Always a pleasure watching you make chips. Those tapered keys look a lot like an MT3 tail stock drift key! That screaming grinder outside your shop is reminiscent of the noise that comes out of my mouth when apprentices walk off the job for the day leaving their tools scattered on the bench, the machines dirty and the floor unswept. In my shop everyone pays their dues or their apprenticeship ends suddenly and gracelessly.
Great as usual. It's amazing to see how something as solid as the K&T overhead arm is flexing with the small concentricity error of the radius cutter. It's very visible at 16:45.
It's a real pleasure watching you work sir. I realize most of what you show us is fairly simple in your eyes, but have been through some machine shop schooling, you are a true artist in my eyes. Thank You for the great videos. I only wish I lived near you so I could volunteer to help you with these projects in your shop.
Great little project Keith! I will add a quick aesthetic note note if I may be so bold: the arbor support for your K&T! Paint stripper, some minor removal of casting lines, maybe Evaporust and painting! It’s your own lovely tool! Go for it!
Another great video Keith, thanks for the effort I greatly enjoy your content. Hoping to get out in my shop and mill the straight edge I bought from you tomorrow.
I must say that I was surprised by the relative motion between the arbor support and the vise on the close up shots. It seems that the support is not as ridged as I thought it would be. Keep up the good work. lg
What you saw was most likely the runout in the arbor. Depending on what kind of shape the arbor, the spacers, and the cutter are in, the stackup can induce runout when it gets tightened down.
@@hdjawa It may also be the spacers. If they're not ground on the ends parallel to the bore, or they're worn, they will cause the arbor to tweak when the arbor nut is tightened.
Watch between 15:30 and 16:00 look only at the arbor support and the vise. The arbor support looks to be moving relative to the vise. I'm assuming the camera is on the floor and that maybe the arbor support arms may be loose.
After watching so many vids with such massive complex machinery, it's funny to see him use a 'tiny' drill press while holding the part with his hand. I guess there is hope for the little guy's shop.
The whole process of making that taper gauge was interesting, but for those wedges that get hammered in place, they could have just been made on an angle vise.
Little or large drill press block the part if you aren't going to clamp it to the table !!! Simply rotate the long end clockwise against the column, part too short, block rotating clockwise to a piece of cutoff lumber placed against the column. Rotating either counter-clockwise for column contact could provide free gastric bypass surgery. Now hand hold to drill. In 1962 on my 31st day of a tool and die apprenticeship I was drilling a 7/16 diameter x 6 inches deep in a 6 x 8 x 10 block of steel. Chips caught starting the block to rotate on the next to slowest speed of a Delta 4 gang cast iron table (Keith Fenner uses a salvaged table for layout and welding) ! The vibration was so great table had rotated 30 degree on the floor before bending the spindle which stopped the V belt. It was mfg before OSHA, the On/Off switches were mounted on the motors, I couldn't reach behind for the switch to stop the rotating/vibrating mess! With a new spindle, bearings, chuck, and cone pulley maintenance repaired it but also moved the On/Off switches to the front of all 4 drill presses!
@@EngineeringVignettes I'm no steam engine guy, but it appears to me that the taper wedge and the taper slot are just hammered in place to keep the round tapered end of the rod tight. That cotter pin just keeps the wedge from flying out if it works loose- I'm thinking that the standard procedure on the assembly was for the engineer to whack the wedge every so often to make sure it was tight. Neither the wedge or the taper slot are of any degree of precision beyond what you could achieve with an angle vise and after a couple whacks with the hammer, both pieces are deformed beyond whatever degree to which they were made.
I was pretty certain I saw the body of the Steam Stoker Engine on another famous TH-cam channel from Florida! :-) Thanks for the update. Love that K&T mill!
Loved the video, Keith. We've just disassembled our loco that uses the same kind of tapered keys holding the pistons into the crossheads. Luckily ours aren't so beaten up! Be looking forward to future updates.
When you temperate the steel in the oven. They make ceramic spacers that would support the steel to give better heat transfer. I believe it's called Kiln furniture. Comes in different shapes and sizes. It would also allow adding more to heat treat at the same time. Not expensive. But what ever you want to do.
