Another post credit scene I love is when Ashley mentions hearing Jess in the mines but not going after her, and it cuts to the cops asking Jess about this and she just says "that wasn't me" in such an eerie way
Ashley's death in the mines is one of my favorite moments in the game because it's the ultimate test of any horror fan's credibility. It's the most stereotypical scenario in which a character in a horror movie can die a stupid death, splitting off from the main group to investigate a strange noise she heard down a dark mineshaft, even though she knows there are monsters out there that can kill her. And you are given multiple opportunities to back out of it. And so many people fell for it.
And bc of ashley being “an academic” does read that they can mimic voices! they give you the information and not paying attention means: make stupid decisions, die stupid deaths lol?
Omg I never even realized that and I’m someone obsessed with horror movies! I think I was so caught up in making sure everyone live and didn’t want any secrets or ppl left behind
@@tallybarnie5453 yea!! it’s so neat ik a lot of people don’t totally understand that characteristics lvl thing but i think it was kind of a challenge to instead of playing the way you want, to play as the characters are. ashley being honest+cowardly, sam being charitable and brave ect. and even if you do that, i think they’d all still live maybe? idk it’s so interesting!
I know right?!? I'm a huge horror fan, I went, luckily was able to collect the totem, while also saying, "Nope, that's a trick. I'm out." plus they said like in the chapter earlier how they can perfectly mimic human behavior, yeah no, don't ever answer the random banging trap door lol.❤i was able to save everyone except Matt, who I think everyone got killed because the one choice that keeps him alive is so lame. He suggests going to the Radio tower and you have to immediately say no u don't want to go, how are you supposed to know that? I think they purposely did that because Black people always die super easily, maybe not overtly but come on. Also Emily the bitch and most hated goes through so much and it is hard to keep her alive on that chase from the mines. I did cheat with the motion controls, just set down the controller lol. I just hate how u can't skip the previously on when you want to replay. Great game though, I was always interested and a great twist, I mean I kinda found it obvious it was Josh but the wendigo twist was awesome.
The reason Jessica seems to be forgotten about is because the devs intended to have Jessica die no matter what but it was decided later to have a choice to keep her alive. I'm guessing that's why there is an achievement for keeping her alive as well.
I thought that wasn’t true, as even in the early prototypes she can survive and the same events play out where she’d wake up in the mines but the only difference was that she was in the snow mobile with everybody else while escaping down the mountain
Actually it wasn't but the actor of Jess had to act in mean girls 2 so she had to stop working on it but finished acting in mean girls 2 but came back when development was almost done
I remember playing this game on a holloween night with a big group of friends, we each switching controller on different acts. We legit finished the game at dawn, with everyone alive. it was sick.
I had a similar experience with my friends and a few of my family members but we got Matt,Chris,and Emily killed,one of my friends was curious to what would happen if you just shot Emily and I kid you not he was like “oh” we all made fun of him for the rest of the night for being stupid,Chris was my fault I wasn’t paying attention and Matt was pure bullshit,hook to face
If you collect all totems, the game gives an explanation why Hannah's wendigo is so big compared to the rest and why she's killing other wendigos: she was possessed by the Makkapitew, a very powerful Wendigo that the stranger and his family had been fighting for generations. The Makkapitew was the wendigo that chased Hannah and Beth in the prologue, meaning it was the wendigo that the stranger killed before trying to help the girls. Wendigo souls circle around until another person resorts to cannibalism, and Hannah did just that soon after the Makapitew was killed, so it possessed her body, and in turn she became the new Makapitew.
Hence why the stranger himself said in his book that you should only kill a wendigo as a last resort. The one time he decided to go against his own rules (by killing the Makkapitew as a means to avenge the twins), it ironically led to his own demise later on. Man, does this game has such clever symbolisms.
@@megadunsparce3672 probably, haha. When Sam blows the house up, you can see the wendigo that possessed Hannah flying around. It was the only one wandering through the mountains, which means that Josh has a higher chance of being possessed by the Makkapitew.
i liked her better with every playthrough i saw of this game (quite a few) and i think it is highly problematic how people actually think it's okay to actively murder her (not just let her die passively but directly shoot her in the face without any real reason), just because she is not likeable, not conforming to the sexist demand that girls and women better have a pleasing, accomodating personality and never tell it like it is, or else. like, the blatant misogyny of it. she never actually hurt anyone or even put anyone in danger (and matt is free to break up with her any time. how dare players paint him as her victim!) - unlike mike, who everybody is willing to accept as the great hero despite being the main protagonist of the "prank" that got the whole thing started - that got two innocent people killed right away. just because he is charismatic and "didn't mean to", he can't be accountable? that's some major BS right there! i think it's absolutely great that the game gives players the choice to kill emily in that way though. it shows how aware the creators are of these deeply ingrained societal dynamics. i'm just shocked how many players never realise what they are doing to emily, how they are publicly proving their rotten morals and what mindless drones they really are. i even saw one of them replay the whole game just to kill emily that time. and he was and still is a very popular influencer. just yikes.
It would've been a cool way for Jess to get more screentime if she met up with Emily while she was in the mines and they had to work together to survive
@@GRYPHOmn I know it was the wendigo imitating her. But I mean the initial set up wouldn't have worked. If you have Jess alive up until that point with Ashley they show a brief scene of Jess alive in the mines hearing a wendigo. This helps trick the player into investigating the voice
I'll never forget watching Markiplier play this game, and he went to check out the voice as Ashley and got her killed and he freaked out, refusing to let that be it, so he started the whole game over just to save her. I feel like the choice to have Ashley go investigate the voice or not is not only to see if you're paying attention to the journal, but also just if you know horror movies in general. Don't split the group is like horror movie 101. Also my wife was with her ex when this came out and she was only passively seeing bits of him play, but she figured out it was a wendigo real fast and he was so mad that he didn't figure it out.
there’s actually a totem of you choose to have ashley investigate the sound, she lives and meets back up with the group as long as you don’t open the trap door
@@Linaxticyou can: - ignore the door and meet w/ the others - open the door and die immediately - open the lock but not tue door, try to walk away and then get killed by the wendigo a few moments later. And this event can happen with Chris too! Though I forgot what were the conditions for him to be there instead of her.
You just tell him he could take a moment to catch up after resting his ankle for a minute. If Ashley was already killed, then Chris gets killed when he also chooses to investigate. You do not get to choose whether he investigates or not, that's something he automatically does.
Emily is a very interesting character cause she is annoying and entitled (and straight up abusive towards Matt tbh), but she's also competent and fierce in a way that shows when she finds herself in the mines. Also, the choice to kill her is like, "being a dick is not an offense punishable by death" which you kinda gotta remind yourself lmao She was unapologetically an asshole and you still gotta keep her alive, cause yknow, none of those kids should die, even the worse one
how was she abusive toward matt? the worst thing i recall her doing to him is her making him get her bags. and i wouldn't say shes the worst character, i mean to put it in context, if ur BEST FRIEND got with ur (ex? timeline isn't clear) boyfriend you'd be mad too
@@vic-xp8ky I don't really remember either tbh but she did try to trick him into investigating a tree that she acted like something inside grabbed her 😭
@@vic-xp8kyshe was verbally abusive, the way she treated Matt isn't acceptable. Like,,,,,, Matt is doing his fucking best and she goes out of her way to berate him, I got Matt killed because I desperately tried to make Emily see him in a better light and bitch literally went and said in the end credits she HOPES he's dead??????? 😭 I'm sorry, Matt, RIP in peace
The craziest butterfly effect for me starts in the beginning. I had seen the start of a play through on TH-cam and they didn’t shoot the squirrel as Chris and I wondered what would happen so I shot it and a bird attacks Sam and scratches her. Later on when Josh is chasing her as the killer and you have to break down the door I got it down but she hits her head and opens up the cut which leads to Josh finding her even if you complete the don’t move while hiding
I must say, I always really hated the fact that josh didn’t have a happy ending. Especially in the horror genre it’s a huge trope to villainize the 'mentally ill character', and so when I first played until dawn I was really surprised how they subverted my expectations on that. They actually made an effort to show that Josh was extremely traumatized from what happened to his sisters and was in fact suffering from severe hallucinations and delusions that led him to believe what he was doing was just a funny prank. They also made it very clear that josh never intended to hurt anybody, his deluded mind just couldn’t tell that he was going too far. Now of course none of this excuses the mental terror he caused his friends, but I still think him being the only character who can’t survive the night really sucks. I mean heck some of the other characters can do some really awful things too depending on choices, like Mike shooting Em, Ashley leaving Chris to die or Sam blowing up the lodge at the very end with everyone still inside just to safe herself. So yea,, it just doesn’t really sit right with me josh is literally the only one doesn’t get a good ending no matter what
I couldn't agree more! And in the end Mike became my least favorite character because 1. he's an ass 2. he barely hesitates to point a gun at/kill Emily with no proof to back up Ashley's freak out idea and 3. relating to this comment - he abandons Josh, which directly leads to Josh dying or being turned into a wendigo. He wasn't this cowardly with any of the others and he just never seemed to actually care about Josh. Josh deserved better, he was sick. And Sam could only do so much as a friend and a teenager before and after Josh went into a manic state/psychosis. To this day it makes me really sad that Josh can't have a good ending.
Thank you! I always felt so bad for Josh! On my 1st play through I tried to wake him up as Beth, and when I saw him again (I loveee rami, so) I was automatically sympathetic, Only wanted to punch him a little bit when he said that stuff about Ashley xD But he was just a teen/Y.A who lost his little sister's. As an older brother it was probably instilled in him to protect the twins... nit to mention he was black out drunk the night they went missing (Beth dieing and Hannah being trapped) he blames his friends but also HIMSELF I was on team Josh the whole time. (Even tho I did save Ashley over Josh at the saw, I felt thats what chirs would do)
I'm a bit sad you didn't get to witness Sam's absolute badassery at the final scene in the lodge when she purposefully gets Hannah's attention like 3-4 times to allow everyone else to get out of the building before flipping the switch. I suppose that's the beauty of these games tho if they are done right. Very nice video essay by the way, glad people are still talking about this game.
I think my favourite one is when you successfully get everyone else out of the lodge and you fuck up with sam so she isnt able to flip the switch, and then mike uses his pocket lighter to light the explosion, sacrificing himself to save everyone else.
My character observations from someone who has been obsessed w this game since it cane out: Ashley + Matt: lovely people in normal circumstances, but in a crisis they have potential to make hasty/bad decisions. Mike + Emily: absolute twats in normal circs, but good in a crisis so everyone likes them by the end. Jess: kinda similar to Mike and Em. bit of a dickhead in normality, but is beaten up so much by the game that everyone likes her at the end. Sam + Chris: just lovely delightful people, they cope well in a crisis and don't make decisions that hurt anyone (apart from shooting the squirrel Chris what the fuck) Josh: bless him idk he's trying his best
honestly, chris what the fuck? nah but all the animal scenes genuinely piss me off, like i get why it’s there but like… shooting the squirrel, killing the already dying animal, and using the axe on the deer????!?!?! you gotta be seriously fucked in the head.
I kinda wished Emily ended up the one with Jessica at the end just to see how they went from fighting and bickering in the beginning to having to depend on each other and survive the night like that would’ve been so good
Ooh, love this idea. It would have been great to see more Emily and Jess interactions. Especially since they used to be best friends- maybe there'd be a full circle arc where they remember why they were friends to begin with (or not depending on player choice) with the ability to repair their relationship by the end of the night.
@@chibivampiregirl this is what im saying, they literally had a build up for their redemption arc with the fight they had. but they just left that to be a wasted potential and make them never meet again that night lol
I hated Emily my first play through when I was younger, but after playing it again recently, it’s just so satisfying playing as someone smart, quick on their feet, and athletic, it’s how I wish I would do in the scenario. Emily is now contender for my favorite cuz she’s such a badass😂
I know Emily gets a lot of hate in the community (at least when I first watched the games wayback then), but I loved Emily. Even back then. When she wasn't being an obvious bitch she was acting intelligent. Wanting to signal for help and trying the radio. Sure, she was rude about things like asking Matt for help multiple times, but she actually did smart things(even when she wasn't aware the threat was supernatural) and did the best to her ability. So I can honestly forgive the bitch slap she gives Ashley if she gets bit, mostly because Ashley literally pulls that out of her ass. Like girl, do you turn into a squirel when you get bit by them?
@@FEKana I also love Emily and found it easy to sympathize with some of her actions. One of her best friends stole her boyfriend, her current boyfriend during certain choices can leave her to die, another one of her friends makes the baseless assumption about bites and FREAKS out causing her exboyfriend to point a gun at her and in some cases murder her. ON TOP OF leaving out the only scene of her being a normal person in the most played version of the game. aka not the pre-sale/extended version. While everyone else, despite horrible actions - have scenes to make them easier to sympathize with. Emily is done dirty by this fanbase in my opinion lmao.
The biggest revelation for me with this game was when even after watching so many let's plays, it wasn't until I watched my girlfriend play it that I realized the game wants you to play the characters and not yourself. She was really into going by the personality and relationship screens when making choices. Almost every time it was the better choice.
@@jagerbaby8628nah she had every reason to be mad, her best friend got with her boyfriend (ofc i only mean being mean to jess and mike, but honestly a lot of the stuff she said abt the other characters was right)
At first, I really like Ashley and Chris because I related to them so much. After years, Emily has become my favorite. There’s soemthing so fierce about her route, barely surviving the tower fall then fighting her way out of the mines, and her mean girl attitude was so fun to see throughout the game even if it was annoying.
emily is my all time favorite character!!! she’s such a badass and really smart too, i can quote that scene with her and jessica fighting from memory lol
i noticed that with the vast majority of popular youtuber playthroughs they HATED emily at first, but once they get to her surviving the tower and being in the mines, they end up loving her purely for how hard she fights to survive and how smart she is.
