The fandom need to start realizing that, if you want to have a 25,000 fur cons, we need a professional, paid staff to run them. You cannot realistically expect what is essentially a full-time job at that level to be done by unpaid staff and volunteers.
Indeed, the last thing we need is chaos causing a con or multiple cons to get blacklisted. If it in one hotel, they’ll tell all the others, then trolls could just tell even more hotels until they can‘t host it in the entire country.
@ charity is charity. I’d prefer the cons get funded by charity and passion, instead of a for-profit corporation that could easily get corrupted and set up exclusivity deals in big venues.
I help out at WAFF, West Australian Fur Frenzy. It isn't about if you can or can't handle the number of people. It is all about anticipating Murphy's Law and creating new policies for the next con to help prevent a repeat of the last year's "drama"... Measured and controlled numbers is great for managing growth, even WAFF with 450 attendees is doing it. It's the "what to do if an attendee smuggles a seagull into the hotel/con space" that is stressful the first time it happens.
@ItsNotAsh94 exactly my point fur cons somehow have the weirdest dramas and you somehow are only vaguely prepared for them. But the guy lured the gull with a chip and casually picked it up and put it in their jumper pocket. Luckily hotel staff clued in first and took control of the situation. Our directors had a fun talk the next morning with hotel management about it all. Basically came down to "he leaves or the con does", it was the last day of the con and the guy was aware they did the dumb thing.
@SiegeDestroyer Kinda off topic but I notice you mention WAFF. I'm planning to go there next year so hopefully all my plans are all accordingly. Greetings from Singapore btw!
Furry fandom surely does grow rapidly. When I was 15 I didn’t have any furries to meet irl because I live in a small russian town. I am 21 now and we have local furry festivals now, most attendees are minors because furry is still relatively new to russia, but it does grow.
@@philspaws and it will continue to grow, until it hits critical mass. Eventually, someone is going to say "fuck it", and develop full body interfaces specifically for furries. Testing with fursuits and then virtual reality.
I think a thing that’s important to note about capping attendance is fire codes. We’ve reached the point where either the convention sets a limit or the fire marshal enforces one
Or the strength of some floors. Have some people never seen clips of parties that are too big and the floor collapsing? Enforcing a limit isn't always meant to just cap attendance to keep it from getting out of hand. Sometimes it can be for the safety of everyone (and the buildings)
I'd rather an event cap attendance than not be able to enforce rules across con space because there's just too many people for con security to keep up with. There are loads of smaller cons that are great events. So not really the end of the world if you cant go to AC with all your buddies. Pick another con to go with your friends and do that instead. Show some love to other events
Good idea, but it’s gonna be hell to pitch it, especially since so many people go to specific conventions because those are the only ones the artists they enjoy go to.
@@masterofwriters4176 Yes that's also true. Additionally, proximity is a factor too. Not everyone can afford to travel for a con, and thus might be restricted to just one convention option that just happens to be in their region.
@@3of6mylove THIS! Anthrocon IS my local con 😭 I definitely think attendance cap is a great idea tho I've just decided to wear my suit to any con where people cosplay or dress up and accept that's probably the best I'm getting for now
@@Memer88175 I guess just try to get tickets as early as possible. As long as they don't do like the airlines, and actively overbook attendees, in which case... We have been forsaken. I've actually never been so I don't know if it is a ticket system, but I imagine it is?
Maybe they should either: A) make it possible to register for the one right after at a bigger discount B) after the cap is reached, ask if they want to register for the one after C) like B but with a lottery system where the person gets either the recent or following con D) increase the frequency of the con E) restrictions on frequency of registration with an exception for locals F) any combination of the above
The way you oh so calmly talked about it immediately just stopped me from panicking about the con because for the past few days I think the only thing that has been going through my head is "I'll never be able to go there ever!?"
Just hard cap events. People also need to realize that you don't need to go to everything ever. I went to FurDU in April, it was capped at 1200 and it was fantastic because of it. No hotel issues, no parking issues, no public area issues.
I genuinely think this is the way to go for most con oriented events, I think con organisers should start implementing certain capacity limits depending on past cons experiences, issues and what the staff can reasonably handle without it driving them bonkers. I feel this would also increase the drive for more furs to start doing more regional conventions too rather than big ones in certain areas of the country, which I see as a good thing
A con I help organize is projecting to at least double in size next year. Keeping up is a massive challenge: more tech, more policies, more liaising with venues and local businesses. There's no good solution to this problem. I'm overjoyed at how many furries we get to make happy for a weekend. I only wish we could keep up. Please volunteer at your nearest convention. We always need more sets of paws.
I'm an ex-security I see massive issue with con check in's. Bag's laying about and a whole host of issue for the safety of furry s and the public. This needs to be addressed fast.
I hope furry cons don't get as big as ComicCons, considering how many corporate sponsors, advertisers, and such are involved in those larger media-based cons. I really don't want furry to have to bow to corporate sponsors on that level. I want furry community to have full control over our own space and having a smaller attendance than those is much more manageable for staff, and frankly better for keeping it a community in the first place. Having been to fur cons of varying size, and comic cons and large anime cons, the feel of furry cons is definitely what I prefer. (Personally, something like DragonCon for example scares me)
It probably won't be like that, but what we definitely need is more regional cons to kinda compete and show they are worth attending over Anthrocon. My Anthrocon experience this year was kinda awful, and I enjoyed TFF and Megaplex way more, but the reason I went there is because too many of my friends only want to go to Anthrocon. Not every fur should have to only go to Pittsburg just to have fun.
Whats odd about the negative response to the attendance cap is its mainly done for safety. A lot of attendees over the last 5 years have cared a lot about "safety," but apparently not this kind of safety. Makes ya think.
I don't think that the people arguing for safety are always the same as the people arguing against the member cap. I'm for safety and I can see the sense in a member cap.
@ I just imagine a scenario where if a convention was to not have a cap, and they were over safety capacity, then things would get ugly fast. You’d have attendees who paid for and are wearing a badge, still getting denied into the convention space because its legally at capacity. I’d imagine that would result in a fuckton of complaints
Staff at multiple cons here: It is an overwhelming nightmare. next to no one understands how hard these events are to not only run, but run legally and well. and then the masses get so mad at things they don't understand and we have no control over. xD But also. 100% This is why so many of us are starting up new cons, aiming specifically to be smaller and focus on attendees more and a community instead of trying to be massive... but yeah. I have... so much shit I could say about the nightmare scape of running cons haha
always more staff, more venue agreements, more security, more medical, more radios, and then people call you out of touch and overpriced when you enforce attendance limits because it's literally illegal to cram more people in
Limited registration spots is not a strange concept for us here in Australia, FurDU has always only offered a limited number of registrations every year to keep things manageable, you just have to be quick when registration opens up, it's like buying tickets for a concert, there's only so many seats in a stadium to be filled.
MCFC has been growing so fast, to the point I haven't been able to go the past two years, and will miss next year's as well. The hotel goes SO fast (this year in under 3 minutes!!) and if my group can't get a room then we aren't going, my fursuiter buds don't want to have to drive or get an uber to the main hotel while in fursuit and they won't go to any furcon if they can't suit. I'm glad they're doing well as a con, but it sucks that due to the hotel situation it's impossible for me to really go to my favorite con anymore.
Absolutely give smaller cons a chance! As a furry and a cosplayer, I've been to many cons at this point, and the smaller ones are hands down the best experiences I've had! Yeah, it's fun to attend the bigger ones every now and then too, but I def prefer smaller ones. Went to my very first furry con this summer, a national one here in Denmark called Furtastic. It's so small and intimate, it's more like a furry camping trip, than a con - and I will forever cherish the memories and friendships I made there. It is some of the best times I've ever had.
Anime Central, a con held at the same convention center as MFF had over 35,000 attendees this year, and my friend says it went really smoothly. I wonder what's different about anime and comic cons that allow them to run smoothly with so many attendees and if fur cons can emulate it in the future
That's what I was wondering. They're quoting numbers that A-Kon in Dallas was doing in 2008. There was some sponsorship, but nowhere as much as they are now.