For a key that is going to be beat into place with a hammer, eyeballing probably would be close enough. Nothing wrong with precision, but half a thou seems like overkill.
Keith, I really appreciate what you do and how you do it. I'm hooked on the Stoker Engine Restore and want to know when you plan on putting it back together?
You had me worried when you started the taper. I thought you had it in your taper too wrong. Not knowing you made the blanks oversize I understand now. Guess I would of had it parallel with the vice and done it in one pass. Nice job. End product is what counts.
Hi...I really like your videos. I have a problem with a set of Starrett 120 dial calipers. The dial numbers are upside down. I can’t find any information on how to rotate the numbers. Any ideas?
Excellent work as usual, Keith. Cross head designs allow for the very long piston strokes encountered in low speed steam and marine diesel engines. The drawing indicates that it was a Norfolk & Western RR drawing. Background?
As a member of the N&W Historical Society it's always nice to see our archive drawings being used. Are the stokers the same between an N&W design and the one on the 576?
interesting question - I'm telling myself I heard / saw the impact in the chip formation, and somewhere else people were warning about wear on milling cutters. Looking forward to the reply :)
I know you have a lot of irons in the fire; but, do you think you could break open that universal head for the K&T just to assess it. We have all been waiting to see that.
End play? I believe the cutter wasn't running concentric. Close ups of the milled surfaces exhibit ridges. Draw file to provide a smoother assembly surface? Good basic content and suggestions.
If you know your vice jaw isn't flat, why in the world with a surface grinder in your shop don't you true it up?!? You have to love the sound of a crescent wrench hammering on a vise to tighten it up. The inevitable "bubba" marks, are abundant in your shop.
Great video Keith. Sorry you have to put up with all the busy bodies criticizing your work and your machines. As I understand it all your machines are vintage, so they have wear on them. Guess they all do their work on brand spanking new machines and get paid enormous salaries.
I know no one likes the safety police but I hate seeing your fingers in there with the cutter spinning. You are obviously very good at this but it sets abad example for the newbies who think they know what they are doing. They don’t know one split second of lapsed concentration and that cutter will have your finger off.
Un-subscribed, the sound of an an adjustable wrench being used as a hammer is distinct and sickening to me, I thought you had a bit more class Keith, apparently I was wrong.
MerlinxPV. Oh deary me .What a shame never mind ,suppose you have never known a screwdriver to be used as a leaver or a chisel either .P/S .looking at your channel watch list I see Andrew Camarata. Oh boy it don't come anymore basic than Andrew with getting things done .
@@karlhrdylicka Correct, the proper tool for the job is the way I was taught and after working all over the world for a global machine manufacturer probably one of the reasons companies requested me for subsequent service calls.
Okey so seeing as you are sick turn this off and go to bed, we will not be here when you wake up after you cry yourself to sleep, we will have moved on without you. Get well on your own time.
It's called a Crescent Hammer. Did you know that they make an adjustable wrench with a hammer head cast into it? It's not what Keith was using, but I'm just saying there actually is such a thing. Check out Clickspring. If he doesn't have the correct tool handy, he will make one.
Hope you are surviving well in the current virus outbreak. I must say, I'm a little shocked. I have heard the sound of steel on steel several times during this video. All those beautiful tools you have and you didn't reach for a lead, or even brass mallet when tramming in or tightening the vice. Glad the stoker project is moving forward. I have seen a couple of Adam's videos, lately, and seen the stoker main casting in the background. Keep safe & well, see you soon.
Always a pleasure watching you make chips. Those tapered keys look a lot like an MT3 tail stock drift key! That screaming grinder outside your shop is reminiscent of the noise that comes out of my mouth when apprentices walk off the job for the day leaving their tools scattered on the bench, the machines dirty and the floor unswept. In my shop everyone pays their dues or their apprenticeship ends suddenly and gracelessly.
Great as usual. It's amazing to see how something as solid as the K&T overhead arm is flexing with the small concentricity error of the radius cutter. It's very visible at 16:45.
An enormous THANK YOU to all TH-cam content creators for providing all of us with additional content during this very trying time!
I can see why you love this machine
I really appreciate the time you put in making these videos.
