Oh my lord ! I have just listened to the Karajan recording . It is so brilliant I can hardly breathe ! The colour and energy - simply phenomenal . Thank you for the recommendation 🥂
The Mercury portion is the absolute finest I've heard. The hair on the back of my neck stood, as if I'd never heard the piece before. The entire recording is sublime. I must've replayed the thing at least 5 times since I saw Dave's recommendation.
I hope you read this because there's a piece of Holst that needs to be talked about. "Egdon Heath". Oh god, how much I love this work and yet nobody seems to know about it. I can't discribe it, it's just so special that I don't know anything it could be compaired to. We always choose the music we listen to by our current mood but Egdon Heath appears to be an enrichment to every emotional state you could possibly think about (at least for me). Holst himself claimed it to be his best work and he was right.
Dave this is amazing, thank you for this. I had just said to my wife the other day "I wonder if anyone else out there obsesses over The Planets and the details of that piece as much as I do, I feel alone" UNTIL I found THIS video.. it was like geeking out with another appreciator of Holst from afar. I dig so much everything you've pointed out in the various recordings, some of which are personal favs of mine as well! This review is a gem, thank you. (Don't worry I *also* get the last couple of planets mixed up, too)
I sat waiting for you to mention the Levine recording, which was the one I used to hold as the best. Then when you mentioned Karajan, I just thought "Karajan? He did the best? Well let's just see" and it dethroned them all. It's made me enjoy the music in a way I never enjoyed before. It's just an absolute monster when it needs to be, and is gorgeous at times I've never heard others capture. I've listened to it multiple times since this video, and now I need to get a copy. Thankfully Apple Music has it for now.
You're almost right about the lack of expressive markings - there is another 'dolce' in the first violins when they take over from that clarinet solo; also 'con espress.' in oboe then clarinet, 9 after fig. III in Venus, and 'pesante' lots of times in Jupiter and Saturn. But your point is a very perceptive one, and something I'd never noticed. In general Holst marks dynamics and phrasing only, and leaves expression to his performers. I had a quick look through my Holst scores and all I found was: a 'dolce' in the Suite de Ballet (at the start of the Scene de Nuit); 'pesante' a few times in the St Paul's Suite; 'legato, cantabile' at fig. F in the First Suite for Military Band; and, my favourite, 'coarsely' at 5 after fig. 6 in Beni Mora. As to recordings, I agree with Karajan/VPO and Boult in one of his recordings (just not sure which one). I'm also quite fond of - gasp! - the Rattle/BPO version, despite one or two Rattleisms and the pointless inclusion of Matthews' Pluto. And, even more bizarrely, Malcolm Sargent with the BBCSO. Say what you like about Sargent, his recordings of Holst are all excellent.
A fine Pick, Dave. I listened to this a few times already. One of the best works ever. And luckily there really are several reference recordings of it.
Love your commentaries, Mr. Hurwitz. You presented a great point by suggesting it should not be interpreted emotionally. Yet, a great performances gets the emotional response perhaps because the listener cannot resist the force, the melodic impetus of Gustav Holt's masterpiece. Love your down-to-earth summaries.
A great wee shop has opened in my village that specialises in classical vinyl and is run by a doctor of music who directed me to David and I'm very glad to be here. I bought the Dutoit in '87 when it was released and I've only ever listened to that version. I can't believe my luck that Qobuz has the Von Karajan/Vienna recording as well as the Mehta/LA, both on 24 bit for £2.79 in their sale! I'm having a ball here - cheers David, from a very happy new subscriber!
Holy Sacred Cow! Karajan with Vienna...Karajan with a SOUL! Did not even know it existed. I'm 51. Started collecting CD when I was 16, right there in 1984-1985 when CD started to show up in stores. I do have tons off pre-digital recordings, but I did miss some great recordings as everyone was pushing the "new" versions. Thanks for your help with this one. Of course, Montréal was my version... Montréal is home. This Vienna version is very atmospheric, instruments sounds as if real people were holding them. Had a blast tonight. Thanks.
Boult recorded the Planets no fewer than 5 times: 1945/BBC Symphony (HMV), 1954/Philharmonic Promenade, aka London Philharmonic (NIxa), 1960/Vienna State Opera (Westminster), 1966/New Philharmonia (HMV/Angel), and 1978/London Philharmonic (EMI). There is a hard-to-find live recording from the 1973 Proms with the BBC Symphony out there too to make it 6 times! The great thing about having 5 commercial Boult recordings is that it allows us to compare how Boult handled the score over the years.
Sad to relate I have all six. As so often with Boult his best technical recordings were not necessarily his best account. Personally, I wish I had the 1945 version in the 1979 recording. Still all worth hearing.
@@swimmad456 I have 4 of the 6. His '45 performance is searing but unfortunately it's in muddy sound. If only that were captured with EMI/KEF's '79 sound.
My 1st exposure to Holst was a freshman in HS - early 70s - we performed his "First Suite" & as we were learning it for Contest in TX, our terrific director played it for us. But what really opened my 14-yr old mind was when he played bits & pieces of "The Planets" over our band hall's Klipschorn Quad speakers at full volume. I remember all 70 of us were amazed - stunned. 3 friends & I went after school to our closest LP shop in our small city & I bought Bernstein's NY recording. I wore that LP out. I decided by my Sr. Yr to become a Music Educator/Musicologist/Conductor & have just retired after 4 decades + I have 50 or so recordings... agree with you, David, on your review... One of my later albums was Steinberg's, Karajan's, & my favorite as of 2012 has been Charles Duthoit/Montreal. I love Karajan/Vienna, too! I like the way you mention Holst's tone colors via his much-expanded orchestral palette. The organ pedal which enters near the end of Saturn gets me every time, still, as the glissadndi in Mars. his use of extended flute & double reed choirs...And that he varies the moods of each Planet so masterfully. Thanks, David!
This is the review which cemented by admiration for your critiquing skill. My "view" of Karajan's overall music interpretation is mixed; here with Holst's PLANETS Suite* he is stellar. (I'm not sorry.) Of all the Holst-Karajan Planets, despite the majesty of Jupiter, the playfulness of Mercury, and the utter conviction of Mars, due to Karajan's expansive color palette, and slow as it is (and should be) Saturn ends up my favorite. Karajan's most skillful highlighting of the low:high pitch "LARGO finale" (unusual and difficult enough in itself to convince one's aesthetic sufficiently), here is of unexpectedly greater dramatic contrast/effect than expected. Tingles my toes while at the same time an ocean-sized waterfall massages me to the marrow. Uberchills..! Sublime. Dare I say a "spiritual" or "religious" experience? (The contrast-consolation of the high strings seems a "little birth" at death.) Much later than hearing this performance, I learned that Saturn was also Holst's favorite Planet. "Sweet" serendipity! * I've always thought "The Planets" was a slight miss in titling and would have preferred "Dance of the Planets".
Surprisingly, John Williams also recorded the Planets with the Boston Pops (it's really telling how much of Mars he borrowed for the Star Wars theme music).
Williams pretty much borrowed everything. They should teach a course on his music where the students have to figure out where he got what from. It would be, well,...educational. A survey of Western classical music.
I got 3 of those good ones. I haven't really binge on all of mine in awhile. So I cant think of which one is my favorite. My first was the Andrew Davis with Toronto Symphony Orchestra. Took me forever to find the cd, but had that album for decades. But any time I come across a copy in a store, i usually end up grabbing it. I doubt I got 20 yet. And looks like I need a few more. Thanks.
Dave, thank you so much! I fell in love with "The Planets" as a teenager, and heard it performed "live" by the LA Philharmonic at Disney Hall a few years ago, such a thrilling experience! My first LP was the Sir Adrian Bolt recording from the 70's. Thank you for sharing your love of this piece, and guiding us toward some great recordings!
Dear David, My Planets-mania a few years ago resulted in collecting 75+ versions, studying each w the full score. I agree with your choices for the most part. Jurowski captures some elements like no other....the fun, mollify of Jupiter for one. Mehta/ NYP is also marvelous and more subtle than LA. I counted the repeats of the 7/4 last measure of Neptune. Mehta does about 20. Ormandy just repeats it 7 times, fading, then just stops, missing the needed effect. The female or sometimes children's chorus entrance is magical, all on a high G, which becomes the leading tone of the following harmony. Holst also wrote tge first glissando for the organ. (In the live LAP performance I heard, the organist accomplished the glissando with not his finger tips, but with rolling forearms) Go tam-tam roll!.
I discovered Dutoit and the Montreal on my own by accident by picking up a cd one day in Tower Records. I know him as a superb conductor of ballets. His cd's of Swan Lake and The Nutcracker are absolutely wonderful. It comes as a complete surprise to me that he would be a wonderful Planets conductor because it seems so opposite to the great feeling of the ballets. I'm so thankful you made this video. My go to reference recording of this growing up as a kid was the DG Karajan with Berlin with the big yellow picture of Saturn on the cover. All these recommendations are new to me and i shall strive to buy as as many as i can. A long time ago i got the DG Gardiner Planets cd that was bundled with The Warriors and had the blue constellation cover, but i found it disappointing compared to the Karajan reference i had grown up with.
on multiple classical music sites/newsgroups i've been on in the last 30 years, the Dutoit is almost always listed as the best Planets. granted, today he's now one of those artists for whom the catalog is a little tainted because of allegations a few years back.
"You can always count on Mackerras" YES!! I've always been a sucker for detail, and that's why Mackerras has always been my go-to recording. Bringing out all those details while preserving a perfectly balanced sound is a real _tour de force._ I've enjoyed Dutoit quite a lot as well.
Largely agree on this (to my delight). LA/Mehta to me has always been the gold standard, and one of the most astounding "initial listenings" of my life. I also think Dutoit is a 5-star, and that good ol' Boult is pretty good. I will be pursuing some of the lesser-known versions that you recommended, with great interest. Thanks for those, and big kudos in general for your videos.
I found Sir Alexander Gibson's recording with the Scottish National Orchestra on Chandos an excellent interpretation. I look forward to hearing the Von Karajan/Vienna recording though. The others I have are Mehta/Los Angeles and the '66 Sir Adrian Boult/Philharmonia.
This was fun! A fun presentation of basically fun music. Everything you said made sense to me. I was surprised by the Karajan/Vienna pick, but I do like that one too. I like the Marriner for just the fabulous playing of the Concertgebouw. It's also a gorgeous, late analog recording from Philips. I know, I know! - Marriner is Marriner. What can I say.
