He definitely fought well on his own dung heap...tragic that history has treated him like a dung heap, up until now, thanks to Kent Masterson Brown, Jennifer Murray and others!!!
As someone who has been reading and researching about the American Civil War since the Ken Burns documentary, I'm surprised that Meade is not more highly regarded.
I always felt Meade got a raw deal. Thrust from commanding one corp to seven while Lee is invading the north. He stopped Lee’s effort and turned him back but then catches hell for not destroying him or failing to pursue in a timely manner. Then when Grant takes over all armies he nominally remained commander of the AOP But would remain in Grants shadow for the rest of the war. Then as a added insult he dies shortly after the war and was unable to defend himself from personal attacks particularly from the Likes Of Damnable Dan Sickles.
@@marknewton6984 I do not think Sickles was nuts. I think he was an opportunist and a definite player. A man not to be trifled with . But at Gettysburg? In over his head.
The information about the maps is interesting. Meade didn’t arrive until midnight of day 1. Why didn’t Meade get a good grounding on the topography. Just the fog of war?
I was completely unaware of the conditions of the men and animals. Also the main supply train had been seized by confederate cavalry. But Meade kept his army between the confederates and Washington despite all the problems.
And just remember that the German Army in its invasion of Russia was for far from motorization that They were moving supplies basically as Meade’s army had 80 years before.
Lincoln reminds me of the villain in a Superman movie who said to one of his henchman something to the effect of “All I asked you to do was to kill Superman.”
An excellent analysis of Gettysburg with fascinating insights into Meade's post battle actions. I have a question, why did Lee have the horsepower to get away from Pennsylvania yet Meade did not?
Because Lee, having been entrenched in his command for a while, was taking everything they needed from the towns in Pennsylvania. General Meade had established a supply line that was designed to operate 10 to 15 miles south of Gettysburg. When General Reynolds was killed, he had to scrap all his orders and orders the entire Army to Gettysburg. Essentially cutting off his own supply line. He had no choice but to move and figure out the supply situation later.
Lee did force the Federals away from Richmond during the Peninsula campaign but the Union won 6 of the 7 battles there. McClelland just kept backing up.
I blame Meade for Sickles being out of position. Meade should have spent some time at least with Sickles over a map. Meade job was to position his troops. I write this at the beginning of this talk so let’s see.
Again it was the same for both sides. Yet Lee was able to escape with his whole force. I'm sorry but I can't imagine Grant letting Lee just slip back into Virginian and call it a campaign. Meade was just satisfied to have stopped Lee and not in attempting to destroy him. That's why history treats Meade like it has. Meade simply didn't do enough.
By the time Grant took command the Army of the Potomac , it was almost twice the size of Lee's Army. Lincoln by then was extremely worried about his reelection. Therefore, he gave Grant a blank check on casualties as long as he wore down Lee's Army. Grant was the actual commander of the Army of the Potomac, beginning in 1864. During the 1864-5 campaign the Army of the Potomac did not win one battle until the Battle of Five Forks just prior to Lee's surrender, by which time Lee's Army was a shell of what it was during the battle of Gettysburg.In my opinion, Meade was a better general than Grant. If you read Joseph Reed's book on Grant, it documents how Grant, due in part to the tremendous support he had in Congress , and by his willingness to minimize and blame other US Army commanders for his own mistakes, made Grant look much better than he really was.
@@jayjohnston1 Maede was not in the same league as Grant. Hancock deserves more credit for Gettysburg than Meade. How many armies surrendered to Meade?
After the third day's fighting at Gettysburg had ended, Meade understood that what his army possessed was position power, not striking power. Having just watched the repulse of Pickett's charge, Meade had no desire to return the favor and assault Lee's lines across that same ground. Gettysburg was basically a stand up fight with field fortifications being improvised on some fronts but largely not a consideration; Pap Greene proved their usefulness on Culp's Hill. The fortifications Lee erected around his bridgehead on the Potomac were quite extensive and Meade understood that a frontal assault on those lines could not succeed. Meade did the Union a favor by not shattering his forces on those lines. Not attacking Lee's fortified lines at Mine Run was also a solid decision. When ordered by Grant to conduct frontal assaults Meade did so with the attendant wastage of life that he usually tried to avoid.