Glad to see the stoker engine getting some more love again. :-)
Cant wait to see Adams video cutting the case . Great Video Keith
Thanks Keith
Great video. I like watching a master craftsman perform technical jobs such as this!
i love watching old iron eat - and eat she did! great setup with the taper gage you made too. smart.
Great work Keith thanks for sharing 👍🇦🇺
Keith I always enjoy your videos. I am a retired engineer off of the L&N and later CSX out of Nashville.
Excited to see this come together
Keith, Great video & content, thanks for sharing your knowledge, skills, & video.!.!.!.
It's a real pleasure watching you work sir. I realize most of what you show us is fairly simple in your eyes, but have been through some machine shop schooling, you are a true artist in my eyes. Thank You for the great videos. I only wish I lived near you so I could volunteer to help you with these projects in your shop.
Lovely job Keith!
These old machines really do a tremendous job!
Thanks for the terrific videos. Love your projects. Be well, stay safe.
Great little project Keith! I will add a quick aesthetic note note if I may be so bold: the arbor support for your K&T! Paint stripper, some minor removal of casting lines, maybe Evaporust and painting! It’s your own lovely tool! Go for it!
THANK YOU...for sharing. Very nice.
Like the job Keith......good work!!
Nice work Keith. Cheers
Love seeing you working the K&T Mill, and great video. Thank You and Stay Save.
Another great video Keith, thanks for the effort I greatly enjoy your content. Hoping to get out in my shop and mill the straight edge I bought from you tomorrow.
Keith, you are a Great instructor. ALL your videos are very interesting.
Thank you for your videos they are absolutely awesome 👏
love horizontal mill videos. :) Thanks for sharing
22:20 Oooh, that's warm! Gloves!
Amazing as always, never knew a taper key like that would be wise to use in an engine, but it’s always good to learn something new
It's not "in" an engine.
Thanks, Keith.
I must say that I was surprised by the relative motion between the arbor support and the vise on the close up shots. It seems that the support is not as ridged as I thought it would be. Keep up the good work. lg
What you saw was most likely the runout in the arbor. Depending on what kind of shape the arbor, the spacers, and the cutter are in, the stackup can induce runout when it gets tightened down.
8:22 the arbor is bent pretty badly
@@hdjawa It may also be the spacers. If they're not ground on the ends parallel to the bore, or they're worn, they will cause the arbor to tweak when the arbor nut is tightened.
Watch between 15:30 and 16:00 look only at the arbor support and the vise. The arbor support looks to be moving relative to the vise. I'm assuming the camera is on the floor and that maybe the arbor support arms may be loose.
@@larry_g9262 looked back, didn't see him tighten the clamping bolt on the top of the mill; maybe that was it. Your guess is as good as mine. :)
After watching so many vids with such massive complex machinery, it's funny to see him use a 'tiny' drill press while holding the part with his hand. I guess there is hope for the little guy's shop.
I am similarly humored when he pulls out his battery powered, handheld, metal-cutting bandsaw.
The whole process of making that taper gauge was interesting, but for those wedges that get hammered in place, they could have just been made on an angle vise.
Little or large drill press block the part if you aren't going to clamp it to the table !!! Simply rotate the long end clockwise against the column, part too short, block rotating clockwise to a piece of cutoff lumber placed against the column. Rotating either counter-clockwise for column contact could provide free gastric bypass surgery. Now hand hold to drill.
In 1962 on my 31st day of a tool and die apprenticeship I was drilling a 7/16 diameter x 6 inches deep in a 6 x 8 x 10 block of steel. Chips caught starting the block to rotate on the next to slowest speed of a Delta 4 gang cast iron table (Keith Fenner uses a salvaged table for layout and welding) ! The vibration was so great table had rotated 30 degree on the floor before bending the spindle which stopped the V belt. It was mfg before OSHA, the On/Off switches were mounted on the motors, I couldn't reach behind for the switch to stop the rotating/vibrating mess! With a new spindle, bearings, chuck, and cone pulley maintenance repaired it but also moved the On/Off switches to the front of all 4 drill presses!
@@oldschool1993 - Likely he will need the taper for slotting the piston rods as well... my thoughts on that...