@@shadycatz85 So far most youtubers seem to remember Mike and Sam more than Emily. Emily seem to only be popular online, I still like her as a character. Emily seems to get hated a lot outside of the internet.
I chose to point the gun at Ashley because she said something along the lines of "you saved me, now let me save you. " And she still held it against Chris, refusing to let him in. Really shows that the two-faced side of her displayed in the beginning prank were her true colors all along.
Iirc her feelings about the prank were also iffy, hinting that she didn't feel that bad about it or only felt bad because the twins died. At least Em and Jess are honest about being mean girls. Ashley is a snake. I totally get being traumatized and breaking at that point and having mixed feelings at having your crush point a gun at you but she told him to do it! IMO that reaction should have only been triggered if Ashley didn't say the line. Simply have her relationship with Chris drop but have her open the door for him or hesitate then as she goes to unlock the door, she's too late. Ffs she was even egging on Mike to shoot Emily. Ashley just really sucks.
well you saved her, she saved you then is your turn to save her by dying outside alone like the dog you are. YYou guys are delutional if you would save someone that moments ago was about to kill you.
It adds more to her character. Everyone is two-faced to some extent, you just don't know who. It makes her more interesting and it gives dynamic to a variety of personalities within characters.
I love the implication in the credits that Mike spends the rest of his life in jail if he shoots Emily (assuming he survives, of course). Well deserved for that ridiculous choice lol. It's so silly, wendigos aren't zombies.
It's a silly decision but logic would go out the window. Imagine going on a trip and then being chased by flesh hungry creatures. Logic would go out the window, debates on zombies wouldn't even cross the mind. Realistically they should of locked themselves in that room till morning but again logic went out the window lol.
@@ciarajones4970especially since, while they are more known about now, those monsters weren’t well known(outside of some tribes native Americans or people interested in their myths) back then. The human brain is really good at looking for patterns. You’ve just found out that a decrepit creature who was once human who feasts on human flesh exists, what other monster does that sound like. The same monster that’s always spread through bites
@@Wwhdduendjdhhfmwosdn the folklore Wendigo also looks very different compared to the until dawn wendigo. Imo the until dawn wendigo looks terrifying compared to the folklore version.
45:14 the reason he dies is because Chris while running got in the way of the flamethrower throwing off the stranger and getting him killed. Also he isn’t used to having to watch another persons back which split his attention
I'm going to add that he also makes a comment like "we're out in the open" when Handigo is attacking, implying that he would never have put himself in that situation to begin with and only did it because Chris insisted on saving Josh and he refused to let him go alone. He more likely typically used the strategies we see him employ in the early game: stay stealthy and quiet, move from hiding spot to hiding spot, and only face the Wendigo in narrow passages were the flamethrower is most effective.
Honestly, the death scenes really struck me, because while some may have been done before, they are much more horrifying here, because you get more time with the characters and see their dynamics and relationships, which makes it all the more horrifying and sad when you fail to save them and are forced to watch them die. Who wasn't horrified when Jessica's horribly mangled corpse dropped down the elevator shaft? Or when Matt gets a hook through the mouth? Or even if Mike, Ash, _and_ Emily all burn to death in the lodge?
killing emily is such a missed and wasted opportunity. she’s the best character they said you can’t turn into a wendigo unless you result to cannibalism earlier. she has some of the best and funniest lines. she’s easily the smartest character of the bunch and the strongest next to mike. she held her own and has amazing survival instincts. i’ve been an emily defender since day 1 lol
@@Abandoned_Account88 true I think they should’ve at least showed a different side to Emily more often instead of the snarky smart bitch of the group. She even had a romantic scene with Matt that showed them having a decent relationship for a few minutes but made that an early purchase exclusive scene for some reason. I still love her but it wasn’t easy to lmao
they do, in a "deleted scene" (you can still see the scene if you have the deluxe version or smth) you see her and matt i think after the jessica emily fight and it brings a lot of insight inter her character by showing she really does care for matt@@nicsongerson4583
the problem with emily isn't that she's annoying it's that even in this cast of disgusting, horrible people, she stands head and shoulders over everyone as the worst and most irredeemable scumbag in the entire game. so no i'm not particularly impressed that the person who deserves to survive least happens to be the best at surviving.
I love that if Matt tries to save Emily and then survives, in her post credits scene, she starts rambling about how devoted she is to him, asking "he knows, right?"
@@patrickmarquez8307and if he abandoned her, and they have a good relationship, Emily still will care about Matt, which is stupid and lazy ass writing. Alternative scenario, where Matt tried to save Emily, both survived and they have a bad relationship. She will be mad at him, but it's like Matt still alive, it makes no sense why she would lie. And she knows that Matt is alive. It's really confusing
Late comment, but besides the evil painting of mentally ill Josh (which paints a harmful stereotype), I wanna point out how ACCURATE Josh's behavior is. I myself experienced psychosis (what most people think of when they hear that someone is 'crazy', bascially false perception of reality) and it's really really well written. The part about him saying something normal and logical one second and something insane another is really good, because people don't just become all crazy and stop making sense completely. Also even though Josh doesn't have a happy ending I absolutely LOVE the scene where Mike(?) finds Josh when he is hallucinating. I love that Mike still tries to snap him out of it and help him.
( just to clarify I've got similar diagnosis' & psychosis/delusion episodes- though very different traumas) I thought the portrayal was really really great, the most compassionate showing of trauma /grief /mental illness I'd seen in horror...honestly ever. It felt like a horrid storm built up, coupled with the little detail you can find that he was misdiagnosed and prescribed the wrong meds. He wasn't getting the help he needed, isolated and desperate. I think he really thought that "revenge" would fix the friend group in some delusional way too. My only issue was him having NO chance for a happy ending or even just barely living. I watched so many playthroughs and was heartbroken to learn he had to die. I don't personally like the narrative that a traumatized, mentally ill person is better off joining their dead loved ones instead of having the opportunity for help & healing. No you're never "fixed" but theres so many of us that have to recover in spite of a little voice that says death is "better/easier/what we deserve" so I think it would be great to have any hint at his friends, even after the shit he pulled, reaching out to help him when they see how sick he is. Especially after finding out their shitty actions led to his sister's (both required to make the wendigo) becoming the monster attacking them. Idk just seeing him have a little support even once his trauma & mess of a mind is on full display, would have meant a lot imo.
@jessieBird96 that's true, I think that's how we see the majority info on his actual mental health isn't it? Sam is of course one of my top favorites :') I'll have to check it out, I used to watch him years ago lol, thank you!
The game does not paint Josh as evil. For everything he did, the game is very sympathetic toward him and paints his death or Wendigo transformation as very tragic and sad.
I honestly couldn't see how long term a "happy Josh lives ending" would work story wise. He blames himself for his sister's deaths and got so obsessed with avenging them he tortured his closest friends to do so. I think Josh becoming a wendigo is the best ending for him as he is reunited with his sister and no longer blaming himself and feeling miserable. (Mostly Bec he's like dead and wendigoy but ya know)
@pianopuncher I said above already but I don't personally love the narrative that "broken hurt mentally ill people who have made bad choices, should die because that's the only way they can feel release/no pain". It's SO common in media, and a lot of us real people do take heart in characters that are broken & at their lowest still living & being given a chance to change/heal. He has parents that seem to love him, and miss their daughters already. He has friends that aren't guaranteed to hate him, we see them struggling with their feelings about it. He could get proper meds and in-patient treatment etc etc. You can enjoy that narrative, it doesn't make you a bad person! I just am tired of it, as the kinda person who has psychosis & lots of trauma, I like when media let's them live. Give the ill hurting person a chance to heal & try again. And not say "well your loved ones died and you think it's your fault, so really you should die too. There's no good option for you" especially when you get to save every other character, even the ones who did directly lead to Beth/Hanna's awful end.
I remember my blind playthough of Until Dawn, it was really awesome. I was lucky enough to get everybody out alive, and even did the weird flare gun choice with Matt to let him try and save Em while still not dying himself. I would totally play it all over again if I could, one of my favorite games I've ever played and by far the best interactive movie type game I have ever played.
The in-game given reason for Hannah attacking the other wendigos is because she was possessed by the strongest one. The night Hannah and Beth fell the stranger was hunting the Makkapitew or the biggest/baddest wendigo of them all. When a wendigo is "killed" its spirit is released until someone else succumbs to cannibalism and then they are possessed. So Hannah was possessed by the biggest baddest wendigo. I also fully believe that she remembers everything. She intentionally goes after certain characters like Jessica is her first victim and is brutally killed. Emily/Matt is usually the second victim and they were fully willing participants, Matt even held the camera. I could be wrong, but I don't think Hannah's wendigo went after Chris/Flamethrower Guy. Chris was innocent. Hannah never directly goes after Mike until the very end and you really have to fuck up to have Hannah kill him, and Hannah doesn't directly go after Sam either because Sam was her best friend and its very clear that Sam and Josh got really close. I read it as they had a thing for each other, at least Josh has a thing for Sam. But yeah, I definitely believe Hannah has her memories otherwise the ending where you find the journal is pointless. An astute player would already know its Hannah when they find the tattoo clue and see the tattoo on the wendigo without the big reveal moment. Edit: but the reveal of the wendigo during Mike's flashbacks to each time he saw a wendigo still give mes chills. The recognition and horror on his face is just SO GOOD. Especially after watching Emily be a fucking badass and we're all like "WTF IS THAT THING"! I know other comments have suggested playing The Quarry but I find is incredibly lackluster compared to Until Dawn. They rehash the same plot twists several times (though I give them credit for the Hackett Family twist), plus they underutilized the narrator and the family background. Spoilers for The Quarry: They should have made the curse go back MUCH farther and have Eliza be tied to the family in some way that makes her plot for vengeance have more depth and meaning. On the surface her motivations are very shallow.
Hannah's wendigo is the one that went after flamethrower guy (fun fact his name is Jack) and Chris since she looks very different from all the other wendigo and you can see her tattoo during the fight scene. But yeah she really picks on Jessica probably because of how Jessica "took her man". Also the fact she never kills Mike but would kill her best friend Sam shows how bad her obsession was with him.
@@purpleofpluto9694The only time Hannah goes after Mike is when you mess up during the final scene. Even then, she still doesn't kill Mike, only gravely injured him. He dies to the explosion and not the attack itself. She really had it DOWN BAD. It also makes more sense that Hannah remembers everything when you find out the game had initially planned for Chris to be an active participant in the prank. That's why some of his dialogue doesn't make sense when talking to Ashley. He's saying "we did" because they kept the original dialogue, and it was just an oversight not to re-record it.
@@MissSimone02 i really hope they polish some of the dialogue up to make sense in the remastered version, or at least explain that chris was a part of the prank (maybe got josh drunk so he wouldn't intervene, or knew about it and did nothing).
I'm late to the party but in Mike's chase scene to save jess, you have to do at least one risky path or you won't make it there in time. Really puts into perspective how they weighed risk and reward with the game.
Agreed. All you have to do is listen to what the stranger says. Anyone that does kill Emily just doesn’t like the character or maybe they weren’t paying attention but let’s be honest they just don’t like the character 😂
I mean personally, shooting Emily seems like a wonderfully tragic end to the character. I wouldn't do it on what I consider a 'canon' playthrough, but I can see the appeal. They're all terrified and some start to convince themselves that Emily is a threat to the moment of safety they found. I don't think it's supposed to be anything _but_ a stupid decision made by a bunch of traumatized teenagers turning on each other in desperation. Choices where they kill each other either intentionally or as a consequence of their actions is like they're metaphorically cannibalizing each other. It just turns the story into more of a Final Destination 'reap what you sow, but make it grusome' kind of horror. I honestly like endings where the only people who survive are the ones who weren't involved with the prank (I think just Sam and Chris iirc), making it all a horrible full circle But yeah most people do just shoot Emily because they think she's annoying lmao I just like to overthink things
@@emackenzie I personally think the best ending for the game involves Emily, Mike, and Sam being the only survivors. Emily & Mike are DIRECTLY the cause of the prank (Jessica too, but I think Emily's relationship with Mike says so much.) Samantha warning Hannah too also feels really involved IMO. There's a photo in game that shows Emily, Mike, Hannah, and Sam together -- I think those four being present in the finale means so so so much. Especially Emily, because in my honest opinion Hannah did her WRONG by trying to get with Mike.
@@emackenzie When people overthink, they can achieve the most profound insights. Your observation is on point. From the outside perspective, it's a stupid decision. For them, it was very real. It's a theme old as time, where when humans are put together in a desperate situation, they will start to turn on each other. Your comment how they are cannibalizing each other in a metaphoric way is very well said and adds more salt to the wound. It just shows once again how people can turn on you given the right circumstances. Nice one.
2 fun facts. 1st fact: If Josh is the sole survivor, we still see him as a partial wendigo, but no one is there to look for him. 2nd fact: If you paid very close attention to Josh's medical records(or watch the Game Theory episode like I did), you'll find out Josh has been receiving the wrong medication due a misdiagnosis. His meds were for treating depression, but Josh is actually schizophrenic.
