What Makes a Monster Taming Game?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 พ.ย. 2024
- A big topic of discussion, I've seen float around is the rules in which constitute a game being a "Monster Tamer". The genre is something really special with it being highly malleable, allowing it to attach itself to several other genres and as of such pinning down the exact specifications of what a Monster Taming game truly is is difficult. Let me know your thoughts on this in the comments below!
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Honestly, A Monster Taming game is, IMO, a game where the Taming/Capture/Befriending of the monsters in the game is the MAIN selling point.
ARK pushes the bounds a bit on this definition, but only by a bit. realistically you can't beat the bosses without taming the dinos, and taming them is not only one of the main selling points, but it also exponentially helps with the other main selling point; survival.
Kindred Fates helps to expand the genre out of turn based combat (though they do offer that option because of one of their stretch goals), and both Kindred Fates and Anitons will likely expand the world limitations of the genre from mostly linear progression of the world to possibly full open world. i honestly have hope that we will see the Genre get innovated as the years go by since Pokémon might actually get some competition at some point.
Great analysis !
@@GymLeaderEd thanks ^_^
looking forward to seeing some of the discussions you guys have going on the discord.
i just came upon your channel yesterday, and i gotta say that it does the heart good to see someone spreading the news of how this absolutely fantastic genre is expanding. i'm ecstatic to see what other news you have to offer in the future.
@@ThePokeShapeshifter thank you:)))
I think anything that has monster taming as a main feature should be seen as an MTG.
I have Monster Sanctuary and I'll finally get to play it today on my recently new labtop
Merry Christmas I finally got that laptop
Defining the line where a group based RPG becomes a monster tamer is one I struggle with. We can clearly define Pokemon as monsters you tame, but what about a game where you collect party members who aren’t human. Where do we draw the line between what is and isn’t a monster?
*humans are the real monsters, therefore everything is a monster tamer*
Man, I just want a combination of classic monster taming, and creature raising games like Monster Rancher and Digimon World 1 already.
U should check out the mythren kickstarter that's coming out today in 15 minutes
I'm a year late, but I'll say what I have to say anyway. I know you're strictly talking about games but I think it can also be useful to look outside of gaming and see a unifying pattern. For me, I noticed it's a lot about 1. there's many monsters (so The Iron Giant is excluded because the other robots don't play a part in the movie); 2. the monsters have personalities and aren't just "tools for battle" (they don't have to talk, they can be like a real life pet, so YGO and Beyblade don't count, but Bakugan does); 3. The relationship between the humans and monsters is central to the story. I think this is at least a decent start to finding a good definition for the genre, then you can narrow it down to just games.
I'd personally want a monster taming game that'd be fast paced action based instead of traditional turn-based and as well as open world and still keep a concrete goal like beating pokemon league from the beginning that will give you an illusion of sport. I wouldn't want levels to directly affect pokemon's stats but to unlock skill points for upgrades. I'm not exactly sure how this would work. but combining legends arceus with pokken tournament would be pretty close xD
I think as long as taming the monsters is an integral mechanic of the game and that you have a good variety of optics to choose from then the game should be considered part of the monster taming genre
I think monster tamer or creature catcher work for a genre name as a whole. Plus I think it just boils down to “is the main focus the monsters and how to tame them?” If the answer is no then it’s a game with monster tamer elements. If it’s yes then it’s a monster tamer.
As for gatekeeping I think another big problem is that we view similarities to the Pokémon formula as bad. Which shouldn’t be the case. Like: “does your game have an item that holds the monsters? It’s a poké fake” I’m pretty sure tem tem has received it’s fair share of backlash as a poké fake. But those same people probably haven’t tried to dive into the uniqueness of the game with more online capabilities. The exclusivity to double battles. And it’s take on the typing system. A lot of people are either too judgmental of similarities to Pokémon or simply too afraid to make something remotely close to it and it’s stifling what could be a full and rich genre of games with millions of unique designs across the monster tamer multiverse. Hell that platypus was originally a Pokémon fakemon concept before tem tem literally bought the design from the creator.
Also people compare Pokémon to digimon all the time but digimon is making a resurgence like never before. A few New anime. New tcg. A rumored 02 movie in the works. New games. The digimon vital brace. Etc.
i'd love to see more monster taming games who arent RPG
or maybe monster taming + tactics mechanics
Do you have any examples? I've never seen a game like that but it seems very interesting
@@sulli2413 not really qwq
there's monster sanctuary thats like action but the battles are turn based XP and rune factory frontier you can capture mosnter and bring them to battle but the dungeons are not the focus of the game since its mostly a farming game : p
as for tactics in final fantasy tactics advance you can capture the monsters that are enemies but again the game is more focused on the human characters...