This reminds me of a local (free) music festival that we have at a park that originally had like 5k or something back in 91 but has grown over 40k as of late
honestly it’s good that they’re capping events, because imagine there’s an emergency and suddenly you have to get 15k people out of the building and most of those people are in fursuits that take up the space of 2-3 non-suiters, are heavy, and have limited mobility, vision, and hearing. that’s a nightmare waiting to happen.
i had gone to AC from 2006-2011, when the attendance was just getting past 3000 (the biggest fur con at the time), and it was great. Then i took an extended break from cons till 2023, at which point i attended Furpoc, which was just under 3000, and it was great.
I have only 3 under my belt. 03, 07, and 08. and by 08, the security guests for AC, the Dorsai Irregulars, were already having trouble. and that was when, if I remember right, it was barely a FIFTH of modern attendance. what kills ME is that some of the smaller cities and a couple bigger 'towns' here in PA could actually not only hold some smaller cons...they could use the money! where I work has 6 or 8 hotels and a full blown resort, and more small restaurants than you can shake a stick at. and a lot of it is actually WALKABLE!
This isn't just a problem with furry events, but fan conventions in general. Attendance records are so massive now that even trying to find a hotel within a reasonable distance from the event is next to impossible. SDCC has a lottery system for their registration that sells out within minutes and there is talk that Dragon Con might institute a cap after it attracted some 80,000 people this past year.
And for a lot of you asking, the answer to the staff question is money. Staffers aren't paid, they do it because they love furry. But to get more staff, extra help for maintaining rules across con space, might require compensation in the future, and cons are usually non profit, which means you can't legally pay people unless it's coming from your own pocket
I wish there were more small furry conventions in general. I think the big ones are getting so big because there just aren't that many options, especially in the very center of the country, for smaller cons. Like for me, MFF is the closest furry con, yet it's still 7 hours away from me. I would love for there to be more options out there!
It's true. but also because the big ones have set a president on how "All cons should be" it's so much harder for large meetups to bridge the gap into a small con, because large cons are actively gatekeeping the ability and it's kinda wild :P
The first time that I attended AnthroCon back in 2004, the entire event fit into a single medium sized hotel with a secondary smaller one next door to handle overflow. It was small, social, cozy, with few if any actual events on the docket. There was the main lobby, a side room for the "Zoo", three ballrooms for events and dancing, and that was about it. Last time I went, it was impossible to get into the opening ceremony unless you shelled out $200 for a VIP registration, there were so many events happening at exactly the same times that I had to miss some to go to others, and, generally, it just felt too crowded. Let's also add the fact that the accommodations of at least eight huge hotels are being overflowed. It's gone from being a fun, friendly social event with like-minded friends to an overwhelming, stressful, and hardly fun whirlwind of chaos.
I am pretty glad that we are far away from capacity issues with Eurofurence, at least legally. The new venue can take like 18k People. Exploding from around 3.500 to 5.200 atemdees this year definitly messed a lot of thi gs up with organizing the event. Popular panels getting completely overfilled, supplies running out mid con, just general disorganisation adding to the mix, yeah organizing larger and larger cons with just volunteer staff is getting hard. Can't imagine how much goes on behind the scenes at huge US cons.
They are at least starting to adjust to their new location, but it is definitely still understandably messy. I absolutely love Eurofurence, it was my first big convention both as an attendee and a dealer, but they're definitely (understandably) struggling with the organisational side of things.
@TaniDraws Oh yeah, organizing is a struggle. Sadly couldn't attend this year, but heard from friends and some staff how nobody ever planned for this size in 2024 (internal plans were 4k, max 4,5 k if lucky) and it caused some issues in trying to plan around that. I am sure things will get figured out, but it might take a bit (as is the nature with any larger volunteer run con).
I remember my first Anthrocon had a little over 600 attendees. My last MFF was in 2014 when the chlorine gas attack happened. That year, at the time, was the second largest attendance for a furry con at 4,600. 🤷♂️
*Repost from Finn the Panther channel* Unpopular opinion, no matter how much the cons are trying to fix and improve without any support, it won't work and it will eventually burst. The staff and registering are the most common problem in the furry cons and we are now seeing a peak very soon. We all saw what happened to MFF and Anthrocon. Imagine that but 5 years from now. Not to mention the pricing. I know this fandom aggresively HATES sponsorship and companies involved but eventually, they had to. I hate to say it but it's true. I went to anime cons that has over 100k attendees and that has already cause a problem. Imagine that with furcons?
This will be my first year attending Anthrocon! Its one of the closest cons to me, and I’ve wanted to go since being in the fandom since I was a kid. You’ve gotta think that next year everyone born in 2007 will be an adult. Theres this massive group of furries who have just hit their 20s, maybe are going into college or entering the workforce, that are all now finally able to attend a con that we’ve all been seeing online in the fandom since we were kids. It’s been held in the same convention center since I was three.
Honestly I take this as a reminder that cons aren't the only way to have fun and be active in the furry community, yes they're a huge part, but if you aren't able to go to a con there's always meet ups and outings you can go to, there's always more opportunities to go to cons in the future! And if you're unable to attend a huge con because of the registration limit there are always smaller slight cheaper cons to go to! You can always make new friends and experiences without going to a huge con❤
They need more staff, and more professional help with the conventions, so that they can handle more people. I mean like look at some comic-cons for example, they just don't have a few people working for the con, no... they got like hundreds of employees, so that they can handle tons of people... also the U.S.A. is going through inflation like on a constant basis, its also fluctuating too.. hotels, food, beverages, merchandise, is all gonna get more expensive.. all we got to do is lookout for the future of the furry fandom now.
It's always interesting to see how large the fandom has become, I've got a few furry magazines from the early '90s and it's interesting to flip through and find some classified sections or seeing the very limited print runs. I'm sure within a few years these conventions are going to be insanely huge.
In my country (France) our biggest convention is just about to reach 1000 attendees, so it's funny to see American being like "What, how can it be a con if there is less than 10k people" X)
I just went to furpoc and the staff there were really kind, especially the bartenders. I think even just the code of conduct discussion needs to be had with the Fandom/participants. I watched furries not tip or tip just enough to roundup the bill’s total. I saw others leave behind messes at the bar & some even stole the bar’s menus that had the Con Special Cocktails printed on them. I honestly think we can do better as a community. ❤
I went to Confuzzled, in the UK this year. The convention maxed out the fire safety limit for the number of people allowed inside the building, and it's a growing con too. I'm skipping out on 2025 for a few different reasons, and ngl, the abundance of furs going, while it is absolutely awesome, is sorta becoming a bit much. This isn't gonna stop me going to conventions, it just means I'm gonna look for smaller, perhaps more local ones
The size of Anthrocon is amazing but size needs to limited for reasons beyond feasibility. Fire code has a huge and final say. The convention does not have an infinite capacity. From what I have heard the DLCC itself has a MAXIMUM capacity of 22,000.... that being the case Anthrocon is pretty much at the capacity that is sustainable for the location itself.
I've never gone to any of the large cons. It's far too expensive, too much travel, too much time off of work. Small cons have been the highlight of my years for like 6 years straight.
12:30 Yesss! All throughout watching this video I was thinking about how you guys covered the same topic. A collab video between you two would be so cool.
Fur-Eh in Canada was pretty overwhelmed this year as well we broke several ACs in the building and caused a couple floods from them overworking lol Best thing is it flooded in the 'Ocean' labeled area in the dealers den hahaha
I couldn’t imagine going to a fur con with that many people. I’m in the uk and went to a new convention called pawsome. Around 300 people and I loved it.
Been watching the Furry community grow from the Brony community side, and while I attended the biggest Brony conventions ever, it's nice to just attend a 1k attendee con now and chill with friends. I think that's what a lot of people want at the end of the day, but everyone ends up circling around individual events. "Oh well (X) person and (X) person are going so we gotta go too to see them! And that cons gonna be an even bigger party! We gotta go!" And it just compounds from there. And you guys need those personal connections. We have a piece of media it all comes back to, you guys have each other. Which is great! I really am happy to see your community grow so large. But I see some longer time members wishing it was smaller. Cursed with success? Seems like it depending on your perspective. It's never been a better time to just try and make external plans and trips with people. My favorite Brony community event is a long weekend with 20-40 people in the mountains every year (and even that place has a super fast growing furry con now lmao). I'd appreciate some responses so I can hear some personal takes. Thanks!
