I did something similar to this on an old busted zildjian a crash. Left it in my backyard for a while summer. Definitely changed the look, but mostly just dulled the cymbal out. Didn't really make it darker sounding though 🤷♂️
I've tried and succeeded at applying a patina on cymbals by burying them underground. I buried a set of Stagg hihats overnight and they were significantly drier and darker.
One thing I like about rdavidr is that his before and after tests are always really thorough. Good examples of the same beat played with both and just the cymbal in question really helps
I contacted the manufacturer (Monoprice) to see if they will start production again. Of course no reply, just the standard will keep you posted Email...🙄
Back in the day we used to bury cymbals in the Fall, covered in all sorts of debris (dirt, leaves, manure, urine, etc) and dig them up in the Spring. We did this with crappy cymbals in order to get them to sound like "something" other than a crappy cymbal.
@@DrSamE Meinl and Zildjian be like "if you want to get smaller logos you'll have to buy Foundry Reserve and Avedis Signature cymbals. That'll be $1,000 for a set of hihats please."
Everyone check out Dream Cymbals. They bury one of their lines of cymbals, Dark Matter, for a few weeks or something and these cymbals are very dry, dark and washy. They still come with the soot on them. Great ride cymbals for jazz drummers. My set of 15" Bliss hats are my favorite hats
Coffee grounds and chips were irrelevant/redundant. All you need is a mild acid on bare metal and some dwell time in a moist environment. Accelerated oxidation is all it is. I think the bell sounded better before, but the taper sounds better now.
I assume the coffee grounds allowed the patina to be more patchy as they allowed it to soak in without even coverage like there'd be if it just soaked in vinegar
I recall reading years ago about using pickle brine to patina cymbals, and that it was highly effective because it was a combo of acid and salt. In this case, the chips do add (some) salt, so they may not be completely irrelevant.
Nice, definitely tames the harsher high frequencies. I would probably experiment with taping the bell to preserve the clear "ping" while oxidizing the rest of the cymbal!
I just tried using "liver of sulphur" on a cheap Meinl ride and a Paiste HH top. Works like a champ with dark, thorough patina. You have to sand off the protective coating first.
For getting dry dark sounds, I think hand hammering is always better than gathering or forcing patina on cymbals. Although patina does add character and mojo, like holes in your favorite jeans. Not too long ago I bought a complete set of 1960s Apollo cymbals, including a 22 ride, 20 Ride, 17 crash, and 14 hats. They all sound amazing, and they all share a weird sort of rainbow-like patina. I rubbed my fingers on those stains and it actually smelled bad! I had no idea why. So I went back over the stains with castille soap and now they don't smell at all. And of course the cymbals still sound like smokey, rumbling, vintage gorgeousness...
It's funny when you said it brought out more overtones. I was thinking that same thing when you were doing the cymbal side by side by its self. It's like it unlocked all this potential that was locked away in the shine.
You mean Sylvia Massey, the producer that's worked with Johnny Cash, Tom Petty, Tool, Slayer, System of a Down and was a professor at Berklee? Yeah, I bet she's real cut up that the rusty cymbal thing didn't work ;)
sylvia massey is prince's original and main engineer. she's a legend, like an eddie kramer to jimi hendrix or something. she doesn't care about a TH-cam video ✌😆
I've successfully applied a patina to a couple cymbals of mine with a lemon juice/vinegar blend , and salt. first wet the cymbal then cake every inch of it with salt, then drench the cymbal using a spray bottle and let it dry completely. drench it, and let it dry completely one more time, and you're finished. Btw using pure ammonia will give nice green and blue tints to cymbals from what I've read. Cheers!
@@anthonypachecodrums The sound was darkened, and it added some amount of control. If you decide to try this method, make sure to follow the above steps exactly, and don't apply the solution more than twice. Keeping the cymbal uncovered and letting it completely dry in the shade after you apply the salt and solution is critical to achieving the desired results.