Your play through has some of the best choices to me! Like of course Chris would pick his lifetime bff over his crush. Like of course Ashley would go to Jessica’s voice if she heard her in the mines it fits her character so much
Lol too bad the ashley one gets her killed, of course the worst choice I made was not saving Mike, which is something i"ll have to live with for the rest of my life
I have to disagree with the Ashley decision. Ashley is Canonically afraid of the dark, it’s one of the fear options Josh can have when asked about the barn and scarecrow picture at the beginning. I feel like if my biggest fear was the dark, I was terrified of everything and (in the moment) convinced I had a 50/50 of living by someone else’s decisions twice before this, then my friends left me alone in the dark and underground, all while people are dying (at minimum flame thrower dude), I would immediately circle back to the group. I would be done being put in situations that terrify me or could kill me. She also has to read the journal and comments on how they can mimic voices. Even if she doesn’t fully believe that it’s a wendigo mimic, you would think a character who’s has a personality trait of academic would have that in the back of their mind. Given everything else above, I feel like there’s no way in hell she goes over there. I do wish they gave an option to tell the group after but they don’t so… 🤷🏻♂️
I discovered this game through GTLive and was briefly obssessed with it, watching first compilations of all the deaths and police interviews, then gamers reacting to the more significant moments (Josh's first Saw trap, Jess's abduction, the Josh reveal, Emily's first Wendigo, and the ending). As other commentors have mentioned, I'm a little sad for your sake you werent able to have a perfect run, as it makes Sam and Mike that much more badass as they single-handedly hold the Wendigos' attention as Ash, Emily, Chris, Mike, and finally Sam herself all escape. Also, other fun "Hannah is somewhat still concious" evidence: she specifically has the most opportunities to kill Emily, and always goes for her face/head as best as she can. Of course she "saves" Josh, and cannot ever kill Mike, and fights the Wendigos to her own downfall, pulling back the one that almost stops Sam, her best friend, at the end.
what I do like about this game is that every character has a "main" death, they could've all died due to quick time events and stuff, but one death is always way more fleshed out than the others for each character. to me this is the "canon" ending for each character.
Jessica-falls down Elevator shaft with her jaw ripped out Matt-dragged to jaw hook. I still remember his mouth filling up with blood, alternatively the head crush by the wendigo is at least solid Chris-wendigo rips his head off and spikes it into the ground Ashley-trapdoor that the wendigo bursts through, bonus points for the sheer speed and suddenness Sam-doesn’t really have one, but I’d give it to the wendigo shoving it’s damn arm into her guts Mike-if he’s the last one in the lodge(sam dies), he breaks out the lighter and gets the heroic suicide death that takes down the wendigos Josh-head crushed or turns into a wendigo himself Emily-getting shot in the eye by Mike
Emily has always been such an interesting character to me, despite her initially coming off as rude and generally unlikeable I quickly found myself enjoying her more and more, especially after the tower goes down. She’s truly one of the most competent in the entire group, and her unwillingness to compromise at times is what allowed her to survive. Fantastic character. (Also bonus points for the absolutely incredible line ‘Understand the palm of my hand, bitch’)
i just gotta say: for those of us who used to watch supernatural (particularly early on), we knew what was up with the wendigo lol. it just felt kinda cool to see it pop up again in a popular game and be like "wait, holy shit, i know the rules of this creature!"
Well for the old Stephen King fan here, I saw the Wendigo and thought crap now I gotta figure out who's Wendigo I'm dealing with because the rules change. I feel bad for those taking FTG'S journal at face value. This game burns the over confident.
I love this video however there are a few things that seem to have been missed in this video that were explained in the game. 1) The wendis dont hunt in packs, they hunt alone, the reason they attacked eachother in the cabin was because they attack whatever moves, it doesnt matter if its animal, human, or wendi. 2) After a wendi has been killed its spirit circles the mountain until it can posses someone else trapped in the mines, the person possessed will then be overcome with an uncontrollable hunger, making them consider eating another human in order to satisfy that hunger. This is why Josh started feeding off the remains of whoever was killed and brought to the mines, because the spirit of the wendis that were killed by Mike, Sam, the Wendi hunter, etc.
I'm pretty sure the spirit doesn't posses you until you eat human meat. It doesn't posses you and make you eat, you have to make that decision on your own due to desperation. Hannah ate Beth because she was starving and that was the only food source, not because the spirit was telling her to do it. It's evident in Hannah's journal that after she did it, she started experiencing deranged cravings for human flesh and started transforming.
@@krahvata A passage from the strangers journal "When a human is desperate and craves food, trapped on the mountain in the fierce winter storms, when he has eaten nothing for many days, the Wendigo spirit will begin to possess him. Even the strongest man is weak to it. He will kill without remorse - often those companions who have travelled with him. He will eat the flesh raw from the corpses. I have seen this happen, for many years ago, a craving for flesh that cannot be sated. And then the change begins." Another entry in his journal states "But try NOT to kill them. Killing a Wendigo should be the last resort. Death releases the Wendigo spirit into the air." The spirit of the wendi possesses those who are trapped in the mines and become hungry, obviously the wendi possession isn't instantaneous but a possession does occur before the consumption of another human.
Can't stand emily at first but ashley is the worst for me..leaving sam if not for chris, letting chris die from the wendigo even tho she beg me to shoot her after saving her life the first time and then throwing emily out of the bus coz of her paranoia.. what a friend! Atleast emily actually done something and secured help to arrive. but then again I killed everyone for going to the switch too early.
Fun fact for you to hate ashley even more: So, you know when the characters traits are established in the beginning of the game, Ashley has the "Forthright" trait (which in my language was translated to "honest"). Well, later on, in the scene where she's with Chris on the basement of the house, they come across a video where the prank they pulled on hannah is shown. In this scene, you are given two choices when Chris asks Ashley why they did that, and if you choose to say that "it was a stupid prank, it was supposed to be funny. We are awful friends. Poor hannah, imagine being humilliated in front of your crush bla bla bla" (which is the dialogue choice most players take) and you go to the characters traits menu, you will see her HONESTY COMES DOWN. She does NOT mean what she said and lied, she probably doesn't feel guilty and just thinks hannah exagerated. Oof.
so you would save someone that tried to kill you if it meant putting your life in danger? if chris dies is because you made bad decitions, she does not own him anything, no need to put her life in danger, because she asked him to kill her once does no mean she is ok with dying for him again
@@anna.owo. That is the beauty of the game honestly if u played multiple times but in my 1st pt… If I was Ashley in that door, in front of me is Chris terrified waiting for me to open the door, the person who chose to save my life over his childhood friend and then going to kill himself just to save me again but didn’t because I asked him not to…..I WOULD DEFINITELY open the door to save him atleast this time I have that option. Unless everything I told Chris are all lies like we’re friends or I love him and “kill me and save yourself” then leaving the door close is justified heck I’ll even put up a finger on him while I step away. Psyche! Don't get me wrong I love her as a character game devs really stuck to her personality
@@anna.owo. Chris doesn't owe Ashley anything. He was given a choice between her life, or his -- and she said pick yourself. He picked himself. So she lets him die even though there's a GOOD chance to let him in? Acting like closing the door will stop it when it obviously won't is CRAZY.
Emily's my favorite character. She's a girlboss. In all seriousness, watching her go from a whiny girlfriend to then her surviving her fall and escaping that cave and the Wendigo (obviously, if you do all the QTEs correctly) gives me a lot of respect for her. Though I will say that she does push Matt around too much, and they definitely need to break it off because I think they just don't work together. Also, "Understand the palm of my hand, bitch" is one of the best lines I've ever witnessed in media.
Spoiledr One of the things I find interesting is that Chris is by far the most tortured character when it comes to the josh’s scheme shows the mental state Josh is in. Chris was the only one of the group who had nothing to do with the prank. He was passed out like Josh.
Josh blames himself for the death of his sisters. He was passed out drunk when the prank took place alongside Chris. I guess he projected his own guilt onto him.
I agree with everything but my only thing is that Josh didn't decide to be a cannibal to be with his sister - it's mentioned earlier that the spirit of the wendigo starts to posses people who are starving on the mountain. Since we've been killing them all game instead of trapping them like the stranger says, the spirits are free to go infect a new host. Also, Hannah definitely remembers. If you find the tattoo clue they show it in the game & that's why she takes Josh. They seem to have some level of consciousness for sure. Sorry if already mentioned in vid or other comments, I just wanted to say lol
hannah attacks the other wendigos in the cabin because wendigos can only see based on movement, so when she saw the other wendigos moving, she blindly attacked.
Because they're part of different packs. The miners all knew each other, therefore being part of the same pack. Hannah didn't, making them hostile. But because she was essentially the alpha Wendigo so she won.@@magmalecreme
I feel like the game was originally going for a "Your choices during therapy determine which horror sub-genre your story will be" I would have liked to have seen that version, but I fear it may have been "split up" too much for any one path to be particularly great. I really do enjoy the game we got, reguardless, and I still think about the story often. Great video! Love your channel name!
More cool police investigation fun facts: If Emily survived, she has four possible cutscenes regarding Matt, dependent on both whether or not Matt survived and on how good their relationship stat was. I'm assuming everyone says it in canon, but as the audience you're always gonna see exactly one scene of a character saying that there's something in the mines, with a hierarchy of whose scene you're gonna see depending on who is left alive. If Sam is alive, you're gonna see her account, but if she died and Mike is still alive, you'll see his, and if they're both dead- You get the deal. And if nobody survived but Josh, the cutscene changes, with nobody going to the Mines and Josh just casually staring into the camera while munching on Flamethrower Guy's head. (There's also a glitch in this alternate version of the cutscene where the guy's neck has a see-through texture in one shot.)
I know this is an older video but here’s a bit of trivia you might be interested in. If you choose zombies as one of the things you’re most afraid of during a Dr. Hill session (which I can see from this video that you DID), then it will affect Hill’s appearance. That gash on his head will appear, and the slow degradation of his appearance then follows suite. None of that will happen if you choose clowns or scarecrows as your “scariest” option.
I'll always remember Markiplier having a complete breakdown when he got Ashley killed. A solid like five minutes of him going through the 5 stages of grief before deciding to restart the entire game.
It’s crazy that I never knew that Jason graves composed this soundtrack! He made the soundtracks for all of the Dead Space games, and it’s music is one of the many reasons the games are so scary and atmospheric!
Theres a rare (rare cus everyone hates em) end credits Scene with Emily that i love. If mat chose to save her twice (make sure you have the flare gun on matt so he lives). She will ask if matt is well and ok
I’m sure this wasn’t on purpose but it’s so interesting that the actors for Matt and Jess have Disney channel backgrounds and are the least explored characters
I absolutely love this game. It really blew Telltale out of the water. You can play through this game so many times with so many little details altering. Like very small details. The Mike character can either go through absolute he'll and be all beat up by the end or literally get out with a scratch. 10/10 game right here. A must-own classic.
I will forever be defending Ashley. People hate Ashley, but actually they hate what THEY make her be. Ashley can be the nicest and also can be cold hearted. Same for Mike, when he kills Emily, yet nobody hates him. Ashley is extremely frightened by what's happening, I'd say she's way more affected by the horrors she experiences than the others. Not everyone can be a level headed badass in terrible situations. She explains several times how afraid she is and how she doesn't want to go on. Everyone is at their limits, but while some are able to muster up the will to move on (like Emily, Mike and Sam), others are not. Also, experiencing the boy you love to actually be ready to kill you would probably turn anyone against him. Yeah, she tells him to kill her instead, but ONLY if you point the gun at Chris first. If you point the gun at her first, she's begging not to be killed. Also, her saving Chris from the Wendigo by letting him inside puts ger at severe risk of being killed. We can see how close the Wendigo (Hannah) comes when following Chris and opening the door is highly risky. So exposing yourself to that risk for a person who was willing to sacrifice you...? I don't know. She's willing to take that risk when she knows that Chris is also willing to take that for her. The character I will always dislike the most is Hannah. Most people feel so sorry for her for the prank that's been done on her - and don't get me wrong, it was a disgusting prank. Yet she openly flirted with a guy who was in a relationship with one of her good friends, she was even willing to sleep with him (hence taking off her shirt). That's some shady behaviour and not something you do as a friend. Also, she's so passive and helpless and puts everyone in danger. Why running out of the cabin in the middle of the night during a snowstorm, knowing very well there are wild animals like wolves and bears outside, also knowing very well that your sister (Beth) will probably follow you (in one of the clues you find it tells that Beth was always looking out for Hannah and helping her, also when Beth finds the faked letter from Mike, she immediately says "what's our sister gotten into again this time?" Hinting that Hannah is usually getting herself into trouble and Beth is there to help her out)? Also, almost everyone walked in and out of that mine several times that night and Hannah wasn't able to do that for an entire month? Yes, it was said that her leg was broken, but still find it unrealistic, since the grave of Beth was found at a different spot than the place where Hannah and Beth crashed down, so Hannah must have been able to move around and bury her sister (carrying her sister, digging a grave, etc.). Given, the Flamethrower Guy and the police pretty much suck as well. The police for not finding shit, not in the mines, not in the sanatorium. And the Flamethrower Guy knowing fully well about the curse, killing the Makapetew Wendigo instead of capturing him, knowing his spirit goes out, waiting for a new victim and yet NOT checking on the sisters to make sure they are both dead... smh.
Another thing I liked was how certain totems were easy to find on purpose. Like in the beginning you get a death totem of someone dying in fire and then you see Mike explode and think he's done for
***SPOILERS*** My only real issue with the story is Josh picking on Chris seemingly the most, when Chris was passed out during the prank. Like… he wants to get revenge on his friends, but Chris was literally not involved in the prank at all. I would’ve wanted to get back at Mike the most, and it doesn’t seem like Josh ever had any plans to go down to the cabin to get him. Sam also didn’t participate, and tried to stop it from happening all together
its been a Very Long Time since ive played so i might be misremembering, but i think the reason chris (and ashley) got their own focused 'plotline' of josh's prank, which was inspired by the movies his parents were famous for, was because josh, ultimate chris/ashleyshipper, wanted to get them together by having his best friend be the big hero and save the girl. not great logic, but he definitely wasnt working with sound reasoning at the time...