Appendix. When my group of 40 timed our event to be at the same time as the furry event, they also had about 40-60. This was 2021. In 2024 they had 553. I had no idea it grew to that size so fast, that's insane... and almost scary lmao.
I've been in this mess since 99 and somehow managed to attend my first convention in 24, and of course it as a matter of coincidence happened to be Anthrocon. I guess I had the hand of fortune on my shoulder, had a smooth day one experience getting my badge in round about an hour even my initial spot in line was all the way in the back alley behind the building. I happened to get in line pretty much as soon as it started moving. I really didn't realize anything extraordinary or problematic was going on until after the fact and talking to other attendees who were there for HOURS. Wow wee.
5:28 im wondering if the Chairman and other high ranking staff members of Anthrocon haves online meetings rn and they’re probably talking about how their gonna handle over 20k ppl since Anthrocon is growing rapidly rn, maybe it’s that? Idk.. ,-,
Having been attending furry cons since 1993, and having been staff at Anthrocon back in 2012-15, I've seen a slow steady growth of con attendees until recently where everyone needs to go to every con. Even 10 years ago, we were desperately in need of a professional, paid staff and for some reason the furry community really just went with 'we can keep doing this with volunteers'. But, that's not just something furry is guilty of, having also been staff for MAGfest, it's the understanding needed to say 'we're too big to run it the same way now' that seems to be missing.
I go to two furry cons a year: Anthrocon and Fursonacon. Anthrocon is the big one that I enjoy for it's celebration of all things furry. Fursonacon is my small local one that has such great vibes and is incredibly fun.
As a yinzer furry, it’s becoming increasingly hard even for us locals to get hotels. To the point where we have to start thinking about commuting. I miss the years of 9k
I just wish furcons would actually have paid staff, and people that actually know things logistically. From the ones I've seen, they have almost 0 staff and very few volunteers and it shows. Comicons do well because they have paid staff.
Don't get me wrong I understand why people want to go to AC so bad, I went to AC three times in a row (2022, 2023, 2024) and next year as well. However next year would probably be the last time I go for a while, AC is great and all but there's so many other cons that I pushed to the side for AC that I never went to but want to experience (FWA, MFF, FURPOC, ANE and etc). Will definitely return to AC in the future when I get the chance but after next year I won't attend for a while.
I went to a con with a reg limit and reg lottery. One of my friends did not get in, which was sad, but honestly having a reg limit makes a TON of sense from a logistics standpoint. Furry cons were never really designed to be The One True Con! Find your smaller, local cons. Engage in your local furry communities, whether that be established cons or small furmeets. Smaller, more dispersed cons help organizers by saving money on venues and volunteer time, they help attendees by making it easier to get into the talks and panels you want to go to, and they help the local communities around the con, both in not overwhelming the town's resources and in helping members of the local furry communities make friends that they can continue to hang out with year-round. Some of my closest friends in the fandom are people I met at random during a furry theme park day for the local community. Some of my other closest fandom friends are people I met at a very very small convention, where we had enough breathing room to really get to know each other.
With 15k people in one area, not counting everyone else that is unaccounted for outside of the convention, the cons would need to contract with either private security or contact local law enforcement for the weekend. When I had the badge any extra money from a side security gig is always great be it a church or public event for a day or even a weekend. There's probably some officers that would be more than happy to provide security service at a furry con.
for me anthrocon is the only close convention I can find. I would be happy to go to a smaller con if I didn't have to drive way further for it. I kinda wish some other folks would support their local cons so that there is space for those of us who ARE local to pennsylvania. Right now im considering driving 7 hours to Anthrohio because I'm not sure if I'll be able to get a ticket for anthrocon.
I haven't been to a proper furry con, only local events like MAW and Furvine (meets in the SoCal area). And even these events get HUGELY populated by local furs. I can only imagine how all of this must be so much more hectic on a larger scale
Joining the fandom in 2005 when my partner introduced me to conventions, we went to the more local ones but stopped going around 2010. After the pandemic, we decided to hit the biggies and attended MFF, AC, FWA, TFF and BLFC in addition to our usual FC. At most of the larger conventions, the wait for the elevators was a big annoyance with the hotel and con staff making some odd choices about how to queue. AC had some rules that stifled creativity in order to be "family friendly" and while I agree some attendees outfits are a bit risque, they went too far in my opinion and I will not go back. For now, we volunteer for our more local cons and I'm quite happy to be able to help.
As an aussie fur our biggest con, FurDU (Furry Down Under), has an attendance cap and prereg too. When tickets opened we just had to confirm our spot and the con sold out in 30 minutes but it was better than last year selling in under 10 without prereg. Ut was an attendance if 1421 this year but the con space isnt very big
OMG, I love the Click! 😂 I was a furry long before his channel (since 2013), but I wouldn't be surprised if he had some influence in encouraging new furs.
@@ThePsychicClarinetist I for one was introduced to the community by him (his yiffinhell videos actually), already had interest in anthro (human thought/intellect; like animox, woodwalkers etc.) before though.
@@Aras14 Awesome. Welcome, fellow fur! 😁 I've been there with having the interest beforehand. I grew up watching Disney and Dreamworks films and playing Spyro and Kingdom Hearts, and lived with dogs and cats from a young age. Only found out what a furry was at 12 and that's when I gave myself the label because it already applied. 😂
I can see a registration cap having one fatal flaw, which would be if you get in, but the friend you were going to meet didn't. And if meeting that friend was the only reason you had to go to the con, what's the point in going? So either a lot of people will unregister, if that's a thing, because their friends couldn't get in, or, they'll be registered and taking up a spot, but just not go.
Vancoufur last year doubled its attendees from 1k to 2k people. We have now upgraded our con space from the Sharaton ( a small hotel ) to the Richmond convention center. We are BEYOND excited but also overwhelmed by the immense uptick in attendees
They only have so much space to hold such a large con, that they have to think of safety. maybe because ive been to countless cons both large and small, a variety of fandoms but limited badges/tickets is completely normal. I went to MAGFest 2024 and they had completely sold out Saturday, I believe around 20k attendees were there. its…. normal
There was a time in which BLFC was in the same tier as fwa, ac and mff. Then mff and fwa skyrocketed in attendance while blfc started its decline, The causes? Maybe the distance from the other three cons and the pizza stuff
If someone has a con that they absolutely want to go to and it has an attendee cap, they need to set alarms, sign up for email alerts, use the resources at their disposal and if it’s one they don’t want to miss then buy the tickets the day of!
I feel like it would also help to make more cons so we can spread things out more. Mostly to help prevent tons and tons of people from being packed into one place but also to help give as many people we can a better opportunity at going to a con especially if one is close by to where you live.
unfortunatly for me the closest cons are either in Canada or anthrocon lol, at least the ones that I could find. I live in NY so its the best I can think of.
Idk man I think the solution for this problem is rlly simple. Just go to local cons. Saves time, saves money, and proves there's a market for you in your area. In my experience, my local con is fantastically run, and so is yours. And if it ain't? Well at least you didn't drop a few thousand to be there.
Another thing that I don't think was mentioned: Even if you can't attend Anthrocon or MFF or another large con is that you can still go have fun in the city they're in! Anthrocon is unique in that it's massive AND it takes place in the downtown of the host city. This gives the advantage of allowing you to easily explore Pittsburgh right nearby when the hall is too crowded or if you want to do something else. MFF takes place at a hotel on the edge of an airport... they should really move to downtown Chicago to McCormick Place. Oh and another thing: When you attend Anthrocon PLEASE explore more neighborhoods of Pittsburgh than just downtown, and The Strip, we have so many other neat places that are easy to get to by bus or light rail. Currently it's $2.75 to get a 3 hour pass that is good for all busses and the light rail and an all day pass is $7.
I was buying an Ultra for AC25 this year... And as I wanted to pay, site went down cause everyone needed to buy THEN... when it went back up, I had lost my spot and lost the Ultra. :(
@@Useless_Science I'm from Europe, it is the only convention I go to, for friends and vacation. So the Ultra (whilst expensive) allows so much less stress. To see it just fly through my hands like that hurt. I send a message to the con staff... Their reply was... Well.... I wouldn't post it here.
my idea of a solution: 15k limit for 2025, see how that runs, if it runs well, 17.5k for 2026, see how that runs, if it runs well, 20k for 2027, so on so forth once they hit a number they cant accommodate, they see their limits and know where to either improve or put limits on another idea: make a google form/registration form where you just show interest in the con, and they can gauge how big the con is gonna be, and if theres too many, they open registration with a limit, the limit i said before
Smaller cons are always the best. Denfur is my local con and I love going to it every year! It’s the perfect size and I just love seeing familiar faces every year!