@@anthonypachecodrums I ran it under hot water in the shower. If there are any stubborn areas where the salt doesn't want to come off, you could lightly rub it off with your hand. After that, place up it up against a wall, and let it dry on it's own; don't wipe or pat dry as you can potentially remove some of the built up patina at that stage. Cheers!
Who figured out you could do this. like did someone spill coffee on their cymbal then forget it outside and then they noticed the cymbal was darker after
A good method for staining wood cheap is to use coffee or tea. So I could see where this method come to fruition for color.. however.. changing the sound.. didn't seem to work as well
Even played through my cheapie Blackweb Walmart speaker, I can tell the difference. I prefer the bright clean sound, however all my cymbals are "aged". very
Not necessarily what I’d do... but Sylvia Massy is a total mad scientist of recording and has produced and engineered records that has shaped music as we know it.
I electro plated my cymbals with copper, also trace amounts of silver, magnesium, and zinc from pennies. There are chemicals bronze artists use for blueing, greening, and Redding statues -- I think it would be fascinating to combine bronze blueing with electro plating, using a variety of chemicals & metals and see what the patinas look like, and if they change the sound.
I've got that same Monoprice cymbal, and have been wondering about adding some patina. You answered that for me. It's not a bad sounding cymbal at all, and I agree that this hurts the sound.
I've been doing cymbal patinas for a couple years now. Cheap B20 is one of the roughest to work with and almost never takes on color how you want/see. I've used Zildjian A's and gotten great color out of them, but they were thrashed cymbals I turned into clocks. That being said, I do think this cymbal sounds a little better with the darker undertones the patina added.
I’ve done patina on a cymbal but it was a different recipe... it got all green and funky then I washed it and it was really dark. The sound really changed and I was happy with it. I used salt and lemon.
Def has less sustain and more stick definition with a roll off on the higher frequencies. Maybe getting the underside with the same blend would be worth trying. Or even sanding it before adding the patina blend would be pretty cool
8:49 You got that wrong there - in fact b8 is generally brighter, higher pitched, especially cheaper stuff, extra bright and glassy; b20 is generally darker. So your uncharacteristically glassy, high pitch, bright b20 gets a tad more b20 like, not more b8. Still, for $20, b8, b20, whatever that thing actually is, that's a lot of cymbal, with or without patina. I wouldn't have had the heart to mess with it like that.
Try hot gun bluing. I want to see how that works. Also a bronze sculpture foundry could give you ideas for other chemical patina. I wonder if your vinegar had lost some acidity. Thanks
I remember burying my old Zildjian ZXT hi hats for around a week and a half to try and darken their sound. I don't it changed much other than their look. No where near as dark sounding as my K Custom Dark hats
Love this patina subject and diy approaches to it. Great vid btw :) Honestly thought you were going to use the common vinegar and salt method. You should experiment and try a few out.
I would do it with a cheap used cymbal for fun, sure. I drilled up a used Rude China and it sounded great. An interesting ending would have been to clean up the cymbal and see what it sounded like.
Not surprised, the gunk changes how the metal oscillates leading to those weird, "gongy" overtones in place of the usual shimmering. Wouldn't do it to mine.
Hello Very good video Thank you very much for those Great Ideas Hey, see that something similar happened to me I have an 18-inch cymbal paiste crash/ride from the Rude series So I cleaned it with a liquid to clean cymbals, sabian promark,I think it was the shape but it returned the cymbal in a pink shade and i want it in its original brown shade it's like a greenish brown shade any idea i can do???? thanks
I used some oven cleaner over a period of time on my paiste brilliant alphas ....they now look a bite like rudes and it's taken some of the brightness away.
It sounds like it took the tiniest sliver of the highest frequencies away. It's incredibly subtle. I wonder if letting it sit longer would have made it more extreme.
I listened with headphones and I disagree that it sounds any more “B8” as those usually sound very cutting and harsh. This did lose shimmer, but I’d say not anything like a standard b8 sound.
