Hi Paul, An excellent piece of detective work, you should be in the Police Force! I can shed some light on the railway operations that might be of interest to you. There were actually 5 trains involved in the run up to and as a result of the first collision, I will detail them in the order they arrived at Charfield as it is inevitably a little complicated. The 00:45 Down Parcels Train From Leicester to Bristol was overhauling 2 Goods Trains, so to enable it to have a clear run the GWR Down Fitted Goods Train the 21:15 from Oxley Sidings (Wolverhampton) was put into the Down Goods Loop at Berkeley Road Junction. The LMS Goods the 22:35 Down through Freight from Washwood Heath (Birmingham) to Bristol was put into the Down Goods Loop at Charfield. After the Down Parcels Train had Cleared the Section From Charfield to Wickwar the Charfield Signalman got the road for the LMS Goods to Wickwar and then accepted the GWR Goods from Berkeley Road Junction. It was at this point things started to go wrong, when the LMS Goods Train came out of the Goods Loop at Charfield the Driver took on water from the water column on the Down Platform something he should not have done as he was not booked to take on water there nor had he alerted the Charfield Signalman he needed to do so this caused a delay of five minutes. The resulting delay meant that the GWR Goods Train would now not be able to get to Wickwar without delaying the 22:00 Hours LMS Passenger and Mails Train from Leeds to Bristol. Signalman Button at Charfield had already accepted the GWR Goods normally so had to let it run into the platform he could not just signal it into the Down Goods Loop. When the GWR Goods arrived and was at a stand in the Down Platform Line he advised the Driver and Guard of the situation and pulled the points and shunting signal for the GWR Goods Train to Set Back into the Down Goods Loop. At the same time he quite rightly accepted the LMS Passenger and Mails Train from Berkeley Road Junction there was nothing in the signalling regulations to prevent him from doing so. The LMS Passenger and Mails Train then ran at full speed and hit the GWR Goods Train which was still setting back into the Down Goods Loop. The crucial thing as you pointed out was the position of Charfield's Down Distant Signal. It had to be at caution, there was no possibility of it being cleared because the points for the Down Line setting back movement to the Down Goods Loop were reversed for the GWR Goods Train. With those points reversed the Down Main Inner Home Signal would have been locked at Danger. This meant that Driver Aldington and Fireman Want had mistakenly believed the Distant Signal was off when it could not have been so they did not slow down in case the Down Outer Home Signal was at danger the Down Main Inner Home Signal was at Danger. As you pointed out the Up Freight Train hit the wreckage and became derailed that being the fifth train involved in the incident, like you I have been unable to confirm the full name of the Guard of the Down Passenger and Mails Train.
Thank you Andrew, and always great to hear from you. Thanks so much for the detailed additional information. I will pin your comment to the top of the comments. I think the track was realigned to stop this happening again after the tragedy. It will be good to see the station reopened and I do hope that there will be a plaque on the new station's platforms. Thanks again, Take care, Paul
@@westcountrywanderings Hi Paul, Your very welcome it was a pleasure to do the comment for you. I feel quite honored you have pinned my comment thank you. I have not come across anything that suggests the track layout was altered due to the accident, I doubt it would have needed to be as far as I can make out there were Trap Points in both the exits for the Up Goods Loop and the Down Goods Loop which would have protected the Up Main and Down Main if something tried to get out of the Loop. I agree with you it would be nice to see the station reopened and looking at the area it probably could be the Passenger Traffic Potential looks to be there. Take care and I hope your Dad is fully recovered by now. Best Wishes, Andrew.
That was an extraordinarily good video. It is amazing where these second hand books have led you, sometimes on a physical journey & in this case finding an article, maybe being used as a bookmark, that really piqued your interest. I hope the school come back to you.
Thank you Faith! Glad you enjoyed it. Yes, second hand bookshops are like keys to different doors, I find. I could spend ages in them. There is one in Malvern, over five floors, that I feel I could take an entire holiday in!! It may have been used a bookmark, although someone deliberately just cut out that exact article from the magazine. Thanks so much! Take care, Paul
The Wandering Detective episode 1. Such an enjoyable video and well researched. I hope you do find out some more on this story. I look forward to episode 2. I hope you will investigate a few more railway incidents.
