the search for the dragon balls make it so its goten trunks and pan instead of goku, keep baby as is with a few changes in characters
@@eldinovm8077easy don’t kill piccolo and if we get rid of super 17 I want something equally as whacky and dumb. Besides it also makes Krillen’s plead to 17 to stop makes more sense there since with super in line. For the shadow dragons change 3 of the 4 dragons, and have Piccolo and Gohan Fight the ones tied to the demon king piccolo and wishes tied to reviving those killed by him and his youth. Just make the fights thematic to the wishes and who’s fighting them.
@@thedevilsleutice meh i still think it’d be better to scrap it and recycle some ideas like baby, gt is bad very bad and would need to many changes to make it a decent story
ssj2 is a multiplier so it really does depend on their base power level, potara fusion is also a multiplier and legendary super saiyan was showed to rival blue goku and blue vegeta in the broly movie so a prodigy like caulifla fusing with a legendary ssj like kale makes sense shes stronger than blue level
@eldinovm8077 that's true and i can see that but at the same time...they was just learning ssj2 that has its own draw backs and we still don't know if berserk and legendary ssj is the same we just assume bc we know it's inspired by og broly & the new broly was blue level after the fact. What makes me doubt it more the was pressed by a fatigued goku before fusing. And if I go by what you just explained I can make the arrangement that gotenks is ssg level bc they retconed the dance which is crazy😂
@@clouty_tv9985 i don’t understand that gotenks example, like he had the right amount of power, the kids were nowhere near that level prior not even together so fusion like i said is a multiplier but the potara are also stated to be stronger. idk it makes sense man, legendary ssj kefla is an unknown you also don’t know the base level of those saiyans as cabba was vastly stronger than base goku in the buu saga, like its implied that the u6 saiyans are somewhat stronger than u7 ones at least the ones we see
“I’ve never read the dbs manga” well in that same manga Gohan explains that he uses the gravity room to train during his spare time, even before he starts training with Piccolo again. Gohan has immense potential only characters that rival him in that aspect are Frieza and Broly. It’s not unrealistic for him to catch up(not or par with blue goku) but have more power than at least ssj3 goku. I hate that people dislike the fact that Gohan can do that when it’s always been his character. Forgetting the rage boost when he actually trained he surpassed every single Z fighter including Goku in just 10 months inside of the hyperbolic time chamber
And that's bs and everybody knows it. He straight up said before that he stopped training altogether, the writers added that gravity training bull to save face after realising that everybody(minus Gohan super fanboys) could see through their shoehorning and axxpull.
Hey! TSO_Sage. How do you feel about vegeta beating goku in dragon ball super super hero? I think Goku should have won, since Goku never beat Vegeta in a fight.
Nah DBZ broly is good for what he is . A villain . DBS broly is good for his reason . I’ll always ride for both . But I do like DBZ Brolys movie better
I disagree with the hot taker’s reason for why SSGSS should have taken longer to learn. By the time of Battle of Gods Goku and Vegeta have already mastered SSJ, removing the need to tap in to anger and making it basically as natural as charging up. So there shouldn’t be any conflict between Tranquil God Ki and their current neutral states of SSJ (Grade 4) I do agree however that Blue should have been unlocked like against Hit. Or even just make Blue a Vegeta only form and God a Goku only form if we are retconning stuff.
Goku is clearly better than Vegeta even in skill wise seriously Im so tired of that narrative. Goku constantly shows that even after the Hyperbolic Time chamber where Goku slightly admitted to the man.
Gohan Black? Maybe. But not Goten Black. Nothing good narratively happens with Zamasu taking Goten's body. There's at least some "Trunks vs. an evil version of his mentor" dynamic with Gohan Black and possibly Gohan seeing what he could be if he weren't slacking.
Hot take: replace vegeta with Nappa and raditz, Keep raditz for obvious reasons and keep nappa because people honestly forget that nappa had signs of being a genuine good guy. He wanted to revive raditz, he was shocked and concern on when vegeta killed a saibaman cause he so it on their side, and he legit was kinda happy when one the bug people called him a hero so
I will never not be so deeply disappointed in GT, it has some absolutely baller ideas and concepts but fumbles so hard on how they are executed, GT could have been better then Z to me if it was executed properly but sadly we live in this timeline
Kuhan would not be stronger than Vegito. One of the the big things that made Vegito so strong was the rivalry boost that was exclusive to him. There are actually guides out there that straight up state that Goku and Vegeta were such a perfect match for the fusion that Vegito straight up came out stronger than if Goku had fused with Gohan instead.
One thing i never understood about Vegetas "loss" to Goku in Saiyan Saga was the fact that he could go Great Ape the whole time. Wouldnt that count as him technically holding back? The same way during their second fight, Goku could have went SSJ3 the whole time so he is seen as holding back.
Your are wrong. The orange form was not ask it was given. Piccolo asked for a potential unlock then the dragon add something special to that wish. Imo Saiyan saga Sheron should be able to do a potential unlock. Also i think the orange form should be over or at ssj3 in terms of multipler because Shevron giving you a discount is like 0.1 chance and you might have to be the creator of the dragon to even get that.
So basically I think in a Olama video, he explains people are misusing the word fraud, I'm saying this cuz of the thumbnail, people are calling Goku the fraud for learning techniques, then aren't all of us fruads cuz we all learned math's from Teachers? We learned history and etc so we are frauds bad on what people say
Goku I think feels laid back even with serious threats because he's seen tons of death and revivals. Like he knows as long as I'm him, everybody lives. Why should he be stressed? He also is a master fighter. Like he can be stronger than anybody without appearing to stress about it. He knows if Vegeta were just the strongest, bro is going unhinged. He's proven that in his entire history. So it's annoying he's always stronger than Vegeta, but he sincerely has to be. So he has that pressure to keep training. I get that Vegeta says he's training in case Frieza comes back, but he's realistically training to be in charge like an Emperor.