Great experiment! I wouldn't say it had great results BUT now we know! It did seem to knock off the higher frequencies though if that's what you were going for in a sound which really isn't a bad technique.
Would you do this to your cymbals?
I have a cheap Paiste PST3 20" Ride lying around and I'm bored so I might try it.
rdavidr I’d try this if I had a good bit of extra ones but if this is my only or main cymbal, probably not.
Honestly, it sounds like it's not even worth the bother.
Lol NO. Cool video though.
I did something similar to this on an old busted zildjian a crash.
Left it in my backyard for a while summer. Definitely changed the look, but mostly just dulled the cymbal out. Didn't really make it darker sounding though 🤷♂️
The Meinl Byzance Coffee Vinegar Chip Dark Extra Dry Rusty-Ass Trash Crash
Haha great comment!
with
hot sauce
Don’t Diss Meinl Byzance lmfao
Cost: $599.99
Why don't you just eat your food like normal people David?
All the grocery stores around me are empty. I had to improvise and make some tasty vinegar-shakes
That’s what I said Stephen🙄
@@rdavidr yum
@@rdavidrey gimme some 💅👁👄👁
I use the timeless method of smoke, dust and years of abuse. 😂
When your mom says, "We have dark cymbals at home" . . .
I've tried and succeeded at applying a patina on cymbals by burying them underground. I buried a set of Stagg hihats overnight and they were significantly drier and darker.
Yes. The Zildjian Earth Ride is named after such a technique. Jazz artists would do this too.
Dr Dr wait rly?
@@natefreedman2972 my guess would be to tame the harsher under/over tones
24" Earth ride is/was a good ride, great for heavy metal
I had an Earth Ride when I was a kid. So heavy. Would’ve been cool with a much lighter cymbal.
the real question is does darker coffee blends mean darker tones?
FBI wants to know your location
I prefer the French roast Arabica.
Lol I was thinking the same actually
Now that's fresh ground beans from the hills of Colombia
Yes. Yes it does.
4:10 Meinl Byzance 20” Extra Dry Spicy Ride
One thing I like about rdavidr is that his before and after tests are always really thorough. Good examples of the same beat played with both and just the cymbal in question really helps
Winter Summers he even wore the same clothes!
Day 33 on the quarantine:
Im watching a dude throw coffee to a cymbal
Will give you all my lesson packs for free if you drink that smoothie you made.
Tempting, but ill pass 😂
If only I could buy this 20$ Walmart cymbal. Sounds amazing for this price!
yeah you can use it as a crash ride and it sounds better than them beginner meinl or paiste cymbals 🥴
@@lewislittledyke9817 20$ for this sound is a no brainer. I would buy 2 or 3 of those in a second lol
I contacted the manufacturer (Monoprice) to see if they will start production again. Of course no reply, just the standard will keep you posted Email...🙄
@@vistalite-ph4zw awesome dude keep me updated please!
Check the millenium b20 cymbals from thomann
That cooking intro was great 😂😂😂
Back in the day we used to bury cymbals in the Fall, covered in all sorts of debris (dirt, leaves, manure, urine, etc) and dig them up in the Spring.
We did this with crappy cymbals in order to get them to sound like "something" other than a crappy cymbal.
normal people: How to clean my cymbals without erasing the logos
rdavidr: dyi patina sounds like a good idea
other normal people: man i'm just never gonna clean my cymbals so they develop a nice patina.
Then there's me taking all the logos off with nail polish remover. Those always getting bigger and uglier logos are just so ugly!
@@DrSamE Meinl and Zildjian be like "if you want to get smaller logos you'll have to buy Foundry Reserve and Avedis Signature cymbals. That'll be $1,000 for a set of hihats please."
