Tivoli speaks after bloody police-military operation
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 พ.ค. 2010
- A tour of Tivoli Gardens escorted by armed security forces lead The Gleaner to capture the voices of the community.
Photographers:
Ian Allen
Rudolph Brown
Ricardo Makyn
Norman Grindley
Narrative:
Laura Redpath
Video and production:
Kyle Macpherson
Being poor is not a crime, being a murderer is a crime!!!!
I am from Barbados and this brought tears to my eyes where is the humanity? It clear the rule of law does not exist in Jamaica. A very sad day in the political history of Jamaica but only the people can change this continued slide towards a failed state.
Them really get them judgement for not giving up the Don
I have to love St. Elizabeth enuh but jah jah I feel it for my fellow Jamaicans
Trust me my yute, a serious talk dat. I agree with you 100%.
im sorry for Jamaica..
that guy that talks like american is right
waby grant t
Yh sounds like one I should know.
Deportation
Yes that's Phill's
Right about what? They're speaking based on emotions because they know the criminals and still hug them up. He said some facts yes but you heard what him said "they didn't come for guns, they come for extradition"...me sure the police dem never just go deh and start kill people, the people dem say dem will dead for dudus so thats what they got. Full-time people stop hug up criminals. See where Jamaica is right now?
Shame not one politican showed their face in the aftermath - only when election time...
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Respect to Tivoli!!
@jack3finger, this is powerful sentence you've written. i.e. "People who think they are inferior are not confident to decide their own destiny"!!!....I actually read this out loud :) so good to see someone else understanding and verbalizing this premise.
My prayers goes out to those who have lost innocence love ones and that this deadly voilence within the island will come to and end without others loosing their lives over a senseless crimininal(s).
And thats why many of them died protecting a criminal. Action has consequences and the so much loss of life is a result.
i am watching this and crying...what is happenin to my island JESUS JESUS JESUS JESUS JESUS...DEVIL U WILL NOT TAKE MY ISLAND
Stop calling for Jesus, it's not Bruce they do what America tell them.
@JamRoca , I was away from youtube for a minute:) I absolutely agree with your post above. i.e. America is willing to hold the world at ransom!!! Good analogy and observation....
@M47623 , Thanks, I read the entire report/coverage....very interesting concoction.
Journalist must be fair too, TG claim them nuh have crime, but that no mean criminal no live there. Them claim is not tunnel , but me know seh is a escape route. Me see video on TV wid man on top of the road block with high powered weapons. Law abiding my ass. Jamaica cant run so, the rule of law must be upheld. If a me, trust me, Tivoli would disappear. me loose two cousin to gun man rumored to be from that area, yes me a carry personal beef, but me hear seh police kill dem already still.
This is so sad. These poor people.
Bring tears 😭😭 to my eyes God kno
Yea man uno bomboclaat uno , a uno same one shield the criminal dem
It is distrubing to see my homeland in such dispare.... Why should so many suffer for the crimminal actions created by choke and the government? It is time that the Jamaican people make a stand because the corruption within the island needs to come to an end. Years of corruption have brought nothing but suffering to Jamaican people....Protecting our people, culture and prosperity should be the primary focus within the nation not the governments' pocket...
One of the final points of "The Art of War" is, "the best way to win in a fight is not to fight"
So for people who have no military resources, as the common people do, the advice is: NEVER ENGAGE THE ENEMY
a bit more advice that may seem ridiculous:
* Never use the currency (or as little as possible)
* Never take a bank loan
* Never send your kids to school, teach them at home
* Never join the armed forces
* Plant your own food
* Don't take hand outs, or be prepared to lose that hand
@jack3finger, yet another good observation. The Maroons have almost nil murders within their communities. Although I indicated above about the "tribal mentality", the difference was in those tribes the elders were given respect and the community/village look out for each other, there was rarely any incident that was not resolve by bringing it before an elder. In the West, its interpreted differently, though subliminal. Yep, the problem is the quest to follow those who colonized us.
the guy with the accent is definitelly a deportee
Jah jah god it rough! Di people and their resilience is impeccable
"mi waan go si mi son, mi waan go si mi son, Murda Murda"
One day it's "we will die for Dudus" then the next day it's "too much people have died for Dudus". In 2023 we call that fucking around and finding out.
The ruling party at the time should not have treated the people of Tivoli like that. They are Jamaicans and obviously were traumatised.
What a load of crap. So the security forces should have gone in their, go on their knees and beg Dudus to surrender?
Armed resistance requires armed response!
You're correct, they shouldn't of behaved this way..................