I said on December 31st 2019 that by the end of 2030 there will be a professional fur con that is ran at least four times a year. This is definitely pointing in the direction that will come to be.
something they could do is have some cons at seperate times if theyre able to for example having a winter and spring one it could really aid in keeping numbers slightly down
I also plan on going to denfur and TFF at some point . I plan on waiting to go to anthrocon, because well im not gonna go to THAT BIG of a furry convention for my first one. Imma try to start small and work my way up. Amd well MFF is one of the smaller of thr big three.
I've been going to non-furry cons for a few years now, personally I like the intimacy of smaller cons way more than the massive ones even though I usually still go to see friends that came from out of town. Usually I advocate for hanging out outside of the con anyway because it's just so much chaos
i'm gonna be heartbroken when my native pittsburgh loses anthro but its inevitable at this point. the attendance is already about twice what the local infra can handle, and it's still growing. LineCon is a fun meme but it's a shitty weekend.
I'd rather them cap it. My local furry con the past 2 years grew too much and put the hotel way above its capacity. It was hot, crammed tight, and not to mention, very very unsafe. Its not fun, its much better that they want to be responsible instead of focusing on making ticket sales.
FWA has grown so much. My first year attending there was less than 800 people and it was chill. Now it's big and chaotic. Still fun but I'm getting too old for chaos. 😆
Furry convention: "COME JOIN US IN MERRIMENT!" **A LOT OF PEOPLE JOIN** Furry Convention: "FUCK, WE HAVE TOO MANY ATTENDEES! IF SOMEONE FARTS IN FORMATION, MAKE THEM TEMPORARY STAFF!"
@@Useless_Science Yup. A reference to mikeburnfire's video: Promotion points. "We have too many small arms repairmen, make the promotion points impossible!" then everyone left the weapon repair workshop and the military Zach was a part of are like: "HOLY CRAP! WE HAVE TOO FEW SMALL ARMS REPAIRMEN, IF SOMEONE FARTS IN FORMATION, PROMOTE THEM IMMEDIATELY!". If I remember... You had to pass... small arms qualification, grenade qualification, ordinance qualification, rifle qualification, small arms qualification (AGAIN)... basically at the time of Zachs employ? His employers made it impossible to get promoted (despite him being the only small arms repairman like 24/7), and apparently freakin' artillery counted as "small arms".
sounds about right, my local largest con has a cap of about 2000 people and when the site opened, the site crashed and it was on a cloudflare server, so a con this big would easily have the site crash
MFF2022 was my first fur-con and the very "friends" who invited me along were emotionally abusive toward me almost immediately upon arrival. When confronted about their bullying they didn't deny it, and clearly said to me "You did nothing wrong." yet had no explanation for their behavior. Two years later I'm still coping with PTSD and trust issues.
Howdy! I've been to cons from FurFright 2011 to Anthrocon 2023. I've been to cons for over a decade so hear me out. Beta's *completely* right. My experience in Anthrocon 2015 vs 2023 is quite the sharp contrast. To pick on AC a bit: people forget that the con affects more than just the convention center. In 2015: There was nowhere I couldn't eat, no event I couldn't attend, and I registered *late* and could *still* get a hotel room. It was busy, sure. But it wasn't overwhelming. I could always find someone whether it be by coordination or by pure chance. In 2023: Most places to eat had lines out the door (hell I had to walk several blocks to find someplace that wasn't overwhelmed), I registered a year in advance and only got a room because one of my roomies won the lottery. Some of my friends had to pack in with locals who were sometimes on the other side of town. Coordination was a mess due to the crowds. I'm *still* finding out people I missed out on seeing because I had no clue they were even there. It wasn't *fun.* It was noisy, cramped, and chaotic.
I think Megaplex has a good chance to keep growing to those sizes especially since there is a chance as well that they will be able to get the Orange County Convention center if it gets big enough. Or so I had heard.
I guess my fear about it, is that I’m generally local to AC. I only get to go to a couple local cons a year, due to how much I make a year. However, I don’t have Twitter. (Couldn’t download it if I wanted to, cause I don’t have the space on my phone and I don’t have a computer rn either.) What if I’m working and they announce it and then I can even go to the convention in my own city, because pre-reg was pounced on and capped out within 15-minutes. I get why they do it, but it still sucks. I suppose that means smaller events will pop up more, though. Guess I wouldn’t mind so much, so long as they are still local and I get to hangout with friends.
CorgiBeans here. So funny enough, I had always wanted to stay at the Hilton connected to MFF and I decided literally a month after MFF 2023 that I was going to book a room in the hilton. I think for 5 nights it came to a little shy of 2,000. Absolutely insane but I wanted it. Being a dealer and not being connected to the con space is kind of a pain and I dont like the cold all that much but yeah I wish they wouldnt price gouge even 11 months until the next con. I would never pay the price it has inflated to now. Dealers almost fully get a guaranteed room but it is at the crowne plaza and that is pretty far from the connected walk ways but if I am fortunate enough to vend in 2025 I think I will go back to the Crowne Plaza to save some money
The fandom need to start realizing that, if you want to have a 25,000 fur cons, we need a professional, paid staff to run them. You cannot realistically expect what is essentially a full-time job at that level to be done by unpaid staff and volunteers.
This! Lots of other cons have paid staff.
Yeah.
Indeed, the last thing we need is chaos causing a con or multiple cons to get blacklisted. If it in one hotel, they’ll tell all the others, then trolls could just tell even more hotels until they can‘t host it in the entire country.
I will say, they probably need more reliable ways to make money
@ charity is charity. I’d prefer the cons get funded by charity and passion, instead of a for-profit corporation that could easily get corrupted and set up exclusivity deals in big venues.
I can't imagine how stressful it is to run and manage a furry convention where *you don't know if you can handle that many people*.
I help out at WAFF, West Australian Fur Frenzy.
It isn't about if you can or can't handle the number of people. It is all about anticipating Murphy's Law and creating new policies for the next con to help prevent a repeat of the last year's "drama"...
Measured and controlled numbers is great for managing growth, even WAFF with 450 attendees is doing it. It's the "what to do if an attendee smuggles a seagull into the hotel/con space" that is stressful the first time it happens.
@@SiegeDestroyerwait someone smuggled a seagull into the con? How the hell do you even go about doing that 😅
@ItsNotAsh94 exactly my point fur cons somehow have the weirdest dramas and you somehow are only vaguely prepared for them.
But the guy lured the gull with a chip and casually picked it up and put it in their jumper pocket. Luckily hotel staff clued in first and took control of the situation. Our directors had a fun talk the next morning with hotel management about it all. Basically came down to "he leaves or the con does", it was the last day of the con and the guy was aware they did the dumb thing.
@SiegeDestroyer Kinda off topic but I notice you mention WAFF. I'm planning to go there next year so hopefully all my plans are all accordingly. Greetings from Singapore btw!
@LightBluly yaasss. I am excited for next year's WAFF. Hope to see you there!
Suffering from success:
Furry culture is becoming more popular meaning we need to be prepared to expand
Like how foxes are always prepared to expand.
@@bcaikouwu
To learn more on how to expand the furry culture, look up furry inflation.
@@bcaiko ☹☹☹☹
oh no
Furry fandom surely does grow rapidly. When I was 15 I didn’t have any furries to meet irl because I live in a small russian town. I am 21 now and we have local furry festivals now, most attendees are minors because furry is still relatively new to russia, but it does grow.
Its so cool to see how our fandom starts to grow now)
I hope, someday rusfurence or another con will accept more than a thousand furries, will watch!)