Here are the dozen "Planets" recordings I have panned (for anyone who is interested): PHI/Ormandy (1976) [committed performance, but lacks gravitas and subtlety] RPO/Previn (1986) [spacious, spiritual, great performance, but last three movements are less stellar, and tubas too subdued throughout] LSO/Previn (1990) [some flaws, horns subdued, sound & balance problems] LPO/Boult (1978) [good performance, but has sound problems & lacks power and vitality in spots] LAP/Stokowski (1956) [colorful, detailed, interesting, but tinny sound; lacks spaciousness] BBC/A. Davis (2011) [meticulous, attention to detail, committed performance, lacks vitality in places, brass generally subdued and a bit muted] CSO/Levine (1989) [tinny sound; lacks mystery and soul] NYP/Bernstein (1973) [crappy sound; too fast] BPO/Karajan (1981 )[odd and weird] PHO/Gardiner (1995) [utterly lacking in spirit and magic; too slow, too fast . . .] LSO/C. Davis (2002) [crappy, tinny brass sound] PHO/Rattle (2002) [lethargic, sub-par sound, slow tempi] What do I like?: LAP/Mehta (1971) [fabulous brass, spectacular sound, spirited, “spacey” & mystical; remains the gold standard] OSM/Dutoit (1986) [majestic, mystical, elegant] PHO/Boult (1967) [magical, impeccable, glorious, high end a bit harsh, horns too soft] VPO/Karajan (1961) [very good, but lacks spirit & verve in some places, and some sound problems] BSO/Steinberg (1970) [eccentric, interesting, colorful performance, but can’t match the best versions; harsh 80s remaster]
I have the Mehta and a very good headphone system, and the sound really distorts during the loudest passages, which kills the performance for me. Great otherwise.
Bernstein and NYPO was the first recording I ever heard of "The Planets". It may not be the best, but there are some cool spots, like how the Bass Flute motive sticks out as the women's chorus starts in Neptune.
I really like Ormandy and the Philadelphia Orchestra, paired with Vaughan Williams' "Fantasia on a Theme by Thomas Tallis" on the album. The record is about as epic as music gets. I am going to listen to the Karajan, though. I've finally started putting together a collection of Karajan records that I really like thanks to this channel, after having written him off thanks to so many records that disappointed me. Besides The Planets he did that album of the Dvorak Eighth and Brahms Third with Vienna, and that's a favorite of mine.
I am pleasantly surprised! Karajan VPO and Levine CSO are my two tops, with Karajan taking the top spot. That VPO recording is just terrifying in Mars, noble in Jupiter, ethereal in Neptune... it is the most involving one for me emotionally. Levine CSO is bombastic and fun with amazing sound quality.
Thank you for guiding me to the Karajan VPO recording, with which I wasn't familiar. It is really beautiful but it includes some awkward moments in Mercury, as the celesta seems to be tuned lower than the orchestra, 440 as opposed to 442 I suppose...
How times have changed. Still remember buying my first Planets when there were only two LPs of the work available in the U.S. I’m not a musician, but I sense a great many of the virtues you describe for The Planets in The Perfect Fool, as well. Hope this video isn’t your last commentary on Holst.
Have to say that my favorite version of The Planets is Tomita's "The Planets", if for no other reason than Imogen Holst did not approve and had it removed. (Though it was released later on, and is an absolute joy to listen to if you like Tomita's style).
I was a little surprised you didn't mention the Norrington SWR version. I listened to Uranus, which you mentioned in Classics Today and you are absolutely right its quite something.
The Houston Choral Society in the early '90's under Dr Betty Divine did a stunning version of Holst's " Hymn of Jesus". This was Holst's favourite of all his compositions. She assembled 5 choirs, including a children's choir, and part of the Houston Symphony Orchestra to pull off this magnificent monster. It was performed ONCE in the splendid acoustics of Houston's vast Foundry Methodist Church; and recorded live with 5 stereophonic microphones, for each choir, positioned in a different corner of the church. The orchestra was on the central stage / sanctuary. The 5th mike was hung centrally. --Recording was done by an expert engineer & a post-production editor, overseen by Dr Divine. To be in the audience, sitting in the middle of all these choirs, was an almost psychedelic experience, and if you have a quadraphonic sound system, crank it up despite the neighbours. Listen to it the first time "straight up" studiously, --and afterwards with *recreational substances* or a G&T, if you are that way inclined. :-) . See if you don't think this is THE definitive recording of this seldom-performed work. You can still get a CD of this work from the HCS; see their website. it was a totally immersive experience; I walked out like a mystical zombie (in the best sort of way) and I didn't want to talk to anybody for a couple days afterward. Apparently Holst taught himself Sanskrit on his school vacation (he was a school teacher) in order to compose this work, --and it doesn't in the least surprise me. Dr Divine intuited the warmth Holst intended, --but buried-- in this work, and coaxed it out so that it was profoundly moving and sometimes tender. This obscure recording is worth searching out.
As a citizen of Kansas City, a fan of our orchestra and a good friend of my neighbor Michael Stern, I had hoped you picked their recording as best. I heard it live twice and thought it slow. But you made me realize how rhythmic and revealing it was. My still favorite since forever.. Steinberg/Boston. I will keep on listening!
A great day for us proud Boultians... and to top it all, you even chose my other favourite recording of the work, HvK with the Vienna Phil as your top recommendation. I pray to foregive me, that I had gotten so much hold of the wrong end of the stick, that I assumed, that this latter recording was up for a severe trashing...or as the clip progressed, that it would be totally ignored! How wrong could I be! PS. Your enthusiastic energy when you greet us at the beginnig of each video, always make me expect you to start out with a 'Hello possoms' as did Dame Edna Everage. I always feel a slight pang of disappointment when hearing your more straight, conventional adress....but then after a while you start to sing, and I cheer up and start to wonder...maybe one day.....
I bought the Steinberg on vinyl in the 70's or 80's. It is my favorite. Then came the Dutoit recording, I cant choose. Since then I bought Boult, and Karajan. NOw I have to find the Mackerras. I am very glad you make me discover Mackerras. Steinberg is maybe my favorite conductor off all time because he always give me joy. I do not mind all the other considerations.
Should have watched this video a few weeks earlier, just bought the Andrew Davis version in SACD, I thought after listening:" I remembered this piece as more exciting... must be me as I'm not a musician..." now I discover it's not me... Thank you for your video's, Igor from Belgium
I have the Ormandy Philly Orchestra one that was recorded in the 1970s. It's on cassette. One of the first orchestral recordings I ever owned. That recording also had the wonderful Fantasia on a Theme by Thomas Tallis by Ralph Vaughn Williams. That one always sticks out in my mind. There's a clarinet squeak in the middle of Saturn at the top of a woodwind crescendo which always sticks out in my mind when I'm listening to anyone's version. I picked up the Dutoit Montreal recording on strong recommendation from friends. I haven't listened to it as much as I should. I've heard great things about an LA Philharmonic recording which had both Tommy Johnson and Roger Bobo on tuba. Well.... mostly because Gene Pokorny mentioned it specifically in his orchestral excepts CD (produced by Summit in the 1990s). His comments had to do with the low E at the end of Uranus and how he doesn't believe anyone's going to come close to reproducing that sound.
As a Brit, can I say bravo - I think you've pretty much nailed this. Yes to Sir Adrian (of course - he really was stunning in this piece as well as being associated with it for ever), Yes Indeed to Mackerras (I thought I was the only person who actually cherished this brilliant disc), and Yes Absolutely to Karajan/VPO. Incidentally, Mackerras did a stunning Planets in 2009 at one of his very last Proms - and that, trust me, was with the BBC Philharmonic who played like gods on this occasion (with the right conductor they can and do). It's the best live performance I've ever heard along with a couple of Boult ones from the 1970s. I need to hear Paavo Järvi - that sounds very interesting. I can't share your enthusiasm for Mehta/LAPO: it's not bad, but I wouldn't have it down as one of the best ones, but Dutoit awakes from his usual slumbers to deliver something much better than his normal efforts. Herrmann is grimly hilarious - it's almost certainly the most perverse ever. Dullness is available from plenty of others (Sargent, Colin Davis et al) but Herrmann is in his own circle of Holstian hell.
I agree that that Proms performance by Mackerras was fantastic. By the way, since we are on the topic of Mackerras, I would just like to give a shout-out to the excellent collection of tributes to Mackerras that you co-edited with the late John Tyrrell. I thought it did a brilliant job of illuminating what he was like on and off the podium.
@@JaneSmith_ Thanks! That's very kind of you. I can honestly say it was the most enjoyable book I've worked on: so many great musicians (Baker, Brendel, Pappano et al) revered Charles as we did (and do).
The only version of The Planets I've had is Gardiner/Philharmonia. After watching this video I listened to the Mars and Jupiter movements of the 1979 Boult, Mackerras, and Dutoit on TH-cam. Though I am a big fan of Mackerras, I thought Dutoit was the clear winner among that trio and versus the Gardiner recording, so I ordered a cheap used copy. I am looking forward to hearing it on my stereo.
I bought the Gardiner CD when it first came out and, while it's certainly good, I didn't think it was one of the greats. However, I really do enjoy the Percy Grainger coupling, which for me is the real star among these Planets :)
You've nailed it! I have the Steinberg, the Dutoit, the Boult/New Philharmionia and the Karajan/VPO. (I do have the Karajan/BPO as well, but I don't think it' s as good as the VPO recording). You may disagree with me, but I think there is something slightly amiss in the Dutoit "Saturn" when the bells enter - or at least that's how it sounds to me. I am also one of those people who - ahem - has the Colin Matthews' "Pluto"
Great review Dave. I'm wondering if you would consider doing a video (or series) on the best recordings from the major conductors. I always listen when you make passing references to a recording that's not on the topic you're addressing, for example you mentioned Dutoit did an excellent Shostakovich 8th. Those are great insights but almost impossible to remember later. Thanks for all you do.
20:22 I remember when it came out. It created a big splash and firmly established Decca as a leader of sound quality in the digital era (while Deutsche Grammophon inexplicably and majorly lagged).
I love the Mackerras for its airiness ( …it also has one of the loveliest of all the Glockenspiele in Mercury ). Furthermore it is normally coupled with his near perfect recording of the Perfect Foul. For me this is a nice bonus to have.
Poor old Pluto. Regardless of its (non) place in Holst's suite, I was sorry it got demoted. And then it put on a spectacular show for the Voyager fly by, talk about a post mortem validation. Magnificent!
When I was a kid, I liked the Tomita version of the Planets. I listened to it the other day for the first time in 40 years. I won't listen to it again. Kids grow up, sometimes anyway. I've played it in too many bad performances. It's really, really hard. Too hard for most regional orchestras, which don't have either the rhythmic discipline or the great harps, woodwinds, etc. And the chorus at the end is SOOOO difficult to get in tune. I'm always in tears, but for the wrong reason. I'll check out Karajan - never in a million years would I have thought of it.