DEM SHOULDA WORSE!!!! FUCK HUMAN RIGHTS, WE NEED TO END DI CRIME BY ANY MEANS NECESSARY.
Jamaica is the playground of the CIA. This has nothing to do with Bruce Golding or Dudas. This has to do with destabilization and trauma. Jamaicans are strong people, we recover quickly from hurricanes and earthquakes, unlike Haiti. So they couldn't use that against us (yes, natural disasters can be stimulated), they had to send in the "Jackals". They've been doing this for decades.
How we recover from this will determine how they use this tactic in South and Central America. Just like the 80s.
Kerosene them out
@pennyredfern he's maybe a deportee, but he dropped some knowledge regarding how stress can kill and how environment contribute....I liked his delivery. Those people only need "opportunity"and coming to America is not necessarily the answer.
Some of you guys be talking shit about the JDF and the JCF blaming the Prime Minister when you should be blaming the terrorist who cause all of kill and shooting the security force take serious action towards the situation they are doing there job don't blame them blame the criminals cause if it wasn't them non of what happen would ave happen
Facts 100%
@pennyredfern by all means, something needed to be done to improve the lives of Tivoli residents and eradicate some criminals, but this was by far the worst way to handle it.
I remember all this situation way back then and it was bad!!
@pennyredfern it is very simple. The head of the JCF and the JDF are acclimated with these situations, the PM isn't. He gave an order. It is for the JCF & JDF to come up with a strategic plan and tell the PM that what he's asking for will result in a massacre so give them a bit more time to come up with a proper plan. They have the right to advise the PM although he has more say. If they MUST go in, there was still no need to kick in doors to kill residents! some killings were totally avoidable
@jack3finger I agree. I sure do hope when the dust settles, all TV residents and other garrisons will forget about Politics, see the true picture and try to rebuild, focusing on "unity".
omg I feel sorry for the innocent people thats caught up in this mess
Didn't they say they would die for him?
She crying yet no tears no weeping...my heart goes out to the inn
too be poor is a crime.
@jack3finger , I'm still here, rarely have time to browse these days. However, I'm still doing my best to keep checking and keep the dialogue going. good point! true thing about the enemies. Sometimes I wonder if it's a hopeless fight to get some of these folks to free their minds.
@jack3finger , you've summed it up. The political lines made a big impact as it regards to crime, anger & hate among Jamaicans. This darn JLP & PNP division. They would have been better off forming a CommonWealth....
@darealtin BRAVO!! they are so sickening!! I can't understand how they can't see that the police and soldiers mistreated these poor people. A criminal should be tried in court and hundred of innocent ppl should not be killed over some BS like this.
pray
@Oats162 True! we are definitely hoping for a better Jamaica, one with little or no crime...the latter is a dream, but the former can happen with the proper leadership and social services to bridge the gap between the haves and the have nots.
oh my god. . .
@MrJama1ca , that part was amusing to me too...even in the midst of their crisis there's that authentic comedic factor created from lack of opportunity for exposure, to finish school etc...my heart went out to her and what she's been through, but when she said "deading" I burst into laughter while tears was running down my face at the condition. glad I'm not the only one who caught that. lol. I LOVE jamaica, yet somedays I wonder why after all the disparity that I've witnessed.
@chippsy2 I commend you for spotting all these twisted @sshole who are trying to pass themselves off as law abiding folks who are supporting the security forces. No one deserve to be treated the way the Tivoli residents were treated and are STILL being treated.
Very sad
no more palitic Rasta way of life jamaican unite. united jamaica
@jack3finger, you're right, they need to be vigilant, but it seems they're becoming weaker and weaker...unless they truly decide to unite and move forward without the corruption, they will fail.
@lijit77 I hope they don't forget that after everything calms down. They need to leave politics alone and quite fighting each other.
a hope the police and soldiers remember that they have sons daughters mothers and fathers i'd love to know what they gonna tell fada god wen heavens gate open......................RIP SERSEY ma cousin who lost his life wen he was closing up his mothers stall in the market jus as the operation started and RIP to all those who have lost their lives and condolences goes out to all there frenz an families
the days for using your fists are long over,use yor mind,thats all i got to say
@BajeBob i agree with you....Jamaican government and security forces have ALWAYS ignored the laws of Jamaica. I guess they are on the books for decoration
@forgothename "Next time warn them of unprofessional soldiers coming in""...That's the BEST sentence regarding what the people should have been told. They were NOT warned that the security force was coming in to kill anything in sight, they were told they would be searching for DUDUS....then all these people are saying the residents should have vacated. I can't imagine what I would have done if I was placed in such a situation. That's the only home they know, they shouldn't have to leave.