@@philspaws Выл, фурриз ар нау кансидорд экстремистами бай Рашон говырнмынт, ыспэшолы доуз ху донт былив ын срэщел мылытри опырейшон
Despite the growth I'm still convinced I'm the only furry within a 300 mile radius where I am. Actual ghost town
Yoooo what town? How are the festivals? I'm in SPB an have been thinking of visiting a fur event for quite a while now
@@philspaws and it will continue to grow, until it hits critical mass. Eventually, someone is going to say "fuck it", and develop full body interfaces specifically for furries. Testing with fursuits and then virtual reality.
I think a thing that’s important to note about capping attendance is fire codes. We’ve reached the point where either the convention sets a limit or the fire marshal enforces one
Or the strength of some floors. Have some people never seen clips of parties that are too big and the floor collapsing? Enforcing a limit isn't always meant to just cap attendance to keep it from getting out of hand. Sometimes it can be for the safety of everyone (and the buildings)
Correct. Huge conventions like Megacon have to deal with that and rent out only the biggest spaces in order to function safely.
@@kayumdoesstuff +1 on the floor strength thing. You fould FEEL the floor flexing at FWA this year during TLT's set.
I'd rather an event cap attendance than not be able to enforce rules across con space because there's just too many people for con security to keep up with. There are loads of smaller cons that are great events. So not really the end of the world if you cant go to AC with all your buddies. Pick another con to go with your friends and do that instead. Show some love to other events
Good idea, but it’s gonna be hell to pitch it, especially since so many people go to specific conventions because those are the only ones the artists they enjoy go to.
@@masterofwriters4176 Yes that's also true. Additionally, proximity is a factor too. Not everyone can afford to travel for a con, and thus might be restricted to just one convention option that just happens to be in their region.
@@3of6mylove THIS! Anthrocon IS my local con 😭
I definitely think attendance cap is a great idea tho
I've just decided to wear my suit to any con where people cosplay or dress up and accept that's probably the best I'm getting for now
@@Memer88175 I guess just try to get tickets as early as possible. As long as they don't do like the airlines, and actively overbook attendees, in which case... We have been forsaken. I've actually never been so I don't know if it is a ticket system, but I imagine it is?
Maybe they should either:
A) make it possible to register for the one right after at a bigger discount
B) after the cap is reached, ask if they want to register for the one after
C) like B but with a lottery system where the person gets either the recent or following con
D) increase the frequency of the con
E) restrictions on frequency of registration with an exception for locals
F) any combination of the above
The way you oh so calmly talked about it immediately just stopped me from panicking about the con because for the past few days I think the only thing that has been going through my head is "I'll never be able to go there ever!?"
Just hard cap events. People also need to realize that you don't need to go to everything ever. I went to FurDU in April, it was capped at 1200 and it was fantastic because of it. No hotel issues, no parking issues, no public area issues.
I genuinely think this is the way to go for most con oriented events, I think con organisers should start implementing certain capacity limits depending on past cons experiences, issues and what the staff can reasonably handle without it driving them bonkers.
I feel this would also increase the drive for more furs to start doing more regional conventions too rather than big ones in certain areas of the country, which I see as a good thing
We really need to spread about MFF. MFF needs attendance improvements. MFF is a great con too as Anthrocon
its also hard to get a room for special accommodation
A con I help organize is projecting to at least double in size next year. Keeping up is a massive challenge: more tech, more policies, more liaising with venues and local businesses. There's no good solution to this problem. I'm overjoyed at how many furries we get to make happy for a weekend. I only wish we could keep up. Please volunteer at your nearest convention. We always need more sets of paws.
I would love to volunteer at a convention! Sadly there arent any next year in my country but if there is one comming up i will give it a try!
I'm an ex-security I see massive issue with con check in's. Bag's laying about and a whole host of issue for the safety of furry s and the public. This needs to be addressed fast.
You are my source of furry news now i can't do Twitter anymore
So... Blue Sky.
@@n0etic_f0x ain't nothin there worth seeing for me...not anymore
Yeah bluesky is better than twitter
That's where I'm moving to
Stop dead naming X its called X not Twitter/hj
I hope furry cons don't get as big as ComicCons, considering how many corporate sponsors, advertisers, and such are involved in those larger media-based cons. I really don't want furry to have to bow to corporate sponsors on that level. I want furry community to have full control over our own space and having a smaller attendance than those is much more manageable for staff, and frankly better for keeping it a community in the first place.
Having been to fur cons of varying size, and comic cons and large anime cons, the feel of furry cons is definitely what I prefer. (Personally, something like DragonCon for example scares me)
It probably won't be like that, but what we definitely need is more regional cons to kinda compete and show they are worth attending over Anthrocon. My Anthrocon experience this year was kinda awful, and I enjoyed TFF and Megaplex way more, but the reason I went there is because too many of my friends only want to go to Anthrocon. Not every fur should have to only go to Pittsburg just to have fun.
Imagine if bad dragon attended cons. Cant have that corporate slop there!
Oh wait...
@@Fr0stbit3_ I like how you didn't actually read my post.
@ you don’t want corporations involved but a company that makes dragon dicks is a-ok 👌
Whats odd about the negative response to the attendance cap is its mainly done for safety. A lot of attendees over the last 5 years have cared a lot about "safety," but apparently not this kind of safety.
Makes ya think.
I don't think that the people arguing for safety are always the same as the people arguing against the member cap. I'm for safety and I can see the sense in a member cap.
@ I just imagine a scenario where if a convention was to not have a cap, and they were over safety capacity, then things would get ugly fast. You’d have attendees who paid for and are wearing a badge, still getting denied into the convention space because its legally at capacity. I’d imagine that would result in a fuckton of complaints
Staff at multiple cons here: It is an overwhelming nightmare. next to no one understands how hard these events are to not only run, but run legally and well. and then the masses get so mad at things they don't understand and we have no control over. xD But also. 100% This is why so many of us are starting up new cons, aiming specifically to be smaller and focus on attendees more and a community instead of trying to be massive... but yeah. I have... so much shit I could say about the nightmare scape of running cons haha
always more staff, more venue agreements, more security, more medical, more radios, and then people call you out of touch and overpriced when you enforce attendance limits because it's literally illegal to cram more people in
Limited registration spots is not a strange concept for us here in Australia, FurDU has always only offered a limited number of registrations every year to keep things manageable, you just have to be quick when registration opens up, it's like buying tickets for a concert, there's only so many seats in a stadium to be filled.
MCFC has been growing so fast, to the point I haven't been able to go the past two years, and will miss next year's as well. The hotel goes SO fast (this year in under 3 minutes!!) and if my group can't get a room then we aren't going, my fursuiter buds don't want to have to drive or get an uber to the main hotel while in fursuit and they won't go to any furcon if they can't suit.
I'm glad they're doing well as a con, but it sucks that due to the hotel situation it's impossible for me to really go to my favorite con anymore.
Absolutely give smaller cons a chance!
As a furry and a cosplayer, I've been to many cons at this point, and the smaller ones are hands down the best experiences I've had! Yeah, it's fun to attend the bigger ones every now and then too, but I def prefer smaller ones. Went to my very first furry con this summer, a national one here in Denmark called Furtastic. It's so small and intimate, it's more like a furry camping trip, than a con - and I will forever cherish the memories and friendships I made there. It is some of the best times I've ever had.
Anime Central, a con held at the same convention center as MFF had over 35,000 attendees this year, and my friend says it went really smoothly. I wonder what's different about anime and comic cons that allow them to run smoothly with so many attendees and if fur cons can emulate it in the future
Money.
@ can you elaborate?
Paid and larger staff numbers most likely.
@ yeah. Unfortunately, that's going to be hard for fur cons to figure out
That's what I was wondering. They're quoting numbers that A-Kon in Dallas was doing in 2008. There was some sponsorship, but nowhere as much as they are now.
This reminds me of a local (free) music festival that we have at a park that originally had like 5k or something back in 91 but has grown over 40k as of late
honestly it’s good that they’re capping events, because imagine there’s an emergency and suddenly you have to get 15k people out of the building and most of those people are in fursuits that take up the space of 2-3 non-suiters, are heavy, and have limited mobility, vision, and hearing. that’s a nightmare waiting to happen.
i had gone to AC from 2006-2011, when the attendance was just getting past 3000 (the biggest fur con at the time), and it was great.
Then i took an extended break from cons till 2023, at which point i attended Furpoc, which was just under 3000, and it was great.