You will eventually revisit TOMITA at a point in your life when you are finally Ready to appreciate his genius; HINT requires the capacity for Extraction .... then and only Then can one appreciate that he is one of the Great Artists who ever lived ... praying that well-intentioned listeners will Always reach This Point in their lives ... peace be with You and ALL the best 🙏
@JenniferEliseAtchiso Very much agree, although in a more specific sense. Early on, when I was digging more deeply into classical music and being already familiar with Debussy's "Afternoon of a Faun" and the string quartet, Tomita's "Snowflakes Are Dancing" pointed me to the piano music of Debussy and opened up that world for me. When the album was first released I heard it in a record store and was amazed at the sound (a far synthesizer cry from "Switched On Bach"). I bought it on impulse and never regretted it. I do think that compared to his other recordings, Tomita pulled off more of a feat, selecting and "orchestrating" the solo piano pieces, rather than revoicing orchestral pieces, as enjoyable as they may be. I thoroughly enjoy all of Debussy's piano music, but to this day I still have no problem enjoying Tomita's "Snowflakes Are Dancing" on its own terms.
My favorite version wasnt because of the recording, but rather something more memorable...back in the early 70s the Chicago recorded this with Solti ( probably the most bombastic conductor in history), and they actually advertised it on TV., I still remember it 'Solti! Chicago! Holst! The Planets!' the commercial was as bombastic as rhe record. The only commercial that was better was this ad for a collection of classical pieces with this British ( of course!) announcer ' you know that as stranger in paradise from kismet, but did you know it was from the Polevetsian Dances by Borodin? So many beautiful themes' ( friend of mine got thrown out of wind ensemble in high school with me when we cracked up when we attempted a wind arrangement of the Polevetsian dances ...
How do you feel about Eugene Ormandy (Holst: The Planets) later version Rattle recorded with the Berliner Philharmoniker in the middle of the 2000s? Thank you for your time.
Great Dave! I love The Planets...I like also Vernon Handley with RPO...anyway Steinberg and Levi are among the best recording ever of this wonderful piece...Dutoit is one of the few that gives an importance to the organ in Mars :D
Steinberg/BSO is my general favorite, but for Saturn, I pick the Karajan. The bells (apparently a pair of "Wagner Anvils") klanging out makes for the most effective climax I've ever heard in that movement (and why Holst asks for metal hammers!). The other is the organ pedals in the pastoral section at the end. My sub-woofer goes nuts (like it does in the Munch/BSO Saint-Saens Organ Symphony) and the floor shakes... literally. Curious that the organ is otherwise inaudible in Mars and Neptune.
I agree with almost everything you say. This is quite possibly the best recording of Karajan ever. The sound is outstanding because Von Karajan was not allowed to interfere with the mastering like he usually did. We have to acknowledge Karajan is not really overrated when you hear this recording... The Montreal is brilliant. What you introduced me to that I have never heard before was the Groves, which actually may be my favourite now, I greatly prefer the live recording techniques to studio, and the horns in this just sound jaw dropping. I think you should have included the Marriner Phillips with the Concertgebow, brilliant recording that shows that Marriner sounds like Marriner no matter who he conducts - clarion sharp incredible detail.
@@leestamm3187 But I love it! "In your face"! As I said, I might be minority but the CSO does precisely what you THINK they will do in that recording. Hearing Bud Herseth and the Trumpets along with Dale Clevenger and the Horns on SATURN still brings goosebumps.
I've been waiting for this one! I just love this work, the Venus movement especially; it's the perfect antipode to violent Mars. I listened to you with breath held, expecting to hear Maazel's infamous French recording for CBS appear among the retrograde Planets. Whatever faults it may have, it is simply furious where it counts (Mars, Uranus). I recently bought Karajan's Berlin account and was really impressed with the quality of sound (at least in the Gold remastering). I could wish for even more vitriol in K's Mars, though. Finally, if I may say so, I believe Andrew Davis recorded op. 32 three times, in fact; the first was in Toronto for EMI. Thank you! PS. A real disappointment was Previn on Telarc - very slack and dull. I'd love to hear Levi and Jarvi on that label.
Maazel is atrocious, especially at the end of Jupiter where he substitutes a snare drum for the tambourine. But it was never in print long enough to matter...thank God.
@@DavesClassicalGuide The Maazel was a huge disappointment. Given his technical mastery, including his ear for orchestral colour, he should have done so much better. The orchestra sounds terrible and the harsh early digital sound only makes matters worse.
@@DavesClassicalGuide It's surprising that you didn't mention the Maazel, considering its disrepute! Still and all, for me it's a keeper for its fury (and I don't find it badly recorded, and I have the first-gen CD). My reference for op. 32, by the way, is Gardiner - spectacular playing and recording (that low note at the end of Uranus - no jokes, please! - awesome). As to The Planets being an emotionless work, I can only say that I nearly always get a lump (in my throat, mind) at the end of Saturn.
@@301268bmh I've seen the playing in Mars described as drunken. Maybe - but they're angry drunks! And I don't find the recording quality bad at all, and I have a pretty early pressing, I believe. I think the whole thing fun to listen to, though it's not my reference. Thanks for reading and commenting!
I cannot agree more with David. The Karajan VPO was my first Planets years and years ago. I have three pressings on LP and the sound is astonishing with a verve which is unique. An aura of mystique which have not been eclipsed. Also superb is the early BBC Symphony performance with Sir Malcolm Sargent in EMI stereo. The Stoki is fun indeed and truly magical in Venus and Neptune.
We've had some fun at Vernon Handley's expense, but he did a really solid Planets with the RPO, for their own label. It has since turned up in a bunch of bargain incarnations, and is worth picking up if you find it. Here's a weird one: Marriner conducting the Concertgebouw. Hardly the most exciting, but gee it sounds nice. Quite idiomatic too, which I guess was Marriner's contribution.
I am surprised you didn't mention the incredible tambourine playing in Jupiter in the Steinberg/Boston recording. In the Karajan it is inaudible! One of the great tambourine excerpts ever! Ha Ha.
I’m slightly surprised you don’t have Andrew Litton and Bergen Phil in here. I’ve played it w him (and Spano) here in Singapore. They’re great w this piece. Litton does, as always, mess around w the timpani parts (my part) and it can be a bit much, but he really brings the music across. I heard a story about a Norwegian conductor doing it in London. The rehearsal came to a stop, when he asked the trombones “Can we, please, take a look at the opening of Uranus?”. I hope it’s true!
I enjoy Previn's reading with the LSO on Telarc. Agree on Dutoit with the MSO. Their recording of Bartok's Concerto for Orchestra/Music for Strings Perc, Celesta is also electric. And his Miraculous Mandarin- second (for me) to Boulez's New York Phil recording from the early '70s
Well gosh, my favorite Planets is Chicago/Levine on DG. I find it riveting. A desert island album for me. Dutoit is my second place and I do really like Los Angeles with Mehta.
The popularity of Levine continues to puzzle me. It's loud, with typically great brass, but otherwise not special in any way, and sonically inferior to boot.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Tough to argue about it being loud so maybe the CSO brass does it for me. Maybe it's time to re-evaluate but I may end up remaining in the group who digs the CSO/Levine. Jurowski is on the agenda for tonight; I've not yet heard it.
Karajan ‘66 seems to be the only recording in which the percussionist uses metal strikers on the bells during Saturn. Holst specifies that in the score, doesn’t he? It’s a terrifying effect that no they recording has!
That's because it wrecks the bells if you do it right. Elgar does something similar at the end of the Enigma Variations--he says to hit the suspended cymbal with a heavy metal beater. Bye bye cymbal if you do it.
UPDATE AUGUST 2024: Ozawa’s Planets seems to be available in full on iTunes now for those who download. (Original comment): It seems to be rather hard to find (and it’s not even complete on iTunes!), but I believe that OZAWA’s Boston recording was used in The Right Stuff film (1983). I don’t think know if that soundtrack is available nowadays, but it wasn’t officially released back in the day (three Planets pieces were heard in the movie if not mistaken, along with music borrowed from a different movie by Mancini, and new music by the picture’s scorer Bill (Rocky) Conti)
The reason right stuff is one of my favorite movies. There is a funny story about that, he used the Planets and other classical pieces as temporary fill in the movie intending to write his own music for it, but it worked so well he kept it (Jupiter and Mars were in there,). My son and I have an argument about the main theme..it is most definitely taken from the orchestra tutti theme in the Tchaikovsky violin concerto , my son says it isn't totally the same ( he is a classical violinist so I have to give him credence) but I recall from the VHS version they credited the violin concerto in the credits( DVS version doesn't have it).
@@njlauren agreed that was a Tchaikovsky piece or “adaptaion” of it, forgot about that in my initial comment. I’m sure your aware of the few stories involving Kubrick’s 2001 soundtrack…how he scrapped Alex North’s full score to replace it with what he did. Classical pieces had been used in movie soundtracks forever, but perhaps not in quite that way, similar to Lucas’ later use of 50’s/early 60’s rock-pop as the entire soundtrack of AMERICAN GRAFFITI. Also how Ligeti’s music was used in Kubrick’s film without the proper permission (or royalties, I think). It’s been a long time since I read about it, and could well be mistaken, but I think Kubrick and/or MGM claimed that they couldn’t locate the composer or his publisher due to their being behind the iron curtain, even though Ligeti had already left and was living in Austria.
@@njlauren Also, early on I had a very high quality sound bootleg cassette of the soundtrack which included all the music coupled with dialogue and sound effects from the movie, which I purchased at a comics convention probably the year after the film’s release, after failing to find an official recording. Another famous no-release of a beloved score from that period was Vangelis’ BLADE RUNNER
@@pauldavidartistclub6723 Yeah, I heard those stories. With ligeti it is interesting , bc they did credit his work in the movie. That raises an interesting question I can't answer, like did ligeti after he moved to Vienna work through BMI or the like? And would a work written behind the iron curtain have any kind of rights on the west? I never thought about that. I know that recordings done in the eastern block did have Mechanical and distribution rights ( playing on the radio), but I don't know how that was arranged...interesting question..
My first Planets was the one with Rattle and the Philharmonia for EMI. Feel somehow partial to it, although sonically it is rather lacking in presence, although it was recorded in Kingsway Hall, but then again it was one of the early digital EMI recordings. Agree on Dutoit’s, a really spectacular sounding one as well as Boult’s 1978 outing. Maazel’s with the Orchestre National de France is also interesting, although playing is not exactly of best stardard, but his tempi are curiously interesting!