@JamRoca , It seem to be past Vendetta to the 80's era, coupled with current events that were planned to maintain destabilization in Jamaica. Jamaica was very close to being pardon for debts etc by the IMF and that would improve the economy. If U.S paint Jamaica as a non-compliant problem country with a leader who's connected to a drug lord the world will look down on Jamaica as US create sanctions to ruin it...Jamaica is small, but dominant on D world stage.from olympics, music to resorts
the first guy sounded like a new yorker...
Amen and Amen
Sad thing is all jamaica got from this was the word "deadin"
P
Tivoli Gardens remind me of Cite Soleil in Haiti
@JamRoca trust me, I totally understood, even prior to your correction. I know that sometimes when we are trying to get out our thoughts "the fingers sometimes type way faster and we end up with Typo's.... I don't weigh heavily on those errors....
Iam sure it wasn't just police shooting ... That's the price ppl have to pay when u have a gang member ruling a neighborhood.
@BufirdMauhaney sounds like your home, don't disrespect a place you haven't been too. Not all of Jamaica looks like this
@kfc667 you are absolutely right about that!
@jack3finger , good point! good point! ;) They were opposing what was better for the country. See majority of people, even in America, england, canada etc where they're suppose to be more literate tend to hang on to propaganda, anything the media project or anything someone who's well dressed in a suit present to them. The presenter only needs to be confident and the idea is SOLD!! all psychology.
@jack3finger that's the disappointing thing about MOST human beings i.e they strive to be like or do the things that an abuser or oppressor in this case has done. It marvels me that after coming out of slavery this is the best black people can do!! It's sad to say, but the quality of life was better under the oppressors, they ensured we didn't kill each other i.e. laws were enforced, blacks appreciated each other then..freedom was valued. Community meant everything, pride & respect was paramount
damn. help tivoli
Two bun and water that is not food ... Bruce Golding that is not food for human being in Jamaica....
Feel that man pain stress a killer
@thedjheady exactly!! these fools keep talking about the people should leave. Leave to where???? The amount of apathy that is shown here is SCARY!!! shows how cruel most humans are.
Good job policy!!!!
Good Union the policy end good job now crimes union policy! !!
@mikeygeneral , usually the ppl who get killed in drug related activity are ALL in the same game, it's just that the survivor gets deported or face punishment etc.i"m not supporting criminal activities, but most often the Jamaican guys who get caught up in the drug trade in the usa don't have the proper papers to get a legitimate job and INS makes it hard!! it's not always about persons who lack ambition,but rather persons who want to survive and get caught in kill or be killed situations.
how can u go in a community and kill so much people that's crazy
one of my cousin was chased in his yard and shot in front of his 5 year old son while his wife witness the entire thing from inside the home. After chasing him, they stood over his injured body and fired 5 shots in his head. cant stand to see innocent people get hust but nuff a the people in Tivoli know , dem know, better than I know. so chat like unnu dont know. Sometime a gun man send them fi demonstrate still, nuff land deh a country, move out. unnu love di freeness and passa passa. no more!
@forgothename I agree with you. I am so saddened that I was about to tell you about a girl my brother once dated from Tivoli and her brother "Loving People" who showed me around, but it's too painful to delve. The government STINKS!! the folks living uptown STINKS!! they paint this barbaric image of people from Tivoli and that's simply not true. Security forces would not go uptown and unleash such force in upscale neighborhoods, where there are MANY gun owners, so why do it it Tivoli?
@Caribbeanprincess1 if you were in charge of the police, what would your strategy be in order to gain control of the situation? I just don't understand why people blame the police, they doing their job in a very hostile and dangerous situation. I can just imagine what the chaos and lawlessness,if the police did nothing. Blame Dudus and the Prime Minister
@rafaelmubaldo good observance....they know he's not there
@jack3finger, I agree. See, it's more of a tribal approach i.e. I am with PNP, you are with JLP, so whenever either party is in power whom ever is not a member or a part of the "in-party" is deprived. I was having a conversation last night and I was telling someone it seems that gangs etc in western society is derived from the tribal mentality. This is my clique...and that's your clique", They don't look for what they have in common, instead they cling to differences and "war" over it.
Jamaicans.........people of TG: mi a pray fi unu!
@jack3finger they know this, but members of the gov focus will remain primarily on "self & immediate circle of friends and family"...they feel as long as they can hide money in offshore accounts etc and have reserves to flee the country if need be there's no need to worry about restructuring....They figure the poor ppl will be left behind to suffer and that's been the strategic plan from the beginning of time"the poor poorer" & "the rich richer"
How tf them Sleep a night knowing them kill alot a people for nothing and no reason !!!
