Yes! This is what I've been telling people for sometime now. With the continued growth and development of Utah and the Region, lets use the momentum of a returning Winter Olympics to tackle infrastructure projects that will contribute to a more sustainable future and improve liveablity for everyone. The Rio Grande Plan fits that need so well!
Thank you for all your work! As someone born and raised in SLC, and who hopes to one day move back, the 2002 games were a formative moment for both me and the state. I really hope that the next games can push through the improvements we all hope are coming!
Keep fighting the good fight, Christian! SLC Airport is proof that Salt Lake City can indeed have great infrastructure for the people. No good reason trains can't get the same treatment.
I'm so glad I stumbled across your channel because it provides such a wealth of information/inspiration! One city that could benefit from a similar project (albeit at a much smaller scale) is Portland, OR- the UPRR mainline from Brooklyn Yard through the Central Eastside district obstruct a few critical intersections due to increasing train lengths causing conflict during switching maneuvers, and creating delays for transit lines as well. In the past, the ROW has been proposed by the late transit advocate Jim Howell for the routing of a MAX downtown bypass to speed up north-south trips. The loose concept is for an elevated line, but a solution similar the Rio Grande Plan would remedy more issues within the project scope. The idea would be to construct a train box roughly 2.3 miles from the Steel Bridge Wye in the north to Brooklyn Yard in the south. This would involve removing the existing Powell Blvd/US Hwy 26 vehicle underpass to allow heavy rail to descend to the necessary depth. On the top of the train box LRT tracks could be constructed, serving 3-4 new Eastside stations and reducing N/S trip time by more than half. Converting the US Hwy 26 back to a surface alignment would make it much easier to implement MAX service on Powell Blvd in the future, too. The main limitations are the yard and wye clearances at either end; north- and east-bound trains have plenty of space to return to ground level, but trains crossing the Steel Bridge have much less room. Brooklyn Yard will likely need layout/operational changes to accommodate the new mainline grade, at least at the northern end of the yard. The gradients aren't insurmountable, but could get steeper than 1% in places. 2-3 tracks currently run in the ROW, but with trenching 4 (maybe more) could fit, with 2 for freight and 2 for a potential regional rail service. I look forward to seeing more updates! Thanks again for your advocacy and enthusiasm for making transit better!
Why are we focused on expanding the entertainment district around the gateway/delta center & eastward- when we SHOULD be focusing on the Rio Grande Plan!?!?!
I'm a planning commissioner in a city along the Wasatch Front. We discussed a revision to our Transportation Master Plan recently, and an engineer from the consulting company said during the discussion that the maximum transit mode share in cities that really try to embrace it (he mentioned Portland as an example) is only around 4-5%. Then one of the other commissioners followed up with, "Well, then why try?" Do you think he was right? This certainly won't be the last time the topic comes up, so I want to prepare myself for the discussion. (I'm in one of the cities that doesn't get a lot of love from the UTA, so part of the discussion is around how hard we push for expanded coverage.)
@sambishop1667 Thank you for serving your city in the planning commission! I know that job can be pretty thankless at times. The 4-5% sounds suspicious to me. I'd go so far as to say that it's a fine example of using statistics to prove whatever you want. I'm sure there is a circle around Portland where, inside of that circle, only 4-5% of trips are made using transit. If you expand that circle, the percentage drops, but if you shrink the circle, the percentage increases. I find it more interesting to break down mode-share by neighborhood rather than by city. Some neighbors are all single family homes, where transit use will be low. But some neighborhoods (especially downtown) depend on high transit use. It all depends on the type of land use you are planning for.
I dream of a day I can take fast, reliable transit from downtown Idaho Falls (where I live) to downtown SLC. I believe the Rio Grande plan is the first step in achieving that goal. Because without a good station in downtown SLC then the idea of riding to Idaho Falls is almost impossible without the basics put in place first.
@@seniorcajun Unfortunately, the question at the moment is still IF we will build the Rio Grande Plan. We can all still influence how that question will be answered by writing to your elected representatives and spreading awareness about the Rio Grande Plan!
