Hyksos: Identity, Origins, History, and Battles (ANCIENT 09)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ก.ค. 2024
- Discover the Hyksos, the first foreign dynasty of Ancient Egypt. Lisa and Richard will cover everything we know about this enigmatic group from their language and culture to governing style and battle tactics.
Hyksos is a term in modern Egyptology that designates the kings of the Fifteenth Dynasty of Egypt (circa 1650-1550 BC). The Hyksos period marks the first period in which Egypt was ruled by foreign rulers, in this case coming from the Levant Region. Many details of their rule, such as the true extent of their kingdom and even the names and order of their kings, remain uncertain. Josephus associated the Hyksos with the Exodus of the Israelites from Egypt. That said, few modern scholars believe the Hyksos are in any way connected with the Biblical Account despite the facial similarities between the Hyksos and the Israelites.
Contents:
0:00:00 Introduction
0:01:43 Setting the Stage
0:18:33 Hyksos Invasion per Manetho
0:29:42 King List
0:33:19 Avaris / Hutwaret
0:47:45 Hyksos Origins
1:01:40 Interpreting the Sources
1:09:08 Writing and Symbology
1:22:49 Hyksos Religion
1:31:00 Commitment to Egyptian Heritage
1:37:54 Architecture
1:42:44 Burials
1:48:34 Pottery
1:51:15 War to Remove the Hyksos
2:09:57 Legacy
2:14:36 Final Remarks - บันเทิง
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This is amazing
Thank you for the kind words! Lisa and Richard worked hard on this!
fantastic job guys!
Thank you so much! We're glad you enjoyed this and please take a look at our channel for other similar presentations.
Was there an ongoing worship of Amun or Re through the Hyksos period? Do we know which Hyksos Pharaohs worshipped Amun?
It is certainly a complex question. We have numerous votive objects that include the name of Re and describe a Hyksos pharaoh as having aspects of Re, especially from later Hyksos rulers like Apophis. However, because most of these attestations of Egyptian gods other than Set (and of the Non-Egyptian god Baal) -- like Re, Hathor, Thoth, and Sobek -- come much later in time, it appears that this was either (1) a later earnest change in Hyksos religion or (2) an attempt to appease the large Egyptian population over whom they ruled from a more cynical perspective. The kind of documentation and artifacts we possess cannot clarify which of these two is more accurate.
In terms of our "historical memory", much of Hyksos iconography and attestation of their belief were not only destroyed by the New Kingdom of Egypt but actively maligned so that Hyksos are portrayed by the New Kingdom to have only worshipped Set (in contrast to the New Kingdom pharaohs who worshipped Re, which is why they prevailed - Re overpowering Set).
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting thank you that is helpful.
Not by the Hyksos but by the 16th and17th dynasties in Waset/Thebes.
Thank you, it was interesting. I would like to add that Manetho changed the name accordingly: 1) “Hyk-ameu” (kings of shepherds) to “Hyk-sos” (kings of pig) by showing here his own hate towards Asiatic people by using his own subjective way (if he used here Greek language). 2) if he used Asiatic language, then “Sus” will be translated as a “Horse” , so we can considered it as objective point of view.
Thank you for clarification
Fun part is that they en-slave-d ancient Egyptians. But Hebrews were Abd in Egypt.
Who about Hyk-khasot
"Ameru" is a derivative of Amorite or Aramaic? Armenian is linguistically related, as well? What is this link with Meru and Ameru people in Kenya, coincidence?
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting, why do you thank her for information that is complete bullshit?
Nice to know… Can you tell about Hyksos People Relation with Prophets… Abraham, Noaa.Joseph and Musaa.
Thank you for watching!
It is entirely possible that Joseph and Moses are among the Hyksos population. However, there is no evidence that this possibility is anything more than wishful thinking since we have no extrinsic evidence of such people. As such, it's not proper to entertain possibilities in a serious discussion for which we have no external evidence. As for Noah and Abraham, if they existed, they would have existed long before the time period covered here.
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting Neither existed. Its pretty clear. Noah at best is a Canaanitish retelling of Gilgamesh.
Ancient Egyptian history is far more interesting. But thanks God i live now days.
Is it possible that later intermarrying led to cultural memory within the Hebrew people later on?
It's entirely possible, but there is no external evidence to support that assertion.