Idk if this is a hot take but I think saying a character is more relatable then the next is wrong as it is subjective to the person I personally found vegeta more relatable then goku not saying goku doesn’t have relatable qualities
Guy said Vegeta is better than Goku at everything? LMAO Thats clearly the opposite in everyway goku is better: 1/ Goku has the better name? Ask anyone who isnt biased i.e who hasnt watched dragon ball who has the better name and they'll tell you Goku does 2/ Who looks better? windows peak and short nothing else needed to be said here 3/Who has the best personality? grumpy arrogant vegeta basically personality traits you'd hate in a real person vs kind hearted and genial Goku traits youd love anyone in real life to have 4/ Whos the better fighter? Obviously goku, based on all his fights how well hes able to hold his own against someone stronger or even with him 5/ Who the smarter trainer? Obviously Goku based on scenes in the cell saga 6/Whos always been the better Dad? certainly not the guy who didnt give a rats ass if #20 blew baby trunks up That guy is crazy funny for typing that
nah dbxv2 fallin off is insane we still have the largest playerbase in all of db gaming. its kakarot that fell off, from the get go its only redeeming quality was graphics. besides that most people didnt like kakarot and some didnt even buy it, me included
Universe 6 Saiyans do not deserve to be that strong. And also there's no way Kefla is SSGSS level? If we do basic Dragon Ball math: SSJ 2 CAULIFLA + SSJ Kale, then some... it shouldnt reach Godhood. Goku was heavily tired, and when he could pop those transformantions, he was like around 15-30% battery. So yeah. Universe 6 Saiyans shouldn't be portraited nowhere as close as their universe 7 counterparts, but Super(anime) just makes things worse
Freeza is definitely the best villain in the entire Dragon Ball franchise we learn Goku’s background and piccolo’s too, it brings character development to piccolo and vegeta too and like you said freeza is just a evil sadistic asshole😂
That’s kinda understandable but solar flare only is really used lately for opponents who don’t sense Ki, like cell max. It also hurts a fuckton, which some people forget. Your eyes aren’t really something you can train a lot. They’re vulnerable, and solar flare literally sears your eyes
Every character that can perform solar flare can also hide their ki. That's why it's a perfect distraction, blinds you so you can't see or sense me as I make my escape
i didn’t say this lmaoo i even said vegeta prolly wins cuz no way Gokus body just keeps up. but the idea Goku with Kaioken x3 let alone x4, couldn’t do damage or even get it done is equally crazy. atp goku plainly overpowers vegeta, just unlikely he actually puts vegeta down in time
Ok. I disagreed with you on one take and that’s that Vegeta is a better villain then Cell. I just don’t see that at all. As a character Vegeta clears and as much as I love Cell Frieza also clears. But the concept, the contrast, the build up, the fights, the Enjoyability and the stakes of Cell just do it for me. Like from an Enjoyability stand point alone Cell vs Goku or Cell vs Gohan and the Kamehameha clash is just so well executed and Cell himself has such a cool and interesting character to go in to I just don’t see Vegeta as a villain being better than him.
How would kuhan ever be stonger than vegito 😭 goku would literally have to lower his power level to even fuse with gohan. And goku being more relatable than vegeta is a bad take
@@TSO_SageI see where you're coming from I think Z is heavily misunderstood in ways, in a sense I feel it leaves the story open for interpretation, in a way with the ending of Z, DragonBall will truly never end (unless you count GT ofc) And...idk I don't really count OG since it and Z were technically originally the same thing. But honestly that ending with Chi-Chi is just heartwarming imo, although ig I can see the end of Super being above that
DBS broly is NOT COOLER!!! The problem that you guys have is recency bias. Everyone’s gonna say he’s cooler becuase he’s so recent, but I dare you guys tell her name one quote from that Broly… Name one memorable line that he said. What exactly did he do in that movie that radiate coolness? because the original was overflowing with coolness
@@TSO_SageI think he meant as broly had better one liners that made him more cool than a super broly which he did. Memoriable lines? A few actually but "Kakarot" the most memoriable lol. I also think Z broly is a cooler broly. Super Broly just had a actual real backstory which i think why people rank him above z broly. trash talking broly for the win
I actually agree with the DBZ Broly being better than DBS broky. Look is DBZ broly's backstory dumb as hell? Yes. But i think his dialog makes up for it overall. Plus he is a straight menace who was destroying the Z warriors until the plot kicked in. DBS Broly has a much better backstory true. But what do we get out of him in terms of speech? Incoherent screaming and yelling. Like damn. I want him to talk! Say anyrhing other than "KAKAROT". Plus he lost to Gogeta fairly unlike DBZ broly who was beat by plot alone.
I disagree with toriyama Micheal Jordan comparison whole heartedly he’s much more like Kobe because he’s not the goat but his impact and style was just so unique and felt
Rip toryama first of all, the goat. Secondly the guy that thought vegeta is better than goku in everything is just a vegeta fanboy, idk how you can watch dragonball and think that to yourself, vegeta never even use to train, talk about cheap powerup? Vegeta utilizes zenkai boost in namek and and did not train in 20 years walking around beating his chest saying hes the best until goku humbled his ass, all he lives off was his saiyan blood, goku was way better fighter for a long time, tbh goku would be in our generation an Alpha, vegeta was a Beta almost bitch made dude again it was not until late buu going into super where vegeta start to become more of THAT guy, goku overpowered vegeta planetary galic gun hand him his first small L in years with kaioken, goku unlock super saiyan first, mastered super saiyan way better, save vegeta's life twice, and then granted with a dead body but he did gain ssj3 which made him way stronger, vegeta was more compelling because you get to see the journey, but people forget goku dad his journey too
Gohan and goku stronger then vegeta? Wtf he just slipped that in goku and vegeta dam near equal and Gohan hasn’t been confirmed to be stronger then both of them
Gokus strongest moments were when he was fighting for his friends. Sure he enjoys fighting and is very vocal about it, but he has always been there to help others. That's literally the guy that almost died in a cave in to save a mouse that helped him in a fight minutes before. Goku is all about his friends.