I have only 3 under my belt. 03, 07, and 08. and by 08, the security guests for AC, the Dorsai Irregulars, were already having trouble. and that was when, if I remember right, it was barely a FIFTH of modern attendance. what kills ME is that some of the smaller cities and a couple bigger 'towns' here in PA could actually not only hold some smaller cons...they could use the money! where I work has 6 or 8 hotels and a full blown resort, and more small restaurants than you can shake a stick at. and a lot of it is actually WALKABLE!
This isn't just a problem with furry events, but fan conventions in general. Attendance records are so massive now that even trying to find a hotel within a reasonable distance from the event is next to impossible. SDCC has a lottery system for their registration that sells out within minutes and there is talk that Dragon Con might institute a cap after it attracted some 80,000 people this past year.
And for a lot of you asking, the answer to the staff question is money. Staffers aren't paid, they do it because they love furry. But to get more staff, extra help for maintaining rules across con space, might require compensation in the future, and cons are usually non profit, which means you can't legally pay people unless it's coming from your own pocket
I wish there were more small furry conventions in general. I think the big ones are getting so big because there just aren't that many options, especially in the very center of the country, for smaller cons. Like for me, MFF is the closest furry con, yet it's still 7 hours away from me. I would love for there to be more options out there!
It's true. but also because the big ones have set a president on how "All cons should be" it's so much harder for large meetups to bridge the gap into a small con, because large cons are actively gatekeeping the ability and it's kinda wild :P
The first time that I attended AnthroCon back in 2004, the entire event fit into a single medium sized hotel with a secondary smaller one next door to handle overflow. It was small, social, cozy, with few if any actual events on the docket. There was the main lobby, a side room for the "Zoo", three ballrooms for events and dancing, and that was about it. Last time I went, it was impossible to get into the opening ceremony unless you shelled out $200 for a VIP registration, there were so many events happening at exactly the same times that I had to miss some to go to others, and, generally, it just felt too crowded. Let's also add the fact that the accommodations of at least eight huge hotels are being overflowed. It's gone from being a fun, friendly social event with like-minded friends to an overwhelming, stressful, and hardly fun whirlwind of chaos.
I am pretty glad that we are far away from capacity issues with Eurofurence, at least legally. The new venue can take like 18k People.
Exploding from around 3.500 to 5.200 atemdees this year definitly messed a lot of thi gs up with organizing the event.
Popular panels getting completely overfilled, supplies running out mid con, just general disorganisation adding to the mix, yeah organizing larger and larger cons with just volunteer staff is getting hard.
Can't imagine how much goes on behind the scenes at huge US cons.
They are at least starting to adjust to their new location, but it is definitely still understandably messy. I absolutely love Eurofurence, it was my first big convention both as an attendee and a dealer, but they're definitely (understandably) struggling with the organisational side of things.
@TaniDraws Oh yeah, organizing is a struggle.
Sadly couldn't attend this year, but heard from friends and some staff how nobody ever planned for this size in 2024 (internal plans were 4k, max 4,5 k if lucky) and it caused some issues in trying to plan around that.
I am sure things will get figured out, but it might take a bit (as is the nature with any larger volunteer run con).
I remember my first Anthrocon had a little over 600 attendees.
My last MFF was in 2014 when the chlorine gas attack happened. That year, at the time, was the second largest attendance for a furry con at 4,600.
🤷♂️
*Repost from Finn the Panther channel*
Unpopular opinion, no matter how much the cons are trying to fix and improve without any support, it won't work and it will eventually burst. The staff and registering are the most common problem in the furry cons and we are now seeing a peak very soon. We all saw what happened to MFF and Anthrocon. Imagine that but 5 years from now. Not to mention the pricing.
I know this fandom aggresively HATES sponsorship and companies involved but eventually, they had to. I hate to say it but it's true. I went to anime cons that has over 100k attendees and that has already cause a problem. Imagine that with furcons?
Alot of furries don't handle authority well and many are uncomfortable when a willing sponsorship wants to put up with them. It's ironic.
This will be my first year attending Anthrocon! Its one of the closest cons to me, and I’ve wanted to go since being in the fandom since I was a kid. You’ve gotta think that next year everyone born in 2007 will be an adult. Theres this massive group of furries who have just hit their 20s, maybe are going into college or entering the workforce, that are all now finally able to attend a con that we’ve all been seeing online in the fandom since we were kids. It’s been held in the same convention center since I was three.
Honestly I take this as a reminder that cons aren't the only way to have fun and be active in the furry community, yes they're a huge part, but if you aren't able to go to a con there's always meet ups and outings you can go to, there's always more opportunities to go to cons in the future!
And if you're unable to attend a huge con because of the registration limit there are always smaller slight cheaper cons to go to! You can always make new friends and experiences without going to a huge con❤
They need more staff, and more professional help with the conventions, so that they can handle more people. I mean like look at some comic-cons for example, they just don't have a few people working for the con, no... they got like hundreds of employees, so that they can handle tons of people... also the U.S.A. is going through inflation like on a constant basis, its also fluctuating too.. hotels, food, beverages, merchandise, is all gonna get more expensive.. all we got to do is lookout for the future of the furry fandom now.
It's always interesting to see how large the fandom has become, I've got a few furry magazines from the early '90s and it's interesting to flip through and find some classified sections or seeing the very limited print runs. I'm sure within a few years these conventions are going to be insanely huge.
In my country (France) our biggest convention is just about to reach 1000 attendees, so it's funny to see American being like "What, how can it be a con if there is less than 10k people" X)
Oh same, as a russian fur, and Russia is pretty big - Moscow furry convention usually gets only around 100 attendees
You'll have to excuse us. We're just trying to make MURRica Great Again!
I just went to furpoc and the staff there were really kind, especially the bartenders. I think even just the code of conduct discussion needs to be had with the Fandom/participants. I watched furries not tip or tip just enough to roundup the bill’s total. I saw others leave behind messes at the bar & some even stole the bar’s menus that had the Con Special Cocktails printed on them. I honestly think we can do better as a community. ❤
Lesson learned: Be an asocial intovert who dreads conventions and thus never goes to them
I went to Confuzzled, in the UK this year. The convention maxed out the fire safety limit for the number of people allowed inside the building, and it's a growing con too. I'm skipping out on 2025 for a few different reasons, and ngl, the abundance of furs going, while it is absolutely awesome, is sorta becoming a bit much. This isn't gonna stop me going to conventions, it just means I'm gonna look for smaller, perhaps more local ones
The size of Anthrocon is amazing but size needs to limited for reasons beyond feasibility. Fire code has a huge and final say. The convention does not have an infinite capacity. From what I have heard the DLCC itself has a MAXIMUM capacity of 22,000.... that being the case Anthrocon is pretty much at the capacity that is sustainable for the location itself.
Wonder if the con will be expanded to greater Pittsburgh since it's pushing the limits of the DLLCC
Capping attendance would encourage more cons to be made, and smaller cons to evolve into middle sized cons.
Sounds good to me o3o
oƐo
I've never gone to any of the large cons. It's far too expensive, too much travel, too much time off of work.
Small cons have been the highlight of my years for like 6 years straight.
I hate large conventions. The parking alone is $120+, the rooms are much more expensive, lines are insanely long and elevators are a nightmare.
12:30 Yesss! All throughout watching this video I was thinking about how you guys covered the same topic. A collab video between you two would be so cool.
Fur-Eh in Canada was pretty overwhelmed this year as well we broke several ACs in the building and caused a couple floods from them overworking lol
Best thing is it flooded in the 'Ocean' labeled area in the dealers den hahaha
Oh damnnn lmao maybe it was good I missed it
I couldn’t imagine going to a fur con with that many people. I’m in the uk and went to a new convention called pawsome. Around 300 people and I loved it.
Been watching the Furry community grow from the Brony community side, and while I attended the biggest Brony conventions ever, it's nice to just attend a 1k attendee con now and chill with friends. I think that's what a lot of people want at the end of the day, but everyone ends up circling around individual events. "Oh well (X) person and (X) person are going so we gotta go too to see them! And that cons gonna be an even bigger party! We gotta go!" And it just compounds from there. And you guys need those personal connections. We have a piece of media it all comes back to, you guys have each other. Which is great! I really am happy to see your community grow so large. But I see some longer time members wishing it was smaller. Cursed with success? Seems like it depending on your perspective. It's never been a better time to just try and make external plans and trips with people. My favorite Brony community event is a long weekend with 20-40 people in the mountains every year (and even that place has a super fast growing furry con now lmao). I'd appreciate some responses so I can hear some personal takes. Thanks!