What the hell was Halleck doing? Surely he as general in charge of all US armies should have tried to move all forces and logistics he could to support Meade to maybe block Lee's avenues of retreat. If this was futile because such support wasn't available it shows Meade made the right decision. If Meade had a 3 to 1 numerical advantage and enough logistics to support a battle fierce enough to destroy Lee's army Lincoln would have had a point. Burnside and Hooker were removed for incompetence. Meade was made to suffer unjustly for his supreme competence. Meade offered to resign due to all the criticism he copped and Lincoln declined to accept his letter. This was Lincoln's most shameful moment of the war. At Gettysburg Lee couldn't make Longstreet attack like Jackson, and after Gettysburg Lincoln's wishful thinking couldn't make Meade pull out a plan more brilliant than Grant would have produced, but that would have been needed to destroy Lee before he got back to Virginia.
Thx. Meade got the army 3 days before and was able to concentrate his forces and win the field. No other officer in that army could have done that.
He definitely fought well on his own dung heap...tragic that history has treated him like a dung heap, up until now, thanks to Kent Masterson Brown, Jennifer Murray and others!!!
I read "Meade at Gettysburg" last fall. It is a fantastic book.
As someone who has been reading and researching about the American Civil War since the Ken Burns documentary, I'm surprised that Meade is not more highly regarded.
People get biased against him by Lincoln's Monday quarterback reaction to Meade not attacking Lee in retreat after Gettysburg.
@neilpemberton5523 Interestingly, a letter Lincoln decided not to send. But I think you are right.
@fishjj76 Lincoln knew Meade was a keeper. Chastizing him for a lost opportunity may have ended badly. After all, Meade offered to resign anyway.
@@neilpemberton5523 I didn't know Meade had offered to resign. Thanks for that. I'll look into that.
This appears to be a very interesting aspect on the working of the Army of the Potomac as well as a fascinating book on General Meade. Thank you.
As you get older you realize the old saying “no good deed goes unpunished” is very true. Meade found that to be true as well.
Great interview. Thanks
Mr. Brown is an absolute gem.
I always felt Meade got a raw deal.
Thrust from commanding one corp to seven while Lee is invading the north. He stopped Lee’s effort and turned him back but then catches hell for not destroying him or failing to pursue in a timely manner. Then when Grant takes over all armies he nominally remained commander of the AOP
But would remain in Grants shadow for the rest of the war.
Then as a added insult he dies shortly after the war and was unable to defend himself from personal attacks particularly from the Likes Of Damnable Dan Sickles.
Not only that but they acted like destroying Lee's Army was some easy task. It took two more years.
Meade was mediocre and lucky. Sickles was nuts of course. Lincoln never liked Meade.
@@marknewton6984 I do not think Sickles was nuts. I think he was an opportunist and a definite player.
A man not to be trifled with .
But at Gettysburg?
In over his head.
Please document.
I read his book and saw the video. Master of history indeed, thanks for your incredible work to rehab Meades honor
The information about the maps is interesting. Meade didn’t arrive until midnight of day 1. Why didn’t Meade get a good grounding on the topography. Just the fog of war?
THANK YOU SIR WILL BUY THE BOOK GOD BLESS YOU ALL.
I was completely unaware of the conditions of the men and animals. Also the main supply train had been seized by confederate cavalry. But Meade kept his army between the confederates and Washington despite all the problems.
And just remember that the German Army in its invasion of Russia was for far from motorization that They were moving supplies basically as Meade’s army had 80 years before.
So many ads that it renders this talk almost unwatchable. Shame, cause every 30 seconds it’s interrupted by ads.
Enlightening.
Lincoln was the ultimate "Monday morning quarterback" in his analysis of Gettysburg and his criticism of General Meade.
He also got misinformation from Meade’s subordinates.
Lincoln reminds me of the villain in a Superman movie who said to one of his henchman something to the effect of “All I asked you to do was to kill Superman.”