@@oldmanjesus9855That’s filler. The manga makes it abundantly evident that Goku places fighting over everything but family only in extreme circumstances. Even toriyama said in an interview that his friends were just a happy coincidence, they appeared along the way as a result of Goku caring for fighting.
@@nivnavion what's filler?? The rat thing? I was just giving a random example, but let's be for real, Goku achieved super Sayian after his friend was blown up. Sacrificed himself twice to make sure his people would stay safe and the second time he literally refuses to be brought back to life after assuming that his friends were being put in danger because of him. Almost cooked both Zamasu and Black after finding out what they have done to his family, was crying like a baby when Roshi almost lost his life in the TOP, and he beat Jiren after Jiren lost his mind and tried to attack Goku's people in the stands, in which Goku actually states that he might not be the "people's champ" but do not mess with his friends, and that was straight from the horses mouth. None of that was filler. Yes Goku loves to fight, but that doesn't mean he doesn't care about the people around him, he has proven time and time again that he cares.
@@oldmanjesus9855 All of those are apart of the aforementioned "extreme circumstances." Also none of that, at all, is power of friendship regardless, it would be mental gymnastics to suggest it was an indirect form of power of friendship, when there are better, more literal examples.
@@nivnavion one's true character gets put to the test in extreme circumstances, not mundane ones. Krillin died and the pain of losing a friend made Goku attain a level of power that made him surpass the literal emperor of the known universe. If that's not the ultimate power gained from friendship then I don't know what else to tell you. Regardless, my point is that Goku is all about his friends and family, and him enjoying his battles doesn't mean that he cares less about his people. 50% of Vegeta's moment in the entire series revolves around him talking about how great he is, yet in extreme circumstances he gives his all for his family, by your logic, since he is constantly talking about his pride, does that mean that Vegeta doesn't care about his family and only fights to feed his ego?
I don't really get more and more people clammering for Videl wanting to be a fighter after that beat down. My own head cannon is that Videl very clearly witnessed and recognized the vast gap between her and literally everyone else and was just like "alright cool, im gonna put my faith in Gohan/the z fighters"
There’s nothing wrong with her wanting to continue fighting on its own. Krillin is a police officer in Super and Videl is a combat sports instructor in super. There’s never been an inclination at all that she stopped fighting, she’s just not going to fight people that can blow up planets, obviously. A side character can just have a side job, as look as they add to character dynamics and add colour, saturation and vibrance to the world, it’s good for characters to be standalone. On a completely unrelated note but kind of related, the best course of action would be for the story would have to end at Z. Super is, whether people like it or not, bad, and Toriyama did end DB in 1995. This means that they can leave it open for characters.
Orange piccolo is perfect Narratively. Think about it. Namekians didn’t search for the dragonballs. Each elder had one. A warrior had to prove themselves worthy then he gets the dragonball. When he ends up with all seven. He can make a wish to unlock the fullness of their potential. That is perfect namekian lore.
I feel like you’re right when Orange Piccolo would be perfect narratively speaking. I really just wish that if they were going to give Piccolo this form, they should have had Piccolo go to Elder Kai and get his potential unlocked during the Tournament of Power. Not only would Piccolo be more powerful in the tournament, but he could also train up his potential and eventually awaken Orange Piccolo. I know it’s kinda cliché, but I feel it’s better than Piccolo wishing for power as it just seems so out of place. Because at least with Piccolo getting his potential unlocked by Elder Kai, you can make the case that Piccolo was being strategic in getting stronger quickly and seeing how much it benefited his student Gohan. Then maybe Piccolo could think it might be a good route for him to gain more power, and then he would be more powerful, not an Orange Piccolo. Although the first step to getting there is difficult. And since Piccolo is one of the most strategic characters in all of Dragon Ball, he would do something that is necessary even if it means obtaining power in a cheap way to protect the Earth. So while I may not like Piccolo wishing for power, I’m not too upset about it as it does align with Piccolo’s character, being realistic, and not to mention Kami and Nail’s part inside him as well.
@@NatharionXTholy bible
Then there is also the fact that even if Dende is the planet's Dragon Clan Namekian, Shenron is still Piccolo's dragon on Kami's side. He's basically just giving himself power.
THATS A REACHHHH
It’s very interesting, and I like the idea. Insane reach unless further explained tho
5:33 ✊😔 rest in peace to the goat
I hate that Gohan misconception. He never was ssjb kk level pre TOP. Gohan told Goku to come at him with all he’s got, Goku goes ssjb kk and then Gohan promptly gets one shotted.
He goes ssjb, trades blows with Gohan, THEN goes ssjbkk to one-shot
@@imlazy_lol right, but people seem to misremember it and claim Gohan is ssjb kk level.
@@jg5004 Huh, weird. Didn't know that some people thought that
yea anybody saying he’s ON PAR with ssb kk Goku is crazy for sure. blue level however is just damn near a fact
@@TSO_SageSSB doesn’t just make goku stronger it gives him 100% ki control so he likely wasn’t going full power against gohan and just used kaioken to end it real fast
Idk the writer for Naruto, but he's literally said he wrote his comics because of Akira Toriyama and Dragonball.