Abraham and Hicksos are CONTEMPORANEOUs, hicksos were a mix of peoples from sumeria up north ural people, iranians, few from the russian steps some from cannan etc they got together out of a volcano explotion than unite them to suvive, they went to Egypt peacefully, lived there close to 500 years in the middle of that they got the power of lower Egypt and egyptians wehre the slaves under them, lower egypt associated with suddany people (their ansestors) and together expulsated the hiksos, that was the "FIRST" exodous mid 1600 bc) those were the militants, but women and young remained and egyptians learning of previous experience, treated harshly the hiksos remaining (future Hebrews) they complained since they did not like it, few left egypt that is the SECOND exodous (biblical), went to cannan where their militant predecessors were taking the concepts of religion from Akhanathen (some hicksos in cannan with relatives in egypt, likely priest since the mother of Akhanathen was a hikso) forming the monoteistic concept taken out of EGYPT with their personal twist. Most of the bible is just myth not good as historical base, it is made up, jews had "NOT" history they created it later, they NEVER write in real time, it is like today they are writting about Martin Luther, they already know the outcome and manipulate things to their purpose, that is why they have been expelled from over 100 countries and in some 2 and 3 times, most people do not do their homework and become what the bible say, sheep of the herd. since their birth in Egypt they take advantage of people and situations they are opportunistic.
Where do the Peleset fit in this “narrative” that are also mention in Luxor.
The Sea Peoples came centuries earlier.
The starving people from the Unas Causeway are fro. The 24th century BC, not rhe 17th. There well may have been a famine in the 17th century (Theran eruption?) but the unas starvation is 600 or 700 years earlier.
The scholar here commits an odd inversion of the Apophis/Sequenenre Hippopotamus story. It was actually Apophis complaining that Sequenenre was keeping a pool of noisy Hippos in Thebes (a deliberately insulting suggestion). I think I heard this gentleman say the opposite, that Sequenenre was complaining of Apophis keeping hippos in Avaris. I don’t know if this is a mistake or an alternate interpretation of the text as he never bothers to say. Goes to show though that scholarship is imperfect and we should always be on our guard about the things we hear from scholars.
Very interesting. Thanks. In the case of ancient archaeology and history evidence varies considerably in clarity and thus the arguments. Take the city of Troy, for example. One thing is clear about the Hyksos, it seems, is they were multicultural, mostly or wholly Semites, and from Western Mesopotamia. They were shepherds. It is said biblical Abraham was of western Mesopotamia, Harran, Ur, Chaldees. Abraham went westward to Canaan likely because others of his region had done the same, and more came, perhaps not Hebrews; maybe cousins or the like. Word spread, and like those many with differences and similarities from similar regions who have come to America, a variety flocked to northern Egypt. Likely, some ancient Hebrews lived in the Hyksos region of Egypt along with others of so-called Amorite/western Mesopotamian origins. Who were the Greeks but a conglomeration of different people with similarities? And we have the twelve tribes of Israel, quite a multitude. If these narrators refute any Israelite origins at all springing from the Hyksos or unto the Hyksos, this would speak to their introductory statements that they aren't academic/scholary--or so it seems. The Hyksos are certainly a fascinating episode in history at large and the Egyptian Middle-Eastern epics. This documentary, as a counter-weight to the Hebrew-Egypt connections, provides some fascinating argument that the Exodus is fact: th-cam.com/video/XObk07uabLI/w-d-xo.html.
It is entirely possible that the progenitors of the Israelites are among the Hyksos population. However, there is no evidence that this possibility is anything more than wishful thinking. As such, it's not proper to entertain possibilities in a serious discussion for which we have no external evidence. The views of Simcha Jacobovici, who you appear to support by linking his "Exodus Decoded" documentary, are lacking in intellectual rigor (often eliding events that are centuries apart, ignoring key differences in narrative, and failing to entertain counterarguments) to the point where, as a New York Times reviewer said (more eloquently than I can): "Mr. Jacobovici presents theories of ancient religious history that in a less stentorian voice might sound like baloney. You might even feel sorry for him, as if he were one of those guys whose tender intellect has been sandbagged by notions about Atlantis or Area 51."
Actually, there's a lot of evidence that shows connections with the Amorites and Hebrews that's easy to find and even in biblical references. Search around. That Hebrews likely lived alongside or intermarried with the Hyksos seems more than likely given the many geographical proximities of their existence, shared shepherding and nomadic lifestyles, linguistic commonalities, and the like. Abrahan and Jacob are Amorite names some say. Saying the Hyksos were all Hebrews would be wishful thinking, but that's not what I stated. I stated the Hyksos were multicultural with Hebrews likely living among them and thus expelled from them, as well, when the Egyptians removed the Hyksos. I also said the lack of clarity of evidence in antiquity makes assertions difficult. There's a lot of apparent "wishful" thinking about antiquity of all kinds. People in antiquity may have been more interconnected than people today due to the practice of slavery and procreation with and freeing of slaves within societies. Also the frequent conquering of neighbors in Antiquity would have shifted territories and absorption of people. "My cousin's Hyksos wife's mom said she has a job for us in her husband's business," for example, would make a short camel journey from southern Israel to the Nile Delta a worthy migration for a nomadic people. As far as Jacobovic's Exodus documentary, I'd talk to him and the scholars he interviewed. It is an interesting take with some evidence the Exodus was real. Many lofty scholars turn out to be wrong in the face of modern science and common sense.