Hehe thank you for your reply! Found your channel yesterday and am enjoying your videos very much. And so far I agree with your choices! We both have good taste Lol. Best regards from Brazil
For decades I only knew the Steinberg (first on audio tape), very aptly but not very generously coupled with Ligeti's Lux Aeterna. It must have been one of the first classical works I bought after Stravinsky's Rites Of Spring and Beethoven's Ninth. Didn't know that there was a "new" CD release of it, as the CD I got later was still coupled with the Ligeti. As it didn't do that well in the Penguin Guide I bought the winner version , the Dutoit /Montreal one. Very good also, maybe more because of recording quality, but as the Steinberg one is really imprinted in my mind, don't think i'll ever can enjoy another as much.
I have no end of admiration for William Steinberg, one of the 20th century’s finest conductors. I do enjoy many aspects of his “Planets”: spectacular playing, recording, and overall concept. My one complaint is that bizarre cut shortly before the quiet coda in “Uranus” - was this Steinberg’s decision, or a careless edit by DGG? Every time I get there, I grit my teeth and wait for it to pass by.
Dave, a number of critics criticized the Steinberg/BSO recording of the Planets because of the quick tempos. However, I have heard from other quarters that Steinberg followed Holst's metronome markings in the score. Is that true?
Karajan's LP was one of those that opened my eyes to classical music in college (many moons ago). Even on mediocre equipment it was impressive. Also, in case no one noticed, Steinberg's Uranus was missing some measures (four, I believe) from the first issue. This was corrected on the CDs.
Also I remember being very excited about watching it on TV with Ormandy conducting. Of course, my TV in the 1970s had sucky sound, so who knows if it was any good. Don't know of him having made a recording that was ever released.
Ormandy's "Planets" has been remastered in the _Eugene Ormandy Conducts 20th Century Classics_ collection, and sounds great. The entire (bargain price) set is a veritable "box of delights", so to speak - some real goodies in there.
The Philharmonia Orchestra recorded this many times. I lost track of the conductors. Also, I think Yan Pascal Torteliet did this with the BBC Philharmonic. I have Previns LSO recording which is better than his later Royal Philharmonic Orchestra. I also have Slatkin with the Philharmonia. Both Previn and Slatkin did these recordings around the time they did Vaughn Williams symphony cycle. (Holst and Vaughn-Williams were classmates one time studying under Ravel).
I have the original Decca UK vinyl pressing of the Karajan, it has become one of my reference recordings. I even like it better than my Decca Mehta/LA, which critics and collectors seem to prefer.
Yes, indeed, there are plenty of choices for the Planets! My introduction on LP was your 1st choice, Karajan and the Vienna Phil; then I added Boult’s 70s recording. On cassette I chose Steinberg and now on CD I have 2 I listen to equally: Dutoit and a BBC Music cover disc of a live Proms concert from 1973 with Boult and the BBCSO. Great music!
By any chance have you heard the recording with Geoffrey Simon and the LSO? It’s a very clean recording in my opinion and it has all the color and grandeur of the Dutoit recording while being a bit cleaner and better recorded. Very underrated imho
1966 Boult was my first Planets. I loved that old Angel lp. I agree about the HvK VPO version. I have both of the ancient first recordings on 78s conducted by Holst, an acoustic of all things, and the second one, electric but not much of an improvement, recorded in a broom closet. I also chortled when Pluto was de-planetized, bwahaha.
The Gardiner does feature an interesting pairing of Grainger’s “The Warriors” - I think his Planets is fine but not as remarkable as some of these in this video. I particularly liked learning about the Steinberg and the Jurowski - I love the pace and tension of those.
Thanks for mentioning Levi and Järvi! I have not heard these. Here’s my very subjective review: My favorites are - Levine/Chicago, Ozawa/Boston, Mehta/LA, Dutoit/Montreal, Elder/Hallé, Previn/Royal Philharmonic .... (Ozawa and Dutoit more than any other) none of Karajan’s are very good. Really surprised by that. Bernstein’s is surprisingly ... not good. There are a number of other big name conductors / orchestras that are super vanilla and uninspired. Also reasonably good - John Eliot Gardiner/Philharmonia, and Geoffrey Simon/LSO, Haitink/LPO, Boult/LPO... Suggest googling “Peter’s Planets” for a very comprehensive review of over 80 recordings. (I’m not involved with it - but cannot recommend it enough)
Usually my favorite is the one I heard first. In that case, it's Bernstein with the New York Philharmonic. In particular the legato section of "Jupiter," which is usually performed too fast, but Bernstein's is just right, which gives it a majesty and a depth of feeling that others can lack. The Karajan is equally slow, but the tempo varies too much for my taste. Check out the Bernstein "Jupiter" on TH-cam and see if you don't agree.
I gave UCMG's favorite, Karajan-Vienna, here a fair chance, truly, but despite numerous earlier winces, I couldn't get past the 1:07 (yes, one minute, seven second) mark in "Mars: The Bringer of War" before hitting the [Please-Make-It] Stop button. No, Karajan is not who I think of first when I want rhythmic precision, and he did not exceed my low expectations here. You want Mars, and the whole Planets suite done best, rhythmic precision and more, it pains me to say, because I hate what he did to so many musicians, but James Levine-Chicago blows Herbert Karajan-Vienna out of the water. Seriously: just listen to Mars by both, and you tell me who gets the score. Who's tight across orchestra sections, and who gets the grinding horror of war in Mars, along with the other sections that follow, better?
I'd take another listen to Previn (the earlier EMI recording). It isn't presented as a blockbuster...nor does it stress the colorful orchestration. But Previn conducts it as what it is, a piece of English music from its time, as he did with Vaughan Williams, other Holst pieces, etc. In this way it's quite beautiful, and the sound seems distant and mysterious...very much space music!
Sorry, I don't buy that. The Planets is a colorful orchestral blockbuster or it is nothing. Boring is as boring sounds--I guess that means like "a piece of English music from its time." ;)
I think that was a joke, Dave! However, it is rightly in line with your previous comments on English music as presented by English conductors. I think you are right in thinking that English composers have often been poorly served by our conductors. So often it is foreign conductors and orchestras who find what freshness and excitement exists. I'm certainly not saying it is always there but it is there in large measure in The Planets, which introduced me and no doubt many others to this wonderful world of music. @@DavesClassicalGuide
I was sooooo hoping von Karajan's Vienna version would be on your list and thrilled that it is at the top. It is a marvel. Utterly gripping and jaw dropping. I never cease to be amazed by the way they shape each planet and the incredible playing and recording. Those Culshaw Decca Vienna recordings are just amazing.
Holst composed a bleak, desolate, and forbidding masterpiece in Egdon Heath, his personal homage to the writer Thomas Hardy and the novel 'The Return Of The Native' Never gets played in concert, those dam planets get in the way !
Hi Dave, I so love The Planets, thanks for a great talk as always. Was there a Dutoit Shostakovich 8th recording? I've only found a $950 CD of Dutoit's 5th+9th on Amazon so far.
The most thrilling performance comes from Hillary Davan Wetton on Collins , 1989 digital: Very powerful & spacy and you hear the tam tam as in no other recording. Organ & Harp also very clear. The choir is as unearthy as could be. It was great reviewed at that days, but where is the label Collins now?
Oh my lord ! I have just listened to the Karajan recording . It is so brilliant I can hardly breathe ! The colour and energy - simply phenomenal . Thank you for the recommendation 🥂
The Mercury portion is the absolute finest I've heard. The hair on the back of my neck stood, as if I'd never heard the piece before. The entire recording is sublime. I must've replayed the thing at least 5 times since I saw Dave's recommendation.
Holst is my fave. I love falling asleep to Planets. Each piece is a journey.
I hope you read this because there's a piece of Holst that needs to be talked about.
"Egdon Heath". Oh god, how much I love this work and yet nobody seems to know about it. I can't discribe it, it's just so special that I don't know anything it could be compaired to. We always choose the music we listen to by our current mood but Egdon Heath appears to be an enrichment to every emotional state you could possibly think about (at least for me).
Holst himself claimed it to be his best work and he was right.
@@SuuSinator Thank you for making me aware of 'Egdon Heath'. Just listened to it for the first time....instantly memorable piece.
Dave this is amazing, thank you for this. I had just said to my wife the other day "I wonder if anyone else out there obsesses over The Planets and the details of that piece as much as I do, I feel alone" UNTIL I found THIS video.. it was like geeking out with another appreciator of Holst from afar. I dig so much everything you've pointed out in the various recordings, some of which are personal favs of mine as well! This review is a gem, thank you. (Don't worry I *also* get the last couple of planets mixed up, too)
same here, I just love it, especially conducted by Hermann, Boult and Stokowski. and Mehta.
I sat waiting for you to mention the Levine recording, which was the one I used to hold as the best. Then when you mentioned Karajan, I just thought "Karajan? He did the best? Well let's just see" and it dethroned them all. It's made me enjoy the music in a way I never enjoyed before. It's just an absolute monster when it needs to be, and is gorgeous at times I've never heard others capture. I've listened to it multiple times since this video, and now I need to get a copy. Thankfully Apple Music has it for now.
So glad you mentioned the Levi recording. It's shockingly good and a shockingly overlooked recordings of The Planets.
This was actually a BBC radio programme "CD Review" recommendation as the 'winner' a few years ago. It is superb.
Karajan & Vienna Philharmonic version blew my mind, what an incredible sounding recording - this is demo disk material!
One of the great things about the Dutoit recording is THAT ORGAN, especially on its first entry in Mars and also in Saturn.
You're almost right about the lack of expressive markings - there is another 'dolce' in the first violins when they take over from that clarinet solo; also 'con espress.' in oboe then clarinet, 9 after fig. III in Venus, and 'pesante' lots of times in Jupiter and Saturn.
But your point is a very perceptive one, and something I'd never noticed. In general Holst marks dynamics and phrasing only, and leaves expression to his performers. I had a quick look through my Holst scores and all I found was: a 'dolce' in the Suite de Ballet (at the start of the Scene de Nuit); 'pesante' a few times in the St Paul's Suite; 'legato, cantabile' at fig. F in the First Suite for Military Band; and, my favourite, 'coarsely' at 5 after fig. 6 in Beni Mora.
As to recordings, I agree with Karajan/VPO and Boult in one of his recordings (just not sure which one). I'm also quite fond of - gasp! - the Rattle/BPO version, despite one or two Rattleisms and the pointless inclusion of Matthews' Pluto. And, even more bizarrely, Malcolm Sargent with the BBCSO. Say what you like about Sargent, his recordings of Holst are all excellent.