Things that should/could happen: I think that the Frontrunner should be expanded to be a network instead of a line. What it would look like is up to your imagination. An extension of BrightLineWest from Las Vegas to Salt Lake City (Rio Grande depo). This could eventually lead to a network of HSR. Edit: I spent 2 hours looking at a potential corridor from Las Vegas to Salt Lake City. The best allingment (IMO) would be to take the Frontrunner ROW from SLC to Provo, take the UP line south until you meet I15 and then do a flyover into the median and then continue towards Las Vegas BLW station. This ROW would allow 200-220mph for about 100 miles, 180-170mph for ~80-90 miles, 160-125mph for ~20-30 miles, 110-90mph for ~100-120 miles and 90-50mph for ~10 miles. Important note: Their would be tunneling involved for about 18 miles of the corridor which are under St. George (UT) and Las Vegas (NE). This to allow trains actually running thru as to there not being room for them within I15. (Perspective SLC->Las Vegas) There are ways to not tunnel under St. George which would be to divert feom the I15 straight from it before it turns to St. George and along the airport. Then the ROW would hook onto route 7 median which has on the eastern side not a parallel road installed. This means we can freely come into the ROW with the road needing to go under the tracks in the future. We then connect with a 200mph curve onto I15 to then go into a 110mph zone again.
It would be amazing to connect to Las Vegas via HSR! Like you said, the geography just south of St George is going to make that proposition very expensive. Still, I love your ambition!
Do you think that a new TRAX Airport station could be built to allow for through-running trains and an easier experience? (plus potential for future heavy rail)
@@manualdriver02 An elevated, through-running TRAX station at the airport is certainly possible. Financing it will be difficult, though, since Delta successfully lobbied the Utah legislature to ban transit spending using airport funds. Also, once trains run through the airport, where do you think they should go?
@@CSLenhartthey should continue on to the Amazon distribution center and further west. Could even make a green loop 🔁 on the west side. Service the airport hotel area and the business area
Yes! This is what I've been telling people for sometime now. With the continued growth and development of Utah and the Region, lets use the momentum of a returning Winter Olympics to tackle infrastructure projects that will contribute to a more sustainable future and improve liveablity for everyone. The Rio Grande Plan fits that need so well!
Let's build the Rio Grande Plan!
Thank you for all your work!
As someone born and raised in SLC, and who hopes to one day move back, the 2002 games were a formative moment for both me and the state. I really hope that the next games can push through the improvements we all hope are coming!
Keep fighting the good fight, Christian!
SLC Airport is proof that Salt Lake City can indeed have great infrastructure for the people. No good reason trains can't get the same treatment.
Key thing for the Olympics is getting Frontrunner trains up into the Wasatch Back!
@@jaydeeification That would be amazing!
I'm so glad I stumbled across your channel because it provides such a wealth of information/inspiration! One city that could benefit from a similar project (albeit at a much smaller scale) is Portland, OR- the UPRR mainline from Brooklyn Yard through the Central Eastside district obstruct a few critical intersections due to increasing train lengths causing conflict during switching maneuvers, and creating delays for transit lines as well. In the past, the ROW has been proposed by the late transit advocate Jim Howell for the routing of a MAX downtown bypass to speed up north-south trips. The loose concept is for an elevated line, but a solution similar the Rio Grande Plan would remedy more issues within the project scope.
The idea would be to construct a train box roughly 2.3 miles from the Steel Bridge Wye in the north to Brooklyn Yard in the south. This would involve removing the existing Powell Blvd/US Hwy 26 vehicle underpass to allow heavy rail to descend to the necessary depth. On the top of the train box LRT tracks could be constructed, serving 3-4 new Eastside stations and reducing N/S trip time by more than half. Converting the US Hwy 26 back to a surface alignment would make it much easier to implement MAX service on Powell Blvd in the future, too.
The main limitations are the yard and wye clearances at either end; north- and east-bound trains have plenty of space to return to ground level, but trains crossing the Steel Bridge have much less room. Brooklyn Yard will likely need layout/operational changes to accommodate the new mainline grade, at least at the northern end of the yard. The gradients aren't insurmountable, but could get steeper than 1% in places. 2-3 tracks currently run in the ROW, but with trenching 4 (maybe more) could fit, with 2 for freight and 2 for a potential regional rail service.