Appendix. When my group of 40 timed our event to be at the same time as the furry event, they also had about 40-60. This was 2021. In 2024 they had 553. I had no idea it grew to that size so fast, that's insane... and almost scary lmao.
I've been in this mess since 99 and somehow managed to attend my first convention in 24, and of course it as a matter of coincidence happened to be Anthrocon. I guess I had the hand of fortune on my shoulder, had a smooth day one experience getting my badge in round about an hour even my initial spot in line was all the way in the back alley behind the building. I happened to get in line pretty much as soon as it started moving. I really didn't realize anything extraordinary or problematic was going on until after the fact and talking to other attendees who were there for HOURS. Wow wee.
5:28 im wondering if the Chairman and other high ranking staff members of Anthrocon haves online meetings rn and they’re probably talking about how their gonna handle over 20k ppl since Anthrocon is growing rapidly rn, maybe it’s that? Idk.. ,-,
They need to ask the comic con people how they handle the business
BetaEtaDelota more like AlphaEtaDelota 😼
(What has posessed me to say this)
@@the_toastedghost idfk.
We have similar profile pics
😎
@@RayTheInsomniac hey that's neat!
erm what the SigmaEtaDelota
Same thing happening at almost every other big convention (in California). Comic-con has a hail mary lottery. It's tough.
Having been attending furry cons since 1993, and having been staff at Anthrocon back in 2012-15, I've seen a slow steady growth of con attendees until recently where everyone needs to go to every con. Even 10 years ago, we were desperately in need of a professional, paid staff and for some reason the furry community really just went with 'we can keep doing this with volunteers'. But, that's not just something furry is guilty of, having also been staff for MAGfest, it's the understanding needed to say 'we're too big to run it the same way now' that seems to be missing.
I go to two furry cons a year: Anthrocon and Fursonacon. Anthrocon is the big one that I enjoy for it's celebration of all things furry. Fursonacon is my small local one that has such great vibes and is incredibly fun.
Ayy fursonacon 2024 was my first con ^^
It was incredible and seemed to be run well
@majestoony hey thank you! I'm glad we made it great for you
Fursonacon 2024 was great from what I heard, it was themed after the delvers guide to the beastworld, a setting from Heartleaf games!
As a yinzer furry, it’s becoming increasingly hard even for us locals to get hotels. To the point where we have to start thinking about commuting. I miss the years of 9k
I just wish furcons would actually have paid staff, and people that actually know things logistically. From the ones I've seen, they have almost 0 staff and very few volunteers and it shows. Comicons do well because they have paid staff.
Don't get me wrong I understand why people want to go to AC so bad, I went to AC three times in a row (2022, 2023, 2024) and next year as well. However next year would probably be the last time I go for a while, AC is great and all but there's so many other cons that I pushed to the side for AC that I never went to but want to experience (FWA, MFF, FURPOC, ANE and etc).
Will definitely return to AC in the future when I get the chance but after next year I won't attend for a while.
Some furries somehow "needs" to go to every convention that exists
I don't understand how they can afford all that traveling and have all that time
Personally it sucks, even small local cons are exploding which has been pushing out local artists from getting booths in dealers den/artist alley :'[
I went to a con with a reg limit and reg lottery. One of my friends did not get in, which was sad, but honestly having a reg limit makes a TON of sense from a logistics standpoint. Furry cons were never really designed to be The One True Con! Find your smaller, local cons. Engage in your local furry communities, whether that be established cons or small furmeets. Smaller, more dispersed cons help organizers by saving money on venues and volunteer time, they help attendees by making it easier to get into the talks and panels you want to go to, and they help the local communities around the con, both in not overwhelming the town's resources and in helping members of the local furry communities make friends that they can continue to hang out with year-round. Some of my closest friends in the fandom are people I met at random during a furry theme park day for the local community. Some of my other closest fandom friends are people I met at a very very small convention, where we had enough breathing room to really get to know each other.
It’s like that damn clip from the Simpsons lmao. “Damn furries they’re ruining the furry community”
Dang furries. They ruined the furry fandom
With 15k people in one area, not counting everyone else that is unaccounted for outside of the convention, the cons would need to contract with either private security or contact local law enforcement for the weekend. When I had the badge any extra money from a side security gig is always great be it a church or public event for a day or even a weekend. There's probably some officers that would be more than happy to provide security service at a furry con.
for me anthrocon is the only close convention I can find. I would be happy to go to a smaller con if I didn't have to drive way further for it. I kinda wish some other folks would support their local cons so that there is space for those of us who ARE local to pennsylvania. Right now im considering driving 7 hours to Anthrohio because I'm not sure if I'll be able to get a ticket for anthrocon.
I haven't been to a proper furry con, only local events like MAW and Furvine (meets in the SoCal area). And even these events get HUGELY populated by local furs. I can only imagine how all of this must be so much more hectic on a larger scale
Joining the fandom in 2005 when my partner introduced me to conventions, we went to the more local ones but stopped going around 2010. After the pandemic, we decided to hit the biggies and attended MFF, AC, FWA, TFF and BLFC in addition to our usual FC. At most of the larger conventions, the wait for the elevators was a big annoyance with the hotel and con staff making some odd choices about how to queue. AC had some rules that stifled creativity in order to be "family friendly" and while I agree some attendees outfits are a bit risque, they went too far in my opinion and I will not go back. For now, we volunteer for our more local cons and I'm quite happy to be able to help.
As an aussie fur our biggest con, FurDU (Furry Down Under), has an attendance cap and prereg too. When tickets opened we just had to confirm our spot and the con sold out in 30 minutes but it was better than last year selling in under 10 without prereg. Ut was an attendance if 1421 this year but the con space isnt very big
When you said "clique problem" I first thought "Click problem" and wondered if he caused an influx of annoying furries or something...
OMG, I love the Click! 😂 I was a furry long before his channel (since 2013), but I wouldn't be surprised if he had some influence in encouraging new furs.
funny cuz the up next video is a video from him
@@ThePsychicClarinetist I for one was introduced to the community by him (his yiffinhell videos actually), already had interest in anthro (human thought/intellect; like animox, woodwalkers etc.) before though.
@@Aras14 Awesome. Welcome, fellow fur! 😁 I've been there with having the interest beforehand.
I grew up watching Disney and Dreamworks films and playing Spyro and Kingdom Hearts, and lived with dogs and cats from a young age. Only found out what a furry was at 12 and that's when I gave myself the label because it already applied. 😂
I can see a registration cap having one fatal flaw, which would be if you get in, but the friend you were going to meet didn't. And if meeting that friend was the only reason you had to go to the con, what's the point in going? So either a lot of people will unregister, if that's a thing, because their friends couldn't get in, or, they'll be registered and taking up a spot, but just not go.
Vancoufur last year doubled its attendees from 1k to 2k people. We have now upgraded our con space from the Sharaton ( a small hotel ) to the Richmond convention center. We are BEYOND excited but also overwhelmed by the immense uptick in attendees
They only have so much space to hold such a large con, that they have to think of safety. maybe because ive been to countless cons both large and small, a variety of fandoms but limited badges/tickets is completely normal. I went to MAGFest 2024 and they had completely sold out Saturday, I believe around 20k attendees were there. its…. normal
There was a time in which BLFC was in the same tier as fwa, ac and mff.
Then mff and fwa skyrocketed in attendance while blfc started its decline,
The causes? Maybe the distance from the other three cons and the pizza stuff
nah its because its in the middle of the week
If someone has a con that they absolutely want to go to and it has an attendee cap, they need to set alarms, sign up for email alerts, use the resources at their disposal and if it’s one they don’t want to miss then buy the tickets the day of!
Maybe they should raise reg prices so that they can pay staff, raise more for charity, and compensate musicians.