Please someone turn this into a movie. Meade the Hero with Sickles as the villain.
But I do not believe sickles was a villain. Sickles is the one who gets a raw deal.
An excellent analysis of Gettysburg with fascinating insights into Meade's post battle actions. I have a question, why did Lee have the horsepower to get away from Pennsylvania yet Meade did not?
Because Lee, having been entrenched in his command for a while, was taking everything they needed from the towns in Pennsylvania.
General Meade had established a supply line that was designed to operate 10 to 15 miles south of Gettysburg.
When General Reynolds was killed, he had to scrap all his orders and orders the entire Army to Gettysburg. Essentially cutting off his own supply line. He had no choice but to move and figure out the supply situation later.
Lee did force the Federals away from Richmond during the Peninsula campaign but the Union won 6 of the 7 battles there. McClelland just kept backing up.
I blame Meade for Sickles being out of position. Meade should have spent some time at least with Sickles over a map. Meade job was to position his troops. I write this at the beginning of this talk so let’s see.
Again it was the same for both sides. Yet Lee was able to escape with his whole force. I'm sorry but I can't imagine Grant letting Lee just slip back into Virginian and call it a campaign. Meade was just satisfied to have stopped Lee and not in attempting to destroy him. That's why history treats Meade like it has. Meade simply didn't do enough.
By the time Grant took command the Army of the Potomac , it was almost twice the size of Lee's Army. Lincoln by then was extremely worried about his reelection. Therefore, he gave Grant a blank check on casualties as long as he wore down Lee's Army. Grant was the actual commander of the Army of the Potomac, beginning in 1864. During the 1864-5 campaign the Army of the Potomac did not win one battle until the Battle of Five Forks just prior to Lee's surrender, by which time Lee's Army was a shell of what it was during the battle of Gettysburg.In my opinion, Meade was a better general than Grant. If you read Joseph Reed's book on Grant, it documents how Grant, due in part to the tremendous support he had in Congress , and by his willingness to minimize and blame other US Army commanders for his own mistakes, made Grant look much better than he really was.
@@jayjohnston1 Maede was not in the same league as Grant. Hancock deserves more credit for Gettysburg than Meade. How many armies surrendered to Meade?
Hancock was all over Cemetery Ridge, more than Meade.@shiloh6519
After the third day's fighting at Gettysburg had ended, Meade understood that what his army possessed was position power, not striking power. Having just watched the repulse of Pickett's charge, Meade had no desire to return the favor and assault Lee's lines across that same ground. Gettysburg was basically a stand up fight with field fortifications being improvised on some fronts but largely not a consideration; Pap Greene proved their usefulness on Culp's Hill. The fortifications Lee erected around his bridgehead on the Potomac were quite extensive and Meade understood that a frontal assault on those lines could not succeed. Meade did the Union a favor by not shattering his forces on those lines. Not attacking Lee's fortified lines at Mine Run was also a solid decision. When ordered by Grant to conduct frontal assaults Meade did so with the attendant wastage of life that he usually tried to avoid.
What the hell was Halleck doing? Surely he as general in charge of all US armies should have tried to move all forces and logistics he could to support Meade to maybe block Lee's avenues of retreat. If this was futile because such support wasn't available it shows Meade made the right decision. If Meade had a 3 to 1 numerical advantage and enough logistics to support a battle fierce enough to destroy Lee's army Lincoln would have had a point. Burnside and Hooker were removed for incompetence. Meade was made to suffer unjustly for his supreme competence. Meade offered to resign due to all the criticism he copped and Lincoln declined to accept his letter. This was Lincoln's most shameful moment of the war. At Gettysburg Lee couldn't make Longstreet attack like Jackson, and after Gettysburg Lincoln's wishful thinking couldn't make Meade pull out a plan more brilliant than Grant would have produced, but that would have been needed to destroy Lee before he got back to Virginia.
MEADE American Hero
Okay. Maybe not nuts, just a little crazy. Actually I like him. He never should have been in the military though.
Let's not forget Meade at Fredericksburg...had he got the army behind him there, the results could have been quite different
Ted Bundy quit smoking.