@@katies678 I totally didn't get hyperfixated and rewatch the game, and now I can confirm that at the beginning that josh was talking to Sam and said Chris and just needed 'some kind of traumatic event' to bring them together and make them bond
leftie made a really good vid abt this but my fave theory is that josh chose to lash out on chris, his closest friend, because when ppl get hurt they are more inclined to hurt people that they care abt than the ppl who actually hurt them bc of this sense that when they enact this to ppl who r closer to them they might be less consequences and also this fear that they have of the ppl who actually did hurt them.
It's missable but there's very strong evidence Josh has a substance abuse issue, particularly antidepressants, and it's implied Chris knows about it. Josh could very well blame Chris for not stopping him from drinking until he passed out the night of the prank.
I love these game essays of yours, I also really enjoyed seeing a clip from your actual gameplay of this and the thought process you had through it. I’d really enjoy watching you actually play these games if you would release it!
This game pulls every horror movie trope and still succeeds at telling a terrifying and excellent story that is never predictable. I had no idea where the story was going at any given minute but it was clearly organized. That is impressive.
I also really love that by keeping the animals alive or nit harming them can stop some of the deaths from happening. Especially because killing for no reason is heavily frowned upon in native belief.
I think you may be one of the few people I've seen who actually liked Ashley's character. She's always been my favorite, I'm glad to see her get some appreciation!!
I'd love a video like this about the Quarry. I came to care about the characters more than the ones in Until Dawn. Excited to see Supermassive's next project too!!
Tbf, thinking back - Hannah was supposed to be close friends with Emily, and she tried to get with her close friends boyfriend behind her back - she's not innocent and Emily could've been more mad about it all than she actually was in her defence
For me the most realistic and fitting ending is Sam, Mike and Emily only survivors. The most carable survivors, who saves each other in some way. Emily save them by call a helicopter, Sam saves them by distracting the Wendigo, and the Mike, who originally come up with this plan. Sam easily could tell everything about Josh's prank to police, Emily could all about things in mines, and Mike could tell about things in sanatorium. Jessica - dies first, which is ironic, it was her idea to prank Hannah Matt - dies, after he tries to save Emily. He definetly not gonna leave her. Ashley - dies, when she wanna save "Jessica" Chris - same death, they both could not just leave Jess behind Josh - he could die or become a Wendigo, doesn't matter.
I think you're way too hard on Josh. He had hardcore schizophrenia, and wasn't getting treated for it. And the death of his sisters certainly made it worse. You can find documents saying he had mental illness since he was a kid, so that gives him a bit of motivation, and makes him a bit of a sympathetic character. Plus, nothing he does kills anyone, so all he did scare his "friends". Yet literally every other character can kill someone. So who's really the worse person?
I recently finished 100%ing The Quarry, and while that game is absolutely awesome, it made me think "wow, i want to play until dawn". Somehow this game still looks fucking amazing, the story still bangs, and the sound design still RULES, EIGHT YEARS LATER. All Supermassive has to do to make money at this point is port it to PC. Dont get me wrong; i love the dark pictures anthology and the quarry, but Until Dawn was one of the first games i ever bought and played on the PS4, and it set my standards pretty high. Great retrospective.
26:47 Another brilliant choice here is the minimal instructions on what exactly the lever does. Because you later learn that the decision didn't matter, the developers needed a way to keep the player from figuring that out as it would take them right out of the story. So the player's choice actually *does* affect something: the way they interpret this moment. The player--in the moment-- isn't entirely sure what they're choosing to happen and can only work on assumptions: Either the lever points to the person the saw will go to, or it will point to the person you want to save. If you think the lever says who you want to kill and you decide you want to kill josh, the game's events tell the player that they were correct. If the player thinks the lever points to who you want to live and you choose emily, the game tells you that is correct. The benefit being that the player suspects nothing and assumes they simply made the right choice. However! Say instead that the player wanted *emily* to die? It looks to the player like they misunderstood what the instructions were! And now they've accidentally killed their buddy that they were rooting for to survive! Which can really put the player in a moment of vulnerability as they are suddenly horrified by what they did. You get that from the other outcomes too, as it is a really grizzly fate, but the idea that you didn't *mean* to kill the guy just twists the knife a little more. Anyway tldr; I love this particular decision because of how it elegantly side steps the problem of "the player figures out the choices don't matter and get annoyed at us for it."
Discovered your channel from the Walking Dead videos - great stuff man, well written scripts, interesting content and interesting uploads - subbed and can't wait for more
Great video, and worth noting that the frame rate issues are fixed on PS5, but then there are some occasional immersion-breaking (but hilarious) glitches when a character is holding a lantern.
Great video, forgot about this games existence, would love to talk about it more but there's only so much I can pack into one TH-cam comment. Great job
My sister and I are actually currently playing though UD and it's been fun so far. She doesn't know anything about the game but I do but I'm avoiding spoiling her ^v^ We're up to the point where she had to choose to save Ash or Josh. I can't wait until she learns about the wendigos in the game. My role is really to be there for QTEs and don't move segments because I have slightly faster reaction times less shaky hands. If it wasn't for me, Jess would not have made it 😭
Another aspect of Until Dawn I think gets overlooked is the opening credits. I love that it foreshadows places/things the characters will eventually encounter and makes the player wonder about really happened in the Blackwood Mountains. The opening song slaps, and if you pay attention to it's lyrics, it tells the story of Hannah being trapped in the mines and her fate.
Man, I generally hate when people just shoot Emily. Its such a big sign the person playing straight up just doesnt listen to the actual game. You are very clearly told how someone changes. But outside of that, good video
something else I really like about this game is its emphasis on the butterfly effect. one thing can lead to another, if the people never pranked Hana or beth then josh would not have suffered as much, and wouldn't even think about pulling a twisted prank on his friend group and his friend group wouldn't even be in this situation in the first place. he wouldn't have died. granted I also do feel like josh deserves this ending. if he found out who the wendigo was he would have finally had that piece of mind that his sister survived if that makes sense but now he has to pay the consequences for what he did to his friends by then becoming the wendigo himself, but if he just went insane then and his sister kills him there, then it's also the price to pay, in the end, everyone had to pay the price for what happened. One last thing I believe about the wendigo is that is Hanna, I feel like she was protecting them. In the scene where Sam flicked the light switch we can see her attacking the wendigo that's going after sam during the slo-mo. I'd like to think that she does remember and forgives them and protects them from the other wendigos, and burning herself in there would not only allow her to protect her friends and the person she loved the most but also free herself from the wendigo spirit. off topic, I killed sam at the last minute on the stay sequence and I was sobbing but yeah, one of my favorite games overall! I liked this video!
this was so good!! very well written and analyzed, haven’t seen a video that described each aspect of the game so well since it came out in 2015. super refreshing to see a more updated review and perspective on the game, awesome job!!
I love finding small channels like this randomly. I love this game and you did a great job. With the work you put it I wish all the success to your channel
I especially love Until Dawn because of its characters, they have been the ones that hold up the game in my recent memory of it. The story is also very well crafted, but it's the realism they bring for me and how I can see myself in their positions that really make Until Dawn worth the ride.
46:00 the reason Ashley leaves Chris if he points his weapon at her isn't because she's mad at him it's because she's not all there and him trying to shoot her only worsens it.
This is super nostalgic to me for so many reasons. One of the last games I got to play with my best friend before she passed away. I remember cosplaying as ashley that halloween. Still one of my favorite games!!
OMG I was obsessed with this game when it came out!! I’ll never forget that time. Mike is my favorite character too!!! Awesome video, I haven’t seen an Until Dawn video even close to this
Found your channel like others here through your TWD vids in the middle of the night - looking for some video essays to chill some anxiety lol. I’m so glad I did! Your content is great man. Really well done, your scripts and editing are super concise and interesting to watch/listen to. I can’t wait for you to make more! Also, Until Dawn is a true banger of a game. Glad to find such a dope video on it :)
I really shocked this is the only game implemented the hold-still control all these years. That's the most immersive gameplay I've had in a horror game.
Ayyyyy, great video on one of my all time favourite games, I recommend checking out the rest of suppermassive's catalogue when you have a chance, specifically the quarry and house of ashes, but only when you feel comfortable, the best way to play these games is at your own pace, and I like your videos enough that I'll probably watch whatever you decide to make videos on next, just a little recommendation from me!
Emily is one of my favorite characters idk I love how this game really pushes horror character tropes too and it kinda forces you to keep Emily alive sometimes even when you try to be like “nah she can die” she’s useful and can save herself a lot. I also feel like people gloss over some of her cute scenes with Matt! Maybe I’m thinking of cut scenes tho..
how does he only have 2k when i first watched the walking dead video i assumed by the quality that this was probably just some youtuber with another 1 million who you seen then and there with a popular vid each year or so but he be dropping bomb asf shi every month
Characters who stood on business: -Mike (chops his finger off in the sanitorium to preserve the machete and then walks it off like a champ.) -Mike's Wolf (man's best friend fr) -Emily (she held her own in the mines) -Sam (straight badass especially in the final act) -Sam's towel (didnt even need adjusting or retying once for that whole act) -Rami Malek (not even Josh, just the actor Rami Malek for delivering that tragic Oscar worthy performance.)
Nice job with this video! It was neat to see someone revisit/summarize this game in 2023. I can't believe Until Dawn was released in 2015... It doesn't feel that long ago. Man, I'm old.
![One Step Forward, Two Steps Back - Analysing The Quarry [SPOILERS]](/img/n.gif)
Another post credit scene I love is when Ashley mentions hearing Jess in the mines but not going after her, and it cuts to the cops asking Jess about this and she just says "that wasn't me" in such an eerie way
That is really cool. Dang i wish I didn't get ashley killed lol
It almost like the windeggo was playing a PRANK
@@rio23xh89It was just a prank, Han!
Yeah it's sorta creepy when the Windigo can mimick voices just to lure victims
@@qasemrimawi568it was just a hank, Pran!
Ashley's death in the mines is one of my favorite moments in the game because it's the ultimate test of any horror fan's credibility. It's the most stereotypical scenario in which a character in a horror movie can die a stupid death, splitting off from the main group to investigate a strange noise she heard down a dark mineshaft, even though she knows there are monsters out there that can kill her. And you are given multiple opportunities to back out of it.
And so many people fell for it.
And bc of ashley being “an academic” does read that they can mimic voices! they give you the information and not paying attention means: make stupid decisions, die stupid deaths lol?
Omg I never even realized that and I’m someone obsessed with horror movies! I think I was so caught up in making sure everyone live and didn’t want any secrets or ppl left behind
@@tallybarnie5453 yea!! it’s so neat ik a lot of people don’t totally understand that characteristics lvl thing but i think it was kind of a challenge to instead of playing the way you want, to play as the characters are. ashley being honest+cowardly, sam being charitable and brave ect. and even if you do that, i think they’d all still live maybe? idk it’s so interesting!
I know right?!? I'm a huge horror fan, I went, luckily was able to collect the totem, while also saying, "Nope, that's a trick. I'm out." plus they said like in the chapter earlier how they can perfectly mimic human behavior, yeah no, don't ever answer the random banging trap door lol.❤i was able to save everyone except Matt, who I think everyone got killed because the one choice that keeps him alive is so lame. He suggests going to the Radio tower and you have to immediately say no u don't want to go, how are you supposed to know that? I think they purposely did that because Black people always die super easily, maybe not overtly but come on. Also Emily the bitch and most hated goes through so much and it is hard to keep her alive on that chase from the mines. I did cheat with the motion controls, just set down the controller lol. I just hate how u can't skip the previously on when you want to replay. Great game though, I was always interested and a great twist, I mean I kinda found it obvious it was Josh but the wendigo twist was awesome.
Not to mention it also tests wendigo knowledge, as it's said that being able to mimic voices is a trait wendigos have had historically.
The reason Jessica seems to be forgotten about is because the devs intended to have Jessica die no matter what but it was decided later to have a choice to keep her alive. I'm guessing that's why there is an achievement for keeping her alive as well.
Yeah I heard about that after making the video lol, that makes sense
I thought that wasn’t true, as even in the early prototypes she can survive and the same events play out where she’d wake up in the mines but the only difference was that she was in the snow mobile with everybody else while escaping down the mountain
Actually it wasn't but the actor of Jess had to act in mean girls 2 so she had to stop working on it but finished acting in mean girls 2 but came back when development was almost done
Jess is one of my fav along with emily.this game was so good at making unlikable characters likeable.emily has the best lines in the game lol
@@avalovestodan6891this game is way more successful than mean girls 2, she shouldve stayed on this project tbh
I remember playing this game on a holloween night with a big group of friends, we each switching controller on different acts.
We legit finished the game at dawn, with everyone alive. it was sick.
Damn that sounds so fun
everyone!? dude that's so cool, what's the result for you?
that sounds so awesome. wish i had a experience like that
I had a similar experience with my friends and a few of my family members but we got Matt,Chris,and Emily killed,one of my friends was curious to what would happen if you just shot Emily and I kid you not he was like “oh” we all made fun of him for the rest of the night for being stupid,Chris was my fault I wasn’t paying attention and Matt was pure bullshit,hook to face
I recently played the game with my friend, each played 4 characters, 2 guys and 2 guys and each of us got one character killed
(Jess and Sam)
If you collect all totems, the game gives an explanation why Hannah's wendigo is so big compared to the rest and why she's killing other wendigos: she was possessed by the Makkapitew, a very powerful Wendigo that the stranger and his family had been fighting for generations. The Makkapitew was the wendigo that chased Hannah and Beth in the prologue, meaning it was the wendigo that the stranger killed before trying to help the girls. Wendigo souls circle around until another person resorts to cannibalism, and Hannah did just that soon after the Makapitew was killed, so it possessed her body, and in turn she became the new Makapitew.