Oops, what I said was supposed to be a comment for Dave but somehow slipped in here... never mind.
The impact of the organ on my very large subwoofer is tremendous.
Totally agree!
I wasnt aware of organs being in the mars orchestration before i listened to Dutoit 😂
A fine Pick, Dave. I listened to this a few times already. One of the best works ever. And luckily there really are several reference recordings of it.
My first recording of the Planets was the Royal Philharmonic Orch. and Vernon Handley. A very underrated recording and one of my favourites.
I concur with your opinion: a very thoughtful reading by Handley, revealing The Planets as much more than a blockbuster. One of my versions of choice.
Love your commentaries, Mr. Hurwitz.
You presented a great point by suggesting it should not be interpreted emotionally. Yet, a great performances gets the emotional response perhaps because the listener cannot resist the force, the melodic impetus of Gustav Holt's masterpiece.
Love your down-to-earth summaries.
A great wee shop has opened in my village that specialises in classical vinyl and is run by a doctor of music who directed me to David and I'm very glad to be here. I bought the Dutoit in '87 when it was released and I've only ever listened to that version. I can't believe my luck that Qobuz has the Von Karajan/Vienna recording as well as the Mehta/LA, both on 24 bit for £2.79 in their sale! I'm having a ball here - cheers David, from a very happy new subscriber!
Welcome! Have fun, and my best to your village shopkeeper!
Holy Sacred Cow! Karajan with Vienna...Karajan with a SOUL! Did not even know it existed. I'm 51. Started collecting CD when I was 16, right there in 1984-1985 when CD started to show up in stores. I do have tons off pre-digital recordings, but I did miss some great recordings as everyone was pushing the "new" versions. Thanks for your help with this one. Of course, Montréal was my version... Montréal is home. This Vienna version is very atmospheric, instruments sounds as if real people were holding them. Had a blast tonight. Thanks.
You are very welcome.
Boult recorded the Planets no fewer than 5 times: 1945/BBC Symphony (HMV), 1954/Philharmonic Promenade, aka London Philharmonic (NIxa), 1960/Vienna State Opera (Westminster), 1966/New Philharmonia (HMV/Angel), and 1978/London Philharmonic (EMI). There is a hard-to-find live recording from the 1973 Proms with the BBC Symphony out there too to make it 6 times! The great thing about having 5 commercial Boult recordings is that it allows us to compare how Boult handled the score over the years.
Sad to relate I have all six. As so often with Boult his best technical recordings were not necessarily his best account. Personally, I wish I had the 1945 version in the 1979 recording. Still all worth hearing.
@@swimmad456 I have 4 of the 6. His '45 performance is searing but unfortunately it's in muddy sound. If only that were captured with EMI/KEF's '79 sound.
The 1973. maybe the best...the most exciting...a live event
My 1st exposure to Holst was a freshman in HS - early 70s - we performed his "First Suite" & as we were learning it for Contest in TX, our terrific director played it for us. But what really opened my 14-yr old mind was when he played bits & pieces of "The Planets" over our band hall's Klipschorn Quad speakers at full volume. I remember all 70 of us were amazed - stunned. 3 friends & I went after school to our closest LP shop in our small city & I bought Bernstein's NY recording. I wore that LP out. I decided by my Sr. Yr to become a Music Educator/Musicologist/Conductor & have just retired after 4 decades + I have 50 or so recordings... agree with you, David, on your review... One of my later albums was Steinberg's, Karajan's, & my favorite as of 2012 has been Charles Duthoit/Montreal. I love Karajan/Vienna, too! I like the way you mention Holst's tone colors via his much-expanded orchestral palette. The organ pedal which enters near the end of Saturn gets me every time, still, as the glissadndi in Mars. his use of extended flute & double reed choirs...And that he varies the moods of each Planet so masterfully. Thanks, David!
This is the review which cemented by admiration for your critiquing skill.
My "view" of Karajan's overall music interpretation is mixed; here with Holst's PLANETS Suite* he is stellar. (I'm not sorry.) Of all the Holst-Karajan Planets, despite the majesty of Jupiter, the playfulness of Mercury, and the utter conviction of Mars, due to Karajan's expansive color palette, and slow as it is (and should be) Saturn ends up my favorite. Karajan's most skillful highlighting of the low:high pitch "LARGO finale" (unusual and difficult enough in itself to convince one's aesthetic sufficiently), here is of unexpectedly greater dramatic contrast/effect than expected. Tingles my toes while at the same time an ocean-sized waterfall massages me to the marrow. Uberchills..! Sublime. Dare I say a "spiritual" or "religious" experience? (The contrast-consolation of the high strings seems a "little birth" at death.)
Much later than hearing this performance, I learned that Saturn was also Holst's favorite Planet. "Sweet" serendipity!
* I've always thought "The Planets" was a slight miss in titling and would have preferred "Dance of the Planets".
Best mnemonic for remembering the order of the last three planets: the solar system starts with the Sun and ends with a SUN (Saturn, Uranus, Neptune).
My two faves: Boston/Steinberg (the euphonium part in Mars was played by Chester Schmitz on his F tuba) and Montreal/Dutoit
Yes! I LOVE Boston with Steinberg!
Surprisingly, John Williams also recorded the Planets with the Boston Pops (it's really telling how much of Mars he borrowed for the Star Wars theme music).
Williams pretty much borrowed everything. They should teach a course on his music where the students have to figure out where he got what from. It would be, well,...educational. A survey of Western classical music.
And Bernard Herrmann.
The funny part plus that Williams as a composer had a lot more impact then the people that influenced him.
I got 3 of those good ones. I haven't really binge on all of mine in awhile. So I cant think of which one is my favorite. My first was the Andrew Davis with Toronto Symphony Orchestra. Took me forever to find the cd, but had that album for decades. But any time I come across a copy in a store, i usually end up grabbing it. I doubt I got 20 yet. And looks like I need a few more. Thanks.
Dave, thank you so much! I fell in love with "The Planets" as a teenager, and heard it performed "live" by the LA Philharmonic at Disney Hall a few years ago, such a thrilling experience! My first LP was the Sir Adrian Bolt recording from the 70's. Thank you for sharing your love of this piece, and guiding us toward some great recordings!
Dear David,
My Planets-mania a few years ago resulted in collecting 75+ versions, studying each w the full score. I agree with your choices for the most part. Jurowski captures some elements like no other....the fun, mollify of Jupiter for one. Mehta/ NYP is also marvelous and more subtle than LA. I counted the repeats of the 7/4 last measure of Neptune. Mehta does about 20. Ormandy just repeats it 7 times, fading, then just stops, missing the needed effect.
The female or sometimes children's chorus entrance is magical, all on a high G, which becomes the leading tone of the following harmony. Holst also wrote tge first glissando for the organ. (In the live LAP performance I heard, the organist accomplished the glissando with not his finger tips, but with rolling forearms)
Go tam-tam roll!.
I discovered Dutoit and the Montreal on my own by accident by picking up a cd one day in Tower Records. I know him as a superb conductor of ballets. His cd's of Swan Lake and The Nutcracker are absolutely wonderful. It comes as a complete surprise to me that he would be a wonderful Planets conductor because it seems so opposite to the great feeling of the ballets. I'm so thankful you made this video. My go to reference recording of this growing up as a kid was the DG Karajan with Berlin with the big yellow picture of Saturn on the cover. All these recommendations are new to me and i shall strive to buy as as many as i can. A long time ago i got the DG Gardiner Planets cd that was bundled with The Warriors and had the blue constellation cover, but i found it disappointing compared to the Karajan reference i had grown up with.
on multiple classical music sites/newsgroups i've been on in the last 30 years, the Dutoit is almost always listed as the best Planets.
granted, today he's now one of those artists for whom the catalog is a little tainted because of allegations a few years back.
Karajan’s 1962 Decca with the VPO is much better than the 1980 DG. If you get a chance to hear it you will be surprised!
"You can always count on Mackerras" YES!!
I've always been a sucker for detail, and that's why Mackerras has always been my go-to recording. Bringing out all those details while preserving a perfectly balanced sound is a real _tour de force._
I've enjoyed Dutoit quite a lot as well.
Largely agree on this (to my delight). LA/Mehta to me has always been the gold standard, and one of the most astounding "initial listenings" of my life. I also think Dutoit is a 5-star, and that good ol' Boult is pretty good.
I will be pursuing some of the lesser-known versions that you recommended, with great interest. Thanks for those, and big kudos in general for your videos.
I found Sir Alexander Gibson's recording with the Scottish National Orchestra on Chandos an excellent interpretation. I look forward to hearing the Von Karajan/Vienna recording though. The others I have are Mehta/Los Angeles and the '66 Sir Adrian Boult/Philharmonia.
This was fun! A fun presentation of basically fun music. Everything you said made sense to me. I was surprised by the Karajan/Vienna pick, but I do like that one too. I like the Marriner for just the fabulous playing of the Concertgebouw. It's also a gorgeous, late analog recording from Philips. I know, I know! - Marriner is Marriner. What can I say.
I LOVE YOUR STUFF SO MUCH!!!!
Big fan of the Mehta recording.
Here are the dozen "Planets" recordings I have panned (for anyone who is interested):
PHI/Ormandy (1976) [committed performance, but lacks gravitas and subtlety]
RPO/Previn (1986) [spacious, spiritual, great performance, but last three movements are less stellar, and tubas too subdued throughout]
LSO/Previn (1990) [some flaws, horns subdued, sound & balance problems]
LPO/Boult (1978) [good performance, but has sound problems & lacks power and vitality in spots]
LAP/Stokowski (1956) [colorful, detailed, interesting, but tinny sound; lacks spaciousness]
BBC/A. Davis (2011) [meticulous, attention to detail, committed performance, lacks vitality in places, brass generally subdued and a bit muted]
CSO/Levine (1989) [tinny sound; lacks mystery and soul]
NYP/Bernstein (1973) [crappy sound; too fast]
BPO/Karajan (1981 )[odd and weird]
PHO/Gardiner (1995) [utterly lacking in spirit and magic; too slow, too fast . . .]
LSO/C. Davis (2002) [crappy, tinny brass sound]
PHO/Rattle (2002) [lethargic, sub-par sound, slow tempi]
What do I like?:
LAP/Mehta (1971) [fabulous brass, spectacular sound, spirited, “spacey” & mystical; remains the gold standard]
OSM/Dutoit (1986) [majestic, mystical, elegant]
PHO/Boult (1967) [magical, impeccable, glorious, high end a bit harsh, horns too soft]
VPO/Karajan (1961) [very good, but lacks spirit & verve in some places, and some sound problems]
BSO/Steinberg (1970) [eccentric, interesting, colorful performance, but can’t match the best versions; harsh 80s remaster]
I have the Mehta and a very good headphone system, and the sound really distorts during the loudest passages, which kills the performance for me. Great otherwise.