@@cremacat518 Interesting, thank you for the info!
I actually wanted to make a monster taming game in the future, so if I end up doing it, I'm definitely going to take your words in consideration :)
Palworld lol
Going to recommend Kaiju-A-GoGo again. Giant Monsters are Monsters too.
I been wondering if there were any Kaiju monster tamers! Will definitely be checking this out immediately, thanks!
Now i think about it medabots is a pokemon like game but your not really catching the other robots you collecting their parts after battle so you can place it on a skeleton frame to use in battle so your more building than catching. Oh an pretty fun card game i have on my phone i play alot that i think card game first is Rogue Adventure you pick your starting class mage,a warrior things like that but all the cards you use are monster that do stuff like 3 damage plus poison or heal you for every angel in your deck. But your not tameing them they are just cards with nice monster art on them very fun card game.i dont think i put any money into i just watch the ads to double the Exp,get free gold you use on a run to buy or open chest for more cards. I think i mentioned before but in the zoids rpg you can destroy wild zoids to get parts from them like weapons and i think cores than back in town you can build them their. So would that be like the medabots. because they are robot animals you use?
I know it makes things weird when non monster games enter the genre but I would say that Medabots would fall under Monster Taming, well the Medabots: Metabee and Medabots: Rokusho games where you get different medals and parts to build your robots and use them. Also Robopon where you can capture and upgrade robots that you also use in combat. While not being monsters they still fall under the monster taming flag in my opinion.
And the card thing you mentioned is a very good point, because you get cards in YuGiOh that also take control of opponents monsters, is it now a monster taming game because of it? haha... I don't think card games should be classified as monster taming games unless if the monsters inside of the cards can be trained and/or used outside of the card game itself, then it isn't just a card game with monster cards but a monster taming game ... I think... haha
In my opinion a game would need to have monster catching as a primary mechanic to be a true monster tamer game so a game where you take control of enemies or play as a summoner class don't quite make the cut. It's sort a sliding scale from monster tamer to game with monster tamer elements, World of Warcraft has pet battles but no-one is going to call it a monster tamer game. I guess it's a you know it when you see it type thing.
I think I'd say it needs to be a significant part of the game aka a large focus rather than just another mechanic of the game. Also if monsters are just a type of army unit (aka in Disgaea multiple units are less human looking but treated the same as other units.)
I think it's about helping keep the balance of the world and there are usually a lot of mechanics in these games like catching monsters, fighting alongside them, or just defeating them. It's hard to explain but one thing's for sure the monsters need to make a significant impact on their environment whether it's the nature or the societies.
I think we have to think about Monster Collecting more as an Subgenre than a Maingenre.
My thoughts what makes a MonGame a MonGame:
- Monsters (obviously): A fairly good variety of different Monsters which you can catch and collect.
- Fighting: A Combatsystem which allows you to fight with the catched monsters.
- Training: Monster got stronger through fights etc. got LvL-Up and learn new moves etc.
-(Evolution): I think its not a nessesary part but I personally like the fact when Monsters evolve into other Forms. Its more subject but I think a good MonGame has to have this.
Great video, probably my favorite of yours! Thanks for the mention as well :)
I would argue a "Monster Taming game" (or as I like to call them "Mons" games) as you put it has a a view general guidelines, much like how Roguelikes (and their variants) do. Games like Pokemon, Tem Tem, Shin Megami Tensei are "Classical" or "Traditional " Taming Games games. Much like how ADOM, Angband, Dungeons of Dredmor are "Traditional" Roguelikes, in that they strictly follow the original ROGUE's example and formula. They have a "tamer" of sorts, who tames and collects a party (or sometimes army) of monsters to fight on their behalf to maintain story progression, there is incremental power growth through RPG mechanics such as leveling up "evolution" (though not required) or "Fusion" (like Shin Megami) and are fairly linear at least in terms of story progression. Some of the later games you mentioned seem like a "lite" or similar variation, much like how Enter the Gungeon, Hades, Binding of Isaac are often called "Roguelites" because they borrow some elements of their father genre but not all of them (procedual generation, permadeath, high difficulty). Maybe a specific variant term to distinguish more "traditional" pokemon-esque games from the variants.
As for Ark, as far as I'm concerned it's not really in the same Genre as games like Pokemon, Megaten etc. Sure taming of creatures is an important mechanic, but it's not the central mechanic, survival and production growth is. In pretty much every monster taming game, the central focus *is* the monsters, the battles, the contests, story progression. In Ark they are a subsystem, at least to me. They help you but they aren't your only or main tool at your disposal.