@@spinyourmind5586 Isaiah 52:4 identifies the Pharaoh who oppressed Israel in Egypt as Assyrian. The only time when the Assyrians could have ruled in Egypt, within the proper timeframe of the Exodus, would have been during the 15th/Hyksos dynasty. I suspect the Hyksos were either Assyrians or a conglomeration of Asiatics with the ruling class being Assyrian. Either way, they enslaved Israel. So it may appear as though the Hyksos and Israel are the same, but they're not: they were contemporary with each other. One ruling over the other.
@@thefarmersdaughter7455 Thanks. Fascinating and confusing time of history with more mysteries than clear answers perhaps? Saying the Hyksos were possibly partly of Hebrew origin or largely perhaps is reasonable. Saying the Hyksos were Israel is another story. Hebrews existed before Isreal and outside of Israel. I would need to research the topic more in dept before agreeing one way or the other. You're really this young girl in the Farmer's Daughter photo with so much knowledge?
(19 September 2023, 10:35 a.m.)
At the end of this video, in a question and answer presentation by Richard Sassoon and Lisa Engelbert, a viewer, Ralph Ellis, asks about the biblical date of the Exodus and the Hyksos expulsion timeline.
Currently 1530 BC is a popular date for the expulsion of the Hyksos.
This date does not align with a circa 1446 BC date for the Exodus based on 1 Kings 6:1 mention of 480 years from Exodus to the building of Solomon's Temple.
Not very well known to many, however, two Egyptologists, who identify themselves as Christian Apologists, Professors James K. Hoffmeier and Kenneth A. Kitchen, independent of each other, toted up the number of years of rule from Joshua, the Judges, Saul, David, and Solomon, and concluded the Bible erred!
It was not 480 years from the Exodus to the Temple's building by Solomon, it was over 600+ years!
This 600+ years aligned the Exodus with the Hyksos period of Egypt!
Despite this extraordinary finding, both Hoffmeier and Kitchen, then trashed this Hyksos alignment, opting for a 1260 BC Exodus based on the mention of a store city called Ramesses, built by the Israelites, which, for them is the city of Pi-Ramesses of Pharaoh Ramesses II.
Apparently Ralph Ellis, Richard Sassoon, and Lisa Engelbert were unaware of these Hyksos chronological findings by Egyptologists Hoffmeier and Kitchen?
There are a number of different date revisions and so while the timing is certainly an issue, it's not the dominant one and so the presenters did not spend time going through every plausible chronology to align the Bible with the Hyksos period.
The primary issue with connecting the stories is that the narrative of the Biblical story (that a population from the Levant that believes in a singular god comes to Egypt, becomes enslaved for 400+ years, and has a slave rebellion to escape) does not match the Hyksos narrative (where a population from the Levant that believe in multiple specific gods of the Canaanite and Egyptian pantheon comes to Egypt as military conquerors, rules part of the country for around 100 years, and are expelled from the country due to losing a war with the indigenous population). These are very different stories with small apparential similarities. It may be the case that they are connected, but it is unlikely.
The Hyksos were the Israelites.
Josephus Flavius, quoting Manetho, says so.
The Hyksos Exodus was the Israelite Exodus.
They are exactly the same.
See book ‘Tempest & Exodus’.
Note: the Israelites were not monotheistic until later.
There were bull-worshippers on the Exodus.
Solomon raised temples to many gods.
The exiles from Jerusalem in the Book of Jeremiah venerated the Queen of Heaven (ie: Isis)
Ralph
Josephus certainly makes this argument in his Apologia Against Apion -- almost entirely by citing to Egyptian Priest Manetho, but there are several reasons to doubt its historical accuracy:
(1) Josephus only agrees with Manetho when Manetho supports his claim that the Hyksos share something in common with Israelites (such as Osarsiph, the Hyksos prophet, as Moses in one instance), chooses interpretations that suit his prejudices (such as choosing to understand the Egyptian word "hyk" as "shepherd" instead of "king" -- despite not actually knowing the Egyptian language and only reading Manetho in Greek) and disagrees with Manetho when Manetho makes less than positive claims about the Hyksos (such as when Manetho argues that such people were lepers and Josephus argues that Manetho has no idea what he's talking about since Israelites/Jews are not lepers).