I look forward to seeing more updates! Thanks again for your advocacy and enthusiasm for making transit better!
Via Rio Grande! 🚊
Why are we focused on expanding the entertainment district around the gateway/delta center & eastward- when we SHOULD be focusing on the Rio Grande Plan!?!?!
Now we need a East to West Trax train , to Magna and maybe Tooela as well as University of Utah
Man this is the most optimistic TH-cam video I’ve seen in a week.
@@FreeJaffa92 There are a lot of things to feel optimistic about! 😁
I'm a planning commissioner in a city along the Wasatch Front. We discussed a revision to our Transportation Master Plan recently, and an engineer from the consulting company said during the discussion that the maximum transit mode share in cities that really try to embrace it (he mentioned Portland as an example) is only around 4-5%. Then one of the other commissioners followed up with, "Well, then why try?"
Do you think he was right? This certainly won't be the last time the topic comes up, so I want to prepare myself for the discussion. (I'm in one of the cities that doesn't get a lot of love from the UTA, so part of the discussion is around how hard we push for expanded coverage.)
@sambishop1667 Thank you for serving your city in the planning commission! I know that job can be pretty thankless at times.
The 4-5% sounds suspicious to me. I'd go so far as to say that it's a fine example of using statistics to prove whatever you want. I'm sure there is a circle around Portland where, inside of that circle, only 4-5% of trips are made using transit. If you expand that circle, the percentage drops, but if you shrink the circle, the percentage increases.
I find it more interesting to break down mode-share by neighborhood rather than by city. Some neighbors are all single family homes, where transit use will be low. But some neighborhoods (especially downtown) depend on high transit use.
It all depends on the type of land use you are planning for.
I dream of a day I can take fast, reliable transit from downtown Idaho Falls (where I live) to downtown SLC. I believe the Rio Grande plan is the first step in achieving that goal. Because without a good station in downtown SLC then the idea of riding to Idaho Falls is almost impossible without the basics put in place first.
When do we find out when they are going to start the Rio Grande plan construction ?
@@seniorcajun Unfortunately, the question at the moment is still IF we will build the Rio Grande Plan.
We can all still influence how that question will be answered by writing to your elected representatives and spreading awareness about the Rio Grande Plan!
Things that should/could happen:
I think that the Frontrunner should be expanded to be a network instead of a line. What it would look like is up to your imagination.
An extension of BrightLineWest from Las Vegas to Salt Lake City (Rio Grande depo). This could eventually lead to a network of HSR.
Edit: I spent 2 hours looking at a potential corridor from Las Vegas to Salt Lake City. The best allingment (IMO) would be to take the Frontrunner ROW from SLC to Provo, take the UP line south until you meet I15 and then do a flyover into the median and then continue towards Las Vegas BLW station. This ROW would allow 200-220mph for about 100 miles, 180-170mph for ~80-90 miles, 160-125mph for ~20-30 miles, 110-90mph for ~100-120 miles and 90-50mph for ~10 miles.
Important note: Their would be tunneling involved for about 18 miles of the corridor which are under St. George (UT) and Las Vegas (NE). This to allow trains actually running thru as to there not being room for them within I15. (Perspective SLC->Las Vegas) There are ways to not tunnel under St. George which would be to divert feom the I15 straight from it before it turns to St. George and along the airport. Then the ROW would hook onto route 7 median which has on the eastern side not a parallel road installed. This means we can freely come into the ROW with the road needing to go under the tracks in the future. We then connect with a 200mph curve onto I15 to then go into a 110mph zone again.
It would be amazing to connect to Las Vegas via HSR! Like you said, the geography just south of St George is going to make that proposition very expensive. Still, I love your ambition!
Do you think that a new TRAX Airport station could be built to allow for through-running trains and an easier experience? (plus potential for future heavy rail)
@@manualdriver02 An elevated, through-running TRAX station at the airport is certainly possible. Financing it will be difficult, though, since Delta successfully lobbied the Utah legislature to ban transit spending using airport funds.
Also, once trains run through the airport, where do you think they should go?
@@CSLenhartthey should continue on to the Amazon distribution center and further west. Could even make a green loop 🔁 on the west side. Service the airport hotel area and the business area
@@ZackScriven Sounds like a winner to me!