Everyone check out Dream Cymbals. They bury one of their lines of cymbals, Dark Matter, for a few weeks or something and these cymbals are very dry, dark and washy. They still come with the soot on them. Great ride cymbals for jazz drummers. My set of 15" Bliss hats are my favorite hats
Simon Oliver love my 15” bliss hats too
That intro to the segment was fire!!!
I don't even play drums but I love your videos. They are so interesting that I'm starting to looking for a drum set
You never replied to my question about the value of my screw.
Coffee grounds and chips were irrelevant/redundant. All you need is a mild acid on bare metal and some dwell time in a moist environment. Accelerated oxidation is all it is.
I think the bell sounded better before, but the taper sounds better now.
I assume the coffee grounds allowed the patina to be more patchy as they allowed it to soak in without even coverage like there'd be if it just soaked in vinegar
I recall reading years ago about using pickle brine to patina cymbals, and that it was highly effective because it was a combo of acid and salt.
In this case, the chips do add (some) salt, so they may not be completely irrelevant.
@@SeanD313 He added salt himself, so the salt from the chips were effectively redundant. But yes, salt and mild acid is what is needed
So pee on my cymbals after I shit and vomit them? Vegan
This is the BEST and fucking FUNNIEST intro i've seen in a while.
And I really mean, like, IN A WHILE!!!
Nice, definitely tames the harsher high frequencies. I would probably experiment with taping the bell to preserve the clear "ping" while oxidizing the rest of the cymbal!
I definitely wanna see some more patina methods
I just tried using "liver of sulphur" on a cheap Meinl ride and a Paiste HH top. Works like a champ with dark, thorough patina. You have to sand off the protective coating first.
Oh brother - We’re at the final frontier of drum content.
Well at least I know where the term salsa and picante crash came from.
For getting dry dark sounds, I think hand hammering is always better than gathering or forcing patina on cymbals. Although patina does add character and mojo, like holes in your favorite jeans. Not too long ago I bought a complete set of 1960s Apollo cymbals, including a 22 ride, 20 Ride, 17 crash, and 14 hats. They all sound amazing, and they all share a weird sort of rainbow-like patina. I rubbed my fingers on those stains and it actually smelled bad! I had no idea why. So I went back over the stains with castille soap and now they don't smell at all. And of course the cymbals still sound like smokey, rumbling, vintage gorgeousness...
Absolutely loved the music in the intro the video!!!! Such an amazing touch to the video!
That jingle changed my life
"alright, it's now tomorrow"
-rdavidr
It's funny when you said it brought out more overtones. I was thinking that same thing when you were doing the cymbal side by side by its self. It's like it unlocked all this potential that was locked away in the shine.
The 1 dislike is the author of that book
You mean Sylvia Massey, the producer that's worked with Johnny Cash, Tom Petty, Tool, Slayer, System of a Down and was a professor at Berklee? Yeah, I bet she's real cut up that the rusty cymbal thing didn't work ;)
sylvia massey is prince's original and main engineer. she's a legend, like an eddie kramer to jimi hendrix or something. she doesn't care about a TH-cam video ✌😆
I've successfully applied a patina to a couple cymbals of mine with a lemon juice/vinegar blend , and salt. first wet the cymbal then cake every inch of it with salt, then drench the cymbal using a spray bottle and let it dry completely. drench it, and let it dry completely one more time, and you're finished. Btw using pure ammonia will give nice green and blue tints to cymbals from what I've read. Cheers!
Did it darken the sound of your cymbal? I might try your method!
@@anthonypachecodrums The sound was darkened, and it added some amount of control. If you decide to try this method, make sure to follow the above steps exactly, and don't apply the solution more than twice. Keeping the cymbal uncovered and letting it completely dry in the shade after you apply the salt and solution is critical to achieving the desired results.