(2) Manetho gets key historical details wrong and Josephus does nothing to correct them (such as arguing that the Hyksos, when fleeing Egypt, were afraid of the Assyrians, but we know that the Hyksos were expelled around 1550 BCE, that not only was there no dominant Mesopotamian Empire, the Assyrians were not even in the running OR claiming that the Hyksos built Jerusalem despite the Bible and archaeology both demonstrating that Jerusalem was built by Canaanites as the city of Ursalim before conquered by the Israelites).
Furthermore, they are not "exactly the same". The similarity is that a group from the Levant who believes in a different set of gods enters Egypt and then leaves Egypt for the Levant, but in nearly every other aspect, they don't match. In the Apologia Against Apion, the Hyksos were the rulers of Egypt and the Israelites are not by the Biblical Account. There are also expulsions of Egyptian priests mentioned in the Apologia that do not seem to come from the Biblical account. There is also never any discussion of a slave revolt, which is a key element of the Biblical narrative, in the Apologia.
The reason to believe Manetho and Josephus, is because the Hyksos Exodus and the Israelite Exodus are identical - in everythin bar the date.
The Hyksos-Israelite Exodus similarities include:
. A group of shepherds
. whose leader was Pharaoh Yakob (Yakobam)
. who were circumcised
. and wore curly (payot) sidelocks
. who had three days of darkness
. and an ashfall (from Thera)
. and a parting of waters (a tsunami from Thera)
. and a pillar of smoke and fire (Thera)
. had a battle with the Egyptians
. were kicked out of Egypt
. all 250 thousand of them
. departed from Pi Ramesse (Avaris)
. went to Jerusalem
. and they destroyed Jericho.
. and Josephus Flavius says the Israelites were indeed the Hyksos.
Q.E.D.
See book: ‘Tempest & Exodus’.
Ralph
@@RalphEllis Yes, you are correct. You also have to know they left Nubia (Avaris) and traveled to Petra. That is where the Hebrews initially came from. Everything about the True Hebrews is in Arabia or Sela or Petra. They were there long before the Arabs arrived. Check it out.
I see other comments also making notes of the connection of the Hyksos and the Hebrew people, and I see the rebuttal about the timing. But timing the exodus from the Biblical record, counting backwards from King Solomon's reign would put the exodus at around 1500 bc and the arrival of the family of Joseph around the 19th century bc. Trying to date the exodus using the name Raamses is pointless since it was used anachronistically. This would align with the Ibscha Relief found in the tomb of Governor Khnumhotep ii which depicts Asiatic peoples from the levant arriving with livestock and goods. Also the city of Avaris which was the Hyksos main city is in the area believed to be the ancient Goshen region. Shepards from the levant that had some kind of uprising is a hard description to put on any other peoples. Genesis 46:31-34:
"Then Joseph said to his brothers and to his father’s household, “I will go up and tell Pharaoh, and say to him, ‘My brothers and those of my father’s house, who were in the land of Canaan, have come to me. 32 And the men are shepherds, for their occupation has been to feed livestock; and they have brought their flocks, their herds, and all that they have.’ 33 So it shall be, when Pharaoh calls you and says, ‘What is your occupation?’ 34 that you shall say, ‘Your servants’ occupation has been with livestock from our youth even till now, both we and also our fathers,’ that you may dwell in the land of Goshen; "
Thank you for your comment. The timing is certainly an issue, but not the dominant one. The primary issue is that the narrative of the Biblical story (that a population from the Levant that believes in a singular god comes to Egypt, becomes enslaved for 400+ years, and has a slave rebellion to escape) does not match the Hyksos narrative (where a population from the Levant that believe in multiple specific gods of the Canaanite and Egyptian pantheon comes to Egypt as military conquerors, rules part of the country for around 100 years, and are expelled from the country due to losing a war with the indigenous population). These are very different stories with small apparential similarities. It may be the case that they are connected, but it is unlikely.
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting Thanks for the reply! While worship of Seth, Baal, or others that is reported among some findings of the Hyksos is true, that doesn't exclude it from Hebrews that were known for idol worship, especially of Baal. Even in the Biblical story of the Exodus while Moses is on the mountain the people grow impatient and demand a golden calf to worship saying, "This is thy god, O Israel, which brought thee up out of the land of Egypt’” Exodus 32:4. The bull/calf motif persistently crops up in Israelite history in other times as well. Also the accounts of a proto-hebraic language carved into mines with the word "El" demonstrates some remnant of a monotheistic population. Most accounts and research that I've seen shows the Hyksos coming in as immigrants not conquers originally. There's also the huge silos found in Avaris which would correspond with Joseph's original ascent to power within the kingdom. Anything is possible, but again similarities and timeline seems more than plausible, and there does seem to have been a deliberate effort by the Egyptians to destroy a lot of records from that time period.