Hence why the stranger himself said in his book that you should only kill a wendigo as a last resort. The one time he decided to go against his own rules (by killing the Makkapitew as a means to avenge the twins), it ironically led to his own demise later on. Man, does this game has such clever symbolisms.
Which is alsp the soul wendingo face coming out the cabin at the very end right before we head the helicopter
I wonder what the range of makapitew is because I wonder if Josh would become the next Makapitew from where he is in the epilogue
And the cycle continued, with Josh being possessed by it.
@@megadunsparce3672 probably, haha.
When Sam blows the house up, you can see the wendigo that possessed Hannah flying around. It was the only one wandering through the mountains, which means that Josh has a higher chance of being possessed by the Makkapitew.
the people that hated Emily really missed out on the iconic "understand the palm of my hand b*tch"
i liked her better with every playthrough i saw of this game (quite a few) and i think it is highly problematic how people actually think it's okay to actively murder her (not just let her die passively but directly shoot her in the face without any real reason), just because she is not likeable, not conforming to the sexist demand that girls and women better have a pleasing, accomodating personality and never tell it like it is, or else. like, the blatant misogyny of it. she never actually hurt anyone or even put anyone in danger (and matt is free to break up with her any time. how dare players paint him as her victim!) - unlike mike, who everybody is willing to accept as the great hero despite being the main protagonist of the "prank" that got the whole thing started - that got two innocent people killed right away. just because he is charismatic and "didn't mean to", he can't be accountable? that's some major BS right there! i think it's absolutely great that the game gives players the choice to kill emily in that way though. it shows how aware the creators are of these deeply ingrained societal dynamics. i'm just shocked how many players never realise what they are doing to emily, how they are publicly proving their rotten morals and what mindless drones they really are. i even saw one of them replay the whole game just to kill emily that time. and he was and still is a very popular influencer. just yikes.
right! like even though she was a mean girl type character she ended up being one of my favorites because of her iconic lines lmao
@@sujammaz YESS exactly this!
fr emily is a great character to observe in this game!
@@navillerax the lines are great too, yes ^^
It would've been a cool way for Jess to get more screentime if she met up with Emily while she was in the mines and they had to work together to survive
That would've been so much cooler
that’s actually an amazing idea that would be so fire!
That would have been sick. But then their build up to Ashley hearing Jess' voice wouldn't have worked but they could have incorporated it some how
That wasn't Jess
@@GRYPHOmn I know it was the wendigo imitating her. But I mean the initial set up wouldn't have worked. If you have Jess alive up until that point with Ashley they show a brief scene of Jess alive in the mines hearing a wendigo. This helps trick the player into investigating the voice
I'll never forget watching Markiplier play this game, and he went to check out the voice as Ashley and got her killed and he freaked out, refusing to let that be it, so he started the whole game over just to save her. I feel like the choice to have Ashley go investigate the voice or not is not only to see if you're paying attention to the journal, but also just if you know horror movies in general. Don't split the group is like horror movie 101.
Also my wife was with her ex when this came out and she was only passively seeing bits of him play, but she figured out it was a wendigo real fast and he was so mad that he didn't figure it out.
Lol you talking about yo wife's exs more than she do I bet.
there’s actually a totem of you choose to have ashley investigate the sound, she lives and meets back up with the group as long as you don’t open the trap door
@@irini03 I didn't even know you could avoid opening the trap door.
@@Linaxticyou can:
- ignore the door and meet w/ the others
- open the door and die immediately
- open the lock but not tue door, try to walk away and then get killed by the wendigo a few moments later. And this event can happen with Chris too! Though I forgot what were the conditions for him to be there instead of her.
You just tell him he could take a moment to catch up after resting his ankle for a minute. If Ashley was already killed, then Chris gets killed when he also chooses to investigate. You do not get to choose whether he investigates or not, that's something he automatically does.
Emily is a very interesting character cause she is annoying and entitled (and straight up abusive towards Matt tbh), but she's also competent and fierce in a way that shows when she finds herself in the mines. Also, the choice to kill her is like, "being a dick is not an offense punishable by death" which you kinda gotta remind yourself lmao She was unapologetically an asshole and you still gotta keep her alive, cause yknow, none of those kids should die, even the worse one
how was she abusive toward matt? the worst thing i recall her doing to him is her making him get her bags. and i wouldn't say shes the worst character, i mean to put it in context, if ur BEST FRIEND got with ur (ex? timeline isn't clear) boyfriend you'd be mad too
@@vic-xp8ky I don't really remember either tbh but she did try to trick him into investigating a tree that she acted like something inside grabbed her 😭
@@thisisfine7697 it was just a prank, matt
@@vic-xp8kyshe was verbally abusive, the way she treated Matt isn't acceptable. Like,,,,,, Matt is doing his fucking best and she goes out of her way to berate him, I got Matt killed because I desperately tried to make Emily see him in a better light and bitch literally went and said in the end credits she HOPES he's dead??????? 😭 I'm sorry, Matt, RIP in peace
@ShieniLicksOnLemons After everything they experienced and know about what goes on on that mountain, being dead is the better option.
The craziest butterfly effect for me starts in the beginning. I had seen the start of a play through on TH-cam and they didn’t shoot the squirrel as Chris and I wondered what would happen so I shot it and a bird attacks Sam and scratches her. Later on when Josh is chasing her as the killer and you have to break down the door I got it down but she hits her head and opens up the cut which leads to Josh finding her even if you complete the don’t move while hiding
Holy shit thats crazy
That's honestly awesome
Also if you're routinely a dick to the wildlife (squirrel and the bird during the snowball fight) the deer will actually be hostile to you.
Holy shit that is actualy crazy
Oh. Yes. Who was that? I saw that forever ago!
I must say, I always really hated the fact that josh didn’t have a happy ending. Especially in the horror genre it’s a huge trope to villainize the 'mentally ill character', and so when I first played until dawn I was really surprised how they subverted my expectations on that. They actually made an effort to show that Josh was extremely traumatized from what happened to his sisters and was in fact suffering from severe hallucinations and delusions that led him to believe what he was doing was just a funny prank. They also made it very clear that josh never intended to hurt anybody, his deluded mind just couldn’t tell that he was going too far.
Now of course none of this excuses the mental terror he caused his friends, but I still think him being the only character who can’t survive the night really sucks. I mean heck some of the other characters can do some really awful things too depending on choices, like Mike shooting Em, Ashley leaving Chris to die or Sam blowing up the lodge at the very end with everyone still inside just to safe herself. So yea,, it just doesn’t really sit right with me josh is literally the only one doesn’t get a good ending no matter what
Yeah it would've been cool to see a redemption ending for him, especially if they made it difficult to get.
Well he CAN survive, it’s just that if he does he’ll become a wendigo.
@@anthonyhack1164so...he doesn't survive. You're only right on a technicality and are missing the point of the post
I couldn't agree more! And in the end Mike became my least favorite character because 1. he's an ass 2. he barely hesitates to point a gun at/kill Emily with no proof to back up Ashley's freak out idea and 3. relating to this comment - he abandons Josh, which directly leads to Josh dying or being turned into a wendigo. He wasn't this cowardly with any of the others and he just never seemed to actually care about Josh. Josh deserved better, he was sick. And Sam could only do so much as a friend and a teenager before and after Josh went into a manic state/psychosis. To this day it makes me really sad that Josh can't have a good ending.
Thank you! I always felt so bad for Josh! On my 1st play through I tried to wake him up as Beth, and when I saw him again (I loveee rami, so) I was automatically sympathetic,
Only wanted to punch him a little bit when he said that stuff about Ashley xD
But he was just a teen/Y.A who lost his little sister's. As an older brother it was probably instilled in him to protect the twins... nit to mention he was black out drunk the night they went missing (Beth dieing and Hannah being trapped) he blames his friends but also HIMSELF
I was on team Josh the whole time. (Even tho I did save Ashley over Josh at the saw, I felt thats what chirs would do)
The people who suffered the most were the Washington parents they lost their three children in a year
Facts!
So damn true... what a horrid loss.
3?
@@eh6623 Josh, Beth, Hannah
@@1995robin wasn’t the prologue like 5 years before the actual game?
I'm a bit sad you didn't get to witness Sam's absolute badassery at the final scene in the lodge when she purposefully gets Hannah's attention like 3-4 times to allow everyone else to get out of the building before flipping the switch. I suppose that's the beauty of these games tho if they are done right. Very nice video essay by the way, glad people are still talking about this game.
I wish I was able to do it correctly lol, thanks
I think my favourite one is when you successfully get everyone else out of the lodge and you fuck up with sam so she isnt able to flip the switch, and then mike uses his pocket lighter to light the explosion, sacrificing himself to save everyone else.
My character observations from someone who has been obsessed w this game since it cane out:
Ashley + Matt: lovely people in normal circumstances, but in a crisis they have potential to make hasty/bad decisions.
Mike + Emily: absolute twats in normal circs, but good in a crisis so everyone likes them by the end.
Jess: kinda similar to Mike and Em. bit of a dickhead in normality, but is beaten up so much by the game that everyone likes her at the end.
Sam + Chris: just lovely delightful people, they cope well in a crisis and don't make decisions that hurt anyone (apart from shooting the squirrel Chris what the fuck)
Josh: bless him idk he's trying his best
Lmao 😂
honestly, chris what the fuck? nah but all the animal scenes genuinely piss me off, like i get why it’s there but like… shooting the squirrel, killing the already dying animal, and using the axe on the deer????!?!?! you gotta be seriously fucked in the head.
Idk what psycho would shoot an animal right after being told sometimes doing nothing is the right move 😂
I kinda wished Emily ended up the one with Jessica at the end just to see how they went from fighting and bickering in the beginning to having to depend on each other and survive the night like that would’ve been so good
Ooh, love this idea. It would have been great to see more Emily and Jess interactions. Especially since they used to be best friends- maybe there'd be a full circle arc where they remember why they were friends to begin with (or not depending on player choice) with the ability to repair their relationship by the end of the night.
@@chibivampiregirl this is what im saying, they literally had a build up for their redemption arc with the fight they had. but they just left that to be a wasted potential and make them never meet again that night lol
emily was my favorite because of how hard she fought. She was so strong in the chase scenes. She had one of if not the best chase scene in the game.
I suppose that's fair. She just rubbed me the wrong way for some reason.
I hated Emily my first play through when I was younger, but after playing it again recently, it’s just so satisfying playing as someone smart, quick on their feet, and athletic, it’s how I wish I would do in the scenario. Emily is now contender for my favorite cuz she’s such a badass😂
I know Emily gets a lot of hate in the community (at least when I first watched the games wayback then), but I loved Emily. Even back then. When she wasn't being an obvious bitch she was acting intelligent. Wanting to signal for help and trying the radio. Sure, she was rude about things like asking Matt for help multiple times, but she actually did smart things(even when she wasn't aware the threat was supernatural) and did the best to her ability. So I can honestly forgive the bitch slap she gives Ashley if she gets bit, mostly because Ashley literally pulls that out of her ass. Like girl, do you turn into a squirel when you get bit by them?
@@FEKana I also love Emily and found it easy to sympathize with some of her actions. One of her best friends stole her boyfriend, her current boyfriend during certain choices can leave her to die, another one of her friends makes the baseless assumption about bites and FREAKS out causing her exboyfriend to point a gun at her and in some cases murder her. ON TOP OF leaving out the only scene of her being a normal person in the most played version of the game. aka not the pre-sale/extended version. While everyone else, despite horrible actions - have scenes to make them easier to sympathize with. Emily is done dirty by this fanbase in my opinion lmao.
I loved em.she literally has best chase scene.she was such a likable bitoch trope.for me I found her really funny.
The biggest revelation for me with this game was when even after watching so many let's plays, it wasn't until I watched my girlfriend play it that I realized the game wants you to play the characters and not yourself. She was really into going by the personality and relationship screens when making choices. Almost every time it was the better choice.
ikr? so ambitious and elaborate to design the story this way 😻
When I played and I heard Jessica's voice, I remembered that book immediately and said "Nope!"
She lived because I was a coward.
Nah you lived cause you were smart lol
Emily’s chase earned my respect for her, she was just as much of a survivor as mike
I loved Emily, she got shit done. Most people just don't like mean girls but she was smart, cunning, and a survivor.
Well yeah, most people don’t like it when others are jerks, even if they are “smart”
@@jagerbaby8628 theyre loss i guess
i agree she's one of my favorites. unapologetically an asshole lol
@@jagerbaby8628nah she had every reason to be mad, her best friend got with her boyfriend (ofc i only mean being mean to jess and mike, but honestly a lot of the stuff she said abt the other characters was right)
You can be decent (not a saint) and smart, you know.
At first, I really like Ashley and Chris because I related to them so much. After years, Emily has become my favorite. There’s soemthing so fierce about her route, barely surviving the tower fall then fighting her way out of the mines, and her mean girl attitude was so fun to see throughout the game even if it was annoying.
emily is my all time favorite character!!! she’s such a badass and really smart too, i can quote that scene with her and jessica fighting from memory lol
Emily has helped me in arguments too.
i noticed that with the vast majority of popular youtuber playthroughs they HATED emily at first, but once they get to her surviving the tower and being in the mines, they end up loving her purely for how hard she fights to survive and how smart she is.
@@shadycatz85 So far most youtubers seem to remember Mike and Sam more than Emily. Emily seem to only be popular online, I still like her as a character. Emily seems to get hated a lot outside of the internet.