@@moviedave2001 what source? CD, download, vinyl, streaming?
@@bradleykay download off Presto. Why?
Bernstein and NYPO was the first recording I ever heard of "The Planets". It may not be the best, but there are some cool spots, like how the Bass Flute motive sticks out as the women's chorus starts in Neptune.
I really like Ormandy and the Philadelphia Orchestra, paired with Vaughan Williams' "Fantasia on a Theme by Thomas Tallis" on the album. The record is about as epic as music gets. I am going to listen to the Karajan, though. I've finally started putting together a collection of Karajan records that I really like thanks to this channel, after having written him off thanks to so many records that disappointed me. Besides The Planets he did that album of the Dvorak Eighth and Brahms Third with Vienna, and that's a favorite of mine.
I am pleasantly surprised!
Karajan VPO and Levine CSO are my two tops, with Karajan taking the top spot. That VPO recording is just terrifying in Mars, noble in Jupiter, ethereal in Neptune... it is the most involving one for me emotionally. Levine CSO is bombastic and fun with amazing sound quality.
Levine with Chicago is my favorite. Also love Stokowski's LA recording, Karajan's and Dutoit's.
I found Levine disappointing. Loud, but disappointing, and not very well recorded.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Fair enough. Love your channel, keep up the great work!
I have friend who really enjoys this recording, but for me it is all too extroverted. It works really well in Jupiter but not so much in 🪐.
Thank you for guiding me to the Karajan VPO recording, with which I wasn't familiar. It is really beautiful but it includes some awkward moments in Mercury, as the celesta seems to be tuned lower than the orchestra, 440 as opposed to 442 I suppose...
How times have changed. Still remember buying my first Planets
when there were only two LPs of the work available in the U.S.
I’m not a musician, but I sense a great many of the virtues you
describe for The Planets in The Perfect Fool, as well. Hope
this video isn’t your last commentary on Holst.
Thanks for recommending Karajan/Vienna. The slow section in Jupiter is wonderful.
Have to say that my favorite version of The Planets is Tomita's "The Planets", if for no other reason than Imogen Holst did not approve and had it removed. (Though it was released later on, and is an absolute joy to listen to if you like Tomita's style).
It's just an opinion given by a listener. It's about the Planets. How is it not relevant?
Egdon Heath & The Perfect Fool i consider right up there with The Planets!
I was a little surprised you didn't mention the Norrington SWR version. I listened to Uranus, which you mentioned in Classics Today and you are absolutely right its quite something.
Yeah, it's very good, but I had enough on hand.
The Karajan VPO version has some great "crazy bells" in Saturn, with a metal striker as per the score IIRC.
The Houston Choral Society in the early '90's under Dr Betty Divine did a stunning version of Holst's " Hymn of Jesus". This was Holst's favourite of all his compositions. She assembled 5 choirs, including a children's choir, and part of the Houston Symphony Orchestra to pull off this magnificent monster. It was performed ONCE in the splendid acoustics of Houston's vast Foundry Methodist Church; and recorded live with 5 stereophonic microphones, for each choir, positioned in a different corner of the church. The orchestra was on the central stage / sanctuary. The 5th mike was hung centrally. --Recording was done by an expert engineer & a post-production editor, overseen by Dr Divine. To be in the audience, sitting in the middle of all these choirs, was an almost psychedelic experience, and if you have a quadraphonic sound system, crank it up despite the neighbours. Listen to it the first time "straight up" studiously, --and afterwards with *recreational substances* or a G&T, if you are that way inclined. :-)
.
See if you don't think this is THE definitive recording of this seldom-performed work. You can still get a CD of this work from the HCS; see their website. it was a totally immersive experience; I walked out like a mystical zombie (in the best sort of way) and I didn't want to talk to anybody for a couple days afterward. Apparently Holst taught himself Sanskrit on his school vacation (he was a school teacher) in order to compose this work, --and it doesn't in the least surprise me.
Dr Divine intuited the warmth Holst intended, --but buried-- in this work, and coaxed it out so that it was profoundly moving and sometimes tender.
This obscure recording is worth searching out.
As a citizen of Kansas City, a fan of our orchestra and a good friend of my neighbor Michael Stern, I had hoped you picked their recording as best. I heard it live twice and thought it slow. But you made me realize how rhythmic and revealing it was. My still favorite since forever.. Steinberg/Boston. I will keep on listening!
I thought the very positive review was sufficient. It's a terrific performance, up there with the best.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Fair deal sir! Thanks!
A great day for us proud Boultians... and to top it all, you even chose my other favourite recording of the work, HvK with the Vienna Phil as your top recommendation. I pray to foregive me, that I had gotten so much hold of the wrong end of the stick, that I assumed, that this latter recording was up for a severe trashing...or as the clip progressed, that it would be totally ignored! How wrong could I be!
PS. Your enthusiastic energy when you greet us at the beginnig of each video, always make me expect you to start out with a 'Hello possoms' as did Dame Edna Everage. I always feel a slight pang of disappointment when hearing your more straight, conventional adress....but then after a while you start to sing, and I cheer up and start to wonder...maybe one day.....
I bought the Steinberg on vinyl in the 70's or 80's. It is my favorite. Then came the Dutoit recording, I cant choose. Since then I bought Boult, and Karajan. NOw I have to find the Mackerras. I am very glad you make me discover Mackerras. Steinberg is maybe my favorite conductor off all time because he always give me joy. I do not mind all the other considerations.
Should have watched this video a few weeks earlier, just bought the Andrew Davis version in SACD, I thought after listening:" I remembered this piece as more exciting... must be me as I'm not a musician..." now I discover it's not me...
Thank you for your video's,
Igor from Belgium
I have the Ormandy Philly Orchestra one that was recorded in the 1970s. It's on cassette. One of the first orchestral recordings I ever owned. That recording also had the wonderful Fantasia on a Theme by Thomas Tallis by Ralph Vaughn Williams. That one always sticks out in my mind. There's a clarinet squeak in the middle of Saturn at the top of a woodwind crescendo which always sticks out in my mind when I'm listening to anyone's version.
I picked up the Dutoit Montreal recording on strong recommendation from friends. I haven't listened to it as much as I should.
I've heard great things about an LA Philharmonic recording which had both Tommy Johnson and Roger Bobo on tuba. Well.... mostly because Gene Pokorny mentioned it specifically in his orchestral excepts CD (produced by Summit in the 1990s). His comments had to do with the low E at the end of Uranus and how he doesn't believe anyone's going to come close to reproducing that sound.
As a Brit, can I say bravo - I think you've pretty much nailed this. Yes to Sir Adrian (of course - he really was stunning in this piece as well as being associated with it for ever), Yes Indeed to Mackerras (I thought I was the only person who actually cherished this brilliant disc), and Yes Absolutely to Karajan/VPO. Incidentally, Mackerras did a stunning Planets in 2009 at one of his very last Proms - and that, trust me, was with the BBC Philharmonic who played like gods on this occasion (with the right conductor they can and do). It's the best live performance I've ever heard along with a couple of Boult ones from the 1970s. I need to hear Paavo Järvi - that sounds very interesting. I can't share your enthusiasm for Mehta/LAPO: it's not bad, but I wouldn't have it down as one of the best ones, but Dutoit awakes from his usual slumbers to deliver something much better than his normal efforts. Herrmann is grimly hilarious - it's almost certainly the most perverse ever. Dullness is available from plenty of others (Sargent, Colin Davis et al) but Herrmann is in his own circle of Holstian hell.
I agree that that Proms performance by Mackerras was fantastic.
By the way, since we are on the topic of Mackerras, I would just like to give a shout-out to the excellent collection of tributes to Mackerras that you co-edited with the late John Tyrrell. I thought it did a brilliant job of illuminating what he was like on and off the podium.
@@JaneSmith_ Thanks! That's very kind of you. I can honestly say it was the most enjoyable book I've worked on: so many great musicians (Baker, Brendel, Pappano et al) revered Charles as we did (and do).
The only version of The Planets I've had is Gardiner/Philharmonia. After watching this video I listened to the Mars and Jupiter movements of the 1979 Boult, Mackerras, and Dutoit on TH-cam. Though I am a big fan of Mackerras, I thought Dutoit was the clear winner among that trio and versus the Gardiner recording, so I ordered a cheap used copy. I am looking forward to hearing it on my stereo.
I bought the Gardiner CD when it first came out and, while it's certainly good, I didn't think it was one of the greats. However, I really do enjoy the Percy Grainger coupling, which for me is the real star among these Planets :)
You've nailed it! I have the Steinberg, the Dutoit, the Boult/New Philharmionia and the Karajan/VPO. (I do have the Karajan/BPO as well, but I don't think it'
s as good as the VPO recording). You may disagree with me, but I think there is something slightly amiss in the Dutoit "Saturn" when the bells enter - or at least that's how it sounds to me. I am also one of those people who - ahem - has the Colin Matthews' "Pluto"
We mustn't neglect poor Pluto which was demoted to a dwarf planet.
Great review Dave. I'm wondering if you would consider doing a video (or series) on the best recordings from the major conductors. I always listen when you make passing references to a recording that's not on the topic you're addressing, for example you mentioned Dutoit did an excellent Shostakovich 8th. Those are great insights but almost impossible to remember later. Thanks for all you do.
Eventually!
20:22 I remember when it came out. It created a big splash and firmly established Decca as a leader of sound quality in the digital era (while Deutsche Grammophon inexplicably and majorly lagged).
I love the Mackerras for its airiness ( …it also has one of the loveliest of all the Glockenspiele in Mercury ). Furthermore it is normally coupled with his near perfect recording of the Perfect Foul. For me this is a nice bonus to have.
Poor old Pluto. Regardless of its (non) place in Holst's suite, I was sorry it got demoted. And then it put on a spectacular show for the Voyager fly by, talk about a post mortem validation. Magnificent!
When I was a kid, I liked the Tomita version of the Planets. I listened to it the other day for the first time in 40 years. I won't listen to it again. Kids grow up, sometimes anyway.
I've played it in too many bad performances. It's really, really hard. Too hard for most regional orchestras, which don't have either the rhythmic discipline or the great harps, woodwinds, etc.
And the chorus at the end is SOOOO difficult to get in tune. I'm always in tears, but for the wrong reason.
I'll check out Karajan - never in a million years would I have thought of it.
Tomita’s planets brought me into classical music, so it served its purpose.