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting As you detailed in the first 45 minutes The Egyptians never wrote history of their defeats. Even though the Hebrew were more honest with their defeats later, it's still very possible that a Hyksos-(possible-Hebrew) were also disinclined to speak of a defeat in the beginning.
The Egyptians portray an Ejection. The Hyksos would portray subjugation and liberation. Even if the Hyksos are not direct relations to Hebrew, the ejection could have brought priest and others that established the Levites and transferred these traditions...melding them with El,, Elohim and Yahweh tribal gods over the next 360 years. Certainly their is evidence that the Hebrew wanted to be associated with the mighty Hyksos.
The Famine of the 12 dynasty matches Abraham. A conflict with a nomadic pastoral people alien to the land matches the Shepard Kings. A conquering Sheppard Kings vs a Pastoral people taking over the land of Canaan by force but leaving the Cities largely intact matches. There would seem to be a link of some sort.
it's possible you're being to literal looking for a 1:1 agreement in the Biblical mythical narrative vs the Hyksos history that we know. Yes, it's speculation but it doesn't seem at all out of bounds. Clearly there was no such single big migration of one people but a roaming or nomadic amalgamation is certainly possible. (at least I think so).
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting Its incongruent until you accept the reality that the bible is largely a collection of stories from other civilizations (Gilgamesh, the fall of Enkidu, Osirian drama, Djosers 7 yr famine=Joseph dream interpretations etc). Using the Bible as the literal framework for recounting historical event is a mistake. If one is dispassionate its clear that the Hebrews were 1) one of many Canaanite tribes. 2) Had a religion that was very similar to other polytheistic tribes in the Levant including the worship of Yahweh 3) Had some experience of being in Egypt 4) Were removed from Egypt and then reintegrated back into Canaan 5) Were displaced when the Assyrians expelled them until their return under the Persians. At some point this group of Canaanites hadn't been monotheistic. Even when we look at the account In the bible its clear the idea of 1 god would've been foreign to most Israelites who worshipped the pantheon including Baal. It was only after returning from Persia (the actual home of monotheism) that the Jewish identity and religion takes shape. The people become convinced that their exile was in part a punishment for not worshipping YHWH exclusively. With their return to Judea the land and its significance takes on a whole new meaning.
@@sw8871 your assessment is spot on. Taking the bible as literal recounting of events is a complete unforced error. The evidence shows that they were a polytheistic Canaanite culture who migrated into Egypt and were later expelled. No other group fits the description. Also its important to note that people embellish stories and find supernatural justifications for their circumstances. The bible is a greatest hits of rationalization of why and how these Hyksos were removed from Goshen and all the trials and tribulations experienced as they re-integrated with the other Canaanites tribes in the area including taking on their gods and customs which were possibly forgotten during their sojourn in Egypt.
I think the first question he answers does do the best job at addressing the Hykosos /Hebrew Connection. It's a foregone conclusion that the Bible is a exaggeration of historical events and shouldn't be taken at wrote. The question is more like this: Are the Hyksos a form of the Hebrews?
We know the Eygptians ejected the Hykosos./The Bible says the Israelites ran from subjugation= was this a creative retelling?
We know the Hykosos were Nomadic/The Hebrew were also nomadic=
We know the Hyksos were semites/Just like the Jews
We know the Hyksos were conqueror that didn't destroy the civilizations/The Hebews took over Jericho and Jerusalem in the same way=
We know there was a Famine that proceeded the Hyksos/The Hebrew ancestors write about a famine during Abrahams time (precursor of the Hebrews)
The Hyksos /Hebrew theory is one of the most fascinating things in modern archaeology. It would be great to get a good break down of the points and counter-points of the theory.
Ahmose 👁️
Indeed, it was Ahmose who expelled the Hyksos.
Where we can fit , Joseph and Mussa. I relationship with Hyksos
As I noted earlier, any placement of the Israelite prophets among the Hyksos history would be pure speculation, but if we conform the Hyksos story to the Biblical narrative, Joseph would have been among the earlier migrants of Hyksos to Egypt and Moses would have have been the leader of Hyksos forces opposed to Ahmose I and whose defeat forced the Hyksos to return to the Levant.