I chose to point the gun at Ashley because she said something along the lines of "you saved me, now let me save you. " And she still held it against Chris, refusing to let him in.
Really shows that the two-faced side of her displayed in the beginning prank were her true colors all along.
It's different when it's you.
Iirc her feelings about the prank were also iffy, hinting that she didn't feel that bad about it or only felt bad because the twins died. At least Em and Jess are honest about being mean girls. Ashley is a snake.
I totally get being traumatized and breaking at that point and having mixed feelings at having your crush point a gun at you but she told him to do it! IMO that reaction should have only been triggered if Ashley didn't say the line. Simply have her relationship with Chris drop but have her open the door for him or hesitate then as she goes to unlock the door, she's too late.
Ffs she was even egging on Mike to shoot Emily. Ashley just really sucks.
well you saved her, she saved you then is your turn to save her by dying outside alone like the dog you are. YYou guys are delutional if you would save someone that moments ago was about to kill you.
@@anna.owo.If I literally told them to kill me, then yeah, I would happily save them. We're not all psychos.
It adds more to her character. Everyone is two-faced to some extent, you just don't know who. It makes her more interesting and it gives dynamic to a variety of personalities within characters.
I love the implication in the credits that Mike spends the rest of his life in jail if he shoots Emily (assuming he survives, of course). Well deserved for that ridiculous choice lol. It's so silly, wendigos aren't zombies.
It's a silly decision but logic would go out the window. Imagine going on a trip and then being chased by flesh hungry creatures.
Logic would go out the window, debates on zombies wouldn't even cross the mind.
Realistically they should of locked themselves in that room till morning but again logic went out the window lol.
@@ciarajones4970especially since, while they are more known about now, those monsters weren’t well known(outside of some tribes native Americans or people interested in their myths) back then. The human brain is really good at looking for patterns. You’ve just found out that a decrepit creature who was once human who feasts on human flesh exists, what other monster does that sound like. The same monster that’s always spread through bites
@@Wwhdduendjdhhfmwosdn the folklore Wendigo also looks very different compared to the until dawn wendigo.
Imo the until dawn wendigo looks terrifying compared to the folklore version.
@@ciarajones4970 Yeah but like you don't kill them until they actually start presenting signs 😭it was s dumb choice
@@lauraitzel8334 Agreed, it's like killing someone who was just sneezed on just cause you're afraid of them having the black plague 😭
45:14 the reason he dies is because Chris while running got in the way of the flamethrower throwing off the stranger and getting him killed. Also he isn’t used to having to watch another persons back which split his attention
I suppose that's true
I'm going to add that he also makes a comment like "we're out in the open" when Handigo is attacking, implying that he would never have put himself in that situation to begin with and only did it because Chris insisted on saving Josh and he refused to let him go alone. He more likely typically used the strategies we see him employ in the early game: stay stealthy and quiet, move from hiding spot to hiding spot, and only face the Wendigo in narrow passages were the flamethrower is most effective.
Honestly, the death scenes really struck me, because while some may have been done before, they are much more horrifying here, because you get more time with the characters and see their dynamics and relationships, which makes it all the more horrifying and sad when you fail to save them and are forced to watch them die. Who wasn't horrified when Jessica's horribly mangled corpse dropped down the elevator shaft? Or when Matt gets a hook through the mouth? Or even if Mike, Ash, _and_ Emily all burn to death in the lodge?
“IT WAS JUST A PRANK HAAAN!” Is a line that will never not be funny. The way it’s delivered is just iconic
I found it to be gross especially since Hannah ran out of the house CRYING
killing emily is such a missed and wasted opportunity. she’s the best character they said you can’t turn into a wendigo unless you result to cannibalism earlier. she has some of the best and funniest lines. she’s easily the smartest character of the bunch and the strongest next to mike. she held her own and has amazing survival instincts. i’ve been an emily defender since day 1 lol
Honestly if she was less annoying she would definitely be most peoples fan favorites
@@Abandoned_Account88 true I think they should’ve at least showed a different side to Emily more often instead of the snarky smart bitch of the group. She even had a romantic scene with Matt that showed them having a decent relationship for a few minutes but made that an early purchase exclusive scene for some reason. I still love her but it wasn’t easy to lmao
they do, in a "deleted scene" (you can still see the scene if you have the deluxe version or smth) you see her and matt i think after the jessica emily fight and it brings a lot of insight inter her character by showing she really does care for matt@@nicsongerson4583
the problem with emily isn't that she's annoying it's that even in this cast of disgusting, horrible people, she stands head and shoulders over everyone as the worst and most irredeemable scumbag in the entire game. so no i'm not particularly impressed that the person who deserves to survive least happens to be the best at surviving.
@@MalkuthSephira but the only reason the others had the chance to survive is emily though?
I love that if Matt tries to save Emily and then survives, in her post credits scene, she starts rambling about how devoted she is to him, asking "he knows, right?"
It's dependent on the relationship, if Emily has a bad relationship she would talk badly about Matt and hopes he would die despite Matt saving her.
@@patrickmarquez8307and if he abandoned her, and they have a good relationship, Emily still will care about Matt, which is stupid and lazy ass writing. Alternative scenario, where Matt tried to save Emily, both survived and they have a bad relationship. She will be mad at him, but it's like Matt still alive, it makes no sense why she would lie. And she knows that Matt is alive. It's really confusing
Late comment, but besides the evil painting of mentally ill Josh (which paints a harmful stereotype), I wanna point out how ACCURATE Josh's behavior is. I myself experienced psychosis (what most people think of when they hear that someone is 'crazy', bascially false perception of reality) and it's really really well written. The part about him saying something normal and logical one second and something insane another is really good, because people don't just become all crazy and stop making sense completely. Also even though Josh doesn't have a happy ending I absolutely LOVE the scene where Mike(?) finds Josh when he is hallucinating. I love that Mike still tries to snap him out of it and help him.
( just to clarify I've got similar diagnosis' & psychosis/delusion episodes- though very different traumas) I thought the portrayal was really really great, the most compassionate showing of trauma /grief /mental illness I'd seen in horror...honestly ever. It felt like a horrid storm built up, coupled with the little detail you can find that he was misdiagnosed and prescribed the wrong meds. He wasn't getting the help he needed, isolated and desperate. I think he really thought that "revenge" would fix the friend group in some delusional way too. My only issue was him having NO chance for a happy ending or even just barely living. I watched so many playthroughs and was heartbroken to learn he had to die. I don't personally like the narrative that a traumatized, mentally ill person is better off joining their dead loved ones instead of having the opportunity for help & healing. No you're never "fixed" but theres so many of us that have to recover in spite of a little voice that says death is "better/easier/what we deserve" so I think it would be great to have any hint at his friends, even after the shit he pulled, reaching out to help him when they see how sick he is. Especially after finding out their shitty actions led to his sister's (both required to make the wendigo) becoming the monster attacking them. Idk just seeing him have a little support even once his trauma & mess of a mind is on full display, would have meant a lot imo.
@jessieBird96 that's true, I think that's how we see the majority info on his actual mental health isn't it? Sam is of course one of my top favorites :') I'll have to check it out, I used to watch him years ago lol, thank you!
The game does not paint Josh as evil. For everything he did, the game is very sympathetic toward him and paints his death or Wendigo transformation as very tragic and sad.
I honestly couldn't see how long term a "happy Josh lives ending" would work story wise. He blames himself for his sister's deaths and got so obsessed with avenging them he tortured his closest friends to do so. I think Josh becoming a wendigo is the best ending for him as he is reunited with his sister and no longer blaming himself and feeling miserable. (Mostly Bec he's like dead and wendigoy but ya know)
@pianopuncher I said above already but I don't personally love the narrative that "broken hurt mentally ill people who have made bad choices, should die because that's the only way they can feel release/no pain". It's SO common in media, and a lot of us real people do take heart in characters that are broken & at their lowest still living & being given a chance to change/heal.
He has parents that seem to love him, and miss their daughters already. He has friends that aren't guaranteed to hate him, we see them struggling with their feelings about it. He could get proper meds and in-patient treatment etc etc.
You can enjoy that narrative, it doesn't make you a bad person! I just am tired of it, as the kinda person who has psychosis & lots of trauma, I like when media let's them live. Give the ill hurting person a chance to heal & try again. And not say "well your loved ones died and you think it's your fault, so really you should die too. There's no good option for you" especially when you get to save every other character, even the ones who did directly lead to Beth/Hanna's awful end.
I remember my blind playthough of Until Dawn, it was really awesome. I was lucky enough to get everybody out alive, and even did the weird flare gun choice with Matt to let him try and save Em while still not dying himself.
I would totally play it all over again if I could, one of my favorite games I've ever played and by far the best interactive movie type game I have ever played.
I would agree with you there! Nice job on saving everybody lol
The in-game given reason for Hannah attacking the other wendigos is because she was possessed by the strongest one.
The night Hannah and Beth fell the stranger was hunting the Makkapitew or the biggest/baddest wendigo of them all. When a wendigo is "killed" its spirit is released until someone else succumbs to cannibalism and then they are possessed. So Hannah was possessed by the biggest baddest wendigo.
I also fully believe that she remembers everything. She intentionally goes after certain characters like Jessica is her first victim and is brutally killed. Emily/Matt is usually the second victim and they were fully willing participants, Matt even held the camera. I could be wrong, but I don't think Hannah's wendigo went after Chris/Flamethrower Guy. Chris was innocent. Hannah never directly goes after Mike until the very end and you really have to fuck up to have Hannah kill him, and Hannah doesn't directly go after Sam either because Sam was her best friend and its very clear that Sam and Josh got really close. I read it as they had a thing for each other, at least Josh has a thing for Sam. But yeah, I definitely believe Hannah has her memories otherwise the ending where you find the journal is pointless. An astute player would already know its Hannah when they find the tattoo clue and see the tattoo on the wendigo without the big reveal moment.
Edit: but the reveal of the wendigo during Mike's flashbacks to each time he saw a wendigo still give mes chills. The recognition and horror on his face is just SO GOOD. Especially after watching Emily be a fucking badass and we're all like "WTF IS THAT THING"!
I know other comments have suggested playing The Quarry but I find is incredibly lackluster compared to Until Dawn. They rehash the same plot twists several times (though I give them credit for the Hackett Family twist), plus they underutilized the narrator and the family background.
Spoilers for The Quarry:
They should have made the curse go back MUCH farther and have Eliza be tied to the family in some way that makes her plot for vengeance have more depth and meaning. On the surface her motivations are very shallow.
Hannah's wendigo is the one that went after flamethrower guy (fun fact his name is Jack) and Chris since she looks very different from all the other wendigo and you can see her tattoo during the fight scene. But yeah she really picks on Jessica probably because of how Jessica "took her man". Also the fact she never kills Mike but would kill her best friend Sam shows how bad her obsession was with him.
@@purpleofpluto9694The only time Hannah goes after Mike is when you mess up during the final scene. Even then, she still doesn't kill Mike, only gravely injured him. He dies to the explosion and not the attack itself. She really had it DOWN BAD.
It also makes more sense that Hannah remembers everything when you find out the game had initially planned for Chris to be an active participant in the prank. That's why some of his dialogue doesn't make sense when talking to Ashley. He's saying "we did" because they kept the original dialogue, and it was just an oversight not to re-record it.
@@MissSimone02 i really hope they polish some of the dialogue up to make sense in the remastered version, or at least explain that chris was a part of the prank (maybe got josh drunk so he wouldn't intervene, or knew about it and did nothing).
@@purpleofpluto9694 I'm really excited for the remastered version! I agree, I hope they fix the dialogue and add in the Emily and Matt scene.
I'm late to the party but in Mike's chase scene to save jess, you have to do at least one risky path or you won't make it there in time. Really puts into perspective how they weighed risk and reward with the game.
From my understanding, you’re only allowed to do one slow path and/or one missed QTE or else Jess WILL die.
Killing Emily was a stupid decision. It doesn’t even make sense. Why would she turn into wendigo?! And you killed the best character. I stand by that!
Agreed. All you have to do is listen to what the stranger says. Anyone that does kill Emily just doesn’t like the character or maybe they weren’t paying attention but let’s be honest they just don’t like the character 😂
@@thatoneguy1232it says a lot about a person too that they think being an asshole is enough to warrant killing them haha
I mean personally, shooting Emily seems like a wonderfully tragic end to the character. I wouldn't do it on what I consider a 'canon' playthrough, but I can see the appeal. They're all terrified and some start to convince themselves that Emily is a threat to the moment of safety they found. I don't think it's supposed to be anything _but_ a stupid decision made by a bunch of traumatized teenagers turning on each other in desperation. Choices where they kill each other either intentionally or as a consequence of their actions is like they're metaphorically cannibalizing each other. It just turns the story into more of a Final Destination 'reap what you sow, but make it grusome' kind of horror. I honestly like endings where the only people who survive are the ones who weren't involved with the prank (I think just Sam and Chris iirc), making it all a horrible full circle
But yeah most people do just shoot Emily because they think she's annoying lmao I just like to overthink things
@@emackenzie I personally think the best ending for the game involves Emily, Mike, and Sam being the only survivors. Emily & Mike are DIRECTLY the cause of the prank (Jessica too, but I think Emily's relationship with Mike says so much.) Samantha warning Hannah too also feels really involved IMO. There's a photo in game that shows Emily, Mike, Hannah, and Sam together -- I think those four being present in the finale means so so so much. Especially Emily, because in my honest opinion Hannah did her WRONG by trying to get with Mike.