@@dieharddrums6343 Thank you sir! I will definitely keep you updated on the process! 👍
@@dieharddrums6343 what did you use to clean off the excess salt
@@anthonypachecodrums I ran it under hot water in the shower. If there are any stubborn areas where the salt doesn't want to come off, you could lightly rub it off with your hand. After that, place up it up against a wall, and let it dry on it's own; don't wipe or pat dry as you can potentially remove some of the built up patina at that stage. Cheers!
this was awesome! production for this video is really cool dave
I spat on my ride once mid performance, just being weird and left it and those spots looked better than this.
You nasty
Its always a good day when David posts
I put 2 small round magnets on the ride edge and it also achives that loss of high frequency. Very good for excessive bright cymbals
What about the old "burying it in the ground for a year" version?
He didnt have enough space on the SD card to film that 😂
liked for the new jingle for "Cooking Cymbals with Dave". Stoked for this season's episodes!
Love to see you make a duo snare like the one on tamas superstar hyperdrive duo line from an old floor tom. Love the videos!
I actually like it. The difference in sound is subtle, but for the better according to my taste at least.
I love the ear defenders for the blender 😂
A friend of mine once buried a couple of Dream cymbals for abut a week and they came out (up?) green. And they sound great
Who figured out you could do this. like did someone spill coffee on their cymbal then forget it outside and then they noticed the cymbal was darker after
A good method for staining wood cheap is to use coffee or tea. So I could see where this method come to fruition for color.. however.. changing the sound.. didn't seem to work as well
Probably, someone like the dry sound of old, weathered cymbals. So they wanted a way to patina them faster. What corrodes metal? Acids!
Zequintiny coffee for the color,vinegar for the acus, but WHY CHIPS ?!
@@mathias841 probably as a medium for the vinegar to soak into.
Yes please to more patina’s. I’d love to know how to get a nice dark sound on some of my old cymbals :)
Even played through my cheapie Blackweb Walmart speaker, I can tell the difference. I prefer the bright clean sound, however all my cymbals are "aged". very
Not necessarily what I’d do... but Sylvia Massy is a total mad scientist of recording and has produced and engineered records that has shaped music as we know it.
When that song came on I laughed so hard! Love it Dave
Bruh when I saw your first try cymbals, I literally yelled out 'OH GOD!' lol!!!
I electro plated my cymbals with copper, also trace amounts of silver, magnesium, and zinc from pennies. There are chemicals bronze artists use for blueing, greening, and Redding statues -- I think it would be fascinating to combine bronze blueing with electro plating, using a variety of chemicals & metals and see what the patinas look like, and if they change the sound.
I've got that same Monoprice cymbal, and have been wondering about adding some patina. You answered that for me. It's not a bad sounding cymbal at all, and I agree that this hurts the sound.
I've been doing cymbal patinas for a couple years now. Cheap B20 is one of the roughest to work with and almost never takes on color how you want/see. I've used Zildjian A's and gotten great color out of them, but they were thrashed cymbals I turned into clocks.
That being said, I do think this cymbal sounds a little better with the darker undertones the patina added.
Hey Dave, when are you going to paint that tom?
i'd love to see some more patina stuff. also wouldn't mind seeing you try to make something like a Dual zone cymbal out of a old heavy ride.
The cymbal definitely sounds better. Try bearing in the earth for a while. A little dirt, a little rain.
I’ve done patina on a cymbal but it was a different recipe... it got all green and funky then I washed it and it was really dark. The sound really changed and I was happy with it. I used salt and lemon.
Def has less sustain and more stick definition with a roll off on the higher frequencies. Maybe getting the underside with the same blend would be worth trying. Or even sanding it before adding the patina blend would be pretty cool
"Welcome to Dave's kitchen"
Couldn't find the background music in the description. What's the song at 4:54?
Cooking cymbals with Dave - hilarious song!
Cool video...everyone loves a funky patina!
I have some spare B8's and i like that patina look sooooo... more cooking cymbals with dave please!
8:49 You got that wrong there - in fact b8 is generally brighter, higher pitched, especially cheaper stuff, extra bright and glassy; b20 is generally darker. So your uncharacteristically glassy, high pitch, bright b20 gets a tad more b20 like, not more b8.