@@HistoryfitnessInvestingaccording to scripture Moses was there after the hyksos were removed…because joseph had no clout anymore
"Josephus mistranslated when he said Hyksos meant 'Shepherd Kings,' it meant 'Foreign Rulers.'"
"How did he mistranslate what could be considered as an accurate depiction of them when considering period artistic renderings of the Hyksos with rams or sheep?"
"We don't know. Anyway, the Hyksos are not related to the Israelites because they didn't worship "Yahweh" they were polytheistic."
"The Israelites started out polytheistic."
"No "Yahweh" let's move along."
"Okay why does both Israelite and Egyptian temple architecture appear so strikingly similar in design?"
"We don't know, but it was probably a generic bureaucratic decision made much later for reasons other than the Hyksos being connected in anyway to the Israelites."
"Couldn't the Hyksos being people from the "Levant" imply a connection to Levites? As in one of the tribes of Israel?"
"This isn't what we're covering in today's dissertation."
"What exactly are you covering?"
"How we don't know who the Hyksos were but that they're not to do with anything Israelite and we're sure of it."
"So donkeys were an Egyptian sign of nobility?"
"Something like that."
"Jesus was declared the Messiah as he road into Jerusalem on a Donkey."
"That's Jewish and Greek literature which is no way related to Egyptian religion I think we're done here."
Let's respond to these points in kind:
"Josephus mistranslated when he said Hyksos meant 'Shepherd Kings,' it meant 'Foreign Rulers.'" -- "How did he mistranslate what could be considered as an accurate depiction of them when considering period artistic renderings of the Hyksos with rams or sheep?"
The issue of mistranslation is a question of Josephus reading a translation of the original Egyptian language in Greek and applying his understanding of Greek to a word that's not Greek and doesn't have the same origins. (It would be like thinking the Spanish word "queso" has something to do with the English word "quest" since they look similar.) You can argue that this is a case where the broken clock is right twice a day, but it is still a case of mistranslation.
"We don't know. Anyway, the Hyksos are not related to the Israelites because they didn't worship "Yahweh" they were polytheistic." -- "The Israelites started out polytheistic." -- "No "Yahweh" let's move along."
Correct. The Israelite pantheon (in its pre-monotheistic period) was composed of several core entities: Yahweh, El-Elyon, Asherah, and Baal. If some or all of these entities are lacking in Hyksos belief, it should make us seriously consider whether the Israelites and Hyksos are related. Simply being polytheistic doesn't mean two religions share an originating people. (Both Hinduism and Yoruba faith, for example, are polytheistic, but the peoples are clearly unrelated.)
"Okay why does both Israelite and Egyptian temple architecture appear so strikingly similar in design?" -- "We don't know, but it was probably a generic bureaucratic decision made much later for reasons other than the Hyksos being connected in anyway to the Israelites."
To the extent that Hyksos architecture bares more similarity to Levant styles of architecture than indigenous Egyptian architecture has to do with the Hyksos being a Levantine people. A perfect example would be to look at churches in Japan built in the Meiji Period and to see that they are built in a Western style and then to assume that they are made by Brits/Americans when they could have been made by other Westerners (like Germans or French) who, relative to the Japanese, build much more similarly to the Brits/Americans. It could be that these churches were built by Brits/Americans, but not necessarily so. Similarly, Hyksos buildings do not have any "definitive" markers that would tie them to specific group of Levantines. It's possible that they're Israelites, but this alone would be insufficient to corroborate this.
"Couldn't the Hyksos being people from the "Levant" imply a connection to Levites? As in one of the tribes of Israel?" --"How we don't know who the Hyksos were but that they're not to do with anything Israelite and we're sure of it."
No. There is no imputed connection specifically to Levites from coming from the Levant. The fact that these two words both start with "Lev" is the "queso/quest" problem all over again. The word "Levite" comes from the name of Jacob's son in the Bible "Levi" which means "attached" in Biblical Hebrew. The word "Levant" comes the French word "lever" meaning "to rise" since, relative to Europe, the sun rose in the eastern Mediterranean Sea.
The presenters also never claimed that they "were sure" that the Hyksos were not Israelites; they simply found the evidence to be against the proposition.
"So donkeys were an Egyptian sign of nobility?" --"Something like that."
Donkeys were a symbol of transportation of goods, which given that the Hyksos were Levantine and most Levantine people transported goods, it was something important to them.
"Jesus was declared the Messiah as he road into Jerusalem on a Donkey."
The donkey exists throughout the Levant; many people rode on donkeys and we have donkey iconography throughout the Levant and from periods as early as 3000 BCE (nearly 2000 years before Ancient Israel). This, like the architecture point, is not specific enough to tie the Hyksos to the Israelites. Furthermore, Jesus (to the extent we can say he lived) rode on donkeys because they were plentiful. To ascribe meaningful significance to this fact in connecting the Israelites to the Hyksos would be rather silly.