@@emackenzie When people overthink, they can achieve the most profound insights. Your observation is on point. From the outside perspective, it's a stupid decision. For them, it was very real. It's a theme old as time, where when humans are put together in a desperate situation, they will start to turn on each other. Your comment how they are cannibalizing each other in a metaphoric way is very well said and adds more salt to the wound. It just shows once again how people can turn on you given the right circumstances. Nice one.
2 fun facts.
1st fact: If Josh is the sole survivor, we still see him as a partial wendigo, but no one is there to look for him.
2nd fact: If you paid very close attention to Josh's medical records(or watch the Game Theory episode like I did), you'll find out Josh has been receiving the wrong medication due a misdiagnosis. His meds were for treating depression, but Josh is actually schizophrenic.
Your play through has some of the best choices to me! Like of course Chris would pick his lifetime bff over his crush. Like of course Ashley would go to Jessica’s voice if she heard her in the mines it fits her character so much
Lol too bad the ashley one gets her killed, of course the worst choice I made was not saving Mike, which is something i"ll have to live with for the rest of my life
@@magmalecreme even that makes sense!! Works as karma for killing Emily when she wasn’t infected
@@rwekcdephlegm lmao yeah
I have to disagree with the Ashley decision.
Ashley is Canonically afraid of the dark, it’s one of the fear options Josh can have when asked about the barn and scarecrow picture at the beginning. I feel like if my biggest fear was the dark, I was terrified of everything and (in the moment) convinced I had a 50/50 of living by someone else’s decisions twice before this, then my friends left me alone in the dark and underground, all while people are dying (at minimum flame thrower dude), I would immediately circle back to the group. I would be done being put in situations that terrify me or could kill me.
She also has to read the journal and comments on how they can mimic voices. Even if she doesn’t fully believe that it’s a wendigo mimic, you would think a character who’s has a personality trait of academic would have that in the back of their mind.
Given everything else above, I feel like there’s no way in hell she goes over there.
I do wish they gave an option to tell the group after but they don’t so… 🤷🏻♂️
You can actually investigate the voice and have Ashley live, you need to do so for a totem. Just don't interact with the hatch.@@magmalecreme
I discovered this game through GTLive and was briefly obssessed with it, watching first compilations of all the deaths and police interviews, then gamers reacting to the more significant moments (Josh's first Saw trap, Jess's abduction, the Josh reveal, Emily's first Wendigo, and the ending). As other commentors have mentioned, I'm a little sad for your sake you werent able to have a perfect run, as it makes Sam and Mike that much more badass as they single-handedly hold the Wendigos' attention as Ash, Emily, Chris, Mike, and finally Sam herself all escape.
Also, other fun "Hannah is somewhat still concious" evidence: she specifically has the most opportunities to kill Emily, and always goes for her face/head as best as she can. Of course she "saves" Josh, and cannot ever kill Mike, and fights the Wendigos to her own downfall, pulling back the one that almost stops Sam, her best friend, at the end.
what I do like about this game is that every character has a "main" death, they could've all died due to quick time events and stuff, but one death is always way more fleshed out than the others for each character. to me this is the "canon" ending for each character.
Do you remember them?
Jessica-falls down Elevator shaft with her jaw ripped out
Matt-dragged to jaw hook. I still remember his mouth filling up with blood, alternatively the head crush by the wendigo is at least solid
Chris-wendigo rips his head off and spikes it into the ground
Ashley-trapdoor that the wendigo bursts through, bonus points for the sheer speed and suddenness
Sam-doesn’t really have one, but I’d give it to the wendigo shoving it’s damn arm into her guts
Mike-if he’s the last one in the lodge(sam dies), he breaks out the lighter and gets the heroic suicide death that takes down the wendigos
Josh-head crushed or turns into a wendigo himself
Emily-getting shot in the eye by Mike
@@XanderMatthews-nv9zfEmily, also gets her eyes gouged out as well
Emily has always been such an interesting character to me, despite her initially coming off as rude and generally unlikeable I quickly found myself enjoying her more and more, especially after the tower goes down. She’s truly one of the most competent in the entire group, and her unwillingness to compromise at times is what allowed her to survive. Fantastic character. (Also bonus points for the absolutely incredible line ‘Understand the palm of my hand, bitch’)
The relationship between Chris and Ashley would determine the life of Chris. So it IS important, at least for some characters
Yeah she can just leave him outside to die lol
i just gotta say: for those of us who used to watch supernatural (particularly early on), we knew what was up with the wendigo lol. it just felt kinda cool to see it pop up again in a popular game and be like "wait, holy shit, i know the rules of this creature!"
right?? haha we were playing it blind with my friend and i kept making supernatural references to wendigos!
Well for the old Stephen King fan here, I saw the Wendigo and thought crap now I gotta figure out who's Wendigo I'm dealing with because the rules change.
I feel bad for those taking FTG'S journal at face value. This game burns the over confident.
I love this video however there are a few things that seem to have been missed in this video that were explained in the game.
1) The wendis dont hunt in packs, they hunt alone, the reason they attacked eachother in the cabin was because they attack whatever moves, it doesnt matter if its animal, human, or wendi.
2) After a wendi has been killed its spirit circles the mountain until it can posses someone else trapped in the mines, the person possessed will then be overcome with an uncontrollable hunger, making them consider eating another human in order to satisfy that hunger. This is why Josh started feeding off the remains of whoever was killed and brought to the mines, because the spirit of the wendis that were killed by Mike, Sam, the Wendi hunter, etc.
I'm pretty sure the spirit doesn't posses you until you eat human meat. It doesn't posses you and make you eat, you have to make that decision on your own due to desperation. Hannah ate Beth because she was starving and that was the only food source, not because the spirit was telling her to do it. It's evident in Hannah's journal that after she did it, she started experiencing deranged cravings for human flesh and started transforming.
@@krahvata A passage from the strangers journal "When a human is desperate and craves food, trapped on the mountain in the fierce winter storms, when he has eaten nothing for many days, the Wendigo spirit will begin to possess him. Even the strongest man is weak to it. He will kill without remorse - often those companions who have travelled with him. He will eat the flesh raw from the corpses.
I have seen this happen, for many years ago, a craving for flesh that cannot be sated. And then the change begins."
Another entry in his journal states "But try NOT to kill them. Killing a Wendigo should be the last resort. Death releases the Wendigo spirit into the air."
The spirit of the wendi possesses those who are trapped in the mines and become hungry, obviously the wendi possession isn't instantaneous but a possession does occur before the consumption of another human.
Can't stand emily at first but ashley is the worst for me..leaving sam if not for chris, letting chris die from the wendigo even tho she beg me to shoot her after saving her life the first time and then throwing emily out of the bus coz of her paranoia.. what a friend! Atleast emily actually done something and secured help to arrive. but then again I killed everyone for going to the switch too early.
Yeah i definitely get what you mean
Fun fact for you to hate ashley even more: So, you know when the characters traits are established in the beginning of the game, Ashley has the "Forthright" trait (which in my language was translated to "honest"). Well, later on, in the scene where she's with Chris on the basement of the house, they come across a video where the prank they pulled on hannah is shown. In this scene, you are given two choices when Chris asks Ashley why they did that, and if you choose to say that "it was a stupid prank, it was supposed to be funny. We are awful friends. Poor hannah, imagine being humilliated in front of your crush bla bla bla" (which is the dialogue choice most players take) and you go to the characters traits menu, you will see her HONESTY COMES DOWN. She does NOT mean what she said and lied, she probably doesn't feel guilty and just thinks hannah exagerated. Oof.
so you would save someone that tried to kill you if it meant putting your life in danger? if chris dies is because you made bad decitions, she does not own him anything, no need to put her life in danger, because she asked him to kill her once does no mean she is ok with dying for him again
@@anna.owo. That is the beauty of the game honestly if u played multiple times but in my 1st pt… If I was Ashley in that door, in front of me is Chris terrified waiting for me to open the door, the person who chose to save my life over his childhood friend and then going to kill himself just to save me again but didn’t because I asked him not to…..I WOULD DEFINITELY open the door to save him atleast this time I have that option. Unless everything I told Chris are all lies like we’re friends or I love him and “kill me and save yourself” then leaving the door close is justified heck I’ll even put up a finger on him while I step away. Psyche! Don't get me wrong I love her as a character game devs really stuck to her personality
@@anna.owo. Chris doesn't owe Ashley anything. He was given a choice between her life, or his -- and she said pick yourself. He picked himself.
So she lets him die even though there's a GOOD chance to let him in? Acting like closing the door will stop it when it obviously won't is CRAZY.
Emily's my favorite character. She's a girlboss. In all seriousness, watching her go from a whiny girlfriend to then her surviving her fall and escaping that cave and the Wendigo (obviously, if you do all the QTEs correctly) gives me a lot of respect for her. Though I will say that she does push Matt around too much, and they definitely need to break it off because I think they just don't work together. Also, "Understand the palm of my hand, bitch" is one of the best lines I've ever witnessed in media.
Spoiledr
One of the things I find interesting is that Chris is by far the most tortured character when it comes to the josh’s scheme shows the mental state Josh is in. Chris was the only one of the group who had nothing to do with the prank. He was passed out like Josh.
Josh blames himself for the death of his sisters. He was passed out drunk when the prank took place alongside Chris. I guess he projected his own guilt onto him.
I agree with everything but my only thing is that Josh didn't decide to be a cannibal to be with his sister - it's mentioned earlier that the spirit of the wendigo starts to posses people who are starving on the mountain. Since we've been killing them all game instead of trapping them like the stranger says, the spirits are free to go infect a new host. Also, Hannah definitely remembers. If you find the tattoo clue they show it in the game & that's why she takes Josh. They seem to have some level of consciousness for sure. Sorry if already mentioned in vid or other comments, I just wanted to say lol
That's cool, thanks for letting me know!
hannah attacks the other wendigos in the cabin because wendigos can only see based on movement, so when she saw the other wendigos moving, she blindly attacked.
Ok that makes sense, but I don't know why the other wendigos didn't attack each other
I always saw it as Hannah still had some remembrance of her friends and even tho she was possed she wanted to protect them atleast for a bit
Because they're part of different packs. The miners all knew each other, therefore being part of the same pack. Hannah didn't, making them hostile. But because she was essentially the alpha Wendigo so she won.@@magmalecreme
I feel like the game was originally going for a "Your choices during therapy determine which horror sub-genre your story will be"
I would have liked to have seen that version, but I fear it may have been "split up" too much for any one path to be particularly great. I really do enjoy the game we got, reguardless, and I still think about the story often.
Great video! Love your channel name!
More cool police investigation fun facts:
If Emily survived, she has four possible cutscenes regarding Matt, dependent on both whether or not Matt survived and on how good their relationship stat was.
I'm assuming everyone says it in canon, but as the audience you're always gonna see exactly one scene of a character saying that there's something in the mines, with a hierarchy of whose scene you're gonna see depending on who is left alive. If Sam is alive, you're gonna see her account, but if she died and Mike is still alive, you'll see his, and if they're both dead- You get the deal. And if nobody survived but Josh, the cutscene changes, with nobody going to the Mines and Josh just casually staring into the camera while munching on Flamethrower Guy's head. (There's also a glitch in this alternate version of the cutscene where the guy's neck has a see-through texture in one shot.)
I know this is an older video but here’s a bit of trivia you might be interested in. If you choose zombies as one of the things you’re most afraid of during a Dr. Hill session (which I can see from this video that you DID), then it will affect Hill’s appearance. That gash on his head will appear, and the slow degradation of his appearance then follows suite. None of that will happen if you choose clowns or scarecrows as your “scariest” option.
I'll always remember Markiplier having a complete breakdown when he got Ashley killed. A solid like five minutes of him going through the 5 stages of grief before deciding to restart the entire game.
😂😭
It’s crazy that I never knew that Jason graves composed this soundtrack! He made the soundtracks for all of the Dead Space games, and it’s music is one of the many reasons the games are so scary and atmospheric!
Yeah he did a great job!
Theres a rare (rare cus everyone hates em) end credits Scene with Emily that i love. If mat chose to save her twice (make sure you have the flare gun on matt so he lives). She will ask if matt is well and ok
I’m sure this wasn’t on purpose but it’s so interesting that the actors for Matt and Jess have Disney channel backgrounds and are the least explored characters
I absolutely love this game. It really blew Telltale out of the water. You can play through this game so many times with so many little details altering. Like very small details. The Mike character can either go through absolute he'll and be all beat up by the end or literally get out with a scratch.
10/10 game right here. A must-own classic.
I will forever be defending Ashley.
People hate Ashley, but actually they hate what THEY make her be. Ashley can be the nicest and also can be cold hearted. Same for Mike, when he kills Emily, yet nobody hates him.
Ashley is extremely frightened by what's happening, I'd say she's way more affected by the horrors she experiences than the others. Not everyone can be a level headed badass in terrible situations.
She explains several times how afraid she is and how she doesn't want to go on. Everyone is at their limits, but while some are able to muster up the will to move on (like Emily, Mike and Sam), others are not.
Also, experiencing the boy you love to actually be ready to kill you would probably turn anyone against him. Yeah, she tells him to kill her instead, but ONLY if you point the gun at Chris first. If you point the gun at her first, she's begging not to be killed.
Also, her saving Chris from the Wendigo by letting him inside puts ger at severe risk of being killed. We can see how close the Wendigo (Hannah) comes when following Chris and opening the door is highly risky.
So exposing yourself to that risk for a person who was willing to sacrifice you...? I don't know.
She's willing to take that risk when she knows that Chris is also willing to take that for her.
The character I will always dislike the most is Hannah.