I feel like it would also help to make more cons so we can spread things out more. Mostly to help prevent tons and tons of people from being packed into one place but also to help give as many people we can a better opportunity at going to a con especially if one is close by to where you live.
unfortunatly for me the closest cons are either in Canada or anthrocon lol, at least the ones that I could find. I live in NY so its the best I can think of.
what if the cons started having paid volunteers to manage the con for a fair pay for 3 days?
Won't restricting entries result in scalping as people try to profit off the limited entrants?
Idk man I think the solution for this problem is rlly simple. Just go to local cons. Saves time, saves money, and proves there's a market for you in your area. In my experience, my local con is fantastically run, and so is yours. And if it ain't? Well at least you didn't drop a few thousand to be there.
Another thing that I don't think was mentioned: Even if you can't attend Anthrocon or MFF or another large con is that you can still go have fun in the city they're in! Anthrocon is unique in that it's massive AND it takes place in the downtown of the host city. This gives the advantage of allowing you to easily explore Pittsburgh right nearby when the hall is too crowded or if you want to do something else. MFF takes place at a hotel on the edge of an airport... they should really move to downtown Chicago to McCormick Place.
Oh and another thing: When you attend Anthrocon PLEASE explore more neighborhoods of Pittsburgh than just downtown, and The Strip, we have so many other neat places that are easy to get to by bus or light rail. Currently it's $2.75 to get a 3 hour pass that is good for all busses and the light rail and an all day pass is $7.
I was buying an Ultra for AC25 this year... And as I wanted to pay, site went down cause everyone needed to buy THEN... when it went back up, I had lost my spot and lost the Ultra. :(
NOOOOOOOOOO this is fuckin sad RIP.
@@Useless_Science I'm from Europe, it is the only convention I go to, for friends and vacation. So the Ultra (whilst expensive) allows so much less stress. To see it just fly through my hands like that hurt. I send a message to the con staff... Their reply was...
Well.... I wouldn't post it here.
my idea of a solution:
15k limit for 2025, see how that runs, if it runs well, 17.5k for 2026, see how that runs, if it runs well, 20k for 2027, so on so forth
once they hit a number they cant accommodate, they see their limits and know where to either improve or put limits on
another idea: make a google form/registration form where you just show interest in the con, and they can gauge how big the con is gonna be, and if theres too many, they open registration with a limit, the limit i said before
Smaller cons are always the best. Denfur is my local con and I love going to it every year! It’s the perfect size and I just love seeing familiar faces every year!
I said on December 31st 2019 that by the end of 2030 there will be a professional fur con that is ran at least four times a year. This is definitely pointing in the direction that will come to be.
Tbh I'd honestly rather not deal with any of that and just personally keep going to Brony conventions lol
Just look at other cons, how they manage to get around more than 25k. Thats just a rookie number
something they could do is have some cons at seperate times if theyre able to for example having a winter and spring one it could really aid in keeping numbers slightly down
Next year ill be going to college and my first con i plan to go to is MFF, the reason being is its the closest convention to iowa.
I also plan on going to denfur and TFF at some point . I plan on waiting to go to anthrocon, because well im not gonna go to THAT BIG of a furry convention for my first one. Imma try to start small and work my way up. Amd well MFF is one of the smaller of thr big three.
I've been going to non-furry cons for a few years now, personally I like the intimacy of smaller cons way more than the massive ones even though I usually still go to see friends that came from out of town. Usually I advocate for hanging out outside of the con anyway because it's just so much chaos
i'm gonna be heartbroken when my native pittsburgh loses anthro but its inevitable at this point. the attendance is already about twice what the local infra can handle, and it's still growing. LineCon is a fun meme but it's a shitty weekend.
Maybe the ones that get so big it becomes hard to deal with that many people, they could make it a whole week long event covering two weekends.
I'd rather them cap it. My local furry con the past 2 years grew too much and put the hotel way above its capacity. It was hot, crammed tight, and not to mention, very very unsafe. Its not fun, its much better that they want to be responsible instead of focusing on making ticket sales.
FWA has grown so much. My first year attending there was less than 800 people and it was chill. Now it's big and chaotic. Still fun but I'm getting too old for chaos. 😆
Furry convention: "COME JOIN US IN MERRIMENT!"
**A LOT OF PEOPLE JOIN**
Furry Convention: "FUCK, WE HAVE TOO MANY ATTENDEES! IF SOMEONE FARTS IN FORMATION, MAKE THEM TEMPORARY STAFF!"
Farts in formation, suddenly becomes temporary staff. Best interview ever.
@@Useless_Science Yup. A reference to mikeburnfire's video:
Promotion points.
"We have too many small arms repairmen, make the promotion points impossible!" then everyone left the weapon repair workshop and the military Zach was a part of are like: "HOLY CRAP! WE HAVE TOO FEW SMALL ARMS REPAIRMEN, IF SOMEONE FARTS IN FORMATION, PROMOTE THEM IMMEDIATELY!".
If I remember... You had to pass... small arms qualification, grenade qualification, ordinance qualification, rifle qualification, small arms qualification (AGAIN)... basically at the time of Zachs employ? His employers made it impossible to get promoted (despite him being the only small arms repairman like 24/7), and apparently freakin' artillery counted as "small arms".
Wasn't expecting a Zach Hazard reference here but ok.
sounds about right, my local largest con has a cap of about 2000 people and when the site opened, the site crashed and it was on a cloudflare server, so a con this big would easily have the site crash
Instead of growing one con, why not set up multiple cons at once in the same city or region?
Spread the masses.
MFF2022 was my first fur-con and the very "friends" who invited me along were emotionally abusive toward me almost immediately upon arrival. When confronted about their bullying they didn't deny it, and clearly said to me "You did nothing wrong." yet had no explanation for their behavior.
Two years later I'm still coping with PTSD and trust issues.
Howdy! I've been to cons from FurFright 2011 to Anthrocon 2023. I've been to cons for over a decade so hear me out.
Beta's *completely* right. My experience in Anthrocon 2015 vs 2023 is quite the sharp contrast. To pick on AC a bit: people forget that the con affects more than just the convention center.
In 2015: There was nowhere I couldn't eat, no event I couldn't attend, and I registered *late* and could *still* get a hotel room. It was busy, sure. But it wasn't overwhelming. I could always find someone whether it be by coordination or by pure chance.
In 2023: Most places to eat had lines out the door (hell I had to walk several blocks to find someplace that wasn't overwhelmed), I registered a year in advance and only got a room because one of my roomies won the lottery. Some of my friends had to pack in with locals who were sometimes on the other side of town. Coordination was a mess due to the crowds. I'm *still* finding out people I missed out on seeing because I had no clue they were even there. It wasn't *fun.* It was noisy, cramped, and chaotic.
They are easily approaching the numbers of major other conversations like dragoncon. It wouldn't surprise me if they do that by next year
I think Megaplex has a good chance to keep growing to those sizes especially since there is a chance as well that they will be able to get the Orange County Convention center if it gets big enough. Or so I had heard.
I guess my fear about it, is that I’m generally local to AC. I only get to go to a couple local cons a year, due to how much I make a year. However, I don’t have Twitter. (Couldn’t download it if I wanted to, cause I don’t have the space on my phone and I don’t have a computer rn either.) What if I’m working and they announce it and then I can even go to the convention in my own city, because pre-reg was pounced on and capped out within 15-minutes. I get why they do it, but it still sucks. I suppose that means smaller events will pop up more, though. Guess I wouldn’t mind so much, so long as they are still local and I get to hangout with friends.
Furries and weebs are natural enemies. Like furries and bronies. Or furries and other furries. Damn furries, they ruined furrycons.
Can confirm
Lol
Furries and Bronies aren't enemies. At least normaly.
@@Xada35you should have seen the wars back in 2011-2012 era
CorgiBeans here. So funny enough, I had always wanted to stay at the Hilton connected to MFF and I decided literally a month after MFF 2023 that I was going to book a room in the hilton. I think for 5 nights it came to a little shy of 2,000. Absolutely insane but I wanted it. Being a dealer and not being connected to the con space is kind of a pain and I dont like the cold all that much but yeah I wish they wouldnt price gouge even 11 months until the next con. I would never pay the price it has inflated to now. Dealers almost fully get a guaranteed room but it is at the crowne plaza and that is pretty far from the connected walk ways but if I am fortunate enough to vend in 2025 I think I will go back to the Crowne Plaza to save some money