The 14th dynasty egypt matches the joseph story. 15th hyksos dynasty matches the narrative "hebrews growing in number then the pharaoh 17/18th dynasty enslaved them". Bronze age collapse matches the plagues of egypt and exodus. Israel invades canaan during the bronze age collapse.
Can you guys make a video on the harappa civilization and the vedic age?
We have it already
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting link to the harappa video and vedic age?
Assuming that the Hyksos were Semitic people, the Israelites could have been desended from them in some way just in some way we are related to people in the Middle Ages. The time differences are similar. I would argue that the nation of Israel did emerge until after the Late Bronze Age collapse. The arrived in the early 12th Century BC and it appears that the well established according to the Book of Joshua. Also I find it curious that the Bible doesn't mention the mighty empire of the Hittites, suggesting that the stories of the Bible were composed after the fall of the Hittite Empire.
The bible mention all you people just don't want to put in the facts, the great Hittites are still today the people of all the North, the whole of Europe joined now and mix with Esau of Edom, just like the Bible says, all Cannanites and Esau and most of Shem and Jephthah are one today, the Cannanites was to serve as your kings, that's what the bible did not said, for certainly the Cannanites did not go in to Africa!
@@nigelwilliams5653 Just remember that the Bible indicates that the Phillistines were already settled on the coast when Joshua arrives in Canaan. Joshua fails to conquer those coastal cities. The Egyptians state that the Phillistines settled along the coast after the late Bronze Age collapse.
@johnbennett757 who were the phillistines according to bible , they were not Semitic in the list . And may be from Mycenaean or Minoan preto Greek origins
@1:01:09 the Bible doesn't fit the narrative you are painting.
You aren't stating what the Bible says. Either you simply don't know or you don't understand.....
The presenters here agreed with your point. Richard's argument that the story of the Hyksos (that they were military invaders, ruled Egypt for a hundred years, and then were expelled militarily) does not match the Biblical story (that the Israelites were peasants fleeing a famine, that they were later enslaved by the Egyptians among whom they lived, they had a slave revolt, and fled).
In particular, Richard said, emphasis mine "The Israelites did not come down to Egypt, you know, create a large-scale mutiny according to the bible, create a country that ruled over Egypt for a hundred years and then get expelled militarily by force."
I believe the bible timeline is seriously manipulated and incorrect. It is not true Hebrew history. Its a European rewrite.
Hyksos from west Anatolia a greek name of hycat god of witch craft and darkness (hycatisos
hykos from middle asia further than levant .
We actually don't know the true origins of the Hyksos because the Egyptians never gave us any clarity on exactly where they came from and the Egyptians took great pains to eliminate as much evidence of the Hyksos as they could. We have determined that they were Semitic-speaking from those few pieces of evidence we have (like the names of their rulers), but that's not enough to pinpoint them on the map.
Current scholarship generally puts the Hyksos in the Levant, but it is possible (though unlikely) that they came from further north or east.
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting They en-slave-d ancient Egyptians, so they are not Hebrews.
The perspective that the Hyksos are not likely to be Hebrews is endorsed in this episode.
Lol. She said "ASS" at 17:58
Now, I'm tempted to remove it, but that would just take the fun out it...
Israelites weren't in Egypt 400 yrs that's a mistranslation
Regardless of whether Israelites were ever in Egypt, the word of Egypt in the Bible (Misrayyim) is not mistranslated. Most Semitic languages refer to Egypt as some form of Misr.
For not having degrees not bad on all the good information. But I do have a Bachelor's in the Classics. Your time lines are way off there has been many artifacts found at Avaris that clearly prove Israelites were there. There's no way The Hyksos and the Israelites were slapping hands as they passed through the same lands. The Hyksos expulsion is recorded on a Stele from Egypt explaining the horrendous storms that were going on during their expulsion. The Hyksos expulsion is the Israelite Exodus make the match please and figure it out. Oh yeah the Amo means God's people Not just people. Thank you. RAM
Well it is known that the hyksos were canaanites and its also known that the canaanites were israelites. It's just that the bible is wrong about the israelites, not that the hyksos and israelites weren't the same. The more accurate history biblically at least would be genesis rather than the silly exodus story and Joseph being vizier to the king at the time lines up actually perfect on a timeline. The israelites were definitely not called israelites at anytime in history and the form of the people we call israelites (more accurately amorites, canaanites, so called phonecians by the greeks) was much different post and pre bronze age collapse, as was the egyptians, Assyrians and babylonians, greeks or mycenaens, due to the impact of the collapse. Its ok if the bible is just a little correct sometimes, it doesn't mean god is gonna smite us lol
Hyksos (a greek nickname) were actually from Akkad. Menes, Memnon, Djoser all the down to Tut_18th dynasty were all Akkadian. Hyksos was a greek "term" but Menes & his ppl were and always will be Akkad. They were known to accept foreign wives (Canaanite, Cimmerian, Edomite, Japhite). Tuts top general.....Ramses-1 "the beloved" was the start of the Arab Kings.