@@EngineeringVignettes I'm no steam engine guy, but it appears to me that the taper wedge and the taper slot are just hammered in place to keep the round tapered end of the rod tight. That cotter pin just keeps the wedge from flying out if it works loose- I'm thinking that the standard procedure on the assembly was for the engineer to whack the wedge every so often to make sure it was tight. Neither the wedge or the taper slot are of any degree of precision beyond what you could achieve with an angle vise and after a couple whacks with the hammer, both pieces are deformed beyond whatever degree to which they were made.
Done a great job there, Keith!
That was an enjoyable make Keith, not your every day usual part.Cheers and stay safe!
I was pretty certain I saw the body of the Steam Stoker Engine on another famous TH-cam channel from Florida! :-) Thanks for the update. Love that K&T mill!
I've seen it too, at the shop of a certain AB.
yes outside = I hope he get it going soon !
nice job that steel got a little hot
Interesting video, thanks for sharing
Fine work my.....Friend...Thanks very much...!
Loved the video, Keith. We've just disassembled our loco that uses the same kind of tapered keys holding the pistons into the crossheads. Luckily ours aren't so beaten up! Be looking forward to future updates.
When you temperate the steel in the oven. They make ceramic spacers that would support the steel to give better heat transfer. I believe it's called Kiln furniture. Comes in different shapes and sizes. It would also allow adding more to heat treat at the same time. Not expensive. But what ever you want to do.
i miss being able to work on parts where eyeballing it was good enough. nice relaxing work.
For a key that is going to be beat into place with a hammer, eyeballing probably would be close enough.
Nothing wrong with precision, but half a thou seems like overkill.
@@machintelligence yes i understand. i am saying i don't get any of those parts anymore.
word of advice when clocking in a vice use a parallel in the vice jaws the jaws could be worn/dished
when you heat the valve sleeve removal use bee wax or any lubricant
your shaft is bent on the vertical mill...its moving the whole support head assembly :O you can see it on the video at 14:00
I am really enjoying watching this steam engine series. What type of oil are you putting on the metal before cutting it?
Keith Rucker The Key Man! Interesting!
How about tips about when to use cutting oil and when not?
Keith, I really appreciate what you do and how you do it. I'm hooked on the Stoker Engine Restore and want to know when you plan on putting it back together?
Enjoyed! If I only had the space for a horizontal mill...lol
You would have a tough time getting my small Atlas horizontal in your shop. :-)
Amazing videos. I have never cut metal with lathes or milling machines. What is cutting oil and what would happen is you used WD-40 instead?
You had me worried when you started the taper. I thought you had it in your taper too wrong. Not knowing you made the blanks oversize I understand now. Guess I would of had it parallel with the vice and done it in one pass. Nice job. End product is what counts.
Hi...I really like your videos. I have a problem with a set of Starrett 120 dial calipers. The dial numbers are upside down. I can’t find any information on how to rotate the numbers. Any ideas?
Excellent work as usual, Keith. Cross head designs allow for the very long piston strokes encountered in low speed steam and marine diesel engines. The drawing indicates that it was a Norfolk & Western RR drawing. Background?
This is a great channel for us folk that love to work with there hands.. Blondie hacks is also a good one..
7:44 I always think these overarm supports looks like surprised faces ;)
Same here.
me too :-)
I was thinking Roberto from Futurama
@@meltdownmatt3849 hopefully the K&T does not begin to take on any of his behaviors!
@@meltdownmatt3849 That's it!! I knew it looked familiar! I just couldn't place it.
As a member of the N&W Historical Society it's always nice to see our archive drawings being used. Are the stokers the same between an N&W design and the one on the 576?
Nice. Has the Shaper walked away..😃
Hi Keith what size t nuts do you use on your k&t mill
I'm curious what the acceptable amount of throwout is on that arbor. Looks like it's out about a thou or 2? Doesn't seem to have been a problem.
interesting question - I'm telling myself I heard / saw the impact in the chip formation, and somewhere else people were warning about wear on milling cutters. Looking forward to the reply :)
Well done Keith, but is that a savage runout I am seeing in the cutter?
Notice your drawing is from the N&W Railroad, not the NC&StL Railroad whose engine you are working on.