Literally growing up with him and being inspired. I wish people talked about things like that when it comes to people's works. Influence shows how we build upon one another
Piccolo didn't ask for Orange, if he had gotten exactly what he asked for and nothing else, He would only have gotten Power Awakened. Orange was a gift from Shenron, he even states he gave piccolo "All he had, plus a bit extra"
Orange is a gift straight from Shenron, and to receive a gift of that level you'd have to be considered worthy of it. Orange feels to me like a narrative reward for Piccolo as both a thank you to kami for creating the dragon, and an acknowledgement from Shenron that he has truly changed, as last time Piccolo summoned Shenron, it was as King Piccolo and we all know how THAT went.
Also it was the nameks who even made the dragon balls
People always talk about "Solar Flare + Destructo Disk" but Oozaru Vegeta in a nerfed state with a damaged eye and verbal reason to believe Krillin & Gohan left the battlefield with his back turned to them dodged a Destructo Disk aimed at his tail like it was nothing all because he was still conscious of him existing. And he can't even sense Ki at that time.
Cabba and Universe 6 saiyans were made to rewrite previous mistakes in the DBZ cannon.
Cabba was only made because they needed Vegeta to teach "a Son" to turn super Saiyan. Goku trained his son. Goku did it. But Vegeta never had a moment like that, because Future Trunks did it himself and Present trunks (and Goten) are Gag characters. (See Gotenks teen just not existing yet)
And Caulifla and Kale were only made because previously Women Super Saiyan weren't cannon in DBZ. Bring them from another universe and that problem is solved
FACTS!
Freiza’s overused. He should’ve stayed dead in z. There are many more characters in dragon ball that deserve more screen time. I think the idea of cooler being cannon is a good idea, but it could be hard finding an origin that makes sense.
GT in my eyes with the Shadow Dragons is probably the most interesting concept in DB
Probably the most fitting final boss.
8:28 in manga that’s eve worse with gohan not only fighting but eliminating kefla from the tournament (he got eliminated too but point still stands)
Simple answer: Kefla isn’t as strong in the manga as she is in the anime so Gohan beating two mostly inexperienced prodigies fused, with him being a prodigy that has experience, makes sense
@@rinjin703Yeah, as much as I like Goku defeated her in the anime, Gohan being the one who does it makes more sense.
Piccolo actually asks the dragon to unlock his potential, which is the slighty lighter green form, orange was the something extra that the dragon gave him.
Highlighter Piccolo
@@semtex234 😂
I can’t use twitter so I’ll leave my take here.
Instead of a power level, it makes much more sense to view power scaling in dragon ball as different levels entirely. Namek ssj level, first form freeza level, etc. it makes the idea of characters being able to keep up much more believable. Also my favorite part of the buu saga was gohan in high school. The saiyaman arc was peak.
Gohan and Trunks are apparently Namek Frieza Level according to Goku and honestly I like this way of scaling more
7:33 But yet people still play and watch Budokai 3 content and that game came out in 2007
That’s not bringing up Tenkaichi series
@@iankendall8467 I know but he was talking about games in general like Xenoverse and Fighterz
@@daxmoney5011yeah but bro mentioned Kakarot out of all games. The game is fun but it fell off HEAVY for a ton of fans. Due to them cutting out fights, repetitive battles, and a grindy system. That was until the dlcs happened, the ones I'm referring to are Trunks, Bardock, 23rd Martial Arts Touramemt, and the End of Z dlc. The Golden Frizea and Beerus dlc were basically just add-ons while the others felt like a stand alone game.
People rag on about Xenoverse yet it still has the most sales out of everyone and still has an active community just like FighterZ, modded or not.
What do yall mean fall off no game is ever going to retain all the players at launch these games been out for 3 plus yrs. Take was saying there not going to be a time where dbz will not draw attention.
@@andrewstokes6859 the commentor wrote that "dbz games are repetitive but will never fall off"
Sage was saying that Kakarot never did but the others did
6:25 Goku pried the door open, but Naruto rasengan'd us through that mf 😂
It's a shame how hard Naruto fell off in Shippuden
9:26 i think this only applies the TOP like half of the fights were near the edge, so blind them and then just throw them out get the quick w, they couldnt fly... technically
6:13 Pokémon and Dragon Ball pushed the door for others
I feel like you should read the manga cuz most issues the anime has aren’t present in the manga
Glass shattering was 17's Barrier, but I guess it can be symbolic of Jiren.
I love the buu saga most because 1, ssj3 come on, 2 the execution was amazing to me, I love how it worked except for video only problem I have with it, the whole Goku realizing that people need him, and the power he's looking for in others is actually the power of friendship or whatever you wanna call it, power of others stuff like that, I love how it's executed, the ending was in my opinion perfect for it
Thanks for that last hot take, idk why people hate on it now, art is usually a work of love and toriyama, really wanted to just show us a fun time, like “look at this little guy” and we were here for it, so many things are standing on the shoulders of DB and DB stands on the shoulders of Journey to the West and so many other things, whyre they looking down on everyone who paved the way?? It’s okay to like things, like you said
I know it’s not much but he got a zenkai boost from reserrection f plus training with piccolo plus he as he fights he gets stronger plus the longer he has potential unleashed it grows so maybe that’s why?
Bwt we get told what Jirens wish is and if he won and wished for what he wanted yeah everyone would’ve been cooked 😂
By the time Gohan gets to fight SSJ Blue Goku pre-ToP, he had been training for at least a year, since the RoF arc.