All Jamaicans need to rise up, do Wat like haiti did overturn the government, people will die but the best will come out of it.. rise up mash down the place. ..
Well,I guess if he stayed inside the house,nothing would happen.
@Killayut - the problem is they won't go to West AFrica... when Marcus Garvey tried to make it happen... most wouldn't follow and they won't now. They prefer to live in a white man's country regardless of all the "proud to be black talk". I know a few people who have moved to Africa (even a cousin who studied in Canada)... and they love it. They are very much a minority though.
@jack3finger , conscience has long been swept away from those greedy people who hide behind their burglar bars...The desire for wealth and to live like the original oppressors captivate them in every way. What happens recently shows us that most ppl lack conscience these days. The $ is the only thing that garner respect. A human life is now meaningless. Poor people are viewed as society's burden, not "human beings in need of help"...
What is an American doing in TG
Ah real badman dat
@jack3finger ,the problem is that blacks view mostly ALL Europeans who folks that appear to be white as "whites', but whites doesn't see it like that, so in essence those that were enslaved weren't considered white----or "pure".
THE PEOPLE ARE DEADING....07:26
@forgothename that's why I get so upset to see these narrow minded people post all kinds of lies about the people in Tivoli. We all know, not everyone in Tivoli is a saint, but not everyone is a saint in any other area either. IT WAS ABSOLUTELY UNCALLED FOR AND THE POLICE AND SOLDIERS ARE NOT REPORTING ACCURATE BODY COUNT. I hurt deeply for the kids. you're right, these kids will have nothing but hate for the police
Rip
People the cause all a this wickedness an Death pon them self
At that time government send buss for you guys and ask you guys to leave and you guys didnt leaving
@mikeygeneral , from what you've stated, you know NOTHING about the INS. My aunt worked as an immigration officer at a NY location for years. I came here legally as a teenager, filed for by an American Dad & a Jamaican mom and I had an issue to sort out years later and the Agents in B'more gave me all WRONG info & references. It was this Aunt that I'd hardly known who visited at a family gathering who later refer to the proper forms "inside info"...It's 10 more complicated for illegals.
@pennyredfern Anarchy? C'mon, Tivoli had a close relationship with heads of Gov, this is not about Tivoli wanting to run things, it's about the Gov wanting to silence people in Tivoli for fear of exposure. EVeryone knew Dudus was NOT in Tivoli before the invasion. If anything government was surprise that some of the ppl decided to voice their opinion and or fight back. The primary criminal elements are government officials and members of law enforcement.
@jack3finger it's all about the "image"...it just needs to "look good", it doesn't need to "be good):) and that's the problem. Example: I traveled to Jamaica back in 99, had a suit on & was carrying my company laptop, the agents at the airport were bending over backwards to please me. Returning I put Jeans, slippers & a spaghetti strap blouse on. The treatment was completely different. I no longer had the oppressors image of success...SAD!!! I look younger than my age & this made it worse.
Try being a 30yr old white male born in ja and revisiting your mother and stepfather in frenchmans district after 14yrs.. i was stripped and bag rip up by security at montego bay airport on my return and made me miss my flight.
@Oats162 please direct me to the MANY videos you've seen with soldiers/police helping the residents? those that behaved remotely civilized, its evidently PR for the Media coverage, the security force are taught how to behave for the Media after escorting reporters! The houses they destroy are NEVER shown etc, If this is one sided, it's the residents who are getting the short end of the stick. JDF/JCF have the support of MOST ppl especially from affluent folks who don't care about D poor...
@GGLebo23 you need a conscience!!! I interpreted your statement just right. What do U mean some people are playing up the victim card?...THEY ARE ALL VICTIMS IN TIVOLI GARDENS REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT THEY VOICED SUPPORT FOR DUDUS. THEY ARE HUMAN BEINGS....they are entitled to the same rights as every other Jamaican.
yes!!! i'm a jamaican-american who travels back and forth regularly. and these people are looking for handouts. they claim he did so much for the community (which he probably did) but how do they think he got the money to do sooo much?!?! they know what kind of stuff he did they just choose to ignore it b/c they could go get a handout when they were ready
Sigh... this community has obviously got a lot of deeply rooted problems. Is there anyway the government could knock it down and replace it with a mixed income community? I heard that worked for a troubled neighborhood in Toronto. All I know is that the criminality, marginalization, mistrust, and garrison politics have to end in this area. Some places just catch so much negativity that the only way to make it better is to start anew.
Tivoli......... Boi sa dat di ruff. Still ruff, hole a jamaica still ruff.
Nasty awful place.