This comment inspired the "monlite" term!
@@GymLeaderEd You're welcome! lol
While I do have to disagree with a small handful of the games used in this video being monster tamers, I think you have some decent points. Someone else in the comments referenced the Roguelike Berlin convention in a negative light, but I'd like to actually defend the validity of using such a system of "strong" and "weak" indicators to classify the genre. I think many of the games that you're more iffy on definitely have those weak indicators but not necessarily strong indicators, and I personally think of those games as mongame adjacent. In the end, I think it largely comes down to what the focus of the game is. Is the game focused on monster care and/or battling? Are the monsters teammates instead of disposable minions? Or are do the games meerly have the ability to tame monsters as a side feature, unimportant to the rest of the game? Just some things to think about haha.
Just in time, was scrolling through your page to see videos I missed lol trying to get my fix 😂
Putting a Genre to videogames is a tricky subject. My favorite example is Portal, why is not considered a FPS? Even when you have a gun and it's on first person view. That's because the main focus/mechanic/theme of the game are Puzzles.
We have a superficial idea of what is a Monster taming game and that's not bad. Personally it's more about the feeling or the focus of capturing/obtaining the monsters to use them in the game than the genre. Monster Taming can be part of a game and not being the main focus like Ark, which i don't consider a Monster Taming game even if they have Monster Taming mechanics.
I've personally always called them "monster collectors" as another key element involves a sort of collect-a-thon element from getting every single monster in the game with a sort of monster field guide. With Pokemon, it's filling the PokeDex. With SMT, it's filling the Demon Compendium. With Yo-Kai Watch, it's the Yo-Kai Medallium, etc. League of Legends already has all the character profiles unlocked as far as I know, so there's not really anything to collect unless you buy skins.
Monsters, a device to a slave them, and a drawn out conflict to use their power against. There you go.
LOL monster sanctuary has no device tho, u just manipulate them from birth hahaha
I believe all it takes to be qualified as monster taming is to be able to catch multiple monsters and use them in the gameplay. But there should be the bare minimum of 10-30 different creatures for the player to use. Otherwise, any game with a dog companion would qualify, such as the game Balrum (which lets the player have a dog, spider or bear as a companion and you need to catch it to be able to use it, but given the small pool of creatures and the lack of focus on it, I wouldn't consider Balrum a monster taming game).
Lol imagine ppl call BOTW a monster tamer cuz of the wolf link amibo XD
Merry Christmas, Gym leader Ed!
Stay safe!
Great vid Ed! Any chance we can get an update on this now that the genre has started to expand a bit?
Thanks and perhaps 🤟
I personally think that a game can be defined as a Monster Tamer if taming monsters is a part if the main mechanics. Ark is a Monster Tamer because it's gimmick is that you can tame dinosaurs _along with being_ a survival game. Farcry isn't because that animal taming mechanic is just secondary, as most Open World games allow you to get mounts to travel faster.
I was referring to fancy primal specifically, it has mon taming mechanics, you can collect the different monsters and summon them to fight at will, but I'd call it a monlite
Personally, I think the definition is a holistic one: is the game's design _centered around_ the player's use of creatures/monsters, or does it just happen to _include_ creatures/monsters as something usable by the player?
As an example, compare and contrast the ill-fated _Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts_ with _The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom._
here's an intresting question
is Skylanders a Monster Tamer/Creature Collector
we need them to play the game and we collect them, just not in-game
What's a monster taming game? You know it when you see it.
A strict hard line does need to be drawn to define the genre, if it's blurred it doesn't exist.
Ed I find this game on steam caled : Nuumonsters ,but except description and release date 28 January, 2021 nothing is known about the game, can you check it out or cover it.
link to Nuumonster steam page here :store.steampowered.com/app/1487940/Nuumonsters/
I'll look into it!
But that Flappy is so adorable hahaha
Merry Christmas
Merry Christmas!!
Is "Sakura Dungeon" and "Moero Chronicle" a Monster Taming Game?
and I found that steam use the tag "Creature Collector"
can we call Sukudin games Monster Taming Games?
Am thinking if your catching and rising monsters to get stronger by leveling them up or feeding them food ill be rising but if they are just monster you have that fight but dont level up ill think of them as a collection since thats what your doing is collecting them but not rising them.