16:50 ish Long story short, we've had enough time for the advancements to become common place, and the flaws to stick out more.
super does having power scaling issues with trunks but as far as gohan and krillin go goku is almost always holding back it’s like the whole suppression thing that most people even fans forget
lol people hating on dragon ball that are fans of animae is beyond me I just dont understand it
I was down with Xenoverse, wanna go back to it.
But Kakarot? I really didn't enjoy the gameplay loop.
How do you feel about the dragon ball kai ending dear zarathustra?
One of my “meh”moments in DBS was how powerful Frieza gotten in Resurrection F as he went from being weaker than Super Saiyan Goku on namel to being stronger than both SSJB Goku and Vegeta in a few months which in my opinion undermines Goku and Vegeta struggles and training during all this time from Namek-Battle of Gods Saga as Frieza is basically resurrected for some reason nobody on Earth notices the sky turning Dark and I would think the Z-Fighters at least on Earth can sense Frieza power the moment he is revive I don’t exactly remember if Frieza can suppressed energy or not but anyway whole Frieza is training on space is it that nobody can sense his power raising even for a second especially at how powerful Frieza was during Resurrection F I just find that to be ridiculous of the Z fighters. Also the concept of god ki and power levels are all over the place because why is it that when Goku and Vegeta get a very powerful boost to their overall power from base to their god forms once they gotten God ki and everyone else does not have God ki and characters like Gohan, Android 17, Kefla, Trunks etc and it’s not that I don’t like the powers up I just found hey hey got the power up really dumb or just explain and plan out more also wtf is Super Saiyan Rage come on that is honestly the most dumbest form in dragon ball history right next to Super Saiyan 3.
Frieza never trained a day in his life before Namek and he was already almost as strong as a Super Saiyan. It kind of makes sense that Frieza’s race gains an immense amount of power from minimal training
Good point and your right I still just find it crazy that Frieza power level and potential would be that big of a jump even with him not training a single day of his life in only a few months
I can see what u mean and this is why the anime doesn’t portray SSB the best. In the manga Kefla , Gohan, Krillin aren’t even close to SSB level. But they make fights seem closer than what it is. Krillin , 17 , Gohan and Kefla can’t sense God chi and an aspect of Blue is perfect Ki control so Goku can have his power at SSJ level or SSJ3 level in blue. For example against Beserker Kale Goku was in SSJ2 and went blue but he was clearly holding back massively of SSB power because we see him Fatigued fight a stronger SSJ2 Kale and Caulifa with just his God form. The anime doesn’t explain well that most of the time Goku isn’t remotely trying in Blue. Another example Gohan fights a SSBK Goku but against Toppo Gohan can’t even scratch him where as Goku in the exhibition enbrasses Toppo in blue l. But yeah unless it was Frieza , Jiren , Zamasu or Hit. Whenever Goku goes Blue he’s outputting around SSJ3 or a little more power
10:45 I seen in a vid somewhere that said a goku and gohan fusion would’ve been weaker then vegito
14:42 Frieza was cooking with his lines in Super. Best written in the arc in my opinion, he always stole the spotlight when he actually TRIED to fight (JUST LIKE HE SHOULD'VE TRUED TO TRAIN A LONG TIME AGO)
6:51 i think he meant the franchise of games wont fall off
I really like your content
Yeah you know you’re onto something there, we’re still talking about dragonball 40 years after it came out, and the franchise never fell off, it’s not like mha which most people who got into it years ago don’t care anymore
Shenron gives orange to piccolo, he doesn't wish for it.
Goku should have taken up the mantle of the Great Sayiaman after Gohan retired from fighting.
I disagree piccolo didn’t ask for orange the dragon gave him a little extra
Videl runs a dojo, she is still involved with fighting?
Sage u gotta make a z dub vs Kai dub I seen 2 much slander on the z dub. Me personally I’ll take the first 2 sagas in Kai dub last 2 in z dub
I got flared for this one but let me cook, Chi Chi is a goated mother, BUT she’s an L wife. Plenty of stuff to prove both of these things, but yk
Love Cell more over Frieza
My GT hot take is it would be better to Readapt it or just outright make parts of it canon, then to outright write it off as a non canon side story
This is entirely based off of the fact that super hasn’t mattered to me, since every arc has still been stuck in the end of Z time skip. GT already opened a template of ideas to open up in a post Z world. Super feels like Z lite cause it takes place that was canonically called a peaceful timeskip, and until that is retconned I don’t care it was considered peaceful 😂, and I’ll point this out Super had a Tuffle appear in the tournament of Power, and I’m all for Baby and an invasion of the Machine Mutants Movie/ arc.
Literally someone just take plan to eradicate the super Saiyan. Replace hatchiyak and Dr.lychee with Myu and Baby. retitle it Dragon Ball Super: Exterminate the Super Saiyan God can have Baby take down the fighterZ on earth and have Myu work on 17 and 18, and set up better segways into Super Hellfighter Android 17.
If u really think about it tho super has been quite a peaceful time at least for earth since the last proper threat was golden frieza and the only outlier is cell max if u consider him as one
@@amadujalo8914fair enough. But I’m not gonna act like Zamasu was exactly peaceful. And Moro literally almost ate the planet.
if youre going to redo gt id change a few things, no super 17, it sucks, its just a bad idea. overusing the dragonballs is a good idea, just make me care about the dragons more, give ssj4 to some thats not vegeta goku or gohan, if youre going to have the search for the dragon balls make it so its goten trunks and pan instead of goku, keep baby as is with a few changes in characters
@@eldinovm8077easy don’t kill piccolo and if we get rid of super 17 I want something equally as whacky and dumb. Besides it also makes Krillen’s plead to 17 to stop makes more sense there since with super in line.