Most people feel so sorry for her for the prank that's been done on her - and don't get me wrong, it was a disgusting prank. Yet she openly flirted with a guy who was in a relationship with one of her good friends, she was even willing to sleep with him (hence taking off her shirt). That's some shady behaviour and not something you do as a friend. Also, she's so passive and helpless and puts everyone in danger.
Why running out of the cabin in the middle of the night during a snowstorm, knowing very well there are wild animals like wolves and bears outside, also knowing very well that your sister (Beth) will probably follow you (in one of the clues you find it tells that Beth was always looking out for Hannah and helping her, also when Beth finds the faked letter from Mike, she immediately says "what's our sister gotten into again this time?" Hinting that Hannah is usually getting herself into trouble and Beth is there to help her out)?
Also, almost everyone walked in and out of that mine several times that night and Hannah wasn't able to do that for an entire month? Yes, it was said that her leg was broken, but still find it unrealistic, since the grave of Beth was found at a different spot than the place where Hannah and Beth crashed down, so Hannah must have been able to move around and bury her sister (carrying her sister, digging a grave, etc.).
Given, the Flamethrower Guy and the police pretty much suck as well. The police for not finding shit, not in the mines, not in the sanatorium. And the Flamethrower Guy knowing fully well about the curse, killing the Makapetew Wendigo instead of capturing him, knowing his spirit goes out, waiting for a new victim and yet NOT checking on the sisters to make sure they are both dead... smh.
Another thing I liked was how certain totems were easy to find on purpose. Like in the beginning you get a death totem of someone dying in fire and then you see Mike explode and think he's done for
babe wake up, new MagmaLeCreme vid just dropped
Lmao
Schizo.
@@weewoo2242 yes
I’m up wassup💀
***SPOILERS***
My only real issue with the story is Josh picking on Chris seemingly the most, when Chris was passed out during the prank. Like… he wants to get revenge on his friends, but Chris was literally not involved in the prank at all. I would’ve wanted to get back at Mike the most, and it doesn’t seem like Josh ever had any plans to go down to the cabin to get him. Sam also didn’t participate, and tried to stop it from happening all together
its been a Very Long Time since ive played so i might be misremembering, but i think the reason chris (and ashley) got their own focused 'plotline' of josh's prank, which was inspired by the movies his parents were famous for, was because josh, ultimate chris/ashleyshipper, wanted to get them together by having his best friend be the big hero and save the girl. not great logic, but he definitely wasnt working with sound reasoning at the time...
@@PhreakOutBigTime oh that’s a great way to look at it actually ur right
@@katies678 I totally didn't get hyperfixated and rewatch the game, and now I can confirm that at the beginning that josh was talking to Sam and said Chris and just needed 'some kind of traumatic event' to bring them together and make them bond
leftie made a really good vid abt this but my fave theory is that josh chose to lash out on chris, his closest friend, because when ppl get hurt they are more inclined to hurt people that they care abt than the ppl who actually hurt them bc of this sense that when they enact this to ppl who r closer to them they might be less consequences and also this fear that they have of the ppl who actually did hurt them.
It's missable but there's very strong evidence Josh has a substance abuse issue, particularly antidepressants, and it's implied Chris knows about it. Josh could very well blame Chris for not stopping him from drinking until he passed out the night of the prank.
I love these game essays of yours, I also really enjoyed seeing a clip from your actual gameplay of this and the thought process you had through it. I’d really enjoy watching you actually play these games if you would release it!
I've thought about streaming my playthroughs once I have a bit more subs, so maybe in the future!
This game pulls every horror movie trope and still succeeds at telling a terrifying and excellent story that is never predictable. I had no idea where the story was going at any given minute but it was clearly organized. That is impressive.
I remember watching Jack’s play through years ago… what’s a trip!
Yeah time really flies by, people like jack and Mark were so much different back then
i dont have time to replay older titles but thats why i love these retrospectives. i pick up on things i never did before and the commentary is great.
Yeah I love watching videos because of that as well
I also really love that by keeping the animals alive or nit harming them can stop some of the deaths from happening. Especially because killing for no reason is heavily frowned upon in native belief.
I think you may be one of the few people I've seen who actually liked Ashley's character. She's always been my favorite, I'm glad to see her get some appreciation!!
Yeah idk she reacted how most people would lol
She gets way more hate now than she did back in the day, which has been so annoying to see develop cause she's always been my best girl
I'd love a video like this about the Quarry. I came to care about the characters more than the ones in Until Dawn. Excited to see Supermassive's next project too!!
Tbf, thinking back - Hannah was supposed to be close friends with Emily, and she tried to get with her close friends boyfriend behind her back - she's not innocent and Emily could've been more mad about it all than she actually was in her defence
For me the most realistic and fitting ending is Sam, Mike and Emily only survivors. The most carable survivors, who saves each other in some way. Emily save them by call a helicopter, Sam saves them by distracting the Wendigo, and the Mike, who originally come up with this plan. Sam easily could tell everything about Josh's prank to police, Emily could all about things in mines, and Mike could tell about things in sanatorium.
Jessica - dies first, which is ironic, it was her idea to prank Hannah
Matt - dies, after he tries to save Emily. He definetly not gonna leave her.
Ashley - dies, when she wanna save "Jessica"
Chris - same death, they both could not just leave Jess behind
Josh - he could die or become a Wendigo, doesn't matter.
That does make a lot of sense!
I think you're way too hard on Josh. He had hardcore schizophrenia, and wasn't getting treated for it. And the death of his sisters certainly made it worse. You can find documents saying he had mental illness since he was a kid, so that gives him a bit of motivation, and makes him a bit of a sympathetic character. Plus, nothing he does kills anyone, so all he did scare his "friends". Yet literally every other character can kill someone. So who's really the worse person?
u are AMAZING at video essays. please never stop making these!! you’re covering all my fav video games!!
Thanks so much!
I recently finished 100%ing The Quarry, and while that game is absolutely awesome, it made me think "wow, i want to play until dawn". Somehow this game still looks fucking amazing, the story still bangs, and the sound design still RULES, EIGHT YEARS LATER. All Supermassive has to do to make money at this point is port it to PC. Dont get me wrong; i love the dark pictures anthology and the quarry, but Until Dawn was one of the first games i ever bought and played on the PS4, and it set my standards pretty high. Great retrospective.
coming back to this to say yes I will be buying the PC port this year. teehee
26:47 Another brilliant choice here is the minimal instructions on what exactly the lever does. Because you later learn that the decision didn't matter, the developers needed a way to keep the player from figuring that out as it would take them right out of the story. So the player's choice actually *does* affect something: the way they interpret this moment. The player--in the moment-- isn't entirely sure what they're choosing to happen and can only work on assumptions: Either the lever points to the person the saw will go to, or it will point to the person you want to save.
If you think the lever says who you want to kill and you decide you want to kill josh, the game's events tell the player that they were correct.
If the player thinks the lever points to who you want to live and you choose emily, the game tells you that is correct.
The benefit being that the player suspects nothing and assumes they simply made the right choice.
However! Say instead that the player wanted *emily* to die? It looks to the player like they misunderstood what the instructions were! And now they've accidentally killed their buddy that they were rooting for to survive! Which can really put the player in a moment of vulnerability as they are suddenly horrified by what they did. You get that from the other outcomes too, as it is a really grizzly fate, but the idea that you didn't *mean* to kill the guy just twists the knife a little more.
Anyway tldr; I love this particular decision because of how it elegantly side steps the problem of "the player figures out the choices don't matter and get annoyed at us for it."
Discovered your channel from the Walking Dead videos - great stuff man, well written scripts, interesting content and interesting uploads - subbed and can't wait for more
Thanks so much, I'm glad you're enjoying them!
Great video, and worth noting that the frame rate issues are fixed on PS5, but then there are some occasional immersion-breaking (but hilarious) glitches when a character is holding a lantern.
I've seen some gameplay from ps5, it looks so smooth in comparison lol
Great video, forgot about this games existence, would love to talk about it more but there's only so much I can pack into one TH-cam comment. Great job
My sister and I are actually currently playing though UD and it's been fun so far. She doesn't know anything about the game but I do but I'm avoiding spoiling her ^v^ We're up to the point where she had to choose to save Ash or Josh. I can't wait until she learns about the wendigos in the game. My role is really to be there for QTEs and don't move segments because I have slightly faster reaction times less shaky hands. If it wasn't for me, Jess would not have made it 😭
Lmaooo that's a funny dynamic
Another aspect of Until Dawn I think gets overlooked is the opening credits. I love that it foreshadows places/things the characters will eventually encounter and makes the player wonder about really happened in the Blackwood Mountains. The opening song slaps, and if you pay attention to it's lyrics, it tells the story of Hannah being trapped in the mines and her fate.
Man, I generally hate when people just shoot Emily. Its such a big sign the person playing straight up just doesnt listen to the actual game. You are very clearly told how someone changes. But outside of that, good video
Great vid! Until Dawn was one of those games in 2015 along with Life is Strange that stuck with me and struck a chord. It is truly a classic!
something else I really like about this game is its emphasis on the butterfly effect. one thing can lead to another, if the people never pranked Hana or beth then josh would not have suffered as much, and wouldn't even think about pulling a twisted prank on his friend group and his friend group wouldn't even be in this situation in the first place. he wouldn't have died. granted I also do feel like josh deserves this ending. if he found out who the wendigo was he would have finally had that piece of mind that his sister survived if that makes sense but now he has to pay the consequences for what he did to his friends by then becoming the wendigo himself, but if he just went insane then and his sister kills him there, then it's also the price to pay, in the end, everyone had to pay the price for what happened. One last thing I believe about the wendigo is that is Hanna, I feel like she was protecting them. In the scene where Sam flicked the light switch we can see her attacking the wendigo that's going after sam during the slo-mo. I'd like to think that she does remember and forgives them and protects them from the other wendigos, and burning herself in there would not only allow her to protect her friends and the person she loved the most but also free herself from the wendigo spirit. off topic, I killed sam at the last minute on the stay sequence and I was sobbing but yeah, one of my favorite games overall! I liked this video!
Thanks so much! I agree with you on pretty much everything you said there lol
this was so good!! very well written and analyzed, haven’t seen a video that described each aspect of the game so well since it came out in 2015. super refreshing to see a more updated review and perspective on the game, awesome job!!
I love finding small channels like this randomly. I love this game and you did a great job. With the work you put it I wish all the success to your channel
I especially love Until Dawn because of its characters, they have been the ones that hold up the game in my recent memory of it. The story is also very well crafted, but it's the realism they bring for me and how I can see myself in their positions that really make Until Dawn worth the ride.
Ahh!! I loved your videos on The Walking Dead and now you’ve done another one of my favourite video games in Until Dawn! Great video so far.
Thanks, im glad you're liking them!
46:00 the reason Ashley leaves Chris if he points his weapon at her isn't because she's mad at him it's because she's not all there and him trying to shoot her only worsens it.
This is super nostalgic to me for so many reasons. One of the last games I got to play with my best friend before she passed away. I remember cosplaying as ashley that halloween.
Still one of my favorite games!!
me casually binge watching your vids lmao. keep it up :)
Lol thank you!
OMG I was obsessed with this game when it came out!! I’ll never forget that time. Mike is my favorite character too!!! Awesome video, I haven’t seen an Until Dawn video even close to this
Thanks so much! Mike really is the goat
Found your channel like others here through your TWD vids in the middle of the night - looking for some video essays to chill some anxiety lol. I’m so glad I did! Your content is great man. Really well done, your scripts and editing are super concise and interesting to watch/listen to. I can’t wait for you to make more!
Also, Until Dawn is a true banger of a game. Glad to find such a dope video on it :)
Thanks so much man! I'm glad you were able to find the videos and that you're enjoying them.
YAAAS THANK YOU MAN. Really happy you made an until dawn video
Yessir
I really shocked this is the only game implemented the hold-still control all these years. That's the most immersive gameplay I've had in a horror game.
very slowly making my way through your retrospectives like it is a netflix series
lmao
I always find it mind blowing that this was Rani Malek it was a very small known actor and now he’s an Oscar winner for Bohemian Rhapsody
Ayyyyy, great video on one of my all time favourite games, I recommend checking out the rest of suppermassive's catalogue when you have a chance, specifically the quarry and house of ashes, but only when you feel comfortable, the best way to play these games is at your own pace, and I like your videos enough that I'll probably watch whatever you decide to make videos on next, just a little recommendation from me!
Thanks so much, I'd be down in the future!
Emily is one of my favorite characters idk I love how this game really pushes horror character tropes too and it kinda forces you to keep Emily alive sometimes even when you try to be like “nah she can die” she’s useful and can save herself a lot.
I also feel like people gloss over some of her cute scenes with Matt! Maybe I’m thinking of cut scenes tho..
how does he only have 2k when i first watched the walking dead video i assumed by the quality that this was probably just some youtuber with another 1 million who you seen then and there with a popular vid each year or so but he be dropping bomb asf shi every month
Thanks so much man!
Characters who stood on business:
-Mike (chops his finger off in the sanitorium to preserve the machete and then walks it off like a champ.)
-Mike's Wolf (man's best friend fr)
-Emily (she held her own in the mines)
-Sam (straight badass especially in the final act)
-Sam's towel (didnt even need adjusting or retying once for that whole act)
-Rami Malek (not even Josh, just the actor Rami Malek for delivering that tragic Oscar worthy performance.)
I'm so proud to say i managed to save all 8(7 considering joshs circumstances) on my first playthrough
Nice job with this video! It was neat to see someone revisit/summarize this game in 2023. I can't believe Until Dawn was released in 2015... It doesn't feel that long ago. Man, I'm old.
Josh deserved better friends. At least both Samantha and Chris were more real than the rest of the Blackwood Gang.