Yesterday i was asking me this quetion after of subscribing to your chanel. Thanks for reading my mind. XD
Im nor part of the community as i only play shit like digimon and smt for fun, but i always thougth it was "monster catcher" when it was the main focus and not an afterthougth
Hey. You're part of this community:)
It is hard to say what really make the game a monster team in game like you said it can fit in so many different genres of games of course you know the usual one is to compare to a Pokémon like game but we also have seen it fits in other places as well pretty nicely now for example let’s look PSO2 summoner class granted the game is clearly not a monster collector/battler game but yet it does a summoner does a lot of that granted not as big of a scale but there’s a decent amount of creatures you have multiple elements for the same creatures and you can even switch between them easily just like Pokémon just with a Live combat system Now me personally I would say it’s a game with creature collecting and battling as options but not a creature collector game in it self but if they did add more creatures then that might change it is definitely a confusing subject lol😁
We've been saying critter catcher.
Very intriguing topic, made me think of an idea for one myself. Will u be making your own monster taming game after the rom hack?
A game with monster enslavement im guessing. BTW that pokemon at 2:13 looks so cool I havent played the new versions not sure what it is.
Urshifu
Monster catching games is any game whose the focus is in the monster catching and training, just because games like Sekiro haves similar mechanics but aren't since it isn't the focus.
I agree or at least it has to be a large focus like in ark or 9th dawn, there could also be levels of monster taming, like full monster tamer, partial tamer, etc. The sekiro bit was a joke of course XD, actually it was a bit of a meme on the discord to try to call everything a monster tamer
I always want to make my own monster taming game. I have the idea, but not the game programming ability
You forgot that hearthstone battlegrounds mode is a monster taming game cuz you can spend money to but cards that have creatures as there design, just thought I'd point out a massive flaw in the be reasons segment 🤣
I think card games with monster in them yugioh,duel master and spirit battle could be monster collecting than monster tameing since your not rising these monsters to make them better or watching them grow levels your just using them.
Yea I'd say digital card games are monster taming or at least closely related. Like a sister genre or something XD
I'm surprised you never mentioned ant of the Cyber Sleuth games
They're no doubt tamer games haha no mention needed ;p
It bad for a genre to have so many restrictions
Read about the Berlin Interpretation RogueLike you will find it here
www.roguebasin.com/index.php?title=Berlin_Interpretation
For long time any game that didn't fallow the rules was not a rogule like (So many rules)
and that kill that kind of games
tell Spelunky relesed in 2008 take few elements and run with it, RL fans hate that
but other game fallow
tell a game call Rogue Legacy released in 2013 calling itself Rogue Lite not Like!
from that point all new games use that name
What we can do Stick with a name even if we don't like it
I know you use Monster Taming a lot in your videos but steam use Creature Collector" so like it or not it kind of the offical name that you will use to find games like that on steam
and have less rules about all that, as long you take a monster and take care of it or something like that it Creature Collector game
Actually steam has both creature collector and monster taming tags! But yea ur right gate keeping too heavily could be detrimental
Oh hey, merry Christmas to me
What is the game starting at 6:30?
Are Crash Of The Titans and Crash Mind Over Mutant monster tamer games?
Me playing tactics ogre and final Fantasy tactics using tamers and an army of monsters. Does this count as a monster tamer game?
I'm of course joking. I imagine if the monster taming is one of the main feature then it counts. In the 2 games I mentioned such things are not advertised and you have to do some specific things to get them.
Never played them but maybe XD
Whats the game at 2:01?
That bit on not ruining the Gen 4 remakes....did not age well....
Me toooo
imo, a lot of those arent monster taming or creature collecting games because youre not really taming or catching any monsters. Some are bullet hell games First and foremost. Others are literally western crpgs. I wouldnt really call those monster taming games just because they have a lot of monsters in them.
And in the case of ark, i guess you could classify it as a monster taming game. But monster taming isnt the main focus. you can tame monsters in the game. but i wouldnt recommend it to someone whos looking for a "monster taming game". when i know damn well they are looking for something along the lines of pokemon or digimon
I'd say that there are different layers associated to the genre. For example, in patch quest you are literally "taming monsters" by riding them, however it's a Monster Taming bullet hell/ roguelite/ metroidvania, or whatever. If someone is looking for a more pokemon-esque experience, then they'd want to look at monster taming RPGs specifically. That's why it's hard to classify what exactly is a monster tamer, since there are so many interpretations of the subgenre and it so easily latches itself to other genres as well :)
@@GymLeaderEd i mean I agree. I wasn't speaking specifically about the games featured in this video. But some others out there. Except ark lol. I was speaking about that game. Like I wouldnt really call it a monster taking game. Idk, I feel like the focus is more on survival and base building. But with monster taming features.
Similar to how games like call of duty and destiny aren't really considered rpgs. Even though they have some rpg mechanics and features