For the shadow dragons change 3 of the 4 dragons, and have Piccolo and Gohan Fight the ones tied to the demon king piccolo and wishes tied to reviving those killed by him and his youth. Just make the fights thematic to the wishes and who’s fighting them.
@@thedevilsleutice meh i still think it’d be better to scrap it and recycle some ideas like baby, gt is bad very bad and would need to many changes to make it a decent story
8:56 uhm can you explain exactly how 2 sayians learning ssj2 then fusing equal ssb levels of power?
ssj2 is a multiplier so it really does depend on their base power level, potara fusion is also a multiplier and legendary super saiyan was showed to rival blue goku and blue vegeta in the broly movie so a prodigy like caulifla fusing with a legendary ssj like kale makes sense shes stronger than blue level
@eldinovm8077 that's true and i can see that but at the same time...they was just learning ssj2 that has its own draw backs and we still don't know if berserk and legendary ssj is the same we just assume bc we know it's inspired by og broly & the new broly was blue level after the fact. What makes me doubt it more the was pressed by a fatigued goku before fusing. And if I go by what you just explained I can make the arrangement that gotenks is ssg level bc they retconed the dance which is crazy😂
@@clouty_tv9985 i don’t understand that gotenks example, like he had the right amount of power, the kids were nowhere near that level prior not even together so fusion like i said is a multiplier but the potara are also stated to be stronger.
idk it makes sense man, legendary ssj kefla is an unknown you also don’t know the base level of those saiyans as cabba was vastly stronger than base goku in the buu saga, like its implied that the u6 saiyans are somewhat stronger than u7 ones at least the ones we see
5:27 oh my god! I’m burning how hot that is I need a fire extinguisher 🧯
Edit: I forgot to say I’m not hating on the ending of super
I love cell but literally every one had to mess up in that saga for him to become perfect?
“I’ve never read the dbs manga” well in that same manga Gohan explains that he uses the gravity room to train during his spare time, even before he starts training with Piccolo again. Gohan has immense potential only characters that rival him in that aspect are Frieza and Broly. It’s not unrealistic for him to catch up(not or par with blue goku) but have more power than at least ssj3 goku. I hate that people dislike the fact that Gohan can do that when it’s always been his character. Forgetting the rage boost when he actually trained he surpassed every single Z fighter including Goku in just 10 months inside of the hyperbolic time chamber
And that's bs and everybody knows it. He straight up said before that he stopped training altogether, the writers added that gravity training bull to save face after realising that everybody(minus Gohan super fanboys) could see through their shoehorning and axxpull.
Xeno 2 is old now haha still the fav though
Hey! TSO_Sage. How do you feel about vegeta beating goku in dragon ball super super hero? I think Goku should have won, since Goku never beat Vegeta in a fight.
Nah DBZ broly is good for what he is . A villain . DBS broly is good for his reason . I’ll always ride for both . But I do like DBZ Brolys movie better
I disagree with the hot taker’s reason for why SSGSS should have taken longer to learn.
By the time of Battle of Gods Goku and Vegeta have already mastered SSJ, removing the need to tap in to anger and making it basically as natural as charging up. So there shouldn’t be any conflict between Tranquil God Ki and their current neutral states of SSJ (Grade 4)
I do agree however that Blue should have been unlocked like against Hit. Or even just make Blue a Vegeta only form and God a Goku only form if we are retconning stuff.
SSJ3 is Goated, just needs more representation
Goku is clearly better than Vegeta even in skill wise seriously Im so tired of that narrative. Goku constantly shows that even after the Hyperbolic Time chamber where Goku slightly admitted to the man.
10:40 you actually do since gogeta movie predates vegeto anime debut
Not just his anime debut he predates Vegito's MANGA DEBUT
Abridged did most of the show better than the original. Abridged Cell especially.
Naw. That's a fake story. It's funny for comedy but it's just another fanmade take
trash take
I agree with this man
Abridged did irreparable damage to the show if anything
Really trash take, original is better by far, it did irreparable damage to the show and is only there for the humour and stuff.
Gohan Black? Maybe. But not Goten Black. Nothing good narratively happens with Zamasu taking Goten's body. There's at least some "Trunks vs. an evil version of his mentor" dynamic with Gohan Black and possibly Gohan seeing what he could be if he weren't slacking.
Hot take: replace vegeta with Nappa and raditz, Keep raditz for obvious reasons and keep nappa because people honestly forget that nappa had signs of being a genuine good guy. He wanted to revive raditz, he was shocked and concern on when vegeta killed a saibaman cause he so it on their side, and he legit was kinda happy when one the bug people called him a hero so
I will never not be so deeply disappointed in GT, it has some absolutely baller ideas and concepts but fumbles so hard on how they are executed, GT could have been better then Z to me if it was executed properly but sadly we live in this timeline
Kuhan would not be stronger than Vegito. One of the the big things that made Vegito so strong was the rivalry boost that was exclusive to him. There are actually guides out there that straight up state that Goku and Vegeta were such a perfect match for the fusion that Vegito straight up came out stronger than if Goku had fused with Gohan instead.
I like your takes, i dont like all of them, but, i like your takes
One thing i never understood about Vegetas "loss" to Goku in Saiyan Saga was the fact that he could go Great Ape the whole time. Wouldnt that count as him technically holding back? The same way during their second fight, Goku could have went SSJ3 the whole time so he is seen as holding back.
Vegeta didn't lose to Goku when it was one on one.
Your are wrong. The orange form was not ask it was given. Piccolo asked for a potential unlock then the dragon add something special to that wish. Imo Saiyan saga Sheron should be able to do a potential unlock. Also i think the orange form should be over or at ssj3 in terms of multipler because Shevron giving you a discount is like 0.1 chance and you might have to be the creator of the dragon to even get that.