Well done Paul for bringing this story back from the past. I was about 8 or 9 years old when I first heard this story about the two children and the mysterious woman in black at primary school in a village only a few miles from Charfield, the woman was always associated with the children but it is probably far more likely she was associated with one of the other victims of the accident. I would have thought that even in 1928 they would have been able to both find and distinguish remains from an accident such as this one as some body parts particularly teeth are almost impossible to destroy so I think it would be highly likely they did identify the remains of two children. It is also possible that these children were reported missing at some time and no connection was made with this incident because of the fragmented way the police worked at this time. I look forward to seeing what you uncover.
Thank you Grant. Yes, I don't know if she (woman in black) was associated with the children or not, but, personally, I suspect not. I will keep posted via my monthly vlogs (and my Facebook Group), or a second (or third) video if there is a major breakthrough. Cheers, Paul
Very interesting. Grew up with this story, and as got older I wondered why no film was ever made of it especially with the intrigue of the woman in black. Can't wait to hear and see your next installment of this story.
Thank you Frank! Glad you found it interesting. Yes, when/if developements happen I will update everyone in my monthly vlog. If there is a major development, I will bring out another video about it. Cheers, Paul
Lovely story Paul, keep up the good work, feels so sad that these children were lost and not identified, hopefully not through lack of care. I visited this school kn an open day once as my ex partner didn't get on well with our daughter and seemed to want to distance herself from her, something I know happens to some children in these schools
Thank you! Yes, it is a very sad tale. I think that can be a common issue with boarding schools, unfortunately. I have heard back from the school and I am waiting for them to do more research with some more information. Cheers, Paul
Wow, Paul, I loved how you told the story of the disaster - thinking about it brought tears to my eyes thinking of the loss of life. Also loved how you told about the missing girl - hopefully the school can bring some enlightenment. It sounded amusing with the theories of them being jockeys or other small-sized people, especially with the eyewitness account of them being schoolchildren. Very well done with this one.
Thank you so much Donna! It was, quite literally, a story that fell into my lap, as I opened that second hand book about a unrelated topic and the magazine article fell out. Glad you found the video interesting. Take care, Paul
Hello Paul - greetings from Poland What a fascjnating video. I can ŕcall Ron from Pparkinsons Walks mentioning the crash. What I find really interesting is neat no investigation has been made over the jnterveening years. I guess because through the annals of time, the information about the school blazer had been lost, until of course you come along. Please keep us updated on your findings.
Yes, I think that is exactly the situation Michael. Strange how that magazine cutting out of the book literally fell into my lap. I will post photos of it later over on my Facebook Group and keep everyone updated in the monthly vlogs. Hope you are better and wound is healing. Take care, Paul
Very interesting story & theory to go with it. I remember being told of similar accidents where gas bottles ignited. One was near Gretna Green, whe a number of service personnel perished in the resulting inferno . In your story, why wasn't the child reported absent . I'll look forward to hearing more to this crash at Charfield
The Gazette report in 2018 said in 1937 a young woman from London claimed the bodies were those of her two young brothers. Strangely enough, her claim was never followed up.
I hope you can shed some light on this terrible tragedy! It has puzzled a lot of researchers. Well done for locating the school involved- I wonder why they didn’t come forward when the original story came out. But if they have kept all their records they should be able to find the names of pupils that suddenly left at that time! Thanks Paul!
Thank you Diana! Yes, I hope so, but, no promises! I guess we are used to everything being interconnected these days it is hard to imagine how difficult it was to search for things manually. After all they didn't have the name of the school - hard to track without a search engine! Thanks again, Paul
We found this video fascinating but sad we hope you can shed some light on these unfortunate souls and we look forward to the next chapter of this sad mystery thankyou regards Gary and Julie Smith
Thank you Gary & Julie. Glad you found it fascinating. I will keep everyone posted. I have not done anything like this before. Just so odd how the magazine cutting landed in my lap. Take care, Paul
It was lovely to meet you yesterday. Glad you find the videos helpful. All the best for completing the walk. I hope you get that sense of elation as you walk from Weston into Bath like I did. Take care, Paul
This is a very interesting video. I, too, have looked into this disaster and there are, as you say, several unanswered questions. There is, for example, a lot of doubt over there being two children on the train. As you say, it has been claimed that they were seen at Gloucester station; that is a long way from Truro. It is highly unusual and unlikely that a young child would be on their own and travelling such a distance unaccompanied, especially in the early 20th century. What seems to be more likely is that the 'two unknown' refers to the two small caskets made by the undertaker to contain body parts that could not accurately be matched to any of the victims. Mourners attending the funeral might have seen the two small caskets and assumed they were children. Nevertheless, it will be interesting to see if you get a response from the school.