Do you have a source for this Akkad theory?
Hilarious, the Monty Python, or is it the Spinal Tap, version of history.
You mean he was, akadians are of kush, not an Arab, now you do knw Arabs are Johny came lately's, their mother was Ethiopian Their father was truly Asian, and Egypt was always ruled by an Ethiopian dynasty, so really they were no different, Abrahams mother was Ethiopian.
@@nigelwilliams5653 Akkadians are ELamite-Kish not kush(Ham). Akkadians are of SHEM - Babylon Google { Babylonian Archers to see Shem. Akkadians aka Hebrews according to Diodorus are the only pre-flood bloodines on earth today. Speaking of late, Arabs are EDomites mixed w/ Canaanite, later merging w/ Hellinist. The "beard" is the only remnant of Shem they have left from Ishmael/Esau = the 2 to wander w/ foreign gentile. Ethiopian/Sudanese(Ham) "Kemet" Pharoahs were 1st humans to rule Hem-Ta(Egypt). Thats a fact, but Egypt was taken over by migration century after century including wars
@2:17:00 So this is the third time Richard speaker seems somewhat pedantic about discouraging the "Exodus" narrative and even sees a need to interrupt the Question to defeat it. It appeared very reflexive. There is also an almost robotic (Macro Like) response to any question as though he didn't receive the question before conceiving the same response he's given 3 times.
I assume Richard is of arab descent...?
Firstly you're talking to a largely western audience. They are familiar and make immediate associations with the incorporated mythical/historical accounts in the bible. That is a point of common ground and I think Richard has utterly failed to take advantage of that interest.
This video has 14,331 views in a year.
History Valley has that amount in just 3 months
Study of Antiquity and the Middle Ages has 161,000 views in 2 years on the subject.
Bruce Gore (overly confirms Biblical History) but got 208,000 views in 2 years.
I guess my point is you have a unique opportunity to talk to Christians because they are extremely interested in this time period. This is an opportunity to educate and de-radicalize and de-passion-ize this topic in a friendly and wonderous way and on this one respect I feel you've failed.
Otherwise the presentation was very very informational!
Speaking on Richard's behalf, first, thank you for the positive comments about how informational and useful this is.
However, to the main thrust of the comment, Richard is generally not concerned about whether it would be ideologically or financially advantageous to indulge the pre-existing beliefs of his audience but whether or not the historical evidence actually support the contention or not. No matter how many times you try to jam a square peg into a round hole, it just won't fit. He also addresses other countervailing narratives in other presentations that he has given, such as rebutting the claim that Crusaders was just some European Imperialist jaunt, when in reality it's a much more complex series of raids, community realignment, and power-plays.
It's regrettable that people may wish only to tune into those programs or seek only that information that will confirm their pre-existing beliefs about reality since reality is far more interesting than those pre-existing beliefs would constrain it towards being.
The Israelites were the Hyksos and you have to be blind not to see it
How so, they left during Ramses to Canaan
@@HistoryfitnessInvesting the Pharaoh of Exodus is unnamed but the events described in Exodus can only be the eruption of Santerini during the expulsion of the Hyksos. Even Ja-Hovah's name means "disaster/volcano god" in Hebrew. It all fits just not with the orthodox academic consensus.
The hyksos are the ancestors of HACKSAW jim duggan
They came from Georgia 🇬🇪 and modern day Azerbaijan 🇦🇿. They were running 🏃♂️ from the raising power of the Hatties and Assyrians
The Israelites were one of the tribes of the Hyksos. Sheppards from the Levant gradually integrating into Egyptian society? Chased out by the Pharoah? C'mon....its the hebrews
Lies
way too many ums and ers
All live recording no additions
The Hyksos were the Native American Indians ... They made the tzizits(numbers 11) .... They are the only one till this day ...still wearing the Feathered Headres and Chin bones ....AND the HYKSOS ....WERE ORIENTALS .....NOT EYGYPTIANS ....GTFOH 🕵️🕵️🕵️💯
Love it lol