Dbz broly is more iconic then dbs broly
So basically I think in a Olama video, he explains people are misusing the word fraud, I'm saying this cuz of the thumbnail, people are calling Goku the fraud for learning techniques, then aren't all of us fruads cuz we all learned math's from Teachers? We learned history and etc so we are frauds bad on what people say
Goku I think feels laid back even with serious threats because he's seen tons of death and revivals. Like he knows as long as I'm him, everybody lives. Why should he be stressed?
He also is a master fighter. Like he can be stronger than anybody without appearing to stress about it. He knows if Vegeta were just the strongest, bro is going unhinged. He's proven that in his entire history. So it's annoying he's always stronger than Vegeta, but he sincerely has to be. So he has that pressure to keep training.
I get that Vegeta says he's training in case Frieza comes back, but he's realistically training to be in charge like an Emperor.
Idk if this is a hot take but I think saying a character is more relatable then the next is wrong as it is subjective to the person I personally found vegeta more relatable then goku not saying goku doesn’t have relatable qualities
Guy said Vegeta is better than Goku at everything? LMAO Thats clearly the opposite in everyway goku is better:
1/ Goku has the better name? Ask anyone who isnt biased i.e who hasnt watched dragon ball who has the better name and they'll tell you Goku does
2/ Who looks better? windows peak and short nothing else needed to be said here
3/Who has the best personality? grumpy arrogant vegeta basically personality traits you'd hate in a real person vs kind hearted and genial Goku traits youd love anyone in real life to have
4/ Whos the better fighter? Obviously goku, based on all his fights how well hes able to hold his own against someone stronger or even with him
5/ Who the smarter trainer? Obviously Goku based on scenes in the cell saga
6/Whos always been the better Dad? certainly not the guy who didnt give a rats ass if #20 blew baby trunks up
That guy is crazy funny for typing that
Name me one ☝️ W solar flare gave to the Z fighters. Frieza’s tail doesn’t count😂
nah dbxv2 fallin off is insane we still have the largest playerbase in all of db gaming. its kakarot that fell off, from the get go its only redeeming quality was graphics. besides that most people didnt like kakarot and some didnt even buy it, me included
you should read dbs manga
12:48 if they did frieza better they should have made him stronger off rip.
You really gotta read the manga. It handles a lot of stuff better than the anime did. Like Jiren and his "Path to Power" arc.
Universe 6 Saiyans do not deserve to be that strong.
And also there's no way Kefla is SSGSS level?
If we do basic Dragon Ball math:
SSJ 2 CAULIFLA + SSJ Kale, then some... it shouldnt reach Godhood.
Goku was heavily tired, and when he could pop those transformantions, he was like around 15-30% battery.
So yeah. Universe 6 Saiyans shouldn't be portraited nowhere as close as their universe 7 counterparts, but Super(anime) just makes things worse
Freeza is definitely the best villain in the entire Dragon Ball franchise we learn Goku’s background and piccolo’s too, it brings character development to piccolo and vegeta too and like you said freeza is just a evil sadistic asshole😂
Also solar flare is useless now because people have the ability to sense ki 9:00
That’s kinda understandable but solar flare only is really used lately for opponents who don’t sense Ki, like cell max. It also hurts a fuckton, which some people forget. Your eyes aren’t really something you can train a lot. They’re vulnerable, and solar flare literally sears your eyes
Every character that can perform solar flare can also hide their ki. That's why it's a perfect distraction, blinds you so you can't see or sense me as I make my escape
Saying that goku was stronger than vegeta in their 1st fight is kinda crazy to me.
i didn’t say this lmaoo i even said vegeta prolly wins cuz no way Gokus body just keeps up. but the idea Goku with Kaioken x3 let alone x4, couldn’t do damage or even get it done is equally crazy.
atp goku plainly overpowers vegeta, just unlikely he actually puts vegeta down in time
Ok.
I disagreed with you on one take and that’s that Vegeta is a better villain then Cell. I just don’t see that at all. As a character Vegeta clears and as much as I love Cell Frieza also clears. But the concept, the contrast, the build up, the fights, the Enjoyability and the stakes of Cell just do it for me.
Like from an Enjoyability stand point alone Cell vs Goku or Cell vs Gohan and the Kamehameha clash is just so well executed and Cell himself has such a cool and interesting character to go in to I just don’t see Vegeta as a villain being better than him.
How would kuhan ever be stonger than vegito 😭 goku would literally have to lower his power level to even fuse with gohan. And goku being more relatable than vegeta is a bad take
Hard disagree on Super having the best ending of all DB. I get the end of the ToP was good but its nowhere near the others at all
Z ending was OK
GT unironically is debatable, one of GTs best moments actually
DB is cool but nothing crazy
@@TSO_SageI see where you're coming from
I think Z is heavily misunderstood in ways, in a sense I feel it leaves the story open for interpretation, in a way with the ending of Z, DragonBall will truly never end (unless you count GT ofc)
And...idk I don't really count OG since it and Z were technically originally the same thing. But honestly that ending with Chi-Chi is just heartwarming imo, although ig I can see the end of Super being above that
DBS broly is NOT COOLER!!!
The problem that you guys have is recency bias. Everyone’s gonna say he’s cooler becuase he’s so recent, but I dare you guys tell her name one quote from that Broly…
Name one memorable line that he said. What exactly did he do in that movie that radiate coolness? because the original was overflowing with coolness
I’m ready to fight on this hill COME AT ME
what’s the DBZ Broly quote… “kakarot” ? 💀
"AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA" DBS Broly.