That is absolutely fascinating Paul and the best of luck with further research. You may have to go down to the Cornwall County Record Office as well. I’m sure they would love to help and might even hold school records for Truro school in question. Can’t wait to hear more.
Thank you Marilyn! It is so odd that magazine cutting happened to be in the book. I will put some photos of the magazine cutting on my Facebook Group later. I will keep people updated. Thank you! Take care, Paul
@@westcountrywanderings I am a family history addict and found a small cutting of attendees at my grandpa’s funeral in my grandma’s birthday book and discovered he had a brother plus close family no one ever mentioned. There might be newspaper cuttings from local papers in Cornwall about the train tragedy shedding light on the passengers. I can see you tied for some time on this Paul. Good luck. Kind regards.
Excellent video. It felt Paul, which I am pretty sure has happened before, that the driver/fireman saw what he expected to see. It didn't really matter what the actual situation was with the signal. I think they redesigned the layout of the sidings on the back of it so that trains did not need to set back into it. There is an excellent, if now slightly old book now called Red for Danger covering a number of accidents. The blue accident reports of which there are loads on eBay for more recent events often read like detective novels.
Great story Paul, hope you can find out more. The children were probably brother and sister travelling together. Was there an inquiry into how the accident happened?
Thank you! Yes, there was and the outcome was to charge the driver and fireman with manslaughter for a signal passed at danger. However, they were acquitted, but I don't know any more than that, I'm afraid. Yes, they could have been, but we don't really know - hopefully I might be able to shed some light on it. Cheers, Paul
Doubtless the school would have contacted someone regarding missing students, even in those days. Might have been more helpful to have published this video after making contact with the school.
Hellp, and thanks for watching. I don't think LMS did contact the school and I have already heard back from the school now. When I said 'today' , that was the today when I filmed the video, not the day that the video was published. I will keep people posted. Cheers, Paul
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed it. You can always share the video to anyone who you may think will be interested on social media. I will keep my viewers posted by my regular monthly vlogs and on my Facebook Group, Westcountry Wanderings. Cheers, Paul
Hi Paul, An excellent piece of detective work, you should be in the Police Force! I can shed some light on the railway operations that might be of interest to you.
There were actually 5 trains involved in the run up to and as a result of the first collision, I will detail them in the order they arrived at Charfield as it is inevitably a little complicated.
The 00:45 Down Parcels Train From Leicester to Bristol was overhauling 2 Goods Trains, so to enable it to have a clear run the GWR Down Fitted Goods Train the 21:15 from Oxley Sidings (Wolverhampton) was put into the Down Goods Loop at Berkeley Road Junction. The LMS Goods the 22:35 Down through Freight from Washwood Heath (Birmingham) to Bristol was put into the Down Goods Loop at Charfield.
After the Down Parcels Train had Cleared the Section From Charfield to Wickwar the Charfield Signalman got the road for the LMS Goods to Wickwar and then accepted the GWR Goods from Berkeley Road Junction. It was at this point things started to go wrong, when the LMS Goods Train came out of the Goods Loop at Charfield the Driver took on water from the water column on the Down Platform something he should not have done as he was not booked to take on water there nor had he alerted the Charfield Signalman he needed to do so this caused a delay of five minutes.
The resulting delay meant that the GWR Goods Train would now not be able to get to Wickwar without delaying the 22:00 Hours LMS Passenger and Mails Train from Leeds to Bristol. Signalman Button at Charfield had already accepted the GWR Goods normally so had to let it run into the platform he could not just signal it into the Down Goods Loop. When the GWR Goods arrived and was at a stand in the Down Platform Line he advised the Driver and Guard of the situation and pulled the points and shunting signal for the GWR Goods Train to Set Back into the Down Goods Loop. At the same time he quite rightly accepted the LMS Passenger and Mails Train from Berkeley Road Junction there was nothing in the signalling regulations to prevent him from doing so.
