An Overview of 2 and 4 minute gearing on Edison Triump and Home Phonographs
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ต.ค. 2024
- This overview demonstrates how the 2-4 minute gear change functions on the Edison Home and Triumph Phonographs, and covers models A, B, D, and 2 & 4 minute (combination) models above the model D.
A separate video will cover adjustment of factory-installed 2-4 minute gearing and installation and adjustment of 2-4 minute combination attachments or "Model D Attachment" on 2-minute only A & B machines.
Fantastic video! Very informative and helpful. I just picked up a Home model at a local swap meet and assumed it was just a 2 minute player until I started monkeying around with it trying to figure out why records were repeating. Bottom line is I discovered it's a 2/4 minute conversion kit. Works perfectly with the clutch casing in the proper position. Thanks again for your great video!
This is also the exact setup for Model E Triumph phonographs. On my Triumph the pulley which should have been labeld "E" or "D" was actually labeled "C" but it looked exactly like the one you show and it worked with no problems at all, so apparently even a "C" pulley will work on the D and E models. I know that on some earlier models this can be a problem but it has worked for me for several years with no problems.
I enjoyed watching this very much. I too have a Triumph A, in a B box. I also got mine at Union in the 90s. I was fairly new to machines at that time, and did not know it was a 2 and 4 min machine. Someone pointed this out to me after a year or so, and I now had a way to lsiten to 4 min cylinders. I had taken it in for repairs because I could not get a troublesome thump thump thump out of it, and I had over-tightened the "cone bearings" to the point that it would not turn. The repair guy showed me the very delicate difference between too tight to turn, and too loose so as to allow the shaft to thump. Thank you for your videos
Can you explain how to not overtighten the bearings. Thanks.
@@TheDtrolinder To adjust the end bearings on A and B models, there are two screws: the set screw on top, and the broad headed screw (called a "grub screw").
Loosen the set screw, and turn the grub screw to move the bearings in or out (the left end does not have a flange, but butts up on the end of the bearing; so to move the bearing out, you will have to push the shaft to the left): the mandrel should be able to spin freely (with the belt off) for several seconds, without too much end play. Then tighten the set screws again.
I'd never been interested in these old jewels before (originally found you searching for Westclox repair/maintenance help), but now find your vids absolutely fascinating. Kudos for sharing your experience & knowledge ... all are now preserved for posterity on TH-cam. Who would'a thunk it?!
Thx... DT
Very good video I was having trouble with my Edison be with the clutch until you explain that it was just an adjustment issue now I've got to go into 4 and 2 minute now I just have to get a belt you got a source for good belting material
Hi Okbridges you made a fantastic video your knowledge and the way you explained the 2/4 min gearing I was able do convert my Edison Triumph And Home to a 2/4 min by looking at your video it helped me and only for your video I couldn't of doing it I was delighted with myself ha I Subscribe to your channel thanks for sharing. Troupee from Ireland. 👍👍🎷🎅🎅🍺🍺
Very detailed and awesome video, thanks a lot.
I have a Home and a Triumph in my collection; both Model A's; both converted to 2/4 minute. The Triumph (ca. 1901/2) has the earlier style conversion, while the Home (late 1904) has the later one. Thanks for the approximate chronology on these!
You had mentioned that the two different 2/4 minute gearing kits came with different instructions. Do you know a source where one can read/view or purchase a copy of these two different instructional brochures published by Edison between 1908-1911? George L. Frow states in his "Edison Phonograph companion" book, that the Model D phonograph models Triumph and Home with factory-installed 2/4 minute gearing - were introduced Oct. 1, 1908, then improving the methods of production/distribution by Nov. 1908. I have never seen the transitional shift mentioned in your video - it must have been a version with limited number made. [Retired early recordings archivist, Library of Congress; collector of early Edison phonographs, cylinders, etc. since 1958].
Thanks for your great informative video.
Several years ago when I first got my Model A Triumph and was searching for what parts I would need to convert it to 2/4 minute, I found images of a machine with what I called the transitional shifter in the video. The images of the machine in question, a very nice Model A Triumph, came up annoyingly frequently and I checked to see if I saved a copy of the images but alas no.
Annoying frequently is what made this variation of the shifter so memorable-I was looking for parts I would actually stand a chance of finding, not unique parts that may have seen a limited use. And that is probably why I didn't save the images of the machine.....
A possible solution to shifting the 2/4 min. pulley on the Model B - - rather than using a fingernail or fingertip, why not use something fairly soft such as a Starbucks plastic coffee stirrer, or perhaps, a toothpick [something that won't scratch or gouge the metal pulley? I have two Triumphs [Model A and B] both having the later 2/4/ minute shifter - which can be a bit difficult to keep in good adjustment, but which - I believe - to be a better Edison design.
This helped me with my great grandfather's model D. I just was not properly engaging the 2 minute gears. However, the 2 prongs holding the leadscrew to the changing gears are barely connect when in 2 minute and sometimes come lose when it is switched. Do you know of a way to fix this?
I’m thinking about purchasing a Triumph machine after I buy the reel to reel deck that I want. When the this whole coronavirus thing is said and done I’ll probably have enough money saved up for both.
They are nice machines, but they can get spendy fast! Both of these I got cheap because they are/were project machines The A I bought at Union in 2014, and the B came from someone on the Talking Machine Forum Yankee Trader.
Make sure the feedscrew is in good shape or you have trouble.
okbridges Things are up in the air now. There’s also a possibility I might get a Vic II instead.
I notice that the 4 minute position seems somewhat noisier than the 2 minute position. Is there a reason for this? Thank you for an informative video!!
Dirty or worn gears, or worn bearing hole in pulley for the reduction gear, gears or feed screw in need of lubrication. If in doubt, disassemble and clean and lubricate all parts. Some light grease, about the same weight as Vaseline on the gears will help to make them run quiet.
You will always get a little bit of gear noise in the 4 minute position but it does not transmit sound into the horn so it can only be heard if you are close to the phonograph itself. The gear noise comes from the small gears that are active in the 4 minute position but inactive in 2 minute mode.
Im missing the little detent spring on my clutch going to have or make one or find one
do you have to adjust the speeds on the governor or any sort of trouble shooting on it or is it more as soon its on there its plug and play?
I'm not sure I understand what you are asking. The 2 minute and 4 minute records both run at 160 RPM if that's what you're asking. The gearing just changes the speed of the lead screw to match the thread pitch of the grooves on the record.
Generally, 2-minute records recorded before about 1903 will run at different speeds depending on the length of the song recorded, anywhere from approximately 120 to 160 RPM.
@@okbridges sorry for my slang mate, I’m asking when you set it up would you have to do any adjustments or once it’s setup it’ll play the intended records at their speeds once everything has been hooked up.
@@Filmandmusicdegenerate Yes, once it's setup on the machine correctly it will play the records at the right speeds. If your machine plays the records fine now, it will operate the same with the 4-minute combo gearing added on.