@@TSO_SageI think he meant as broly had better one liners that made him more cool than a super broly which he did. Memoriable lines? A few actually but "Kakarot" the most memoriable lol. I also think Z broly is a cooler broly. Super Broly just had a actual real backstory which i think why people rank him above z broly. trash talking broly for the win
@@FestyNlocks imo Z is just more nostalgic tbh. super broly is kinda him lmaoo
I actually agree with the DBZ Broly being better than DBS broky.
Look is DBZ broly's backstory dumb as hell? Yes. But i think his dialog makes up for it overall. Plus he is a straight menace who was destroying the Z warriors until the plot kicked in.
DBS Broly has a much better backstory true. But what do we get out of him in terms of speech? Incoherent screaming and yelling. Like damn. I want him to talk! Say anyrhing other than "KAKAROT". Plus he lost to Gogeta fairly unlike DBZ broly who was beat by plot alone.
tso read dbs its miles better in comparison to its anime i promise youll atleast find stuff more interestin
I disagree with toriyama Micheal Jordan comparison whole heartedly he’s much more like Kobe because he’s not the goat but his impact and style was just so unique and felt
did you really NEED to comment this tho?
Then who IS the GOAT?
Russell Westbrook is top 40 all time
Rip toryama first of all, the goat. Secondly the guy that thought vegeta is better than goku in everything is just a vegeta fanboy, idk how you can watch dragonball and think that to yourself, vegeta never even use to train, talk about cheap powerup? Vegeta utilizes zenkai boost in namek and and did not train in 20 years walking around beating his chest saying hes the best until goku humbled his ass, all he lives off was his saiyan blood, goku was way better fighter for a long time, tbh goku would be in our generation an Alpha, vegeta was a Beta almost bitch made dude again it was not until late buu going into super where vegeta start to become more of THAT guy, goku overpowered vegeta planetary galic gun hand him his first small L in years with kaioken, goku unlock super saiyan first, mastered super saiyan way better, save vegeta's life twice, and then granted with a dead body but he did gain ssj3 which made him way stronger, vegeta was more compelling because you get to see the journey, but people forget goku dad his journey too
Goku more realistic than vegeta is the worst take ive ever heard and yes vegeta is a way better fighter than goku hence why he 3-0 in 1v1
Zamasu is one of the best villains out of DB
What is he talking about?
if he was done right
Dbz broly clears Dbs broly, but dbs broly is a better movie.
no he don't
Gohan and goku stronger then vegeta? Wtf he just slipped that in goku and vegeta dam near equal and Gohan hasn’t been confirmed to be stronger then both of them
Yo
XV2 definitely fell off
Goku and the power of friendship?!!! Goku has never been that type of character. To his core he just loves fighting
Gokus strongest moments were when he was fighting for his friends. Sure he enjoys fighting and is very vocal about it, but he has always been there to help others. That's literally the guy that almost died in a cave in to save a mouse that helped him in a fight minutes before. Goku is all about his friends.
@@oldmanjesus9855That’s filler. The manga makes it abundantly evident that Goku places fighting over everything but family only in extreme circumstances. Even toriyama said in an interview that his friends were just a happy coincidence, they appeared along the way as a result of Goku caring for fighting.
@@nivnavion what's filler?? The rat thing? I was just giving a random example, but let's be for real, Goku achieved super Sayian after his friend was blown up. Sacrificed himself twice to make sure his people would stay safe and the second time he literally refuses to be brought back to life after assuming that his friends were being put in danger because of him. Almost cooked both Zamasu and Black after finding out what they have done to his family, was crying like a baby when Roshi almost lost his life in the TOP, and he beat Jiren after Jiren lost his mind and tried to attack Goku's people in the stands, in which Goku actually states that he might not be the "people's champ" but do not mess with his friends, and that was straight from the horses mouth.
None of that was filler. Yes Goku loves to fight, but that doesn't mean he doesn't care about the people around him, he has proven time and time again that he cares.
@@oldmanjesus9855 All of those are apart of the aforementioned "extreme circumstances."
Also none of that, at all, is power of friendship regardless, it would be mental gymnastics to suggest it was an indirect form of power of friendship, when there are better, more literal examples.
@@nivnavion one's true character gets put to the test in extreme circumstances, not mundane ones.
Krillin died and the pain of losing a friend made Goku attain a level of power that made him surpass the literal emperor of the known universe. If that's not the ultimate power gained from friendship then I don't know what else to tell you.
Regardless, my point is that Goku is all about his friends and family, and him enjoying his battles doesn't mean that he cares less about his people. 50% of Vegeta's moment in the entire series revolves around him talking about how great he is, yet in extreme circumstances he gives his all for his family, by your logic, since he is constantly talking about his pride, does that mean that Vegeta doesn't care about his family and only fights to feed his ego?
I hated broly. When i finally saw the movie as a teen i thought broly was lame. Was glad they made him somewhat moderately interesting
Pls pin I’m your ten like
Z broly is way better than super broly in everr way period
delusional
I don't really get more and more people clammering for Videl wanting to be a fighter after that beat down. My own head cannon is that Videl very clearly witnessed and recognized the vast gap between her and literally everyone else and was just like "alright cool, im gonna put my faith in Gohan/the z fighters"
There’s nothing wrong with her wanting to continue fighting on its own. Krillin is a police officer in Super and Videl is a combat sports instructor in super. There’s never been an inclination at all that she stopped fighting, she’s just not going to fight people that can blow up planets, obviously. A side character can just have a side job, as look as they add to character dynamics and add colour, saturation and vibrance to the world, it’s good for characters to be standalone.
On a completely unrelated note but kind of related, the best course of action would be for the story would have to end at Z.
Super is, whether people like it or not, bad, and Toriyama did end DB in 1995. This means that they can leave it open for characters.