Still, for $20, b8, b20, whatever that thing actually is, that's a lot of cymbal, with or without patina. I wouldn't have had the heart to mess with it like that.
so weird that the patina on the cymbal would make the tune of your snare slightly deeper
lol
the ole monoprice ride cymbal. i remember when you got that thing. cool videos btw! love watching!
That little singing transition was the nicest thing I've ever seen
Could you make a video trying to do a patina finish on a steel (or any other metal) with a basic torch?
Loved the segment intro 😂😂😂
"The Cymbake Project"
Yes please do more patina videos!
This intro music "Cooking Cymbals With Dave" is pretty cool hahahaha
My grandpa did this to his Ludwig vistalite set.... He gave it to me and it has some cool sounding symbol
Hi David,
Question, you have any idea to remove flam stickers from basdrum head? ;) :)
Try hot gun bluing. I want to see how that works. Also a bronze sculpture foundry could give you ideas for other chemical patina. I wonder if your vinegar had lost some acidity. Thanks
Production quality goin up👆🏼
That jingle was awesome!
Hola hermano Olle una pregunta como puedo convertir un tambor flotom 16 en bombo ?
I remember burying my old Zildjian ZXT hi hats for around a week and a half to try and darken their sound. I don't it changed much other than their look. No where near as dark sounding as my K Custom Dark hats
If you take the steel wool and clean it back to bright again, does it sound the same as it did before? How does it sound if you treat both sides?
Love this patina subject and diy approaches to it. Great vid btw :)
Honestly thought you were going to use the common vinegar and salt method. You should experiment and try a few out.
I would do it with a cheap used cymbal for fun, sure. I drilled up a used Rude China and it sounded great.
An interesting ending would have been to clean up the cymbal and see what it sounded like.
Not surprised, the gunk changes how the metal oscillates leading to those weird, "gongy" overtones in place of the usual shimmering. Wouldn't do it to mine.
can you make bronze/copper snare drum patina? There is lot of company doing some kind of green/blue amazing patina; and i wonder a lot how to do :)
Hello Very good video Thank you very much for those Great Ideas Hey, see that something similar happened to me I have an 18-inch cymbal paiste crash/ride from the Rude series So I cleaned it with a liquid to clean cymbals, sabian promark,I think it was the shape but it returned the cymbal in a pink shade and i want it in its original brown shade it's like a greenish brown shade any idea i can do???? thanks
The most change in sound is in the bell
It maybe got a tad darker but nothing to write home about. Great video as always! Hope you are doing well during this quarantine.
This is prime content right here!
what about doing the same thing to the bottom as well?
def want to see more!
Love the intro jingle bro, hope you end up using it with your cymbal experiments:)
The goddamn death metal with the blender slayed me.
I used some oven cleaner over a period of time on my paiste brilliant alphas ....they now look a bite like rudes and it's taken some of the brightness away.
It sounds like it took the tiniest sliver of the highest frequencies away. It's incredibly subtle. I wonder if letting it sit longer would have made it more extreme.
I wonder if the quality of the bronze makes a difference.
Hei!
Try OFF roll on insect repellent,
I used it to scare away mosquitoes, but it left strong spots on the surface...
You could also just join drumline and have your band director leave and take some 30 year old marching cymbals home that have been through all weather
Can u try doing both the bottom and top of the cymbal patina-d ?
rdavidr .... very curious.... what handheld thermometer did you use in this video, and would you recommend it?
1:52 Man, even your kitchen looks like a woodshop - oh, wait
Wait that’s his kitchen
I listened with headphones and I disagree that it sounds any more “B8” as those usually sound very cutting and harsh. This did lose shimmer, but I’d say not anything like a standard b8 sound.
The man’s a legend
Great experiment! I wouldn't say it had great results BUT now we know! It did seem to knock off the higher frequencies though if that's what you were going for in a sound which really isn't a bad technique.