The LMS Passenger and Mails Train then ran at full speed and hit the GWR Goods Train which was still setting back into the Down Goods Loop. The crucial thing as you pointed out was the position of Charfield's Down Distant Signal. It had to be at caution, there was no possibility of it being cleared because the points for the Down Line setting back movement to the Down Goods Loop were reversed for the GWR Goods Train. With those points reversed the Down Main Inner Home Signal would have been locked at Danger. This meant that Driver Aldington and Fireman Want had mistakenly believed the Distant Signal was off when it could not have been so they did not slow down in case the Down Outer Home Signal was at danger the Down Main Inner Home Signal was at Danger. As you pointed out the Up Freight Train hit the wreckage and became derailed that being the fifth train involved in the incident, like you I have been unable to confirm the full name of the Guard of the Down Passenger and Mails Train.
Thank you Andrew, and always great to hear from you.
Thanks so much for the detailed additional information.
I will pin your comment to the top of the comments.
I think the track was realigned to stop this happening again after the tragedy.
It will be good to see the station reopened and I do hope that there will be a plaque on the new station's platforms.
Thanks again,
Take care,
Paul
@@westcountrywanderings Hi Paul, Your very welcome it was a pleasure to do the comment for you. I feel quite honored you have pinned my comment thank you. I have not come across anything that suggests the track layout was altered due to the accident, I doubt it would have needed to be as far as I can make out there were Trap Points in both the exits for the Up Goods Loop and the Down Goods Loop which would have protected the Up Main and Down Main if something tried to get out of the Loop. I agree with you it would be nice to see the station reopened and looking at the area it probably could be the Passenger Traffic Potential looks to be there. Take care and I hope your Dad is fully recovered by now. Best Wishes, Andrew.
Excellent piece of research which may help solve a century-old mystery. Well done!
Thank you!
Glad you enjoyed it.
I will try and solve it - can't promise, but it is interesting.
I will keep everyone updated.
Take care,
Good detective work, Paul! We await further developments.
Thank you Jim! Yes, I will keep everyone posted. Cheers, Paul
That was an extraordinarily good video. It is amazing where these second hand books have led you, sometimes on a physical journey & in this case finding an article, maybe being used as a bookmark, that really piqued your interest. I hope the school come back to you.
Thank you Faith! Glad you enjoyed it.
Yes, second hand bookshops are like keys to different doors, I find. I could spend ages in them. There is one in Malvern, over five floors, that I feel I could take an entire holiday in!! It may have been used a bookmark, although someone deliberately just cut out that exact article from the magazine.
Thanks so much!
Take care,
Paul
The Wandering Detective episode 1. Such an enjoyable video and well researched. I hope you do find out some more on this story. I look forward to episode 2. I hope you will investigate a few more railway incidents.
Thank you Alice!
I am not sure how this one will turn out.
I will keep everyone posted.
Take care,
Paul
Well done Paul for bringing this story back from the past. I was about 8 or 9 years old when I first heard this story about the two children and the mysterious woman in black at primary school in a village only a few miles from Charfield, the woman was always associated with the children but it is probably far more likely she was associated with one of the other victims of the accident.
I would have thought that even in 1928 they would have been able to both find and distinguish remains from an accident such as this one as some body parts particularly teeth are almost impossible to destroy so I think it would be highly likely they did identify the remains of two children.
It is also possible that these children were reported missing at some time and no connection was made with this incident because of the fragmented way the police worked at this time.
I look forward to seeing what you uncover.
Thank you Grant.
Yes, I don't know if she (woman in black) was associated with the children or not, but, personally, I suspect not.
I will keep posted via my monthly vlogs (and my Facebook Group), or a second (or third) video if there is a major breakthrough.
Cheers,
Paul
An intriguing mystery, like something from an MR James story especially when you told us about the mysterious woman in black
Thank you!
Yes, it is quite the mystery!