You will eventually revisit TOMITA at a point in your life when you are finally Ready to appreciate his genius; HINT requires the capacity for Extraction .... then and only Then can one appreciate that he is one of the Great Artists who ever lived ... praying that well-intentioned listeners will Always reach This Point in their lives ... peace be with You and ALL the best 🙏
@JenniferEliseAtchiso Very much agree, although in a more specific sense. Early on, when I was digging more deeply into classical music and being already familiar with Debussy's "Afternoon of a Faun" and the string quartet, Tomita's "Snowflakes Are Dancing" pointed me to the piano music of Debussy and opened up that world for me. When the album was first released I heard it in a record store and was amazed at the sound (a far synthesizer cry from "Switched On Bach"). I bought it on impulse and never regretted it. I do think that compared to his other recordings, Tomita pulled off more of a feat, selecting and "orchestrating" the solo piano pieces, rather than revoicing orchestral pieces, as enjoyable as they may be. I thoroughly enjoy all of Debussy's piano music, but to this day I still have no problem enjoying Tomita's "Snowflakes Are Dancing" on its own terms.
My favorite version wasnt because of the recording, but rather something more memorable...back in the early 70s the Chicago recorded this with Solti ( probably the most bombastic conductor in history), and they actually advertised it on TV., I still remember it 'Solti! Chicago! Holst! The Planets!' the commercial was as bombastic as rhe record.
The only commercial that was better was this ad for a collection of classical pieces with this British ( of course!) announcer ' you know that as stranger in paradise from kismet, but did you know it was from the Polevetsian Dances by Borodin? So many beautiful themes' ( friend of mine got thrown out of wind ensemble in high school with me when we cracked up when we attempted a wind arrangement of the Polevetsian dances ...
How do you feel about Eugene Ormandy (Holst: The Planets) later version Rattle recorded with the Berliner Philharmoniker in the middle of the 2000s? Thank you for your time.
Ormandy is good but the sonics need freshening up. Rattle sucks.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Hello,
Thank you so much!
Great video and thank you for your info.
Have a wonderful one. Cheers
Great Dave! I love The Planets...I like also Vernon Handley with RPO...anyway Steinberg and Levi are among the best recording ever of this wonderful piece...Dutoit is one of the few that gives an importance to the organ in Mars :D
Steinberg/BSO is my general favorite, but for Saturn, I pick the Karajan. The bells (apparently a pair of "Wagner Anvils") klanging out makes for the most effective climax I've ever heard in that movement (and why Holst asks for metal hammers!). The other is the organ pedals in the pastoral section at the end. My sub-woofer goes nuts (like it does in the Munch/BSO Saint-Saens Organ Symphony) and the floor shakes... literally. Curious that the organ is otherwise inaudible in Mars and Neptune.
I agree with almost everything you say. This is quite possibly the best recording of Karajan ever. The sound is outstanding because Von Karajan was not allowed to interfere with the mastering like he usually did. We have to acknowledge Karajan is not really overrated when you hear this recording... The Montreal is brilliant.
What you introduced me to that I have never heard before was the Groves, which actually may be my favourite now, I greatly prefer the live recording techniques to studio, and the horns in this just sound jaw dropping.
I think you should have included the Marriner Phillips with the Concertgebow, brilliant recording that shows that Marriner sounds like Marriner no matter who he conducts - clarion sharp incredible detail.
...missing percussion...
@@DavesClassicalGuide what is the marriner ?
Excellent suggestions. May I add my personal favorite: a live intepretation with the LSO with Marek Janowski.
I might be in the minority but the Chicago Symphony's recording with Levine on DG is my fave. It's an "in your face" performance.
It's good overall, though the percussion on Mars is far too loud, often obscuring the rest of the orchestra.
@@leestamm3187 But I love it! "In your face"! As I said, I might be minority but the CSO does precisely what you THINK they will do in that recording. Hearing Bud Herseth and the Trumpets along with Dale Clevenger and the Horns on SATURN still brings goosebumps.
@@maestroclassico5801 Have to agree on the Saturn. I've followed the CSO since I was a kid in the Reiner era.
@@leestamm3187 VERY interesting that neither Reiner nor Solti recorded THE PLANETS with the CSO. Solti's with the London Phil is still pretty good!
I've been waiting for this one! I just love this work, the Venus movement especially; it's the perfect antipode to violent Mars. I listened to you with breath held, expecting to hear Maazel's infamous French recording for CBS appear among the retrograde Planets. Whatever faults it may have, it is simply furious where it counts (Mars, Uranus). I recently bought Karajan's Berlin account and was really impressed with the quality of sound (at least in the Gold remastering). I could wish for even more vitriol in K's Mars, though. Finally, if I may say so, I believe Andrew Davis recorded op. 32 three times, in fact; the first was in Toronto for EMI. Thank you! PS. A real disappointment was Previn on Telarc - very slack and dull. I'd love to hear Levi and Jarvi on that label.
Maazel is atrocious, especially at the end of Jupiter where he substitutes a snare drum for the tambourine. But it was never in print long enough to matter...thank God.
@@DavesClassicalGuide The Maazel was a huge disappointment. Given his technical mastery, including his ear for orchestral colour, he should have done so much better. The orchestra sounds terrible and the harsh early digital sound only makes matters worse.
@@DavesClassicalGuide It's surprising that you didn't mention the Maazel, considering its disrepute! Still and all, for me it's a keeper for its fury (and I don't find it badly recorded, and I have the first-gen CD). My reference for op. 32, by the way, is Gardiner - spectacular playing and recording (that low note at the end of Uranus - no jokes, please! - awesome). As to The Planets being an emotionless work, I can only say that I nearly always get a lump (in my throat, mind) at the end of Saturn.
@@301268bmh I've seen the playing in Mars described as drunken. Maybe - but they're angry drunks! And I don't find the recording quality bad at all, and I have a pretty early pressing, I believe. I think the whole thing fun to listen to, though it's not my reference. Thanks for reading and commenting!
@@DavesClassicalGuide The High Fidelity Magazine reviewer concluded his review with, "The orchestra play like pigs".
I cannot agree more with David. The Karajan VPO was my first Planets years and years ago. I have three pressings on LP and the sound is astonishing with a verve which is unique. An aura of mystique which have not been eclipsed. Also superb is the early BBC Symphony performance with Sir Malcolm Sargent in EMI stereo. The Stoki is fun indeed and truly magical in Venus and Neptune.
We've had some fun at Vernon Handley's expense, but he did a really solid Planets with the RPO, for their own label. It has since turned up in a bunch of bargain incarnations, and is worth picking up if you find it.
Here's a weird one: Marriner conducting the Concertgebouw. Hardly the most exciting, but gee it sounds nice. Quite idiomatic too, which I guess was Marriner's contribution.
I agree with Handley, if you can still get it, but the sound is so forward and can become fatiguing.
@@mickeytheviewmoo I admit it's not the most natural soundstage.
I am surprised you didn't mention the incredible tambourine playing in Jupiter in the Steinberg/Boston recording. In the Karajan it is inaudible! One of the great tambourine excerpts ever! Ha Ha.
Right on the money with Karajan and Vienna. Dutoit is a close second. Haven't heard Boult's recordings. But who needs Boult's when you got Karajan.
I’m slightly surprised you don’t have Andrew Litton and Bergen Phil in here. I’ve played it w him (and Spano) here in Singapore. They’re great w this piece. Litton does, as always, mess around w the timpani parts (my part) and it can be a bit much, but he really brings the music across. I heard a story about a Norwegian conductor doing it in London. The rehearsal came to a stop, when he asked the trombones “Can we, please, take a look at the opening of Uranus?”. I hope it’s true!
I've just about memorized this suite. Steinberg/BSO/DG for me. It rubs Mars in your face.
I enjoy Previn's reading with the LSO on Telarc. Agree on Dutoit with the MSO. Their recording of Bartok's Concerto for Orchestra/Music for Strings Perc, Celesta is also electric. And his Miraculous Mandarin- second (for me) to Boulez's New York Phil recording from the early '70s
Always have the seatbelt on when you listen to Steinberg and Boston play Mars! One hell of a ride!
Well gosh, my favorite Planets is Chicago/Levine on DG. I find it riveting. A desert island album for me.
Dutoit is my second place and I do really like Los Angeles with Mehta.
The popularity of Levine continues to puzzle me. It's loud, with typically great brass, but otherwise not special in any way, and sonically inferior to boot.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Tough to argue about it being loud so maybe the CSO brass does it for me. Maybe it's time to re-evaluate but I may end up remaining in the group who digs the CSO/Levine.
Jurowski is on the agenda for tonight; I've not yet heard it.
@@sjc1204 Just have fun with it. If you like Levine, that's fine too.
Great Video! thank you
Karajan ‘66 seems to be the only recording in which the percussionist uses metal strikers on the bells during Saturn. Holst specifies that in the score, doesn’t he? It’s a terrifying effect that no they recording has!
That's because it wrecks the bells if you do it right. Elgar does something similar at the end of the Enigma Variations--he says to hit the suspended cymbal with a heavy metal beater. Bye bye cymbal if you do it.
I enjoy the Boult. But I also have the Colin Davis/Berlin Phil on Philips, which I think is a bit tinnish in spots...any comments about this version?
Bad sound, dull performance.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Define "bad sound", with what equipment are you measuring the quality of sound? what is your criteria?
@@douglaskelly1394 My ears.
I lived in Palo Alto from 1959 to 1981 . I did attend some concerts of the Stanford Symphony Orchestra. Were you playing Percussion then ?
No, I was 83-85.
I have a CD of the Planets conducted by Andre Previn (Telarc) which I like. Any thoughts on it?
Dull, and not even that spectacularly recorded.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Thanks. It is amazing how you can keep track of so many recordings. I'm enjoying your videos.
What are your thoughts on the EMI Simon Rattle/Berlin recording from 2006?
Check out reviews at ClassicsToday.com.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Thanks!
UPDATE AUGUST 2024: Ozawa’s Planets seems to be available in full on iTunes now for those who download.
(Original comment): It seems to be rather hard to find (and it’s not even complete on iTunes!), but I believe that OZAWA’s Boston recording was used in The Right Stuff film (1983). I don’t think know if that soundtrack is available nowadays, but it wasn’t officially released back in the day (three Planets pieces were heard in the movie if not mistaken, along with music borrowed from a different movie by Mancini, and new music by the picture’s scorer Bill (Rocky) Conti)
Conti ripped off several works.
The reason right stuff is one of my favorite movies. There is a funny story about that, he used the Planets and other classical pieces as temporary fill in the movie intending to write his own music for it, but it worked so well he kept it (Jupiter and Mars were in there,).