You should see my brother with milling machines and lathes and so on, he takes cuts so that the shavings comes outa there blue and orange. :-))))
Keith, why didn’t you zip the stock down on a vertical mill so you weren’t relying on a specialized cutter for material removal?
Hiya Keith
In first! He He… Can't wait to see what Adam does with the case/housing!
^^Easily amused.
That’s the fastest I ever seen anyone put gloves on, ha ha 😂😂 !
I'd like to see a photo of the steam engine.
It's part 11 of the series. I am not certain but I think there is a photo somewhere in there...:)
Are you going to be doing any work on the other stoker engine you mentioned?
Hi Keith. I would imagine the taper you made for the keys would be used to set-up for the slot in the rods? Or I am getting ahead of you...
Can we say that those old tapered keys are consumables that have been consumed ??
I know you have a lot of irons in the fire; but, do you think you could break open that universal head for the K&T just to assess it. We have all been waiting to see that.
Was it just me or did that cutter look like there was a lot of end play? Is the arbor round?
End play? I believe the cutter wasn't running concentric. Close ups of the milled surfaces exhibit ridges. Draw file to provide a smoother assembly surface? Good basic content and suggestions.
Are you going to put those keys through a hardening heat treatment?
I'm not a metal worker ,but my shade tree genes tell me that those keys should be a little soft . They will conform better to the tapers .
I heard a rumor that there was a taper somewhere bouts.
What's happening with the 1800 shaper?
If you know your vice jaw isn't flat, why in the world with a surface grinder in your shop don't you true it up?!? You have to love the sound of a crescent wrench hammering on a vise to tighten it up. The inevitable "bubba" marks, are abundant in your shop.
Is your hammer all right? It sounded like an angle grinder when you were using it!
Funny that the drawing ( as a standalone drawing ) does not specify the
round over spec as 3/8" diameter. only implied
They had no sense of humor in 1930.
Tapered Key = Wedge Lock
👍👍👍🇬🇧
I heard that, halfteen measurements
probably a stupid question but why do americans measure in imperial and not metric? we use the metric system in NZ and it seems to work well
Blueprint overexposed shot. Could not see bar or radius cutter
Keith, somebody needs to get going on your stoker body.......Adam??.
Great video Keith. Sorry you have to put up with all the busy bodies criticizing your work and your machines. As I understand it all your machines are vintage, so they have wear on them. Guess they all do their work on brand spanking new machines and get paid enormous salaries.
A little scary seeing your finger behind the cutter.
4:31 FART
Fenner says that those noises are from “barking spiders”.
I know no one likes the safety police but I hate seeing your fingers in there with the cutter spinning.
You are obviously very good at this but it sets abad example for the newbies who think they know what they are doing.
They don’t know one split second of lapsed concentration and that cutter will have your finger off.
:)
Un-subscribed, the sound of an an adjustable wrench being used as a hammer is distinct and sickening to me, I thought you had a bit more class Keith, apparently I was wrong.
MerlinxPV. Oh deary me .What a shame never mind ,suppose you have never known a screwdriver to be used as a leaver or a chisel either .P/S .looking at your channel watch list I see Andrew Camarata. Oh boy it don't come anymore basic than Andrew with getting things done .
@@karlhrdylicka Correct, the proper tool for the job is the way I was taught and after working all over the world for a global machine manufacturer probably one of the reasons companies requested me for subsequent service calls.
ok boomer
Okey so seeing as you are sick turn this off and go to bed, we will not be here when you wake up after you cry yourself to sleep, we will have moved on without you. Get well on your own time.
It's called a Crescent Hammer. Did you know that they make an adjustable wrench with a hammer head cast into it? It's not what Keith was using, but I'm just saying there actually is such a thing.
Check out Clickspring. If he doesn't have the correct tool handy, he will make one.
Hope you are surviving well in the current virus outbreak. I must say, I'm a little shocked. I have heard the sound of steel on steel several times during this video. All those beautiful tools you have and you didn't reach for a lead, or even brass mallet when tramming in or tightening the vice. Glad the stoker project is moving forward. I have seen a couple of Adam's videos, lately, and seen the stoker main casting in the background. Keep safe & well, see you soon.
Reliable Work!