Cheers,
Paul
Very interesting. Grew up with this story, and as got older I wondered why no film was ever made of it especially with the intrigue of the woman in black. Can't wait to hear and see your next installment of this story.
Thank you Frank!
Glad you found it interesting.
Yes, when/if developements happen I will update everyone in my monthly vlog. If there is a major development, I will bring out another video about it.
Cheers,
Paul
Lovely story Paul, keep up the good work, feels so sad that these children were lost and not identified, hopefully not through lack of care.
I visited this school kn an open day once as my ex partner didn't get on well with our daughter and seemed to want to distance herself from her, something I know happens to some children in these schools
Thank you!
Yes, it is a very sad tale.
I think that can be a common issue with boarding schools, unfortunately.
I have heard back from the school and I am waiting for them to do more research with some more information.
Cheers,
Paul
Wow, Paul, I loved how you told the story of the disaster - thinking about it brought tears to my eyes thinking of the loss of life. Also loved how you told about the missing girl - hopefully the school can bring some enlightenment. It sounded amusing with the theories of them being jockeys or other small-sized people, especially with the eyewitness account of them being schoolchildren. Very well done with this one.
Thank you so much Donna!
It was, quite literally, a story that fell into my lap, as I opened that second hand book about a unrelated topic and the magazine article fell out.
Glad you found the video interesting.
Take care,
Paul
Well that was fascinating, Paul! I look forward to your further investigations! Meanwhile I'll have another read of my book of railway disasters!
Thank you Michael!
Glad you found it interesting.
I will keep everyone posted.
Cheers!
Paul
Hello Paul - greetings from Poland
What a fascjnating video. I can ŕcall Ron from Pparkinsons Walks mentioning the crash. What I find really interesting is neat no investigation has been made over the jnterveening years. I guess because through the annals of time, the information about the school blazer had been lost, until of course you come along. Please keep us updated on your findings.
Yes, I think that is exactly the situation Michael.
Strange how that magazine cutting out of the book literally fell into my lap.
I will post photos of it later over on my Facebook Group and keep everyone updated in the monthly vlogs.
Hope you are better and wound is healing.
Take care,
Paul
Very interesting story & theory to go with it. I remember being told of similar accidents where gas bottles ignited. One was near Gretna Green, whe a number of service personnel perished in the resulting inferno . In your story, why wasn't the child reported absent . I'll look forward to hearing more to this crash at Charfield
Thank you Lionel & Mary.
Yes, the Gretna Green Tragedy was similar and equally horrific.
I will keep people posted.
Cheers,
Paul
This is a fascinating and absolutely tragic story all rolled into one. Wonderful job Paul. Looking forward to the next video.👍
Thank you Daryl!
Yes, it is certainly a tragedy and a mystery - I do hope to be able to shed some light on it.
Cheers!
Paul
Hi Paul nice video and very interesting 😀
Thank you Roy!
Yes, quite a mystery!
I do hope I can shed some light on it.
Cheers,
Paul
very interesting Paul, tragic and sad but your research may solve the mystery of the young girl. can't wait for the update and see what you turn up👌👍👍
Thank you!
Yes, I don't know if I can solve it or not, but I will try!
Glad you found it interesting.
I will keep people posted.
Cheers,
Paul
Well done Paul on your research. caroline
Thank you so much Caroline! Take care, Paul
Wow! Very fascinating Paul! I look forward to hearing how this progresses.
Thank you Louise!
Glad you found it fascinating.
I will keep everyone posted on any developments.
Take care,
Paul
The Gazette report in 2018 said in 1937 a young woman from London claimed the bodies were those of her two young brothers.
Strangely enough, her claim was never followed up.
Oh, that's really interesting Ted!
I'll see if I can find that Gazette report.
Thank you!
Take care,
Paul
This video was like watching television. I enjoyed it
Oh, thank you!
Glad you enjoyed it.
Paul
I hope you can shed some light on this terrible tragedy! It has puzzled a lot of researchers. Well done for locating the school involved- I wonder why they didn’t come forward when the original story came out. But if they have kept all their records they should be able to find the names of pupils that suddenly left at that time! Thanks Paul!
Thank you Diana!
Yes, I hope so, but, no promises!