My son and I have an argument about the main theme..it is most definitely taken from the orchestra tutti theme in the Tchaikovsky violin concerto , my son says it isn't totally the same ( he is a classical violinist so I have to give him credence) but I recall from the VHS version they credited the violin concerto in the credits( DVS version doesn't have it).
@@njlauren agreed that was a Tchaikovsky piece or “adaptaion” of it, forgot about that in my initial comment.
I’m sure your aware of the few stories involving Kubrick’s 2001 soundtrack…how he scrapped Alex North’s full score to replace it with what he did. Classical pieces had been used in movie soundtracks forever, but perhaps not in quite that way, similar to Lucas’ later use of 50’s/early 60’s rock-pop as the entire soundtrack of AMERICAN GRAFFITI.
Also how Ligeti’s music was used in Kubrick’s film without the proper permission (or royalties, I think). It’s been a long time since I read about it, and could well be mistaken, but I think Kubrick and/or MGM claimed that they couldn’t locate the composer or his publisher due to their being behind the iron curtain, even though Ligeti had already left and was living in Austria.
@@njlauren Also, early on I had a very high quality sound bootleg cassette of the soundtrack which included all the music coupled with dialogue and sound effects from the movie, which I purchased at a comics convention probably the year after the film’s release, after failing to find an official recording.
Another famous no-release of a beloved score from that period was Vangelis’ BLADE RUNNER
@@pauldavidartistclub6723
Yeah, I heard those stories. With ligeti it is interesting , bc they did credit his work in the movie. That raises an interesting question I can't answer, like did ligeti after he moved to Vienna work through BMI or the like? And would a work written behind the iron curtain have any kind of rights on the west? I never thought about that. I know that recordings done in the eastern block did have Mechanical and distribution rights ( playing on the radio), but I don't know how that was arranged...interesting question..
My first Planets was the one with Rattle and the Philharmonia for EMI. Feel somehow partial to it, although sonically it is rather lacking in presence, although it was recorded in Kingsway Hall, but then again it was one of the early digital EMI recordings. Agree on Dutoit’s, a really spectacular sounding one as well as Boult’s 1978 outing. Maazel’s with the Orchestre National de France is also interesting, although playing is not exactly of best stardard, but his tempi are curiously interesting!
The Maazel substitutes snare drum for tambourine at the end of Jupiter--an obnoxious and gratuitous choice.
Hehe thank you for your reply! Found your channel yesterday and am enjoying your videos very much. And so far I agree with your choices! We both have good taste Lol. Best regards from Brazil
For decades I only knew the Steinberg (first on audio tape), very aptly but not very generously coupled with Ligeti's Lux Aeterna.
It must have been one of the first classical works I bought after Stravinsky's Rites Of Spring and Beethoven's Ninth.
Didn't know that there was a "new" CD release of it, as the CD I got later was still coupled with the Ligeti.
As it didn't do that well in the Penguin Guide I bought the winner version , the Dutoit /Montreal one.
Very good also, maybe more because of recording quality, but as the Steinberg one is really imprinted in my mind,
don't think i'll ever can enjoy another as much.
I have no end of admiration for William Steinberg, one of the 20th century’s finest conductors. I do enjoy many aspects of his “Planets”: spectacular playing, recording, and overall concept. My one complaint is that bizarre cut shortly before the quiet coda in “Uranus” - was this Steinberg’s decision, or a careless edit by DGG? Every time I get there, I grit my teeth and wait for it to pass by.
Dave, a number of critics criticized the Steinberg/BSO recording of the Planets because of the quick tempos. However, I have heard from other quarters that Steinberg followed Holst's metronome markings in the score. Is that true?
I have no idea. Holst's own tempos were very quick also.
Karajan's LP was one of those that opened my eyes to classical music in college (many moons ago). Even on mediocre equipment it was impressive. Also, in case no one noticed, Steinberg's Uranus was missing some measures (four, I believe) from the first issue. This was corrected on the CDs.
Also I remember being very excited about watching it on TV with Ormandy conducting. Of course, my TV in the 1970s had sucky sound, so who knows if it was any good. Don't know of him having made a recording that was ever released.
It was, on RCA. It's quite good.
Ormandy's "Planets" has been remastered in the _Eugene Ormandy Conducts 20th Century Classics_ collection, and sounds great. The entire (bargain price) set is a veritable "box of delights", so to speak - some real goodies in there.
The Ormandy video of the Planets from 1977 can be seen on TH-cam
The Philharmonia Orchestra recorded this many times. I lost track of the conductors. Also, I think Yan Pascal Torteliet did this with the BBC Philharmonic. I have Previns LSO recording which is better than his later Royal Philharmonic Orchestra. I also have Slatkin with the Philharmonia. Both Previn and Slatkin did these recordings around the time they did Vaughn Williams symphony cycle. (Holst and Vaughn-Williams were classmates one time studying under Ravel).
I have the original Decca UK vinyl pressing of the Karajan, it has become one of my reference recordings. I even like it better than my Decca Mehta/LA, which critics and collectors seem to prefer.
Yes, indeed, there are plenty of choices for the Planets! My introduction on LP was your 1st choice, Karajan and the Vienna Phil; then I added Boult’s 70s recording. On cassette I chose Steinberg and now on CD I have 2 I listen to equally: Dutoit and a BBC Music cover disc of a live Proms concert from 1973 with Boult and the BBCSO. Great music!
By any chance have you heard the recording with Geoffrey Simon and the LSO? It’s a very clean recording in my opinion and it has all the color and grandeur of the Dutoit recording while being a bit cleaner and better recorded. Very underrated imho
I heard it, yes. I don't agree that it's superior to Dutoit, however.
@@DavesClassicalGuide fair enough
1966 Boult was my first Planets. I loved that old Angel lp. I agree about the HvK VPO version. I have both of the ancient first recordings on 78s conducted by Holst, an acoustic of all things, and the second one, electric but not much of an improvement, recorded in a broom closet. I also chortled when Pluto was de-planetized, bwahaha.
Where’s Gardiner my opinion one of the finest disc’s?
Gardiner is nothing special.
The Gardiner does feature an interesting pairing of Grainger’s “The Warriors” - I think his Planets is fine but not as remarkable as some of these in this video. I particularly liked learning about the Steinberg and the Jurowski - I love the pace and tension of those.
Mr Hurwitz: It would be nice to see a video from you talkin´ about the line and chord conductors
I have many times.
Great list! Karajan and Dutoit are the 2 I own and my 2 faves, and I’m completely satisfied with them!
Thanks for mentioning Levi and Järvi! I have not heard these. Here’s my very subjective review:
My favorites are - Levine/Chicago, Ozawa/Boston, Mehta/LA, Dutoit/Montreal, Elder/Hallé, Previn/Royal Philharmonic .... (Ozawa and Dutoit more than any other)
none of Karajan’s are very good. Really surprised by that. Bernstein’s is surprisingly ... not good. There are a number of other big name conductors / orchestras that are super vanilla and uninspired.
Also reasonably good - John Eliot Gardiner/Philharmonia, and Geoffrey Simon/LSO, Haitink/LPO, Boult/LPO...
Suggest googling “Peter’s Planets” for a very comprehensive review of over 80 recordings. (I’m not involved with it - but cannot recommend it enough)
Music is the ear of the beholder.
Usually my favorite is the one I heard first. In that case, it's Bernstein with the New York Philharmonic. In particular the legato section of "Jupiter," which is usually performed too fast, but Bernstein's is just right, which gives it a majesty and a depth of feeling that others can lack. The Karajan is equally slow, but the tempo varies too much for my taste. Check out the Bernstein "Jupiter" on TH-cam and see if you don't agree.
I don't agree.
I gave UCMG's favorite, Karajan-Vienna, here a fair chance, truly, but despite numerous earlier winces, I couldn't get past the 1:07 (yes, one minute, seven second) mark in "Mars: The Bringer of War" before hitting the [Please-Make-It] Stop button. No, Karajan is not who I think of first when I want rhythmic precision, and he did not exceed my low expectations here. You want Mars, and the whole Planets suite done best, rhythmic precision and more, it pains me to say, because I hate what he did to so many musicians, but James Levine-Chicago blows Herbert Karajan-Vienna out of the water. Seriously: just listen to Mars by both, and you tell me who gets the score. Who's tight across orchestra sections, and who gets the grinding horror of war in Mars, along with the other sections that follow, better?
Hi Dave, could you consider assembling a nice repertoire on soundtracks too?
Already did the Gerhardt box, and I hope to do more.
Mackerras is truly a treasure!
I'd take another listen to Previn (the earlier EMI recording). It isn't presented as a blockbuster...nor does it stress the colorful orchestration. But Previn conducts it as what it is, a piece of English music from its time, as he did with Vaughan Williams, other Holst pieces, etc. In this way it's quite beautiful, and the sound seems distant and mysterious...very much space music!
Sorry, I don't buy that. The Planets is a colorful orchestral blockbuster or it is nothing. Boring is as boring sounds--I guess that means like "a piece of English music from its time." ;)
I think that was a joke, Dave! However, it is rightly in line with your previous comments on English music as presented by English conductors. I think you are right in thinking that English composers have often been poorly served by our conductors. So often it is foreign conductors and orchestras who find what freshness and excitement exists. I'm certainly not saying it is always there but it is there in large measure in The Planets, which introduced me and no doubt many others to this wonderful world of music. @@DavesClassicalGuide
I was sooooo hoping von Karajan's Vienna version would be on your list and thrilled that it is at the top. It is a marvel. Utterly gripping and jaw dropping. I never cease to be amazed by the way they shape each planet and the incredible playing and recording. Those Culshaw Decca Vienna recordings are just amazing.
His later DG digital CD of 1980 was no match for the earlier Vienna one.
Holst composed a bleak, desolate, and forbidding masterpiece in Egdon Heath, his personal homage to the writer Thomas Hardy and the novel 'The Return Of The Native' Never gets played in concert, those dam planets get in the way !
No, it wouldn't get played anyway--sadly in my view--but it's a rather special piece in that respect.
There is an older Decca Solti/LPO Planets CD that includes Egdon Heath.
Hi Dave, I so love The Planets, thanks for a great talk as always. Was there a Dutoit Shostakovich 8th recording? I've only found a $950 CD of Dutoit's 5th+9th on Amazon so far.
I don't believe so. In any case, I only saw it live.
The most thrilling performance comes from Hillary Davan Wetton on Collins , 1989 digital: Very powerful & spacy and you hear the tam tam as in no other recording. Organ & Harp also very clear. The choir is as unearthy as could be. It was great reviewed at that days, but where is the label Collins now?