I guess we are used to everything being interconnected these days it is hard to imagine how difficult it was to search for things manually. After all they didn't have the name of the school - hard to track without a search engine!
Thanks again,
Paul
We found this video fascinating but sad we hope you can shed some light on these unfortunate souls and we look forward to the next chapter of this sad mystery thankyou regards Gary and Julie Smith
Thank you Gary & Julie.
Glad you found it fascinating.
I will keep everyone posted. I have not done anything like this before. Just so odd how the magazine cutting landed in my lap.
Take care,
Paul
Very interesting Paul.
It was lovely to meet you yesterday. Glad you find the videos helpful. All the best for completing the walk. I hope you get that sense of elation as you walk from Weston into Bath like I did. Take care, Paul
This is a very interesting video. I, too, have looked into this disaster and there are, as you say, several unanswered questions. There is, for example, a lot of doubt over there being two children on the train. As you say, it has been claimed that they were seen at Gloucester station; that is a long way from Truro. It is highly unusual and unlikely that a young child would be on their own and travelling such a distance unaccompanied, especially in the early 20th century. What seems to be more likely is that the 'two unknown' refers to the two small caskets made by the undertaker to contain body parts that could not accurately be matched to any of the victims. Mourners attending the funeral might have seen the two small caskets and assumed they were children.
Nevertheless, it will be interesting to see if you get a response from the school.
Thank you, and some really interesting theories there!
I will keep people updated with any developments.
Cheers,
Paul
What an interesting idea on the mystery.
If there were children, they would have boarded the train at a very unusual hour ?
That is absolutely fascinating Paul and the best of luck with further research. You may have to go down to the Cornwall County Record Office as well. I’m sure they would love to help and might even hold school records for Truro school in question. Can’t wait to hear more.
Thank you Marilyn!
It is so odd that magazine cutting happened to be in the book. I will put some photos of the magazine cutting on my Facebook Group later. I will keep people updated.
Thank you!
Take care,
Paul
@@westcountrywanderings I am a family history addict and found a small cutting of attendees at my grandpa’s funeral in my grandma’s birthday book and discovered he had a brother plus close family no one ever mentioned. There might be newspaper cuttings from local papers in Cornwall about the train tragedy shedding light on the passengers. I can see you tied for some time on this Paul. Good luck. Kind regards.
Excellent video.
It felt Paul, which I am pretty sure has happened before, that the driver/fireman saw what he expected to see. It didn't really matter what the actual situation was with the signal.
I think they redesigned the layout of the sidings on the back of it so that trains did not need to set back into it.
There is an excellent, if now slightly old book now called Red for Danger covering a number of accidents.
The blue accident reports of which there are loads on eBay for more recent events often read like detective novels.
Thank you Nigel - yes, I think I have that book somewhere - it is very good if I recall.
Thanks for great comments.
Cheers,
Paul
Great story Paul, hope you can find out more. The children were probably brother and sister travelling together. Was there an inquiry into how the accident happened?
Thank you!
Yes, there was and the outcome was to charge the driver and fireman with manslaughter for a signal passed at danger. However, they were acquitted, but I don't know any more than that, I'm afraid.
Yes, they could have been, but we don't really know - hopefully I might be able to shed some light on it.
Cheers,
Paul
Look forward to the outcome Paul.
Thank you Lee!
Would modern DNA and forensics on exhumed skeletons be able to provide answers?
Possibly, but maybe the relatives of those affected would not wish for an exhumation. I don't know.
Paul
Doubtless the school would have contacted someone regarding missing students, even in those days. Might have been more helpful to have published this video after making contact with the school.
Hellp, and thanks for watching. I don't think LMS did contact the school and I have already heard back from the school now.
When I said 'today' , that was the today when I filmed the video, not the day that the video was published.
I will keep people posted.
Cheers,
Paul
Wow! Great bit of history and research. I don't know why your channel isn't more popular. Keep on with this! 🚋📓🚶♂😃
Thank you!
Glad you enjoyed it.
You can always share the video to anyone who you may think will be interested on social media.
I will keep my viewers posted by my regular monthly vlogs and on my Facebook Group, Westcountry Wanderings.
Cheers,
Paul